"Atheists can't answer this question" ...but I Can

[@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic]

Go to ground.news/skeptic to verify the source of your information + access all sides. Subscribe through my link for 40% off unlimited access this month.

[@Cajek2]

The most frustrating one: "hOw dO U hAvE MorALiTy wItHoUt gOd" TAKE AN INTRO TO PHILOSOPHY CLASS Dozens and dozens of morality systems that don't use the bible!

[@Greg501-]

Seriously though this has such an obvious answer: "Life is full of compromises, going against what you want for other people builds community"

[@cathyrenick8562]

I don't believe anyone is atheist. The fact they had to have believed in God at one time all they're doing is questioning. That would be agnostic. That's how perfect God's plan is you have to have believed in order to say you don't. So, where is an atheist possibly a satanist.

[@Cajek2]

@@cathyrenick8562 You're the one asserting there's a god, we're just saying we don't agree with your assertion. Please take an intro to philosophy class to learn logic.

[@Greg501-]

@@cathyrenick8562 Because obviously all atheists converted from monotheistic religions like Christianity. /s But if everything is according to God's plan, then why should you let it bother you that there are non-believers? If that is also part of the plan, then should you believe the God that made people non-believers just to be hated on by "true believers" is good?

[@fridesvandeven5183]

-> in libraries you can’t talk -> people like to talk -> libraries are divine temples

[@stylesrj]

Well, librarians are goddesses... or gods. Or an orangutan.

[@mrmackinac5266]

@@stylesrjshhh, we don’t talk about the orangutan

[@stylesrj]

@@mrmackinac5266 As long as we don't monkey about with his species.

[@mrmackinac5266]

@@stylesrj The Patrician would consider that a form of suicide.

[@jasonclinton3367]

@@mrmackinac5266 Just remember to address him as Mr. Monkey.

[@bretthiguera8360]

I hate those tiktoks so much. Those people look so incredibly cocky considering they are just copy/pasting someone else's idea without any context or input.

[@filiperosa7496]

But that's is not 99% of TikTok?

[@theboombody]

If Tik Tok only allows 2 minute videos, you really don't have time to show any work.

[@nullieee]

​@@theboombody"Your work" being scrolling through Reddit, finding a post and copying it?

[@marcoz6281]

@@filiperosa7496 it is

[@Yuto_specs]

@@theboombodyit let you make longer vids for a while now

[@shalltear159]

If all movies are made by humans, how come some of them are bad? Man wouldn't make a movie that man doesn't want to watch.

[@sandwichqueen]

Morbis is devine because people don't desire it.

[@tma2001]

but what about those that are so bad they are good ?

[@presentfuture7563]

@@tma2001 You're tearing me apart, Lisa!

[@scottthiemann2420]

Some???My. YOU, are generous!

[@AnnoyingNewsletters]

*_Oh, hi Mark!_*

[@princessmaly]

5 Questions Atheists CANNOT answer: 1. If evolution is true, why does Pikachu require a thunder stone to evolve? 2. How me a dog learn to talk? 3. King Kong is a movie and you believe that, don't you? 4. A train leaves New York traveling at 500 miles per hour at 5 pm on Saturday, and uh... is it... does it get there in time? 5. What came first, the xenomorph or the black goo? Checkmate, Atheists!

[@stylesrj]

1) Because the requirements change with every generation and because of PIkachu's popularity, the devs wanted to make it hard for people to lose that mascot. 2) Because all dogs are good boys! 3) Wait, are you saying it's NOT a documentary or something? 4) Depends if there's someone on the tracks 5) The goo of course. The Engineers were working on all sorts of stuff.

[@tristanqr]

4: Considering the fastest train in the world goes a little over 300 mph, and 500 is over half the speed of sound, and a crash would have the equivalent energy of one thousand and seventy nine sticks of dynamite, unless that train's destination is a flaming ball after it rips through the tracks and causes a city block to be leveled, probably not

[@rajori111]

these are HARD you kinda ate with that

[@thelilbuggy]

Really enjoyed the fact you asked whether the black goo or the xenomorph came first. Most would say face hugger or xenomorph I imagine

[@michelewalburn4376]

Wow. I bet your mommy is so proud of you. Does she still wash your face and wipe your arse? If not who does those things for you? I'll never believe that you've learned to do them yourself, nope. No way. There's absolutely no chance that you're intelligent to get your velcro shoes to stay on without help. Let's talk about how daddy "punishes" you when you mess up. That's not punishment. He's not trying to correct this behavior. 57.5% of pedophiles are white men 96% of those white men are Christians. Have you started growing your own victims yet or are you still reliant on the other church members to keep bringing in new victims?

[@RocketboyX]

What could be more aligned with "Man's Desires" than being able to ask a silent third party for forgiveness to absolve themselves from all guilt?

[@ziploc2000]

...and consequently live forever. That's the big one they really want, because they're super duper special.

[@FrozEnbyWolf150]

As well as to bring retributive justice towards all of one's enemies.

[@antonioscendrategattico2302]

Yep. It's hilarious because you KNOW that when they say "man's desires" they are only thinking of sex, because they have the understanding of a choirboy fresh out of Sunday School about the topic.

[@playinglifeoneasy9226]

The divine permission to lord over your family and the natural world.

[@likedebia4693]

Well I belive Jesus said that one should resolve their problems on earth before asking god for forgivness, I belive it was in the Matheus evangelium. Although as this was inconvinient and a good idea it appears to not be too prominent in modern Christianity

[@bazookajoe6317]

If "do not murder" and "do not commit adultery" go against your "human desires", it may be time for serious introspektion

[@infebris]

"If you need the threat of eternal torture to be a good person, you aren't a good person."

[@le_ooer]

@@infebriswell said. Morals should not be based upon fear

[@222ableVelo]

@@le_ooer Without God, your morals are based on fear. Which proves that man has a sinful nature. If you have God, then your morals are based on God, and not fear. You are unwittingly proving the Christian stance. And that's without going down the rabbit hole of where morals come from in the first place.

[@Hospitaller1099]

I guess common sense isn't your strong suit.

[@gh6stz]

​@@Hospitaller1099is what i say to anyone who makes the argument "if christianity is a man made religion then why does it go against mans desires"

[@מ.מ-ה9ד]

"If laws are man-made, why is it illegal to do drugs?"

[@Jcs57]

If laws are man made why is illegal to not wear a seatbelt?

[@rondotexe]

This is an incredibly good response to such a silly question.

[@notmaifox]

This one's really good

[@elih6087]

Literally what I thought. "If law is man-made, why does it go against our desire to kill each other?"

[@weatheranddarkness]

@@elih6087 problem is, this kind of christianity does see law as somehow bestowed by god, unless they can blame a catholic/atheist/activist_judge for 'corrupting' the law.

[@trashpanda1742]

I don't believe in god, but I go to a christian school, and in one of our lessons on religion, a question popped up. The question was "Is it arrogant to believe that there is only one true religion?" Majority of the answers from my class was "no it isn't because Christianity is the only real one" Are they even hearing themselves?????

[@akirafan28]

As a Christian I think this is an interesting and fair question 🙂.

[@TheManDude]

“Is it arrogant to believe that you’re never wrong?” “No, because I *am* never wrong.”

[@johnrockyryan]

​@@TheManDude that's pretty much the gist of what bro said

[@chrisk6637]

​@@TheManDudefax

[@tr1bes]

No. Christian strive to uphold to be close to God but there is a flaw. We strive in whatever ways but all come short on achieving it. That's why Jesus said there is only 1 way. Whether one is Catholic, Lutheran, Presbyterian, Orthodox, Baptist, and etc, all fail because we all have sins. The Jews fail so many times is a perfect example. Even the 12 Disciples and the Roman Catholic fail. "Do not commit murder." The 12 Disciples fail because there were in fighting between them. They even hunt down their fellow brothers to Eithopia. The Roman Catholic were not better as well. I remembered my Pastor said that, his denomination, can have flaws but again stated only 1 way to Heaven. So my answer to your question is NO because we are all sinners. No matter what Christianity denomination you are in, it still flawed.

[@jamielishbrook2384]

Counter question. If you need the fear of hell to be a good person. Are you really a good person?

[@124-u7m]

That's a really good question.

[@feha92]

@@124-u7m The answer is yes. There are the schools of thoughts where Results are everything. According to this, the fact that you were a good person makes you a good person. Same holds true for the slightly different school of thought where Actions is all that matters (differs in that the result matters less than the action taken itself). Even with the school of thought where Intent is all that matters, what was the _cause_ of said intent is irrelevant. And thus you end up classified as a good person. Stepping away from those ethical frameworks for a moment, we also have the schools of thoughts classifying humans as a mass of desires and selfishness and even maliciousness. A beast. And that what makes a human civilized - a good person - is the conscious choice to _not_ act on those impulses and desires. Again, the "why" does not really matter, but rather the fact that you made the conscious decision and had the self-control to follow through. Rather, in this philosophy, the more you wanted to do something the better of a person you are when you refrained (so arguably anyone that can be a good person without an imaginary threat of punishment to discipline themselves, is LESS of a good person). I can go on, but overall I think that I can list more schools of thoughts saying you are a good person, than ones that argue that you are not. The latter are pretty much only ones that considers personhood/humanity/goodness as more of an intrinsic part of someone's nature, rather than their decisions and actions - which admittedly includes pretty much all religions with gods who judge your soul on death. ps: as for personal opinion, I don't quite agree with any of the above schools of thoughts. I think people are an equation of nature and nurture, and that you don't even need to be human to be good. I think that we all are complex being where to decide whether we are good or not, we need to consider both desires, intent, actions, results, and scope/context. And everything in-between and beyond. Meaning: the answer is relative to your perspective and 2 separate people/groups can come to different answers. Like the quotes goes: "everyone is their own hero"; "the only difference between a hero and a villain, is who wrote the book". pps: I have no idea if the second one is an actual quote.

[@suzumi111]

being a good person doesn’t automatically get you into heaven jesus specifies this

[@jamielishbrook2384]

@@suzumi111 yes well neither does being a shit person while still claiming to be Christian. Or did you forget the part about loving your enemies, praying for them, going the extra mile, and how you literally cannot be forgiven, like at all, if you can't forgive others, and my personal favorite "he turned to those on his left, and he said he gone from me wretched sinners for I do not know thee. They said but Lord did I not spend my entire life life living for you. The Lord answered saying I was homeless and you did not house me, I was naked and you did not clothe me, I was hungry and you did not feed me, I was sick and you did not visit me, I was in prison and you did not minister to me. And they asked him Lord when did we see you homeless, and naked, and hungry, and sick, and in prison and did not minister to you? And he answered saying that which you did not do to even the least of my brother's you did not do to me. Merely claiming Christ isn't enough either. You gotta work at it. So again, COUNTER question. IF YOU NEED A FEAR OF ETERNAL DAMNATION IN HELL to be a good person, are you REALLY a good person?

[@suzumi111]

@@jamielishbrook2384 i pray for everyone i love everyone you shouldn’t stereotype people i’m really sorry if you’ve been hurt by a christian before because it seems like your projecting but i’ll pray for you!

[@austinluther5825]

The constant barrage of "Okay, atheists, what's your answer to THIS!" is exhausting and annoying. We're not the ones making a claim. The burden of proof is not on us.

[@NorthernSeaWitch]

It's a communal form of gish gallop, bombard people with enough claims, and if even one is missed, then QED God. It didn't even have to be actually missed, just missed by enough to lend false credence to the premise.

[@Richard_Nickerson]

​@@ericgraham8150 1. Not every atheist actually posits this. 2. Even if you do phrase it that way, then it is a direct response. They made the claim.

[@SupachargedGaming]

​@@ericgraham8150 Nope, that's anti-theism. "There is no god." Atheism is simpler. "There is no evidence for god, and therefore we shouldn't believe in god." It's not the claim that there is definitely no god. It's the equivalent of the following exchange: Theist: "God exists. I know god. I know god's will!" Atheist: "Prove it." Theist: "Something exists, therefore god!" Atheist: "Nope, try again." Theist: "Your moral framework cannot be grounded without god." Atheist: "Nope, fuck off. Try again."

[@NisseHult101]

@@ericgraham8150 No, most atheists only reject the claim that there exists a god, since you can't prove a negative, and a claim without evidence can be rejected without evidence. (But then there is of course lots of evidence that makes the existence of a god unlikely, and also lots of evidence that makes the claim of a god not existing plausible.)

[@JackSack-w5h]

Antitheism isn't "there is no god". Antitheism is "god is harmful/false and we should therefore actively try eradicating it or arguing against it". A subset of atheism is "god doesn't exist and I am certain of that". A minority sure, but it is a flavour of atheism ​@@SupachargedGaming

[@thunderbird3694]

Susan B Anthony: "I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do, because I notice it always coincides with their own desires”

[@antonioscendrategattico2302]

And by now we basically have scientific confirmation of that.

[@uncleanunicorn4571]

Interesting how god always seems to hate exactly the same people that you hate...

[@playinglifeoneasy9226]

Christianity gives men dominion over their wives, children, non-Christian’s as slaves/servants, and the natural world

[@AllThingsFilm1]

This comment needs a ♥

[@patrickkerrigan6323]

​@@uncleanunicorn4571 this is not true. I know someone who knows that God hates racism and goes to confession for it regularly and still finds themself being hateful despite knowing God doesn't desire that behavior.

[@Freshfruit91]

But if man made hardcore minecraft then why did i snap my keyboard in half when I died

[@Gre_N]

Now we’re asking the real questions.

[@waxedexposedcutcopper]

YESSIR (except I don’t have Java)

[@thebirdguardien.14]

because the player is frustrated and he or she lost their patience.

[@Freshfruit91]

@@thebirdguardien.14 yeah but why does it go against my desires to be a hardcore pro it must be because jesus made minecraft

[@Freshfruit91]

@@thebirdguardien.14 ive solved religion

[@Deit_Elysieu_son_ein]

The worst enemy of rhetorical questions is answers

[@roberteriksen6434]

You forget the secret weapon. _Uhmm, nuh-uh_

[@Erichwanh]

Homer: Do *I* know what RHETORICAL means?

[@rr.studios]

​@@ErichwanhI don't know...DO you?

[@germanvisitor2]

From DragonballZ Abridged: "Everyone goes on and on about the children. I tried leaving them alive, but all they do is grow up or devote their pathetic little lives to revenge. Frankly, I consider killing them a kindness. I could retract that kindness, but who would be the villain then?" "Y-you." "That was a rhetorical question." "And I gave you a rhetorical answer."

[@destroyerofturtles5024]

@@rr.studiosXavier, is that you?

[@phil23_8]

Christians: our religion is so strict, it says you shouldn't get drunk or have casual sex... Buddha: Life is suffering

[@jackabug2475]

Buddha: Hold my beer.

[@Someone-ll1rc]

@@jackabug2475Buddha: I won’t be drinking it anyway.

[@gowthamnayak6753]

Wait till you hear about Jains. They cant even kill micro organisms.

[@manjugoswami2233]

​@@Someone-ll1rc Bartender: Then why the hell did you even order it?

[@warangelcloud]

Casual sex and Drinking are not forbidden in the Bible. Neo-christians, good grief.

[@Joshinken]

This can be easily countered with “if taxes are man made, then why do they go against mans desire to avoid taxation?”

[@tourdeflores2693]

bro thinks hes funny

[@mattiamontanari-ym5vu]

​@@tourdeflores2693 You think you're right

[@TheCanaryodoom]

​@@tourdeflores2693I hope he thinks he's smart since I think this is the best counterexample I've seen so far

[@Adra_Haru]

​@@mattiamontanari-ym5vu I read "tight"

[@Gernot66]

cough the roman obulus was somewhat bound to religion, you was free to keep your gods but had to pay a higher obulus, it was already back then for a small but very selfish group inacceptable and they still think this was not right (2000 years later they cannot forgive, not even what was 5000 years ago, one day they will extinct caused by their own hate and complain about 'til the very end of time) to cut their rights in the empire, but well romans deal, special right here one right less there, it's a fair deal. if you exclude yourself from society as something special then pay a price for it. it prvents from sour blood in the community.

[@granienasniadanie8322]

If taxes are man made, then why do they go against mans desire to keep his money?

[@wyleecoyotee4252]

The tax collector is keeping that money

[@JackgarPrime]

Have these people even HEARD of Buddhism? The whole point of it is about separating oneself from desire and attachment! Way, way, way more than Christianity does.

[@kaylinhendrich4673]

I was about to say… ascetic Buddhism goes brrrrrrrrrrrt

[@nondescriptcat5620]

i suspect the extent of what they've heard about Buddhism is that it's "diabolical" and a tool of Satan.

[@Mico-Xiyeas]

Literally. I'm not a Buddhist but shid, psychology and Buddhism are AMAZING together. Transformational. More so than all my other transformations

[@hineraable]

Yeah, isn't it's entire premise "wanting things is making you miserable so follow the path to get rid of attachment"???? Even believing in higher beings can be considered as attachment in Buddhism, hence why some schools of Buddhism are indifferent about the existance of higher beings, despite believing they exist, it isn't relevant for them.

[@PhotonBeast]

@@hineraable A generalization and not entirely correct, but yeah. Depending on flavor of Buddism, it can also mean that wanting things will make OTHER people miserable - that in wanting things, especially things that go against the expected flow of the universe, it can be highly disruptive, destructive, and cruel. For example, say there really was an afterlife, one which requires the living to pray or otherwise perform rituals to allow ghosts to pass on into it. Imagine then, that someone you loved died and was a ghost, waiting for you to perform that ritual. You, because you love that person and want to keep them around/don't want to lose them completely, refuse to perform the ritual. The conceit is that this refusal to perform will, ultimately, make you unhappy and potentially drive you to even worse actions. Would you stop someone else from performing that ritual for your loved one, for instance, and if so, what would stopping them entail for you?

[@davidwales9657]

Those tiktokers aren't looking for atheists to see their posts, they're just farming likes from fellow christians

[@banheezone]

That's really true from all those random "God loves you " comments. They only get positive attention from other christians.

[@Yinyara]

And there is a whole movement behind it to teach the younger generations about Christianity. Most of the popular ones are paid to spread this bs.

[@Hospitaller1099]

@@banheezone God loves you.

[@rodshop5897]

@@Hospitaller1099 I'm glad you imagine He does.

[@hedgehog3180]

Exactly, why else would they be putting such an emphasis on their pious self sacrifice otherwise?

[@tristenm1526]

When I first heard this argument, my immediate follow-up question was "...which men's desires?" The desires of the slavers, who's ownership of slaves is biblically sanctioned? The household patriarchs who lord over their women? The priesthood class who founded and continue to govern the church? I dunno, looks like those men are sitting pretty under the Christian system to me...

[@lyravain6304]

I think it refers to the whole 10 commandments. The ones about not un-aliving people, not taking stuff, not betraying your spouse. Because, obviously, only Christians would never do that. All those things are perfectly legal anywhere else in the world. Oh wait... And frankly, the Christian Apologist viewpoint of "if not for Christianity, we'd have no reason to not un-alive each other" is more telling of the Apologist's lack of empathy than anything else.

[@augustuslunasol10thapostle]

@@lyravain6304 lmao true almost every fucking culture hated unnecessary violence to the in group unless it was part of some ritual and even then that wasn’t common

[@natedinoffria1609]

you may be a little confused, are you talking about men meaning Males or man meaning the human race? because the human race is often referred to as man in the bible.

[@Nysyarc]

@@natedinoffria1609 The bible is also deeply misogynistic, so as far as the people who wrote it were concerned, "man" and men were one and the same thing. Women were less than in their eyes, not the same class of being. Many men and even women still unconsciously or even consciously hold this view today.

[@jaclo3112]

@natedinoffria1609 but the bible itself specifically often validates and legislates the desires of males. Especially when it comes to wealth, treatment of women, warfare, property ownership, wish for immortality etc.

[@cal8354]

All religions evolved from homo sapiens' desire to understand and control the world around them. Hence, why there are rules to quash your desires. It gives them control and they don't have to understand others' differences. They can just label them as evil.

[@cal8354]

@@orthodox.nikolai it's exactly what this video says but with different words.

[@ImPaCt_ZxZ]

@@cal8354yeah, people tend to forget that at the end of the day. We are still animals.

[@a9ball1]

Back in the past when we didn't know why something happened we would blame it on a god. Like God got mad at my friend and made a lightning bolt hit his hut. But now we know why most things happen and it's not God taking revenge.

[@WinniePooh33]

​​@@a9ball1Yea, I think it all initially started as an unknowable force, that was just a happenstance, but as a intelligent social species we start giving things names and associations, believing in a God is a very historical human thing to do, but it doesn't make it the truth is what people don't get.

[@darkhand412]

“Man wasn’t made in God’s image, religion was made in Man’s image” is a saying I think applies.

[@jaizyjamal]

Wow that's deep

[@cmecre8629]

... god was made in man's image

[@RickJaeger]

It's just a saying. Aphorisms don't win arguments. They make people who already think like you nod their heads and go "oh wow so true go off king" and they make people who already think unlike you to shake their heads and scoff at your pithy foolishness. It's useless rhetoric.

[@victoriashelly5115]

Womp womp

[@jakeaurod]

Of course religion was made in man's image, it's made to fit humans. This argument makes as much sense as saying car seats were made in man's image.

[@carpediem5232]

If self help books are man made, then why are they going against mans desires? no lusting, no drinking... why do other religions like Islam Buddhism or Hinduism or philosophies like stoicism follow the same trend? This question fits the other online trend of "Tell me you ... without telling me..." trend. Tell me you are ignorant about other religions and philosophies without telling me that you are ignorant about them.

[@nondescriptcat5620]

@@washada the word Yoga comes from the same root as "yoke," with the implication being that one could only achieve true freedom through extreme self-discipline.

[@Jcs57]

I’m especially fascinated by how many literally know nothing about their own religions development the contents of their magical book and the origins of the grand wizard himself.

[@jimmyhirr5773]

​​@@Jcs57I also wish Christians would be more curious about their religion's history, but there is a logical reason for why they aren't more curious. If they knew the history of Christianity, then they wouldn't believe what they do. Look at what happened to Bart Ehrman, for example. It's hard to believe that the Bible is the divinely inspired word of God while knowing that many of the New Testament books are altered, falsely attributed, or straight-up forgeries.

[@falcon_arkaig]

Really shows how Schools should teach about all Religions and not just Christianity.

[@m.p4603]

​@@jimmyhirr5773 Early Christianity was so different to the current one too, plus Gnosticism existed, but Christians just... Don't care.

[@marcuscarana9240]

"I'm a Christian so that means I have to be humble. Let me make a narcissistic tiktok." The irony amongst Christians never fails to disappoint.

[@TommyStahr]

Where is a true Christian today? 1John3:23 sums up Christianity. Bigotry and idolatry killed Christianity. 2Thess2:11 is here. The church is fallen. Trump is lawless. They believe THE LIE! Jesus is coming soon for this born-again gay stoner Jew but all hateful bigots will be left behind to suffer the destruction we've caused our planet. Revelation 11:18 says God will destroy those who destroy the earth. It's all fulfilled.

[@BoomerangVillage]

Nah. One of the unique aspects of Christianity as a religion is their eagerness to spread their beliefs to others. Their messiah instructed them to do exactly that. A Christian can be humble and spread the word without contradicting. That is the way of the entire religion. It's probably the reason Christianity has been so incredibly prolific. Other religions primarily recruit via birth.

[@marcuscarana9240]

@@BoomerangVillage "Other religions recruit via birth." Oh the arrogance and sense of specialness of Christians never fails to amuse me. 90 percent of Christians are Christians cause they were indoctrinated by their parents. Christianity thrived through indoctrination not recruitment. That's why missionaries going door to door trying to recruit new Christians fail 99 percent of the time. You can't brainwash those that haven't been indoctrinated, only the mentally vulnerable ones. That's why Christians goes for the kids while their brains are still being programmed.

[@sleepyearth]

@@BoomerangVillage Nah. Look at their smug faces. They are narcissistic to the core. A Christian can be humble and spread the word without contradicting is the opposite of humble.

[@marcoz6281]

don't call those people chirstians, they just sell themselfs as lovers of god because it gets em likes

[@iatisen-for-real]

"If cigarettes are man made, why are they causing lung cancer?"

[@roberteriksen6434]

My favorite type of argument: - Is false - Even if true, wouldn't argue their case - Doesn't matter cause the questioner didn't believe it in the first place And finally: - If I didn't have an answer to it, they wouldn't stop bringing it up. The holy grail of religious thought.

[@IllustriousCrocoduck]

I just think it's uselessly open-ended. 100 people will interpret 100 different ways. Just like scripture. Useless, and thought up by primitives.

[@danielnemesio3388]

Even the guys who invented already expected this and made verses like "fool is the one who's doesn't believe in god" or something, like they were already anticipating being caught in their lie

[@IllustriousCrocoduck]

@@danielnemesio3388 or those people just didn't have a comeback so their response was everyone else must be dumb.

[@skoomaenjoyer9582]

A perfect way to put my frustration, thank you.

[@davidw2739]

@@IllustriousCrocoduck Yeah, that's what Matthew 7:6 is all about "casting pearls before swine." When the writers of the Bible realized there were people who knew they were full of sh*t, they wrote Matthew 7:6 as a way to make believers feel better about themselves by painting the smart skeptics as the dumb ones. Pretty clever, actually - they understood basic human psychology.

[@silviajulianaalvarezgomez1392]

I am vegetarian, I go against my own desires, I am my own god. Cool.

[@robertcollins6088]

Same!!

[@YoungerFuthark]

Yet another god I don't believe in.

[@Nightknight1992]

hail silvia

[@Saurabhkumar-bn3dl]

​@@YoungerFutharklmao

[@michaelmay5453]

Do you not desire to be a vegetarian? I think you do, or you wouldn't be one so that's not really a good example.

[@Griffolion0]

Christianity as a man made religion actually appeals to one of humanity's most deep and primal desires: immortality.

[@tschakatschada]

Thus appeasing the fear of death. Was also the first thing I thought when I heard the argument. This is probably one of the strongest appeal to any religion.

[@tourdeflores2693]

wow dude that is so deep i am tearing myself

[@infebris]

aswell as making the followers of said religion feel special when in reality we are all just animals.

[@zoharphilbrick4583]

@@tourdeflores2693why comment, it’s true, most ppl probably didn’t think of it

[@MilitantAntiAtheism]

@@tschakatschada Atheists have slaughtered more than 110 million people in less than 100 years in the name of atheist religion, making it the most lethal religion in history with islame on a close second

[@VivekPatel-ze6jy]

0:20 read that and immediately thought: "are you saying that murder is a man's desire?"

[@Jpeace91]

Sex is a man's desire

[@VivekPatel-ze6jy]

@Jpeace91 well yes but that only shows that one of the biblical commandments goes against desire. The argument relies on lots of teachings fulfilling that, not just the one

[@Jpeace91]

@VivekPatel-ze6jy you read me right

[@arlynnecumberbatch1056]

@@VivekPatel-ze6jy desire doesnt ALWAYS equal to sex, it can be gluttony (eating stuff like candies and chocolate) or gambling besides, sex is a gift from god. MISUSING it (you know, rape and all of that stuff) is where it becomes a sin

[@xjoseph1]

Yes

[@RoderickEtheria]

Best I can answer is "It doesn't." I don't desire to kill or steal, and most atheists agree in most cases.

[@Acinnn]

Also.. lot of the restrictions are "you can't.... unless...."

[@hosemad69]

lust is a sin

[@RoderickEtheria]

@@hosemad69 and some of us are aroace.

[@hosemad69]

@@RoderickEtheria okay? You can't say you haven't done something bad ONCE in your life, everyone has, everyone will, and, aroace people can be lustful as well, IDK where you got that from

[@RoderickEtheria]

@hosemad69 But the argument that it goes against natural desires, when many of the things it preaches are actually supporting the natural desires of at least certain portions of society doesn't support its argument.

[@phatman9762]

What a great recruitment slogan that is. "Join Christianity, you'll get none of what you want."

[@braeden4878]

Sounds like it could be a Simpsons bit

[@mikek9297]

Repressing people's desires is a mechanism of control

[@johnfsenpai]

It's especially funny because our ideas of good and evil are based on what we consider desirable. So this claim is equivalent to saying the true religion is the one with the most malevolent god.

[@wr31rf]

@@mikek9297 man desire's only lead into emptiness

[@l.m.892]

"And it won't be easy"

[@pig1114]

now i won't lie, i thought the title was ''athletes can't answer this question'' and got thoroughly confused for a moment, but this is fine too.

[@darkmatter1129]

Athletics works too "Exercise goes against our desires to be lazy"

[@C4Oc.]

​@@darkmatter1129 And it works both ways too. Exercise can fulfill our desires to be healthy and functional and look good

[@jamesaston410]

😂

Crossfit. Sport for christians, right?

[@ZeketheZealot]

“If run fast, then why cars? Checkmate, athletes.”

[@FORD_PINES]

god exists...but for some weird reason hes an axolotl who gives people therapy, i dont make the rules.

[@Eyebagdude]

OOOOO fuck ye gravity falls

[@mentarium9741]

sounds good enough to me

[@scavenger2002]

Gravity falls

[@FORD_PINES]

@@scavenger2002 yes, that is a place in oregon.

[@MomokoMai]

You are my favorite person, ever.

[@isaiahwynn2110]

“If Christianity is a man made religion, why does it suck?”

[@audrete6071]

surely if man made this religion they'd at least make it cooler

[@octosquid48]

I was raised in a catholic household, and I can confidently say that it doesn't suck. The problem is the people who use their own religion to justify their wrongdoings.

[@lorion42]

@@audrete6071 So you say, that man only made cool things? Take for example the imperial units. They are man made and not very pracital. Why it is not more like the metric system? Man do made thinks that suck. And I'm pretty sure that the founders of Chistianity thought that they are right, even if some of the rules they declined are against man's desires.

[@Blazingbiskit]

​@octosquid48 homie, you really think that Christianity and more specifically the Bible don't have gigantic moral and social issues (hence they suck)?

[@whitemakesright2177]

LOL exactly, it's a hell of a sales pitch. "Our religion is miserable drudgery, come join us!"

[@Ailleas]

I had the displeasure of losing my grandma a few weeks ago. She was a Christian. We reassured her in her final moments with the idea that she was going to see her loved ones soon. I’m not Christian, but while reassuring her and grieving for her I noticed that I really want it to be true. The idea that she is with my grandpa and that she is no longer suffering is very comforting. Meaning Christianity definitely has its desirability.

[@zekrom6537]

its just coping as you wish it was true but deep down you know the sad reality that after death there is nothing

[@simsage1462]

Well, ain't that a hellish thought, where life and existence are entirely pointless and empty and that you would rather there be nothing than something at the end. It isn't cope to have faith in something outside the physical or even something after death, depending on the view of quantum mechanics you could take. So then, why are you here destroying a person's hope when there's no scientific evidence to disprove something after death? Why not have a little faith and hope in something science doesn't have an answer to? Or is it a way of copeing with there being something?

[@ShadyPaperclips]

sorry for your loss :/

[@PANZERKACKER]

It is sad, that people dont see the special thing christianity has to offer. They just deny, dont seek the truth. They just argue whilst I found the truth. Btw, religion isn't always right, but god is definetly real, if all of you like it or not.

[@TillyCorbin]

@@PANZERKACKER i don't believe in god but why would i not want it to be true? it would be a completely positive thing for me

[@Arexion5293]

Wait, this is an argument for Christianity and not Buddhism?

[@siddhartacrowley8759]

Yeah or jainism.

[@JonS]

He says that in the video

[@Arexion5293]

@@JonS Commented first minute in. It's a bad habit, I know.

[@likedebia4693]

Buddhism is man made so it would be a weird argument for Buddhism

[@uncleanunicorn4571]

Some confusion is understandable...

[@Dangerless1423]

"Freedom of religion" includes freedom to not have religion.

[@Utreshimon]

I hate social media for exactly this reason: A person can pose a thoughtless question or statement to millions that obviously invites debate and demands correction, and the people having to respond to it to debunk, correct or counter the argument are then driving engagement and cause it to be promoted in the algorithm with comments and views - when a mindless concept should be just as mindlessly ignored.

[@rubryc1557]

Agreed, dumb people can just say something stupid never questionning their claims and forget about it while others are left to think and discuss it.

[@Mefistofy]

In the end it's just an elaborate system to waste resources.

[@Rafaela_S.]

Keep the dislike ratio up, regardless of comments, if the video has a lot of dislikes, then the algorithm will not show it to a lot of people, regardless of the comments. A german dashcam channel had testet it out, with telling his viewers to dislike a video at the start of the video. Was the video with the least amount of views by far of all of his videos and some people even asked, when the next came out, if he made a mistake in the video number, since they haven't seen the disliked one, cause it didn't show in the recommendations. So if people would start to dislike, stupid and bad stuff, it would die down from alone, even if you would comment on it or engage in the comment section. (If it weren't for the personal recommendations, that at some point would not show these videos to you anymore to dislike them... And people who are as stupid as the creator and therefore like it...)

[@theultimatereductionist7592]

Welcome to your White Knight: Reductionism and Mathematics to the rescue. A formal way of generating infinitely many stupid questions and a formal way of answering/addressing them all at once. If people are not made to feel guilty about breeding and murdering animals for meat, then they should not be made to feel guilty or ashamed about anything. Period.

[@-blank-]

I actually dont agree. While i recognize some of the downsides, i think the best way to deal with these types of things IS for people to interact with and correct it. While social media does tend to spread misinformation, it also does the opposite. For every mindless concept that is ignored is an equally mindful one that would benefit the whole. The solution to these problems should rarely ever be getting rid of the advancement that caused it. Because we keep doing that and we never go forward as a species. Instead, we should inform the masses on ways to scrutinize the information they see and encourage better critical thinking. We should think of putting things in place to catch and correct misinformation and maybe even combat it ourselves. Thats what i think is the best solution anyways.

[@23Hiya]

I've seen this a lot with people who are in Evangelical orbits. "Desires" are just all the things that they take to be bad. I remember talking to my sister in law and she claimed that without her faith she would probably be neglectful of her daughter because what she desired was to be independent in certain ways. I literally had to point out that the very fact that she was worried and knew that she would feel guilty if she neglected her child meant that she also desired to be a good mother to her daughter. It's that brainwashing: "Everything I want is evil cuz I'm a sinful, depraved creature." People are literally taught to discount their most noble impulses and attribute them to God.

[@Trashgriffin]

The groundworks are simple: Everything good gets accredited to god, everything bad is one's own fault. Making people believe that they're evil and depraved from the get-go (but the god who created them to be that way is obviously perfect and would never make a mistake, huh?). It's horrendously toxic.

[@DundG]

How did she react to you pointing it out?

[@23Hiya]

@@DundG Ever since she had her daughter she's been thinking more critically about all the Orthodox Presbyterian stuff she was raised with. She received the comment well. She's still going to church and all that but has since said some things about doctrines that she will not be teaching to her daughter.

[@laislyra5512]

I agree. You're playing with a game of first and second order beliefs. The first order belief is "I want to be neglectful of my daughter to have more free time", and the second order belief disapproves of the first order belief, saying "But I won't do that because I want to be a good mom to my daughter first and foremost."

[@WastedTalent83]

Man what's worst.. is that religious people basically admit they are all Psycho that don't go around killing others just because they have faith.. How scary is that? XD what about self restraint and fukking respect for others without the fear of being sent to hell? Just like.. being a decent human being without gaining something or without a reason? I don't get how these people are so stupid i swear. In their mind, im not religious, so if i help somebody what happened? how do they explain that? do their brain just crash?

[@vibetech89]

Even 9 year old's arguments are better than tik tok level arguments.

[@ontoUmer]

*old's.

[@user-vt3vo1yd3v]

there’s no difference in them.

[@johnburn8031]

The op has fixed their mistake.

[@brotherben4357]

@@ontoUmer*olds’, if you’re being pure.

[@crono276]

@@user-vt3vo1yd3v dont diss the 9 yr old

[@MJ-mi9qc]

As a Christian with a good ability to think critically, I agree with you here. Most of the loudest Christians trying to make these claims have no idea what they’re talking about.

[@Trawpius]

I'd argue religion actually satisfies two of the biggest human desires. It assuages the fear of death, and it gives a reason for suffering. Many go one step further, and promise divine retribution against unpunished evildoers. I'd also argue that there are cognitive/rational explanations for asceticism beyond costly signaling. Some restrictions might have been proto-health measures, some might have been ways to maintain power structures (limiting women's freedom, punishing the 'greed' of lower classes), and some might have been consciously adopting behaviors in opposition to an enemy's culture

[@burningtheevidence8038]

With the action of "preying" it also gives you a feeling of power when you have none (thoughts and prayers) or makes it easier for you to not act in the real world.

[@MadisonPaige]

This right here

[@neonshadow5005]

It also fulfills peoples' desires to feel like their lives have a "higher purpose", a desire that is startlingly common place and it also fuels a superiority complex, something else that is all too common in people.

[@mono90286]

This diet goes against man's desire to eat ice cream, therefore it must have been given to us by aliens.

[@gozzilla177]

Space daddy*

[@MoboFromDoomed]

​@@gozzilla177LOL

[@chrisk6637]

​@@gozzilla177😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@thebirdguardien.14]

no. a diet for people who are overweight and unhealthy. A diet was created by people for health reasons.

[@Quataure]

@@thebirdguardien.14 why are you typing like that? and obviously the commenter knows, it is to mock the losers who repeat this argument in the first place

[@yessrodd]

"If your car can go over 100 miles an hour, why is there a speeding limit? that's literally the question's logic.

[@annoyingbstard9407]

That’ll be the Standard American “Literally?”

[@dunemae]

@@annoyingbstard9407name checks out

[@arlynnecumberbatch1056]

"if jesus christ died for our sin, why do you need to police everyone not to sin?"

[@jasondiasauthorpage615]

I'd say those wannabe influencers aren't even making an argument. They're pandering to people who already believe, hoping for engagement, wishing Tik Tok will make them viral and they can get paid.

[@gryphonbotha1880]

I feel this answer has hit the nail on the head.

[@weatheranddarkness]

It's the religion of grift.

[@AbsurdlyGeeky]

“And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full." Matthew 6:5 I'll see myself out.

[@meodrac]

of course they are, they're doing it to gain views and followers, they're doing it to attack their enemies and to make their followers feel good about themselves they're not trying to "save souls"

[@meateaw]

yep, tiktok religion farming.

[@cultmecca]

Glad you brought up Buddhism. When I heard “Christianity goes against man’s desires more than any other religion” my mind immediately jumped to Buddhism lol

[@minestar2247]

The irony with their statement is that, because of historical reasons, Christianity is the abrahamic religion that indulges the most in desires

[@aaronadamson7463]

As a Christian, I also thought the same thing. I really don't think that's a good argument as evidence that something is a divine teaching.

[@wcjerky]

Desiring to get rid of your desires in Buddhism? This is gonna be a problem...

[@Zerpersande]

Except buddhism, as originally outlined, was a) atheistic and b) a philosophy, not a religion

[@Zerpersande]

@@wcjerky how so?

[@lukaslambs5780]

I think it’s funny that no matter how many times someone answers these questions people will still use them as a “gotcha!” question.

[@stanley9868]

Yeah, someone genuinely tried to convert me with Pascal's wager a few months back and I was mostly just disappointed

[@AbsolutePixelMaster]

@@stanley9868 Pascal's wager makes a good gauge regarding how much time the individual has spent in deep thought on these matters. Not much

[@sidwhiting665]

True, although I see it more often from atheists trying to "gotcha" at Christians with silliness like mixed fabrics, shellfish, and claiming that the Bible promotes rape and slavery. It's a problem both sides have when they're more interest in scoring points for "likes" and publicity rather than engaging in substantive debate.

[@nope1918]

​@@stanley9868That would have the opposite effect on me. "But what if you're wrong and god does exist?" "Well, considering the state of the world and people in general, I think it's safe to conclude that if god does exist then they're an asshole. So I wouldn't pray to them anyways."

[@claytonreeves150]

They are incapable of actual learning. They only "learn" when the "information" coincides with their already-held beliefs.

[@hēæmburger]

Religion is very man made. "I don't want to die." **creates heaven** "I don't want my enemies to be happy." **creates hell**

[@stylesrj]

More like: "I don't want my enemies to be happy" *Creates a series of strict requirements to get into Heaven*

[@nateB-l7k]

@@stylesrj *including never wearing mixed fabrics and GOUGING OUT YOUR EYE IF YOU LOOK AT A WOMAN IN A SEXUAL MANNER* Verses: leviticus 19:19 & matthew 5:29, respectfully

[@somebodyody]

How imagine Christian “gotcha” questions gain popularity: Christian person: here’s a question no atheist can answer! Same person: *cannot answer the question themselves and assumes-without checking-that no one else can*

[@thelibyanplzcomeback]

"If Christianity was created by man, why does it go against all of man's desires?" Because it's a control mechanism. There, answered it.

[@seanlahm4826]

Rules for thee, not for me.

[@DundG]

Sounds like you answered before watching the video.

[@thelibyanplzcomeback]

@@DundG I watched much of it. Why does that even matter anyways? I answered it myself.

[@umbraignis0]

​@@DundG its a very reasonable answer however it is harder to prove and paints Christianity in a much more negative light, which is probably why it was avoided in the video. While somewhat obvious(in the same way government/laws are control mechanisms) it can be a poor argument to make because it will appeal to people who already look down on Christianity but will make those who respect it feel attacked and defensive and less likely to listen to the rest of your arguments.

[@Maladjester]

It doesn't go against them at all. People desire to transcend death, abrogate responsibility, clear their consciences without working to right wrongs they have done, presume superiority over others, externalize their faults, be loved and accepted, know that the people they think are wicked will suffer, shed their own pain and suffering, and a laundry list of other things, all of which religion promises/allows.

[@TheShapingSickness]

If suicide is man made, why does suicide go against man's desires?

[@Greeeenmoss]

Lol 😂💀 this actually what i want to do, does that makes me a divine being, goes against 'human desire' to survive and thrive 💀💀💀

[@chrisk6637]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@TheShapingSickness]

@@Greeeenmoss please don't do it

[@buukkreider544]

1 Timothy 4: This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, 4Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; 5Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

[@Person-24X]

@@buukkreider544while dude you should drop that song, amazing verse!

[@susanamartin2369]

0:52 I don't know why Rainbow Dash is being used as a symbol of atheism but I love it

[@kingfriday.]

Because the Atheist stereotypes on the internet are portrayed as neckbeard, brony, obese guys since that's what they really were in real life.

[@SkyTheDumbBirb]

Cuz she's lesbian, duhhhh

[@SkyTheDumbBirb]

Cuz she's lesbian, duhhhhh

[@SkyTheDumbBirb]

Cuz she's lesbian, duhhh

[@Quinn-40]

It feels like they’re trying to defend a toxic relationship. ‘The worse conditions I have to live in the more likely he is real and loves me right?’ Why does everyone assume god would be good?

[@Safetyman99]

The idea of an evil god, if a god even exists, is much more likely IMO. All you have to do is read the bible, assume that the god depicted within is all-knowing as Christians are required to believe, and make the conclusion that the god of the Christian bible is quite evil.

[@planetary-rendez-vous]

It's written he is good. That's it... And also there's no reason to love an evil god, or else you do it out of fear which is actually what happens to some people.

[@themetricamerican]

According to the bible, god is the undisputed champion of killing humans. He beats satan's body count by millions of people. Actions speak way louder than text, god is obviously the opposite of good.

[@kellydalstok8900]

@@planetary-rendez-vous Is it written? The OT paints a picture of a genocidal maniac and the NT of a maniac who has his own son killed; there’s nothing loving about those things. It’s all “love me or else”.

[@planetary-rendez-vous]

@@kellydalstok8900 Actually I don't know. I assume. In the Bible there's all this talk of love in the NT and sacrifice. You would assume god is all good from there I guess.

[@JohnJesus]

Christianity is in absolute favour of mans desires: "please, someone pay for my sins because i will never take responsibility for myself"

[@superduperdonkey911]

this is a vast misunderstanding, which in and of itself is understandable and many christians do not understand it either. we are not called by the bible or God to ask for forgiveness… we are called to repent and be better because of forgiveness. and it is stated in scripture that those that do not repent are not forgiven because God would know our heart. so no one can trick him and be like “ah ha! gotcha! i asked for forgiveness so i’m good!” so… youve done exactly what this video is about: make a wildly misinformed remark that is supposed to be a gotcha moment, but any christian that has studied scripture at all would know how to refute that… and we refute that by agreeing with you… ‘christians’ that behave that way are not what christians are supposed to do

[@fischio-gc-hides5994]

So repentance is getting your crap togheter and get your life in place?​@@superduperdonkey911

[@freshairkaboom8171]

@@superduperdonkey911 Which you know because you are the only person alive that knows the one true way to read the bible. Because you're such a special little boy that God personally put on Earth to speak truth, while all those other Christians are just pretenders. Gotcha. It's time to put down the ancient book and wake up in reality dude. Universes cannot be spoken into existence, and people don't walk on water. These are bullshit tales you've been told to believe in, and that harms millions of people every day.

[@matthewjohnson3656]

@@superduperdonkey911asking for forgiveness is literally the definition of repenting….

[@thoughtfuldevil6069]

​@@superduperdonkey911 Condemning people to eternal torture because they made an honest mistake is still sociopathic.

[@calculated-_-9464]

Imagine claiming Bertrand Russell has less will to live because of his atheism and then showing his lifetime of 97 years 💀. Apologist did not prove his point

[@infebris]

if anything atheists would have more reason to live longer lives, because you know, the endless nothingness after death? they seriously have no logic lmao

[@GravitasZero]

My Grandfather was very catholic He also wasn’t an idiot and didn’t try to force his beliefs onto me (or others). Sure we sometimes went to christmas mass, but that was because when you love someone you sometimes do thing *they* like. It made my grandpa happy so it made us happy. I don’t reject the possibility of a god, but I firmly reject the way humans have built almost all religions… for control and power more than for an actual belief. It also helps that by grandfather quite liked philosophy and science (he did NOT believe in creationism, or other BS people preach out of ignorance). Only time my grandfather tried to “convince” me to believe in god was when we talked about Pascal’s wager… because it kind of made sense (that’s why I don’t just plainly reject god since I can’t prove for or against anyway)

[@johnrockyryan]

Oh there definitely is a GOD but imo it isn't Jesus, Yahweh, Allah or Jehovah or any of those man made creations they link to THE ALMIGHTY.

[@danijelandroid]

As an atheist I don't feel despair. I accept the oblivious after death. Theist fear there is nothing after death.

[@thiagomiguel4544]

i dont think that is true at all, while some people does feel like this, you are generalizing too much

[@infebris]

theists don't fear there being nothing, they just can't comprehend there being nothing therefore they use religion to explain it.

[@FlanaFugue]

you mean you accept that oblivion is obvious?? 😁

[@feonor26]

Nope. Theists fear that they will be judged to be not good enough and then end up in hell. That is their deepest fear so they go overboard with their faith so that they will be "good enough". I know, I was one of them.

[@FlanaFugue]

​@@feonor26 We are talking about two different levels of motivation here: on the one hand, fear of going to Hell, but on the other, fear of oblivion, of nothingness. One is a conscious, known motivator and is what the bible tells people will happen if they are "bad" ; the other is the deeper primeval collective subconscious motivation for creating religion in the first place, and would rarely be admited to by believers because it essentially questions the foundation of their beliefs. i.e. Why do you go to church? A. to get spiritual and moral guidance so I can navigate my immortal soul down the path of righteious and gain a seat in paradise (fear of hell) B. because deep down I fear that there really IS nothing in the afterlife, so I comfort myself in the hope that this thing called "religion" is true and I will hopefully be immortal. (fear of oblivion, or, fear that all this religion stuff is fake). Which answer do you think the devoted will give?

[@DjVortex-w]

The answer is very simple: Because it's easier to control people when you make them feel guilty and in need of redemption by your religion. If you tell them "you can freely do whatever you want, you can do no wrong" then they don't need you for anything.

[@jartho3996]

Christianity isn't about control. When the gospels were first written about 2000 years ago, there was no need to control people, because they already had Judaism which controlled the people a lot more than what Christianity does. Christianity is basically Judaism but without so many rules and restrictions (just one: Love), and why would anyone who wants to control cut back on the rules? Christianity only turned into a control thing when catholics took matters into their own hands and starting monetising religion (which the bible clearly speaks against many times)

[@jartho3996]

Christianity isn't about control. When the gospels were first written about 2000 years ago, there was no need to control people, because they already had Judaism which controlled the people a lot more than what Christianity does. Christianity is basically Judaism but without so many rules and restrictions (just one: Love), and why would anyone who wants to control cut back on the rules? Christianity only turned into a control thing when catholics took matters into their own hands and starting monetising religion (which the bible clearly speaks against many times)

[@donld_duklin7378]

I was about to type this up, you are spot on! It’s as simple as that, I’m surprised how this argument out of all the arguments against religion seemed to be unanswerable one. 😂

[@mmgs1148]

Also knowing their secrets gives you power over them being afraid how will it affect them, in actual cults snitching and knowing things about common members is one of the tools of control. Jesuits promoted snitching and physical punishment in their schools

[@mwfmtnman]

Exactly. Control by the useless priest class.

[@Axel-wo6qu]

I think this just goes with the trend that tiktok arguments are very powerful when the counter argument can't be made in a tiktok amount of time.

[@viiextraviado3403]

Brandolini’s Law. The amount of energy needed to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than that needed to produce it.

[@jeffbaer5851]

Oh, it CAN. But anyone who regularly posts to, or relies on, Tiktok isn't intelligent enough to make that counter.

[@woojoow]

Honestly, if anybody wants a short and pithy response to this supposedly-difficult question, it's actually pretty easy. Why would a man-made religion be against man's desires? The simple answer is the old "opiate of the masses" explanation. Rich and powerful men will push religion on the populations they control in order to preserve the power structures that keep them at the top. They tell you that you must be pious and humble and virtuous, while they themselves will be none of those things. There you go, question defeated.

[@YabaDabaDoiBoi]

New viewer here. I'd like to say two things. 1) Great logic, GMSkeptic. Watching this video made me a little less worried about the future of humankind. 2) My take on religion: Christianity, like all religions, is a fairy tale that was invented to explain why everything exists before we started to develop scientific knowledge. And to make us feel less afraid about our loved ones and ourselves dying. Thinking about the self ending forever brings out a type of fear that most folks can’t deal with at all. So reality must be defeated!

[@mentarium9741]

i know this is a month late, but you forgot the key component of many large religious organizations: control. What is the best way to control a group of people? have a divine being give them a set of rules to follow. Then it's not just another dude telling them what to do. it's another dude relaying a divine message. When the church then became big it was a massive generator of money and power that actively conquered and spread through force while extorting the poor and uneducated for money while also not even letting them read the text the religion was based on.

[@galvenin505]

"Christianity gives a reward, a purpose for being a better man. The religion was built around man's desire to be better despite flaws, therefore it is not against man's desire, but for it." -An Atheist

[@wyleecoyotee4252]

Which athiest

[@galvenin505]

@@wyleecoyotee4252 Me

[@SonyaEre]

@@wyleecoyotee4252 just an average atheist you will find on the street lol

[@wyleecoyotee4252]

@@SonyaEre An athiest wouldn't ever say anything like that. I certainly wouldn't.

[@SonyaEre]

@@wyleecoyotee4252 Well I'm an atheist and I certainly would. Although not everyone is the same of course. Sorry if I have offended you, it was meant to be a little joke. If you wish i can delete it :)

[@shanillaabdul9896]

Those claiming to have questions atheists can't answer fail to realize that "I don't know" is a valid response.

[@MayHugger]

Or that sometimes there is an obvious answer but it would take too much time to bother explaining.

[@jace_d]

Or that there is an answer but they don't accept it cuz it goes against what they believe :/

[@liamdood11]

And furthermore, it is often the ONLY valid response.

[@0Fyrebrand0]

The "questions" are rhetorical, in the sense that they aren't actually putting them out there in the hopes an atheist will respond. These types of posts are to spread around to other like-minded believers, to reassure themselves in their faith and that unbelievers are stupid and confused.

[@wyleecoyotee4252]

Or they can't be bothered and it's a total waste of time to talk to religious folks

[@koimonsterkhaos6329]

"It goes against man's desires" the Aztecs who cropped their own body parts off...

[@weatheranddarkness]

as the fremen say "i cut it there, now that's where it ends"

[@qstionblomens6138]

Then there’s the human sacrifice, which I think is the most against man’s desires people can get

[@annara686]

​@@qstionblomens6138, sacrifice was convenient way to get rid of children, war captives or means for population control or wealth extortion (if all sacrifice victim possessions were stolen/taken by temple) and also intimidation tactic

[@annara686]

Let's not pretend that humans are hive mind with same desires and would never harm one another if given a chance

[@destroyerofturtles5024]

@@annara686most wouldn’t, humans are built for cooperation.

[@delphic464]

"I did horrible things to childern, stole from the needy, and violently attacked those who don't think the way I do." "Do you say sorry?" "I sure did." "Ok. you're cool." Talk about man's desires!

[@jennifersmith4864]

Being an atheist means never having to say yer sorry.

[@purp4168]

​@@jennifersmith4864Correction. Being an atheist means you don't apologise to get a reward when you die.

[@jennifersmith4864]

@@purp4168 Like I said, being an atheist means never having to say yer sorry.

[@purp4168]

@@jennifersmith4864 I suppose, but it don't mean it isn't a polite thing to do

[@jennifersmith4864]

@@purp4168 Hey, you said being an atheist means you DON'T apologize. No offense but why be a hypocrite now & do it cuz it's polite? Who are you trying to be polite for?

[@These_Old_Engines]

There is a very simple answer to this question. "It went against the COMMON MAN's desires". Religion has been used as a tool of control for the lower classes for a very long time. Those with power and knowledge can safely ignore the teachings of a religion. Those of the lower classes cannot......Additionally it benefits those in power to have the masses forgo their desires baser desires and work for a "common good". And while this can start out good, it does not take long for it to be shifted into control and dominance.

[@massimilianoreali4398]

Tecnically religion its a thing that would have involved every single man and woman without looking at the status its not fault of the religion itself if humanity is trash

[@kevinw.6177]

@@massimilianoreali4398 If humanity invented religion, then yes. Yes it is.

[@massimilianoreali4398]

@@kevinw.6177 no its still not many principle of religion are not wrong when they aren't manipulated

[@weatheranddarkness]

@@massimilianoreali4398 That's a pretty fragile position, because it doesn't directly rely on anything else that's been established in this context. But it does hint at some of the other motivations for "religion". That's a broad and deep field which kind of gets swept over in discussions like the one from this video. There's a post below about Bentham's opinion on asceticism, which I think underlines the desire to kind of dismiss the whole value system that creates ascetic practices amongst some here. Humanity's fundamental problem is its tension between animalistic survival and its potential to something more complex and sophisticated than it sees in other species.

[@massimilianoreali4398]

@@weatheranddarkness to what position are you referring the fact that religion was meant for every single person without counting status or the fact that some religious principles are good?

[@OceanusHelios]

Q: "If Christianity is man-made, then why does Christianity go against common sense, intelligence, reality, science, humanity, humulity, compassion, fairness, kindness, and mercy?" A: "Because Christianity is man-made."

[@Trashgriffin]

Yes! Or the Christian deity is just evil. But thankfully there is no evidence for its existence, yet a lot of evidence for the whole thing to be made up by humans. Phew.

[@fritztom9918]

I think christianity goes with intelligence, reality, science, humanity, etc. Btw: You need moral standards for society and therefore you need christianity

[@mohamaddelkhah]

Can you tell me what Christianity's moral standards exactly is? For example, does it forbid a person to attempt to murder their innocent child? And what if God wants them to do it?

[@Alpharelic]

​@@fritztom9918you're telling me that a book which says: -Insects have 4 legs -Whales are fish -Humans can be made directly from soil -Snakes can talk -The universe was made in a week -You need to invite your attackers to beat you up more -Women who defend their husbands need their arm cut off Goes with logic? Especially when the data collected from observation, reflection and experimentation goes against all that? Yeah, no. Also: Christianity isn't the only moral framework in existence. Aside from those of every other religion, most atheists follow humanism, which prioritises humans above any supernatural matters. The morality stems from evolution of social traits and states that we should act with reason and empathy, consider the consequences of out actions and the likely impact on other people and animals.

[@j.m.w.5064]

​@@fritztom9918How exactly would you derive a moral solution to any given problem from the bible? Serious question.

[@3DBanditTutorials]

Being sober is a christian thing? As a Belgian this feels weird, since our greatest Beers are made by monks in monasteries and are even seen as cultural heritage.

[@icecream3281]

Inderdaad 😂

[@happyspaceinvader508]

Champagne was also invented by monks. Teetotal Christians are weird, but fortunately only represent a minority of all Christians.

[@patsonical]

Also, didn't Jesus literally turn water into wine?

[@melaniemanning2462]

American Cheistians operate under the premise that they are the only Christians.

[@smiles1035]

@@patsonical *metaphorically

[@praiseafrogtoday]

“my answer will not be anti-christian only anti-ignorance” very cool 👍

[@marc21256]

"Christianity denies all human desires" Man's biggest desire [citation needed]: live forever. Christianity: Sure, you can live forever.

[@augustuslunasol10thapostle]

@@VSLS06 it is one of the most biggest desires in the world

[@PJM257]

I would argue that people don't want to live forever. They are just scared of death because of the uncertainty of what it will be like. Christianity and many other religions offer an answer to this, and that makes them appealing.

[@DevilOfRoses]

Oh, never mind that it offers absolution for ones sins, allowing the people who know they're being pricks an out through 'the forgiveness of God'.

[@ganymede3141]

🎯🎯🎯

[@FreezingHot]

What if I want to live forever in this life? Also afterlife isn't living

[@tonyrex99]

DO this people ever look up their questions before asking it?

[@finn6364]

No, they don't even think about them 😂

[@C-Farsene_5]

They want publicity, not an insight

[@Frommerman]

This content isn't directed at us. It's directed at themselves. They ask themselves the question, find they have no answer, and assume that's proof of their position. Then the first time one of them foolishly asks one of us and we immediately answer they find themselves confused.

[@not_enough_space]

They're asking these questions precisely because they don't want answers. As soon as an answer is provided, they're frustrated and annoyed that we didn't play along with their not answering game.

[@redtiger7268]

Actually they do look up the questions before BUT they only listen the people who already agree with them for the "answers"

[@TheBarelyBearableAtheist]

An additional point that could be raised is that, in practice, believers tend to apply the restrictions to other people more than to themselves. In that sense, such restrictions are a claim to power over those around you. The restrictions they apply to themselves are the restrictions they are comfortable with. And let's not overlook the fact that if a believer _breaks_ any of those restrictions, a simple prayer of contrition is sufficient to restore themselves to a state of forgiveness--while still insisting that these restrictions are binding on others. Such a self-serving religious system is very much consistent with a human origin.

[@tma2001]

yeah there's a reason its called 'organised religion' - its all about control and do as I say and not as I do.

[@darlalathan6143]

So hypocrisy is about dominance?

[@aibalta6340]

​@@darlalathan6143everything person ever did is about dominance

[@---Dana----]

Christianity endorses patriarchy, misogyny, racism and homophobia.

[@dewardroy6531]

Yes, darla.

[@Jason-hh5mq]

Mentioning both Buddhism and Jainism is awesome. I am a Buddhist that follows many Jain practices of non-violence towards all living beings. I do not limit myself to only a single religious or secular path as you can find wisdom in all kinds of teachings.

[@Anticrystal88]

If Christianity goes against man's desires. and God made man to have those desires, is Christianity then some kind of "I dare you" perverse game?

[@Arexion5293]

Maybe they should start calling God as daddy instead of father.

[@PaxRascal]

​@@Arexion5293😂😂😂

[@antonioscendrategattico2302]

I mean, if we tried to untangle the downright radioactive mess of psychosexual issues deeply embedded in most religions but Christianity specifically we'd be there for ages.

[@nondescriptcat5620]

yes.

[@shadowdragon3521]

>Omniscient being puts tree in Garden of Eden knowing full well Eve will take the fruit and then punishes her for it

[@KadrmasPaul]

Christian here. This is an excellent analysis, delivered without attacking or insulting. Great work.

[@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic]

I’m glad you liked it!

[@spikes3216]

@@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic L

[@ARealItalian]

@@spikes3216L ?

[@thiagomiguel4544]

@@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic sadly, i think a lot of people in the comments are stuck in trying to be dismissive of religion alltogether

[@tourdeflores2693]

imagine worshipping a dead jew on a stick

[@ftt7429]

I swear these people remind of when I was a kid, a little too old to believe in Santa, trying to sooth my belief with any lame excuse I could come up with. Always so sad to me when adults do this.

[@allthe1]

They flood their thoughts with these reflections because they don't want to deal with their reality, the reality of their own suffering and that of people around them. It distracts them from confronting evil and defending themselves from those who really harm or harmed them. It gives them something other than their pain to think about.

[@darlalathan6143]

@@allthe1 A very good answer!

[@massimilianoreali4398]

​@@allthe1i think you higly misunderstood religious people if you think this is why people want to believe in god

[@ashkebora7262]

@@massimilianoreali4398 It's one of many _possible_ reasons people believe in God. One is ABSOLUTELY a desire to _not_ face reality. You'd have to be plain stupid to fail to see that.

[@massimilianoreali4398]

@@ashkebora7262 generalization is howewer a bad thing overly in discussions of topic where generalization is heavily used for showing the superiority of one of the two sides P.S:i do not refere to this comment section

[@EvangelineBelle]

If sexual activity is man’s desire… does that mean asexuals are divine deities???

[@morganwoods8929]

As an asexual, I see this as an absolute win 😂

[@RayzTheGreat]

This is the funniest thing ive seen in such a long time

[@oldestdreamdokja]

​@@morganwoods8929wtf is asexual? You can reproduce by yourself?

[@dizzylilthing]

​@@oldestdreamdokjaYou don't experience sexual attraction.

[@oldestdreamdokja]

@@dizzylilthing oh.. I thought I was like amoeba type

[@pauljensen6699]

My immediate thought when I heard this premise was, “alright. Give me a list of what you think are desires of man.” -The desire to be a part of a group or tribe (the desire for numbers). -The desire for protection. -The desire to lead the pack, to be an authority (civil, moral, or other) -The desire to be lead (by an authority or otherwise) Yeah, I’d say the premise that man’s desires are inherently antithetical to Christianity is a false one.

[@Huorfern]

Thank you, i was about to write some of these as i felt them missing in the video. Especially the aspect of perceived safety that comes from restrictions is an important part of any group dynamic as safety is often inherently understood as an antithesis of freedom.

[@yurimiva]

It also kind of reminds me of how animals are organized socially, especially our closest relatives, and it feels a lot like their society, just focused on spirituality and with some sort of morality that's actually not been there for a veryyy long time.

[@TrafalgarWaterDLaw-dl5cm]

Religion also serves the prevention of chaos. Especially back during the very uncivilized days with no real surveylance or dna testing to pfove crimes as essily. The fear of hell can stop crimes. Can make people act in ways helping the community in hopes to reach heaven. Empowers the church/cult in charge. And enriches its members. So it absolutely makes sense a manmade religion can be against all of mankinds basic instincts. Thats how laws work. And religion served as law as well. And thosr in charge get rich and very much endulge in desire.

[@kellydalstok8900]

I think that the desire of a handful of sociopaths to dominate people played an important part in the emergence of organized religion. Just look at present day power hungry mega pastors.

[@jzlove5088]

Tell me you don’t understand the desires of the human flesh without telling me you don’t understand the desires of the human flesh…..

[@heitorcoutinho4462]

"Their proponents spread them with a smugness that can only be achieved through a profound ignorance of the subject on which they're speaking" Ouch.

[@kevinw.6177]

That bit was particularly potent with the actual audio cut out. Not that the copyrighted music would actually distract from how dumb it is to just stand behind a caption and make a series of comically fake expressions like a clown practicing their faces.

[@RCake]

Thus was the very best moment in the video, I loved how this felt 🥰

[@Cajek2]

The most frustrating one: "hOw dO U hAvE MorALiTy wItHoUt gOd" TAKE AN INTRO TO PHILOSOPHY CLASS Dozens and dozens of morality systems that don't use the bible!

[@Zangelin]

it's pretty simple. I don't want to be killed. So killing others would be bad. and apply to pretty much everything else.

[@marknieuweboer8099]

Recently I met a nice variation on this theme. Apologist: "If not from God, where does logic come from?" Me: "Logic is manmade - you don't even know to ask the right questions " *) Apolologist: "If logic is manmade I can make my own logic that rejects what you assert." Me: "That's exactly what apologists like you have been doing on internet last quarter of a century." The right question is "How do you ground logic (and morals) without God?" Atheists can answer that one too, but at least they can't use the answers to refute theism.

[@whitemountainapache3297]

Marcus Aurelius, Meditations.

[@jmwild1]

I have one more frustrating that is a follow-up to "you need god to be moral". The response I've gotten when I say I don't need a higher power to tell me not to kill or steal or do harm to others: I am being inspired by God to have those morals, even if I don't think I am. I may as well tell them that I'm a Last-Thursdayist (the universe and everything in it, including our memories, was snapped into existence last Thursday) and there's nothing anyone can say to refute that.

[@marknieuweboer8099]

@ jmw: in such cases I answer: "Aha, you know and understand better how I think and feel than I myself."

[@justanartist23]

“If Christianity is man-made, why does it go against man’s desire?” BRO I’M BUDDHIST AND THAT LOGIC APPLIES TO US😭😭😭🙏🙏

[@UncySpam]

People who pose these questions will never accept that you can answer the question, as they don’t believe the answer you do provide is valid.

[@Chocomunchie]

Let's save a step and admit they don't even want to hear our response. They think they made a "gotchya!" moment, and are content with it ending there, in their false sense of satisfaction. They don't really care what we have to say in rebuttal.

[@douglaswolfen7820]

​@@Chocomunchie this is why I like to give them a choice before I respond. "Good question. Now do you actually want to hear the answer? Or do you just want to assume it can't be answered so you can make a rhetorical point?" I like the idea of giving them that space, where they either have to admit that they aren't actually having a conversation, or else they have to invite the answer. Getting them to actually invite an answer is a good step towards getting them to actually think (at least a little bit) about what you say

[@Starcrash6984]

The fact that there are people who will argue in bad faith is not a good reason to never argue, nor to automatically assume that your debate partner is incapable of arguing in good faith.

[@Conqueror-of-Demons]

@@douglaswolfen7820 Thats a good advice.. imma do that from now on.

[@douglaswolfen7820]

​@@Conqueror-of-Demons👍 (careful with the wording though. The version I posted here is a bit confrontational. There are softer versions)

[@kamper5789]

“All religion, my friend, is simply evolved out of fraud, fear, greed, imagination, and poetry.” ― Edgar Allan Poe

[@beans3977]

A good quote to remember. Thank you for sharing

[@ecogreen123]

amen

[@Maladjester]

Quite generous to refer to any of it as poetry.

[@cursedcat6467]

@@ecogreen123wait a minuteeeeee

[@ecogreen123]

@@cursedcat6467 lol

[@charleslamb2214]

My one question for them, in response to their claim…. “Then why are you so smug?"

[@meateaw]

Simple answer, "Why do you follow your religion?" if the answer is: "It gives me hope/meaning/belonging" then boom, desire fulfilled, answered their own question. "It doesn't go against all mans desires".

[@iantaakalla8180]

As a question, being overly smug goes against man’s desires for autonomy when you impose beliefs onto people, which means smugness is divine, or smugness comes from some need to defeat enemies and to feel morally superior to hated foes, which means smugness is of man’s origin. Does this mean all behaviors, going towards some man’s desires and denying others, prove all humans are semi-divine /s

[@chuckkv]

Social creatures will ... socialize. Thus fulfilling their desire to socialize. Imagine that. Great explanation!

[@davidtaylor142]

The question presupposes that greed, violence, etc are inherently "man's desires" when they arent

[@Maladjester]

Of course it does. "Everything good comes from God™, everything bad comes from you. Have we offered you our installment plan for salvation?"

[@RonJohn63]

Greed, violence, etc are most certainly _some_ of man's desires. But that's the point: being _some_ of man's desires means that man has _other_ desires (like sacrificing today for a better tomorrow).

[@syppy7416]

"Atheists can't answer this question" then they proceed to ask the easiest question ever

[@Nobody_Shroom]

4 year olds' can't answer this. What's 2+2

[@yohei72]

I first noticed this tendency in creationists. "If we evolved from monkeys, why are there still monkeys? Checkmate!"

[@andyferari6478]

“Theist getting asked very tough questions” *proceeds to strawman and ignore the answers*

[@RobMost]

If laws are manmade, why do they go against man's desires? Edit: Because it's apparently not fully clear, this is a simile to the argument about commandments not being manmade because they go against man's desires. The reason is the same.

[@lilyayora]

If I ate the number of donuts I desire, I would become very, very fat.

[@RobMost]

@@lilyayora I don't know how that relates to my comment, but sure, me too.

[@ThatWhichObserves]

@@RobMost it's reducing the intensity down from 'law' to 'self control'. Self control being against 'man's own desires' it's more fundamental to the human than the society. Especially with the disparity of laws from place to place (Age of consent is a basic one that differs from country to country, and in the us, from some states to other states.. even)

[@Digicara64]

because the government are lizard people!!!1! 😱😱😱

[@RealMiami33141]

The Bible feeds into humanity’s most basic desires for control and self-righteousness. Next question, this is fun.

[@jennifersmith4864]

Are you an atheist? If so, why are you trying to interpret an old book you don't believe? Why not interpret Mother Goose? Oops, that's 3 questions --- well, pick one.

[@Ignyus_rock]

​@jennifersmith4864 1. Yes 2. About 63% of the people in my crountry believe it is true and a good chunk try to put it in school and teach as true and/or try to put it in the government. And people interpet the bible in a way that causes harm to others 3. I dont have an intrest in that book

[@SharedPhilosophy]

The smugness is the worst part about the whole situation here. It's so sad and irritating to see that these people truly think they found an argument which has no answer and is impossible to debunk. As an atheist arguing against these views it's often extremely hard to keep my irritation out of the conversation, but it is nesseary if we're striving to achieve any progress. Awesome video Drew!

[@HungryWarden]

Their stupid smug faces make me want to instinctually get a disinfectant wipe and disinfect the screen.

[@luminousdragon]

The core of Christianity is "Be a christian or burn in eternal hellfire, but if you DO become christian you'll be in heaven forever". This is the most blatant, most extreme possible example you could even CONCEIVE of for a religion to appeal to mans desires. "You dont want to burn in hell for ever? You desire eternal life in Heaven filled with bliss dont you?" That is the very core of the religion, and it appeals for humans desire to avoid pain and also the desire to be in bliss and never die, and its stated in the most extreme way you could imagine. everything else is the things you are forced to do in order to get your desired outcome that it has laid out for you.

[@jimmythebold589]

t h i s

[@iantaakalla8180]

Heck, even the version that actually takes into account how people who are into Christianity want it to be read is more like “God is an infinite grounding, so if you have sinned you can repent, not do it again, and still be a good person”. This is still an appeal for the desire to “be a good person”, so it is still very much aligned with man’s desires.

[@Artist_Doing_Art_Mildly]

think you I was waiting for this comment, Christianity is the definition of appeal to man's desires

[@vexywexypoo]

They think they have such a "gotcha" question but they mostly argue against average people who happen to be atheist instead of people who have deducated themselves to theological discussions.

[@WastedTalent83]

man.. i tell you, even idiots can answer that question, you don't need to be a theologist.. It goes against men desire exactly for the purpose to look convincing. Religions are a weapon of mass mind control.. they have to be convincing otherwise nobody would follow it.. Also its a stupid question in itself as the guy in the video show, because there are many things that go against man desire, and they are not all magically divine because of it..

[@Melkutin]

Christianity answers man's desire to worship and be in the favour of his creator. Anecdote: The essential feeling in my conversion from secular to christian was precisely the desire for my creator and source of being. Basically I was looking for my origin. End anecdote. It was created by man in cooperation with God.

[@Let5g069]

they say christianity goes against man's desires, but fail to see the fact that religion was created due to man's desire to answer existentiall questions. and when they imply that restrictions religion places go against man's desires, those are LITERALLY rules on how to be a good person, so if you have a desire to break those rules... seek help?

[@WaillerC5]

If you think human beings need a book written in a society two millennia ago to have a basic understanding of current well-being and ethics, seek help

[@bphennesy]

What is also ignored is the fact that the xtian churches have continued to fragment into sects that allow more and more of what people want like sexual preference, for example.

[@Nerobyrne]

No, there's nothing wrong with picking up sticks on Sunday, eating shellfish or having "relations" without permission from the state.

[@WaillerC5]

@@Nerobyrne Not to mentioned that stoning women to death, beating a child for their mistakes and openly accepting slavery is not a particularly great rulebook to becoming a good person, at least in my atheist view

[@BalaenicepsRex3]

The fact that they reduce "man's desires" to only drunkenness and sex, while also claiming humans are inherently spiritual, crave divinity, meaning, family and love... Which at the same time they proudly accept their religion directly caters to all those inherent desires LOL Saying "Christianity is the most restrictive of religions" is also extremely ignorant. Meanwhile, Buddhists, Hindus and even ancient Greeks very often starved themselves to the bone for enlightenment.

[@ProphetofZod]

So apparently Christianity is our only possible source of hope, morality, or meaning, yet it still goes against all our desires. Okay.

[@ProphetofZod]

Oh never mind. That was the first thing Drew said. 😆

[@Trashgriffin]

@@ProphetofZod It's a really good point. It works by shaming a person for their plain existence.

[@Demetri450]

When someone said to me while smirking; how do I know right from wrong if I don't believe. I could have given an answer that was sensible, truthful and logical, but then I also realized how insulting that question was; not just to me but to everyone who doesn't believe in that nonsense. I said if that is the only thing that keeps you from doing "wrong" (whatever that may mean) then you need a new belief system including a new god and now I know to watch my back and to keep an eye on you when you're around.

[@0Fyrebrand0]

"If you don't get your morals from God, then what's to stop you from raping and killing anyone you want?" "Religion goes against man's desires." I think we just found out something disturbing about their desires...

[@Digicara64]

i hope a giant group of people saw that live

[@d.chruscielewska4735]

Just because someone can't answer a question doesn't mean you're right

[@jcs1025]

These people make atheism so much more complicated than it needs to be. It’s simply the rejection of a premise based on lack of evidence. Do they really lack the intelligence or imagination to conceive of anything that someone may not believe in? It’s almost funny sometimes.

[@eugeneoisten9409]

Short answer: Aye Long answer: Yeeeeeessssshhhhh

[@lukepoplawski3230]

Just another way to demonize and attack an “out group” and tribal tendency leans towards that. Takes an educated and introspective mind to entertain an idea and not be consumed by it. And IQ studies of theists vs non-theists is pretty telling on that.

[@nikushim6665]

@@lukepoplawski3230 The learning/reward center tends to favor it. Attacking the "bad guys" and having a collective group ("good guys") behind you patting you on the back for doing it is one big Dopamine generating circle jerk.

[@AllHailDiskordia]

Wishful thinking and indoctrination at an early age produces religious people

[@kevinw.6177]

@@nikushim6665 Gee, thanks for the flashbacks to high-school.

[@nunyabusiness9307]

To any religious person who asks “questions atheists can’t answer” here’s my response to virtually all of them: Does an unfounded answer count as answering a question, or do we have to provide evidence for it to count? If an unfounded answer counts, I can answer any “question atheists can’t answer” by making up an answer on the spot. I just don’t on principle. If there has to be evidence for it to count, than any answer that’s grounded in your religious beliefs doesn’t count as an answer until we have a way to test your religious beliefs and they come back positive. Assertions without evidence to back them up being used as answers are either acceptable or they’re not. Pick one. (This is my response to those who ask this question. It is 𝘯𝘰𝘵 an attack on all religious people. If you’re a religious person who doesn’t do things like this, this isn’t meant for you.)

[@riluna3695]

Mad respect to this comment. There's an unspoken message hiding behind these questions: "If you can't answer them, I win, and that means my belief is the one that corresponds to reality". Which is flawed on so many levels. It's a false dichotomy, for starters. Meanwhile your challenge to it is a true dichotomy that shows that no matter which of those two things is true, it leads far, far away from where the theist wants to be. Some people place so much emphasis on having an answer to life's questions that they completely forget that the goal is to have the CORRECT answer. And if they really did have the provably correct answer, your challenge would only highlight that fact all the more. And yet somehow, it always leads away from religion when properly investigated.

[@nunyabusiness9307]

@@riluna3695 I completely agree. I’ve always believed that having no answer was better than having the wrong answer (in any context other than an exam). Having no answer can be remedied very easily. Having an incorrect answer can result in you being wrong forever and engaging in behaviors that cause harm based on that incorrect information. There’s also a common double standard here: I’m expected to have an answer that is grounded in some kind of testable reality, while they only need their religious traditions. If there isn’t a testable answer, that in their mind is a win for religion.

[@riluna3695]

@@nunyabusiness9307 It's funny you mention exams here. The way the system is set up, it does indeed benefit you to guess on something like a multiple choice question. But I've heard of high-level exams for things like doctorates that run on a different system. You gain points for a correct answer, you get no points for not answering, and you LOSE points for an incorrect answer. So guessing suddenly has a much higher chance of backfiring than helping you. I vastly prefer this system, for basically the exact reason you just alluded to. Teaching people, especially doctors, that it's worth just taking a shot in the dark when you don't actually know, 'cuz you might be right, is FAR more likely to lead to immense harm and outright tragedies. Better to encourage being as certain as you can reasonably be before progressing with something so risky.

[@nunyabusiness9307]

@@riluna3695 Completely agree. That makes way more sense. It’s also worth mentioning that if you look up an answer during an exam, that’s “cheating.” Because why research something when you can guess at it? Ridiculous.

[@riluna3695]

@@nunyabusiness9307 mhm. It's a nasty combination. The intent is for you to show that you know it under your own power, but in practice, when combined with other factors, it just leads to a "you are smart if you know things and dumb if you don't" mindset, which must necessarily lead to "you are smart if you appear to _others_ as if you know things", as no one can know your inner thoughts. Which is an extremely toxic view to land on, that only ever leads away from truth and understanding. Obviously not every person exposed to the system will instantly become fully corrupted by it. Different base personalities will respond to the same things very differently. But anyone who would be receptive to or vulnerable to that idea in the first place need to be shown firsthand how it leads to harm, or they'll dive right in and be lost. Once your sense of self-worth relies on the appearance that you are never wrong, you will never admit it, even if it's obvious to everyone; even when doing so would benefit you greatly in the long-term. Thus learning becomes impossible, because only those who are willing to try to know better and be better will actually achieve it. You can't force these things on someone unwilling, it just isn't possible. They have to want it themselves.

[@coffeegator6033]

Basically, you don't control people if they are doing what they want. Religion is useless unless someone is making you do something you don't want to. Also, money.....