Hornby's TT:120 - Tragic, Sad, Pish

[@lucysblade]

I’m pleased with my TT layout. Scale is just right for my limited space and clumsy fingers.

[@bobslobs]

Tragic , sad, pish, sums this channel up nicely.

[@LocomotionInMotion]

I think that's your pronouns

[@trevorbellTT120]

What an ignorant ill informed video. It ignores the latest Hornby financial statement, where TT120 is doing well. It ignores the fact that Revolution Trains are now stepping into the scale. It ignores the fact that the scale is bringing in fresh people to the hobby, like myself, who won't touch 00 or n. It ignores the manufacturers who make accessories for all scales, who report TT is growing fast. But, if being negative is your thing, enjoy it.

[@LocomotionInMotion]

Yet: Hornby Revenue: £56.2m (up 2.1% from FY 2023). Net loss: £12.1m (loss widened by 104% from FY 2023). £0.071 loss per share (further deteriorated from £0.035 loss in FY 2023) ...good luck Hornby

[@trevorbellTT120]

@@LocomotionInMotion Which shows how important TT120 is to the recovery. Their best selling set across both scales is the TT Scotsman. Sales they need.

[@markpeers4226]

@@trevorbellTT120 The Hornby financial report does not sstate that TT120 has been a “monumental success” as someone below has stated. It also does not say that TT120 has been profitable. With sales of TT dropping in it’s second year from £1.5m to £1.3m despite many new products it certainly cannot be described as a success.

[@MarkJT1000]

Don't know how it will pan out in the end but I've bought into TT. I've not had a train set since being a kid so I'm a new customer to the hobby. I have limited space in my house and I'll be setting up a 8x4 board. I've seen too many OO gauge layouts on similar sized boards where they are just simple loops and rather boring, so I would never have bought into OO gauge. I can see that TT gives me much more scope for making an interesting layout.

[@stevenpeaketrainsandstuff3682]

I have a ton of the Triang TT, it was very cheap when i got into it. It does allow you to fit a whole lot more into a smaller space, and the servicing is quite easy. Storage of rolling stock takes up far less space as well. For those put off by the fiddlyness of N gauge, this is a good option. I hope Hornby sticks with this scale.

[@julianshaw3776]

Hornby tt120 maybe the same gauge as your older Triang tt, but it's a different scale as Triang was tt100. They look very odd being ran together!

[@stevenpeaketrainsandstuff3682]

@julianshaw3776 But you wouldn't run them together unless you wanted to. I haven't bought any Hornby 120 yet. But I also collect Tillig as well. It's the gauge that is advantageous, it allows so much more in limited space.

[@garryhall5552]

What a load of shite comes out of your mouth. A total imbecile, you have not bought anything by your own admission yet you talk a load of crap. Idiots like you spoil it for everyone else. Hornby have produced far more for a new scale in under 2 years than anyone else ever has and you complain, just shows your childish mentality. Do everyone a favour and do one of a short pier.

[@tombowden6090]

I love TT120, I have a 8x5 board that I was going to use for OO. With TT I can run longer trains as well as having a longer running line. The level of detail on TT is brilliant. It is a fantastic scale.

[@wahiba]

00 needs an 8x4 board. TT for the same needs 6x4. Houses are smaller. N gauge is too small. TT is spot on and has the benefit of not running on narrow gauge. I hope it succeeds.

[@Failways]

Narrow guage runs on N guage because N guage was made before narrow guage got popular

[@muppetrowlf1473]

“Houses are too small”. Nothing but Hornby propaganda. Absolute rubbish. My Granadad ran Dublo on a board in a terraced house in the 1950’s. Statement like this are why Hornby are in a mess in the first place.

[@martinw8735]

Personally I like the look of it but n gauge now is very detailed, fits even more into a layout, and has far more choice available. I don't understand why Hornby didn't recruit another manufacturer to into this with them on a new scale.

[@markcale7034]

Sadly, you are way off the mark on TT:120. I like it, and the obvious reason Hornby did not to go with N gauge is the existing competition in that market. TT:120 is already the most profitable part of Hornby Corporation. Sets and locos have sold out, while the 00 gauge faces stiff competition, especially from Accurascale. I haven't switched exclusively to TT:120 because I am heavily invested in the 00 gauge with over 182 locos in my collection. However, I am adding TT:120 to my collection. Size matters, and setting up a layout with a 1:120 scale makes more sense to me than expanding my existing 00 gauge range. The main issue with TT120 as you say is the limited availability of locos, with just 26 different models available to buy and receive today and over 20 more coming soon. But this is far more of a range than what Hornby had in their 00 range in the 1970s when they dominated the market, and model railways were more common. But....what do I know. Focus your attention on that, Sad Sam. You'll gain more traction on that rather than just focusing on Hornby.

[@drewzero1]

There's a lot of competition in N scale, but it's a growing market with a lot of existing customers and has been getting more and more popular among railway modelers. Instead Hornby is trying to create a new ecosystem in what's historically been a very niche scale, which is an uphill battle and not helped by their paltry offerings in the scale. Maybe it's working out for them now, but I think for it to work in the long term they need to build beyond the 'train set' phase so their initial customers can come back to upgrade their layouts: more new models, scenery, complex track pieces, etc... and since it's a niche scale Hornby has to do it all themselves instead of being able to rely on third parties to flesh out the ecosystem. Don't get me wrong, I think TT is a great size compromise, but it's a hard sell against the more popular scales that people already use. It's never caught on before *precisely because* there was so much competition (read: models available) in N and OO.

[@andrewhotston983]

Do you have any evidence that Hornby's TT range is their most profitable? Selling out is NO indication that the sales have made a profit.

[@GwionRhysDavies]

​@@andrewhotston983 this is a statement from the annual financial report. "Initially launched with 6 models, a further 8 have been added to broaden the scope of interest by era and region. By the end of March 2024, over 4,000 TT:120 sets had been sold, with an additional 8,000 locomotives and a staggering 30,000 coaches and wagons, reflecting the appetite for a new scale in the hobby. TT:120 sets sales have surpassed our forecasts resulting in 3 re-orders on key product lines and the TT:120 Scotsman set has become the best-selling trainset, in value terms, from the entire Hornby catalogue over the last 18 months."

[@andrewhotston983]

@@GwionRhysDavies Interesting, but the costs of tooling and promotion for a whole new scale must be substantial, so shifting stock doesn't necessarily equal making a big profit. It may well be that the profit margin was low, in order to keep the retail price lower and tempt people to take a step into the unknown.

[@markpeers4226]

@@GwionRhysDavies The figures bring us back to reality. Total TT120 sales year one £1.5m year two £1.3 m A drop in sales despite many new products and a fire sale just before their biggest sales season rather indicates too much stock and slow sales. Nothing in the Hornby figures shows a profit, with the massive increase in borrowings and cost of sales, record debts and a worrying drop in assets. With sales of 8000 locos why are sales of 30,000 coaches and wagons "staggering" do the maths

[@dougbull3289]

Love TT120, I use both 120 and oo on my layout. If I was starting again , I would go 120.

[@johnworby5130]

You are allowed to your opinion of course, personally I think TT-120 is an excellent idea. 00 is fat too big for many of us and N gauge too small, so please stop criticising and allow us to enjoy. is stop being so selfish

[@pedantik]

N Gauge is far too fiddly for some (including myself & those of advancing years), TT will find a market where space contraits are an issue (especially with new build housing) & OO a non-starter. UK N is already covered by others - Hornby probably see TT as a market to themselves. Time will tell.

[@gamerfan8445]

It more likely it will crash and burn if they don't get another company to help.

[@JeffDM]

TT is is only 20% larger than N scale, 20% larger than tiny doesn't seem like a major difference to justify choosing an ecosystem that's so sparse. Hornby crowds out competitors by announcing models of the same units announced by others. But hey it's not my money.

[@pedantik]

@@gamerfan8445 - TT is more than active elsewhere in the world. Railway modelling does not end at the shores of the UK.

[@pedantik]

@@JeffDM - that 20% makes a huge difference to some, there are plenty of other manufacturers of TT apart from Hornby.

[@romeldias]

Everyone seems to be missing the point....while a few people will go from HO to TT to save space...I think the bigger crowd is from the folk who have tried N Guage and found the scale too small! So this seems like a masterstroke from Hornby and with them being the first mover here...beginner sets will ensure that folk will stick with Hornby even if other brands step in!

[@leonkernan]

N scale is cool (I’ve got a layout next to me) but it’s too fiddly and small for the general market. I reckon they’ve made the right choice and so far it seems like it’s selling enough that people agree.

[@rambling_railfan]

The irony is a Hornby community post advertising TT:120 was under this video lmao

[@NEVILLEGROVE]

Shameless click bate, way off the mark I’m afraid.

[@TwigmoorWharf]

I joined the TT120 club at the beginning hoping there would be lots more offerings after 6 months or so but it just didn't happen. Starting a layout from scratch with such a poor offering of accessories meant i wasn't going to invest £000s only to see it possibly fail, and why not allow outlets to stock them? They just didn't have the funds to do it right. I ended up going for N gauge and wish Hornby would have done the same.

[@robd2184]

I’ve modelled in OO since I was a kid. I’ll never have the time or space to build something big enough for mainline . So I use OO for detailing, shunting puzzles and MPDs. I’ve brought a TT 50 and coaches and will have space enough to make something with a mainline feel

[@chuckmaddison2924]

I've always wondered Hornby didn't go N scale . Love Tomix and Kato. Very popular in Japan.

[@joshuagoodfellow1719]

Too many competitors like Graham Farish and Peco to make N scale viable.

[@User-3O3]

@@joshuagoodfellow1719 And Dapol.

[@MichaelHeslam-z2z]

Did produce Hornby Minitrix in partnership with Trix I think

[@wildstrawberryline]

Theres already an existing market of good quality product for British N gauge covering a wide range of models, but it's nowhere near as large as say 00 (and an order or magnitude smaller market than Japan), it doesn't need to be further thinned out among yet more producers plus what's left that hasn't already been made by the other firms? Don't forget Hornby collaborated with Minitrix back in the 70swith good reliable locos and stock, but ultimately those models were compromised designs to fit the German chassis and didn't keep up with the improvements of the European Minitrix models, instead continuing to make locos based on late 60s and early 70 chassis tooling. Hornby Lyddle End was an effort to get a share of the market for pre-made N gauge buildings, some were quite good but ultimately the range was discontinued. Hornby group includes the Arnold brand, top quality European N and TT gauge and they did release N gauge Brighton Belle units, but again limited market size and some sets didn't sell well. There has been a second batch produced though.

[@ethmister]

TT has Peco. It will also have Revolution trains soon.

[@LocomotionInMotion]

If you think that's good, you'll love checking out what TILLIG Modellbahnen offers

[@racingblue4722]

TT120 track, Hornby, Tillig, Peco. How much choice do you need?

[@Galacticmaster]

truly agree with you. i model in N gauge due to size and that it works. The range overall though could do with a British style overhaul away from farish and the Europeans. Hornby could of massively filled this void, and added value and stability to this scale, pushing it into the mainstream like OO and HO scale. FFS if the Americans and Japanese can do it, Hornby could have done it for even less. They could of even still maintained their creation of sub-standards models with all sorts of reliability issues. I, for one, would have once again started buying Hornby products for starters.

[@davidchilds9590]

IMO, the TT120 USP is the correct scale/gauge ratio. It just looks better. Yes, Hornby could have done better (why launch just with express passenger locomotives/trains?), but they are starting to fill out the options.

[@JohnDavies-cn3ro]

If I can throw a few thoughts into the pot - HP Models were crude by our standards, but were pretty sharp by those of 80 years ago, and they were pioneering a new gauge/scale combo. Simply finding motors small enough to fit back then was an achievement. (Sadly, TT is now virtually dead over in the US - a forgotten scale, as dead as American OO scale, with 19mm gauge track) TT3 (3mm to a foot) was a necessary compromise, again to get available motors into British outline models in the late 60's - TT120 is 2.5mm to a foot linear scale. German engines generally were and are bigger than British ones - so at that time it came down to practicalities. Now TT120, the original and correct scale is the European standard and it makes more sense to use their scales. I'm quite happy with the original Hornby, and Berlinnerbahn/Tillig, incidentally; I can get the mechs very cheaply from the 3mm Society, usually with damaged bodies, and scratchbuild narrow gauge OO and HO scale upperworks on them. The chassis are tough - built like tanks, will take the treatment I give them and run reliably. Which is precisely what I want from model trains.

[@pim1234]

Someone like you did say this when 00 was introduced LOL

[@owenpavey]

This is of course a re-issue of a video posted earlier in the year but at the moment hasnt recieved quite the level of attack it did from new TT fans first time around. Im in a very interesting situation,i have never brought Hornby stuff for a place of my own before,so TT is certainly an option,as is N gauge. It was always OO gauge in the family because that's what Dad had in the late 1960s before i was born. But Dad's Triang Midland Pullman & Class 31 Diesel didnt work. You could put them on the track and the 1960s transformer would make a terrible growl noise as if it was short circuiting. And Dad bieng an electrical engineer always made his own controller block,with massive capacitors and resistors all exposed at the back of a metal plate.Touch one of the capacitors and suddenly Kneller Hall,Evening Star or Lima Class 50 Eagle would zoom around and derail on the inner radius curve,sending the odd assortment of LMS & Great Western coaches on their side "YOU COULDNT LEAVE IT ALONE COULD YOU?" shouts Dad,clipping me round the ear. Well...i seem to have drifted a bit,but now that money is not so much an issue for me,rather ironically i still want to save money where i can on rolling stock and OO still allows me to do that,either by just going onto my local market and haggle or look at attending Railway Model Exhibitions. Im not sure there is a market for Hornby TT in second hand at the moment so that is not a buying factor for the starter sets. Im also not technically minded at fixing motor problems or identifying them and in this sense the less fiddly OO trumps both TT and of course N gauge. The advantage of the 9mm N gauge idea is of course more variety of track layout and units running,providing i can somehow pick up Bachman items cheap and get into maintaining the motors. Much to think about,this is an exciting time for railway modeling but i think i need to give TT another 5-10 years to see how it progresses.

[@shottsj]

100% in agreement. Hornby even have a legacy in N gauge from when their brand was associated with a nice little range of British locomotives as Hornby/Minitrix. Why would they want to dilute the skills and attention and demands of producing new and better models by spreading them what is effectively another competing scale.. Massive waste of the industry's focus and attention span. N gauge from Hornby would capitalise on its even greater space saving benefits and introduce more competition and variety into an already successful scale, and benefit from all the existing ranges of ancillary products available in that scale. A vain and silly decision that does a disservice to the hobby.

[@IbilisSLZ]

From continental TT scale entusiast perspective I wonder if they chose TT instead of N from the same reason OO was initially used instead of HO: with slim british locomotives N scale would require oversacale (like Triang 1:100 TT back in the day) to fit reasonably affordable motors inside, so instead they went for TT 1:120 in which they could have remained „in scale”.

[@BobSimpkin]

Great video, thank you. I'd have thought you were completely right but reading the comments suggests we might both be wrong. I'd like to see the financial figures mentioned by one of the commenters. Like you, I hope Hornby lives forever. Good luck to them and good luck to you.

[@mattsmocs3281]

Hey wait a second. Thats my E7! The thing didn't work right rill recently. Now freshly oiled up she is better than some current locos

[@MrMyc70]

So you havent bought any TT-120 but you think you can just pan the range. My TT 120 layout is doing great for me and at least ive bothered to try it rather than just criticise it without buying any.

[@LocomotionInMotion]

I've not bought any Hornby TT:120 but I have bought European (mostly Tillig) TT scale stuff and when I looked at Hornby's items in the flesh, they just don't measure up in terms of detail, features or price. Try some Euro-TT stuff yourself and see

[@markpeers4226]

The Hornby financial report does not sstate that TT120 has been a “monumental success” as someone below has stated. It also does not say that TT120 has been profitable. With sales of TT dropping in it’s second year from £1.5m to £1.3m despite many new products it certainly cannot be described as a success.

[@class_31clag]

I absolutely agree with you, i found TT 120 looks too close to N gauge and i would have preferred too see hornby start n gauge, years ago they made resin buildings in n gauge for some reason but never anything else. Hornby N gauge would be brilliant and im glad too see someone talking about it considering the big players on KZbin not mentioning names have ether not mentioned it or kinda slaged n gauge off by buying old dapol locos and not going for better manufacturers with a good name making n gauge look bad. Enough of my tangent. Glad too see you back locomotion motion and hope too see more of your content soon. [Dont sniff to much humbrol polly cement ;D ]

[@Badastro59]

You may be right, But I'm in ,I'm 65 received my first tri-ang set at age 3, ( night mail) by the time I was 28 I had everything Tri- ang and Hornby Railways had made, in OO, met ( the Girl of my dreams ) that year She bought my my first G guage, and we started collecting that, Now as a boy I wanted the TT tri-ang sets , but those where Lean years, I did start collecting Marklin Z Guage, that was lounge/ bedroom layouts, so two and a half years ago, the daughter and two young teenagers, moved in with me, my 10×5 foot layout had to go and the Hornby stuff, Now I only have the Lounge room, my son's taken the last spare bedroom, So I'm buying the Hornby tt Stuff, also have some Tilling, Roco, ( F'ing) fanastic fantastic quality) and Arnold, the Chinese are making stuff, And here in Australia a guy is making coach lights, for hornby, I have a great guy in Germany who is a TT specialist, So if you don't mind I'll fiddle if Rome burns, ( never made a Fiddle yard before,) I will buy everything Hornby makes in TT. I'm excited by trains again, that's a big thing at 65 years old, There are things to criticize about Hornby, always has been, but I owe Hornby a dept I can never repay,

[@tedrobberts3093]

My thought as mixed having seen tt i thought it looked wonderful and sitting in-between 00 and N gauge may be the whole point of it. If you look at the avalable space in modern homes for hobbys youl see space is of a premium no more is the space under your bed avalable for a hiden layout replaced by storage solutions from ikia. Hornby could be reacting to this alowing a middle ground that will develop, the issue i have with N is its just too dam small any modifications or model kits are fiddly fitting lights to a carage is difficult for example. TT is just big enough to alow tinkering and save space wether its a gamble that will pay off who knows only Hornby does you never know it could replace 00 gauge 100s of years in the future 😂

[@henrycummins764]

Please can you make an entire video dedicated to roasting the he'll our of my chanel and feel free to use any of my content in that video I won't pull a bachmann on you don't worry I just want to have a video I can watch and laugh at. At my experience

[@guyclark2975]

'I won't pull a bachmann on you' you mean Sam's Trains such a sad individual who plays trains on his carpet.

[@jimrobinson6362]

Have developed my 00 layout over the last 50yrs currently fills my garage plus a lean to shed and its more or less dormant for 4/5 months of the year due to temperature so have started a small exhibition layout i can work on during the winter indoors , needs to be small cos there's no 2nd hand stuff avail but being new should be reliable and target for show sept next yr - wish me luck

[@LivingLifeSlower]

A lot of people in here seem to struggle with someone's personal opinion.

[@little_britain]

I hope you're not correct. It would appear that models of UK prototypes are still flying off the shelves even for non-Hornby manufacturers. As for N-Gauge it is another "out of gauge" scale, it doesn't run all that well (especially steam outline) and Hornby would be very late to the parade. I believe they chose TT because there is (was) no competition, it is true to scale (and the only RTR scale in UK outline that is), it's small enough to fit in any house and they would have a clear head start over all competition. The "new modeller" isn't (for the most part) the seven year old. It is the seven year old's father, and the once seven year old nearing retirement and looking at the hobby again. These people (I count myself among them) would struggle with N gauge. I chose OO because of the strong second hand market and there wasn't any TT when I (re) started. If I was looking at entering the hobby now I would probably choose TT120. I suspect that you chose your point of view mostly because it is contrarian and likely to get clicks and views, not because you have any data or solid reasons to back your theory.

[@LocomotionInMotion]

Hornby Revenue: £56.2m (up 2.1% from FY 2023). Net loss: £12.1m (loss widened by 104% from FY 2023). £0.071 loss per share (further deteriorated from £0.035 loss in FY 2023) RISK ANALYSIS Has less than 1 year of cash runway Earnings have declined by 25.2% per year over past 5 years Does not have a meaningful market cap (£34M)

[@little_britain]

@@LocomotionInMotion These figures are to be expected with tooling up new models, ie: more revenue but less profit.) What would be more indicative would be breakdown by scale, bu even that would be premature at this stage.

[@markpeers4226]

The Hornby financial report indicates nothing is flying off Hornby's shelves. Hence the fire sale just before their busiest selling season

[@little_britain]

@@markpeers4226 The financial report does not go to that level of detail. I do know that with the discounts, Hornby have sold almost everything TT scale - showing Out of Stock already - in time for the holiday season and some new offerings I would expect to see shortly.

[@markpeers4226]

@@little_britain It looks like each production run of TT120 is in the low hundreds when you look at the prices and the numbers sold and with a drop in sales this year to only £1.3m was it worth the gamble as it will have hit sales and investment in OO

[@GronkstonModelRailway]

Hornby did venture into N gauge via Skaledale, but that was a complete flop, due to everything being the wrong scale maybe due to moulding materials not fine enough to get decent depth of detail and the use of latex type moulds. Couple that with Bachmann acquiring Graham Farish and then releasing there superior Scenecraft range using the same type of production methods. Hornby gave up after a couple years, giving the stock at a massive discount to any trade account holder. What I’ve seen of TT120 locally is nice, but the lack of choices is a big, “Walk away and get something else”. For my N gauge project or save and get another O gauge item.

[@pmb9172]

Within the company it went wrong when they shunted out the Chairman/CEO who realised in the late 90s that Hornby needed better quality manufacturing, he started to invest in Margate but realised the vast funding required in a factory neglected for decades was not going to be forthcoming . So off to China , he found an excellent manufacturer and business took off . He made the mistake of promising results faster than they actually were so he was moved on , replaced by former Airfix boss who really rode on his shirt tails and decisions . Factory in China came up for sale during financial crisis , Hornby could have purchased but didn’t , the excuse given to me by one of the well known hierarchy was they didn’t want the staff responsibilities , which are challenging in China , not sure that’s the real reason but it didn’t happen . It’s all gone wrong since then , Phoenix Assets have been pulling the strings since with a series of duff appointments, the business is full of staff who are just not right for what was a straightforward business that used to throw off loads of cash. The latest appointment , someone who was in charge of another well known business that went bust , they seem to have a penchant for these sorts .

[@railwaymechanicalengineer4587]

TT120 OR NOT TT120 ??? The problem Hornby face is "Market share". And as many in the business have been saying for years, the problem of the average British House is shrinking, and "OO" scale is effectively too large. Further while "N" scale has taken a small section of the market as an alternative scale in Britain especially. It is too small, especially for older modellers. Further although "TT" has seen little commercial success in Britain for over 50 years, modern tooling now allows high quality accurate products to be produced in this size. Further Hornby have launched TT120, not the original British TT100 scale, which suffered from export potential in the past, as a non conformist scale overseas. The bottom line however is can Hornby fund the large advertising campaign necessary to make not just British Modellers aware of this new range. But also Hornby's numerous European subsiduary ranges (Rivarossi, Lima, Electrotren, Arnold, Jouef). "TT" it must be added, was reintroduced in mainland Europe around 25 years ago, by a number of European manufacturers, and has seen a slowing growing market share !!!

[@jetbee1106]

Should have, could have, gone HO SCALE WITH BRIT models using Rivarossi or Lima. No brainer. Just look at Trix and their success with Flying Scotsman. Don’t forget Roco has also entered the TT 120 gauge. Check out the track selection. Cheers!

[@pedantik]

Roco & Rowa before them always produced a limited range of TT models.

[@gamerfan8445]

One problem is that Rivarossi and Lima don't have British models in HO scale. However, both have European and American designs that can open more markets.

[@pedantik]

@@gamerfan8445 - Lima used to have UK outline in HO, but the opportunbity for UK models to be produced in a correct scale/gauge ratio & loose their "narrow gauge" look has long gone.

[@111greatbear3]

Hornby Minitrix was a thing

[@xeniakucher7721]

Plenty of us overseas who have long been interested in dabbling in a bit of British modelling, but couldn't get over the nonsensical scale/gauge combinations used in the UK. Now here I am. Hornby's track is pretty rubbish but that's not a big deal, buy Tillig's track instead - far greater selection anyways, with bedding or without - but the models themselves are fantastic.

[@RonCooper-nl4pn]

Perhaps Hornby should have gone into ‘O’ Gauge ! I have that as well as my ‘OO’ if you ain’t got room for that then I would suggest that you get an outside room for it. I run both gauges in my out side workshop and it’s brilliant ***** regards from Ron 👍😃✔️🚂

[@muir8009]

TT's awesome! If you're keen on the German scene anyway.... Just an FYI the US HP products gave the size a scale, however they were but one of a few manufacturers at roughly the time time. HP's catalogue was '46, the same sized wesa was '45, lytax '45, Mignon which was more N sized was '45 or '46, and there are examples still around of prewar tt, before it was known as tt. I completely understand why hornby didn't go down the N Scale route, for exactly the same reasons as märklin never went to N, preferring to invent Z scale. Doing N scale would've been more of a waste. Flying off shelves with popularity? Don't think so. British N is but a tiny fraction of the market. All hornby would've done is just add another manufacturer making the same to a very limited market. Where hornby may have visited was to revisit the 0 range, or even reinvestigate delving into S scale again. Now, that could'v been interes Now, on a more intriguing note, The Lines' observed at a show the new Rokal tt line, and Richard Lines was absolutely taken by it and the word went through tri-and HQ: this is what we're going to make. Now, this was only a couple of very short years from the purchase of Rovex and other companies. About the same time as the shift from London to Margate. Now tri-ang 00 was still coming together as a range, with various production issues etc. Imagine what today might’ve been like if tri-ang had taken the plunge and ditched the still getting it together 00 line, and went hugely into the new tt scale. Royals scale, like wesa, was basically 1:110. Lytax had an absolutely incredible multi control idea: using variable Hz

[@dawdawes]

TT 120 is here to stay, especially with Peco producing products as well

[@pim1234]

Most people love it ...

[@lukestephens8672]

Tragic is exactly what this channel is.

[@johnhudghton3535]

Yes I agree. They should have gone to N gauge.

[@Laticity]

Agree 100%. As a newbie to N gauge some more range and more competition would be welcome.

[@stuartr7785]

Scalectrix?

[@raymondleggs5508]

Hornby should have went G scale

[@michaelwhiles5282]

I have to agree - TT120 is a poor direction for Hornby to have taken - well we'll see if it's still around (other than 2nd hand at carboots) in 5 years time.

[@timothykeinard8085]

PIKO TT SCALE

[@timwilks666]

It's "Scale-ex-tric". Have another go.

[@LocomotionInMotion]

Skol-ux-track?

[@WhiffTheRubbishEngine1869]

Wow. Is locomotion Motion making serious videos now?

[@gamerfan8445]

More a re-upload of an older video before Sam sent his fans after him.

[@dinosauralan.9486]

Many a true word is spoken in jest, come Christmas 2025 and we will see what we will see ❗

[@guyclark2975]

Excellent video and sums Hornby TT:120 up in a nutshell. It was a pet project for Simon Kohler who subsequently left leaving Hornby with an untried and untested scale. Perhaps Hornby would have been better going with N gauge or perhaps even explored Z gauge though not fully committing themselves as they have done with TT:120.

[@pedantik]

Hornby quality control & Z gauge - don't make me laugh please !

[@samharv8076]

Not a good idea. Robbing peter to pay Paul.

[@muppetrowlf1473]

As far as I can see Hornby have just engaged in another round of borrowing, which is dangerous to my mind, given their gamble on TT-120. There are no “new” modellers which is precisely why other manufacturers concentrate on OO and to a lesser extent N. Even if there were “new” modellers, the cash being spent is by older members of the community with disposable income. Hornby’s offerings in the last 5 years on OO have been lacklustre to say the least. The change of staff was needed. But they need to get their collective head out of their backsides and start competing in OO. The Class 43 in BR Blue a welcome surprise. Now keep the bloody stuff coming. And forget TT-120.

[@markpeers4226]

As a pensioner returning to the hobby, I considered TT120, but really it was a non starter as the range of locos and stock was, and still is, far too limiting. I will be dead well before they have anything like the range to make an interesting layout. A brave decision but a very foolish one for a company with considerable financial problems. Alas it is now quite likely to bring the whole company down as they have reduced the output for new 00 gauge and encouraged their main customer base to buy from its competitors who offer more new products each year at better prices

[@xeniakucher7721]

Conversely, had they not released 1:120 I'd never have bought a British model in my life despite having been interested for decades - I couldn't with the scale/gauge mismatches used in the UK. Hornby have opened themselves the door to sales not only inside the UK, but in the rest of the world as well, particularly Germany and Central Europe, where TT is big.

[@markpeers4226]

@@xeniakucher7721 Don't get me wrong I wish TT120 well and I really do hope it is a success. But the Hornby are in financial trouble and therefore they have taken a huge gamble which could bring the company down. It is true that TT120 has sold to people new to the hobby but many of these same people would have bought OO anyway so these TT120 sales are at the expense of their OO business. There are some that say it has been a big success but where is the proof of this when set against the huge tooling and set up costs. Also why then the massive fire sale of TT120 just before the big Christmas sales season?

[@xeniakucher7721]

Well, im their own financial report they say TT has been a monumental success even more so than they expected, so I think I'll take their word for it... as for the fire sale - standard marketing tactic: huge sales are always planned for and budgeted for, as a way to draw attention. If it were a clearance sale because TT is failing, they wouldn't at the same time be speaking Hungarian of new releases coming soon.

[@markpeers4226]

@@xeniakucher7721 Perhaps you can tell me which page in their financial reports it states that TT120 has been a "monumental success"? Important as you say, you "are taking their word for it" I do not regard £1.2million sales income from TT120 in the last year "monumental" and no where does it say that TT120 has been profitable. What has gone up in the last year is the group losses (-£12m) the Net Debts (-£14m) and group borrowing (up £9m to £16m) yet the Net assets dropped by dropped £12m . The cost of sales is up from £16.5m to £21.5m which rather indicates too much stock and not enough sales hence the fire sale.

[@markpeers4226]

@@xeniakucher7721 Nowhere in the Hornby Financial reports does it say TT120 has been a "monumental success" that is fiction take my word for that. The TT120 sales for the last year was £1,2mill marginally up on their 2023 sales. No mention of profit at all. In fact the group made a £12mill loss and net debts were £14 mill (the highest for a decade) Borrowing increased from the previous year from £7 mill to £16 mill yet net assets dropped from £36 mill to £24.3 mill. Cost of sales was up from £16.5 mil to £21.5 mil yet group turnover was only marginally up. All this points to too much stock and slow sales. I did not say it was a clearance sale but clearly an attempt to improve liquidity. As I said it gives me no pleasure to report these facts, but it is clear that Hornby launched TT120 at the expense of their main market which is OO gauge but could not afford to offer a sufficiently wide range of models to interest people like myself. I am pleased that you and others that took the risk of going TT120 are happy with the limited range but at my age I do not have the time to wait the many years it is going to take.

[@dutchbeef8920]

You’re right, they could have developed “space saving” oo stuff without splitting their own market. The internet is littered with tiny oo layouts. Or indeed N gauge or god forbid HO both of which they already have the expertise inhouse!! Their brands already do N and HO. Also its been two years and no smaller footprint sets in TT so that argument is out the window and no turntables. Still no turntables

[@ianmckee6843]

I do share the same worry that Hornby are stretching themselves too thinly. Also from a personal point of view, i will never move from OO to TT. And do not like to see precious pages of the magazines taken up with stories and news that i do not read.

[@danshobbies13]

I’m here in the states and I’ve tried different scales. I always come back to HO. The problem I see is after market accessory support. I do believe that might be the downfall of TT:120. I don’t follow the scale that closely, but at some point, you’re gonna want to add more to your layout other than trains.

[@Ivan_Cornelius]

For building I tend to use n-scale and modify it to my needs. I’m also starting to see American stock which I didn’t see when I first started modeling in TT.

[@thestocktonflyer4059]

Spot on my friend 👏 👌 keep up the great work 👍

[@g.r.railway7302]

I think they could have ventured into now at biggest oo9 market instead