Gorion, Wise Mentor | Upping the Average

[@skylarthoma5353]

That Taigam synergy is kinda wild, I love it

[@notgonnasay09]

I'm so happy Gorion was chosen for this video! I just finished my own budget list, and I'm glad to have seen this one!

[@boingy2828]

Wake up babe, new Upping the Average just released

[@Salary-Barbarian]

Holy crap, very apt timing. I built a sub $20 Gorion deck and played it with my Pod this week. The result was... sub-optimal. We ended up with a 4+ hour game because I simply had stacked my version full of removal and left out some key elements. Great suggestions Joey. I'll definitely be re-assessing my build to apply appropriate win-cons

[@Moss_flower]

I would also recommend Lier, Disciple of the Drowned for adventure decks. Due to how Lier works, you can flashback adventure spells and have them go on an adventure rather than putting them in exile due to flashback. Then if the adventured creature dies, you can do it all over again!

[@Dragon_Fyre]

The problem with this is the time sink. First, the argument. The explanation. The lack of understanding and subsequent google search. Your opponent still not getting it followed by a further explanation but condescendingly much slower. That blank look in their eyes when they say now they get it, but you know they really don’t.

[@Dollarwine]

iirc flashback only checks the stack to see if its a valid target or something?@@Dragon_Fyre

[@hunterkeiser6121]

That's why I always keep a screenshot of weird rulings in my phone. I'm here to play the game, not argue

[@michaelluepke9467]

Edit 2: I was incorrect, the following is not how it works, but I don't want to be the guy that deletes my mistakes lol Apparently you start off by placing a proposed spell on the stack THEN the rules check to see if it is possible, so Lier successfully gives the card flashback AFTER the adventure gains its existence on the stack. Kinda unintuitive based on Liers wording, but I ain't gonna argue with the google judges. So I may be wrong but I don't think this works. Lier specifically gives instant/sorcery CARDS flashback. 715.4 states "in every zone except the stack, and while on the stack not as an adventure, an adventurer card has only its normal characteristics." So this means that if your Beanstalk Giant is in the graveyard, that card ONLY retains it's super-type of "creature" and sub-type of "giant". The Fertile Footsteps "Sorcery - Adventure" box does NOT add "sorcery" to the overall card type at all, as it only exists when the adventure is cast and on the stack. This hurt my brain trying to put it into text-form so here is the TLDR: Lier looks in the graveyard for specifically instant and sorcery cards. Because the adventure spell is not on the stack, it's types do not apply to the base card. Edit: I feel like a buzzkill and I am sorry, I wish this worked bc I'm actively building Gorion rn : (

[@Dragon_Fyre]

@@michaelluepke9467 There are many videos, articles etc. available to explain why it works.

[@sittingbull484]

Wow amazing works ! I play Gorion since i opened it in a Bladur's Gate booster and love to play it. I started to rework my pile due to the wilds of eldraine and your video arrived juste in time. Thanks a lot.

[@myabi]

I know this might bit a little bit of an outdated video but I've decided the Gorion is a great self-insert which is what I was looking for in my next commander deck after watching your videos about signature decks. Thanks Joey!

[@VisibleNinja5674]

Love the inspiration for reexamining my Gorion pile! Hopefully there's enough adventures so I don't take it apart this time

[@madscientist2621]

Why did you take it apart? I'm thinking about building a Gorion deck.

[@melonlord2229]

@@madscientist2621 I assume they built it when Gorion first came out, before the new eldraine set, so the amount of adventures were practically halved.

[@weeklyweeks7545]

Joey, it was nice to meet you this weekend at MagicCon! Wish I would've seen this video before going to the Con because this is the exact deck that I brought to the event. Thank you again for all you do for the community and the knowledge you bring to newer players like myself.

[@MakeVarahHappen]

One of my pet cards that I think is really underrated is Niko Aris. It's bounce effect provides additional value and is free after they come down so it comes up in a lot of situations and the x cost means that if the late game is going very poorly you can dump a bunch of mana into them to have a better Sphinx's Revelation. It's even incredibly situational removal that deters attacks.

[@danieldragotti2608]

My favorite part of adventures is how they interact with delirium and flashback

[@FroPlamondon]

Chulane felt like a solid addition to my Gorion deck. It helps get some good value out of the overcosted creature sides of the adventures with the draw and ramp, plus gives a way to bounce stuff back to your hand. I had a copy that didnt have a home and it seems to help in a lot of areas where this deck can struggle.

[@brentwalker9576]

The Rebound trick works the way it does with adventures because the wording on rebound is “cast *this card*”. There’s no check for the same spell being cast, only that the card was the one rebounded. This allows you to pick which part to play, and override the timing restriction on both sorceries and creatures not being instants.

[@jessenash5]

Holy shit I just built this deck Been wanting him to be viable since he dropped

[@ceronmachtdinge]

Primal Surge is something that can go well in Gorion lists. Since we dont actually need any non permanent spells (Removal etc), we can just have 1 or 2 sorceries there, cast Primal Surge, and basically play your whole deck for free in one turn. Add in some concordant crossroads or something to give haste (Boots + Crashing Drawbridge will do fine as well) to your team and swing for the win.

[@PALIGames]

I made a budget list a while back. It's fun it can keep up with most precons. I had been considering slotting in Vega the Watcher and using primal amulet.

[@MixTwentyOne]

I''d love to see an Upping the Average on The Goose Mother! It's such a fun commander for stompy enjoyers

[@brendans1983]

I lean more into making Gorion a huge monster than going wide with my adventure creatures, so Rafiq of the Many and Finest Hour get the damage rolling pretty good for me. The creatures are mainly there to block 🍻

[@zacharybecker8228]

That's just a rafiq deck with extra steps

[@VTindaTV]

​@zacharybecker8228 you mean Rafiq without the hate. Gorion is best is casual pods but I he was good in be able to pivot to what is needed.

[@MakeVarahHappen]

Krosan Verge isn't a cycle it's a single card. There's a reason it's only in the two colors that tutors lands the most. All the other colors get Myriad Landscape, which is intentionally worse.

[@andrewfornes5320]

Illusive Otter is an MVP for this deck

[@del132]

I've been playing this deck a bunch lately and I have to say Vantress Visions (the Instant half of the blue Virtue) has combo'd with Jadzi to close out a few games for me. My favorite game ender was the adventure side of Pollen-Shield Hare to buff 3 unblockable creatures, copied by Gorion and Lucky Clover (x3 Jadzi triggers), copy Gorion's effect with Vantress Visions (x3 more Jadzi Triggers) then it was off to the races. That said, I don't think I've cast the enchantment side once.

[@Saxus43]

I love these decks so much. They are so fun. I'd love to see your take on a Xira the golden sting deck.

[@epicwhimsy389]

Nice to see I am not the only one struggling to find a win con with an adventure themed deck. I will say I may have challenge the states on some of the comments. Adventure cards are only instant/sorcery on stack and are permanents in all other zones so Flashback and Delirium effects won’t work with them unfortunately.

[@mewmeister8650]

Flashback does actually work. Flashback allows you to play a card from the graveyard if the resulting spell is an instant or sorcery. It only checks for typing once the spell is on the stack. Edit: To clarify, this only applies to cards which continually provide flashback, like Lier, not to one time effects like Past in Flames.

[@Dragon_Fyre]

@@mewmeister8650The hard part is having to explain how it works for 15 minutes to people.

[@epicwhimsy389]

@@mewmeister8650 Thanks for that. Didn’t know it only checks the card type when it moves to stack.

[@mewmeister8650]

@@epicwhimsy389 It just has to be a continuous effect or the flashback granting effect won't stick on the card long enough for you to try casting it. It's weird.

[@Zakading]

Just started brewing Beluna and this is definitely going to be helpful for that. At least the Simic third of it.

[@RowanHeartwood]

When Baldur's Gate released, I planned on building Gorion, buty favourite adventures were in black, so I passed it up. When Wilds of Eldraine released, I KNEW I wanted to build Beluna, but Gorion was at the back of my mind. Couldn't decide which to build. MTGgoldfish once released a deck tech for a 2in1 kicker deck, where they had a base of cards in green, and deck additions in either red or blue. I'm going to build a base of simic cards, with either white or red as additions using both Gorion AND Beluna.

[@wesleyulloa6062]

where can I find this 2 in 1 tech?

[@retro.7673]

Say it with me. IT’S ADVENTURE TIME?

[@BFG93]

C'mon, grab your friends! We'll go to very distant planes.

[@zEr-ne5ri]

With Jake, the dog, and Finn, human the fun, will never end its adventure time.

[@johanandersson8252]

I don’t get it

[@travis_approved]

@@johanandersson8252it’s a show

[@rubyseverinwhitworth9066]

​@@johanandersson8252there was a show called Adventure Time on Cartoon Network

[@stevenguitink5947]

Joey: Pronouncing Gorion incorrectly. Me: Screaming internally cause I'm old enough to remember playing the Baldur's Gate games in high school. xD

[@ceronmachtdinge]

being old as a magic player is kind of fun, because you get these glances of admiration.. "I was there Gandalf, I was there 3000 years ago"

[@jclatos_dg]

Love these videos! I'd love for you to do an upping the average for a Kwain group hug deck!

[@dragonfist]

please do Beluna Grandsquall as well

[@benny7221]

Just in time 🎉

[@failureworks]

Rashmi Eternities Crafter is slightly easier

[@Qaicudbebdkdiwj]

Can we (I) please get an episode on how to cut theme cards for win cons. It’s something I’ve been struggling with for a long time

[@ceronmachtdinge]

play a few games, see which theme cards are the least fun to draw and play, cut them for wincons. I always keep a bunch of paper scraps while playing, so when I see a card underperform, I slip a marker in the sleeve after the game. When I look for cards to cut, those come up first.

[@brianshanahan5274]

Crazy that this was uploaded as I'm literally sleeving up my own Gorion deck. Wack.

[@Dragon_Fyre]

That is crazy! I mean… What are the odds that WotC released a new adventure themed set earlier this month and someone would not only put together a deck based on that theme but there would be a related video on KZbin. It’s madness! 🙃

[@brianshanahan5274]

@@Dragon_Fyre I guess it's good to know I can't make a comment about a coincidence without someone being a dick about it.

[@Dragon_Fyre]

@@brianshanahan5274 Knowing is half the battle.

[@Grumbl3cakes]

Built Gorion back when WOE was first announced last year. Even with just eldraine and baldur's gate to pull from he was really fun. Finishing a game was definitely a point of concern, though. I had been running overrun and candlekeep inspiration, but perhaps I might run some suggestions here.

[@erosbronzo6518]

I've purchased my Gorion deck just a few days ago! I've made a special challenged with my pod where we build a deck with all the cards under 0,50€ (no sol ring and no arcane signet too) and this was my choice

[@benrichardson5662]

This has helped me cut Sage of the Beyond from my Oskar deck, for the same reason you cut them here.

[@nickd6303]

One thing I noticed about adventure heavy decks is that the creature side is an afterthought or just plan "B".

[@lso5013]

I used to have a Gorion deck before Wilds of Eldraine came out… I sadly took it apart. It just didn’t really perform the way I was hoping

[@XSoul7]

Hi!! I really like these kind of upping the average videos and thanks to them I got some fantastic ideas for my Hinata and Gishath decks. Now, I want to build something with Jund colours, but there aren't many choices (except the broken Korvold). I was thinking about Slimefoot and Squee to have an aristocrats/reanimate deck. Any suggestions here to "up the average"? Thank you for all your work!

[@jasonmccoy3280]

I love to see you do tor wauki the younger

[@BruuhMetalcore]

I love it, could you please do a version to willowdusk. I'd love it, cause it's so hard for me to upgrade this deck, but it always ends up in a golgari goodstuff hahaha

[@garru4459]

Please do an Adventure theme on EDHREC !

[@disajster]

hi! pretty late to the vid but what's the consensus on Mana Reflection with this deck?

[@beurtalvarez]

oh god, Taigam with adventures seems bonkers

[@chezpizza3869]

Yep, Adventure ninjas. I was wonder when you were going to mention them. It's super jank.

[@em688]

Beluna + Invoke Calamity/Urabrask/Song of Creation upping the average/challenge the stats lets go

[@nicholasbruce4124]

I have this deck and it just spins its wheels for days lol

[@UnreasonableOpinions]

The biggest let-down with adventures has so far simply been that none of the specialised decks can use Mosswood Dreadknight, who has overperforned in every single game I see him in.

[@paulodourado7891]

Am I the only one hoping for a Sauron deck?

[@serafimb2319]

Saruman of many colors should have been red, too.

[@jaivse5085]

first and Nice, let's go on Adventure reruns XD

[@MultiGingerwizard]

Jadzi goes crazy in a Gorion deck

[@roborob6033]

Just made this deck lol

[@gabriellecureux5528]

Ya that is a slight problem( ending the game i mean) I have noticed but gorion having vigilance is big I've started taking out most of my bounce except for my board wipes and quite a few of my clones also just got to say all the virturs are insain especially the blue one allowing you to copy one adventure 4 times or even fetch land 2 twice it is very versatile.

[@danielharrison2383]

now this is a good set of data. not doing an episode like 2-3 weeks after a card has been released.

[@Ryadic]

It's pronounced Go-Ryan.

[@brendans1983]

I prefer auto-correct's Gordon

[@sethmassacre]

This is why Riku is the superior adventure commander

[@Thesteadfast]

It's GO-Ryan. NOT GORE -EON. Being an old school Baldur's Gate fan it's hard to listen to this :P

[@damdaley8092]

Gorion should’ve been 5 colors

[@RibusPQR]

Wouldn't be on flavor.

[@edmundtetch3357]

I'm working on a 5C King Kenrith Adventure deck. Also, second....

[@Gamercosplayerfit]

Very informative! That commander Rocks!