Heathkit Analog Multi-Meter vs. Radio Shack!

[@NEW_INSITE]

I remember while I was twelve, Im 67 now, I ordered a Heath Kit proximity detector. It had one vacuum tube and some electronic components like capacitors and resistors and a length of copper wire with a little copper disk to put on the top. When you got about six feet from it it would start to glow on a little neon tube. The closer you got the brighter the neon tube lit up. I have a bunch of old volt ohm meters that are pretty much antique I guess, they have vacuum tubes in them. All this is in storage right now. I was in Tech Control for Communications in the Army in Berlin and an old German man named Mr. Schultz was very friendly with me and when I left he gave me a multimeter that he had since he was 16, that was before World War Two. He was seventy something at the time in nineteen eighty two when he gave me the meter. It was given to him when he started working for the Deutsch Bundes Post. That was the German telephone company at the time. It is a Siemen's Volt Amperage meter that did not require any batteries It uses a lot of coils inside kind of like magnetic switching. It's in a wooden case with an Analog Meter and a leather carry strap. I've only seen one like it on the internet when I was searching and that one was broken , mine still works. The Model # is Q23 R02-303. I really enjoy your videos Fran, Thank you for sharing this bit of history.

[@mikeazeka1753]

In the early 1960s, my dad bought and assembled the Heathkit IM-13 vacuum tube multi meter. It used 110 VAC, and a single battery for the ohm meter. I used this VTVM for many years until I could afford to buy a Radio Shack digital multimeter.

[@njphilwt]

I built an IM-18 when I was a kid. I loved that thing. I always wanted the bench model. The IM-13 was an earlier one of those. They were all the same devices over the years. They only changed cosmetically.

[@chrispomphrett4283]

I restored my old IM-13 a couple of years ago and still use it just for the hell of it. Very high input impedance makes it useful for valve (tube) radio work and the massive meter scale (once calibrated) make it surprisingly accurate....

[@fredlotte5897]

My IM-13 built about 1965 is still in daily use. Recapped about 3-4 years ago.

[@goodun2974]

In well-known radio historian Alan Douglas's book "Tube Testers and Classic Electronic Test Equipment", he wrote about his day job that "all electronic equipment is on a strict calibration schedule, except for the grade school ruler I keep on my desk which is marked in quarter inch increments and stamped 'no calibration required' ".

[@tlhIngan]

Remember, Heathkit got started because they somehow acquired a whole train car's worth of 5" X-Y CRT tubes. These got made into the famous Heathkit oscilloscopes with 5" CRTs that pretty much kicked them off. They just had so many tubes.

[@mikejohnson4617]

When I was a technical parts illustrator for a couple of years we used Koh-I-Noor technical ink pens to draw illustrations like you showed. This was before CAD and PC's took over. I'm here because I built and still have a Heathkit Digital VOM which still works. Learned to de-solder when I soldered the IC socket upside-down on circuit board. I miss Heathkits.

[@shaddoty]

Radio Shack Model 22-211A, my first multi meter and I still use it every day

[@chrisstorm7704]

I had that same RadioShack meter growing up; not sure what ever happened to it. It was something my dad bought for me. I remember learning how to use it, and going out of my way to try measuring all kinds of stuff with it. Those click-clack hinges sure bring back some memories.

[@Jedward108]

I love the case design. Beautiful! The whole look of it takes me back.

[@evilrslade]

I work in an Electronic calibration lab in Europe. Love this stuff!

[@BixbyConsequence]

I loved that little Radio Shack meter, especially that someone cared enough to add the mirror strip to help avoid parallax viewing when reading the needle. And a jewelled movement -- what else could you want?

[@goodun2974]

A pair of teaspoons placed between the underside of the knob and the chassis, 180 degrees opposite each other, makes an excellent dual lever to pry the knob straight up and off, and the rounded bottoms of the teaspoons won't mar the chassis.

[@sguttag]

I built the audio generator from the "skid row" series...and, like you, I still have it. And, like you, I didn't have the battery eliminator. Then again, I wanted it to be portable and isolated so having it on battery was a benefit. Once I got my Loftech audio generator, that was the last time I used the Heathkit. The Loftech was smaller, had a digital readout for both level and frequency. I also liked that it could do the full 20-20K without having to change ranges. But hey, the IM-5200 series was a place to start.

[@NonEuclideanTacoCannon]

What a coincidence. One of my jobs is testing donated electronics for a Habitat for Humanity store. Yesterday I got a whole box of old Heathkit gear. That's the part of the job that I enjoy, is seeing the fun vintage electronics. We do get some pretty neat stuff. Unfortunately people also use us as a way to dump trash and get a tax write-off for it. Sometimes it's just box after box of e-waste.

[@FranLab]

Anything good you wanna donate to the Lab?

[@NonEuclideanTacoCannon]

@@FranLab I'll keep an eye out! Nothing remarkable at the moment. Got some very expensive but very destroyed speakers yesterday, and a bin full of coil packs for certain Ford models. There's a complete but unfinished grandfather clock kit, and bin after bin of Dell pr HP office e-waste. Keyboards and 10 year old laptop docks and such.

[@davegarfield9007]

I remember them! Couldn’t afford to buy one back then (HS student), but it was high on my list.

[@andypalm7061]

Yup, I remember Heath! As a kid I saw this and was fascinated from then on. But you have the book! How cool. Like many others here, looks like Heathkit was our “primer”

[@lawrencelederer5060]

The extra battery holders were to store spare batteries. Wher the need 18 volts they wired them in series. I have the power supply and three of the series units (RF oscillator, audio oscillator and the LCR meter.)

[@frenchcreekvalley]

This kind of content is more like what I used to watch you for. I built Heathkits and EICO kits for my bench back in the late 1960's. Also had a lot of stuff from Allied Radio.

[@MikeSmith-sh3ko]

You forgot to think about the problem with analogue meters that back in the day the resistance of the meter would add an ohm-per-volt to also effect the reading. This adds to the fun back in the day. As a result of all of us just using digital meters we completely forget about it 👍

[@goodun2974]

Back in the 50s and 60s, schematics and service info often referenced the type of voltmeter to be used in order to achieve accurate measurements that refect the schematics' voltages. If you're working on, and especially if you're trying to calibrate, older equipment, you may need to shunt a digital meter with a resistor so that it loads down the circuit under test similarly to how it would back in the day if you were using an analog meter (unless the schematic calls for use of a VTVM, in which case of modern digital meter will be fine). I know from experience for instance that calibrating a Hickok tube tester requires 1K ohm per volt meter, and an unshunted digital meter will give you false readings.

[@chrispomphrett4283]

Valved radios in the UK often had AVO meter model 7 or 8 specified on service data as the AVOs were industry standard, every workshop had them. I keep a pair for vintage radio work, makes life easier...

[@eecarolinee]

Heathkit.. fond memories... mostly gazing at catalogs, wishing.... and then assembling a shortwave receiver. My dad built a Heathkit fathometer and fishfinder..... 1960s tech.

[@mikegLXIVMM]

In my 20s (60 now), I kept old circuit boards so that I could extract parts I need. I could not afford an electronics hobby otherwise.😄

[@lv_woodturner3899]

I have a Radio Shack Micronta 22-210 analog multi-meter purchased in the mid 80's. Still in good condition since I store it without batteries. I do not use it these days since I now have digital multi-meters with a lot more functionality, but I keep it just because it was my first multi-meter and it still works.

[@goodun2974]

The World Radio History website has over 60 full Heathkit catalogs from 1948 up to the 80's, cleanly scanned for free downloading. They also have some Allied, Lafayette, Radio Shack, Olson, McGee Radio and Burtein Applebee catalogs, and others.

[@Barbarapape]

I can well remember Heathkit and bought a few of them in my early days of mastering electronic repairs. My largest expendature was a 5 mhz single beam oscilloscope, the tube had a flaw in the glass and the waveforms had a bend in them. They were easy to assemble but they were expensive and didn't always perform that well. Then along came the test gear from Japan and ex-military gear could be bought at auctions for a fraction of the overpriced Heathkit gear. Still great to take a trip down memory lane.

[@rb343]

I remember my dad built a heathkit home stereo.

[@goodun2974]

You can still buy newly manufactured Sompson 260 analog multimeters, for around $450 give or take! The official model # is 260-8B (or C, or D); I don't know where they're being made nowadays.

[@youtuuba]

goodun, Simpson was bought out years ago by one of the Indian Nations in northern Wisconsin, as part of their plan to modernize and bring some tech industry to their tribe. As far as I have been able to determine, they still manufacture a select number of older Simpson models, and they can provide parts and service and calibration for a wider range of older Simpson products.

[@tomschmidt381]

I built a bunch of Heathkits in the 1960s - 1970s, Can't say I remember ever seeing that transistorized VOM.

[@Jon6429]

I can smell that circuit board.

[@bobdobbs4413]

You weren't in the Radio Shack Battery Club?

[@FranLab]

The few times I year I got a ride to the distant Shack wouldn't help the lack of batteries much.

[@uni-byte]

@@FranLab They did. I was a proud member since the early 1970's.

[@maxeisenstadt1459]

I love seeing that catalogue. Tools I need…

[@unsoundmethodology]

Oh, I pored over the Heathkit catalogs all through the 1980s; never could get my parents to spring for anything. As it is, I didn't actually get around to doing anything with electronics until the 2000s, and only learned to solder around - 2012 or so? So my first meter was a digital one from Sears, though I have picked up a couple of little analog ones over the years. (I also have a weird rackmount nixie tube digital multimeter i picked up somewhere; I need to get around to fixing that just to show it off.)

[@marjon1703]

OMG 18:45 I Still use my Micronta (Tandy UK,) meter on tractors today. They take way more cr*p and noise than modern meters and I don't like breaking out my avo8 in mud and grease.

[@BrianMCarroll]

I built this same kit when I was laid up and bored. Used it for many years. Finally retired it when I inherited a small portable multimeter from my father-in-law. It still worked when I did Swedish death cleaning of my workshop.

[@leonardpeters3266]

I still have a Heathkit Vacuum Tube Voltmeter. It will measure extremely large resistors. My Fluke won't. It is my second one, the first was built in 1979 and destroyed in the 2001 Nisqually earthquake. I found another. Still use it often.

[@NEW_INSITE]

I have one of those Heathkit vacuum tube Volt meters as well. They were very accurate and did measure very high in the resistance range

[@goodun2974]

A small bottle of superglue debonder costs less than $10; mine is a mixture of nitromethane and acetone. Excellent for unsticking your fingers from each other, but if you use it on glossy plastic or painted surfaces it will probably cause them to smear and get tacky. Anyway, it's cheap enough to justify keeping some around for emergencies (but keep the bottle tightly capped or it will evaporate and disappear on you, as I found out with my first bottle of it).

[@ScottHenion]

I would not want a multimeter tied to the other test equipment, so batts are better in this case. I picked up an SG-8 RF generator a few years back. Apparently it never worked right; always 2x freq on one band. Took me a while to figure out one of the coils and the 3 wires out of order.

[@eecarolinee]

Hooray Heathkit !

[@jrdcontrol8996]

For the Radio Shack meter, are those the original leads? Because I have a similar 1980's Radio Shack meter (the kit version), and the end of one of them broke off years ago . And I have NOT been able to find any modern replacement leads that will fit into the meter's plugs. Everything is banana plugs these days. At least you got fancy (for Radio Shack) alligator clips on yours.

[@FranLab]

The leads I used are the original Heathkit ones - the probes for the RS meter are probably buried in storage.

[@dhpbear2]

34:47 - "... do not *taunt* this multi-meter..." :)

[@tedmich]

Heath kits were great! Nowadays I prefer their bars though...

[@JCWise-sf9ww]

Fran, I liked this video on the older Analog Volt/ohms meters from the 70's. That was kind of short cutting on Heathkit's part, having the Ohm scales go from 1 to 100 times from one range to another. What were the design engineers thinking?

[@andygozzo72]

i remember that flip top meter from tandy shop here in the uk, but i had their normal cased 'range doubler' model when i was probably 12/13 in the mid 80s until its casing started to crack up some years later, i've since got hold of another one in good physical state but has had a blow up inside, i plan to try and get one good one out of the 2 sometime!

[@kenmore01]

I had the LCR bridge from that same series (or at least the same blue case.) It worked okay. At some point, i built a power supply to run it. Also, I'd replace the dumb 1.5V battery reference with a regulator. I was thinking the biggest issue that Heath neter will have is the carbon comp resistors. They will all be high by about 10-20% by now. If you care, you should replace them all with good netal film 1% ers. You can probably get them from Mouser for a fraction of a penny each (plus shipping, of course. :-)

[@qumqats]

I've got one of those HK meters sitting in the garage, I've been staring at it wondering if I should bring it in and add to the current bench. Really miss HK, loved walking thru the stores drooling over the various kits. I've even got the AC power supply! Love the blue plastic All the memories of building various HK kits! . . . What contact cleaner are you using?

[@yasnac7576]

I remember those kits. I built a shortwave multiband receiver, a depth Sounder and a compass but that was not a Heathkit . Wish I could still buy them

[@mikesradiorepair]

Technically "Heathkit" is still in business. A former employee purchased the rights to the company several years ago and is trying to bring the name back to life. They currently sell a digital clock and a AM radio receiver kits. I have purchased and built both of them. Considering the quality of the kits and the low production I think the price is fair. I would say the quality is way above par. Very nice with real exotic wood panels.

[@FranLab]

There are several entities claiming Heathkit for their own these days in different ways - one guy making the kits, another 'owning' the manuals, another owning the licensing, etc... But in name only. The Heathkit company as we knew it is long gone and over.

[@mikesradiorepair]

@@FranLab At least someone is still making a couple kits under the Heathkit name. Wish he would come out with a few more products. I miss all the kit companies of the past. I just finished restoring a "kit" DuMont TV last month.

[@FranLab]

I'm familiar - kzbin.info/www/bejne/foOUmoFrdspoi7M

[@goodun2974]

​@@FranLab, Since I expect Keith Richards to outlive us all by several decades, maybe he should start a company to sell "Keef-Kits"! Who wouldn't love to build and own a "Keef" kit guitar amp? Or a life-extending "Keef" analog clock? Perhaps a "flapper" clock; the ad copy would read "it keeps on flicking so your ticker keeps ticking!" 🤔😉😁

[@robertmeyer4744]

I still have some old heat kit meters. The DMM with Nixie tubes still works . The VTVM still works. I got a red led DMM one . that stopped working. may be a bad cap. My old HP ones DMM Nixie tubes still work and been re caped and calibrated . The HP frequency counter with Nixie tubes the time base crystal that is in a heated unit failed but with a external time base GPS locked . It works super. I do have a old Fluke 87 DMM still working . My old analog meter is BK precision and takes a odd battery like 15V . or 22 1/2 . do not remember been in a box 25 years. it did work except ohms that needed that odd battery .

[@uni-byte]

Just a point on the batteries here. A brand new and fresh alkaline will measure at very close to 1.65V. A similarly fresh lithium primary cell will measure at jus under 1.8V. I honestly don't think that extra 0.15V will do your meters any harm. Just my thoughts on the subject.

[@FranLab]

Not a matter of harm, just proper voltage reference.

[@uni-byte]

@@FranLab Got it.

[@manuellujan666]

Electronics Class highschool I learned on one of these

[@davegorum7684]

I also got the multi meter about the same time, my first and still have it, ( ya never forgot your first). And got the RCL bridge a little time after that. Yes a little disappointing but still like playing with it and way to check my caps. I cut a small notch to bring the 9V battery connectors out of the case to make battery change easier.

[@microknigh7]

I still use Levell TM3B AC Microvoltmeters (looks similar to the Heathkit) for audio level measurements because an analogue meter is immediately obvious for in/out of range checks and spot frequency checks. Not sure how old the Levell's are, but they are very 60s/70s looking 🙂

[@klumpy103]

Looking at the meter dial on that, no resolution marked. I'm guessing multiple uses for it...or.....you could tinker with the circuit to make it display the way you wanted...just a thought.

[@DimasFajar-ns4vb]

peace be upon you

[@baratono]

Hey, I built that same meter a long time ago. I'm not sure what happened to it. I must have left it behind in one of my moves...

[@youtuuba]

It is not really a fair comparison, not "apples to apples", to compare this Heathkit meter to that Radio Shack meter. The Heathkit is a solid state meter circuit driving a powered-bridge analog meter movement (such as VTVM's had), while the RS is just a plain VOM. The Heathkit has the same kind of high impedance input as any modern DMM has, while the RS will load down circuits under test (especially in the voltmeter functions). However, the Ohms function in the Heathkit, as a result of their severe penny-pinching to keep the cost of this series of equipment as low as possible, is really just the same simple circuit as any basic VOM. No advantages due to a constant current through the resistor under test (which would have given a linear meter scale) or due to employing a ratiometric scheme like most handheld DMMs use. And indeed, this Heathkit meter's Ohms function probably performs worse than most VOMs because the shortcomings of the basic Ohms circuit are compounded by following it with an understabilized, drifty solid state meter driver bridge circuit. And to make the Ohms function even crappier, they economized by having only four Ohms range switch positions, thus having a jump of two orders or magnitude for every switch position and THEN dropping that crippling aspect into the non-linear meter scale, making the Ohms function barely usable for anything other than the roughest estimates of resistance measurement. AND, in the lowest Ohms range, that poor ol' alkaline voltage reference cell can be subjected to total resistance loads of as little as 9 Ohms....heck, the meter will be drifting badly while the measurement is being taken! Still, some of the other equipment in this series, especially the LRC bridge, were reasonably useful devices, free of most of the compounded sins of the multimeter.

[@67w30]

I’ve got a Heathkit Oscilloscope if you want it?

[@richiebricker]

I would have thought you would ake a power supply. Ha, You needed a multimeter to fix your multimeter. I once needed a solder gun to fix my solder gun

[@youtuuba]

Basic Heathkit test equipment, especially the VOMs', VTVM's and DVM's, were all designed to be made workable and meet spec using nothing but their own circuitry, plus often some built-in reference parts, and sometimes a few factory-measured components, combined with what was often very clever design of the calibration procedure. Unless your meter had something very unusually wrong with it, their calibration and troubleshooting procedures in the manual were enough by themselves to get most problems resolved and result in a working meter whose performance met specifications.

[@richiebricker]

I remember when digital meters came out and people complained they were inaccurate and ya cant calibrate it. I dont know if its true or not

[@CARLiCON]

cool AMM, I still have a Sabtronics 2000 Bench DMM, kit-built which is basically the same as a the Heathkit Model IM-2260 with red LEDs. Still works, but power is AC adapter only so not real portable/convenient

[@youtuuba]

Carlicon, the Sabtronics 2000 and the Heathkit IM-2260 are NOT "basically the same" as each other, unless you only intend to mean that they are both 3-1/2 digit, red LED DVM's. They are not based on the same large scale voltmeter IC's (which by itself makes their circuits very different from each other), and their circuits are substantially different from each other in many different ways.

[@CARLiCON]

@@youtuuba good call, my bad, you are correct. Not only that, my Sab 2000 was actually a 2010a

[@paulstubbs7678]

It can be good digging out your old kit to find out how good/bad it was. I'm surprised at the amount of knob twiddling needed on the zero adjust pot, kind of surprised they didn't supply knobs for the two adjusters given how often you needed to touch them. That optional supply seems like a bad idea as it puts all the connected instruments on a common ground, that could cause confusion and a pile of smoke if you forgot about that point. I thought Heathkit was a lot higher in quality, boy is there a great chasm between this and a HP.

[@youtuuba]

paulstubbs, this series of cheap Heathkit test equipment was a last-ditch by Heath to try and remain competitive with all the other low-end Chinese and Japanese sourced equipment then coming on the market. They were into some serious penny-pinching in every aspect of the these designs. Knobs cost money, and by ordering those two potentiometers with knurled shafts, they effectively turned them into tiny knobs, and kept the price down. One reason that these meters are so drifty, requiring frequent adjustment of the trim pots in the Ohms function, is because Heath left all the normal stabilization components out of the circuit design, and had everything based on the voltage stability of an alkaline cell (in their better electronic analog meters of the same era, they included the stabilization stuff and used better voltage references). Another big cost cutting move with this meter was jumping TWO orders of magnitude for every position of the Ohms range switch, which as Fran noted in the video, tends to leave the majority of resistance readings too far to one side or the other of the meter, greatly reducing resolution and thus accuracy and usefulness for any serious applications.

[@eDoc2020]

@@youtuuba My clamshell Heathkit meter (originally introduced in 1967 IIRC) has the same selection of ranges and the same lack of knobs, it's not limited to this era. The lack of ranges is an issue but I'm fine without proper knobs, they only need to be adjusted when the batteries age.

[@youtuuba]

@eDoc2020 , bit you are comparing apples to oranges. The clamshell meter you reference was not designed down to a low price point so much as it was designed to be limited for a certain basic application, a "home handyman" kind of situation. The last ditch plastic bench top series was truely designed to be cheap from the outset. However, Heath being Heath, they reused circuit designs as much as possible, so certain characteristics crept into diverse models, but for different reasons.

[@eDoc2020]

@@youtuuba For a "home handyman" type meter I don't see why you need a FET-amplified meter. A passive VOM would be more appropriate for that _and_ I'm sure it would be cheaper as well. And further supporting the idea that it's not for home handyman work, 120 volts is in the nearly-unusable part of the range.

[@youtuuba]

@eDoc2020 , I am not guessing about this. I have been reporting what Heath said in their catalogs and marketing, what inside memos and such have been recovered by Heath historians, etc. You are correct that nor all of it makes total sense, but it is true nonetheless.

[@colinstamp9053]

I wonder how they went about moulding the top half of the case with those weird battery retention features.

[@FranLab]

I suspect a multiple section mold, but it is all one piece.

[@richiebricker]

Not that you have any free time but do ya ever volunteer for the local highschools that could probably use a female to encourage girls in the electronics programs. I was thinking of volunteering at my old high school

[@winstonsmith478]

Did Heathkit charge for the repair?

[@FranLab]

As I recall there was a fee.

[@igoeco2049]

The moulded nubbies were not to hold spare 9-volts, they were for holding the battery clips to keep them from shorting to something if you had the power supply option. Keep up the good work!

[@youtuuba]

They did not charge if the problem was due to a factory defect or error in the assembly manual. If the problem was failure to follow the assemble steps faithfully, or sloppy workmanship, or use of inappropriate solder, then they would charge for their service, and of the kit was really messed up by the builder, they might refuse to service it.

[@njphilwt]

The physical meter components are just so awesome. DVMs are great, but they have no character. 😢

[@lIlIIlIllIIIllIIllIlIllIllI]

0:22 hey :)

[@Davidjb37721]

Are you a Ham operator amateur operator?