Hancock Horses (Episode 173) - Herm Gailey: A Lifetime with Horses

[@lastlivingoldcowboy9082]

Hancock horses are the origin of the saying "Some horses won't take to a twitch." The horse falls in the movie Second-hand Lions is a Hancock named Trip. He is partnered with Ramon Frank stuntman. Fastest horse I have ever seen, including derby stock

[@robbiemcvane1046]

We started a 5 year old Hancock stud horse that ran with mares. They wanted to start him. Everything you said was right. 6 months from just being haltered we were in the lead steer pen! Smart, talented, and a little bronc-e !! Turned out to be a great heal horse!!!

[@davelindstrom382]

I have to agree. You have described my experience exactly. I've had my Hancock mare from a halter broke 3yr old. She has always had a mind of her own with some guidance. If I'm fair with her she will take care of business. I pushed too hard a handful of times when she was young and paid for it with bruises from that hard Montana ground. She is 9yrs now and a rock solid, do anything, go anywhere cow horse. She does like to stop on a trail periodically, look out over the vista and take it all in. It gets me every time as I look out too and also take the time to take it all in. Amazing horse.

[@hermgaileyalifetimewithhorses]

I guess they really are consistent! Thanks for your comment

[@indiancreekfarms3011]

Herm I like the Hancock breeding. My dad was Cherokee Indian and when I first started breaking and training horses. He said son remember become one with the horse and go in the same direction as the horse. I learnt what he was talking about and it’s served me well over the years

[@SuzannahHardy]

Out west, Skipper W horses are similar to the Hancock horses. Most don't like them because they say they "think" too much and are not easy to train. I personally love them because they think. You just need to "read" them and earn their trust. They will be loyal from then on. Maybe my next one needs to be a Hancock horse. Thank you for explaining this line.

[@ranchlifelogic1991]

I agree on Skipper W horses. And most are put together very well.

[@AndyTheCornbread]

I'm a fan of the Skipper Ws as well. You don't want to pick a fight with them and they aren't the easiest to train but they are good looking, they think through things rather than react so they come off stubborn but most aren't usually broncy and so long as they aren't outcrossed on something that carries a genetic disease the actual Skipper W lines have none of the six panel genetic diseases. The one thing with them though that you have to watch for is that they can be very one person horses in that they will do anything for "their person" but woe to him or her who tries to ride them who isn't "their person".

[@vicki1141]

Your history of Hancock blood lines was so very interesting. Thank you. I have long admired Hancock horses because they remind me of the old style quarter horses who were built for ranch work . Those dainty peanut roller pleasure lines dont catch my eye at all. Has anyone ever tried a Hancock for endurance rides ?

[@Californiathehorse]

My colt has Hancock in him, very gentle yet very brave horses also. Confident horses, which can be its own challenge but ultimatley a great trait.

[@hermgaileyalifetimewithhorses]

That pretty much squares with my acquaintance with the bloodline. I also don’t doubt that there is a certain strain within the bloodline that must be pretty tough or there wouldn’t be all the legends about bad wrecks involving Hancock horses!

[@Alex-horsman]

Very interesting story, like all others!!! Thank you for sharing your experience!!!

[@elgallorojo]

I have a 2 year old Hancock filly. Gettin ready to get on her. I'll let you know how it goes.

Thank you, very interesting history of the Hancock/Valentine horse. I had noticed them as I like the way they are put together, but I heard exactly what you said about them. I don’t care to have one suddenly go to bucking and these days, I’m too old and don’t bounce anymore. I’ll stick with my old mule. They can live to be 40, he’s 21, and I am 69, so we are going to see which one of us dies first.

[@mosspiglet_]

Preparing to start my Hancock mare next month for the first time under saddle. This was very educated and sane advice. So helpful and incredibly accurate. She is a descendant of Blue Valentine. I feel like she could go either way as far as being a bronc but I can vouch for the fact that everything that I've taught her up until now including trailer training, blanketing, picking up her feet etc, I have done without rushing and I've given her time to digest each new thing and haven't run into any fights with her. But I know she has it in her if I were to push her way too hard too quick. You are definitely right about that. It takes a lot more thinking to work with these horses but if you do it right their potential is phenomenal.

[@normajanderson7304]

Good solid transportation

[@hermgaileyalifetimewithhorses]

At their best what you said is precisely accurate about Hancock horses. The only problem I have is that when they are not at their best they can be very bad indeed. Overtime I’ve developed more of a love/hate relationship with this line of horses. Believe me, both those emotions are there. I truly love and admire how tough resilient and brave they can be. On the other hand I don’t like the element of unpredictability that is embedded somewhere in so many of them. Sounds like you have had some good ones. No wonder you like them. Just be sure to stay away from the other kind! Thanks for your comment and thanks for watching.

[@katieelkins2753]

Been riding a Hancock came in for training in sept . I’m now in love. Thank you for sharing your experience:)

[@aprilcottrell2799]

Just watched this, and I have to agree with you. Had two. One was actually raced and then I bought her, she was a great horse, could go all day. The other was a reined working cow horse, and she had an opinion. If you didnt do things right, lookout, she would get fired up and buck. But do day work on her all day when I lived in Florida, and she was a perfect angel and worked.

[@barbarawitt9989]

I love all your stories! Very interesting and informative.

[@ranchlifelogic1991]

I’ve been raising Hancocks for nearly 25 years and agree with you on the approach to training. They are tough and willing but you shouldn’t pick a fight with one. I can rope big cattle in rough country and they will stick with you until the job is done. I’ve stayed with the Blue Valentine lines. Also I have found that people will blame the bucking on the Hancock in the pedigree but the horse is less than 10% Hancock. That’s not a good or fair practice.

[@mosspiglet_]

Totally agree. It's really encouraging to hear from someone who has this much experience like you with Hancocks. People keep telling me horror stories right before I'm going to start my horse under saddle next month. A trainer I talked to said he refuses to work with Hancocks! I actually just received a very detailed pedigree from AQHA and it looks like my mare is from Roan Hancock. I also see Blue Valentine. I absolutely love her and we have a very strong bond. Everything I've asked her to do she's been willing to do it as long as I'm patient and fair.

[@ranchlifelogic1991]

@@mosspiglet_ keep us posted. I think you’re going to have a great experience!

[@mosspiglet_]

@@ranchlifelogic1991 thank you so much!!

[@mosspiglet_]

@@ranchlifelogic1991 I just have to say we are only on day four of starting her under saddle and she is doing 100% fabulously. She had her first ride today. You were right.

[@ranchlifelogic1991]

@@mosspiglet_ thanks for the update!

[@monaliberty473]

As I listen to you talk about the Hancock line & their personality, they sound a lot like a mule. After 70 years being around horses, I bought my first molly mule. She is a quarter horse bred mule. Talk about a learning experience. Even though she is well broke, building trust with her is a been a challenge.

[@hermgaileyalifetimewithhorses]

Never thought of that but I can’t disagree. A very different set of challenges with both these creatures! Thanks for your comment and thanks for making me think.

[@samfelix-]

Could you do a series on bloodlines? This was fun to watch! Do you know anything about the Blackburn line?

[@hermgaileyalifetimewithhorses]

Good idea. I have a lifelong interest in quarter horse bloodlines. I may well do a number of episodes on the subject. I would probably can find myself the bloodlines and I’ve had direct experience with. As to the Blackburn line I have had limited exposure to them. It is old foundation blood that still carries through to the present. Had a nice mare long ago by Pokey Blackburn.He was one of the leading sires of that bloodline. She was athletic attractive and a beautiful mover. Thanks for your comment and hopefully we will do some more videos of this sort.

[@loredelore7286]

Man O War appears four times in Jo Hancock breeding, that explains a lot.

[@sassy6292]

Omg you just described my mare!!! I had a couple of blow ups yesterday because she was not amused that we were going back to work after a year of rest and rehabilitation and light exercise in saddle and on ground. It was reminiscent of her early days. After two blow ups she went around the arena all loaded up as though she was ready to go again but was giving me a chance to rethink my intentions. We ended the session peacefully, agreeing to disagree but now I know at least what I need to do going forward. I did manage some controlled lopes both ways before we quit. I am still wondering if she may have been in a bit of pain but there was no outward sign of that. I’ve been exercising her from the ground these months and have saddled up for short walks and trots. No loping. I asked her to lope and she wasn’t having it. She is a Paint that has some Barr and the recent dna contributors are Nightline, Sky Jet Bar, Night Train and Sky Jet Bar, Bar Moon Bar and the list goes on. She came from a breeder in Louisville Kentucky. She’s an interesting mare to have to deal with. She is for the most part indifferent and very hard to read. It has taken a few years for me to even scratch the surface of who she is lol.

[@kenmorris2290]

I had heard that the sire of Joe Hancock's dam was a "14.2hh Percheron." Have you heard that as well? If so, this makes me suspect that the sire was not actually a Percheron, but a related breed, the Canadian Horse, which looks similar but on a smaller scale. Looking through old newspaper ads of horses at stud, Canadian stallions turn up all over the United States between the 1840s and 1930 or so, a good strong all around using horse that was cheap to feed. They were also used as a cross for stagecoach horses. I suspect there may have been confusion because Percherons were called "Percheron Normans" or "Normans" but in the US the term "Norman" was also used for any horse with French origins. I also suspect that Canadians, which were cheaper, were sold in the US as Percherons because they got higher prices that way! They looked a lot like the smaller "diligence" style Percherons in France, that were used to pull their version of stagecoaches. But I'd never heard of those lighter built "dilgence" Percherons ever being here in the U.S. Anyway, what really struck me is that EVERYTHING you said about training Hancocks also applies to Canadian Horses. So it may be that these particular mental traits come from the French side of the Hancock family, whether it be a small Percheron or Canadian. They are quite simply, too smart and independent minded to say "Yes sir!" to any order, without having a think about it first. Now a thinking horse can indeed be very reactive, and say NO!! or even H--- NO!" the first time they are introduced to something before they have had time to investigate or process it. But this independence of mind can be a real asset when the going gets tough. I have seen them get out of pickles that would have killed or seriously injured other horses. Sounds like Hancocks, like the Canadians, are horses you need to build a relationship with. I suppose that's why people either love 'em or hate 'em! Well I am going to pass on what you said to my fellow Canadian Horse enthusiasts because it applies so perfectly.

[@vicki1141]

@kenmorris2290 I have noticed that the true old stock appaloosas, need that same relationship building as well. My 25 year old appy still likes to assert his opinion😂 but he is a dang smart horse.

There was a man in Connecticut who was trying to recreate the Norman horse and he was using Percherons with Andalusian stallions. I had an old type Morgan, pure Lippitt, and ran into a Canadian man who more or less said that the Morgan came from Canada originally and was really what they call a Canadian chunk, (if I remember correctly). He had one at my friends barn and I commented on how his horse was put together like my Morgan, hence the conversation. It could very likely be true because the founding stallion, Figure, was traded to a school teacher in Vermont, and Vermont is pretty close to the Canadian border. My Morgan was great, but did go to bucking once when we were heading out on the trail, but only once. I team penned him once to see what he would do with cattle, trail rode him, my daughter put him over small jumps, had him plowing, drove him down the road, and would go straight through the woods if I asked. I got along with him fine, but he was dominant with anyone who he sensed was afraid of him.

[@traceybumpus1007]

Always interesting

[@melissawagner2735]

On my second hancock. First one I raised and was a little easier than one I purchased. Agree slower learner but once get it got it. They will have an issue or two you have to work through. You have to stick with it and work them through it. Agree that you have to show them respect and expect respect too. Mine is a thinker too. My gelding was being a little pushy on ground so trainer says back him everywhere so I did for about a week. Then one day he wouldn't stand at mounting block etc. Would just back away. So we had a little come to Jesus meeting and I stuck with him. Then next day he slides over to the mounting block perfectly like he used to but gives me that last little nudge pushing me off ever so gently. I had to laugh. We moved on and he is back to normal.

[@tarynronningkuman6629]

I love my gelding but yeah they deserve all the respect. Once you earn their bond they will walk through fire for you

[@michaelfraser2614]

Mine is the same way slow learner will not win a time event but he always ready to go from daylight to dark never buck up he act up few times when you try to push him to hard you can give him a minute or some times 5 his attitude ( Stopping his feet and shaking his head) goes away and you ready to start your day best kids horse I ever had

[@shelbellm4193]

My guy is hancock bred, this sounds just like him!

[@hermgaileyalifetimewithhorses]

I believe that they are consistent and even a bit predictable.That makes it easier to live with some of the quirks which can come along with that breeding. Thanks for watching and thanks for your comment.

[@barbarawitt9989]

So, are the Blue Valentines any more mild-mannered than the John Red cross??

[@synialopez5467]

I been on a lot off Hancock horses never been on that I can say is going to a awesome horse the r just ok horses

[@elizabethturner7739]

In tough country probably great. But like how smart my reini g cowhorse are. They want to advance.

[@PersonalTriumph2022]

Herm I believe this is the horse that caused your fall a few months ago ? Did you end up selling him on ? Curious what became of him

[@hermgaileyalifetimewithhorses]

Yes, this is the same horse that I came off in February. As much my fault as his. At this point I am giving him the benefit of doubt and saying he was a good horse that had a bad day. We still have him and I’m riding him. He has been absent from video for a while because about the time I started back riding him he hurt himself in the pasture and had a deep bruise on a hind foot that requiring about four months off. He is now back in work and is doing fine. However, one has to wonder whether it’s merely a coincidence that the first horse to put me in the hospital ever was a Hancock!

[@AndyTheCornbread]

I've owned several over the years. My biggest dislike about them is the prevalence of pssm in Hancock lines. Joe Hancock was the equivalent of a modern day warmblood or sport horse and pssm probably came into the QH breed through his mother. The second thing I don't like about them is their attitude and intelligence level. They aren't typically very smart horses and they take longer to pick stuff up than other lines and other breeds even if you compare them to other warmbloods they aren't as trainable or as personable but they have the staying power of warmbloods. Third thing I don't like about them is their propensity to buck if you get anything wrong or if they are just having an off day. It wasn't so bad when I was younger but now that I am older I don't like trying ride out a buck. A Hancock can go all day in rough country they can also buck all day if you push the wrong buttons on them. Me personally I won't own another one, but if you know their quirks and you don't mind riding out a buck now and then, they can make a good using horse. Personally if I want a bigger horse with more bone and that can go all day, I'm just going to ride some type of warmblood or warmblood type like TB/draft cross etc.

[@rhondab9792]

I've never been able to survive much of a buck. What was involved in you taking this "deep seat?"

[@timandersonhorsetraining]

Hancock's do have a place in the world, just not with me. Lol.

[@lesabarnum9318]

I was hurt the worst from a hancock that did me dirty running down a yearling heifer that thought she was leaving the county . In a area where there was no getting a vehicle into ..ended with 5 broken ribs broken collar bone. Cracked hip dislocated shoulder , 3 cracked neck vertebrae, real nasty concussion..this was before cellphones..i swore i would never ride another Hancock..hancock means your life and health insurance needs to be very good..I've been stabbed in the back by them to many times to want to deal with them again..