GIANT backwards pellet shows mind-twisting physics

[@ryanhenderson4395]

Physics still rules the day, the center of pressure is still behind the center of mass. The cross sectional area facing the fluid (air) hasn’t changed, so the drag hasn’t changed. Due to the awesome diablo shape, the skirt is still present (albeit smaller) to provide pressure at the back when the slug is shot backwards. The center of mass is near the small diameter of the slug and the center of pressure is still behind that point....it should be less stable at slower speeds due to less pressure on the back..... great video!

[@michaelransom5841]

well said. saved me the write up.. lol

[@OUTPOST-31]

I didn’t know as a kid which was the “proper”way to load these damn things, so I experimented. And guess what? Rabbits never lived to complain!

[@randolfaquino9998]

i loaded them with powder on the other and.and yes...nasty for Rats too

[@lucastonoli3256]

I'll take a minute to appreciate how you guys find ways to keep shooting interesting things after all this time doing it and delivering interesting videos. Keep it up!

[@Kheir112]

I have a thought about this. As the pellet is moving backwards through the air, it is compressing the air. This compressed air forms a dome of compressed air in and around the entry to the skirt, thus, forming an aerodynamic "dome" from HP air (a high pressure boundary layer). The shape of the pellet, functions as it's intended and it flies stable. Just a thought. Love your videos guys.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Like a couple of others, I'm wondering if dropping the velocity back to subsonic levels will give the same results. Trying it would confirm or exclude the "shockwave" theory. The other possibility is that, since all forces act around the centre of mass, if the slug is perturbed, the part of the skirt which is now pointing more forwards generates a touch more drag than the opposite side, which is now pointing a little backwards, which tends to pivot the slug around its CoM back to flying straight. If this is the case, there'll be a criticle amount of "wobble" that will cause tumbling, but if you stay within that, there's a negative feedback loop from the drag on the skirt. But indeed an interesting and entirely unexpected result!

[@taofledermaus]

I think it's just magic. lol What perplexed me the most was the water drop test. I really though it would immediately flip around. I don't think that water fluid dynamics emulates supersonic fluid dynamics.

[@BlokeontheRange]

@@taofledermaus Yeah, that was wierd, but I think the key is that it's pulling quite a lot of air down with it, but more than that I can't say... There's a PhD in that for somebody somewhere, lol! I've got the same mould in .410, so might cast some up and drop them into deeper water and see if it flips once the air's moved away from the slug.

[@KalLanPIDT]

@@BlokeontheRange I've shot backwards pellets in my airgun several times, it's not a high power rifle so it's always subsonic. They always stay the same direction they were shot in.

[@BlokeontheRange]

@@KalLanPIDT That's with rifling though, right?

[@AlexanderTzalumen]

I'd also like to see these forward and backward, super- and subsonic fired into a water column.

[@UrbanTiger74]

A former F4 Phantom pilot told me..."The Phantom proves if you put enough thrust behind any object, it'll fly..." LOL!!!

[@damascusblade]

How does a Phantom pilot know he just accidentally made a gear up landing? It takes full military throttle to taxi back to the hangar.

[@CriticalElixer]

Uniform Tango excellent quote. everybody thinks those jets are a handling dream. as gliders they are profoundly horrific. demonized on every conceivable level& in every possible flight spectrum. in reality planes should be designed from the dead stick up. Reptilian angels have the legal right 2troll those pilots bcuz those pilots are dropping bombs on innocent kids cuz President Jack is angry at President fred. Its just a prop Satan owns the chessboard

[@glockerbob]

TRUE

[@makantahi3731]

in remote controled aircrafts world, they say :even brick can fly if you put enough strong engine

[@SimoTheSergal]

Makan Tahi thats the phantom for you

[@MoreBrainz]

I think that it's flying fast enough that the air pressure in nose (when shot backwards) builds to a point that it starts to divert the air hitting it around it acting like a flat nose

[@alexmcconnell7626]

Thats what im thinking as well

[@nmd4332]

This concept is applied in a weird kind of airfoil called a Kline-Fogleman. The airfoil has sharp steps that create a sort of pseudo-boundary. I think the idea is that you can eliminate a lot of skin drag if your wing is 'made of air' so to speak.

[@carlosmatos9848]

Good point, kind of reminds me of tailgate open vs. closed on a pickup truck. How the closed tailgate creates a vortex that diverts the air and keeps it moving smoothly over the truck and over the tailgate. I think its sort of the same concept anyway... lol

[@kurtmohnsam7588]

And yet I remember in the 1970- and 80s everyone was buying those nylon nets to replace their tailgates in PU trucks. Scientific method never fails to amaze me. Sometime, things are NOT what they would seem. "Test Everything." Very often, the "Any fool can plainly see" doctrine is just based on a lack of testing the hypothesis.

[@troygrant5418]

Most logical explanation for what we have seen here Dale. I agree with your thoughts

[@mcdon2401]

Used backwards loaded pellets for years for short range rat shooting. Absolutely devastating, more so than some actual hollow points.

[@StealthyNomadica]

mcdon2401 ....messy!!!

[@ZRTMWA]

I am not actually super surprised. Compared to a badminton shuttlecock, the Diablo is much less nose heavy, it's basically in the center. The Diablo tail is also much heavier in comparison to the mass of shuttlecock's tail (with respect to the whole shuttlecock). It's also the same diameter as the nose, whereas a shuttlecock's tail is like 5 times the diameter of the nose, and again like a fifth of the mass. I bet it would be different if someone machined a little tiny badminton shuttlecock, where the tail was the diameter of the shotgun barrel and the nose was much small but much thicker and heavier. I bet that would flip around if fired backwards or at least stay stable fired forwards, like the Apollo slugs. Or who the hell knows. Physics is hard.

[@shelbyseelbach9568]

@@erikdeeNOSPELLSNO not to mention the fact that, being fired from a shotgun, the pellet doesn't really ride the rifleing, the wading does. The release from the wadding, not being prefect, is, i believe, what is causing the instability. If this pellet was fired by itself down a rifled barrel, like a minet ball, witch it essentially is, i am willing to bet it would be as stable as any other round would be.

[@illuminatedcrosshairs7865]

Very!!! Well stated!👍

[@TheMTBChannel]

Spot on Yung. Exactly what I was thinning with respect to the shape. They shuttlecock has much more cross sectional area in the rear compared to this slug which has roughly equivalent front and rear cross sectional areas.

[@shelbyseelbach9568]

@@TheMTBChannel this is essentially the same shape as all commercially available pellets. The difference is the shotgun, as the pellet is not in direct contact with the rifleing of the barrel as essentially all other pellets are when fired. Any incidental contract with the rifleing on the way out the barrel will be uneven and actually cause or exacerbate any wobbling. The shape is proven, just not in this firearm. I believe.

[@TheMTBChannel]

Understood Shelby. Yung and my comments were more in relation to the comparison with a shuttlecock which the pellet doesn't represent (ie nose weighted and lots of tail drag). The pellet is centre weighted and has the same aerodynamic face area at each end. Yungs point is that, even with rifling, a true shuttlecock shape would turn as he describes it (with small weighted nose and large tail area). Interesting to see how the slugs behave in any case.

[@vmcfalls1]

I suspect, as others have mentioned that it builds a compressed area, in the backward facing hollow, like a bow wave in front as it moves forward. It would be interesting to see a gel block test.

[@Svejky001]

I saw years ago fortune cookie 45 shooting them backwards and they did nice cuts in the paper. Just like wadcutters.

[@PuffycloudsHD]

Martin Svejkovský and saw a young man

[@tim18wheels76]

Yes, the diabolo works like a wad cutter when loaded backwards vs paper targets, but loaded nose forward it is like a semi-wad cutter.

[@gregbradshaw3410]

This would be my theory of what is happening that is causing it to be more stable when shot backward. The air that is filling the cup portion of the pellet is essentially bouncing off the cup at a pressure greater than the air it is passing through causing more air to be pushed out of the way to the sides and reducing the friction on the pellet itself. Most of the turbulence is happening behind the pellet and not on the pellet. When the pellet is shot forward the air pressure at the front is reduced making the turbulence happen more forward in the trajectory which increases the friction on the pellet. When we look at the effect on the gels, we can see just how much energy is at the front of the pellets, with the backward pellet having far more energy. When you watch the slow-motion portion of the video of the 2 shots on the gel, you can see that there is a greater amount of air disturbance on the backward pellet. We normally would think that greater air displacement would make an object more unstable, however, as we are seeing here, the greater amount of air disturbance is creating almost a bubble for the backward pellet where the air is being accelerated forward.

[@wdog103]

Guys all of your intuition from subsonic aerodynamics goes out the window once you go supersonic. It gets real complicated real fast. Thus why I love this channel. -aerospace engineering student watching TFM in class

[@taofledermaus]

Yeah, it's pretty fascinating!

[@CJ-sl4wd]

Aere here too... I was contemplating trying to explain why this happens but I think it'd get too complicated... lol

[@willdwyer6782]

If you pack the hollow skirt of an air gun pellet full of petroleum jelly you will get a higher muzzle velocity, but you might want to clean your barrel a lot more often. The compression in the barrel will ignite the petroleum jelly, increasing the pressure behind the pellet.

[@dangerrangerlstc]

Whatever happened to your "mass accelerator" video? Was it ever demonetized?

[@mfsolutions]

Air rifle pellets never cease to astound me. My son was practicing in the back yard with an Air Arms S400 Compressed Air .177 biathlon rifle (muzzle velocity reduced to 495 fps). He was zeroing on paper and one of the targets was over the 2x4 upright of the wooden stand. He complained that he got hit in the trigger finger with a pellet bouncing back from the target. He shot again and was left with a bruise on his cheek beside the aperature sight. I walked the 10 metres to the target and there was only one hole. When I looked behind the paper there was only one pellet embedded in the wood. It appears that the second pellet impacted the first pellet exactly on the skirt and compressed the air in the skirt providing enough energy to make the return 10 m trip at almost exactly the same elevation. The third pellet benefited from more air space in the skirt and came back harder. I thought that the pellet would be tumbling on the reverse journey and could not figure out how it could maintain that level of accuracy. Your illustration of the backwards flying pellet provides some evidence of how efficiently these pellets fly - in either direction!

[@hallofo8107]

Now THIS was a mind-blower. I figured that the CoM was going to be the big factor in stability, but you can't argue with your results! Also, I'm not giving up: that's not a _shotgun_ that's _shooting_ stuff, it's an ad-friendly... Kinetic Ablative - Ballistic Linear Acceleration Method Or.. "KA-BLAM"

[@taofledermaus]

thanks!

[@cartersol38]

This test blew my mind! I have loaded Diablo pellets into my BSA air rifle a nd did not experience any problems. However, when I saw this being done on purpose, and seeing the flight stability, I was numbed! Well done.

[@buffalosoutdoors]

Very cool seeing that monster pellet flying in reverse all nice and stable. I have to admit I wouldn't have thunk it.

[@michaeld9108]

@@capelsid Oxford dictionary: thunk2 humorous, informal ‘who would've thunk it?’ non-standard past and past participle of think

[@michaeld9108]

@@capelsid Still in wide enough use to be entered into the dictionary 😋

[@Kombat_Wombat]

it’s exactly what you should expect... this isn’t defying physics it’s conforming to it.

[@jamessavell9851]

NRL Sledging Immortals foldingdiy knives

[@Maxaker]

@@capelsid Respect! Somebody on the internet changes their mind and acknowledges they made a mistake.

[@Ms2mark]

@4:10 for a split second when the slug hits the gel it makes such a large hole I can see the field @7:02 the flies on OG’s right shoulder got a nice surprise

[@Billthebaker420]

this is nothing like other "upskirt" videos I have seen... lol

[@WhittsOfTheDim]

Bill The Baker lollololololol bout died... almost

[@dannyd3717]

For those interested the upskirt is at 2:07

[@Billthebaker420]

It was either that or a shuttlecock joke...

[@Maxumized]

Bill The Baker why, why...did you have to be that guy?

[@Billthebaker420]

@@Maxumized why not?

[@andrewgcrowhurst]

Due to the slugs shape, when moving in a forward direction the "stabilization drag" is generated at the rear point where the slug wall transitions from a side to end wall. The similar transition at the head of the slug. Just before the head moves into the skirt portion. Creates a low pressure area that helps prevent tumbling. When the slug is reversed, drag is created at the same rear point and due to the slugs shape. The throat behind the new head serves to create another low pressure area. Again, preventing the slug from rolling. The spin from the rifeling created micro oscillations that collapsed the forward low pressure area allowing the slug to roll

[@WalkerBait]

Exactly what I said, but you said it better.

[@SuspiciousGanymede]

Wow the air disturbance around those backward facing slugs is crazy. What about flipping regular foster slugs backwards?

[@jasontruman1215]

TheAllSeeingTruth fairly certain they have a video on that.

[@miophx8283]

Could it be that the cone forward creates a pocket of air which is more dense than ambient air while simultaneously forming it's own aerodynamic bubble which has less drag than the original forward, weighted shape?

[@fearthespear4242]

Got it Einstein

[@salvadorebertolone]

you got me thinking. maybe any axial deviation causes a laminar flow separation and essentially mimics an air foil stall on that side, and the resultant lift reaction from the other side pulls it back straight. im assuming this would lead to a runaway oscillation and start tumbling, but at these ranges it looks to not have enough time to cause that.

[@fearthespear4242]

@@salvadorebertolone english translation?

[@salvadorebertolone]

@@fearthespear4242 when it tips, because of the taper of the tail, its too difficult for the air to stay attached to the surface of the projectile when it deviates from straight and level flight. When the air separates it loses lift on that side of projectile causing it to self correct to straight and level. Watch a video on Bernoullis principle and air foils and it might make some more sense.

[@maxximumb]

It's all about viewer engagement. Leaving comments, no matter how nonsensical will also help. Commenting on other people's comments will help too, KZbin likes conversations. It doesn't care how you spell aluminium though.

[@loddude5706]

*trough

[@taofledermaus]

lol

[@sarchlalaith8836]

What alooooominum? :D

[@sarchlalaith8836]

@Jake Heke :D

[@jeffbruce]

@Veg etable It's turtles all the way down.

[@MarkLoves2Fly]

There is a major difference between the diabolo pellet, and the shuttlecock. The tail of a shuttlecock is vented to allow air to pass through. The venting increases drag, and therefore directional stability. The mechanics are similar to that of a parachute. A parachute functions well with a hole in the center, and poorly without the hole. This is because the airflow takes the path of least resistance. The shape of the diabolo pellet created a high pressure zone at the tip, which forces the rest of the air to go around. Since the shape allows for even distribution, the pellet will fly stable. Of course with faulty wadding, tumbling should be expected, due to the uneven forces exerted as the projectile leaves the barrel. I really enjoyed the video. Two Thumbs!

[@waterchildtera]

Try a foster slug backwards!

[@KalLanPIDT]

YES!

[@smilesaredaggers3088]

like the dimples on a golfball helping divert and change the drag and lift, it makes sense from a physics standpoint if you look more at the shape structure and ratio of the angles, divot, wall thickness etc and compare to weight and velocity when leaving the smooth bore barrel

[@RRTSBloodyknife]

I wonder if it's catching a small pocket of air I the open end causing it to act as a done. Kinda like a pick up bed when you drive highway speeds

[@cdawson198600]

RRTSBloodyknife I bet that’s exactly what’s happening.

[@maxximumb]

I think the dome idea might be something to look into. The air trapped in the hollow will get pushed by the air it's flying through. Eventually the pressure won't allow any more air into the cavity, so the air will flow around the slug. It makes sense that the compressed air would form a dome over the cavity.

[@KalLanPIDT]

Have you seen the video of the slugs that had a hole all the way through them from front to back? Air didn't move through the slug at super sonic speeds because there's a shockwave around it. I think its the same with these, the air inside the nose(skirt) doesn't move at all until it drops to sub sonic.

[@Aglai76]

That's exactly what i was thinking

[@BikerDash]

The same principal as the dots on a golfball as well.

[@tronjavolta2213]

I shot competition 3p air rifle for about a decade through the county 4H program back when I was in school. Sometimes when fatigue started to set in it was difficult to get the pellets from the block into the small breech of the Anschutz I used the right way around. Everyonce in a while they would land backwards and I would fish the out and flip them around. One time during practice the pellet landed in the breech backwards. I was curious how it would shoot, so I just loaded and fired it anyway. I checked on it through my spotting scope to see how far off it was. Near as I could tell it was just as accurate as it was when they were loaded normally. I tried it a few more times and they all seemed to be just as accurate as with the pellets loaded normally. I always tried to load them normally for the sake of consistency, but if they landed backwards I'd just fire them so I didn't have to move around in my position to mess with flipping them around. It never seemed to effect my scores one way or another.

[@jamescrawford1534]

I was very surprised to see the 'pellet' stabalise itself wh n dropped in water, though I wonder if the wide front would cause a cylinder as opposed to a cone through the air, the air inside the cone of the pellet (the new 'front') would compress effectively giving it a solid face as the air in the cup would have no where else to go, meaning the flow would be pushed around the sides and back rather than cause turbulence within the cup if used correctly, if it was the correct way the cup would have much lower pressure inside it meaning the flow of air would be across the sides, back AND out (flanging). This is all hypothesis as I've been thinking about why it's stable when reversed

[@TheDiplococcus]

I've just watched this and arrived at the same conclusion. A similar effect can be achieved by keeping the tailgate up on a moving, empty pick up. You would expect a closed tailgate to provide resistance but it doesn't, instead it creates a cushion of air that causes air to flow over the top of the void when the vehicle is moving. In the case of rifled vs smooth barrels the smooth barrel generates forward motion only so the bullet maintains trajectory pretty well. The rifled barrel imparts spin and angular momentum, which with a backwards bullet would emphasise and exaggerate even the tiniest imperfection in balance from manufacture and generate a 'wobble'. The position and the severity of imperfections in the density around the skirt will determine how much wobble there is.

[@myongpark]

Hypothesis aside, Mr. Crawford deserves kudos for not using the word “theory.” Excellent work on remaining properly scientific in your thinking Sir!

[@jedjen7473]

You're almost spot on, the air pushed in to the cavity forms a point at the front then pushes through the air in front of it

[@nla27]

The compressed air inside the skirt of the pellet travels with the pellet adding to forward weight. Also the rear of the pellet may be in a sweet spot in the slipstream where it flies more like a tear drop with the pressure wave hitting the sides of the pellet just enough to correct any wabble.

[@marcmason2079]

Well that puts a whole new thought in my head as far as physics and aerodynamics go

[@Dragon-Slay3r]

So why are we pretending to be with Ukraine 🙀

[@johncochran8497]

There are three possibilities for the pellet. 1. Center of mass in front of the center of pressure - Inherently stable. 2. Center of mass behind the center of pressure - Inherently unstable. 3. Center of mass at the same location as the center of pressure - Neutral stability. From your attempt to balance the pellet, the center of mass is approximately in the physical center of the pellet. I can't tell where the center of pressure is, but just based upon it's shape, it looks to be fairly close to the physical center as well. If that's the case, then your pellet has neutral stability and would fly just stable forwards, or backwards (and sideways as well, but attempting to shoot it sideways would present an interesting problem.

[@tonytrumble]

I was certainly amazed that it flew straight dead nuts when it was backwards

[@DBCoop-bz4sl]

It all depends on the twist rate to bullet length and velocity. Shorter twist rates like 1:7 are good for longer heavier rounds and long twist rates suck as 1:14 or 1:16 are good for short, light and high speed projectiles. If you matched the diablo pellet with the right amount of powder and the right twist rate it should fly just as any other round.

[@paulh7589]

I guess it has the same effect as dimples on a golf ball. The forward momentum disturbs the air enough to create a virtual aerodynamic vacuum. By far I am no expert, it's just a guess. I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

[@stallingfortime2334]

Dimples on a golf ball along with the associated spin of the ball provided by the angle of impact of the driver when it makes contact with the ball creates drag; otherwise the golf ball would simply fly straight and never be able to hook or slice.

[@egreenie3819]

Should have come to Motel 6. We would have left the light on for ya!

[@documented2]

did you empty the minibar before writing?

[@theblueshepard776]

@@stallingfortime2334 now I can only imagine a lone, undimpled golf ball sailing aimlessly through space and time in an infinite, moving prison of zero resistance.

[@tenchraven]

Since the center of mass is the waist, it's not as likely to flip compared to a shuttlecock. But I think that if you drop the velocity enough (or raise it, if you suddenly hate Greg's shoulder) you might find that the performance changes. Either longer range, or drop the powder charge. Also,t hat sound at 4:21, so nice. Did you guys get a chance to recover any of that slug? It's rare that you HEAR the effects of fragmentation.

[@DrewWhitehead]

Video not yet loaded, like already applied. Thanks for the ever more interesting videos Jeff. I’m wondering if the hollow point is more or less plowing a wake making little/no resistance on the normal front end. To word it better, is the old front slip streaming in the wake of the hollow point? How would these do subsonic where there’s potentially drag along the length of the pellet?

[@taofledermaus]

That's probably what's happening.

[@BooBaddyBig]

I think the flare part around what is nominally the nose, when it's travelling backwards makes a pretty good tail, and it may well be completely stable flying backwards- albeit with higher than normal drag.

[@aaronkianjohnsonmyers7395]

"Shoot more stuff backwards, you must"

[@SantinoNutini]

-yoda

[@sheaman220]

the reason the pellet is stable in reverse flight is due to the aerodynamic nature of objects that are longer then they are wide. if it begins to tip to one side on that same side near the base(last part to leave barrel) a partial vacuum forms sucking the base the opposite direction it began to tip, at the same time a high pressure build up of air on the opposite side of the base pushes the base back inward maintaining the orientation of the object. the hollow tip would only catch air and slow the pellet quicker then in the normal orientation, being that it has a symmetrical shape it wouldn't catch the air in an awkward imbalanced way. if the pellet were to perform in a similar way as the bad-mitten birdie the heavy nose must be of a smaller diameter then the skirt.

[@thewisemanwalks]

Okay, where to start. First, the backwards pellet is heavy side forward. Second and more complicated, using the same principle by which hollow points fly accurately, that cup actually forms a perfect point from the air itself. The surrounding air is compressed in the cup in flight forming that perfect point. I'm actually more shocked that the rifled barrel didn't perform much better than it did. The rotation should have made it's flight perfect. Not surprised at the damage a backward pellet causes though

[@chevota400]

Wrong, wrong and wrong

[@thewisemanwalks]

@@chevota400 and what's your proof? My theory comes from both personal experience and experimentation and two vets from the Persian Gulf wars whom first informed me of this. So what fact set are you basing your assumption on?

[@CandC68]

I used to work with a friend who designed a nozzle for atomizing liquid injected into the air stream. The nozzle had a rearward facing cup in front of the flow of air. The cup was held in place rigidly on the nozzle. Two things that may relate to your test. 1- The air came out of the face of the nozzle and hit the cup, rebounding back against the air flow. The result seemed to be a very active standing wave as the two collided. Any injected liquid (water, fuel oil, etc) hit that layer and was torn apart into a very fine mist. This was the purpose. With water it created a very fine mist, usable to humidify the target area. With fuel oil the mist burned faster and more efficiently. 2- Part of this operation was the noise. This thing was loud, like a shrieking whistle on steroids. And that turned out to be a measure of its efficiency. The louder it was, the more "vigorous" was the standing wave. And the more violent the effect on an injected liquid. So, with you slug test, I'd guess that the air hitting the forward facing "cup" rebounded into the air it passed through and created a wave front. The passed through air then diverted around the irregular aerodynamic shape. But, when the slug velocity slows, the wave dissipates and then it will tumble.

[@manguydude287]

Maybe we have all been loading them backwards our whole lives, I always shot my air rifle pellets backwards because when I was younger I was told that it would act like a hollow point. I personally never took a high-speed camera to it but they all seem to shoot fine backwards. So who knows, Maybe they really were meant to be loaded that way

[@nanaki-seto]

backwards pellet + bb + frontwards pellet out of break barrel bb guns i had a few of them fuse together lol

[@kurtmohnsam7588]

Liked this video for that reason too. Had a nice break action air rifle at about age 12, and what 12 year old doesn't think of trying to shoot the pellet backwards, right? Surprise! No difference in accuracy, but double the damage on ground squirrels. But that was half a century ago for me!

[@swampjoe1985]

We have all been using can openers wrong too... imagine that..

[@MarcGyverIt]

I always thought they felt slightly larger at the back side, which held the pellet in place and kept it from sliding in. lol I guess I just never thought to try it the other way. Weird.

[@zekethefishgeek8690]

@@MarcGyverIt that's EXACTLY what she said!!!

[@karlinathan]

If you could see the air displacement as the backwards pellet flies, its virtually the same formation around the pellet as a forward facing one. A vacuum behind that holds it stable and a rolling around the sides from the air being pushed outward as the pellet passes through. It's the aerodynamics that's keeps it stable.

[@Rosen545]

I load my air rifle (.22) with diabolo shaped pellets backwards to create a hollow point pellet and they fly very accurate even at longer ranges (around 50m) and expand nicely every time.

[@AutismIsUnstoppable]

How do they compare to hollow point airgun pellets?

[@Thane36425]

Is that subsonic? My old subsonic pellet guns were accurate to ranges like that. The new supersonic replacement tends to lose accuracy after a while, probably when the pellet goes subsonic.

[@Rosen545]

@@AutismIsUnstoppable In my opinion they are better, because the whole tail expands and it's wider in diameter than regular hollow point. But in order to put the pellet backwards in the barrel you need to make the tail end a bit thinner.

[@Rosen545]

@@Thane36425 Yes with subsonic i have better expansion and accuracy. With supersonic pellets they are not accurate and the tail brakes off instead of expanding when it hits the target.

[@BikerDash]

@@Rosen545 I had a subsonic pellet rifle years ago that a BRUTAL against squirrels out to 40 or so yards. Also effective against crows.

[@realflow100]

My theory is that the cone shape on the back captures air. compresses it. and it adds just enough weight to the "back" when its flying backwards to make it stable in either direction of flight.

That was very informative I like that. You know that I now have to try pellets backwards in my pellet rifles LOL

[@chugnorris7091]

The Porsche 911 of sluggos. You can hate it, not understand why, but it performs beyond expected. Technology! Science! Taofledermaus! I'm always here for the slow mo. Keep up the great work.

[@andrewbeeco967]

A cavity in the front will generate an area of compressed air that will cap the projectile

[@was1069]

There was an article in Popular Mechanics about 20 years ago that talk about this effect. the Air compresses and becomes a cone of compressed air which diverts the air around the object. The example that was used was a train/truck.

[@brianr8581]

You guys rock! I always enjoy your work! Also donation sent to the vet cause.

[@PuffycloudsHD]

Brian R sadly

[@wcthomas65]

Can't recall the effect name but it is the same when you blow out your windscreen on your car. You keep all the other windows shut and you can drive at normal speeds with hardly any wind blowing in the cavity. There is a pressure boundary created inside the car that creates an invisible windscreen. Obviously doesn't stop rocks that are kicked up by other cars.

[@mr.manson1195]

I shot a few pellets out of my air rifle reversed, a few jammed but most flew straight.

[@1495978707]

My hypothesis about the stability is that the air flow around the backwards cone causes more suction when the back is tilted away from that side than when towards. Try covering up the cone so it's just a cylinder the the hollow point and I bet it won't be as stable. What would be really interesting is if you did schlieren photography with it

[@niwachien]

DI-AH-BO-LO.... not diablo (devil). Diabolo is a shape like a butterfly yo-yo or an hourglass.

[@josephkool8411]

My favorite projectile shape in the world. regardless of what it's composed of, it just works really good. It has a huge meplat for maximum devastation. It's stable and you can make it at home..... it's beautiful. Officer Greg I know how scary it is to be a Greek in Turkish custody. They must of liked you. Best thing to do is be respectful

[@JesseAndMike]

Always enjoy these videos! :D Liked!

[@taofledermaus]

thanks Jesse and Mike!

[@brycep7093]

What r u guys doing here ??😂

[@benedictsamir8477]

i guess im randomly asking but does any of you know of a trick to log back into an instagram account?? I was stupid forgot the account password. I love any tricks you can give me

[@trentoakley1473]

@Benedict Samir instablaster =)

[@susieromano7001]

@@benedictsamir8477 I think the only way is just press forget password and they'll email you a link so you can reset the password.

[@quadflopper1012]

I found out about the backwards pellet thing on accident, one of my older crosman guns has a lousy design for loading the breech which causes the pellets to sometimes load backwards, I got tired of having to stop shooting to go find a rod to push the pellet out so one day I just left it in backwards turned towards the target and shot, I was amazed by how much larger of a hole the backwards pellet made in the target. every since then when ever I want to do more damage to what i am shooting I always load the pellet backwards....

[@MrT8T3R]

"Ye canny change the laws of physics!" -Montgomery Scott

[@MrT8T3R]

While this may be true, Craig; don't let that distract you from the fact that in 1972, a crack commando unit was sent to prison by a military court for a crime they didn't commit. These men promptly escaped from a maximum security stockade to the Los Angeles underground. Today, still wanted by the government they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them....maybe you can hire The A-Team.

[@therearenousesrnamesleft6843]

I know symmetrical rounds tend to be pretty stable, like the cube round from way-back-when. do you think that had anything to do with it?

[@TaunusTV]

You ain´t never gonna get a thumbs-down from Taunus TV !! Thanx for the nice & informative video, and like always: special thumbs-up to the O.G. !!! 👍👍👍

[@PuffycloudsHD]

Taunus TV so I bought it from the shop

[@ferrarigirl666]

Aint never.... So always?

[@Primer595]

I believe there is a "virtual" pressure wave at the leading end of the pellet which causes the slug to be stable . It resembles "fluid lubrication" or air bubble lubrication used on speed boat hulls that mimic shark or dolphin skin. It would be good to know if this phenomena helps retain speed in that backward fired slug. Nice video!

[@JoshuaC0rbit]

I actually know exactly what episode of The rifleman you're referring to. he had lost his rifle and only had a pistol and he improvised a rifle stock. crap I think it was probably 1985 when I saw that.

[@ocalavictory3728]

Lol I saw that episode only a few months ago on MeTv.

[@peterxyz3541]

We use to place a BB in the skirt of a typical omelet and fire it backwards. The theory is that the BB is more aero and upon impact, it is smooth enough to retain a tiny bit more distance. The BB would separate leaving the skirt to catch any air or liquid or debris. Can’t say if it worked or didn’t, no measuring equipment as a kid.

[@ALWhiteAuthor]

"Hitchcock" lol... I don't think that fella from Tennessee wrote classics like The Birds or To Kill A Mockingbird.

[@5roundsrapid263]

AZ Patriot To Kill A Mockingbird? Harper Lee wrote that.

[@vinodztube7363]

I think that the backward facing dome catches air in it and forward velocity of the pellet compresses that air pocket so hard against the air in front of it that the air trapped in the pellet acts as a solid and displaces the air in front of it. Which makes the hollow part acts like solid. The empty area in the backward of the pellet is occupied by a packet of highly compressed air.

[@Primer595]

I chronographed pellets backwards and they travelled faster ! They expand better too and are great for rats in a barn .

[@steven12601]

The amount of drag produced in the bell forcing it to a center point of the slug forces it to have a greater accumulative mass over the tip or now rear of the pellet which now is still heavier than the front or skirt of the pellet but is now stabilizing the pellet instead of by drag but by weight and the skirt is now producing a high pressure "tip" that forces low pressure around it making it stable by creating its own ballast weight at the front through drag while still having tail weight from the "tip" of the slug, one way to think of it is parachuting u weigh more than the parachute but through aerodynamics the chute catches air creating enough mass and opposite force to keep u moving faster than it but enough to slow u and keep u stable not the exact same physics but its just an example of similar physics, not sure if that's exactly what's happening but my best hypothesis for what we are seeing.

[@weirdscience8341]

We use gamo match in .22 backwards for rats on the farm they get in the chicken pens and a backupell as I've dubbed them to the head at 10 yards is totally devastating takes them right off. Also if u get polymag pellets and pull the red insert out and load them backwards the cavity of the hollow point we're the polymer insert was exspands under the air pressure in the barrel so the pellet engages with the rifling properly I only use gamo pellets as there so cheap polymag are like 15 pounds a tin gamo are 3.99

[@deanwells2859]

I am very puzzled by how stable the pellet flew flying “backwards”. I am sure you have a viewer with enough of a physics background to explain the how and why? I am looking forward to reading this information.

[@jacobotts8443]

A boundary layer forms around solids at high velocities preventing the skirt from catching any new air particles in flight. This stability is further increased if there is any rotational motion.

[@saltedcashews269]

"Thatsa biga pellet." *italian blood intensifies*

[@dannyanderson2618]

I wasn't surprised by this video. I found similar results from a smooth bore pellet gun. I had a pigeon problem. I picked up a cheap smooth bore bb gun with a scope. I purchased an assortment of pellets and ordered some special hunting pellets that came to a point. I sighted it in at 30ft with the gun in a clamp, down the hall of my apartment. I found that the more of a point the front had, the larger spread on the target. The flat or hollow point held a pattern of about a dime. The hunting pellets that came to an actual point had about 1 foot pattern (the target was only about 10in across, to my dismay putting holes in a door and walls around the target) and none of them came close to the bulls eye. I turned the pellets around. All of the pellets no matter the shape of the point, held the dime size pattern backwards, although they didn't sink as deep into the phone book that was behind the target. I assume there was a loss of pressure due to the skirt pointing forward. I expected the sharper the point the more accurate but that wasn't the case. Even the pellets that had rounded faces held a pattern radius of about 4 inches. The hollow points, flat face, and any put in the gun backwards held a pattern about the size of a dime. I had 8 different types of pellets, all different shaped faces.

[@heraclitus6100]

We need to submit this to Destin of at Smarter Every Day, so he can break down the physics behind this conundrum.

[@PeterOekvist]

Dustins skirt will get Shorter Every Night to show his conundrum...

[@100GTAGUY]

It'd be cool to see these recorded with a slow motion schlieren setup like he's been using recently

[@heraclitus6100]

@@100GTAGUY yeah!

[@lafibremaker7988]

just what i was thinking while watching this video!!!

[@JosePerez-il5qy]

The nose is the heaviest part, so the best aerodynamics will be going nose in front, but for the skirt-in-front shots, think of those firework rockets attached to a stick as a stabilizer. The heavier part in those rockets flies in the back, the same as the inverted pellet. I would theorize that for the aerodynamics part, the skirt will trap an air bubble in flight, helping it to reduce drag. When it comes to speed, that "air trapping" will definitely slow it down a bit. Still effective anyway as a tool of destruction for the "hollow-point" effect of the skirt. Nice experiment guys.

[@justinpowell3174]

Thanks for the upskirt, Officer Greg

[@Ma77riK]

think of the adjustable cones on the sr71 blackbird engines, at high velocity a pressurized zone is created just before the inlets ( this created a loss of air intake reducing the engine efficiency dramatically, and why they decided to make the cones adjustable) this is essentially what is happening here, an pocket of trapped static air is creating an aerodynamic dome that is diverting airflow evenly.

[@brucebaxter6923]

Jeff, think cavitation and not shockwave. That happens in both the slow water and super sonic air.

[@MrGivmedew]

Cavitation is impossible in air by definition.

[@brucebaxter6923]

MrGivmedew Citation needed.

[@brucebaxter6923]

www.dfrc.nasa.gov/Gallery/Photo/X-15/Small/E-5256.jpg So the blunt end is for what reason if there is no cavitation type effect.

[@twilightknight123]

As a physicist, I'm not particularly surprised. The center of mass isn't too far from the center of the slug and the conical bore in the back provides an air cushion to help stabilize it during flight (at least that's the first thing that comes to mind). Think of it like this: The hole in the tail end of the slug "captures" a cushion of air as it moves forward. Because there's no where for that air to leave, it should create a high pressure zone that acts as a new "nose" of the bullet to help stabilize it. There's going to be some critical amount of wobble that will destabilize this air cushion and cause enough outside torque to cause it to tumble, but that wobble is going to be a lot more than on a shuttlecock since the imbalance and asymmetric drag are much more exaggerated than in this slug.

[@randlerichardson5826]

I wouldn’t believed that if I hadn’t seen it

[@aerobetamax6022]

Pre-watching hypothesis: The slug will fly straight and balanced. I have shot backwards pellets a lot through my air rifles for curiosity's sake and the only thing that seems to happen is slighter velocity (skirt not expanding) and a bit more energy transfer to the target (apples, cans of water). Why? My theory is that the air fills the cavity and creates a small rounded bump in front of the slug, directing the oncoming air around it. The effect is that the air flowing around the slug will stabilize it (like normally for a diabolo). However, super-sonic effects might change the behaviour like it often has shown! Let's watch, and merry christmas from Sweden!

[@hakrj12]

Sell these now as Olbaid slugs

[@themoviemaniac8416]

This actually does show the laws of physics working properly. Pellet's center of gravity is actually near enough to the center according to your own measurements, and nothing at all like that of a shuttlecock, which has a COG much closer to the nose's front tip. The pellet behaves as I'd expect it to behave in a high velocity shot out of a smooth barrel. Small indents as on the "rear" of this pellet, facing forward, have no negligible drag and no significant working pressure vortex within the indentation as would be the case on a larger, similar shaped item like a shuttlecock.

[@glywnniswells9480]

makes complete sense the air stream at that speed is like concrete the pellet is fixed in that position the heavy part cannot drop it is like a tube of steel of high speed airflow like an extended barrel i bet alot of shapes would stay straight.

[@raysonsarmiento6079]

No

[@johnharvey892]

I did an experiment a few years ago. I super glued 17 caliber steel BBs into the skirts of 22 caliber pellets. All I can really say is they worked out of my break barrel rifle. It didn't appear that I had anything that tumbled. The accuracy wasn't so great but it did make a huge hole in my cardboard box Target that was stuffed with old phone books.

[@brycep7093]

Wow that’s crazy great vid btw keep it up and I hope KZbin monetizes your vids 🤞🏻

[@taofledermaus]

thanks Bryce!

[@Primer595]

I think the hollow nose and dome theory is most likely at supersonic velocities.Its a type of self lubricating "virtual" pressure wave.Strangely enough if you fire a spitzer shaped bullet it causes a "W" shape of virtual pressure wave around the inverted "V" of the spitzer nose, actually causing bigger holes on impact.If the pellet is symmetrical it might be experiencing the "coanda" effect which helps it to travel without toppling.Nice video

[@kenwomick1332]

Love the show, you guy's ever shoot a stone slug/ plug? Like a granite counter top drill out.

[@taofledermaus]

Not yet, but many have suggested it

[@anonamous9945]

It appeared pretty well balanced near the midpoint on that string test I thnk having very similar mass to the front and rear has something to do with it - Love your videos keep up the great work!

[@taofledermaus]

The centerline is just behind where the string is, just a couple mm.

[@SimonSpe]

*THATS A LOT OF DAMAGE*

[@TH-xo4zx]

PLEASE.👏SHUT.👏 *UP.*👏 😠 😤

[@Inesophet]

I think its all about pressure zones. When fired the air doesnt really have time to fill the space between the head and the tail, this means that there is a low pressure zone around it that keeps it stable. while alot of other air flows by creating a high pressure zone around it. this keeps the Pellet from Flipping. This works forward and backward, center of mass doesnt matter too much. When the Thing spins it gets rid allows high pressure air to fill those gaps and voila we have instability.

[@anjinmiura6708]

We need explanations for this anomaly.

[@mho...]

i would bet its a "bubble" of denser air getting trapped in the front part!

[@glenr834]

Have you seen what happens when the tail of a pick up is down, whilst being driven, vs it being up and closed? I’m always looking at pockets of air and watching out for interesting effects from things that aren’t aerodynamic but may well be quite aerodynamic because of the pocket.

[@LukeTheJoker]

I heard the 4:30 in England OG!

[@OGsDangerShow]

Just for you, Luke! 🇬🇧

[@LukeTheJoker]

@@OGsDangerShow Actually I'm an Aussie! 🇦🇺 I just enjoy the jokes!

[@OGsDangerShow]

LukeTheJoker Same thing isn’t it?! 😂

[@holyfnshet]

i think the reason it flies straight is because the symmetrical dip creates a pocket of air when fired backwards and that pocket of air traveling at that speed pretty much creates the tip of the bullet stabilizing it. and when the air bubble breaks on contact that force dissipates into what ever broke it.

[@AFishBicycle]

You should try to make a pellet short enough to be loaded sideways and see how it behaves at supersonic speeds!

[@gregorymanning6201]

There is a ROAD with moving traffic just past the tree line where they're shooting. No backwall to catch ricochets or ANYTHING to catch bouncing rounds and moving cars in the background... The irresponsibility shown here was staggering.

[@cluckeryduckery261]

Gregory Manning well said

[@tim18wheels76]

Now fill the hollow base with micro-shot with elastomer holding it, and shoot it backwards. FortuneCookie45LC showed us how to do this. We have not seen it shot at stuff, and we all know how you 👍 shooting stuff. My vote is for water jugs arranged like bowling pins.

[@tim18wheels76]

Also on must shoot list is cat urine stained gun books and stacks of wet paper. Don't forget that the old gun books that look like bibles but are not bibles must be defiled with cat urine for an account and comparable test. 😉

[@taofledermaus]

haha

[@Ben-uf3dc]

I used to load air rifle pellets backwards in my old gecado .177 rifle, for the hollow point effect with small birds. I never had any problems with accuracy or take down power, it always had a solid thump on impact