Suspension Forks, Coil & Air Shocks | Everything You Need To Know About MTB Suspension Part 1

[@tombolo22]

As usual, the best treatment of this subject on youtube. One thing I hoped Doddy would do is, for pedagogical purposes, explicitly call it "rebound damping" and "compression damping" rather than the shorthand "rebound" and "compression" since, to a complete beginner, a statement like "to reduce the pogo stick effect, add more rebound" sounds like the opposite of what you want to do-since an actual pogo stick already has LOTS of rebound. For teaching purposes "to reduce the pogo stick effect add more rebound damping" makes more sense and may be less confusing to a novice, though I understand the shorthand phrasing is completely understood by experienced suspension users.

[@mtbboy1993]

Yes he means rebound damping, not rebound. Plus or a snail logo is more damping. It's the only part of the video I would change.

[@archetypex65]

Agreed 👍

[@micktheshaggy3977]

@R T Fully agreed, I was going to write very similar comment.

[@recsund]

cheers, thought i was loosing it there

[@edh7492]

That’s a very good point well made

[@martinrule7188]

Cheers Doddy Brilliant video

[@joed899]

USD forks were introduced to motocross in the early 90's, with the road bikes not far behind. Conventional forks are still used on many models other than sports bikes. So USD forks on motorbikes are still called USD and conventional are still conventional. Exactly the same as on mountainbikes.

[@JimF-777]

Was just going to say this. Conventional was how it all started and should be "conventioonal"

[@PredatorDK]

Exactly! I have made this comment at least a handful of times now! It drives me absolutely mad that an obviously talented mechanic and tech journalist keeps on spreading misinformation.

[@smuy3782]

Also the longer the travel of the fork the more it needs to hang below the axle in a conventional fork. Just have a look at the last of the conventional MX forks. They were having ground clearance issues. MTB doesn't have anywhere near as much travel so it can all be packaged above the axle.

[@borntobewild2724]

"Just like on suspension forks, rebound is always red and compression always is blue" *laughs in Manitou

[@imeem9]

Doddy da man

[@Outdoorstuff1]

I would like to know how my shock has 130mm of travel but the actual shaft looks less then 100mm

[@James-dn1hu]

If your talking about rear suspension it’s based on the travel that the axle moves in and with the added leverage and depending on design the axle will move 130mm rather than the actual shock shaft being this size.

[@chrisgenovese8188]

this was crazy helpful! Doddy is a natural communicator and teacher.

[@aknzortuk4027]

I love this guy what a great lecturer. I literally listened things that I already know, he explains things like a story.

[@franciscot4552]

Great instructional video! NJ USA newbie here. This really helped me understand the functionality of the front and rear suspension. This also helps me decide if I should upgrade my suspension or make some minor changes/adjustments to them. Thanks for posting! & Keep Riding.

[@Pionirish]

Any chance of an "all you need to know about retro suspension" such as Mag 21s, Marzocchi Bombers etc from the 90s?

[@edh7492]

Yeah man I had some circa 2000 Z3 Flylight 100’s on my jump bike as I couldn’t stretch to a Z1 drop off. I remember the launch of the Boxxer and the SID, what an exciting time it was...

[@marcusoutdoors4999]

Another interesting exploration of everything

[@Monyx92]

Great and informative video 🙏🏼

[@mtbnow2292]

Great vid Doddy

[@brendan1]

Brilliant explanations! Thanks! So confusing with so many options on the forks and shocks.

[@fjcoughlin]

I agree with the below comments-you are a great teacher and the amount of detail is perfect. I am new to this sport and want to learn as much as possible. Thank you

[@tadej255]

The focus and pic quality is great and Doddy, as always, is simply the best.

[@GFClocked]

This video is so amazing. Thank you so much Doddy. ❤️

[@Scamparelli]

Excellent information! Thank you!

[@suesheane3671]

Great video Doddy. For a novice rider like myself. Found it really infomative and easy to understand And retain. Cheers!!!

[@gmbntech]

Great to hear!

[@energyideas]

Part 1 & 2 have lots of information. Thanks.

[@MrAdambinnie]

Nice one Doddy!

[@LivingBGLegend]

Bought a Scott aspect 740 XL with suntour XCM front fork and I am happy with it so far. Just bought for $150 :) :) I will save up for a gt fury

[@Eduardo_Espinoza]

The classic Vespa still uses that trailing style front suspension :).

[@dorjirabten7177]

I have no idea what this man said after I watched it three times

[@Woopy11]

Great tech talk!

[@arrongarcia175]

Just got my first full sus and this video is great!!

[@lwittrock1]

Excellent video!

[@billderas3420]

Beautiful review of suspension forks and shocks. Cannot wait for Part 2. Many thanks.

[@gmbntech]

Coming soon!

[@thanosob3329]

Suspensions are my favourite subject

[@derHadide]

Great Tutorial!!! Thanks a lot!

[@ClubmanGT1971]

Absolutely superb presentation once again, Doddy.

[@Velo1010]

At one time I owned a Lefty fork. This was on my Cannondale Jekyll. It got a lot of looks. Besides that it was also great for riding in wet conditions because you wouldn’t get it caked up like on a standard fork.

[@shantymariol5014]

Holycrap! Well done!

[@bobbyrenschler2779]

Great stuff as usual, thanks!

[@stormMTB]

why does everyone say fast and slow rebound and compression but the adjustment is + or - ??? Do I put more (plus) to slow or speed up the respond or compression ????

[@danyduval7334]

Perfectly explained! Thanks Doddy!

[@edh7492]

First suspension fork was a triple clamp sr suntour which came on my Saracen Raw DH circa 1998, they were absolutely poo. I upgraded them to a set of RST 461DH with a massive 100mm travel, the off white with red lettering looked mint on the black and red bike. I then upgraded the rear shock from a no brand piece of crap to a rock shock deluxe I got off a friends brothers old voodoo frame. Thing was a tank but a plusher tank after those tweaks. That was the glory days of the sport, the World Cup XC and Dual came to Newnham Park in Plymouth, as a 12 year old lad going to a place within riding distance of my house and watching Steve Peat , Brain Lopes, Wade Boots etc race made a serious impression. The money in the sport back then was crazy!

[@nerdexproject]

Highly interesting! I love GMBN Tech! :D

[@BengLang84]

Great work Doddy and the GMBN team! This video is very informative! 😀 Hopefully in the next video Doddy would touch on the DVO suspensions since that will be the one that I am having for my bike. Would really appreciate that! Ride safe always guys and God bless! 😀

[@simonchaddock3694]

Nice vid doddy just got a scott genious and getting to know my suspension

[@mstringer90]

great video guys

[@greenbimoon]

Well explained and put together, thanks mate

[@juanandresperedachavez7105]

Magnífica explicación. Doddy must be the nicest guy in the world. Thanks for all the knowledge you share. Greetings from Peru.

[@VeeVeeArcher]

#askGMBNtech I have had a hard time finding good discussion on when, for whom, and why the mid range forks are good enough. Or perhaps more important what terrains are mid range forks always going to be adequate, when/what will be speeds that just reach the limits of those forks. Another point in that discussion I'd like to see is for bigger riders, bigger weights. Currently, I know low end forks are adequate for many folk because they really don't ride at all. Mid range forks tend to get called trash by most riders' comments and reviews with very little reasoning in the dismissal.

[@fenderbenderspecial]

I'm as confused as you are in this regard. It'd be nice to hear Doddy's thoughts on it. I have been riding a 10 year old, second-hand Rockshox coil fork for years. I have no complaints. I recently built a bike with a Suntour Durolux 36 and have been really enjoying it. Both of these forks are considered mid-tier, but I've had a blast riding them. Is this because I don't know how nice the mega-expensive ones are? Is it because I don't ride hard or fast enough to need the snazziest fork? I am ~200 lbs, maybe a touch more with all of my riding gear, and these forks have held up well under me.

[@itarry4]

The top MotoGp Forks are hardly "over built" for strength. They're as light as they can possibly be, the expense isn't important in any way which is what actually gets the hit, the price of making them. Yes they're to big and heavy for a MtB, yes they can be heavier as the engine takes the strain not you but over built? Nope. Great video though as usual.

[@archetypex65]

👍 # öhlins

[@patrickmoran8583]

Excellent information as usual, Doddy. Thanks!

[@TroyCollier]

Very well done! Perfectly explained.

[@Bob_Shy_132]

Good job Doddy!

[@rickymills8612]

Awesome video! Thanks Doddy 👌🏼

[@haithamelmaleh1138]

Brilliant as usual

[@shoeboy23john89]

I just my set my settings to midway and just go out and enjoy my riding instead of messing my head up with a myriad of different tuning ways. Mountain biking doesn't need to be complicated.

[@James0the0Bradley]

Really good video Doddy. Thought I had a good basic knowledge on suspension but definitely learnt a few things here 🤘👏

[@gmbntech]

Happy to help!

[@mantasjaskevicius1385]

Thanks

[@Sibert_]

Great video again. Educational as always, I've learned a lot. Very helpful, thanks Dodd!

[@thatguynathan5816]

New drinking game, take a shot every time Doddy says "ok" in this video xD

[@twowheeler1000]

Very interesting, thanks Doddy!

[@gheminway]

Awesome video Doddy. You da bomb.

[@spokebloke1]

The other advantage of running USD forks is less unsprung weight,, which is why high performance road and dirt motorbikes tend to run them. The big negative of USDs, however, is having the fork inners far more exposed to damage from rocks, etc.

[@Kenshiken]

Very interesting! Thanks, Doddy!

[@martinphilippmayer8228]

Thanks Doddy!

[@brianthompson1045]

Great video! I learned a lot! Thumbs up!

[@juliandlamb]

What a brilliant video

[@DanielTorres-et8ky]

Very informative. Thank you!

[@tim__sadler]

Tidy content, crispy audio and tasty DoF!

[@md.moinulislam9467]

Very good video.....!

[@michaelsigismonde7958]

Seeing all the complexities of shock absorbers, I think I'll keep my Montague folding hardtail 26" mountain bike.

[@rising_sun8892]

Brilliant, really needed this!!

[@cosmincostea8386]

Nice video , I really like how you explain

[@tankie2ndrtr]

Legend.

[@antoniomiguelmm205]

Lovely video today, congrats!!

[@TheButlerNZ]

USD forks are USD forks as motorbikes started with conventional forks. Another advantage of USD forks, less unsprung weight. There was a lot of discussion around USD and stiction vs conventional forks... this was mainly with high energy use like motor cross and race bikes. A down side of downside forks... the staunches (we tend to pronounce it storn-shins in NZ) are open to damage from lower leg hits which is why the large plastic fork leg protectors on motor x bikes. Linkage forks have an advantage of no stiction but an increase in failure over weak points at the crown for the girder fork and forward weight countersteering of the 'Trailing link' fork design. I chatted with the pit crew of the most beautiful race bike ever built, the 'Britten V1000' that brought out the 1st successful trailing fork system and was told one of the main reasons John Britten made the forks.. was that 'they could". They weren't any great advantage and there is a good bit of footage of (i think Andrew Stroud) testing the bike, which was wheelie happy, when the forks failed. If you have never heard of the Britten V1000, check it out... It's not very often when a bike built on a farm at the bottom of the world, takes on Factory Ducati's at Daytona and not only pull up beside the 2 front runners.... but then proceed to pull wheelies beside them while they were full throttle... then leave them behind... wait.. where were we... oh yes MTB... there is also a fork I have seen that runs a rod through the crown and through a lever, runs the shock on the frame, removing all the weight from the forks. I've got a 2010 Giant Faith 0 with Rockshox Totem Solo Air forks (40mm staunches)... the stiction is quite bad. I tip the bike upside down before a session to wet the seals but long for the plush feel of my old Foes with Boxxer tripples.

[@JayGee6996]

You're on top form here Doddy, brilliant analogies

[@blusoda0021]

Can you please do a complete coil shock service video - one with a piggyback) 🤘🏻

[@I-Love-Taylor-Swift]

Great vid. I learned some good stuff.

[@RickyDownhillRDH]

A couple of things here. Moto-forks started out just like our conventional forks of today. The "upside down/inverted" fork came much later than the conventional fork. Doddy, you're probably too young to have known that. :) And for Gods sake people. Your mountain bike has a FORK on the front (singular), it's not called FORKs (plural), there is just one fork on your bike. Sorry, just a pet-peeve of mine.

[@user-oj9jw5dx6q]

Really helpful thanks

[@StanStanton-p1s]

being new to e.biking my recent purchase of a engwe m20 has left me somewhat puzzled. if i replace my rear shock with a shorter one it will lower my seat [which is great for me] my problem is will it alter the geometry of the bike and make it dangerous or will it be ok? TIA stan the newbie. ps a great video keep em coming !!!!!

[@ATLaracheClub]

Amazing video, cheers!

[@Comingsafra]

thanks sir

[@denisrogers4358]

Greetings Doddy Could you please cover the new tech from Avalanche Suspension.

[@rupedog]

Quality vid AD. Clear, thorough.

[@tubemaster1205]

Great video Doddy. How about Wren fork from Wrensports. Inverted fork from 100mm to 150 mm. Would be nice to see a review from u about them.

[@curtisbotzet7579]

Liked the old Amp/concept linkage forks so much that I have 5 of them lol.

[@bigsteve7459]

What advice would you give to "bigger" riders say above 100k? would you change anything in riding style or change anything on the bike itself? #askGMBNtech

[@archetypex65]

Sag is the amount of initial preload on the spring, whether it is air or coil.

[@goldmine234]

Would like to know a bit more on spacers in forks. Can't wrap my head around advantages for my riding style. I usually like rough terrain with drops and rocks. Black diamond trails. Thanks Doddy for the tech info.

[@benfairhall5331]

Are you talking like volume spacers? Ok say for example your 90kg and to get the correct sag for yourself you need to use 25% for sag. To get this sag number for yourself you might need to run say 120 psi which is max psi for fox forks adding volume spacers should reduce the air pressure needed to do the same effect. So after you put in say 3 volume spacers you might be able to knock the psi back to a 100psi by doing that you will also create a much more progressive dampening curve and instead of sort of being the same stiffness the whole way through the stroke it will seem much plusher on the initial stroke and then ramp up towards the end

[@goldmine234]

@@benfairhall5331 Thanks!! That actually makes sense! Haven't done anything yet.

[@lewisatkinson7277]

Great and informative video. I wish I could understand Compression and damping more. I'm still lost 😔

[@archetypex65]

Check out vorsprung suspension. Also check out Race Tech suspension Bible.

[@lewisatkinson7277]

@@archetypex65 Super, thanks!

[@freberh]

reat video and very informative., I've learned a lot

[@timmontanus4311]

Take a shot everytime Doddy says "okay?" lmao

[@MightyFireL]

Okay.

[@grogibear]

Great Video Doddy like always but this was especially action packed. Would love to see graphics of the insides of both with you explaining the airflow. I get that air is the main driver but when you talk about oil it confuses me a little ie is that just for aiding the slide? Is it air and oil that goes into the piggy back? In the coffee analogy is it the filter holes that are changing and not the liquid? I’ve a new Fox 36 but didn’t have low and high speed compression. How does that work?

[@PatMat05]

I have bos deville 170. I can’t seem to find many official documents on how to carry out a lower leg service specifically on oil weights or volumes.

[@__Viii]

Contact BOS or their service center

[@computerbob06]

Is there any reason why a small rear type shock, can't be put in or near the steering tube? The forks could then be rigid and would cut the weight down substantially. I guess it would need to be able to turn as well so would be quite complex, but someone could give it a go!

[@itarry4]

Look up the SCW1 mountain bike. Not a solid front Fork but uses a rear shock in a odd linkage system so there has to be a reason why you can't just put on a rear shock with solid Forks...

[@__Viii]

@@itarry4 in current metric sizing longest shock is 75mm. You'll need a linkage to provide any reasonable wheel travel.

[@itarry4]

@@__Viii yhea I sort of figured it was something like that I guess if the system really worked then they'd make longer stroke rear shocks for front systems. There has to be a advantage for the traditional Forks as its what they use so... I'm absolutely certain that bike companies have looked at it.

[@gregknipe8772]

solid presentation. you are a great teacher.

[@307.William]

#askgmbn. Why don’t bike manufacturers give us BB night and bike geometry based on the bike sitting at the sag points.

[@Norway-BOY-MTB-Mountainbike]

Thanks !! Mate !!

[@boiing9274]

How do volume spacers not decrease the overall travel of the suspension.. if you reduce the amount of air in the air chamber, doesn't that also translate to the piston in the sense that the piston won't have to move as far to bottom out? lol i really need a suspension anatomy vid to make sense of this

[@ianbarber6463]

I thought fork offset was the difference between centre line of fork slider and axle.??? Obviously there is further offset at top crown but the lower offset is what changes the "Trail" of the wheel and reduces the "Trolley" effect. Anyone have opinion on this?

[@Raphaelch93]

Linkage forks bmw has mastered them i think in the gs's

[@virdi1992]

Shock brands need to come up with a better way for armatures to tune their suspensions so they track as well as possible not just based on their weights etc, but also on the type of environment they ride on. I don’t know where to start on setting up my suspension for tree roots I mostly ride over.

[@makeitathome1327]

Is it possible to remove the rear spring shocker permanatly? I don't want the rear shocker on the bike anymore, so is it possible to remove it permanatly?