George’s Men OR Jacobite Sympathisers? Newcastle’s True Loyalties Will SHOCK You!

[@reecehansen3179]

Videos turned out great,thanks for having me on.

[@TynesideLife]

Thank you again Reece 🙏👍🏻

[@THENORTHSACE73]

😂😂😂

[@jimso771]

As a Scottish person I think that the majority of the people in Newcastle and surrounding areas are descended from Scot’s judging by the Scottish surnames in Geordie country 😊 I have always felt a strong connection between Scotland and all the Geordie people.

[@TynesideLife]

It’s the other way around Jim 😉

[@EpicAelflaed]

The lowland Scot’s have always had English mercenaries and settlers going back centuries. The Scot’s Irish in Ulster were from northern England and lowlands of Scotland (mainly English people)

[@ibana8449]

In this weeks paper, a university study discovered that Geordies & Scots can detect false accents better than anyone else. Great stuff

[@TynesideLife]

Oh wow

[@robinmackie2840]

I'm Glaswegian born and bred. Proud Weegie and proud "half Geordie" (Mum was from Gosforth). Personally I love listening to voices and accents....and I can recognise voices easily...when I hear anyone on the phone or whatever.... I used to work in an office where countless calls would come in from dozens and dozens of external colleges and so many different staff members. I actually prided myself in knowing who was speaking within a few seconds 👍

[@sherlockh22]

Thanks Ed and special thanks to Reece, hope he publishes his work.

[@TynesideLife]

👊🏻👍🏻

[@MONTYMAGPIE2K15]

Can't beat a new tynesidelife upload notification 👍🏻☕️. Cheers eddy top channel

[@TynesideLife]

👊🏻👍🏻

[@da90sReAlvloc]

My Scottish mate reckons Geordies in both Gateshead and Newcastle are exiled Scots. Who stayed in those locations and invited family and married, .he reckons loads of Scots left Scotland and inhabited these areas and that's why we share similar words and says that Geordie was a Scottish word, Great video Eddie stay safe 👍

[@nobbytang]

Newcastle and surrounding was always an English bastion …medieval English Lords and families like the Percy’s, Clifford’s and Neville’s made sure of that …..Border wars and the Revers prevented and immigrants from just moving anywhere they wanted ….

[@EpicAelflaed]

And same with lowlands of Scotland - full of English mercenaries settled there. Likely mixed with Scot’s

[@robinmackie2840]

I'm Glaswegian, born and bred....but half Geordie (Mum from Gosforth). I come down to Newcastle very often. Very interesting video.❤ Thanks

[@RussellFogg-ew1ju]

Reece certainly knows his stuff. Another great video about the history of the Toon. Well done Eddie.

[@TynesideLife]

☝️👍🏻

[@PaulM_aka_4c21]

Absolutely correct, everyone in Durham and south Northumberland were referred to as Geordies (including Sunderland and nearly as far as Middlesborough) were Geordies right up to the 1980’s.

[@henryblunt8503]

This is true. Scot Dobson, in his book "Larn Yersel Geordie", even goes into variations of the Geordie language in Durham. I don't think people like me from the Teesdale/Tees valley ever thought of themselves as Geordies though, though the rest of the country seems to think we are!

[@angelavasey5083]

In the 70's people from Sunderland were called Maken & Takem

[@PaulM_aka_4c21]

@@angelavasey5083Late 70’s and 80’s as an insult by the mags, but adopted by Wearsiders. However as a SAFC Geordie supporter we were all Geordies back then, we even sang at 73 cup final, Geordies here geordies there Geordies every f*****g where la la la la, la la la, la la. I was born in 1958 and was watching at Roker Park for years and that is what we sang. Have you actually watched this video as this is what he confirms. Geordies are the whole of the North East, Durham and Northumberland whether you like it or not.

[@StewartSelkirk]

@@angelavasey5083 Correct. Sunderlanders were never referred to as Geordies in my lifetime; unless of course it was some ignoramus from the Home Counties who didn't know better! 😆

[@StewartSelkirk]

@@PaulM_aka_4c21 Definitely not late 70's! When I was 16, in 1972, it was commonly used on Tyneside and Geordies were regarded as Newcastle and Gateshead only; Tyneside's not Wearsiders.

[@johnd8538]

Well in Sheffield and south yorkshire George was always "judd" like in kes, Geod, judd, same thing. The area was part of the ancient kingdom of Northumbria under I think Aethelstan.

[@johnd8538]

And of course the "jocks and the geordies" in the old comic proves it true that the geordies are scotsmen with there heads kicked in 😂

[@TynesideLife]

☝️👊🏻👍🏻

[@stevepearce1913]

So pleased to hear that. It's no surprise that the upper classes supported the King while the rest of the Toon were against the idea of being ruled by a German who apparently couldn't even speak a word of English. We Geordies have always been and still are proud of our heritage and it gladdens me to find out that we were not as a city a bunch of royalists.

[@TynesideLife]

☝️👊🏻👍🏻

[@keithcharlton-g6y]

I’m from Hebburn and my wife is from shields, we recently did a dna test and I’m 60% Scottish and she is 55%, think if more people did a test they would probably get a shock, I was only 24% English

[@gordimac9]

i done one of those tests am 57%irish,scottish and welsh 21% scandinavian 16.1%greek and south italian and 5%finish am not even english even though i was born in a flat in longbenton and my folks were from byker😎

[@keithcharlton-g6y]

@ I have Irish and Welsh as well

[@andrewharrison7767]

@@keithcharlton-g6y similar to me - ancestry website meant I traced one side of my lineage up grandmother, great grandmother (b1909), then further back to early 1800s. I knew 2 or 3x great grandfather moved from Glasgow (Ibrox pits), but 2-3 generations before that they came from Dublin

[@OBIB_SPRUNK1]

i did one I traced my family bk in newcastle/gateshead/durham to the 1600's I'm 30 percent scottish, 50 english and 20 scandinavian

[@jamesrowe3606]

I can't remember who said, a Scotsman no doubt, that Geordies are just Scots wi' the brains bashed oot. No offence marra. 😉

[@lewisy1702]

Hey Eddie, I think it would be great to do a longer form conversation with Reece perhaps in a cosier setting like the Town Wall pub - I'm sure a lot of people would love to sit and listen to our rich history!

[@Chieftracyhorse]

Fascinating stuff! Thanks Eddie! ❤

[@StewartSelkirk]

This made me wonder if the term Geordie came about more through the linguistic quirks of the region. For instance, Ralph became Rahfie, George was Geordie and William became Willy or Billy. I seriously think a linguistic study might reveal this to be the simple answer. What do the other commentators think about that as a possible explanation?

[@TynesideLife]

That’s a different topic Stewart, which I covered in my Edinburgh Geordie video. The lineage of the name George and nickname Geordie isn’t synonymous with our area and has nothing to do with why we in this area are collectively known as Geordies. The name goes back centuries and at least to the 1500’s. It’s interesting nonetheless 👍🏻

[@StewartSelkirk]

​@@TynesideLife I'll have a look at that video. I thought that the Geordie issue could have been along the lines of 'Mackem,' denoting a person from the Sunderland area, where "make them" or "take them" was commonly pronounced as "Mac 'em" or "Tack 'em".

[@davidmalarkey1302]

Excellent informative video as usual Eddie with superb from Reece.

[@TynesideLife]

👊🏻👍🏻

[@StewartSelkirk]

I think that I will ask David Olusoga if he can shed any light on it.......😃

[@TynesideLife]

😃

[@Flukey_1970]

Great stuff mate really enjoyed that. Interesting about the plebeian term. I’ve heard the term Pleb being used in a derogatory term never knew where that came from. Pretty compelling evidence that Geordie came from the lamp theory then.

[@TynesideLife]

Cheers Martin. I agree. Definitely didn’t come from the Jacobites

[@malcolmlancaster5499]

So the conclusion is....we'll never know!!

[@TynesideLife]

Yep. Unfortunately. But we know the Jacobite theory is dead in the water

[@Jimmy_Cream]

The sauce of the Geordies is definitely broon sauce on a Greggs sausage and bacon sarny

[@TynesideLife]

☝️ bloody genius!

[@GeordieTerriers]

Great video about the History

[@colinveitch9815]

Another great video Eddy x

[@paulconnor2261]

I think we started calling ourselves geordies in the mines cause of the lamp men needed to belong to and bond together it’s a feeling we all have ..maybe

[@garysolly7038]

Another good video Eddie I like to think it's because of the Geordie Lamp given our working class history, especially as it was after The Felling Pit disaster in 1812 when the lamps were invented being from The Felling that's the explanation I prefer , our history on Tyneside is built upon the industry within the area...

[@henryblunt8503]

The Oxford English Dictionary has an earliest recorded use of "Geordie" in 1827, as a nickname for any pitman in the NE. The writer they quote explains that this is "a common name among them" - similar to calling a Scotsman "Jock" or a German "Fritz". This in a way combines the two theories, because calling your child George during the Hanoverian period was a demonstration of loyalty, and it seems a lot of miners in the NE were doing that. Without an earler written reference to "Geordie" (with an appropriate meaning) everything else is just speculation.

[@TynesideLife]

The earliest recorded use of the nickname (that I have found) is from the late 1500’s and likely goes back further than that. This was George ‘Jinglin Geordie’ Heriot, a jeweller to the monarchy in Edinburgh. This is on historical record. I have heard this reference you refer to before, but I’d challenge the premise that it’s from the Oxford English Dictionary: not that it matters as it’s superfluous anyway. 1827 is not the earliest recorded ‘Geordie’ that I can find? There is a reference from 1836 in the Urban Dictionary, referring to ‘Geordies’ In addition, the topic isn’t about the litany of the nickname Geordie, this is about a whole community being referred to as ‘Geordies’, which is different. This video evidences that one particular theory is redundant

[@henryblunt8503]

​@TynesideLife Yes, There's a difference between using "Geordie" as a pet name for someone called George, and moving on from that and calling a community by that name. The OED quotes what it thinks is the first recorded use for NE miners as a "community", from a writer called William Hone. You're quoting the first use of the pet name, which had been around for a lot longer as you say, and which Hone says was the reason for pitmen being called Geordies. If you think you have an earlier written reference that uses Geordie to refer to a *community* of people in the NE I'm sure the lexicographers at OED would be delighted to look at it. Etymology needs evidence. There is a rule of thumb in etymology that the least interesting etymology is most likely to be true. Stevenson's lamp and the Jacobite rebellion both seem too interesting to me.

[@TynesideLife]

I actually believe that the Geordies term was likely derived from post 1815 and the pitmen use of the ‘Geordie Lamp’ but I know this is conjecture and just an opinion. We do know now that the Jacobite theory is dead in the water, as our history scholar, specialising in working class Newcastle in the 1700’s has stated there is no historical reference to the Newcastle community being collectively referred to as Geordies. It does t make any logical sense either, which he elaborates on in the video. Are you able to send me the reference you’re using to support your claim of the OED and Horne as I can’t find anything. I feel this may be conjecture, after the event.

[@peterrear2864]

I always believed the miners lamp story ,being from the north east and ex mineworker

[@InBodWeTrust]

Very interesting, thanks Eddy. It also made me realise that my stereo speakers were connected the wrong way round. 🤦‍♂😂

[@TynesideLife]

😂

[@AJ-cz6ui]

Another enjoyable video, thank you. I was always told that we were called Geordies because of the mining connection with George Stephenson's lamp. The other theory regarding the local people being supporters of King George is a more recent one to me.

[@wallygargett6175]

The council have just put a mining lamp on the corner of great lime road and South Gate killingworth opposite Lidl in Killingworth It lights up at night. It’s just down the road from me and about 100 metres away from George Stephensons house on Great Lime Road. Well worth a visit

[@TynesideLife]

👊🏻👍🏻

[@sarahscraftyallsorts6482]

Love the thought of it being from the lamp as am a decent of the Stephenson family so would make me well and truly a genuine geordie I am anyway born and bread but would be great to think it came from my ancestors.

[@TynesideLife]

☝️👊🏻👍🏻

[@PaulDT1]

Have you looked back to the vikings when they were in Northumberland some Vikings had the name George, as the Danish form of the name is Jorgen. The name George comes from the Greek name Georgios, which is derived from the Greek word georgos meaning "farmer" or "earthworker". The word georgos is a combination of the Greek words ge meaning "earth, soil" and ergon meaning "work".

[@TynesideLife]

Researched the name quite extensively and is Greek in origin, you’re right. It’s interesting stuff. The name isn’t synonymous with Newcastle, or region. The earliest record of someone nicknamed Geordie dates back to the late 1500’s and I covered it in a video recently. This is a different story however to why a whole community became known as ‘Geordies’. 👍🏻

[@PaulDT1]

@TynesideLife I'll keep watching and hopefully one day you'll find a definite answer 👍

[@PaulDT1]

@TynesideLife just a thought and just read this , maybe it was the most common name of the time, like the word jock for the Scots. Jock is the Scots English equivalent of the Englisk Jack. Jack, in turn was a term used for a generic guy, bloke, geezer, ordinary man. It is a diminutive form of John, which was for most of history, the most common British name. In the British Navy, a Jack Tar was an ordinary sailor. A Jack of all trades is a guy who can turn his hand to many different tasks. A Jack in the Box is a puppet man who jumps out of a box to surprise children. There are man such examples of Jack being used to describe an everyman. In Scotland, Jack became Jock and so Jock became a generic term for a specifically Scottish Everyman. Its use in the armed forces was ubiquitous but by no means exclusive. Jock is used extensively as an affectionate term for a Scot. Similarly, the most common name in Wales, David Daffyd in Welsh becomes diminutive to Taffy. The Irish, Patrick becomes Paddy. In English Thomas becomes Tommy. I never had the chance to serve my country so never had to deal with a mess room full of Jocks and Tommys and Taffys and Paddys. It must have been complicated

[@Mind-your-own-beeswax]

My surname has Norse Viking origins.

[@jimmycburfield5997]

Interesting update

[@OrijinaruBTC]

Awesome video again Eddy. On a different note whats the weather like up there as Ill be arriving on Sunday evening and wonder if I need to pack an extra jumper and dont forget if you fancy having a birthday drink with me Ill be heading to the strawberry between 6 and 7pm. Again excellent video very enjoyable watch :)

[@TynesideLife]

Cheers bud. Yes it’s very cold 🥶

[@Bob-uu3tt]

If it is indeed derived from use of Stevenson's lamp Eddy, as I always thought it was, what it does not explain is why today popular opinion is that you have to be from Newcastle itself to be a Geordie, given that the vast majority of pits in the area were in Co Durham and Northumberland to the south and north of the city. If that's true then (and this will not be a popular thought ) does that not make Mackem's Geordies until fairly recent history?

[@TynesideLife]

Aye, that’s modern culture Bob. It’s derived from football from about the 80’s and these ‘claims’ are merely invented in someone’s head and shared around. You’re right, people from Sunderland weee know as Geordies until around the same period until ‘we’ took the much with the accent and the term ‘Mackem’ stuck. There is of course no ownership of the tag and nobody has the right to decide who is and isn’t a Geordie. As far as I’m concerned, if you identify as being a Geordie, then you are 👍🏻

[@Bob-uu3tt]

@@TynesideLife Agree mate, makes it a huge geographical area if it is down to use of that lamp, from south of the Tweed to north of the Tees..

[@mightay6672]

❤

[@mightay6672]

I'm Scottish but moved at 19 to Newcastle and they welcomed me with open arms❤my pal says Im an adopted Geordie ❤I don't live in the UK now but will always thank Newcastle for where I am now🎉🎉🎉

[@JorgelinaVega]

Super interesting! 😊👍

[@123fishpond]

A post grad student who can’t form a sentence without misusing the word “like” two or three times.

[@marcusoreallly]

Great stuff 👏👏👏

[@TynesideLife]

👊🏻👍🏻

[@nufcbob]

New subscriber, been watching all your videos and what a great content creator you are. Love learning more about the Toon

[@TynesideLife]

Cheers Bob 👊🏻👍🏻

[@cheeks7050]

ty

[@johnaspinall3200]

I thought geordie came from George Stevenson. And his rocket

[@keithrichardsom1898]

Brilliant

[@JacobScott0000]

I would say the amount of Scottish emigrants Newcastle had would make it one of the few places in England that actually had a significant amount ofJacobite supporters. Couple that with Reece saying there’s no mention of anyone here being called Geordie around that time. The theory just seems to be - the guy was called George and Geordie was a nickname for George lol The Geordie lamp theory seems far more probable given this information

[@TynesideLife]

Absolutely. The Jacobite theory is built purely on conjecture. There’s not a shred of historical evidence to support it. Even before meeting Reece, the theory made no sense, since Newcastle and the Jacobites never laid a glove on each other. Newcastle’s part in the 30 year uprisings is barely a footnote and there were other English locations where the Jacobites went into battle who were far more likely to be referred as‘ George’s Men’.

[@adammooney3058]

Class i like the history ones the best

[@Brockite]

All theories are valid until disproven.

[@TynesideLife]

I’d say the Georges Men theory is well and truly disproven. It’s a theory without a shred of evidence but a bag full of conjecture

[@PazLeBon]

i doubt many of us thought anything about it haha

[@TynesideLife]

The ‘Georges Men’ theory of the Jacobite uprisings is a very popular theory as to why we’re called Geordies. You need to keep up bonnie lad

[@PazLeBon]

@@TynesideLife lmao, was top of my bucket list

[@redcalx9568]

lol brill

[@OBIB_SPRUNK1]

thought that was jamie fraser coming bk fromm 1700s

[@TynesideLife]

Loved Outlander!

[@chriswarburtonbrown1566]

Top video, many thanks. Keep being awesome. The oldest known use of 'Geordie' means 'fool'; by local comedian Billy Purvis in 1823.

[@TynesideLife]

That’s not the oldest known use of the word Chris, it’s just one (relatively modern in a historical context) interpretation of it. The nickname is centuries old and was also used to refer to men who worked the land. The oldest recorded man nicknamed ‘Geordie’ (that I can find) is from the late 1500’s in Edinburgh. He was the monarchs private jeweller and was called George Heriot. His nickname is on historical record 👍🏻

[@northernengland]

doesn't it make sense that they would support a german when the lingo is still anglo saxson ?

[@TynesideLife]

The whole of Britain was Anglo Saxon for several hundred years after the Romans left and as far as I’m aware, until the Viking’s came, got their feet under the desk, influenced our language and then the French occupied from the 11th century, influencing our language again. So no, several hundred years later, a fondness for Germans wasn’t lingering amongst the desperately poor plebeian population of Newcastle and they had no internet either, as far as I’m aware 😃. It makes no sense whatsoever bud 😅 As Reece points out, there was no collective identity in Newcastle in the 18th century, there was a large Scottish and Irish migrant community too, who were mostly Jacobite sympathisers. The rest of the working class were just trying to stay alive, day to day, a new king was of no concern.

[@northernengland]

@@TynesideLife I thought it was well known that the newcastle accent is mostly anglo saxon, my geordie son in law was asked by some starnger in Poland if he was speaking some kind of german.

[@TynesideLife]

You’re desperate to square the circle… 😅 Our accent is heavily influenced from the vikings bud. In fact today some of our slang words are used in Norway and Denmark but its right to say that our language is a hodge podge of old Anglo Saxon (like the rest of Britain), Viking Norse, French Latin and others. But no, there is no historical record of Newcastle specifically having a special kinship with a new German King in 1714. Reece is an expert on Newcastle history in the 18th century and he laid out the historical facts, from his research 👍🏻

[@Beruthiel45]

I was friends with a lass back 60 years ago, in Newcastle, whose Dad was Norwegian. She told us that "gannin yem" was the same in Norwegian, which I've no proof of since I did French and Latin at Rutherford, but I'd be surprised if she was putting us on. My Dad's Dad came from Co Mayo, his Mam was a Livingstone from Scotland, and my maternal grandparents were Welsh and local northerners. My kids have Scandinavian genes, as well as their Celtic ones, plus a few points from elsewhere. We joke that we're all Heinz 57. One teacher at school taught us that most dialects retain older vocabulary and pronunciation of English, varying from place to place of course, but I was gobsmacked to learn that our habit of dropping the "ING" from verbs was actually the original version of the words and the change to the "ING" ending was a newfangled dialect thing from down South. Instead of being thought uncouth for not including our G endings we are actually just stubborn in retaining an original version of our language. Fascinating stuff, wor history. 🤔☺️ Great video, and very satisfying to have that King George theory debunked. It always rang false in the first place. Geordie pit lamps? Of course! 👍🤗

[@TynesideLife]

☝️👊🏻👍🏻