HAS FANTASY GOTTEN BETTER OR WORSE? 🐉 a retrospective on the state of fantasy

[@dragoninwinterfell5213]

I feel like the shift has to do with a prioritization on vibes, tropes, and aesthetics over the quality of writing.

[@Avarn388]

@dragoninwinterfell213 Spot on. Tropes aren’t bad as they are tools. But like any tool; it’s why and how you use it. Why are you using the trope? How can you best integrate it into your premise and gain depth from it? These are the things I’ve found can be lacking from a lot of newer authors. Note, I’m not saying this is easy. It’s hard. But hard is not impossible. You can do this. It just takes time, care and effort. Redraft your stories and make sure your choices make sense. If you do that, you will be in a good position. And most importantly never give up.

[@orladdin]

I think the fact that we're hearing similar complaints across all genres indicates that it's not just about changing trends, but a broader problem of how publishers are choosing to invest their dollars (marketing perhaps) and we're they're skimping (editing, development)

[@gemgerm]

IMO if fantasy has gotten worse it’s not because of the rise of a specific sub genre but because editing and development are not valued as they should be by the industry.

[@Avarn388]

@gemgerm The number of recent books I’ve DNF’d because of a lack of good editing is enormous. When you go back and read older books that were published, it really highlights the importance of knowing the rules of writing. There’s a reason why proper spelling and grammar rules exist. They allow you to make your ideas clear. Also, you’re spot on about developmental editors. They are tough to find and can be expensive but if they are good; they are worth every penny. You need someone to be a professional nitpicker. To assess what about your work is bad and good and improve it. It’s one thing if an editor simply doesn’t see eye to eye with your work. But that’s not all editors. Having an editor actually can and will make your job easier. And I suspect a lot of modern authors aren’t into that which is sad.

[@gemgerm]

@avarn388 you said this perfectly!

[@alldolledupinstraps]

I think it's both tbh.

[@zenderfall]

People don’t want to pay thousands for good editors and simply get multiple beta readers as substitute. Then they slap on a AI generated cover and voila…A published book!

[@orladdin]

couldn't agree more. and the fact that we're seeing the same issues across every genre only highlights this

[@ellyra412]

I'm afraid that publishers forgot that they must edit a book before publishing it. That is the main issue I believe.

[@ellyra412]

Or they only edit the first chapter and stop there

[@runningcommentary2125]

I hate the influence of social media. I don't particularly like what is popular right now, Romantasy and Cosy Fantasy aren't really my thing, but I wouldn't say the genre is in a worse place because of them, they have their fans. I think it's in a worse place due to the influence of social media over marketing and how the process of editing and publishing has been affected as a result.

[@TheLastKentuckyIrregular9524]

Politics. That's been a very damaging and subversive element. A lot of what's being written now is so blatantly checking off DEI boxes that it makes it impossible to put together a coherent story.

[@janetrenfrew6373]

I completely agree with you. Fatigue is the right word. Romantasy and cosy fantasy just doesn't grip you the way that epic fantasy does. There is room for ot to come back into the foreground and I think Wind & Truth will fuel that

[@violaivy]

I agree that cozy fantasy's popularity has a lot to do with the irl things of recent years. It's been observed that pop music was very popular following the 2008 recession and it's also very popular now (some of the biggest artists of 2024 were pop artists like Chappell Roan, Sabrina Carpenter, Charlie XCX, Olivia Rodrigo etc) and I think this is also felt in other kinds of media like like books. Many people reach for comforting books like cozy, nostalgic fantasies, romantic stories they can escape into and relax with. And maybe less likely to pick up darker, harder to get into books. Or they do, just not as many as in the past.

[@beach_lion]

I think it's a response to doomscrolling since 2012. As in, social media maximizes user engagement by serving the most scandalous/stressful content, regardless of what's going on in the world.

[@gracie9658]

I've been struggling to find new books I'm interested in. I find sometimes things are too specific or tropey nowadays, there is romance everywhere. I don't know if it's because I'm getting older but I keep starting series and not finding the characters or story compelling enough to continue. My favourite books this year have all been from years ago, and to be honest now that I'm 9 books into the Realm of the Elderlings, a lot of things pale in comparison to Robin Hobb for me.

[@deadlightlabyrinth]

Almost done with this myself, most of it read this year. Not even saying anything about books that came out this year, but not much compares to her writing. Became a massive fan of hers this year. ❤

[@Tokayd13]

I just read Liveship Traders last year. Now THAT is some quality storytelling. Then I read the Farseer trilogy, but I'm afraid to go further because I can't stand worrying about Nighteyes. I mean, I literally had to go into spoiler mode in order to finish Assassin's Quest.

[@truthjustice61]

Fantasy has definitely shifted in many ways, but the lack of large epics in the publishing pipeline can be laid at the feet of the Big 5 who are trying to manage costs by limiting word counts. The prevailing "standard" is now 150k words or less (and that's a stretch; they'd really like 120k words or less) for debuts, including high epic fantasy. 150k words (or less )is a much smaller canvas on which to build a truly secondary world with multiple characters and a braided story arc, which is what I believe many fantasy readers crave. Some might say it is an impossibly small canvas to achieve that. In addition, we have some very popular epic series (ASOIAF and TNOTW to name two) that will likely never be finished, and some series where the author didn't stick the landing, leaving publishers wary of committing to debut authors pitching a series. And finally, there have been some shakeups on the editorial side where the ability for a single editor to champion a book and see it published is greatly diminished or more commonly, nonexistent. We are now seeing committee-backed risk-avoidance mediocrity resulting from a heavy reliance on trends, metrics and echo-chamber popularity contests to determine upcoming publishing slates, rather than a desire to find new and exciting premises that might not fit their predetermined criteria. That alone is squeezing much of the creativity out of the genre. As long as a book gets decent sales, that's all that matters.

[@danielleoliver1734]

A lot of fantasy books I’ve read have a small book one with book 2 onward being double the size

[@missep1830]

I read a post elsewhere a few days ago that said more recent books have way less introspection from the characters and tend to write like they are describing a movie rather than delving into a written story, and go so hard into "show don't tell" that the author can't connect with the characters. For example, so often a book will say "I hated that" or even physical actions like "I frowned" but don't allow the characters to 'monologue'/their inner voices to ramble beyond the literal telling of the story. When I read that I felt so validated because there have been so many books in the last couple of years that I have read, I have felt that the plot is good but the books feel 'shallower' and like I don't really connect or care about the characters because I don't feel like I know them.

[@ElijsDima]

I certainly feel that what's lately popular with Goodreads is less and less relevant for my interests. It almost seems like Goodreads is increasingly self-selecting towards a specific niche. There seems to be a trend towards "cozy" stories, and towards "modern vibes fantasy" even when set in ostensibly pre-technological worlds. And... idk. those things are not what I'm looking for in fantasy stories; and I definitely do not want fantasy stories to read / feel like written by twitter.

[@tenjou0]

I'm happy that big bookstores like B&N are making a comeback, but it feels like a double edged sword almost because I've noted that the way they stay open it seems is to sell more things but less of each thing. As an example, my local books a million sells a lot of different genres of books - more than it ever has - but each section is now so small that you can never actually walk in and grab what you're looking for. The fantasy section is so small that even some of the more popular series don't get shelf space, the manga section is 3 aisles long but only has the first 2 volumes of any given series, the classics section now only carries classics that were originally published in English (so no Three Musketeers or Anna Karenina), and half the store is tarot cards, toys, and journals.

[@flis625]

So glad I saw this, thank you for posting it. I have been reading fantasy since Enid Blyton’s Faraway tree when I was 6. That is nearly 60 years. Fantasy has changed a lot in that time. Early on it was harder to find fantasy books because they were less popular but it also meant that those that were published were really good. The Majipoor Chronicles for example. Then fantasy became more popular and more was published. I think that one of the things that has happened is that many authors do writing courses that teach how to write to a formula and publishers like safe options. You may, like me be finding that as you have read many books and series many stories are kind of the same. I don’t use good books so cannot say anything about their measures. I rarely like the popular books these days as I want something different. I haven’t read many of the books you discussed though some I own or hope to read. Now I am even more excited about them. Thanks.😊

[@hollym7878]

This is why I'm increasingly turning to fantasy from the late 90s/early 2000s. I'm simply not interested in a lot of the popular fantasy books that are currently being released. There are some newer series that intrigue me (and most of them have been recommended by you, so thank you for that!), but for the most part, my overall feeling is "meh". I'm glad more people are reading, but I'm hoping publishing raises their standards back up soon!

[@gabrielrybicki894]

I was terrified when book stores closed. There is something magical about books that I thought would disappear. How ever, regarding saturation of the market, this is going to happen as any market fantasy, sci-fi, Romantasy, is going to water down the books. The trade off is we will get some amazing books but we will have to get through a lot of similar themes, plots, characters just to stumble on to amazing books.

[@elizabeth.n1187]

I think it's just over saturation of pandering to influencers instead of quality.

[@samlstowell]

Under the whispering door was 1 of my favorite books I've ever read in my life. I ugly cried, and I recommend it to every single person I know that is a reader. It's so beautiful

[@estack24]

I mentioned this in one of your recent videos but while I think the publishing industry has affected the genre, I think there is also a rise in new readers who hadn’t read since they were young and discovering a love for reading through the mainstream/softer fantasy reads like SJM, Fourth Wing, etc. which is influencing what’s popular thanks to the likes of Booktok and Fable. I hope that these new readers try other fantasy books that they are simply unaware of or think they wouldn’t enjoy and expand their love of fantasy, especially if publishers are releasing books that fit the same old SJM, mainstream fantasy mold.

[@Meg_Sprite]

Yes! Everything is just a copy of a copy of tropes. I would be more than okay if romantasy went away for a while. Or at least got edited and had a plot.

[@giliyavneh207]

I definitely felt a shift in what’s popular in fantasy, I enjoy low-ish stakes only in contemporary romance. Don’t love most romantsy, don’t love most of the cozy fantasy I read (to me howl’s moving castle is the epitome of what could be good about cozy fantasy because the focus of the storytelling is about coziness, but the stakes are pretty high for both the main character and the world. Anyways…). I too am enjoying looking back into the backlog of books I bought or was interested in and just didn’t get to reading. To me, some of it is the result of people’s changing preferences, but also discoverability of books that are not top 20 most popular on goodreads became much more difficult. I used to rely on social media for more offbeat book recommendations and had to take a break from a lot of it and have less access to authors I used to follow. So I don’t think books are becoming worse, I’m just not exposed to enough of them.

[@heathersbooks816]

I think 2024 was the worst year for fantasy that I can remember. I read 7/20 of the Goodreads nominees and none of them were books I loved. I also DNF’d 5/20. In 2025 I’m going to try and read more backlist and indie fantasy.

[@Avarn388]

@heathersbooks816 A lot of my favorite books as of the recent few years is indie or books from the 80/90s that I never read. For example, I recently discovered the Coldfire trilogy. It’s become one of my favorite new series of all time. What a unique premise and world for a series that was competently written. In general, a lot of modern epic fantasy series just really don’t appeal to me. The reason is the lack of wonder and whimsy. Much as I love a good hard magic system, there’s too many books who treat it like a science and in turn I question if I’m reading a sci-fi series instead. Whereas something like a Tolkien, Dragonbone chair, Shannara etc. treat magic with a sense of wonder and mystery. This is the case with its lore as well.

[@heathersbooks816]

@ I’ll have to look into Coldfire. Dragonbone is one of the ones I want to read this year.

[@sarrahchang4424]

Same!

[@ashleigh4159]

I completely agree! I had to search for books published between 2000-2013 just to read some decent books with good writing

[@Avarn388]

@@heathersbooks816Dragonbone is good but be warned. The first book is slow. Just go through it because it’s necessary as the setup actually matters for book one and the final book of the original trilogy.

[@RyeMiArt]

So agree. In 2024 I was not even interested in books that were coming out and when I picked something, it was not enjoyable for me. I had much better luck with backlist books but still, 2024 was overall the worst reading year in terms of enjoyment. This year I'm planning on reading older fantasy series I did not have time to read yet. While 2020 was awful, it brought many people back to reading which is great. And while I did not read in 2020 almost at all (being on the 'other side' of pandemic as a healthcare worker meant no time or will to read in my case) I noticed more people enjoying reading which I loved, in 2021 I discovered Robin Hobb and I never stopped reading from then :D which led to 100 books being read in 2024 but as I said, it was middle of the road most of the time.

[@zenderfall]

It’s just like everything else, once in a blue moon something really big and successful comes out, and right after that comes the fanfics and knockoffs. Not that they’re bad, some are really good, it’s just that they’re not original.

[@IamHis66]

I work at a public library and worked at a book store, and I have to say the Goodreads award books were not being read or sold. At the library, there are 4 of us reading fantasy, and we did not read most of the chosen titles. I see what patrons were putting holds, and they were not those titles. And for science fiction selections, this was even worse. What sold at the bookstore are titles you and I have been enjoying. I hope 2024 was just a fluke because I am one for the epic fantasy standalone and series.

[@ladyjatheist2763]

I've always loved a good series, the problem is that in many cases the idea of a series got way out of control with far too many books to hold a readers interest (I'm looking at you Magic of Xanth, and Dune series). I got sick and tired of fantasy books that were largely thoughtless, mindless, gratuitous sex and violence instead of thought provoking, or really meaningful in any way. The fifth and final book in the Heroes of the Line series was just released in December. The totally "under the radar" series is a science-fantasy hybrid aimed new adult/coming of age readers. It's thought provoking, both scientifically as well as in terms of the psychology of the primary character(s), which of course means it'll probably never get read anywhere.

[@MissMokate]

just added the heroes of the line to my potential tbr list. wow does the amazon page not have a single customer review for it

[@ladyjatheist2763]

@@MissMokate I know right! The first book is called The Coming of Schades.

[@violaivy]

I find the Goodreads Awards interesting to discuss but it's not a great metric to measure really anything but who are the most read authors on the site. And this year it feels like they picked (however it's done) a lot of fantasy books with a wider, general fiction appeal. This doesn't mean that other kinds of fantasy don't exist. Things like romantasy and cozy fantasy bring many readers to fantasy and reading and that's overall a good thing. There are always trends and they don't last forever. I'm sure readers who don't like grimdark had a harder time picking new realeases they liked when those books were popular. For many years, women had to look really hard to find books with well written female characters and stories without objectification, violence and oppression of women. These things are often the norms of many medieval Europe inspired epic fantasy. I think there's a notable bitterness from a certain demographic who got used to considering themselves as the primary target audience of fantasy. While for many years others were purposefully kept out as readers or authors. More kinds of fantasy becoming popular doesn't mean others are going away. There are decades worth of epic "more traditional" fantasy out there to read, and new books as well.

[@Eluarelon]

I think it has gotten way better, not necessarily in the last five years, but from when I started reading fantasy and scifi. Way more variety of topics and themes, way more diversity, which even I as an old white man can appreciate (we're not all out-of-time idiots), and while the heavy focus the industry puts on Romantasy and the way a lot of content creators seem to focus on creating clicks with overhyped stuff is not particularly to my liking, I still find more stuff I would be interested in than I will ever be able to read without even really trying. And while I am not a big fan of popularity contests like the Goodreads Choice awards (because the high quality stuff never seems to come out on top at those), I still found a lot of things in the last five years I would at least be interested in reading if not for the fact that I also have to play a lot of catch up with books/series that are already considered worth reading that I missed/ignored when they were published. So I'll keep reading books based on recommendations on booktube creators like you, and I'll keep finding other recommendations in outlets like Locus Magazine and the many awards out there like Hugo, Nebula and others (I'm especially fond of Arthur C.Clarke awards and the British Fantasy awards) and I don't fear running out of new stuff I'll be exited to read anytime soon.

[@fidato_]

The peak of fantasy was between 2006-2018

[@AllyEmReads]

I've definitely felt the shift in the more low-stakes stories. I personally find lower-stakes and cozier stories grating, maybe because I'm a pessimist at heart but I almost always get frustrated with the near constant happiness. When I pick up fantasy (and usually historical or literary fiction, and horror and sci-fi) I want to feel swept away by the plot and the stakes. The type of escapism I search for in books is "my life sucks but at least it's not as bad as (insert story here)"/"if characters from (insert story here) can overcome their obstacles, then I can overcome my own problems" which I can understand why people don't want that type of story lately with the world being the way it is for the past few years. But the escapism that I'm seeing lately with cozy stories, the "life sucks but at least here everything is fine" type, frustrates me in the same way that others get frustrated with my preferred stories. I can appreciate the lighter stories for sure, I just enjoy them more in moderation rather than it being the only thing I read. Seeing the market be flooded with these stories and the darker, grittier books being pushed to the wayside is frustrating for sure. I'd love to see epic fantasy come back around to the mainstream

[@kczagrodney4007]

I think a better reflection would be to take all the books you read each year, give them a rating on 1-5 and then get a percentage of possible points rather than focusing on goodreads nominees. Goodreads nominees are not reflective of the books released in a given year. I dont thinknthe eay you did this experiment is valid.

[@VideoSmirf]

I recommend The Sum of All Men (Runelolrds-series), if you want epic fantasy, high stakes and a unique magic system.

[@nikolaysavchev5165]

Like movies, tv, video games and comic books ...everything geting worst and worst...

[@neetfreek9921]

Once something becomes profitable the passionate will always get drowned out by the greedy. Why aim for quality when you can take shortcuts and make twice as much. Eventually they’ll starve the ecosystem, and then the passionate can rebuild from what’s left after everyone’s moved on. And then it’ll repeat :) Market trend chasers are awful for the art industry as a whole.

[@sarrahchang4424]

@@neetfreek9921just wish it would starve so we can have some real bangers again 😂

[@S.Y.77]

For me, epic fantasy tends to be "just ok." I read a bit here and there, but quickly lose interest when the story is too high angst. Reading is my happy place, so too much betrayal, death, and despair get me down - and I hate it when a favourite character is killed. So... I appreciate the rise of the Cozy Fantasy sub-genre and hope it persists (alongside all the other sub-genres), as I generally like cozy fantasies more than classic epic fantasy. I also love the rise of genre blends, like The Tainted Cup (Fantasy-Mystery).

[@fatimawright8575]

I am not a big epic fantasy reader, I read more stand alones and cozy/romantasy. However, I was also really disappointed in the 2024 goodreads picks. Like you, I wasn’t even interested in the picks. I usually try to read a few books from the fantasy category so that I can vote properly but I didn’t bother trying this year and switched to horror. I’m not sure why the books were worse though. It might not be a trend, maybe it is just a bad year of fantasy.

[@dayphantasm]

A Study in Drowning is now a duology.

[@sarrahchang4424]

Uhh why 😂

[@efalkows]

Hi Elliot, can you do a video on middle grade fantasy books? My daughter saw me watching your channel and wanted to know if you had a middle grade fantasy recommendation video.

[@NectarHandmade]

I have picked up so few brand new releases in 2024 that it’s baffling. And I read most genres. And one recent new release I read felt like it was lacking the last layer of editing so I was disappointed in one of my favorite authors. 😅

[@sarrahchang4424]

I have seen a steady decline in how I consume newer books coming out. The focus on tropes vibes and romance has been ( thought with some exceptions) imo a detriment to fantasy. Having followed along my highest years were 2020 and 2021 tied. A steady decline from 2022 to the lowest 2024. A think some of the issue is the mismarketing of fantasy books. Though I don’t mind a good Romantasy here and there oft times they are plugged as just fantasy and then I feel left wanting. Many of the romantasy is just romance with a sprinkle of fantasy elements with covers that pretend it is a fantasy book ( I know this sounds a bit harsh but it is honestly the truth). And then some are marketed as romantasy and I’ll skip over it cause I am not looking for it when it is in fact a fantasy with a subplot of romance. I can say this shift in fantasy has pushed me to read outside the genre more but I find in order to really scratch that itch I have to read backlists and have been more apt to read Indie authors more.

[@danielleoliver1734]

I don’t think it’s gotten worse, I just think ‘popular’ fantasy has leaned heavily away from more epic fantasy that most fantasy leaning readers enjoy and switched to light fantasy that all readers can enjoy, so it’s less enjoyable to traditional ‘fantasy’ readers. I really enjoyed most of the 2024 nominees, but I’d only want about half of them to be listed in a fantasy category even though they do have fantastical elements or a made up world so technically fit here. I adored the Fox Wife, the Warm Hands of Ghosts and Book of Doors but don’t really view them as fantasy. The Sweet Sting of Salt, a Song to Drown Rivers and the Blackbird oracle aren’t really ‘fantasy’ for me either (blackbird oracle is paranormal / urban fantasy in my mind - same as SJMs Crescent City). Cozy fantasy has a lot of magic but it’s vibes also make it feel not really like fantasy somehow so Emily Wilde and Somewhere Beyond the Sea are also fantasy light in my mind

[@matthewbackhouse6309]

The advantage of only having started reading fantasy in the last 2/3 years for me is that there are still hundreds of epic fantasy books and great fantasy books for me to get through before I have to worry 😂about

[@JayGTheAwkwardBookworm]

Yesssss I feel like I have SO MANY 3 star ratings this year because everything felt so MEH

[@arosas913]

I want to fall in love with a story like The Folk of the Air 😭 smut is ok but its not everything, nor should it be in part a reason to read a book.

[@surpriseitsus9622]

I jad my worst reading uear in decades. I had zero 5 🌟 books. Im going back to love, urban fantasy and paranormal books, and even older series. I've already found/read some gems. 📚 love to Luna 🐕

[@DWHershey]

I am a writer in the process of crafting my debut novel. I've been writing for a year and a half, currently halfway through my first draft. I feel that fantasy and science fiction have taken a nosedive in quality. There are exceptions, but a big demand is going unsatisfied.

[@maddy-zzz]

You might like the book Greenteeth by Molly O'neill when it comes out soon! It's cozy fantasy but has medium stakes. A quest story with fun characters including a lake monster.

[@afergbird]

It could be that the mixing of genres makes it harder to classify. I think epic fantasy is about the same but the trending genre/themes have leaked into the others. Which might feel worse if you don’t enjoy the crossovers. Wanting a fantasy plot and getting a mainly romance driven story is a let down.

[@ericccky]

Fantasy has gotten better in my opinion because we have more diversity both in representation, sub-genres and target audiences. The rise of cozy fantasy and fantasy romance “revived” the genre which fantasy needed desperately. We have been stuck in grimdark high fantasy series for too long that even the acid fantasy readers have been getting tired.

[@annmoore321]

I think the powers that be don’t care about quality so much as trends. What sells? Sex. LGBTQ+. Dark and Gritty(for half the population). Light and fluffy(for the other half). Villains as “morally grey” heroes. Feminism. You get the idea. So publishers and writers will do the bare minimum using things like that to check boxes so their books will sell. And it WORKS. They don’t care about the writing. They care about money. More goes into it, obviously, but there is a reason you only hear about a handful of books from previous decades. Time has a way of sifting out the dross in favor of true gems. Mostly.

[@domeniquejordaan1364]

I am a fan of 'romantasy'( normal fantasy as well). Back before covid, I read about 3 mediocre books per every book I felt was great. Now the 'good ones' are on par with the mediocre ones pre covid. The only books I am excite about are books of existing series or from my trusted authors. Booktok has given me to many bad suggestions. I want to start a new series but just can't find one I want to continue. It feels like the authors are not putting in the same amount of passion/imagination and dedication they use too. A pretty cover is all that matter(the ironing💀)

[@cmeeki4]

As a long time fantasy reader, the genre definitely has shifted over the past 5 yrs. Too many same book tropes and ideas.

[@thewitchyreader6131]

Great Video!

[@ArbiterLibera]

I'm not a fan of fantasy right because of this ever-growing and almost fetishistic obsession with character relationships that seems to have given birth to romantasy as its own entity. Will things change for good old fantasy as a result? Maybe. I'd put the time frame on the last ten years, but I was glad to see more standalones as writers found ways to divest from traditional publishing and do their own thing without "we paid for a trilogy and by god we're going to GET that trilogy" contracts of old.

[@Tokayd13]

Question re Attack on Titan. Are you just watching the show? Or are you also reading the manga? I watched the first couple of episodes on a free 7 day Crunchyroll trial but didn't continue the subscription (feeling poor), and wow! That first episode was wild, those giant monsters are creeeeeeepy... Also, I haven't found any current fantasy releases that really get me in my gut. The closest would be the Bloodsworn Trilogy (John Gwynne), but the final installment was a bit too battle-heavy for my taste. Well done, but a bit much. I think I lost steam on the Stormlight Archive (Sanderson) series, not sure if I finished the 4th book. Honestly, the best fantasy I read last year was older stuff. Liveship Traders (Robin Hobb) and Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell (Susanna Clarke). I haven't found any really compelling new Science Fiction either...it's depressing. Thankfully, there's a whole lot of older stuff I haven't read, and a whole lot of stuff that was so good it warrants a reread 🙂

[@Booksandmoe]

I am not sure if fantasy is inherently worse but I do think the rise in Fantasy romance being marketed as “epic” Romantasy - making me think it will be at least a balance of romance and fantasy- has lead to me being very disappointed with the reads I’ve been picking up. I’m a romantasy girlie, through and through, reading epic fantasy as well but the generalisation of “romantasy” for what should be called fantasy romance, is really confusing.

[@kelleyceccato7025]

A couple of fantasy novels from 2024 that I personally enjoyed, though they flew further under the radar so aren't likely to end up in Goodreads' Top Ten: Song of the Huntress (Lucy Holland) Goddess of the River (Daishnavi Patel -- though I liked this one a little less than I liked Kaikeyi) I'm reading Wind and Truth (Sanderson) and Fury of the Gods (Gwynne) at the moment, so I can't properly review them, but so far I'm liking them a lot. But on the whole, you're right. The books I enjoyed most this year weren't actually published this year. There does seem to be a bit of falling-off. I see too many upcoming books with contemporary settings, which I personally loathe, and too many authors trying to jump on the Romantasy bandwagon. Joe Abercrombie has a new book coming out, so I have my fingers crossed for that one. Robert Jackson Bennett will publish a new one. We're getting a new Emily Wilde book, which should be delightful. But I'm not seeing the take-my-breath-away epic fantasy that I hope for.

[@sarrahchang4424]

Agree enjoyed Goddess of the River by Kaiykeyi was much better. I agree with you. With an exception of a few books I feel underwhelmed by the 2025 selection coming out. Not hating on Romantasy for when it’s done well it is great but it’s like most are this trope or that vibe and less actual story. And trying to find a new fantasy is hard when looking just in the category of fantasy the books that show up in like the first 100 books are all Romantasy. Fustrating. Will be a year of backlist for me or exploring outside of fantasy

[@Tessa_Ru]

Fantasy has become the "every man's" genre. Which means it often has almost nothing to do with fantasy as we know it (and is basically modern contemporary, with fae or dragons or wizards shoveled in for flavor). It's trying to appeal to the most amount of people, instead of crafting a specific world or message that an author wants to explore. This, imo, had made a lot of newer stories feel incredibly diluted because of these corporate trends. A story for everyone is a story for no one in the end, because there is no specific audience except "people who are easily seperated from their money." Pretty depressing stuff.

[@hannahyoder7949]

There’s so many sub genres of fantasy that get grouped into basic fantasy on GoodReads. Recent releases aren’t as good as they used to be. Do they even edit books anymore? 😅 Most plots are copy, paste, repeats and many characters I feel like I’ve read about in another story. Also, authors please stop using modern language and cursing in epic/historical fantasy. It’s not immersive 😂

[@sarrahchang4424]

🎉 agreeeeee

[@Alexis_R5]

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[@Marie45610]

I think the surge of cozy fantasy has a lot to do with everything that happened in 2020/2021. Grimdark isn't as popular as it used to be either. And Fantasy Romance is more popular than it's ever been. It doesn't feel like a lot of books get as much editing as they used to. I don't like that tropes and comp titles are used to market books over the actual book's plot/synopsis.

[@calmdown3842]

Fantasy has gotten worse; the plots are repetitive-her being in a competition, him being the dark broody guy who helps the fragile girl.

[@sarrahchang4424]

Literally almost every new book 😂😂😂😂

[@Murderface666]

I see too many people just loitering around the GOT/LOTR flavor without taking a creative risk elsewhere

[@Hesperus84]

Year after year, I find less new books that are to my taste. Therefore, I just look to the past for books.

[@lazerbeams2536]

For me personally I'd say fantasy books have definitely gotten worse. The fantasy section in Barnes and Noble (the closest bookstore to where I work with a decent selection) is mostly romance and super low stakes stuff. I like low stakes sometimes, but only really as something to relax after reading a more high stakes story. Romance is my least favorite genre, I don't think I've ever read a book where romance was the primary focus all the way through

[@mbranche4234]

Romance, Sci-fi and Fantasy genres are being co-mingled which impacts reading outcomes. Good Reads Choice Awards are biased in that certain authors are highlighted over the true rating of their books.

[@freckledklutz]

I think romantasy itself is a big contributor to how we are feeling collectively for those of us who want epic fantasy and high stakes and big worlds and complex characters. I feel like I got the bait and switch with some books I thought would be high romance but are a lot of smut to be honest and it's like an excuse to use a fantasy world with the romance being the centre. Don't get me wrong those are entertaining but I feel like that is more substance than the plot many a time and that can be infuriating to me as I feel duped. I don't have anything against romance and in fact enjoy it as genre but I feel like right now publishing is trying to ram romantasy down our throats and all of us who love fantasy that has a great plot good characters and romance just happens naturally or it doesn't at all and that is more than fine feel frustrated as that is what we want but the prevalence of tik Tok and other apps has meant they are trying to appeal to those "audiences" shall I say. I know this is a nuanced conversation that is my two cents on it.

[@Redfield70]

Worse. I can't even finish almost any book published in the west in the last decade. Manga and some light novels are still fire though.

[@Tamar-ph8ov]

Oh yes, I thought it was just me, I saw list of books that are coming out in 2025, and there’s one book that I want to read, and maybe 2 more. And in 2024 it was the same, I don’t really like cozy fantasy

[@TheLastKentuckyIrregular9524]

It's gotten worse but not for the reasons a lot of people initially think. For one, a lot of it has become incredibly derivative. There are so many GoT clones still out there and it seems that the Romantasy subgenre has taken over. The insertion of heavy-handed politics and publishers hyper-focusing on predominantly female-led stories has also taken a toll. I'd also fault the popularity of "isekai" Manga and anime which have inspired a plethora of highly recycled fantasy plots of a similar vein. Bottom line: it's hard to find a fantasy book now that doesn't revolve around a "normal" teenage girl stumbling into a strange world one way or another and then falling in love with some emo dude that's also really powerful while she discovers her own inner power. It's that or the latest GoT clone.

[@Avarn388]

@TheLastKentuckyIrregular9524 You are right in that there are publishers who have been quite heavy handed in political elements and just following trends. A latter that is no exclusive to today. Go back to the 90s where there were Tolkien ripoffs everywhere because people wanted more of it. Though, we did get good stuff like Dragonbone chair which had that element of epic fantasy but also did something different. Ironically, Martin would borrow a lot from that series. The whole manga and isekai aspect is also something I’ve noticed. Too be fair, Isekai did exist well before anime. Peter Pan, Narnia and Alice and wonderland all existed beforehand and technically fall under that category. I’d say the bigger problem you mention is that folks are borrowing these aspects on either a superficial aspect or just want wish fulfillment. As opposed to having a good reason/ point to have it. My own novel I’m working on is a portal fantasy but I really questioned if it was necessary with my second world I was developing. I managed to find a way to justify it but I will let the readers decide that. All in all, you raise some good points as to why a lot of modern fantasy isn’t great. Also, I’ve noticed a reduction in technical skills of craft. That is sad to see.

[@TheLastKentuckyIrregular9524]

@Avarn388 I absolutely get what you meant with the LOTR clones. We saw a ton of then after the movies. And again when Skyrim became super popular. There were also a lot of Harry Potter clones when those movies dropped. Publishers always want to capitalize on trends. It cheapens the genre since the majority are subpar and are promoted only because it fits the genre and the publishers want to make a quick cash grab. As for isekai, that was just a currently relevant example. I've picked up a bunch of new fantasy stories lately and a LOT of them have been Isekai-lite. It's not a bad plot device, it's just becoming and oversaturated one. Oversaturation of any theme, trope, or idea in fantasy tends to be detrimental to the genre in any current moment because it buries the true gems beneath the mediocrity.

[@AmericanaGardens]

Smut romantasy made it worse.

[@Avarn388]

@AmericanGardens My only exposure is KrimsonRogue’s channel where he was critiquing Fourth Wing and Iron Curtain. The fact that is incredibly popular is quite sad. What a horrid book series. The fact it starts off as a murder college makes zero sense. And the dialogue. I’ve read plenty of decent YA books, Bobby Pendragon for example, but even for the standards of that genre; the dialogue is painful. All in all, I don’t understand how this stuff is popular. And it also reinforces a good point. Just because something is popular does not make it good. Something of quality can be popular but not the other way around For frame of reference, Sabriel by Garth Nix is an amazing book that is barely talked about. That’s a YA story( existed before the genre was labeled) and it’s fantastic.

[@surpriseitsus9622]

2022, was the 2nd worst year, after 2024.....and 2023 was the best.

[@_george_jorge2067]

So much worse! There's barely any plot without romance, not that is necessarily bad, but the romance has been so spicy that its description makes me feel awkward and steals the magic! Also the trend of toxic men and submissive women or women who become weak before those men is so disgusting!

[@Avarn388]

To be honest, this year had a lot of let downs for me, reading wise. Note there were good things I read. Cold fire trilogy was good and I enjoyed the Threshold Cradle short stories by Will Wight. But that’s it. The knight by Will Wight was very mid sadly and I tired to get through Eye of the world and couldn’t. And the Progression and LitRPG stuff I read if I could kindly describe it, they are like Big Macs. Satiating to a point but lacking the quality of a home cooked meal. As for your point on epic fantasy, I want more of it but it needs to be something old fashioned but competently written. I’ve grown really tired of the grimdark trend and cozy fantasy I argue is the response that’s come from it. But I want to see heroic people doing heroic things. I’m tired of postmodernist, nihilistic stories where main characters are horrible, miserable people. That’s fine in a small dose but what I want is a bit more balance. I suspect why this has happened but I won’t go into that because it is off topic. But really, there’s a reason why there is a growing trend of younger and older folks just going back to older stuff that’s good. Because it’s reliable. Comfort food.

[@StephanieG7]

I find your bookcase so beautiful and sexy. It’s so library to me ❤

[@Tamsuw1781]

Rhythm of War killed the whole series for me. And the length is too much.

[@shaunduquette5992]

brandon let that book expand too much,some pretty useless viewpoints.

[@laurenschenck5355]

I feel like authors have forgotten real meaning behind fantasy and characters 🎇🎊🎊🎆🎆🎊🎇🎉🎉🎇🎆🎆🎆🎆🎊🎇🎉🎉🎊🎆🎆🎊🎇🎊🎊🎉🎉🎉🎇🎆🎆🎆🎊🎇🎉🎉🎇🎊📚📚📙📙📚📚📚📖📖📖📖📖📙📙📙📚📖📖📖📖📙📙📚

[@wolfs1bane]

1st!

[@shaunduquette5992]

Romance fantasy is ruining the fantasy market,all so the publishers and bookstores can save their businesses with common drivel. Stormlight 5 was awesome BTW.