How a WWII Bomber Became a "Photo of Death"

This is the story of B-24 Liberator "Extra Joker" and how she became a photo of death. Extra joker was a part of the 451st bomb group based out of Italy, and was shot down in 1944. This was made using the World War II flight simulator War Thunder. Hope you enjoy! Please like, comment, and subscribe. #WW2 #WWIIHistory #WarThunder
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[@CarrieMickelson]

The Tail Turret Gunner of this plane, Sgt. Oscar W. Bateman, was my grandfather. My mother was eight months old when he was KIA, she is now 79 years old. My dad came across this video last night and shared it with my sisters and me. This video is greatly appreciated by my mother and our family as we learned things we did not know. My mom has cherished those photos all these years, they gave her a piece of her daddy and his bravery. Tommy will never know how much he did for her.

[@zen4men]

Seeing that no-one has commented in 3 months, I am glad it helps you. To a lesser degree, I am in a similar position to yourself. My father was a British Royal Navy submarine officer in WW2, First Lieutenant on HMS Torbay at 22 years of age, and awarded the DSC. He commanded T-Class submarines until 1956, but never sasid much about it. After his death, a video came to my attention, showing HMS Tactician in the Sea of Japan during anti-submarine exercises with other ships, during the Korean War. I realised that one of the tiny figures on he conning tower was almost certainly my father. A strange feeling! / You grandfather and my father played their part in fighting against tyranny, and we can be proud of that. Sad to say it, but tyranny is everywhere in the world today, and using tools of social control unavailable to the tyrants of the 1940s. Even tiny children are a battlefield of the Left, brainwashed over marxist sexual theories. I think our world will turn very dark again, before things change for the better. .

[@zen4men]

@@malcolmmcfarlane7565 You mean utterly selfish people who expect everyone else to dance to their tune, or be vilified? Behaviour that is so 1930s, and led directly to a world war. Intolerant people, always pushing their agenda forward to achive a marxist world, where there is no freedom at all. / That is what millions of people fought to stop from 1939-1945, includng Carrie's grandfather, my mother and father, and a number of uncles.

[@shable1436]

​@@malcolmmcfarlane7565they are the same ppl that claim their country has turned communist, and has actually never lived in a true communist country, and experienced the atrocities the ppl had to live under.

[@mgfrisb]

​@@malcolmmcfarlane7565wtf are you commenting about? 🤡

[@kremepye3613]

​@@malcolmmcfarlane7565xi and putin aren't trying to force rainbow stuff on our children

[@henrys.6864]

My uncle who flew in a B-17 as a "ball gunner" is one of the few remaining alive of WW2 is Remarkably healthy 100 year old. He flew 30 "Sorties" in Europe. His name is Ignacio "Nick" Sanchez. 🇺🇲

[@fade_wboom1967]

Btw if i'm correct he is highly decorated.

[@douglasglaser9634]

30 was 5 more than the required 25 to go home.

[@fade_wboom1967]

What was the planes name ?

[@drippycatt]

🫡

[@christopherburnham1612]

The Americans were told how dangerous daylight bomber were but Americans never listened

[@TJ3]

Historical notes - First off guys, please forgive me. I definitely say "but" too much in this script, but by the time I realized it, it was already upload time. I'll try to improve that in the future. Secondly, before you ask, I have no idea why "Extra Joker" was silver, but "Thunder Mug" was Olive drab, but based on all my research I do believe that to be the case here. In addition, some of the other skins may not be exactly accurate, but I did my best. Also - some have pointed out, and rightly so, that I may have over emphasized the effectiveness of the Nordon bomb sight. Some of it was propaganda, and it wasn't necessarily "new" in 1944, but rather, was seeing major combat usage for the first time.

[@captainhurricane5705]

I didn't notice at all. A very interesting story, thanks.

[@TJ3]

@@captainhurricane5705 haha thanks that makes me feel better.

[@FozzyZ28]

Absolutely nothing wrong with your narration! Didn't even notice what you were on about??? As a 13yr old I used to buy replica news papers about WW2, growing up in forces I was addicted, , obviously now I'm an old fart I truly think that your narration is elegant and above all respectful. I'm probably your harshest critic if I wanted to be..... but I truly think that your channel rocks!!! Super happy I found your channel. 😁😁😁👍🇬🇧

[@TJ3]

@@FozzyZ28 thank you :)

[@10mmfan]

You do a fantastic job on all your videos. I didn’t notice the buts at all. Keep ‘em coming.

[@Farbar1955]

The father of a friend of mine was a navigator on a B-24 and he made it home after the war. He rarely, if ever, spoke about his experiences. But one time he and his wife were visiting his son...my friend...who was stationed with the US Army in Germany and one day they went on a driving trip in the Wiesbaden area. They drove past two particular places...an industrial area and a large train yard...and he mentioned that they had bombed both sites 30 years earlier. He was glad to see that those spots had been rebuilt and were active. He said nothing else after that.

[@bsmith4u2]

My father was a tail gunner in a B-24, shot down, one man went down with the plane as it turned over. Prison camp for 8 months near the end of the war. Liberated from Stalag Luft III.

[@billcounts9516]

My father was a pilot shot down June 29 1944 spent almost a year in Stalag Luft 3

[@bsmith4u2]

@@billcounts9516 Our dads were in there at the same time. My dad was in there from Aug 1944 until liberation.

[@twentypdrparrott694]

I had a good friend who has long since passed on who was the top turret gunner in a B-24 over Europe. He had a little military aircraft clock mounted on a wooden block on his desk. I asked him about it and the following story flowed out: We were doing night practice touch and goes on a grass field near Walla Walla, Washington. It was raining cats and dogs. We had done several touch and goes and then we came in for the last one. The pilot misjudged the height and dropped it. I was riding in the top turret. When I woke up, I was still in the turret but 100 yards from the plane. This clock came from that plane. These scars on my arms is where they went through the plexiglass on impact."

[@michaelwhisman]

Your friend ws an accomplice to the slow deaths of thousands of children. NOt all were German or Italian.

[@DEP717]

@@michaelwhisman Don't be a griefer. I doubt that the kids in occupied countries were doing OK under occupation, either.

[@cmck472]

The difference was that the Axis were killing people in a deliberate manner on an industrial scale. If Germany had surrendered, the bombing would have stopped the same day. If the Allies had stopped fighting, the concentration and death camps would have just carried on killing.

[@askewcat3209]

@@michaelwhisman war is brutal for everyone involved no getting around that fact but dont go around acting like things would have been better if we left the nazis continue their genocides and brutal occupations of the countrys they took over

[@charlesgreathouse7376]

@@michaelwhisman troll.

[@stulynn2005]

That photographer should have just got a good luck medal. The individual stories of these men and planes make these videos great Also the 24 you were in front of ,Diamond Lil was the 25th B24 made out of over 18,000

[@dyer2cycle]

I wish they would either fully convert it(Dianond Lil) to B-24A configuration, short nose and appropriate paint job and all, and correct the cockpit greenhouse, or just completely restore it back to it's original LB-30 configuration..It's a beautiful plane, but too many things are incorrect on it the way it is...

[@chgr7025]

It's hard to hit the "like" button for such a tragic story, but thank you so much for bringing forgotten stories back to those of us that hadn't heard of them. Thank you for all you do for bringing history back to the masses.

[@midnyte6195]

👍😁I hit the like button

[@seanm2511]

It's not the photo where a P39 pulls straight into a B17, although the crew is just as dead.

[@christopherhughes9984]

@@seanm2511 Do you mean a P38 Lighting.

[@seanm2511]

@@christopherhughes9984 No, I mean a P39. In Dallas. The recent incident.

[@christopherhughes9984]

@@seanm2511 Oops sorry, anyway a very interesting story keep up the good work regards Chris. 👍

[@jeffjensen782]

My grandmother built B-24s at Consolidated in San Diego. She became a “Leadman” and was responsible for the navigation system installations.

[@brucep8748]

A few years ago when I read about this story I noticed one of the crew was local to me; Sgt. Harry V. Bates - ball turret gunner (KIA) Reinholds, Pennsylvania. I found his headstone in the local cemetery and pay my respects to him yearly. I realized his surviving brother was a member of the same VFW post as myself, he was a B17 radio operator, he and I would talk about his time as a B17 crew member when I would see him. Not knowing this story about Sgt Bates until after his brother passed a few years ago would have made for some interesting discussion I am sure.

[@Runehorn]

My Grandpa was a gunner of the Extra Joker Crew that switched to the Thunder Mug. I looked up his journal entry on the event, its very difficult to decipher his writing, but from what I can tell, when they landed they had 150 holes in the plane they had to repair. I never really got him to tell the story of the events, but I do remember him saying he got credit for one kill that day.

[@Onoma314]

My grandfather did 33 missions in B-17's with the 384th Air Expeditionary Group....I cannot even imagine what it was like . Different breed of men in those days

[@CFITOMAHAWK]

Not Liberals.

[@highvoltage4719]

@@CFITOMAHAWK Biden was not on board 😉👍 didn,t understand the call🤣

[@theman3456]

Yeah today we might not do those kind of war crimes...

[@sjp2775]

My father in law built B-24s during WW2. Pretty interesting time to live....

[@neilmccann5826]

@@theman3456 ...and without those crimes you would not have your freedom from the totalitarian Huns (assuming they let your parents live).

[@daveranville6381]

In this situation my uncle was in the B-24 that was shot down before the extra joker was hit. His pane was called the "Fertile Myrtle" and he was then the upper turret gunner. His plane went down in Frankelfels, Austria and there is a whole story on his remains being returned to the U.S.

[@darrinsiberia]

cool detail i was waiting for the narrator to give the name of that plane. sorry for your loss.

[@salvagedb2470]

Whether in a B17 or B24 , they're not a place you wanted to be with swarming Fighters but many Men were , respect for them all..great vid.

[@clintonreisig]

and the flak, too

[@danclayberger770]

The Norton Bomb Sight never "got better". Continued review of all bombing missions would show that only 15% of all bombs dropped hit within 2 miles of target. That's why they did Carpet Bombing.

[@kurtmartin8446]

Norden is now the subject of lots of good writing showing what a long-term scam it was. Bomber Mafia is good, too.

[@Tuuhura]

Yes the continuation of the propaganda re the Norden! It was rubbish!

[@rustynail6819]

Correct, the Norden bomb sight was garbage. The Germans captured one that was not tossed out of a B-17 before it crashed like it was supposed to, and they said it was trash.

[@CallsItLikeISeizeIts]

There is a video on YT about the myth and fallacy of the Norden BS, all PR from CEO to help win contracts. Can probably search for it

[@Pearldrummer55]

Yeah I dont think the bomb sight improved rather the tactics leading up to the bombing run, and the bombardiers ability to have control of the plane on bombing run is what really improved.

[@toddkurzbard]

I can only imagine the horror the switched crew must have felt, not only watching their friends die, but in seeing their own plane, which I'm sure they loved, die as well.

[@buildingwithtrees2258]

My grandfather was a medic who picked up soldiers from the front and flew back to England. He was sick, and a friend covered his shift. The plane was shot down, and his friends died. He lamented, "That should've been me."

[@markg999]

My grandfather switched planes for a person...his plane had a horrible crash and he almost died. The guy he switched with the plane was lost and all of the crew. He was navigator for B26.

[@frankmorris9682]

My Moms first husband was a pilot, they were married for just over 2 years when he was the pilot of a B-17 , sadly he was shot down over Germany on a bombing run , the blew up in mid air air , no parachutes seen ,just a ball of fire, crew of 10 perished with the plane,no bodies ever recovered, this haunted her till her dying days …. They were so deeply in love. 💕may Johnny & his crew RIP. !! I still have his metals, flying glasses. hat & other momentous ! He and his brave crew paid the ultimate price “GOD BLESS THEM “ and all others who served our country 🇺🇸

[@brt-jn7kg]

My uncle started flying and as he would say killing Germans over North Africa many did it in the Soviet Union and over Europe. He really dislike the Nazis I mean he did not like but after flying in witnessing the Japanese capacity for just downright murder he really hated them. He used to say it doesn't take long to start hating when you see your friends machine-gunned helplessly in a parachute by some Japanese soldier in a zero. People forget those airplanes a lot of times would get hit with a loaded bomb loading just disappear into a puff smok and aluminum.

[@leddielive]

Thank you for your story & a reminder to all that the suffering, sadness & loss has been felt by many many thousands of families, lest we forget the sacrifice made for our freedom today.

[@TJ3]

Thanks again to the Commemorative Air Force, check them out here! commemorativeairforce.org/ facebook.com/CommemorativeAF/

[@billclisham8668]

If you have driven a GM vehicle with an automatic transmission in the last 70+ years your transmission was built in the very building the B24's were built in. It's still often refered to in the area as the bomber plant.

[@LarryNiven226]

I had a cousin who was a navigator on a Halifax. He survived a shoot down. However, the radio operator and engineer were not so lucky. Those bomber crews were heros

[@cvisenti]

These videos are astonishingly well done in all aspects, pacing, graphics, depth of information balanced with engaging narrative. I’m 51, had two uncles in WWII, one who stumbled seasick onto the Normandy shores, who we only learned three years ago had a little girlfriend back in England during the buildup to D Day, and she had a son by him nobody knew about, a cousin we here in Texas finally got to meet a couple years back. And the other a B-17 pilot in the Pacific who survived all the missions of his tour unscathed only to have a rookie he was training stateside clip power lines & kill them all. Gone at 24yrs old. These videos make those times a little more tangible for me, so thank you

[@michaelmartin9022]

I went to a memorial service once for a WW2 bomber crew that crashed in training / a ferry flight. I think somebody had done a lot of family tree research and tried to get as many relatives of the crew together as possible.

[@liverpoolscottish6430]

Interesting and tragic tale- never knew about this incident. I have nothing but RESPECT for the USAAF bomber crews- brave men indeed. Greetings from across the pond!

[@riharikaa809]

Well done from New Zealand. Knew the pictures but not the back story. Let us remember always these brave people and their sacrifices. Lest we forget.

[@williamkennedy5492]

My father would tell me of the B17s and B24s returning to their bases in Norfolk ,Suffolk and Cambridgeshire , he just couldn't believe the damage they flew home with, such brave men to face that onslaught , Some years ago i visited the 100th bomber museum near diss, its worth a visit.

[@krisgreenwood5173]

My father's first cousin, Gene Greenwood was a member of the 100th Bomb Group at Thorpe Abbot.

[@alanquintus2069]

My dad was a E7 in the motor pool. While stationed in England before D-Day he told me of the time a B-17 landed after a mission. It had flak damage. They got the tail gunner out with a garden hose . God bless all those brave men for their sacrifices.

[@terrydunn5784]

My mom worked on the B-24 at San Diego in WW2 and one of her brothers was a B-24 pilot in the war. Her dad was a foreman at the plant.

[@josepolotan6899]

James Stewart, one of the most popular actors in history, completed flew combat missions over Germany in the B-24. A college graduate and a licensed commercial pilot before the war allowed, he received a commission as a second lieutenant with the Air Corps in January of 1942. He was concerned, however, that his celebrity status mean the military keeping him behind the lines in order that his safety would not be at risk. He spent a year training pilots in Albuquerque, New Mexico after which he went to his commander and asked for more challenging assignments on the front lines. For whatever reason, he would up in England in November of 1943 with the 445th Bombardment Group flying the B-24 Liberator. He was promoted to Major after a mission to Ludwigshafen, Germany in January of 1944. Later he would receive the Distinguished Flying Cross for his actions as Deputy Commander of the 2nd Bombardment Wing. In March 1945, he was promoted to Colonel. He retired from the Air Force at the age of 60 in 1968 as a Brigadier General to which he had been promoted in July 1959. Brig. Gen. James M. Stewart was buried with full military honors when he passed in 1997.

[@colinschaeffer3940]

Read Stephen Ambrose en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wild_Blue about the B-24 and George McGovern.

[@richardfabacher3705]

My father was ground crew for the 482nd Bomb group. He was apparently one of the best welder/solderer/instrument specialists and they would send him all the problem aircraft for repairs. The trickiest part was the thermocouples soldered to engines to indicate temperatures. Apparently he was a wizard in this field. Dad was a big-rig mechanic whose hobby was fixing radios and record players. (Later, TVs)The 482nd had planes on every mission because they had the super secret airborne radar the Germans didn't know about. The Army actually gave classes to the soldiers to explain the "bathtubs" (radardomes) where B-17's normally had a chin turret. The deflecting strategy was with jokes about how our "chicken" pilots keep soiling themselves so they need a bathtub to get cleaned-up. Or, good place for officers to sleep-off a hangover. Where else you gonna hide the hookers? etc. This unit at Alconbury included both B-24s and B-17s. Dad was with 17s. BTW, he said the 17s had a much better chance of returning when badly shot-up because the wing had more lift at lower speeds. Many made it back on one remaining engine. The B-24 needed more airspeed to generate lift on the Davis wing. Anyway, Jimmy Stewart "Shanghaied" Dad from his unit to fit and weld a piece of armor plate under his seat in his B-24. Apparently a small fragment of flak had come through his seat and sliced his backside a bit too close to the Stewart Family Jewels. Ironically, Dad couldn't mention it until after the war because of all the secrecy. I can imagine Stewart's drawl as he told Dad "Dying for your country is one thing, but, uh . . . ." Dad lost one of his favorite aircrews on their 24th mission. He was a totally closed-up person but the only time I ever saw him break down was whenever he mentioned that loss. That crew all called him "Gramps," because at 35, he was older than his crews.

[@sammvoyager]

Great story. We'll always remember him as George Bailey from It's A Wonderful Life

[@pusheenthecat9264]

For those who are wondering, the video stalls for 10 minutes. Here is when it actually shows the "death bomber" 11:10

[@alexrebmann1253]

One of my favorite B-24 Liberator stories is the Lady be Good. A bomber based out of Libya. Disappeared coming back from a mission. Wreckage was discovered deep in the Libyan desert in 1969 by a British oil expedition team. Crew survived the crash but died in the desert days later from the desert heat.

[@williamforbes5826]

I read of the 'Lady be Good' many years ago. They thought they were over the Med when they bailed out. It's amazing that the plane was ever found.

[@MelbaOzzie]

Their story is told in the book "Log of the Liberators". Check my post above for a link to the ebook version of this book.

[@tonyclough9844]

Didn't they make a film about it.

[@alexrebmann1253]

@@tonyclough9844 1969 TV movie Sole Survivor. Richard Basehart, and William Shatner.

[@DarylW426]

Possibly the most famous photographs of Air Combat to ever come out of WWII. It is so tragic but also so fascinating to hear the story behind the photos. Thank you!

[@1168PJ]

The photo of Wee Willie and his wing blown off and also the one of Queenie coming back in shreds after the party at Schweinfurt.

[@b.k.2974]

My dad flew in the Extra Joker. His main plane was The Minnesota Mauler but when it was in repair he'd be was, at one point, the nose gunner in the Joker. I wish the computer generated video would show the actual planes of that time. The "green house" nose of the plane had been replaced with the "turret" style by then. You can see this in the actual photos. God Bless the 451st and the men who flew them!

[@AmyMartin-id3cg]

I would like to suggest a focus of an upcoming video be on researching the story of B-24 Ole Tomato. A story that deserves to be told...the bomber crashed over an island in the phillipines in September 1944. No survivors with several crew members still considered MIA as their bodies were never recovered. I stumbled upon this story in a historic cemetery in Atlanta, where the mother of radio operator JT Hooks had erected a grave stone next to hers on their family plot even though his body was never recovered with this quote...."He stands in the unbroken line of patriots who have dared to die that freedom might live." When I read that quote it drew me in to learn more about him and his story...born and raised in Atlanta, childhood home in Grant Park, worked as a grocer and store clerk at a local hardware store, died at 28 years old...miles and miles away from home in a B-24 bomber nicknamed the Ole Tomato. I would love to see if you can find out more about JT Hooks and his story... I've turned over just about every rock I knew to look - but thinking you can take this story much further!

[@elderlyboy]

Love this idea look into this TJ3!

[@robertzedeker3234]

My father was the co-pilot in a B 24, nick named the Flak Magnet. He was shot down in April of 1944. The whole crew got out except the pilot who was killed by enemy fire. They all became POW s and even though the camps were harsh, it probably saved their lives and they survived the war. I admire all the air crews, it was the most dangerous job you could have in the war.

[@richardhead3211]

the irony of the name flak magnet is brilliant.

[@nairbvel]

Somewhere in the back of my head is a fuzzy memory of seeing "Flak Magnet" in a photo in one of my history books...!

[@richardhead3211]

@@nairbvel so cool

[@marchellochiovelli7259]

Some men in tanks and Merchant ships would like a word with you.

[@richardhead3211]

@@marchellochiovelli7259 statistically ball turret gunner on the b 17 was the most dangerous in the war

[@jimgrady7458]

Interesting, but if Extra Joker had been equipped properly and been flown by it's regular crew wouldn't it have occupied the position in formation that Thunder Mug occupied this mission? Hence, wouldn't the same crew have been lost? These WWII bomber crews must've been some of the bravest guys around. I can't imagine the stress levels those missions would push you to.

[@markwoods1530]

they were very brave. The most dangerous must have been Uboats, it would have certainly been beyond me.

[@KatraMoo]

Looking at this video, I noticed one thing that may have had impact on the German fighter pilots choices of target, Extra Joker was not painted, it was shiny aluminium and therefore easier to pick out. Low hanging fruit so to speak. However, the other two that were also shot down were painted dark green. So that would indicate the surviving B24 was just lucky that day.

[@Skinflaps_Meatslapper]

​@@KatraMoo Bare aluminum is easier to spot from a distance, but only if you catch a reflection. The rest of the time it's actually pretty decent camo in the skies (especially on cloudy days viewed from below or winter campaigns viewed from above). I've lost several really nice RC planes because of this too, they just kind of disappear and you can't figure out which way they're oriented. OD green is pretty dark in the sky and only modestly helpful when viewed from above, might as well be painted black viewed from below. Mostly irrelevant to this situation, as camo is only helpful to prevent detection at very long distances, and only if your entire formation is the same, AND only if you're not producing any contrails. Once you get within engagement range, it doesn't really matter if your plane is day glow orange with bullseyes painted on or wearing a ghillie suit made out of clouds, you're still going to stand out in a big way. Even without any kind of camo, spotting anything beyond 5 miles or so is extremely difficult in the air. I've tried spotting aircraft using ADS-B while ferrying around places and it's tough even when you know their exact direction and altitude. Around 3 miles out is generally where color or size makes a difference in spotting. Within a mile they're hard to miss, no matter the size or color. I think it's just a matter of circumstance, to be honest. The tactics used by the interceptors on this encounter was to pick off the bombers from the rear because the formation was weak, but usually they try to go for the lead planes first and pick off the strays after a few runs. They might have changed their tactic to pick off the lead if the rest of the bombers had stayed in formation, and then the Thunder Mug might have been the first target instead. If the other crew was trained first, same situation.

[@samuelhowie4543]

Generally, the only crews that were delegated to a specific position were the top ranked pilots plane. They were usually the most experienced and the commanders of the squadrons.

[@peterruiz6117]

Same fear/stress/duty of attack fighters, that died in droves....One P47 pilot reportedly came back from a terrible mission, stood up in the cockpit,and emptied his pistol into the plane. He was sent home. Another, P47 pilot had a bomb ,that was hung up, come off on landing, exploding near the plane. After many misshaps, he had a nervousbreak down. Bravery is usually finding a way to function, with terror.

[@geraldnelson5808]

This one was good, nice job! One of my favorite stories is Chuck Yeager getting shot down in a head on pass over France early in his career, he had to escape with the help of the Maquis and Basque resistance groups. He was in a P-51B, off the top of my head he was shot down by a FW-190.

[@nickmitsialis]

Yes; I had heard it was some Operational Training Gruppe, not one of the 'front line' units like JG2 or JG26

[@razorus1]

My dad was a waist gunner on a B-24. He was in the 451st bomb group, 727th squadron. When he was in his 70s we went to a local airport to see a Liberator that was flown in by the Confederate Air Force. After touring the ship I surprised my dad by saying "I will buy a ticket for you if you want to go back up." (They were $300 so it was a stretch for me). Dad looked at me and said "are you crazy? I flew 35 combat missions in that thing--the last thing I want to do is get back on one!!"

[@darrinsiberia]

my grandpa said the same thing when "saving private ryan" came out.. "why would i want to watch that i already lived through it"

[@captainhurricane5705]

One of the most chilling videos I saw was from a bomb bay door camera that shows a B-17(?) releasing its bombs only for them to land on another bomber that is somehow flying directly below them and breaking it apart. Any ideas of the history behind that one?

[@TJ3]

I already covered this one :) this is Miss Donna Mae. Should be able to find it on my channel.

[@captainhurricane5705]

@@TJ3 Ah right, I missed that one!

[@danielbayer278]

I've had a book with a photo of that event for years and I've always wondered about the details. I'll have to check that out!

[@Biggusdikusincontinentabuttoks]

If I remembered, everyone was able to jump out. Unfortunately, it was over enemy territory, so a lot of them were captured

[@bad74maverick1]

@@danielbayer278 The book you are referring to that has all these pictures and details of that incident and the one in this video in it is called "Log Of The Liberators". It's a fantastic book.

[@Wonderwhoopin]

Keep it up, looking into and learning about the platforms and you came up. Good data and visuals to help show what and why outcomes were like they were

[@jimc6687]

In case you wanted to do a follow up story on the tragic Dallas air show crash involving two planes including one of the last flyable B-17s, TJ......I thought I'd give you a 'heads up' that they just released more details on this sad accident including the voice recordings. Jim C.

[@Jaykilyourbrain]

I miss those beautiful beasts, especially that flying fortress 😫

[@demetridar506]

That incident with the B-17, unfortunate as it was, showed the spectators what WWII was about. It was not about heroes, it was about aircrew dying in large numbers and then getting cremated in aviation fuel. Also, if debris had fallen on spectators, it would have also shown how bombers delivered death on the people on the ground. Air shows are twisting the story trying to glorify the war. And in that respect, that terrible accident hopefully revealed to the crowd what war was really like.

[@widyasantoso4910]

It's probably not a good subject for TJ- way too recent, the families of the victims are still living, and probably disrespectful to simulate the crash.

[@Jack-Tactical]

@@demetridar506 That’s a pretty stupid take on air shows.

[@Jack-Tactical]

@@demetridar506 That’s a pretty stupid take on air shows.

[@kendunn2218]

Maybe the B-24 was overshadowed by the B-17 in Europe. However, the RAF Coastal Command were glad to have them in the Battle of the Atlantic. Their long-range made them a great weapon in the war against the U Boats. Our people needed everything at their disposal. Thanks for the video.

[@paulbartels6585]

That and the Catalina along with other flying boats

[@walterarroyo5220]

This story along with those photos gave me chills. RIP brave souls.

[@FutureSystem738]

You mentioned the Nordern bombsight- I believe it’s efficacy was waaay less than most people believed. It was actually a serious con job.

[@tonyclough9844]

It worked for the atom bombers.

[@hotcakesism]

@@tonyclough9844 didn't exactly need to be precise

[@andiesayer5085]

The Norden bomb sight had been around before the War. 1936, I believe. The Germans had the plans for it pretty quickly

[@michaelmartin9022]

The Germans and Japanese both captured examples and thought it wasn't that impressive, but it needed to work with other systems on the plane, not just on it's own. There was a late-war German prototype bomber that used B29 landing gear. Yes, they were so desperate they had to rely on salvaged wreckage for production!

[@kenkahre9262]

Germans had access to it. They were not impressed. And had their own.@@andiesayer5085

[@jimward204]

My Dad was a nose-gunner on a B-24 of the 15th US Army Air Force, 465th Bomb Group, 783rd Bomb Squadron, based in Italy. He never talked about his wartime experiences until 1996 when he was diagnosed with cancer. Then, he was an open book and I soaked it all in! He was truly one of the Greatest Generation!

[@billbayno7059]

Very interesting Jim! My Dad also flew with the 783rd, he was a Flight Engineer. He went down twice, Sep13, 1944 into the Adriatic then finally Feb 16, 1945. The first time 5 of the 9 crew perished, the second time 7 of the nine perished. The German village of Haselbach built a memorial to the 7 Americans who died there on Feb 16th. I attended the dedication in 2013. Gerry Brown

[@richardbriscoe8563]

A family friend was a B-24 pilot who was twice shot down and lived to tell the tale.

[@nommadd5758]

I have seen these tragic pictures before but never knew the back story. Thank you!

[@ianc8999]

The Fortress is far more aesthetically pleasing than the Liberator which certainly helps in terms of PR - see also Sptifire vs Hurricane and Mustang vs Thunderbolt.

[@dukecraig2402]

Thunderbolts are my favorite US fighter's and Typhoons are my favorite British fighter's, precisely for the reason that both of them are big nasty looking beasts, when I attack an enemy I want him to look up and think "Oh shit!!! Look at that hideous beast coming at me!!!" and drop dead from a heart attack before I even have to pull the trigger.

[@ant-onemusic444]

True about the spit vs hurricane, but p51 and thunderbolts were two very different planes both loved because they excelled in their own fields

[@paulbartels6585]

Hellcat vs Corsair is another I love the HC

[@lightninwillie2261]

My father flew in B-24's and said it was his favorite plane to be in only because it always got back to base.

[@ultrametric9317]

Sad. I would come down to a chickenshit CO to deny that tail gunner his award. My Dad trained on a B-24 in the States but flew waist gun on a B-17 during the war. He was a volunteer in 1940 so his crew and squadron were some of the earliest to fly, without escort. He had a 2% chance of making 25 missions - made it to 13 when frostbite grounded him. He had removed his headset to clear out the frozen sweat and in that short time near an open window at 50 below zero and a howling wind, his big ears froze. He joked to me that his ears probably saved his life. I look at my own big ears in the mirror and see my Dad :) RIP Pop!

[@1pcfred]

When they told your Dad he had a 2% chance they lied to him. Statistically it was impossible to survive a tour. But 20% beat the odds. You had a better chance of being in a German U Boat than a US bomber. US bomber crews suffered the worst losses in the war.

[@stephenkalatucka6213]

The thermometer on a B-17 only went down to -65. It was probably often colder than that.

[@rockymountainlifeprospecti4423]

Well done, keep up the great work TJ3 history!!

[@jamiebray8532]

So easily fate can twist. The generation of people during WW2 in my opinion is the bravest of generations. They make me proud to be an American. They were just a different breed. And we need the fight & courage back today to help save our Republic once again. 🇺🇸

[@roywall5231]

Too many migrants. USA will never be the same.

[@mustanggun]

Sad to say, but I think most of this generation now are cowards. Not all, but most. We’ll have to fight three.

[@markputnam4902]

AMEN 🙏

[@therealuncleowen2588]

I agree that the greatest generation was amazing. They saved the world from tyranny. Also, our Republic WAS saved when trump was voted out in the 2020 election and when the attempted coup was thwarted on January 6, 2021. Had the insurrection succeeded, we'd be living in a dictatorship today. We still have a Republic, thank God.

[@rackcity5981]

Bankers always do what's best for business

[@richsmith7200]

My grandfather couldn't enlist because of a childhood fracture that didn't set properly, so was never able to even come close to straightening his arm out. But he was an intelligent man, got into aerospace industry, actually work on the design of part of the cockpit. I can't even imagine what these guys went through each day. Just amazing.

[@demiurgiac]

I have viewed that iconic image dozens of times over the years but never knew about all this detail presented here.

[@robertlong7033]

Had an uncle who flew a B24 with the 15th out of Italy. 51 missions. Didn't care much for it. Getting the thing off the ground was sometimes the scariest part of the mission. A bit faster, carried a bigger bomb load couldn't fly as high as the 17 and the easiest thing in the world 2 shoot down or catch on fire.

[@robinboucherwonderfulflight]

Hi, Where in Italy was he stationed? Thank you

[@robertlong7033]

@@robinboucherwonderfulflight He died in 2001. Didn't talk much about it. Perhaps it might have to do with the morning following a mission the day before where they took some enemy fire when the crew chief came up to him and said: "Do you know that you flew out of Europe across the Mediterranean and back to base with one strand of wire left on your main battery cable?. Shot nearly clean off". The Isle of Capri was mentioned his plane was unpainted and he was there from August 1944 to sometime late 45 .And he did some time flying in a B29. Talked about the huge technological jump forward with the B29. Why do you want to know. ?

[@robinboucherwonderfulflight]

@@robertlong7033 I had a grand uncle who was a flight engineer/ top turret gunner with the 455th in the 15th Army Air Corp flying out of Italy in B-24s.

[@gilwhitmore9682]

Thank you TJ for going the extra mile to bring this story to light in an accurate and relatable way. Appreciate what you do.

[@fredemny3304]

Mmmmm.

[@daffidavit]

I'm proud to say that my day had four brothers and two sisters during WWII. My day was the youngest and entered the Navy as a mechanic and PBY flight engineer at Pensacola Fl, during the entire War. He stayed in the Naval reserves for another 20 years of so. However, the real credit goes to both of his brothers, my uncle Jim who was a nose gunner on a B-24. I have many photos of him and his flight crew posing in front of their B-24. He completed his missions and came back alive after the war. I don't know much more than that. But the story of my uncle Pete, his brother, is most amazing. Pete was a tank commander, not unlike Brad Pitt's role in the movie "Fury". He served under General Patton in North Africa during "Operation Torch". My uncle Pete earned a "Silver Star". I saw it with my own eyes when his son, my cousin Peter Jr. show it to me. As the story goes, in North Africa there were many hills of sand. In front of his long ridge of sand-hills was a large group of German and French-Vichy troops ready and able to over-run them and attack a smaller group of American soldiers behind them. It could have been a disaster. My uncle Peter only had command of about 4 or 5 tanks. Yet, there was a large group of enemy invaders ready to overtake them. My uncle ordered all of his tanks to take position on top of a hill and fire away. Then he ordered them all the back off and travel down-stream and return to the top of the hill again and take more shots. Instead of it appearing that there were only 4 or 5 tanks to protect the troops, it seemed as if there was a row of over 20 or more tanks. The Germans decided to back off and not advance. This allowed enough time for replacement troops to fortify the remaining troops behind my uncle's line. For that he earned the honorable "Silver Star" which I understand was second to the top of all honors. I'm proud of my father and his brothers who battled in the war and came home alive. I honor all service men and women who defend my country.

[@TrustyZ900]

My brother and I had the pleasure of thoroughly checking out a B-24 at an air show in Spokane. No one was around and it was sitting out by itself. It was amazing how low it sat as compared to a B-17. For some reason, I've always been drawn to it's looks from the front,back, top and bottom views. Little bulky from the side. Maybe not as well rounded as a 17, but it was a capable machine in Europe and the Pacific.

[@fredhayes6162]

I have seen the photos many times but never knew the tragic story behind them. Thank you

[@temijinkahn511]

My father was pilot in the 448th Bomb Group on a B24 flying out of Seething airfield in east Anglia. He flew 29 combat missions and was preparing to go to the Pacific theater when Japanese surrendered. I asked him once how he handled the stress of the missions. His answer was chilling “It s easy when you consider yourself already dead”. I remember waking up as a small child hearing him screaming in his sleep. I could hear my mothers muffled voice through the wall we shared as she woke him up. I asked him once a couple of years before he passed away what the screaming was about. He said he had a recurring dream that his plane was going down in flames and he was burning alive trapped in his seat. He had seen his best friend’s plane go down with the cockpit in flames. Rest in peace Dad. I miss you.

[@ARoyalLyon]

My Dad was nursery school age when my Grandfather went off to WWII. He didn't talk about his experiences, but I gathered from my Dad's tales of his childhood that he was a mess for several years after the war. They lived in Basilone Homes in the San Fernando Valley for a time. Pretty sure it was training barracks turned projects for returning vets. Later he went to a couple of weekend retreats hosted by this guy who had radical ideas about therapy and transformation, but stopped going because it was too out-there for Granddad... that man's name was L. Ron Hubbard. By the time I was born in the late 60s, he'd been working as a succesful Radar engineer at Hughes Aircraft.

[@apocalypticweasel9078]

I have visited that airfield you will be pleased to know the tower has been fully restored along with some of the other buildings and a big marble plaque of commemoration is placed here to commemorate those that served. They have open days but it mostly serves small civilian aircraft today and you can take flying lessons there now. Raf Horsham St Faiths also had B24's flying out of it, its now Norwich airport but there is also a museum here to and plaque to commemorate those that served, our city library also has a large section dedicated to the USAF flying missions out of bases in East Anglia the wall is lined with small versions of B24's tail fins from all squadrons serving very nicely done.

[@darrinsiberia]

❤this is hard to comment but i appreciate you sharing your story because 1. my grandpa flew the b24 over 30 missions came back to New York and met my grandma and they had my Dad in 1946 2. my Dad often told me how difficult his childhood was. after the war my Grandpa suffered the same PTSD tried to smother it with alcohol. divorced my Grandma after about ten years of a miserable marriage. 3. my Dad suffered his own version of PTSD and social anxiety as a result. in his 70s it came to haunt him in the form of dementia and Alzheimer's. 4. both my Dad and Grandpa are gone now. i hope theyre all up in Heaven someplsce having a good time together.

[@temijinkahn511]

@darrinsiberia Thank you for your comment. Tens of thousands of vets never really got over their combat experiences. The Eight AirForce suffered more casualties than the US Marine Corps did in the Pacific campaign. My father told me that before the belly tank was invented to extend the range of the fighter cover, you had a one in ten chance to be shot down every mission. At the morning mission briefing, you couldn't help but notice the missing faces. He said you just knew your turn was coming. He said they were told to try to make it to a luftwafe base if you got shot down. They would protect you. The Gestapo would shoot you on the spot and the farmers would hang you.

[@marksauck8481]

When I was young in the 1960s I would pour over many books with incredible photographs of combat in all areas. I remember this particular photo as well as others shot by photographers on these bombers. One showed a B17 above another with a birds eye view of bombs dropped and one falling through the bomber’s wing underneath. These photos showed just how horrifying the air war was back then and it’s something I’ll never forget. These photographers did an amazing job back then.

[@Liberator74]

An amazing insight into the B24s and their crews.

[@pistolpete65]

Hmm I like the B17 but with a crew of 10 compared to a Mosquito with a crew of 2 for the same 4000 LB payload and could out fly almost anything at the time, I would say that the B17 was somewhat of a liability. The B24 had a larger 5000LB payload but still had the same 10 man crew. As for the Norden bomb sight, 1 in 10 bombs landing within 500 ft of the target is not great for precision even for the time. Mosquitoes were used as pathfinders for night raids, laying down incendiary markers for bombers to aim on by flying at a low level ensuring accuracy. The B29 however would be a different matter and opens a different theatre and campaign.

[@dutchhoke6555]

One in ten and similar "data" are popular to downplay the effectiveness of the bombing campaigns, which were nonetheless devastating enough on German war efforts.

[@fonziebulldog5786]

Poor guys. Rest in peace and thanks for what you did.

[@clintonreisig]

A neighbor of mine started as a sergeant waist gunner on a B-17 and later was retrained and promoted to lieutenant navigator / radio man. He served in 1944. Even in '44, he said that there were many losses and he wondered if the 8th Air Force was going to be defeated. He lost a lot of men in his unit and thanked God that he made it. They took tremendous losses in aircraft and wounded and men in his own barracks died every week.

[@davidduley1029]

My uncle was the pilot of a B-24 over Europe during WWII. It always irritated him that the B-17 got most of the glory. He preferred the B-24. One of his recollections was that the B-24 when it touched down stayed down unlike the tail dragger B-17 which would take off again if you weren't careful. I have nothing but the greatest admiration of those bomber crews whether they flew B-17s or B-24s.

[@Suspicious_Trabant]

It never fails to amaze and shock me what bomber crews endured. The randomness of life or death. My Great-Grandfather flew aboard a bomber (Idk which one but he was RAF), and left to train new flight engineers. His plane went down next flight without him on board

[@gavinvalentino6002]

I'm sure he'd be super proud of you for using such disgustingly lazy excuses for words such as "Idk".

[@Conference87]

@@gavinvalentino6002 he'd be less proud of the state the world is in, he'd feel almost like he fought in vain.

[@Suspicious_Trabant]

@@gavinvalentino6002 why u so mad?

[@michaelvalentine4867]

Idk must mean I don't know never hear that before must be new ? Well let's stick to history yes !

[@stevenbass732]

To be honest, as a kid I read about the air war in Europe. I was amazed that those crews could walk around with balls that big.

[@JacobDovale-ts2ct]

Can you imagine losing your wings or tail and falling thousands of feet to you death.. you just sit there, waiting.. until you finally hit the ground and die.

[@ccrider3435]

Incredible Production TJ3 History! Well done indeed.

[@halfboiledegg4519]

I love how you use War Thunder for these videos. Keep it up!

[@bhall4996]

I could just never understand the human courage to do what these brave bomber crews did. They were asked to do what no human should be asked to do. True bravery

[@TheBlackfall234]

I could never understand how dropping bombs unto innocent Civilians can ever be considered Brave. When Americans Genocide People its brave, when Germans do it - its the worst thing ever. Talk about some double Standarts.

[@bhall4996]

@@TheBlackfall234 The difference is one was a war of conquest supported & aided by the civilians to enslave the free world. The other was a desperate war of liberation to free the enslaved & stop the completion of said conquest by any desperate means possible. War is hell

[@TheBlackfall234]

@@bhall4996 Thats the Story weve been told. The World of today proofs that a lie.

[@davefield8100]

Another good picture like this id Little Warrior from the 493 Bomber Group based in Debach, England. My dad was a bombardier in the 493rd. Some of the crew started yelling in the intercom about this hit just as it happened and he looked over his left shoulder and saw the plane in flames and out of control. He did not talk much about casualties in the Group, but this is one of the couple he would discuss a little.

[@edstein5642]

It’s fascinating to get the story behind a famous photo. I’ve seen it all my life & had no idea.

[@mikenorton632]

My uncle flew both B-17's and B-24's during the was and said that the B-17 was like flying a Cadillac, that it almost flew itself! But the B-24 was like driving a Mack truck, that he had to constantly fight with the controls, and returned from every mission exhausted!

[@MikeT-TheRetiredColonel]

Kudos to your uncle, I guess it's better to be exhausted and alive than rested and dead :/

[@nickmitsialis]

Exactly. B24s were hard to keep in formation--and a 'loose/bad' formation attracted interceptors===apparently German ground controllers and 'airborne' station keepers could pick out a crappy formation (and a lack of escorts) and deploy their forces accordingly.

[@stephenkalatucka6213]

The B-17 when hit, looked like a wounded eagle. The B-24 would fly apart like a Chinese motorcycle.

[@mikenorton632]

@@stephenkalatucka6213 or as my uncle called it 750,000 pieces flying in loose formation!

[@lylegleason6844]

My dad flew in B-24's late in the war, and got in 6 missions, (2 over Berlin!) before VE day. He said that the 24 was a much better bomber than the 17. It could fly higher, faster, farther, and with a bigger payload. It was, however, more fragile, and could be shot down easier. The 17, being the 'prettier' plane, got all the positive press. Nobody ever called the 24 a beauty!

[@raggs2007]

My father was a pilot who started out on the B-17 and then the B-24. Later in the war he went to the Pacific and flew B-29's. I still have his Logs. The B-24 had the majority of his flight time. However his favorite to fly was the B-17.

[@erictaylor5462]

1:00 Also developing the B-29 and the amazing B-36. While the B-36 was not ready in time for the war, it did live up to its nickname, the Peacekeeper. A plane with 10 engines altogether. 6 piston and 4 jets. Thou the jets were only used for takeoff.

[@derekrusso6069]

Wow 134k congratulations! I remember when you were at a few thousand subs. I used to watch all your livestreams during online school lol. Keep going Tj!

[@CodyFreemanOutdoors]

My grandfather was in the 451st. Would love to learn more about that bomber group

[@milsurprifleguy7091]

My wife’s uncle was in the US Army Airforce as a photographer . If I remember correctly from his discharge papers he was in from 1943 -1945 , based out of Guam . I have some of his aerial photographers of target acquisition , bombing runs and damage assessment of Japan . Also ground photos . I do have the USS Missouri in Tokyo Bay on September 2nd , 1945 , plus on deck with the US officials , with the desk for signing the surrender documents , but none of the Japanese officials

[@justincooper5189]

Did he ever cover the last flight of the devil plane? It was a B17, tail number 666. Most heavily armed B17 in the Pacific,if not ever built. If I remember correctly, the whole crew died and it was because of a superstitious commander not wanting to escort the plane on its mission. Makes me hope he got charged with dereliction of duty for that crap.

[@milsurprifleguy7091]

@@justincooper5189 not that I know of , or seen in any of the photographs that I have of his

[@wolfdestiny2519]

You used the DDay footage we shot last stream! Another great vid, thanks TJ.

[@stevenewman1393]

😉👍Very nicely well done and very well informatively explained and executed indeed 👌.

[@dovidell]

A classic case of " there but for the grace of God go I "

[@johnmcmickle5685]

That late in the war I am surprised they did not have P-51's and P-47's that could take them all the way to the target.

[@larryolandese7917]

My dad was in the 466th BG Attlebridge England ... A great man from the greatest generation ... God bless them all

[@rickadelmann9478]

My dad, Adolph Adelmann, was a bombardier on a B-24 and part of the 15th Air Force, 456 Bomber group. He flew out of Cerignola, Italy. On his 25th mission, in May, 1944, his bomber was shoot down over Austria. He was able to bail out to spend the last year of the war as a POW.

[@keving1318]

B-24 has always been my favorite WWII Bomber. It is horribly underrated.

[@dukecraig2402]

Yes it is, and despite the age old narrative that the B17 could absorb more punishment and get more guys home it's simply a myth. One of the ways it got started was researchers figured a good way to compare the two was by looking at the early 8th Air Force results from when they'd fly missions with mixed B17's and B24's, on it's surface it seems like a good way to compare the two when it comes to survivability but it's actually highly flawed for a reason. B24's could fly a little faster than B17's but B17's could fly a little higher, as a result when they had mixed missions they'd have all the B17's up front since being slower they'd have to set the pace, and since they flew a little higher that meant that the B24's were not only at the back but also around 2,000 ft lower. Any WW2 fighter pilot would tell you that "Tail end Charlie" was always the best aircraft to attack, and since B24's were at the back they already had the disadvantage of not having the interlocking fire of defensive guns from bombers behind them, that was made even worse by the fact that they were flying 2,000 ft lower than the rest of the bombers denying them even that much more benefits of interlocking defensive gun fire. After a while the 8th Air Force caught on to what was happening and why they were losing a disproportionate amount of B24's compared to B17's and quit mixing the two, but early aviation writer's doing research to compare the survivability of B24's to B17's didn't know that, they just figured the two bombers being on the same mission would be a good comparison when it came to survivability. Last year I read an article written by a guy who went over all that and other things that led to the myth of B17's being more survivable than B24's, he did an exhaustive study that took him over a year to complete and his math came out to the B24 being about 1% away from the B17 in the survivability category, it's like he said in summary 1% is easily inside of any kind of standard deviation for a study as complex as the one he did and that his conclusion is that neither one was more survivable than the other. That being said however the B17 overall was the better of the two for the simple reason that it was a more stable platform and would put more of it's bombs on target, however the B24 could carry slightly more bombs on the same mission so destructive power evens out in the end, but since the B17 could do the same with less the edge goes to it, but not by much.

[@jpmtlhead39]

Because is Ugly as hell.

[@keving1318]

@@dukecraig2402 WOW thanks for that fantastic response!

[@keving1318]

@@jpmtlhead39 Ugly is in the eye of the beholder. I think she is a beautiful a/c!

[@philvanderlaan5942]

As aircrew I would prefer the Flying Fortress as a commander I would probably prefer liberators. Actually no! I would prefer SBDs as their airfields are mobile.

[@jamesholden6142]

B-17 bases were closer to London than B-24 bases. As most of the press was based in London, it was a closer trip to go to the B-17 bases and therefore B-17s got the most pic and stories

[@bad74maverick1]

And B24's were the first to complete 25 missions not B17's. B-24D "Hot Stuff" of the 330th Bomb Squadron, 93d Bomb Group, 8th Air Force was the first bomber even though she was attached with the Memphis Belle, the Belle got the story.

[@nickmitsialis]

In more ways than one: Most B24 units were attached to the 15th airforce in Italy. Southern Italy was a pretty 'dreary' place==no night life like in London. The B24 had longer range, sure, but if the books by Donald Caldwell on the luftwaffe fighter force were any indication, the 'Liberator' had a few weak points: it was very hard to fly in a tight box formation (it was said that if you just trim the 'Fort', it would pretty much stay that way) so pilots found it very fatiguing--the further into the mission, the more the formations would loosen. Also, apparently it had a lower operational ceiling (which just happened to be right in the prime altitude for the FW 190). Finally it was not as resistant to battle damage. So you combine lower ceiling and sloppy formation, it was always a magnet for German fighters. That being said, The B24 was very useful in the Pacific theater due to its long range and very useful in the struggle against the Uboats.

[@theochoateam3760]

Thank you for such a well done video!

[@raymondvia3786]

My late uncle flew B-17s from England with the 379th Bomb Group. He asked a B-24 pilot a question, and he said he had been raised on a farm doing hard work, but flying a B-24 gave him all he could handle which is paraphrased.

[@mikek7283]

those poor boys .rest in peace.

[@garyfindlay5503]

The emotions going through that crew on their way back must have been overwhelming.

[@rolandoscar1696]

Excellent visuals, as usual.

[@rickyhenry4958]

One of your best yet!

[@philipmason3218]

I'm always extremely humbled by the dedication, bravery and duty exhibited by these men. We owe them a debt which can never be repaid. Thanks for a very interesting video.

[@brianliggett9087]

we can go a long way to repaying that debt by being a good person , and ensure our children become good responsible adults , and enjoy the life, the sacrifice of these wonderful brave men made possible .

[@philipmason3218]

@brianliggett9087 Thank you for replying. I have a grown up daughter, she's been brought up to respect others and to enjoy her life. Looking at some of the kids these days, it's unbelievable to think just how young these crews were. Good health to you and your family 🇬🇧.

[@TerentiiTaras]

I was once given a ride by a WWII vet who flew in a B-24 out of Italy. He told me about a mission he was on toward the end of the war, in which a single Liberator was lost after it was hit in the nose by flak. Not long after VE Day, he was hitchhiking home in the US and got a ride from a middle-aged couple who noticed the 15th AF patch on his shoulder. They told him their son was a bombardier on a B-24 in the same outfit as his, but he had been listed as MIA ever since the day that one Liberator was shot down. The guy giving me my ride knew instantly that their son had been killed, but couldn't bring himself to tell them he'd watched him die.

[@jameswoodbury2806]

A good video. My father-in-law flew in a B-24. He told me that the aviation fuel vapors got so bad that the bomb doors had to soetimes be opened to prevent the bomber from exploding. He also had earlier flown in his first love an A-10. The plane was so agle, fast and heavy armed with nose machine guns, that he pilot would dog fight and shot down an emeny fighter(s). The A-10(s) would do skip bombing against enemy vessels. A-10s also bombed the tunnels of C.orregidor by first going into dive and pull verically to drop a bomb down one of the tunnels.

[@michaelmartin5632]

I talked to a small quiet guy named Bob. Told me that he had been in B24 Liberators over Italy: more than one. Shot down twice: I tried to imagine how anyone could have gotten me back into a bomber after going down the first time.

[@tootired76]

A Marine on Tarawa had a better chance of surviving combat than an 8th Air Force crew member!!

[@1pcfred]

Everyone in the whole war had a better chance to survive than an airman in the US 8th. The 8th lost 80% even Germans in U boats only suffered 75% losses. The guys flying all knew the odds too. They were all dead men walking.

[@DaveSCameron]

Wasn't there one or two Great British 2 and 4 engine heavy bombers , also fought a couple of years longer than the USAAF?

[@amerigo88]

British four engined, strategic bombers were primarily the Avro Lancaster and Handley Page Halifax. Earlier examples included the Short Stirling. Two engined, medium bombers early in the war were the Handley Page Hampden, Bristol Blenheim, and the full war's length Vickers Wellington. You could throw in the later war DeHavilland Mosquito light bomber and popular American imports like the Douglas Boston light bomber and Matin Baltimore. The Avro Manchester was a bust, but was developed from a two engined disappointment to the four engined Lancaster of the Dam Busters fame. I left out some others as these are all I can recall without looking online .

[@1pcfred]

The cowardly British only did night area bombardments.

[@amerigo88]

@@1pcfred The cowardly Germans targeted military targets until late August 1940, then only civilian targets for the rest of the war. They started with daylight bombing of London, but Coventry was burnt out in a night raid. Liverpool, Manchester, Portsmouth , and the other cities were hammered at night in The Blitz until German attention shifted to Eastern Europe to begin the invasion of the USSR. Twin engines bombers, Jabos, and then the V-1 and V-2 tickets were delivered by cowards through the end of the war. What was sauce for the goose, was also sauce for the gander. Besides , the bombing of Nuremberg in late 1943 went terribly wrong for Bomber Command and they lost a whopping 94 bombers in a single night versus the worst American loss of 60 bombers on the Schweinfurt-Regensberg raid of October 1943. Don't forget the cowardly Zeppelin raids on British cities in WW1 and the German battle cruisers shelling seaside towns with 11 inch naval rifles on multiple occasions . The World Wars were not fought by the rules of the Earl of Queensbury.

[@1pcfred]

@@amerigo88 remind me who declared an unjust war on whom?

[@peterrebelwithoutamenopaus6962]

​@1pcfred Idiot. From mid 44 to 45 it was more dangerous night bombing over Europe. German nightfighters using radar guidance and upward firing cannon brought down more British heavy bombers than the US bombers in daylight. One German ace brought down 7 Lancasters in less than 30 minutes. By then the US bombers were escorted to Berlin by Anglo American Mustangs. Fancy calling them cowards. British had a tour of 30 missions and many did 2 or up to 4 missions. More RAF died than Americans bombing Europe, admittedly they served longer. But of course they ALL were heroes, both RAF, USAAF and many other nationalities who died, including the German and Soviet airmen.

[@lawrencejohanson5178]

My 22 year old second cousin PO Phillip Matthews went down in a Halifax Bomber along with four other Canadians on a training mission in Northern England in 1942.They were to go on their first mission over Germany within a week.He is buried in Ripon England in a Canadian military cemetery.

[@gindaburra]

My son sadly said, "I bet he never stopped dreaming about it." That moved me as well. My boy's alright. RIP crews.