HMS Devastation - Guide 221

[@Drachinifel]

Pinned post for Q&A :)

[@roterex9115]

You mentioned torpedo nets being carried deployable along the side of the ship. Could you expand on this, how common was it, why didn't continue, how effective was it in general and compared to stationary nets built in an anchorage.

[@Billy_Annizarry]

Why are there no British battleships with triple barreled main gun turret except for the Nelson class?

[@Snowbird815]

Where aerodynamics ever considered during ship planning and construction to increase topspeed or other things? If so, to what extend?

[@paultrigger1819]

Did the switch from a combined sail/steam propulsion to steam only come with a new hull form?

[@Thirdbase9]

Recently you discussed Ships of the Line manning both broadsides. At what point did ships start regularly carrying crew for all weapons to be fully manned?

[@maxrobe]

Sail out into that storm and see if you sink. Old beta testing seems somewhat more perilous in the old days.

[@richardmalcolm1457]

The Royal Navy definitely had a different approach to risk assessment in those days.

[@notshapedforsportivetricks2912]

Just sail out into the biggest bastard of a storm that you can find. But don't worry. You can take some less-experimental ships out with you to pick up the survivors ... if any.

[@richardmalcolm1457]

@@notshapedforsportivetricks2912 "Never mind maneuvers - go straight at 'em."

[@lostinpa-dadenduro7555]

It cuts out the bureaucratic BS and gets right down to the heart of the matter. 😂

[@scottmccrea1873]

Today, the subject is... HMS Captain...

[@waverleyjournalise5757]

Ah yes, that brief and wonderfully illuminating period of RN history when the RN forgot how to design ships and instead focused on making them as By Jove as possible.

[@mostevil1082]

Looked at the US monitors and instead of being repelled draws up a bigger one with a dafter loading system. Awkward times for naval architecture.

[@insignificantgnat9334]

@@mostevil1082 I thought the monitors were decent ships considering that they were emergency wartime builds meant mainly to operate in shallow sheltered water and bombard fortifications.

[@WildBillCox13]

A most enjoyable allusion.

[@richardmalcolm1457]

In fairness, it was a veritable *flood* of new technology, and it was not always obvious what the optimum technical solutions were - even without factionalism rearing its ugly head.

[@richardmalcolm1457]

@@insignificantgnat9334 Yeah. Kept within their mission, the USN monitors mostly did their jobs pretty well.

[@potatosinnato1767]

Can you do more more warships from the 1870s and 1880s, because this period is so interesting as its the transition from sail to steam and from iron to steel.

[@notbobrosss3670]

Yes pls I love this era of ship design. Because they had so many new technologies. But outside of engineers it didn’t seem anyone else new what any of the new technologies was or how to use them. So there response seems to have been throw everything at wall and see what sticks. Making for some both absurd and creative designs. Not mention Uncle Drach seems to be the only one to bring these gems back from obscurity for us to enjoy. Thank u Drach!

[@potatosinnato1767]

Yeah the age of weird steam punk ironclad when nobody knew what they were doing

[@michaeldy3157]

Agreed

[@jackdaugaard-hansen4512]

The 1870s and 1880swas not a shift from sail to steam, it was getting ride of the sails all together,

[@liamwakely7181]

Not to be a blithering nuisance (looking at you Kamchatka), since we know you're really busy (and not a torpedo boat), but an idea for a video could be on the Spanish pre-dreadnought Pelayo that you mentioned a while ago in the Armada Options video. Its a proper cool ship, and could bring about some more interesting info on the Spanish Navy. Oh, not forgetting, love you're vids Drach *probably should've started with that*

[@Drachinifel]

Pelayo will be coming, gotta find some good sources on it though. If anyone can recommend one I'd be grateful, even in Spanish as I can read that language!

[@nonna_sof5889]

Are you sure Drach isn't a torpedo boat? He seems small, cute, and deadly enough.

[@markrook6085]

Pelayo would be a great subject. From what I’ve read, it was the one Spanish warship Dewey really worried about coming to Phillipine waters after Manila Bay. He was no doubt happy when he heard Admiral de la Camara had been recalled to Spainish waters.

[@blueseanomad7435]

Nice.

[@Engine33Truck]

Someone say torpedo boats? I think I heard Kamchatka firing somewhere.

[@pepagacy]

I'm going to ask for a video on the City-Class gunboats of the United States Civil War. Those ships had a brief career, but had a large influence on the direction of that war.

[@robertmatch6550]

So Devastation, named after the feeling a prom queen gets when her corsage wilts early, manages to be a pre-pre dreadnought but proves some early modern ship concepts and lasts just long enough to be retired when the real one arrives. Good longevity!

[@Tuning3434]

Yes, interesting to see such a innovative ship to live all the way to see both _HMS Captain_ and _HMS Dreadnought_ during her life.

[@Dave_Sisson]

I see that Drach has her predecessor, the Cerberus scheduled in a couple of months. That monitor was a year or two older but lasted even longer until about 1920 as a store ship.

[@Big_E_Soul_Fragment]

HMS _Devastation_ is one badass name for a ship

[@vintagethrifter2114]

Someone also thought that Devastator was a good name for an airplane. Look how well that turned out.

[@guaporeturns9472]

@@vintagethrifter2114 Devastation and Devastator are not the same...see how they are two different words? You can tell they are different words by the different arrangement of letters.

[@Bisexual_Sovereign]

Indeed And would have been even more badass if it was on smth like a QE (also hey, your back to pre-retro Exeter pfp)

[@vintagethrifter2114]

@@guaporeturns9472 My comment is lost on you if you fail to notice yourself that they are indeed two different words. Also one was a ship and the other was a type of navy plane.

[@ronmaximilian6953]

The British certainly had some very good names. Revenge, Dreadnought, Invincible, Terrible, Conqueror, Warrior, indomitable, Indefatigable, Resolution, Iron Duke, Warspite, ..

[@stevepowsinger733]

As an American, and an Army man at that, I find stories and pictures of early British ships very interesting. Thanks.

[@charleslyster1681]

HMS Devastation is the ship depicted on the ‘England’s Glory’ match box.

[@MarchHare59]

Charles Lyster: There was a dance too! A dancing master celebrated a visit by HMS Devastation by introducing a new dance at the welcoming reception called "The Devastation Gallop". (I wonder if there are any records of what that looked like.) The British Admiralty might have had mixed feelings about HMS Devastation, but it did succeed in capturing the imagination of the average citizen at the time.

[@notshapedforsportivetricks2912]

It also features on packets of Players Navy Cut cigarettes. (assuming that you can still but 'em).

[@benholroyd5221]

@@MarchHare59 I wonder what a modern day cultural equivalent would be? I would guess the dance would have arms out front and a lot of spinning.

[@hallamhal]

A striking beauty!

[@VersusARCH]

2:41 the OG "all big gun" capital ship. And one of the few that actually followed the concept to the letter (no secondaries or AAA).

[@BarnDoorProductions]

Well, anti-aircraft guns may have been a trifle premature in the 1860s! :)

[@godofprocurement]

Anti alcoholics anonymous battery?

[@richardtrue2758]

One thing I learned from this channel is that the British come up with some cool ass names for their ships

[@delurkor]

I read an article many, many years ago; some Congress critter, upset because the Brits had cooler names than the USN, demanded one of the, then building ships, be named: Skeerdanutin.

[@MothaLuva]

@@delurkor Steerdarodin.

[@kennethgarland4712]

Fun (alleged) fact. Devastation is widely believed to be the ship portrayed on the boxes of 'England's Glory' matches, perhaps because the ship had become famous with the public in a 'show the flag' cruise around the UK (the picture is not an exact representation of the ship). There is a pub in Gloucester, where the matches were made, called the 'England's Glory', which has a similar picture on its sign outside (I hope the pub is still going!).

[@jon-paulfilkins7820]

This time I'm so early, the King of Spain has an unsinged beard!

[@johnedwards3198]

I'm so late that the USS Enterprise is now Captained by Jean-Luc Picard

[@mikepette4422]

The Devastation class were my fav ships of all time because when I first saw a picture of it as a kid I was so impressed by its shape and the fact that in 1870's they had such modern look good vessels when literally everything else was more like a ship of the line.

[@skeletonwguitar4383]

Even in cloudy days of mine, such as today, theres always a Drach ready to entertain and educate me with his big brain and soothing voice

[@77thTrombone]

2:14 an interesting picture. Perhaps the engineer is explaining the damage to a visitor. ➡️ Particularly noteworthy for us moderns: The illumination for the engineering space consists of a handheld, double-wicked oil lamp. "Well, of course," one might say, but seeing the scene does improve one's perspective on shipboard environment, even when dockside & cold iron.

[@BELCAN57]

This era in naval architecture is really fascinating. Going from the early ironclads and working up to more modern designs like HMS Dreadnaught. You can see navies feeling their way along the evolutionary corridor.

[@mathewkelly9968]

Still waiting on HMVS Cerberus , would be interesting to know how hair raising sailing a ship with no freeboard from England to Australia was .

[@bjturon]

@@TonysGemDesignswithGCS Yup, they build basically a wooden cofferdam around the low-freeboard ship.

[@wesleyintihar670]

It still sits off Black Rock in Port Phillip Bay as a breakwater. Pity it has deteriorated so much to be restored. Some items of the ship are on display at the museum at HMAS Cerberus.

[@mathewkelly9968]

@@wesleyintihar670 one my favorite swimming spots am aware

[@Duckless23]

@@TonysGemDesignswithGCS that is correct and confirmed in the delivery log kept by the engineer James Lennox Breaks. It is a harrowing read!

[@ar4040smith]

Ah yes, Drachinfel posting a new video. 1 of my three top KZbin favorites along with The History Guy and Mark Felton.

[@rogerwilco2]

Have you tried Forgotten Weapons and ScolaGladiatoria?

[@ewhartiii]

Don't forget Bismark's Military Aviation History, and Greg's Airplanes and Automobiles. Drach has the best sense of humor of them all though.

[@alexandermonro6768]

The Chieftain comes close in the humour rating...

[@notshapedforsportivetricks2912]

Snap!

[@tomstech4390]

I'll throw "plainly difficult" out there.

[@na3044]

Wow, I have been waiting for this ship! Finally, some Ironclad Love!

[@billc3278]

Love the photo @ 5:30 new in foreground, old in background.

[@TheLoxxxton]

ML 1392 Harbour defence launch would be nice to touch on as a class of ship. This ship was used as a channel marker for Gold beach on D Day and at least a couple still survive to this day. Little wooden ships but with an interesting history I think

[@SSN515]

Read in one of my history books that these ironclads did not do well against the Martian tripods and their heat ray.

[@ColdWarVet607]

Thank you, loved it. You always have great stories. History is the greatest story ever told.

[@peterroberts4470]

Thank you for the excellent video, so informative. I have a particular interest in HMS Devastation, because my grandfather who was a Royal Marine served on the ship in 1894.

[@andrewclayton4181]

Devastation is the ship that features on the match box 'England's Glory'. The artist shows it merrily steaming in reverse. One of the problems was having the funnels forward of the mast, apart from deceiving artists, was that the smoke often obscured the lookouts view.

[@Exkhaniber]

"Thunderer". I mean, it's kinda close to "Thunderchild" and it's the right sort of ship...

[@ewhartiii]

Maybe you just pointed out H.G. Wells' inspiration for the name

[@glenmcgillivray4707]

Two forward guns. Ram bow. A depressable forward turret. Seems legit. Not quite as heavily protected but entirely serviceable

[@rybuds47]

I second this.

[@J4H3AD]

I was expecting to settle in for an hour for this 5 minute guide! This is remarkably closer to 5 minutes than usual!

[@agesflow6815]

Thank you, Drachinifel.

[@SeanHogan_frijole]

I have never watched one of your videos and not come away wiser and more curious. Thank you Sir.

[@oliversmith9200]

HMS "Thunderer", Eh? I'd sport it were quite possible if not likely that the well informed H.G. Wells were aware of that boat's revolutionary place in the British Navy's development. Hence I speculate as to his "War of the Worlds" naming of the described as top notch "Thunderchild" as related to the Thunderer's occasion. Only in a minor way do I speculate, but, I'll speculate to distraction if given slack to... It's not a bad speculation if you ask me.

[@ewhartiii]

The same thing occurred to me as I read a comment appearing further up the list. Possibly he envisioned the Thunderchild as as an upgraded, and modernized Thunderer, hence child of Thunderer, a.k.a. Thunderchild.

[@williamanderson3185]

Unfortunately, Thunderer wasn't an inspiration for wells writing the novel, name is similar but that is it. The novel ship is a torpedo ram style.

[@kyleph1058]

thankx yur channel is the best i have come across thankx for the hard work

[@russwoodward8251]

Excellent research. Thanks.

[@77thTrombone]

It's a Thunderchild Saturday! I got my _Thunderchild_ t-shirt on. I got my third cup o _Java._ I got a new video from that DrachiniFellow to watch as I dig into my domestic responsibilities. A great start to an otherwise mundane weekend.

[@richardw2566]

122 likes in 9 minutes, not bad. A fine way to great a Saturday morning. A Drach video and coffee. Thank you, sir.

[@18robsmith]

Ah, a name to behold, such shall Devastation be named and such shall she deliver.

[@VonChoker]

I love hearing about this period of history with the dramatic arms race brought about by all the new technologies being developed in the growing industrial age

[@gunner678]

The picture on a box of matches. Interesting vessel.

[@danischeel4846]

Love those 1870's+ battleships

[@scottmccrea1873]

Thanks for clarifying the difference between the First Lord of the Admiralty and the First Sea Lord.

[@SuperPhester]

What a history lesson! Thank you!!! Also, a beautiful ship!

[@cliff_young]

HMS Cadmus was the last sloop to be built for the royal navy, would it be possible to do an episode on this ship as it was the transition from sail to steam. Thank you for the brilliant video's that you do, plus the humour in which they are narrated. My grandfather served on her during ww1 in Singapore.

[@laciehardman3097]

My British cousins make the best names for ships. We've got batlleships named for our states and a lot of cruisers and subs named for our cities. (Fleet) Carriers now are usually named after important people, like Presidents and famous admirals. Ok. Not bad, but not awesome. But you can't compete with Untouchable, Devastation, Dreadnought, Unsinkable, Redoubtable, Thunderer, Victory, Ark Royal, etc., etc. I mean just look at some of the names of the ships in Beatties' battlecruiser squadron. Inflexible, Indomitable, Lion, Indefatigable, etc. So awesome! The only ship we have with as cool and prestigious a name, imho, is Enterprise. Not that Johnston, Roberts, and many others haven't comported themselves with great honor, just that their names haven't reached the height of CV 6, CV 65, space shuttle, NCC 1701, etc. Good on the Brits for having the overall absolute best names. ...And may the old alliances still stand strong!

[@aaronjohn6586]

Amazing to see the evolution of ships.

[@jonathanlee5907]

One of my favourite ships. When I was young I found an old note book in a bookshop with ink drawings of this ship in.

[@michaelrider]

Nice tune. Really fits the sea and also war.

[@connormclernon26]

Good afternoon in Greenwich Mean Time

[@JRwash25]

Good afternoon 6 hours later, in eastern standard time.

[@kurumi394]

Good morning in UTC+9 (Seoul/Tokyo)

[@tommeakin1732]

Idk why, but as time goes, ironclad and pre-dreadnought era ships look cooler and cooler to me

[@TheWirksworthGunroom]

Fascinating. Was completely unaware of these vessels.

[@cliveprothero-brooks6384]

my Grandfather was appointed to HMS Devastation in Jan 1889 as a Commander was known in the RN as Prothero "The Bad" commanded the naval Brigade early part of the Boer War, wounded at Graspan, flag Captain of HMS Doris, later in retirement as Vice-Adm R.C Prothero C.B, M.V.O., RN

[@MikeB071]

A very useful, long-lived pair of ships!

[@hlebo]

Excellent video. It was a surprise to me to learn that naval guns at this late date, and of this size, continued to be muzzle-loaders. For we who are just learning about the evolution of late-19th century naval ships, could I encourage you to do a video about the large-bore muzzle loading guns of the period, and how they were operated (especially during combat)? Many thanks, Harlan

[@Strabo4]

Thanks for the content!

[@M.M.83-U]

I love 1860 to 1880 designs. Victorian battleship names are soo good, soo unapologetically imperialist.

[@vyacheslavscheredin3038]

I remember Drach talking about peculiar ship names and nicknames in a very old Drydock episode. Maybe its time for a proper video about funny/unusual ship names? :)

[@moritamikamikara3879]

HMS Cockchafer Nuff said

[@kirgan1000]

HMS Manligheten, a Swedish a coastal defence battelship, translation of the name "Manliness"

[@keithwoodburn7895]

@@moritamikamikara3879 there is still a fleet tender called Cockchafer working out of Kyle of Lochalsh.

[@washingtonradio]

HMS Toutou and HMS Fifi in WWI

[@SR-ol6xm]

HMS Gay archer

[@peterblood50]

I've never seen these two ships before. Thank you.

[@inyobill]

I have been waiting for this one since soon after you started the "Five-Minute Guide" series.

[@jakemrs9718]

Hms cavalier I really enjoy your videos!!! 👌

[@malcolmtaylor518]

Given the uncertainties of the time, these ships were a quality revolution in design, and outmatched any contemporaries. The breastwork extended to the sides of the ship and made them far more practical than monitors. The Royal Navy got it right with these ships.

[@jeffd1962]

Great video. A ship I had forgotten about.

[@trenthura4261]

I have a crazy scenario playing out in my head about an alternative situation in which the Devastation and Thunderer were kept in service until the Great War now, just feeds my alternate history imagination I guess

[@matthewrobinson4323]

Facinating.

[@Spartaner251]

gattling on the masttop ? 1st CIWS!

[@Tuning3434]

@JZ's Best Friend Taking out those darn Pigeons!

[@notshapedforsportivetricks2912]

Not to mention the angry scot on the foc'sle yelling "What are you looking at? I'll do you, Jimmy!".

[@jamesharding3459]

@JZ's Best Friend Bloody Scots will wear them anywhere! But only because ordinary trousers won't fit their massive balls!

[@wildcolonialman]

Remarkable.

[@LukesYuGiOhChannel]

Gotta love those older names.

[@stuartaaron613]

I had read about the Thunderer gun explosion, but this is the first time I got to see a photo of the ship.

[@dyerwulf5459]

I have been waiting for this one

[@zhouenlai2569]

Very interestng ship, great to see steam&iron era ships shown in detail. More suggesions: MN Dupuis de Lôme, Russian Navy Peresvet Class.

[@duncani3095]

Gotta love the old royal navy names of it's ships.

[@jec1ny]

Why is it that every ship built before the turn of the previous century looks so damned sexy compared to (almost) everything that came after?

[@kavemanthewoodbutcher]

Saturday startin right!

[@TheGibusDemo]

This is where I really see the beginning of Pre-Dreadnought design as we know it

[@kkhagerty6315]

“A combined steam and sail rig” Uh oh, I’m getting HMS By Jove flashbacks

[@johnfisher9692]

Devastation was a great looking ship in her day and in many ways was just as revolutionary as HMS Dreadnought would be.

[@marcbloom7462]

How about a guide to the USN Mississippi class, The USS Mississippi BB-23 and the USS Idaho BB-24? Lots of opportunity for snark at the US Congress and a long history.

[@Keaperman]

With reference to last nights Live Drydock. I'm requesting that Drach sings Drunken Sailor. ;) It was clearly what one of the questions was aiming at, lol. But I think Drach missed it when he answered the question. :) I would happily join in making a fool of myself, but I live a bit to far away. :)

[@tcofield1967]

Best name for a battleship ever.

[@billbolton]

Great names, Devastation, now there's a statement of intent.

[@nigelscott1495]

Interested in this ship as CPO Tom Crean, one of the greatest Antarctic explorers with Scott and Shackleton served on this ship as an AB.

[@tomriley5790]

Good names!

[@frederickgates4349]

O dear,but i love the programs

[@johnfairhurstReviews]

"We've replaced all the engines, she's been totally re-armed. The armour's been up(down)graded. New funnels have been added. Funnels have been removed. The ship's length/beam has been extended/reduced [OK, not necessarily this ship, but....]. Ah, still that wonderful old [insert ship name here]!" 😊

[@richardanderson2742]

A fascinating period for military tech on land and the sea. I wonder how the average sailor felt about going out into an Atlantic storm in a hunk of very sinkable iron with little freeboard.

[@Trek001]

5:32 - Kamchatka shakes in fear on the design board

[@Eleolius]

My love life in ship form!

[@jlvfr]

A gatling on the mast top... that must have been a *fun* place to be...

[@WildBillCox13]

Drach . . . the double ended monitor (as seen here in HMS Devastation) was a good idea. Why did everyone go for wing turrets in the next generation (i.e.: Dreadnaught, et al)? Would not extending length for the mounting of stepped, superfiring, turrets, fore and aft have been tried, too? What benefit lay in leaving ships shorter, and adding the extra batteries on the beam? *I know, USS Kearsarge wants to know my location, but her MB/SB (8" RIfle) turrets aren't stepped, or successive, though they are superfiring. I can't imagine what operations were like on those stacked turrets during combat.

[@TheWhoFan4]

Devastation would be a great name for a ballistic missile sub

[@greycatturtle7132]

Yea

[@bjturon]

The Devastation-class would have been the ideal ship-type for the US Navy to have built 1870-1890, ideal for coastal defense and regional power projection. With the exception of large caliber rifled guns and thick armor plate, the US had the tech and industrial capability to build such ships, in fact the USN had a lot of surplus armor plate and steam engines from the Civil War that could have been utilized in newly built iron hulls. Adopting a sloping 6-inch protected deck made up of 3-inch plates with subdivision above and in putting into production the rifled Dahlgren guns developed in the late 1870s could have given the USN a respectable seagoing ironclad. If the Russians could build the Devastation-knockoff 'Petr Veliky' then the USN surely could have too. In fact the USN did end up with Devastation-like ironclads with its 1880 built monitors that raised up their gun turrets with a armored barbette, with a raised superstructure amidships. The largest monitor, the 6000-ton USS Puritan (BM-1) was equal the Devastations, serving very well as a "battleship" in the Spanish American War off Cuba and Puerto Rico. Better administration in the 1870s (The USN ate more money in 1870s then it spent in the 1880s when they actually built new modern ships) could have created perhaps three or four Devastation-class ships, that with refits would have served well into the 20th Century.

[@cugamer8862]

1860 to 1900 was like the Cambrian explosion for warships. So many strange designs and so much experimentation, trying to figure out how to make the combination of shell/iron/steam work together properly.

[@aljbairi]

Such HMS devastation, this was not my intention

[@marcusfranconium3392]

Its funny to see how it takes all new technologies to reach maturity in 40 years from steam powerd ships with paddles to steam and screw driven machinery , from early iron clads to pre dread noughts , from early powerd flight to jet fighters all in just 40 years. of first conception even today , from the primitive computers of the late 30s and early 40s to personal computers in the late 70s and early 80s. A mysterious thing technological evolution is. it takes 40 years from infancie with limited use to general use and adulthood .

[@Dave_Sisson]

That is a great theory, I had never realized that before, but your 40-ish year rule seems to apply to many (perhaps most?) new technologies.

[@Kwolfx]

At the image at 5.45 it appears that on the stern mast both a spanker sail and topmast square sail could be set, if desired. Was this to way to soothe the feelings of the old guard who still believed in wind power, so it could be said that sails could still be used if necessary?

[@cw9819]

Nice

[@MMuraseofSandvich]

I love US Navy vessels, but the Royal Navy has some of the most badass names.

[@Guillermo90r]

Could you make a post about the process of ship refitting and what it involves?

[@MrDiggityaus]

Probably the best name ever.

[@b.thomas8926]

I wonder if the British just go down a pre-determined list to name their ships or is there some kind of drunken committee that just tosses darts at names they think are cool. Because, let's face it, I'm surprised more warships haven't been named "Devastation."

[@hellhound47bravo3]

Those ships lasted a long time considering the technological advances of the era. I'm impressed.