GLORY (1989) | FIRST TIME WATCHING | MOVIE REACTION

GLORY (1989) | FIRST TIME WATCHING | MOVIE REACTION
FULL UNCUT REACTIONS
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[@davidharr8518]

The confederate army tried to shame Robert Shaw's family by saying we buried him with "coloured people", His father replied with “We would not have his body removed from where it lies surrounded by his brave and devoted soldiers...We can imagine no holier place than that in which he lies, among his brave and devoted followers, nor wish for him better company - what a body-guard he has!”

[@isurvivedhaddenfield6055]

Burying Shaw, a white officer, with black troops was meant to be an insult to him. Later when it was offered to move Shaw's body to a officers cemetery his father said to leave him in honor with his men.

[@priyamd4759]

Thanks for that info. Since the Fort was never taken, it must have been the people on the Fort that buried him. I had missed the point. I am from India and not very conversant with the Us historical details. Regards,

[@malcolmdrake6137]

In actuality, Confederate soldiers just wouldn't have Wasted Time separating whites from blacks. They were simply disposing of dead bodies, but people like to Pretend there was more to it, because Americans like to Pretend they are more than they truly are...😂😂😂

[@kylespeirs6510]

Nope

[@bretcantwell4921]

​@@priyamd4759the dead were tossed into a trench and buried in one of the last scenes.

[@Top10soon]

​@@kylespeirs6510yup

[@greggross8856]

In the actual battle, a private named William H Carney saw the flag-bearer shot and mortally wounded. He caught the flag before the colors hit the ground and held it at the base of the sand fort, just like Tripp did. And he was shot multiple times, just like Tripp was. Unlike Tripp, however, Private Carney survived, albeit barely. Too badly wounded and losing blood, he made his way back slowly to the regimental camp, refusing help from white Union soldiers along the way. When he finally reached the 54th encampment, he said “the old flag, never touch the ground,“ and then collapsed. He survived the battle, was promoted to sergeant and survived the war. In 1900, 36 years later, he became the first Black American soldier to receive the Medal of Honor, the highest American award for military valor. Only 88 Black Americans have ever received it.

[@PaganMinn]

thanks for sharing this man. this was cool to read. love this sorta stuff.

[@gregoryeatroff8608]

Carney wasn't mortally wounded, he lived until 1908. There is a monument to him in Norfolk, Virginia, the city where he was born into slavery before escaping north to Massachusetts.

[@wunderbex8755]

That would have been nice for the producers to add in the end credits at least. They missed more than one opportunity to honor the accolades these men received.

[@tekay44]

so he snubbed the union troops who lost 350k fighting to end slavery. this unit was a drop in a bucket full of white northern young men who righted a terrible wrong. Carney can kiss my ass.

[@karlmoles6530]

The reason Tripp was flogged was he had been caught Deserting. They had no idea why he ran away, only that he had. Desertion in wartime is usually punishable by death. A lot of soldiers in the Civil War that did and were caught were executed by firing squad. So flogging was actually a lenient punishment. However, given that Tripp had formerly been a slave wasn't the best way to handle it either. If Colonel Shaw had wanted to be lenient but not flog Tripp he could have ordered a buck & gag or similar punishment.

[@Filmfiend27]

“They’re liable to shoot you.” Morgan Freeman even warned them.

[@karlmoles6530]

@@Quey-rc1ym Flogging was still allowable in this era

[@karlmoles6530]

@@Quey-rc1ym In the United States Army yes. In state militias it varied. Most Civil War era units were Federalized Militia

[@worstcaseofcrabsever5510]

@@Quey-rc1ym wrong

[@Robert-un7br]

@@karlmoles6530The way I heard it was that the US army(Union) outlawed flogging in the first few months of the war. Since the 54th Massachusetts wasn’t formed until the Emancipation Proclamation a year and a half later, a black soldier would not have been flogged. Actually, for desertion he would have more likely been hanged.

[@SurvivorBri]

My high school history teacher was in this movie. He had taken part in Civil War reenactments and the filmmakers recruited them to be extras in the battle scenes. Glory is one of my favorite movies of all time. It had tremendous impact on me back then. I'll never forget the collective gasp in the theater when they raised the Confederate flag. The realization hit us that the battle was lost.

[@marioneno]

I felt the same way the first time I watched it. It was like, all that...for what?

[@lanolinlight]

I guess the idea, re the flogging, is that in the military, rules are rules. If you bend any active rule (even a cruel or extreme one) for one soldier, you essentially weaken the rule of law and the chain of command.

[@dnlprls]

The sergeant that trained them, and who you said was unfair. Was one of the main reasons the regiment was so successful.

[@vincentkrommenhoek7431]

I agree. Tough but fair.

[@bbwng54]

Agree- soldiers (black and white) needed to be trained hard and disciplined if they were to follow orders successfully during a battle, win the battle, and survive. Comment by karlmoles6530 is correct; Tripp was deemed to have deserted from the army, and he was lucky that he was not executed. Either way, he left camp and was "absent without leave" (AWOL) which deserved punishment, which was harsh back then. In the Revolutionary War and earlier, soldiers could be flogged with 100 lashes (although they were not all done at once).

[@carladavis1473]

They're just so naive.

[@haraldisdead]

"He's finally showing the courage that we wanted to see." HED BEEN SHOWING IT THE ENTIRE GODAMNED TIME.

[@jessestanley1690]

The training was the same for all soldiers in those days but Robert was tough on them because he wants them to be the best and he succeeded

[@jflaugher]

When he told Thomas that he had to go through proper channels to talk to him, he was doing it so as not to play favoritism. There's a way to do things in the military - and if he breaks the rules for the people who are his friends, he has to break them for everybody. Going by the book is harsh when you're in the military. They flogged Denzel because he deserted. He ran away. The punishment for running away was flogging. A harsh punishment, but those were the rules. The Colonel was carrying out the rules of the military. If he hadn't flogged Denzel, he would have been neglecting his duty. People don't have to like it or agree with it, but they should understand why without judging him too harshly. In a military situation equal treatment sometimes means equally harsh.

[@bbwng54]

Other than Robert Gould Shaw, the other characters in his regiment are fictional. William Carney won the Medal of Honor for saving the regimental flag during the assault at Battery Wagner (South Carolina).

[@BM-hb2mr]

7:10 I noticed that you both had a weird face about how he was treating the men, it's not because he was being mean, he was only trying to instill accuracy, more training for whet thy would see on the battlefield. Seal training in the US is the same way but more. And if yall watched Lone Survivor you would more understand. The training officer was trying to makes them more aware of what war was. He knew the were all tough He also saw that the commanders friend needed a little bit of growing left, he was making him tougher.

[@BM-hb2mr]

Nevermiind on yall watching Lone survivor. I watched you both react to it. Anyway you have to be really hard on someone, because you may need that later in boot camp or Hell week for military training, it's not only the body you have to train, it's the brain. A person has to be trained to reach deep within yourself the Will to survive. Th only way to do that is to break someone and have them see it for themselves. Everyone has a will to survive, but you must know how to use it when and if that time comes. War sucks, Seal training was easy, but real war sucks.

[@worstcaseofcrabsever5510]

The flogging scene only seems cruel because its a white man striking a black man who was a former slave. But flogging was a standard military punishment that had been going on for centuries. So tons of white men also were flogged. He could have been executed for deserting but the commander chose a lesser punishment. Black folks were treated like second class citizens by some people in the north. It is understandable since the majority of the blacks were uneducated and some were former slaves who had never had to pay for their living expenses before. So a lot of them were still in a learning phase adapting to a new life. It must have been extremely difficult for these men to go through all of this. Blacks fought in the Confederate Army as well so they were present on both sides.

[@tmendez31]

Nobody can say that Col. Shaw was a racist person. His mistake in the flogging decision was that he didn't get the facts about the guy actually not trying to leave, just looking for shoes. His choice may not be liked, but wouldn't it have been racist to treat those men differently than a white soldier? I think it was done with the mindset that he needs to treat them no different than any other soldier.

[@sdev2749]

You have to understand the flogging part as punishment in the army at the time was not given out on racial grounds, floggings was standard practice regardless of race, white soldiers suffered this form of punishment also if they committed a crime. The problem with flogging black soldiers is that floggings was also the form of punishment handed out to black slaves for doing the wrong thing. Robert HAD to administer the flogging punishment even though it is typically used against black slaves. It was standard military punishment.

[@MasterBiffPudwell]

If Shaw were to treat Thomas as a friend it could be construed by the other men of the 54th as preferential treatment and ultimately undermine the chain of command. The chain of command is essential on the battlefield and having it compromised could be the deciding factor between victory or defeat. If the men have no confidence in the chain of command they could fold and retreat in the face of an enemy charge even though the officers are trying to hold the line. Also, the man being flogged was actually a light sentence for desertion. Desertion during the Civil War was most often dealt with very quickly by firing squad. Yes, flogging seems inhumane by today's society considering the man's history and race but in reality Shaw was being merciful by not ordering him executed on the spot. The man had to be punished or others may begin to think they can come and go as they please. When they torch the town such things were happening. Read about Sherman's march to the sea. Union general William Tecumseh Sherman took his troops and pillaged and plundered his way across the South from Tennessee to the Georgia coast leaving a trail of death and destruction that cut the Confederacy on half.

[@cynthiaschultheis1660]

There's a huge sculpture on wall of them in honor. In Boston.👍👍👍👍👍

[@MargaretLaFleur-j5j]

“We fight for a men and women whose poetry is not yet written.” How beautiful is that?

[@PantoniStrikesBack]

I love the part where they all pray. And the guy singing at the begining... holy shit, what a voice!

[@SCharlesDennicon]

33:12 Death... the great equalizer. I've always loved that shot. The symbolism, the slowlo, Horner's score...

[@jesusfernandezgarcia9449]

There is nothing better than seeing intelligent youth, reacting and understanding situations better than older people. New and better people for the world.

[@jessestanley1690]

Deserters were shot in those days the flogging was mercy it’s not easy to watch but it’s reality

[@binraswtor7760]

In any case, whether Hagood or anyone else intended the burial in a common trench as a desecration, Shaw’s family took it as a point of pride. His father rebuffed attempts to have the body found and exhumed. “We can imagine no holier place than that in which he lies,” he wrote, “among his brave and devoted followers, nor wish for him better company-what a body-guard he has!”

[@DELANOdutch]

Great reaction! You two are adorable. 🤘🏼👍🏼 Keep up the good work.

[@shan0997]

Fyi, this movie is pretty accurate. Also, idk how much you know about the civil war but during that time desertion was a crime, punishable by death. Therefore, the whipping, though brutal and hard to watch, was the better alternative. As far as Captain Shaw knew the soldier WAS deserting. He was not made aware of why he broke camp until after the punishment had been dealt. Still doesn't make it any easier to watch but it was either the flogging or a firing squad.

[@Smenkhaare]

Robert wanted his horse to live, because he knew he was going to die with his men. Also on horseback... Robert would be a perfect target and anyone near him. This was a very smart tactical move. Robert was suffering from heavy PTS (post traumatic stress.... we no longer say syndrome) after the Battle of Antietam in the beginning that the Union "won". Back then Brigadier Generals, Colonels, Lieutenant Colonels and Majors are led from the front. Not the rear as in modern day... especially for general staff.

[@tileux]

When the rebels later sent very high ranking (to the rebels) emissaries to Washington seeking peace terms, Grant and Lincoln deliberately sent a black cavalry regiment to escort them. Shaw was intentionally stern with his men because his family was well connected in the abolition movement, and with Frederick Douglas, so he was well aware of how important the 54th Massachusetts would be in setting the example required to overturn the enormous prejudice against them, even in the north. Slaves in the south were never freed until the 14th amendment was passed but - through a clever bit of legal reasoning - the Union labelled them ‘property of rebels, therefore liable to confiscation’ - contraband. Thats what the black ‘soldiers’ were in florida and new orleans. But because of the prejudice against them they were never trained and were a dangerous rabble. The corruption in the Union command in the south was very bad - that is absolutely true - and what Shaw did to get reassigned is accurate. By the way, in case you dont know, the narration in this movie is taken directly from Shaw’s diary and letters. He was 25 when he was killed at Ft Wagner. The emancipation proclamation issued after Antietam - the bloodiest day in US history, and a battle that was an absolute fiasco for both sides - only freed slaves in the south, because two union states were slave states. Lincoln had long wanted to issue the emancipation proclamation but was waiting for a union victory so it didnt look like an act of desperation (it was important to prevent france or britain from recognising the south as a separate country - although we now know that neither britain or france ever had any intention of doing that). Antietam was really a very gruesome draw but since it resulted in a rebel withdrawal Lincoln counted it as a victory and issued the proclamation. The only major flaw in this movie is that the 54th Massachusetts actually fought for quite a while before it attacked Ft Wagner (which was actually a dumb idea and a major union disaster - the fact that the 54th performed so bravely was publicised a lot to cover up just how dumb the attacks on Ft Wagner and other attacks in the area were). Black soldiers and their officers were massacred at fort pillow and in an infamous incident during the siege of Petersburg. Lincoln eventually ordered that if any union soldiers were killed after surrendering then an equal number of rebel prisoners would be shot. After that the rebels started treating black union soldiers as prisoners of war on surrender. This has always been a favourite movie of mine ever since i saw it in a cinema on release. But im white and not american. Watching your reaction to it was fascinating and very moving.

[@hannaford111]

Impressive. You seem to know a lot more about the history of the war than many of us Americans.

[@johannesvalterdivizzini1523]

Well said, but Antietam was the bloody end to a Confederate invasion of Union States. The Union forces stopped that invasion in the battle, and the Confederates retreated south. It was undeniably a Union victory. Costly, very imperfect, but a victory nonetheless.

[@aubreyjones2206]

Washington’s character was a combination of men but mostly William Carney who was awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor. Carney survived the Battery Wagner assault.

[@reverance_pavane]

Flogging was the prescribed punishment for being AWOL (it technically wasn't desertion because it wasn't "in the face of the enemy" and he had returned to the unit voluntarily), regardless of the colour of the enlisted soldier. The fact that Colonel Shaw was shocked when Private Trip's tunic was removed just shows how far removed his Boston life was from the life of the slave negro. And of course the message was intentional. [And most regimental officers of the time wouldn't had stayed to actually observe the punishment. Shaw did. He took moral responsibility for issuing the punishment.] The training may seem very brutal but that was the nature of fighting at the time. The inaccuracy of their muskets meant that troops had to advance en masse and use mass fire and shock to try and break the enemy units. So you stood shoulder-to-shoulder with your fellow soldiers to the end. But it was also the start of modern warfare, with field artillery and repeating weapons starting to make an appearance. The casualty figures were considered unbelievable and inflated by European generals.

[@nannunbgd]

In army,in all armies from this planet,if you whant to talk with a superior,you must ask. Is a general rulle.

[@sylvesterbestertester1013]

Ladies, I love watching your reactions to movies. And you pick such great movies. I don't know if I'm the only one that complained about this, but I can hardly hear the movie compared to you guys talking. If I have the volume up enough to hear the movie, then you two comment and it's louder than thunder. And visa vera. If I turn it down enough where it doesn't sound like your screaming so I can hear your reaction, I can barely hear the movie at all Maybe it's me. Maybe it's my device. Just thought I'd share in case others have commented the same. Otherwise, I guess I'll just have to put up with it.

[@antoinettelopes]

I have one of those purple Tesla disks. I don't know where it is tho. 🤔 So I saw this movie in the theater. This regiment is from where I live. It's the first movie I think I saw Denzel Washington in. I believe he was nominated for an Oscar for it.

[@OldSkoolDad23]

Glory is in my top 10 movies!

[@walterblackledge1137]

The Army used to be very harsh. They would whip deserters

[@Writer102385]

The punishment for desertion was firing squad. Even though it was a harsh punishment, it was a lesser punishment of the two. If one man steps out of line and not punished before the other soldiers for being disorderly, the rest could fall out of line.

[@DONLove-e8u]

Flogging was. Called for by Uß Army regulation for desertion Flogging was used in the USN.. The Colonel was acting çorrectly. A deserter oould be hanged.

[@aljosapetkovic69]

He cannot give his friend special treatment in front of everyone else, its terrible for morale and sets an example of favoritism - same reason they can't be to friendly with the enlisted men. The drill sergeant is correct when he's pushing them to the point of breaking, because trust me, this is nothing compared to real war, its the sargeants job to make the men kind of hate him.. then he knows he did his part well. Emotions will get you killed in combat period. Whipping was the punishment in the army and navy back then nothing to do with colour.

[@tommywalker3746]

Ya that punishment would have happened to any enlisted man. The fact that he only got the required punishment is the miracle. If the captain was anyone else with a rich family (democrats)in that time period Denzel's character would have been killed. And the movie ended

[@skizz0phrenia270]

The flogging scene is hard to watch, but I also think it's the reason Denzel won so many awards for his role in this film. Allow me to add some context to the scene. Back then there were only three punishments. The most minor punishment would be running extra laps or pulling late watch. When Denzel states that Thomas "should have ducked", Shaw orders the drill sergaent to deal with him, and in the background you can see him begin to run laps. Now if a soldier were to do something that could possibly harm the morale or integrity of the company, i.e. desertion, inciting mutiny, smuggling contraband, they need to be made an example of in front of everybody. The choices are being flogged with a whip, or being executed via firing squad (as Freeman's character states "You're liable to get shot if you do that.") Major Forbes expresses feelings any person with even a shred of humanity would in this situation "Not with a whip, not on them!". Even the drill sergeant, who has been shown to be a (respectable) hardass, looks back at the Colonel after seeing the scars, as if asking if they are really going through with it. Now to understand Shaw's decisions, you need to remove any and all personal feelings on the situation and look at it with cold, hard logic - Shaw believes in equality for everybody. This means each and every person, in his eyes, should have the same exact rights as everybody else, which in turn means that those same individuals need to suffer the same punishments that anybody else would for a crime. His men aren't just freemen and former slaves, they are expected to be soldiers too, which means that they are held to an even higher standard than the civilian population. If Shaw had not administered punishment to Trip, he would have been treating him differently from others based solely on the color of his skin, and to be fair, he could have had him shot on the spot, which most other white commanders of black units would do without a second thought. In our current times, the whip has become a symbol so powerful that even mention or sight of it is enough to invoke strong emotions, but I believe in this scene, the act of whipping... It was equality.

[@PaulSnook-PewPew]

the way Thomas was treated was harsh, but it is also part of breaking the men down, and turning them into warriors

[@Cage2053K]

When the regiment departed Boston in 1863 for war it comprised 1,000 men and officers. During the assault on Fort Wagner the regiment's vanguard of 250 men sustained 20 Killed, 125 Wounded and 102 Missing. Following the assault the remaining men and officers of the regiment were withdrawn from combat and returned to Boston where it marched down main street as heroes. The regiment was rebuilt and commissioned under a new colonel and returned to serve the rest of the war with honor in many battles.

[@lutzderlurch7877]

A bit of context: old military worked on a rather strict discipline and hierarchy. It worked best, when the system was applied fairly, i.e. everyone treated equally. The highest ranking officer in the regiment being openly friends and friendly with a common soldier, could easily sow discontent among the others, or make Thomas a target for bullying from others. It is best to avoid any semblance of favoritism. As per flogging: Desertion was a serious offence, often punished by death. Apart from death, flogging had a long tradition as corporal punishment in armies. That it is inflicted on a black soldier in this case is troublesome. But Shaw‘s reasoning may well be, to treat the black soldiers fully as equal to whites, and thus liable to the same military justice system. Last point about his major openly intervening and him carrying on: in the same vein as military discipline mentioned above, there were ways for disagreeing but open conflict was to be aboided. Otherwise, why should anybody else follow commands unchallenged? The open and emotional challenging of authority barred Shaw from possibly reducing the sentence. Because had he done so after having his authority challenged, the lesson learned by the others could easily be to just question and disregard unpleasant orders, because he will take them back. So there is reason behind those actions, even though they feel harsh at times.

[@brianrecinos3914]

4:36: It's out of respect for the military code. Any personal fraternizations between enlisted men and officers is a bad idea because it can lead to enlisted men refusing to carry out orders and undermining the officer's authority and officers becoming too attached to the men that they'll hesitate to send them into a combat situation, thus it will be seen as them not doing their jobs. What works for them in the short run will work against them in the long run. That's why Shaw is reprimanding Forbes. It would be fine for Forbes and Thomas to still be friends if Thomas didn't volunteer in the 1st place. 7:04: The Sergeant Major is in the right for that. Thomas joined the military, not the boy scouts. They trained men to be capable, fighting units and they're not gonna achieve that by moddly cuddling them. The man's job is to break them down as civilians, so he can build them up to be soldiers. I heard this saying about basic training: "The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in combat". 10:09: I think you 2 ladies may have misunderstood this scene. Thomas is realizing he and Shaw are military men and that he can't go on acting like a civilian around Shaw and Forbes just because they're friends. Thomas also realizes Shaw is an officer and he's a recruit which means Thomas has to deal with whatever problems he's facing on his own and at the same time, maintain discipline. The whole flogging scene is showing Shaw being stuck between a rock and a hard place as a leader. If he orders the flogging, he'll be upholding his duty as colonel to uphold discipline whenever a soldier violates military code, but it also means he's betraying the abolitionist idealism he's been carrying when he enlisted. If he doesn't order the flogging, Trip may have been spared the rod and Shaw may feel relieved that he didn't order it, but he'll probably be viewed as weak and unable to do his duty as regiment leader and that is not acceptable because it's moddly cuddling and he could very well be replaced by someone who can be worse than him. I think the reason Shaw ordered the flogging is because he realizes that as a military man, he doesn't have the luxury of ideals and that he must set himself up as an example of a proper colonel to his men and to himself. 19:39: Shaw is again in between a rock and a hard place. If he complies, he'll keep his regiment, but after committing a war crime. If he doesn't, his regiment won't have a stain on its record, but he'll be court martialed for disobeying the operation commander AND Shaw's regiment will serve under him. What Shaw did was choose the lesser of 2 evils which means one war crime under Shaw is better than multiple war crimes under the other colonel. This is a good Civil War movie and I highly recommend you 2 watch another Civil War movie called Gettysburg.

[@itt23r]

Thank you for that perspective on this film. It was very moving. And I am now a subscriber.

[@louielouie22]

Lincoln

[@imnotyourfriendbuddy1883]

They had anesthesia, especially the USA(Union, North). Ether, chloroform, opium, morphine, alcohol, nitrous oxide, etc. Army surgeons often didn't have enough for large battles. Some was always reserved for officers.

[@Carl-o5d]

It's all painful (brother killing brother) I know people in the south and they are braves and genuine people I have known. Black and white women in the south are soo beautiful in character.

[@George-kv6gm]

Your usual great reaction to a great movie. Thanks!

[@williammontroy9024]

I understand the feelings behind him key stepping in and intervening in his flogging but you have to understand that was the standard punishment for a deserting soldier in the army back then . He wanted these men to be true real and well trained fighting men because at the time it was more likely a all black regiment would be relegated to labor and support duties kind of a figurehead propaganda function . He wanted to be sure his men were proper soldiers so they could prove their cause and show each man’s worth as a man not a ex slave but a tried and tested American soldier and citizen. Freedom is beautiful but it requires toughness which these men had in abundance he knew that and knew the only way to show that was to make real soldiers out of them

[@startingQB]

While the flogging was tough even for Robert, it had to be done. Robert told the other officers to treat the men like real soldiers and train them like real official soldiers. So when it came time to discipline the men, they had to discipline the men like they would all the other soldiers. Otherwise Robert would be looked on as a hypocrite. Robert was being tough on them because he was preparing them to survive battle.

[@gabrielegenota1480]

It’s difficult to be friends with people who you’d eventually, if the situation dictates, send to their deaths.

[@tripsaplenty1227]

flogging was for desertion. it was a common military punishment at the time and was done on white soldiers to.

[@Smenkhaare]

For supposed desertion Trip could have been executed. In this instance... even though he is whipped... Shaw gave him the much lesser punishment, also he was showing others that Black troops could suffer through the same punishments. The Union had officially eliminated flogging as a punishment for desertion and it was never really carried out in 54th Mass. Also the importance of Frederick Douglas should not be overlooked. His importance is as big (if not bigger) than Mass governor Andrew. Frederick Douglas' oldest son was a sergeant major and his youngest son was a first sergeant. Lastly, the 54th was made up of Thomas'... not the formerly recently enslaved. There may have been one or two Trips, Sharps and/or Rollins, however the 54th was made up of middle class men. Doctors, dentists, shop keepers, skilled laborers, farmers... the trope back then was that the formerly enslaved would not fight their enslavers. So Frederick Douglas and other Black leaders (along with Northern White leaders who supported them) that the 54th Regiment would be made up of Free Men and not the formerly enslaved. Today we know that the formerly enslaved would make excellent soldiers, however they believed otherwise back then. 19th Century Warfare up to the mid point of the Civil War had mass charges, infantry lined up for battle. Before muskets were rifled you had to be with 50 or so yards with a mass of muskets in the hope of hitting the enemy. The knives on the ends of the guns are bayonets turning the rifles into spears. They could only fire three shots within a minute if well trained. If you fired too soon... you had an empty rifle with no easy chance of reloading in sight of the enemy.

[@TheFalconking]

Awesome reaction video as always. try using a bit less of gain in your mics because they were starting to saturate or distort. virtual hugs guys !

[@m.vondrake5534]

Battery Wagner was never fully captured by the Union. No Union regiment had gotten closer to capturing the fort than the 54th Massachusetts. The following Union forces only attacked long enough for the remainder of the 54th to retreat. The Confederate forces at Battery Wagner gave the Union 8 hours to retrieve wounded Soldiers (after the Confederacy had mentioned they would give no quarter). They executed all other wounded and captured colored Soldiers and buried them in a mass grave as shown. The 54th Massachusetts went on to fight a few other battles and lasted the remainder of the Civil War.

[@Mittens.49]

Good job. Great reaction.

[@whynotflee8079]

Great reaction ❤

[@Roadghost1969]

I always wondered if being so young helped or hurt Robert? My thinking is his regiment might respond better to a younger guy (look someone putting their baby in harms way and he might not act like the older "white people") . He did have Morgan Freeman to be the "father" of the group and that did help when he smacked some sense into Denzel's character. Now.... with the rest of the Military they were not taking him serious with his requests. How many times did he have to ask for items and then he had to bring his "Boys" with him.

[@christopherpeters6365]

Frederick Douglas' son was in the 54th❤

[@tboltaq2]

It is hard to understand for people today to understand the harsh realities of 19th century military discipline. Flogging in the Navy was commonplace and not so much in the Army. The Articles of War were harsh but necessary as there wasn't any other way to deal with people as we didn't have the body of law and traditions to govern an Army. Civil wars are particularly barbaric as it is a fight against those who were once your countrymen. The south has still never fully gotten over it to this day. What isw really impressive about the fighting to me was the ability of men to stand there and fire 3 shots a minute of aimed fire and then do a full run in a bayonette charge.... Hot lead and cold steel.

[@robertparker6280]

6:53 Sadly not abuse, thats Army or Military. BT is supposed to be VERY a tough on you, most drill sergeants are getting them ready for war. Also with Robert and Thomas, its the chain of command that Robert is keeping and Thomas has to respect it. Every time Thomas (or anyone) is going through something hard, can't be going to your best friend, and cry about it. Again its war, you have to toughen up.

[@cjmacq-vg8um]

flogging deserters was a common punishment in the military at the time throughout the world. and executing those who desert during battle was also common. and "boot-camp," also known as basic training, is still a very rough experience even today. though, perhaps, not as harsh as it was back then. the idea behind these punishments and the mistreatment of soldiers was to make them FEAR their govt's "authority" more than fearing the enemy. to make them mean and mad and ready to kill. its about the only way you could convince any sane person to walk straight into a hail of bullets and cannon fire. war sux. and so does the military and militarism. it doesn't make anyone a "man." it turns them into scared, compliant automotons who'll obey any command and commit any autrocity if ordered to do so. i'm so damned glad and lucky i never had to experience the horror of war or the rigors and rigidity of military discpline.

[@luvlgs1]

a lot of brave men died for our freedom and our rights. BTW that flogging scene won Denzel the Oscar...so some good came out of it, you have to admit, babe...keep on rockin

[@bradharris8935]

There is a chain of command. It's a military thing. It's there for a reason. Yes, it's hard. It's not for everybody. That's my experience, and mine was 100 years plus after this. s

[@artbagley1406]

This movie is based in FACT, actual events. Shaw was "uncomfortable" taking the command of Black troops because it had never been done in the U.S. Army before. He was also young and a lower-grade officer -- lots of unknowns and variables not in any Army manual or school textbook. Thomas has to do it The Military Way to get to speak with Shaw; THAT'S the correct way ... in the army. Denzel's character was charged with DESERTION (leaving camp without permission). That borders on COWARDICE in some cases. The United States Colored Troops (their official designation, USCT) actually fought two enemies at the same time: the Confederates AND the United States Army's racism. The Black troops not only felt "happy," but they were fiercely PROUD to fight for their own freedom and the hope for a more equitable nation. "Give 'em hell, 54th" shouted by the group of white soldiers who derided them earlier -- "n's with stripes, like tits on a boar." And then the "Butch Cassidy & The Sundance Kid" ending inside the fort. UGH! Thank you for your thoughtful commentary and reactions, Ladies!

[@dominushydra]

There is no bend with Military Law. If a soldier leaves without permission they get punished harshly no matter the reason.

[@311Essie]

I'm a white boy but I would have courageously fought for you sistahs....

[@scottdarden3091]

The flogging was necessary, because he should have been executed for desertion in time of war. What signal would no punishment have given?

[@Writer102385]

In the military you are to ask permission to speak to a higher ranking officer.

[@lazyperfectionist1]

0:49 This strategy puzzles me. I mean this is something the _English_ infantry used in the battlefield against the troops of General _Washington_ in the US _Revolutionary_ War. Washington's troops dressed to blend in with the environment and hide behind natural _landscape_ features like rocks, trees and _holes_ in the ground. They started firing when they received the order "Open fire" and _kept_ firing until they either heard the order "Cease fire," ran out of ammo, won or died. The troops of General Cornwallis, on the other hand, wore _red_ and marched in a _straight line._ They didn't fire until they received the order "Fire," and then they reloaded and waited for the order to come _again._ Consistently, the approach used by Washington's troops turned out to be far _superior._ Those British troops looked _very impressive_ in their bright, shiny uniforms, but they made _very_ easy targets. So why is Captain Shaw _emulating_ them? Does he _want_ to see the troops under his command massacred?

[@gregall2178]

That wasn't Captain Shaw's personal strategy, it was the military's. Rank and file formations were still commonplace during the U.S. Civil War. More accurate weapons made that strategy obsolete.

[@tugalord]

Line fighting in lines was still the most effective way to fight up until then, and the continental army used the same strategy as the british (fighting in lines). By the 1860s, rifled muskets made line fighting obsolete other than for fighting cavalry.

[@lazyperfectionist1]

@@tugalord I fail to see how fighting in _lines_ is especially devastating, even when you're wielding nothing better than a _musket_ with which every single round must be loaded and fired one at a _time._ Not if you're going up against an army the soldiers of which are hiding behind _landscape_ features.

[@tugalord]

@@lazyperfectionist1 fighting in lines was done for several reasons: - smoothbore flintlock muskets were innacurate past 100 yards and very unreliable (even in sunny days), so lining up and fighting in volleys was a way to mass firepower and to actually inflict some damage), not to mention black powder made tons of smoke, so you would be firing blind after a few volleys. -better protection from cavalry (it would be easy to form into a square if attacked by cavalry (horses arent too keen on rushing à wall of bayonets). -coordination, as radios and other more efficient methods of communication werent a thing, tight ranks, musicians and flags helped to retain cohesion and give orders. And there were some infantry units that fought in loose order formations (light infantry), however they were more used for harassing the enemy, because they would be vulnerable against cavalry. However with the development of the percussion cap (which fixed the reliability of the musket) and the minié Ball (which made rifles more effective to be used by line infantry, solving the musket's accuracy problem), aswell as advancements in artillery and the fact that cavalry charges quickly became a thing of the past made line fighting obsolete, however the nail in the coffin for fighting in lines was WW1 (with machineguns, smokeless powder,etc...).

[@davidward9737]

There were Confederate black Troops. The thing is, this is what human beings do. I hope the 54th statue didn't get torn down. I'm from the South born in the Southern Capital of Richmond Va. The Union committed atrocities you will never here. Shermans March. Black Slave owners and you will be surprised. I love the 54th and I love everyone that fought in the war between the States. Like Tripp said it "stinks" I have done so much research. Both wars ended in Virginia. Appomattox in Civil and Independence in Yorktown. Thank you both that white folks died among black folks. Read Robert Could Shaw's letters.

[@James-ih7xm]

Classic movie.👍👍

[@haraldisdead]

Except they weren't ex slaves. They were nearly all freeborn, yankee, Massachusetts men. They would have had a New England accent, spoken standard American English, and certainly didn't have a southern revivalist testimony before battle.

[@heathen-heart]

I love it when reactors who know nothing and have no experience make and pass judgment on the story being told, It earns them a thumbs down.

[@DONLove-e8u]

Flogging was a usual punishment for military crimes.. The man deserted. He could've been hung or shot..

[@cynthiaschultheis1660]

GENERAL SHERMAN (NORTH) BLAZED A SWATH ACROSS THE SOUTH, ESP ATLANTA!!!

[@YoungMoney_1788]

In the 1840’s to 1861 it was a form of legal army punishment which would be implemented on deserters he didn’t really have a choice

[@scar445]

The sergeant major has a point. "Let him grow up some more". Thomas lived a shielded and protected life. He grew up in it. And the only way for the Sergeant major to keep him alive once the fighting starts, is to rip him out of the illusion of safety and shielded living, and prepare him for the harshness and brutality of war.

[@Roadghost1969]

Yes, that was a fine line to walk his fellow soldiers probably called Thomas a Brown Nose/book worm. And Robert had to not show favoritism.

[@scar445]

@@Roadghost1969 the scenes, first with the crying Thomas that wishes to speak to Robert, because he needs the comforting words of a friend, only to be rejected because it is not protocol, and the later scene with them wishing each other a genuine merry christmas. It shows the growth of Thomas, and the understanding that Robert did what he had to do. He didn't do it to spite Thomas, but to protect him.

[@DavidMichaelson-j7n]

I like how proud he looked watching march off to war. He knew they were ready.

[@henrikvridstoft2774]

True. You see that "growing up" pay off in the end, when Thomas uses the bayonet countermove during the fight at Ft. Wagner, that he was exposed to during boot camp (right before he sadly is stabbed in the back)

[@Smenkhaare]

Exactly... he had the blood of John Brown in him and he was a heart felt abolitionist. Poetic license and his reputation is sullied by this characterization.@@henrikvridstoft2774

[@blanketstarry7725]

The other soldiers can't see Thomas being friendly with the commanding officer, because it will seem that he is getting special treatment and that can foment discord among the troops. The soldiers all need to be on equal footing and they need to feel like they are all in it together. Feeling resentment toward this or that soldier because it appears they are "in the boys club" will put others in danger during battle. Shaw is doing the right thing by treating Thomas as a proper soldier.

[@houseoftoussaint9609]

It's hard accepting military culture over civilian culture. In the end, everything is meant to keep morale up and everyone alive.

[@eltreum1]

Exactly. When their training sarge made the comment about Thomas growing up he was also talking to Shaw who was clearly feeling uneasy himself. Shaw not showing favoritism and allowing Thomas to become a soldier the right way as every other man there was a respectful act of tough love for them both to mature.

[@gingerbreadman1969]

In the military it's called the chain of command. No enlisted person can just approached his commanding officer without going through the proper channels. The colonel, I forget his name, was trying not to show favoritism to Thomas and had to do his part to instill the military discipline they would all need going forward. It's not a question of his humanity..

[@davidcorriveau8615]

It would also be a case of 'jumping the chain of command' since the Private answers to probably 2 possibly 3 officers before you get to the Commanding Officer of the Regiment, the Colonel (who happens to be a childhood friend).

[@reecedignan8365]

@@davidcorriveau8615 You are correct and not just coming 2-3 he’s jumping practically all of it. If he wished to make a complaint to their commanding officer he’d need to first meet with his company sergeant. The sergeant would either deem the issue reasonable to be brought up further in the chain or quash it there - I.e. if someone was to say have a minor injury or feel ill, do you think it reasonable to get the officers involved vs just the sergeant going “go to the medical staff and have it checked out”. If the situation is deemed severe enough or that it cannot be dealt with by a sergeant - say a man was having issues of pay, and that he was not receiving it or that he had found acts of misdoing amongst other men of the regiment - he would be sent to meet the company lieutenant and/or captain (note if it’s something more minor the lieutenant would be the one to deal with it, if quite severe the captain would be forced to deal with it) however those two would only be expected to deal with said situation if it pertained to their company not someone else’s. - the only exception of going higher than these two for a private would be in a situation where it is the lieutenant and captain being accused of crime. At which point the man would likely get to speak with the regiments major or senior sergeant. Note after he has dealt with these senior people, the private would not actually then go onto speak with the actual major, lieutenant-colonel or colonel. Instead it would be his captain who’d be expected to take this information up the line if it was most severe for these higher up to deal with. And it would be the lieutenant-colonel or colonel who’d be expected to relay information onto their brigade commanders who’d then pass it up to division and army if most severe. However, stuff would usually never get this far. The only time such a private would be allowed to speak with the colonel would be in invitation of passing on information he may have - I.e. if he is witness to a crime or situation or he has something to report given to him by other senior personnel. The only other exception would be if the colonel choose to speak with the private at his own choice however such would be discouraged incase of showing favouritism - I.e. if Shaw was to speak with Thomas normally and was treated with a bit more lenience compared to his fellow soldiers this may breed a resentment for the man or amongst some an idea to use said man to persuade the colonel of officer to do as they wish.

[@babs3241]

To be fair, Robert probably should have explained that to Thomas before training started, since Thomas would have had no way of knowing that. His friends were both officers and had a general battlefield camaraderie; it very well might not have occurred to him that an enlisted man would be in a different position.

[@gingerbreadman1969]

@@babs3241 This is probably true too..

[@lutzderlurch7877]

Might be true. Though I‘d guess it is among the first things taught to new soldiers and assumed it to have happened off-camera

[@michaelf8702]

When you guys couldn't understand why he told his friend that he needs to go through the proper channels to speak to his commanding officer, it's because he cannot show favoritism. That was the way in which all soldiers had to speak with their commanding officer. Just because the guy was his childhood friend doesn't mean he gets special privileges or treated differently. It would have been hard for Robert to do that, but he was right in doing that Denzel got flogged in front of everyone because that was the punishment for deserting. Most likely that was the punishment for anyone who deserted, regardless of race.

[@ericjohnson7632]

He was also breaking the chain of command. You don't skip your first line leader.

[@George-kv6gm]

Telling an officer not to fraternize with an enlisted man is correct. No matter the color of either of them. It's still the rule in the military. For instance, officers' quarters are completely separate (when possible) from enlisted living quarters. You hope that officers and enlisted personnel are basically friendly to each other at work, but there is still a level of being "reserved" around one another. Lots of movies show officers and enlisted being close friends, but at the end of the day, everyone has to understand that there is still a social separation to be observed. Combat does tend to blur the lines, though, as you've seen.

[@bbwng54]

Agree- similarly, you generally don't jump the hierarchy of communication- you talk to your immediate boss or superior- you don't approach the commander/general

[@kellymoses8566]

The division between officers and enlisted is stupid.

[@russellcollins52]

​@@kellymoses8566the boundary between enlisted and officers still exists and is needed. A big reason that it is needed is that those in a leadership position must be fair and impartial. If there is no separation then the leaders friends are rewarded and not those most responsible. Just like the leader could show leniency their friends and be harsh to those they dislike.

[@kellymoses8566]

@@russellcollins52 Then why do the officers deserve better food and housing?

[@russellcollins52]

@@kellymoses8566 same food, bit back then most officers paid for their own food. Better pay equals more money for food. And the housing isn't that much better between enlisted and officer's. In some cases the housing is worse on base.

[@martinsear5470]

One of my top 5 films of all time. Unlike films like Braveheart and The Patriot this is how you make an historically accurate movie. Makes me cry everytime I watch it.

[@blueeyedcowboy8291]

"Give 'em hell 54th!" gets me every time. Denzel, Andre and Morgan are so great in this movie.

[@GrimrDirge]

He didn't invent flogging, it was a prescribed punishment. Firing squad was his other option. He wasn't seeking personal validation, he was tasked with proving that black soldiers were viable soldiers. He was actually very liberal and forgiving for the era. Life was harsh.

[@robertelder164]

Actually flogging had been banned

[@thomassmith-s4i]

Exactly. Flogging had been a standard punishment in every army since the Roman legions. It was applied to both white and black soldiers in the Civil War. Desertion (leaving post without permission) could have been dealt with by firing squad, so Tripp got off "easy." In a strange way, if Robert had forgiven Tripp and not done anything, it would have been an insult to Tripp- meaning that he had not earned the right to be treated as a "real" soldier. I thought Morgan freeman was just as deserving of an Oscar as Denzel Washington- two of the best performances in any war movie ever. More young people should be watching films like this instead of "The Avengers" and other ridiculous fluff. Kudos to these two young ladies for bringing this to the attention of their audience..

[@currinwoodruffwoodruff1555]

We know for the punishment of desertion in the Union army you could be hung shot or flogged it really depends on if you got a court marshal trial during the Fredericksburg campaign following the emancipation proclamation few hundred union soldiers deserted Lincoln spent days pardoning and exonerated these men that were condemned to death by hanging and or firing squad

[@robertelder164]

Flogging banned by this time. They had many other options-buck and gaggign for instance.@@currinwoodruffwoodruff1555

[@meganoob12]

yeah, the point Shaw is making by his behavior is that these men are treated just as white men are treated. Black or white, these men are soldiers of the US Army. The don't get better, nor worse treatment than their white brothers.

[@matthewcharles5867]

The other option to the flogging was being shot. The commander was trying to train them to a competent level so when they got to fight they had a better chance of success. The 54th was well trained despite having problems like getting supplies from the quartermaster. They preformed well in battle due to the good training they received.

[@kristymcdowell6185]

Glory has a special place in my heart. It’s so incredibly moving. There are lots of people who I don’t think grasp how awful, bloody, and horrific the civil war was.

[@meknottyou3998]

And, there are even more people who don't realize that the Civil War is still being fought. It never ended.

[@chandlermorgan708]

An underrated movie

[@alltogetherfitandproper4252]

It’s understated. I haven’t noticed anyone whose seen it not appreciating the hell out of it.

[@EgbertWilliams]

When you said that Shaw seemed both excited and scared at the responsibility of leading a new regiment on his own, I agreed. Also, he was only 23 years old at the time.

[@davewhitlow2984]

Battery Wagner (site now underwater) was never taken. However, the 54th was the ONLY regiment to gain access to the east wing of the of the battery and held it for over an hour before being repulsed. Shaw was an early casualty as portrayed in the movie and was buried along with his men. There is a beautiful monument in Boston (seen at the end) that commemorated the 54th.

[@marioneno]

Technically that's correct, it was never taken by force, though it continued to be under siege for a while, until the Confederates simply couldn't stay anymore, probably from a lack of provisions. Then, they just kind of slipped away, quietly. That's what I read and heard anyway. One Confederate soldier supposedly spoke of Fort Wagner being 'the closest thing to Hell' he could imagine.

[@davewhitlow2984]

@@marioneno I imagine is was.

[@thomaseggle8886]

You both are right that the Colonel and the Drill Sergeant were very tough....and the whipping scene was the first time I was so bothered in a movie when I saw this at 12. But to prepare them for what was to come...a world were all compassion, remorse, humility and happiness would not exist on the battlefield. They had to make it hard...if not harder since they were the first black regiment. They didn't want to give any impression whatsoever that they were holding back with the toughness of the training. So as hard as it is to watch...seeing them perform in combat the way they did with honor and valor and courage only magnifies the type of training they received despite the hurdles, intolerance and pitfalls. The last minutes before the final battle still make my eyes flood with tears. A very powerful movie. You guys did a great job with your reaction.

[@lazyperfectionist1]

9:51 "Enlisted men wishing to speak to their Commanding Officer must first get permission." "Wow." "He grew _up_ with this guy." Yes, but now they're both members of the same military _unit_ and this is the _reality._ Shaw is an _officer._ Searles is undergoing training to join the _enlisted_ ranks. Officers have to keep professional _distance_ for the sake of unit _morale._ He dares not give special treatment to _Searles_ that he can't give to the _rest_ of the unit. That wouldn't be fair to _them._

[@stevenbeumer4725]

The voiceovers read by Matthew Broderick throughout the movie are from letters written home by the real Colonel Shaw. Always thought that was cool so you know how Shaw felt.

[@michaelatteberry6462]

10.30 You have to remember this is 1800s and Enlisted and Officer ranks did not fraternize. Also, these troops had no training at all and the colonel had to turn them into an effective unit for the times.

[@jamescanole3940]

The flogging scene is my favorite Denzel scene from all his movies. I'm sure it contributed greatly to him getting his Oscar for Best Supporting Actor. When the credits roll at the end they are displayed over a beautiful monument showing Shaw leading the troops. 11x14 feet in size, it was erected across the street from the Massachusetts State House here in Boston in 1884. Thanks for watching and reviewing this great film!

[@aubreyjones2206]

Flagging was a military wide form of punishment and is even still in use during “Starship Troopers”.

[@tommywalker3746]

This is one of top 5 greatest movies of all time. Our citizenship is what unites us all

[@falcon215]

I saw this at the theater when it first came out and remember most how quiet it was as everyone waited until the last credit rolled. I think it still holds up very well, doesn't look dated in any way. Enjoyed your reactions as always.

[@AgenteusaRR]

its an "under the radar" movie. Won 3 oscars and though its not entirelly historical, the government (years after) had a request to to retrieve Shaw and his family said " no, he's honored to be buried along his men". not only wasn't he not aa racist like most were back then, he was a "beacon", died at 27-28, supposedly charging "Battery Wagner" . There are men whose deeds are just impossible to explain, this is one of them.....and im not even American ;)

[@truewilliams7118]

I watched this movie when I was 10 and it was the first time I wanted to cry at the end of a movie I didn't know you could kill the "good guys" in a movie, great video and reaction!

[@anyviolet]

I saw this in the theater and the flogging was by far the most upsetting scene in the film for audiences, judging by the complete silence except for the sniffing and crying going on. The public flogging was standard procedure, however, and it was necessary -- to show the other men the penalty for deserting and discourage other deserters. Regardless of race. The colonel was actually treating the soldiers with respect for their safety, by insisting on proper training, treating everyone the same (how he instructed Thomas to act like any other soldier with him) and concern for their safety in battle. And as we saw, the flogging, given the context, was upsetting to the colonel too, and was the impetus for him getting the soldiers their just uniforms, shoes, pay, and respect from other officers outside the unit, going forward.

[@TheFalconking]

On this subject, guys, please do a reaction on AMISTAD, one of the most underrated Spielberg movies about slavery in America and the men that opposed it.