How Are Seat Belt Laws Legal? Ep. 5.468

[@ThatEEguy2818]

I remember when they first came out with this law. "The seat belt law will never be a primary offense, " - every lying politician at the time

[@Big_Old_Dog]

in Massachusetts we have what's called the initiative petition where the people can directly make and repeal laws. We repealed the mandatory seat belt law in the 80s and the corrupt politicians just waited a decade or so and passed it again. We only think we're free people.

[@Big_Old_Dog]

@@Finn-McCool It's that kind of attitude that makes becoming a slave to the State even possible.

[@yellowyellowyellow7894]

@@Big_Old_Dog cololocololocone cone cone cone.. Colololoolocone

[@JayKayKay7]

I knew an EMT guy from Dallas who told me he never cut a dead body out of a car wreck wearing a seat belt. I rode a motorcycle for many years. Two old phrases come to mind. Dress for the crash, not the ride and wearing anything other than a helmet is just wishful thinking. I am a retired gas passer who eventually realized that if every body did what they were supposed to, I wouldn't have any work. The other side of the coin is we are not free to f*ck up, than were are not free at all. The problem is nobody wants to own and live with their mistakes.

[@toadamine]

He hasn't seen many car wrecks then... I've seen it a few times just driving tow truck for a year...

[@rs232killer]

At 2:12 you state "Motorcyclists will tell you that should have the right to not wear a motorcycle helmet." While, yes, SOME motorcyclists will tell you that, it is also the case that many motorcyclists will also tell you that you are a complete idiot if you ride on the street without a helmet.

[@adamhixon]

I've found not wearing a seat belt to be very profitable. When I get pulled over for speeding and I'm wearing a seatbelt, the cop writes me a speeding ticket. If I'm not wearing a seatbelt he usually writes a seatbelt ticket and gives a warning for the speeding.

[@jefftullius]

There's been quite a few accidents here in Georgia where the only people killed are the ones ejected from the vehicle. The ones that survived in the accident were the ones wearing seat belts.

[@MagentaRV]

As a first responder, I can tell you that the cost to society is much greater from people who survive from seatbelt use than those who die from non-use.

[@adamlynch9153]

I care about my family and myself before society thank you. I advocate for seatbelt wearing. I don’t advocate for it being the law.

[@danielle8557]

exactly right because we're back on the road,crazier than ever

[@SuperEndiku]

When you go down a "cost to society" argument, you can ultimately eliminate people with handicaps. That's also logical and has a cost to society. Of course, it's also evil. Maybe not to the benevolent dictator who thinks he is saving humanity by culling the weak. Don't run into these problems when you simply stick to what is ethical. It's not ethical for one person to tell another how to live when that second person has no direct effect on you.

[@progenderrole1329]

BASED MF

[@noahmosher6381]

These laws interfere with the right to travel. Through the windshield.

[@ednolan3355]

I didn’t start to wear seat belts until I was in my mid 30s. I had small children and wanted them to wear seat belts so I started to wear them. So far they have saved me from death or serious injury twice. The last time I ended up hanging by my seatbelt upside down on the freeway after losing a tire at 65 MPH. When stuff happens that seatbelt instantaneously becomes your very best friend.

[@KevinCollins2157]

The other thing that is hypocritical and I'm sure it has been mentioned is School Buses are not mandated by many states because they are deemed safe if over 10,000lbs because of there size , smaller buses are mandated (NHTASA) but I must wear a seat belt in our work trucks (dumps, roll offs, flatbeds) which are from 12,000 to over 26,000lbs makes sense to me. NOT!!!

[@PipeDaddy907]

How do you get the government to pay your medical bills? Could have saved me a couple grand last year

[@kimberlysteller2556]

Oh,I am sorry but that privilege is reserved for illegal aliens. You are probably one of those toxic males that i have heard about. Ha ha

[@cmlxjcky]

Don't give them your name

[@johnrice1943]

Don't damage a taxable unit.

[@randallabracadabra]

Motorcyclist are not required to wear seat belts, so that's how you know it's not about safety when a cop riding a motor cycle gives you a ticket for driving a car without wearing yours.

[@easternwoods4378]

If you go rock climbing and fall there's a lot of people that have to risk their lives to recover you or your body

[@vernadkins1673]

Wearing a seatbelt in car by state law that exempts bus passengers. Including school buses. Contradictory law seems like.

[@mr.h5436]

20% of drivers aren't wearing seatbelts. Seems crazy. Anti-Seatbelt/helmet law advocates concentrate on the catastrophic accident. Safety gear keeps minor incidents from becoming terrible accidents every day. So a bug or pothole doesn't lead to hurting others and the operator. I do see some buses with seat belts now.

[@MrTruckerf]

Eventually buses will also have restraints. It is happening now.

[@Slinkygal]

I also cannot understand the logic of no seatbelts on buses, especially school buses, but I hope you're right about the move to add them.

[@boataxe4605]

It’s simple, the insurance industry doesn’t loose enough money on bus crashes to make bribing lawmakers profitable. And the bus industry has its own lobbyists who bribe lawmakers to keep them from being required. Hell, in the city I live in you are allowed to ride the bus standing up!

[@yepnope4309]

After fighting for what felt like an eternity to cut myself free from a seatbelt in my burning truck, I refuse to wear a seatbelt. I've also lost a close friend to a car wreck and he was wearing a seatbelt but his passenger wasn't and she walked away with minor injuries. Every situation is different so to those saying they will save your life are only lying to themselves. And how anyone can think a police officer and his current victim sitting on the side of the road for a seatbelt is somehow safer than allowing the driver to continue driving at his own risk needs to get their head examined. Also seems mighty hypocritical for the police who don't wear seatbelts to ticket us for not wearing them. Yep, definitely about the money and chipping away at our rights as free human beings.

[@davidwexler1745]

I hear you on that. I wonder, if someone got hurt through Forced compliance if the state could be held liable?

[@danielle8557]

so true !

[@johnclarke2814]

C.S. Lewis
�Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.�

[@boataxe4605]

He was perfectly on point!

[@doctorthee]

At what point does the insurance argument work though? Do we ban smoking or even fast-food because we end up paying for others' insurance?

[@isabellahobbs2125]

hopefully

[@chefzak6505]

You give an inch, they take a mile. Look at the lockdown and mask mandates, done to "protect you, the people."

[@pinkpinkpink7717]

Come in between the lions

[@hapnewsom9217]

I have a neighbor who never wears a seatbelt, nor did she require her children to belt up when they were young...I don't know if they wear them now that they are grown and on their own, but she still refuses...she's had MANY tickets for this over the years and her comment about the whole issue is "I can afford the tickets, so I'm going to do what I want to do"....hard to argue with that attitude.

[@mr.h5436]

If she causes harm to others due to loss of control, I doubt she would support an eye for an eye ruling.

[@zero32700]

If you're over 18 here in New Hampshire you don't have to wear a seatbelt. Live free or die. Lol

[@Cryptonymicus]

If you DO have insurance, who pays your million dollar medical bills? EVERYBODY ELSE WHO PAYS INSURANCE!!!

[@brucegillingham2793]

Yes but they pay that voluntarily further more the insurance company could have a disclaimer that says your not covered medically if you don't wear your seat belt. Many life insurance companies wont cover you if you do high risk activities such as sky diving or rock climbing.

[@Eric-rz2xb]

If economic burden to society is the valid argument should we be allowed to grow old?

[@Big_Old_Dog]

That's exactly where this is leading. Wait until they control your medical care...

[@CanItAlready]

Eric Not even close the same thing. Growing old is unavoidable.

[@mtpocketswoodenickle2637]

Eric, If slip and falls are the leading cause of injuries in the United States, why don't the rocket scientist in the Legislature just pass a law making it illegal?

[@sparkzbarca]

@@CanItAlready it is the same thing. It's just not relevant. First off because it would be depriving you of life. Secondly because it wouldn't make you more safe just less burdensome And thirdly because we just wouldn't allow it. We could outlaw many things on safety and get away with it if we wished. No one is going to vote to die early and kill Grandma.

[@sparkzbarca]

@@mtpocketswoodenickle2637 they actually have in some ways. Things like mandating proper signage when a public surface is wet. That's a real law to reduce slip and fall. Which you felt was absurd but which legislation exists and probably has stopped some slips

[@briceyokem9236]

A few things - I knew a gal who had a car with an air bag. She bumped into a lamp post on the side of her bumper which the system interpreted as an accident and activated the air bag. It gave her whiplash and she spent months in therapy. She said to me the doctors told her she would never be entirely 'right'. Motorcycle helmets add extra mass to the head which put strain on the neck. No minor motorcycle accidents? I had one in a parking lot where I turned too fast and fell to the ground, got a scrape on my hip, got up and rode off. Had another one where driver pulled out in front of me causing me to spill. The motorbike needed repair, but I came through unscathed. The driver and his insurance settled the matter. I suspect attorneys like you only get involved when there is a serious matter, so only see the bad wrecks.

[@manknownonlyasjeff7106]

I remember the governor saying no one will ever be pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt. Give the govenor an Harumpf.

[@myutube6422]

Since I survived 2 multiple rollover accidents because of the seatbelts, I use mine, law or no law. If you all remember Gary Bussy(sp) fought the helmet law until he cracked his head against a curb, and it's evident that he still has issues because of it. You fall off a mountain and it's our tax dollars that rescues you, So far you can skydive without a parachute, but only once.

[@kimberlysteller2556]

Live and Learn

[@lmordin]

Why doesn't the government ban everything that can potentially harm other then? Smoking, drinking, cars as a whole, electricity, factory jobs, gasoline, etc. The list of dangerous things in life is endless, and with this idea being so broad the government can literally outlaw anything that they want to. We are meant to be free sovereign citizens that govern ourselves.

[@adamlynch9153]

it’s all about insurance. It’s super corrupt. Notice how new cars will freak out if you don’t have your seatbelt on yet they’ll let you drive over 100 miles per hour with no warning.

[@vorpalweapon4814]

because jobs drinking and smoking make the people who pay politicians money. the other stuff is kinda needed and the modern age cannot exist without it.

[@richlaue]

Back in the 60's you could buy after market Seat Belts. My father installed them in the family car. When advantage of wearing seat belts is that they hold you in place and makes it easier to stay in control of the car, and possibly avoiding the accident.

[@randomvideosn0where]

With bucket seats much less so, but on bench seats definitely an advantage.

[@MichaelDubenetsky]

I've always found it amazing that I can get in trouble not wearing a seatbelt which "if" I get into an accident I"may" be seriously injured or die, yet I can buy cigarettes which will affect my health and most likely the health of others near me. I figure it's just a way the government and insurance companies can make increased coin off of me.

[@mr.h5436]

You can't fix stupid but they keep trying. :)

[@orientmaple7254]

That's not even comparable they're bad but cigarettes are a slow burn you're not going to smoke a cigarette one day and instantly die or suffer a crippling you would have to be doing it for a while at least injury 1 cigarettes not going to kill you one car accident might and it has a higher chance of doing so without a seatbelt

[@antoniobarnes694]

I feel like it’s all a double standard it has nothing to do with keeping us safe if it did people wouldn’t be allowed to go bungie jumping or sky diving it’s all a injury risk. If riding with no seatbelt is illegal then make it all illegal. Taxes is going up anyway and it’s all going somewhere I can tell you exactly where it’s going in there pockets. Of course they’d rather not put the money into people’s injuries. But the likely hood of someone driving without a seatbelt is more likely than someone jumping off a mountain so they’ll make more money giving tickets for that. Plus it’s a control thing

[@clarkgabriel427]

Seat belts on (ALL) airplanes, but no seat belts on (Greyhound, et.al.) buses or long-distance (i.e. Amtrak) and commuter trains? Which mode of transportation is actually safest, and should have seat belts? Also, how do you justify no seat belts on school buses? These are driven by part-time (usually geriatric) persons. Inconsistency in our state / federal transportation laws, based on which lobbyists doles out enough money to our elected officials.

[@danielle8557]

It's all about control, they just wanna tell us what we have to do and where.

[@tonydesaire9326]

IF I get in a wreck, and IF I'm injured, and IF those injuries are extensive, and IF I don't have insurance, and IF frogs had wings.

[@rangersmith4652]

You think this will only happen to someone else? Remember that to every other driver on the planet, YOU are someone else.

[@sippigrrrl]

I know this is just my opinion, and you know the saying… But, it was September 4, 2015, and I was involved in a car accident where I still am beyond amazed that I survived. I was on the freeway and a car drifted into my lane while it was beside the front part of my car. I hit the brakes, but they locked up and sent the car into a skid that was impossible to get out of, and I had no room - there was no shoulder on my right, and two lanes of traffic on my left. I went up the jersey barrier, and the car was high enough to where it came back down on the roof and the A pillar collapsed completely - this was a 1998 Mustang. When the car came to rest, I was facing the oncoming traffic, blocking two of the three lanes, screaming my lungs out, with a literal hole in my forehead!! If I hadn’t been wearing my seatbelt, I would have, without a doubt, been crushed UNDER the car! A detective from the NOPD happened upon the car (traffic was completely stopped, I’m told), and she called 911 and sat and talked with me until the ambulance came and she followed us to the hospital. She called my DH and told him that I’d “had a little accident, and that he needed come to the hospital.” I don’t remember anything about this day, despite the fact that I was awake and able to speak (even though I bit through both of my lips upon impact) and I even made sense. I had 7 surgeries to sorta put my face back together. One third of my face is now made of 3D-printed implants made of polyether ether ketone that were made in Germany, they replaced my shattered cheekbones, blown out eye sockets, and the big hole in my skull above my eyes. Yes, my various surgeries ended up being a total of 37 days in the hospital and 43 hours in surgery, at a cost that was more that $1M but less than $2M. I still cringe when I drive by the spot where my car scraped the jersey barrier while it was starting to do its acrobatics, and the marks still look fresh. PLEASE, I understand not wanting to wear your seatbelt, but I am living proof that yes, SEATBELTS CAN and DO SAVE LIVES!!

[@KayFabe87]

Preface: I always wear a seat belt. I agree that traveling at high rates of speed without a seat belt is more dangerous to the person who chooses not to wear the seat belt, so it is wise to buckle up when driving at high speeds. That being said; seatbelt laws have simply become an additional revenue source for most states under the guise of altruism. Not wearing a seat belt used to be a secondary violation as opposed to primary violation in most states (i.e. you could not be pulled over simply because you were not wearing a seat belt unless you had committed an additional traffic violation), but the municipalities realized that they were leaving a lot of money on the table. I understand the safety argument when driving on a highway, but if one is simply driving through town at 20 MPH, from stop sign to stop sign, the likelihood of a collision that will launch a belt-less driver through a window is minuscule to no-existent. New Hampshire does not require adults to wear a seat belt.

[@richardgates7479]

2 days of comments and you're the only one to get the actual point.

[@AbuMubarak]

Steve, that was not a legal argument. it was a social argument. His question was why is it the govt has the RIGHT to dictate seat belt considering it is within his vehicle, and it doesnt improve nor deter his driving ability According to your argument, cigarettes, sugar, aspertame, etc should equally be controlled and outlawed by govt Why is are seatbelt laws the worst thing? Because they began a social experiment of govt controlling our behavior within our personal spaces

[@stevelehto]

"cigarettes, sugar, aspertame" are all controlled by the government. (They are not "outlawed" any more than cars are outlawed.)

[@JJ-oj1ri]

@@stevelehto controlled, but citezens aren't fined for abusing or misusing these substances... As we we are with seatbelts

[@extraacct478]

If seatbelts are required then explain this: I run a red light and hit a car. You are wearing a seatbelt and get minor injuries, I get a ticket. BUT I run a red light and you do NOT have a belt on and you die. I get charged with negligent homicide. Completely different charges for ME because of YOUR choice to disobey the law.

[@tbthedozer]

Don’t you run the risk of killing someone every time you run a red light? Just asking? There are visual impaired pedestrians, passengers where the impact will be their head on your grill through the window....

[@extraacct478]

Tony Bjorklund Of course. In fact shouldn’t I the be charged with reckless endangerment every single time I run a red light? Or speed? Etc.

[@TimothySielbeck]

My problem with seat-belt laws in the US is they are used as another excuse for the local authorities to extract more money from people in lieu of raising taxes. When I was stationed in Germany, in the early eighties, we were told that it was required of us to wear seat belts. If we did not, and then were involved in an accident that was not our fault, we could have any potential monetary damages awarded to us reduced because we didn't take every precaution to mitigate our injuries.

[@gregtheegg3576]

That makes sense.

[@richardjafrate5124]

Steve, as you say, wearing a seatbelt is usually safer than not wearing. Which means sometimes it is safer to not wear a seatbelt. All the seatbelt does is concentrate the force of impact along the length of the belt, rather than distributing it more evenly across a larger area of the body. Every once in a while stories crop up where someone dies from injuries caused by a seatbelt. One such incident occurred, I believe, in Northern Virginia, many years ago. A family was in a slow speed accident, most of the people were uninjured except for gradma who was riding in the back seat. The seatbelt ruptured her spleen and she did on the spot. It's not the proper role of government (or moral in any way) to decide who gets to live and who must die. Suppose there was a magic pill that would prevent most cases of cancer but would cause some smaller number of people to die who would not have otherwise develop cancer. How would you feel Steve, if a man with a gun showed up and forced you to take the pill? You explain that there is no history of cancer in your family, that you are healthy, you are at a very low risk for cancer, and you've had family members die from taking the pill. The G-man steps back and draws his gun and states that your death is cheaper for insurance companies and/or the government than treatment for any cancer that may develop. Another issue is who decides what is safer or more healthy. For almost two decades the federal gov mandated school cafeteria design their offerings according to the now discredited food pyrmid. Basically kids were fed very little meat and dairy mostly high carbohydrate load foods such as potatoes, pizza, pasta, etc. Years later they wondered why kids turned out obese diabetics at 16 years. Oh! Now that the damage is done they change their minds. IMHO it's immoral to force someone to make a decision for which they have no consequence or accountability.

[@pinkyb.7398]

vaccines

[@lswinney1000]

The problem is that these laws that keep creeping into our private lives do start snowballing. How soon will it be before the "exercise police" start coming by our homes, requiring us to do 30 minutes of exercise a day because people who do exercise are healthier and costs everyone else less money. If you can't prove you that did exercises then you get fined. If I decide not to do exercises, that's my risk and nobody else's as long as I have health insurance. Does that sound preposterous and that could never happen in America? I work construction and on most jobs I'm required to do exercises for 15 minutes before work. I know that's because of the insurance company requirement for the contractor, but once these things get started they have a way of creeping into our private lives.

[@nathangillen721]

Without a seat belt I would not be here today to enjoy your videos. Keep up the good work Steve, thumbs up from Australia.

[@mspeagle2]

The only true reason for seat belt laws under public safety is income generation for state and local gov. Next they will be monitoring your vehicles speed remotely and just sending tickets to you in the mail. Oh, wait they already do that with traffic cams set up or adjusted to generate income the same way.

[@dannytravis7118]

I've said before that I'm a truck driver. what was the big reason for seatbelts are to keep the driver at the controls. it's really hard to drive when you're face first in the floorboards on the passenger side. I have have witnessed the after effects of accidents and seen where people killed because they got flung from a car. to the naysayers I say it's the law, it's a good law. wear your seatbelt and get over it. just thinking about it I had a 1990 mercury topaz with automatic seatbelts and you didn't really have a choice.

[@adambohm4367]

How does bank bailouts forced on me not harm me?

[@scotthedrick2460]

Under what authority did the government bail out the banks in the first place?

[@Reno_Slim]

I think anyone should have the right to opt out of any mandatory personal safety requirements so long as they have a standing DNR.

[@raphidae]

There are other costs you missed, costs that are arguably *much* *more* important: The cost imposed on the first responders' (Police, FD, EMT) mental health. In the EU this is the primary justification for making seat belts (and on cars produced after a certain year, airbags) mandatory. Every time first responders arrive at a major accident, it's traumatic to them (if they're not psychopaths). The scope of the trauma is not easily quantifiable (and it differers per person), but it can be shown definitively from statistics that the less severe the injuries/trauma they encounter in the line of duty are, the less impact their work has on their mental health. This becomes clearer when looked at averages over a longer time span (like a year). Making seat belts mandatory in the EU had a direct causal effect on the mental health of first responders that was positive and statistically significant. When seat belts were made mandatory in the EU, there was a drop of (from memory) something like 20% in first responders being unable to continue to work, or having to retire early, due to PTSD and related mental issues the following year, and another 10% (so 30%, less relative to pre-seatbelt law) the year after that, and then it stabilised again. This correlation has been seen everywhere seat belts were made mandatory. Together with other evidence, this correlation has been shown to be a causal relation. Later, when airbags were made mandatory equipment on new cars, there was another, albeit much smaller, drop. And this agrees with common sense too. Obviously when a first responder arrives it's going to impact them less when you're alive and walking around, but just bruised where the belt held you in your seat than when they arrive they see someone's brain matter splattered all over the windshield, or when they have pull your blood-soaked body from the car, do CPR on you, etc.. Especially when there's also two children in the back seat. Then there are the effects on the mental health of the secondary care providers (doctors, surgeons, nurses) that take care of you after you've been delivered to the hospital (ER, ICU, etc.). These are humans too, so the less trauma they have to experience, the better for them, and as an extension, for society in general. There's even a tertiary effect still, as people that have experienced a traumatic accident (and possibly subsequent revalidation etc.) usually require therapy to deal with their traumatic experience. Psychologists and psychiatrists that have to listen to people's traumas regularly develop so-called "secondary PTSD" (aka "Compassion Fatigue" or "Vicarious Trauma"), just from listening to their patients (as humans are compassionate and emphatic beings). See: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secondary_trauma www.scientificamerican.com/article/post-traumatic-stress-disorder-can-be-contagious/ www.tendacademy.ca/warning-signs-of-vicarious-traumasecondary-traumatic-stress-and-compassion-fatigue/ Here too, less trauma means less impact on people other than the direct victim. Instead of a mental health professional having to listen to the horrific details and also horrific dreams, panic attacks, etc. from someone that was in a car accident over and over for years, the person in the accident may not even need any therapy at all had they worn their seatbelt. This last category includes the direct victim's family (spouse, children) and possibly even extended family that would have to deal with this (second, or third hand) trauma. The spouse and/or child(ren) may even need therapy themselves even if they weren't even involved in the accident themselves. So "no cost on others"? Provably false. So false, in fact, that people making the argument that wearing a seatbelt or not only impacts themselves must not have thought it through very well (or at all).

[@johnr9579]

Terrence Koeman thank you for you statement that many failed to think about.

[@Slinkygal]

Yes, thanks for your added wisdom.

[@norezenable]

Just to be clear, it has to do with money not safety.

[@charleswendt4868]

actually I started wearing seat belts the first time I buckled my child in the car seat. That made me think beyond myself.

[@firemanjeff911]

1.As a firefighter /EMT I very much appreciate seat belts and helmets. The aftermath is different. 2. I've seen more than one accident where the driver was shifted out of position causing a complete loss of control.

[@brucegillingham2793]

The law is never one size fits all. A friend of mine is alive today because he was not wearing his seat belt while driving his semi truck. Another driver fell asleep and went left of center on the highway had my friend been belted in he would have remained in the driver seat that was completely obliterated. When first responders arrived they assumed he was dead due to the total destruction of the drivers side of the vehicle only by a miracle he was able to get to the passenger side of the vehicle.

[@firemanjeff911]

Yeah, I've heard stories like this, but never witnessed one. That is not how it usually works out. Couldn't even tell you how many times I've seen it go exactly opposite. My main point was that the decision to wear or not wear a seat belt can affect other people.

[@ernestcastillo8473]

i live in a Texas border town, and i used to work illegally in matamoros, Mexico across the Rio Grande river from my town. At the time i was working in mexico, Texas did not have a seatbelt law. But talking with my health insurance agent, he told me, that if i were ever involved in an auto accident in mexico and my car was still able to move, i should drive away because in mexico both parties are guilty of the accident. So driving into mexico, i would put my seatbelt on, because if i wrecked, and my car was driveable, but i had been hurt...i would not be able to drive back, so i would buckle up. Once i was back in the U.S. i would take it off. BUT i kid you not, after about two weeks, i would AUTOMATICALLY buckle up....even if i was not go to mexico. Force of habit.

[@johnd1680]

There are plenty of states with no helmet laws, but enforce seat belt laws. Seems very ironic, it's a revenue generator plain and simple.

[@rangersmith4652]

It's much simpler and less nefarious that that. States without helmet laws have experienced an organized and well-resourced campaign against them.

[@jebediahkerman8245]

I think you can make this argument as soon as tobacco smoking, overeating, binge drinking, boxing, MMA, American football and automobile racing all become illegal. Until then, lobbying is the real reason laws get made or not made. Money.

[@SolGuy42]

Proper control of a vehicle requires use of the steering wheel and a couple of foot controls. If you are flopping around the interior trying to grab anything, you have no chance to survive.

[@wilhelmkirkpatrick]

I can get a ticket for not using my seatbelt in a car but there is no issue with me standing on a bus going 65 mph on the highway.

[@DENicholsAutoBravado]

That can't stop feeling weird for me... busses - no seat belts...HUH!??

[@rossswenson532]

Part of the reason is physics. Example a subcompact hits a SUV over twice it's mass, who gets hurt more...the subcompact. A bus weighs much more than most vehicle's. The bus occupant is unharmed, the driver in the crushed subcompact is rushed to the ER.

[@Kaynine3]

@@rossswenson532 OK, so if the answer is physics, then why should I wear my seatbelt if I am going only 30 miles an hour? Also, I guess you haven't read about all those bus accidents where dozens of people have been killed, have you?

[@rossswenson532]

@@Kaynine3 Yes I have heard of multiple bus crash fatalities but by passenger miles it it still much safer than driving by vehicle. Also while you maybe only going 30 mph the person who hits you maybe going much faster. I trust you to drive safely, others not so much. Bigger vehicles are more survivable in a bad crashes.

[@hoganfan924]

My favorite is when a motorcycle cop issues a ticket for it. ;)

[@spruce-bogey]

Safety The following missive, by Lawrence A. Bullis of Phoenix to the "Arizona Republic," was reprinted in Harper's: "Everyday some new do-gooder is trying to save us from ourselves. We have so many laws and safety commissions to ensure our safety that it seems nearly impossible to have an accident. The problem is that we need accidents, and lots of them. "Danger is nature's way of eliminating stupid people. Without safety, stupid people die in accidents... "With safety, however well-intentioned it may be, we are devolving into half-witted mutants, because idiots, who by all rights should be dead, are spared from their rightful early graves and are free to breed even more imbeciles. "Let's do away with safety and improve our species. Take up smoking. Jaywalk. Play with blasting caps. Swim right after a big meal. Stick something small in your ear. Take your choice of dangerous activity and do it with gusto. Future generations will thank you." -- from Jeff Cooper's Commentaries, Vol. 8, No. 9, 24 August, 2000

[@richardgates7479]

The only way to learn your limits is to exceed them.

[@meritholdingllc123]

Using your logic, Steve, we now need to outlaw swimming pools (kill more people than guns do) , stairs (someone could possibly fall), trees (what if one fell on someone?), cops (what if they shoot another innocent person?), carbohydrates (what if you cannot control yourself and get fat?) and countless other things. You'll have us all in padded rooms during morning so we don't hurt ourselves. It is smart to wear a seat belt and to wear a helmet. Regardless of judicial ruling, these laws are bad laws and are not congruent with our federal constitutions and likely many state constitutions. Bad law is bad law.

[@Guythatknowsitall88]

Agree 100% that arbitrary reasoning would bring a end to liberty as you could make that argument for anything with some stretching which we know lobbist have no problem doing.

[@Darthodieus]

We can't outlaw everything that's fun? Govt: Hold my beer.

[@russellhowell9854]

If the police were so concerned about your safety, they would not go flying through residential or 30 mph areas flying like a bat out of hell for a minor traffic accident (along with 3 or 4 more of their fellow officers in separate vehicles) when it's totally not necessary. I totally understand them having to get to an emergency as quick as "safely" possible but I have seen some with their wheels coming off the roadway and out of control! That's is more of a threat to my life than not wearing a seatbelt! The law enforcement is not as so much concerned with your safety as much as they are concern with getting your money!

[@MrTruckerf]

In my state-Iowa- we are not required to wear a helmet. When a cyclist is killed on a bike, if the victim was not wearing a helmet it is told in the news coverage. But when covering car fatalities, they never mention if the deceased was wearing a seat belt. Don't get me wrong, both are very beneficial. I just don't think they should be law. We don't need laws written by insurance companies.

[@atticstattic]

_Lehto's Law: You're Not The Boss of Me2 - Don't forget to check that organ donor box_

[@DaleRaby]

What made me wear seat belts was buying a 1977 Ford Pinto. It had an obnoxious buzzer and I did not know how to disconnect it, so I got in the habit of wearing seat belts. When I drive something like an Allis-Chalmers WD45, I am uncomfortable because vintage tractors do not have seat belts. For me, the law was unnecessary, all they needed was a buzzer.

[@billbeard4081]

if you are strapped into your vehicle if it loses control and you are on top of your game you can sometimes keep it under control I have been in a rollover in the seat belt kept me in and I kept it under control as best a I could

[@Condorinflight]

I live in Ohio. I don't have to wear a helmet when I ride my motorcycle and I don't. Ohio was one of the last to enact a seat belt law. The federal government withheld money unless they pass the law. I still don't wear a seatbelt.there's many other things that could cost the country money if I got hurt.

[@donjackson1681]

In your paradigm of the cost transfers to the public then why are we letting poor people have kids knowing they can't afford it. It also isn't my place to pay for those kids. Why is it ok for me to pay for these people that can't afford what they do but I am forced by law to protect others from and cost they may incur on my behalf?

[@markg7030]

In the U.S. car manufactures started installing seat belts in the late 1950's. In 1966 it was mandatory for manufacturers to install them( they were optional before 66). In my State the seat belt laws were enforced in the late 1990's.

[@mr.h5436]

I remember the pearl clutching! Seatbelts will get you burned alive! Better to be thrown from the vehicle! lol

[@ZENMASTERME1]

My best friend was killed instantly in a car crash, because he had a seatbelt on! His cousins life was saved, because his seatbelt was off. They were T-boned by a drunk driver in the middle of an intersection. Damned if you, do damned if you don’t. But either way it’s simple Logic!! A simple seatbelt infraction can make the city tons of money 💰 It also makes the insurance company’s a boat load mula 💴 every year in up charges to your insurance. Although I do Know unequivocally, children under the age of 18 should always wear their seatbelt. PERIOD

[@kimepp2216]

The cause of your friends death was the impact of the other vehicle on his. Not all collisions are surviveable, seat belt or not. I doubt the seat belt killed your friend. I have heard stories like this before, never from an emt or cop though.

[@atticstattic]

If you pay insurance, you have a dog in the fight....

[@Howlinblind]

I once asked a cop friend of mine about seat belts i asked is it about safty or generating money, he sais generating money

[@hello-sz7hp]

What I do in my own vehicle that can’t be seen is none of your business

[@malaki7919]

I remember in the 90's Texas passed a mandatory helmet law. I remember me and a group of riders wrote letters to our State Governor at that time. I remember wearing a helmet in very hot weather. Sweat from my head would run down into my eyes because it was so hot and the helmet made my head so hot that I would get dizzy. The state of Texas quickly removed the law realizing in that it is very dangerous to your brain to wear a helmet in hot weather. Plus if sweat is running into your eyes you can't see the road well. Its

[@malaki7919]

@@Finn-McCool Your Funny. You should do Standup. Have you ever been in Downtown San Antonio stuck in traffic in 100 degree weather on a crotch rocket. I don't care how expensive your helmet is the heat Will fry your brain with a helmet on. Yes the sweat runs in your eyes!

[@malaki7919]

@@Finn-McCool 😜

[@ReasonablySane]

The hospital cost argument has never flown with me. I've argued against it for decades. That excuse can be used to prevent every single type of activity that brings any risk with it at all if the government so chooses to enforce it that way. I consider it a slippery slope that is already off limits. The idea that someone can control my activity because they are going to choose to take responsibility for my injuries if I hurt myself is laughable. Why can't I tell them that I'm on my own if I hurt myself. This is why, at age 66, I have no health insurance, and haven't since January 1st 2014, when ObamaCare took effect.

[@Robocline]

so what you're saying is the government has a vested interest in protecting the bottom line of insurance companies. I support seat belt use but not by some government mandate. The Idea that you being injured costing everyone else money is a weak argument. That same line of thought could be used to deprive the people of all liberty in the name of cost savings. I could argue that women who become pregnant cost the rest of us money in higher insurance costs. Under your logic pregnancy should be illegal especially if the woman uses medicaid to get prenatal and obgyn care. I'm sorry but I see seat belt laws as an end run around the 4th amendment. When a cop wants to stop someone they often use the seat belt as their reasonable suspicion and then proceed on a fishing expedition. There are a lot of nit picky laws to facilitate this but it always comes down to he said she said type of things that end up being abused. I do believe it's by design just like cell phone laws.

[@Drooligan]

2:34 I'd argue that the majority of motorcycle accidents are minor single vehicle accidents, many of which go unreported.

[@ike7933]

Hi Steve , I’m from the great state of Delaware ...I remember when we got a seatbelt law 15-20 years ago. At the time I remember reading in the local paper, that basically, the insurance companies indicated that they would be increasing rates for everyone in our state....unless the legislature created a “seatbelt law “ ...so to save us money ....they did exactly that. Being from a small state makes it easy for insurance companies to get changes of this nature passed easily , since we are such a small customer base (unlike California or Texas) I guess I agree with the libertarian point of view in theory however, “it should be the insurance companies that require seatbelts, not the government “....(possibly splitting hairs though ) I wear mine BTW😌

[@hello-sz7hp]

Next up, mandatory by law to lock our house doors when we leave or sleep

[@SuperEndiku]

I was really curious where this was going because it can only go one of two ways. 1) Logical 2) Emotional nonsense Sadly you choose the second answer. The only reason you can claim a person injuring themselves is the rest of society's responsibility is if you are a socialist or someone who doesn't believe in private property or individuality. Using this logic I can dictate what you eat and whether you can partake in anything bad for your health; because your ultimate health care costs are something I have to pay.

[@briceyokem9236]

Which means the government has the right to tell you anything it wants you to do.

[@ah64dbeast37]

Thank you yeah I would say like telling people they can only have eclectic stoves because gas is too dangerous. Or the most obvious thing Banning motorcycles because it's almost guaranteed that you're going to seriously harm yourself or die if in a wreck. If we go that route. And that's not freedom

[@SuperEndiku]

@@ah64dbeast37 You got it. This entire discussion is a failure because it argues the results of bad decisions in the first place. It's like handcuffing yourself to someone and then saying to them "well, now we have to agree on where to eat, sleep, and use the toilet." Maybe you don't handcuff yourself to them in the first place. Maybe that is the real place to make the first good decision.

[@1guysopinion798]

Weak Steve...number one, seat belt, or helmet, or not there could be injuries. The ability to pay doesn't change so it is not a factor. So whether serious or less serious everyone pays for that person. Next speed limits are not the same, you speed right next to other so its not contained to just you. On top of that, I've driven on Germany's autobahn in the sections with no speed limit. Except for speeds under 55 in the US there is little difference between the highways. Based on your only argument that "we might have to pay" then the writers is right ...no dangerous activity should be legal. It's unconstitutional and a weak argument. It's right there with civil forfeiture.

[@k0vert]

My dad used to race cars and he drilled into my head the seatbelt thing. He said if it was up to him, all cars would have a 5-point harness like a racecar but nobody would wear them. I feel weird not wearing a seatbelt and I don't think it makes you uncool to wear it every time you're in a car

[@scotthedrick2460]

I'd wear it for damn sure.

[@scotthedrick2460]

@@HighestRank Been done: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n5rOgqJ8pbN1hMk

[@JimmysTractor]

Yet I can ride a motorcycle with no helmet or seatbelt. Imagine riding your motorcycle with no helmet to pay your seatbelt ticket. This is a fine example of how our laws don't make sense.

[@JimmysTractor]

Now, I'd never ride without a helmet or drive without a seatbelt. It would be safer to drive with a 5 point harness and helmet, should that be a law too?

[@johnadair6054]

Please explain how or what gives the lawmakers the ability to pass laws for public safety.

[@stevelehto]

Police enforce laws. Legislatures pass them.

[@johnadair6054]

@@stevelehto @4:44 you stated "the courts have consistently said that the government has the right to do what it can to make society safer and that's very very broad strokes that I'm painting that with but I'm doing that purposely and I don't have the kind of time to explain more". I'm just asking you too elaborate with more specifics (and fewer generalities) because the title of this video was titled "How Are Seat Belt Laws Legal?" Thanks for posting.

[@rangersmith4652]

@@stevelehto Bingo. Everything that is a law was made so by a group of elected legislators who supposedly listened to arguments and counter arguments before making the decision to create the law. Just like in court, the better argument usually wins. If the anti-seat belt forces didn't show up to make their case--or if it was a weak case--the seat belt law passed.

[@beelzbb9976]

Nebraska the seat belt law is a secondary offense which means you can't be stop for a seat belt violation. They can ticket you for it if you are stopped for say speeding and aren't wearing a seat belt.

[@jefffroman7044]

Lots of Americans are libertarians until the bill comes.

[@markcoxen8563]

How many motorcycles are equipped with seatbelts?

[@MrJonsonville5]

3

[@roderickbanks8596]

I live in a constitutional republic Steve ;-)

[@maxspeed57]

I was in a minor motorcycle accident. I was traveling around 45-50 mph when a car pulled out from my right into my path of travel. I locked the brakes down and slid the bike into the car. I moved my right leg over the R rear turn signal so it was clear of the car. The left corner of the car contacted the engine block of the motorcycle. This stood the bike back up and it was over. Damage to the engine block, points cover and forks. No damage to me. 80 y/o man named Charles Brown paid to have my motorcycle put back to new. (it was 1 month old when this happened)

[@mooing_cowmilk]

School busses: I'm in danger!

[@shexdensmore]

The difference between a buss 🚌 and a car 🚗 is this... the same amout of energy exerted on a car vs a buss has 2 very different outcomes.

[@ivanvalentin3898]

@@shexdensmore you go down a highway at 55 mph in that monster truck and crash and let's see what happens

[@redredred8408]

@@shexdensmore *Vaccine existing* is to *20th booster* As *Running stop signs* is to *T-bone accident* As *Showing up around 3 am everyday* is to *barely showing up ever* As *Being upstairs until around 3 am everyday* is to *almost always being upstairs* As *Not wearing a mask unvaccinated* is to *catching covid* As *Banning hate speech* is to *banning all kinds of speech* As *Wrong way driving* is to *head-on collision* As *Jaywalking* is to *getting ran over* As *Keeping your doors unlocked* is to *getting robbed* As *Running with a knife* is to *it hitting someone else* As *Having 1 floater* is to *having 4 floaters all over the place* As *Being shortsighted* is to *being severely short sighted* As *An innapropriate bot on the internet* is to *having all kinds of multiple inappropriate bots getting lots likes in seconds* As *Knocking over the cones* is to *drivers getting confused and driving in dangerous unfinished parts of the road* As *Shining a powerful laser in the sky* is to *blinding a pilot* As *Throwing dynamite in someones garage* is to *it blowing up* As *Speeding* is to *rear-ending someone and hitting a pedestrian* As *Having no headlights on at night* is to *someone not seeing you and hitting you* As *Not wearing a seatbelt* is to *dying from an accident* As *Not wearing a helmet* is to *dying from an accident* As *Not wearing safety glasses while welding* is to *something sharp in eye* As *Throwing a brick from a tall building* is to *it landing on someone* As *Playing baseball in your yard* risks *breaking the neighbors window* As *Firing a glock in random directions at the store* is to *someone killed*

[@chamsdropz24]

I disagree with your idea regarding the cost to society. If that were the case, anything and everything we do should be regulated by the government. Taxing sugary beverages, banning fast food, etc...all theoretically should be things the government does under your explanation due to the cost to society.

[@hawgietonight]

You may be interested in knowing that there are countries where this is happening. Sugar refills are banned in countries like France, and in the USA they have proposed to ban sugar drinks for children.

[@GeorgeLisi]

New Hampshire is the only state that doesn't require adults to wear seatbelts. Those under 18 are required to wear a seatbelt. Live Free or Die

[@Dont_Tread_On_Me]

"Red flag" laws deprive people of property without due process. They violate the 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th amendments, and will cause a "chilling effect" on people's 1st amendment rights. I would like to see a video on that.

[@vitaliyjuterbog8912]

We need a Leto's Law: "Why you will die" playlist

[@Donny18088]

Hey Steve my first ever comment on your channel. Pennsylvania repealed its motorcycle helmet law after viewing statistics that established for every fatal head injury prevented there was an additional fatal neck injury. The weight of the helmet in a collision easily snaps necks.

[@thunderman77]

Not only that, even if you have insurance, a major injury will increase rates for us all.

[@timgraham7851]

In the 80's, a deal was made between the federal government, auto makers, and the states. The deal was, that if states agreed to make seat belts mandatory, automakers would not be forced to install airbags. Of course, the feds forced airbags anyway.

[@pearabellum]

I see ur argument but why does the government allow cigarettes and alcohol and we can choose to use them or not we pay tons on peoples lung treatments and what not.I just don’t feel the government is consistent and as a society we should strive for consistency and fairness

[@jerry2357]

I have a few comments about this, in favour of seat belt laws (which we also have in the UK). Firstly, my father would have died 16 years ago if he hadn’t been wearing a seat belt, when the car in which he was a passenger crashed. He had to have several operations and spend several weeks in hospital, but he recovered. He might not have been wearing a seat belt without a seat belt law. His death would have impacted the whole family. Secondly, someone sitting unbelted in the back seat of a car could kill the driver or front seat passenger by impacting their head in a crash. Thirdly, I could make a similar comment to that made by your correspondent, but concerning taking I llegal drugs instead of nor wearing a seatbelt. One could put forward an argument that taking drugs is only the business of the person taking them. I don’t think that’s a good argument either, because as you say, no person is an island.

[@paulkelley9641]

I disagree with the seat belt law. 1. If I had been wearing a seat belt in the accident I was in, I wouldn't be here to argue the point. The passenger side of the car was smashed half way to the driver side and the roof was crushed down to the top of the head rest. ( dead driver ) I slid under the steering wheel, saving my life. I was banged up, but alive. 2 The studies and tests done for frontal and side impacts were carefully PRODUCED to show favorable outcomes. And were backed by most of the insurance company's so they could take the next step of getting a law passed to force people to wear seat belts and escape paying thousands of dollars in claims. ( same way as black boxes, another topic )..

[@rodh1404]

Seat belts are a balance of probability thing. Yes, some people die /because/ they were wearing their seat belts. But on balance, the studies have shown that correctly wearing properly installed seat belts save lives and reduce injuries. This has been verified by looking at actual crash outcomes, not just lab tests.

[@bobroberts2371]

Paul Kelley You said " And were backed by most of the insurance company's so they could take the next step of getting a law passed to force people to wear seat belts and _escape paying thousands of dollars in claims._ " You do realize you are admitting that over all , seat belts protect occupants.

[@Maybe-So]

Some insurance companies use the argument of “you were NOT wearing a seat belt” as an excuse to NOT pay. So... While I wear my seat belt, I wouldn’t say that Paul Kelley’s argument “and escape paying” necessarily had to do with survival and safety.

[@suemcelvenney1956]

Dear Steve, Many years ago, I always wore my seatbelt. Then, the Pennsylvania General Assembly passed a seat belt law. In protest, I stopped wearing my seat belt. Not too long after that, I decided to stop being a knucklehead and went back to wearing my seat belt. I recall that Scalia once asked in one of his opinions, “What is the limiting principle?” The day I saw your podcast, I saw a 60 Minutes story about a man who was the world’s record holder for surfing the highest waves. Among other things, he had suffered horrendous injuries pursuing that sport. On a lighter note, once I danced with my wife in my living room. I slipped and fell and turned my foot 90 degrees. I have no doubt the insurance company lost money on me that year. A colossal range of human activity could be restricted by your logic. Just a thought question - would it be all right for Bill Gates to ride without a seat belt? I think I have the answer to your limiting principle. The law was passed democratically. I wish that were entirely true. The Secretary of Transportation threated to cut off federal highway funds to states that did not pass such a law. One of our complaints against King George was, “He has made Judges dependent on his Will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.” Let me admit this is not the same but it is disturbingly similar. I am not a sovereign citizen, but it is it too much to ask for my representative in the General Assembly to be more afraid of me than they are of the Secretary of Transportation. Even though, I occasionally disagree with you, I enjoy your broadcasts. I am often struck by some of our similarities despite our differences. I am a dog lover. In college, I had a radio show. When my Mom would play it, my dog went nuts trying to find me in the radio. I have not been a lawyer but engineer. My retirement job is as a magician and balloon artist. Keep up the good work. Sincerely, Bill McElvenney

[@GoldenTV3]

4:16 What about the cost of medical bills mountain climbing, playing sports, skateboarding etc? If that's the case we should ban all those too

[@MrOneILoveALot]

Like he said they can't outlaw everything.

[@phlodel]

Motorcycle riders are evil. I was told by an employer that if I missed one day for a motorcycle injury I would be fired. A co worker broke hi leg skiing and they circulated a get well soon card for everyone to sign.

[@mixedfeelingsaboutturning1910]

Sounds like a slippery slope universal healthcare is causing

[@TheCrystalGlow]

This begs the statement “just because you can, doesn’t mean you should.”

[@swdierks]

So the govt says "we will take care of you if you can't afford to". So now since we will have to pay for you, we can tell you how to live. Ineresting.

[@MrTruckerf]

You have figured it out.

[@1slyboy]

If I’m in an accident with someone where it was partially my fault- I would be significantly burdened by the extra it would cost my insurance and me personally if the injury went beyond my insurance coverage. All this because someone didn’t have seatbelt or helmet that might have been easily avoided. Also the additional mental anguish if someone dies in an accident I was involved in - even if not my fault- just because they chose not to use a seatbelt or helmet.

[@jamie42172]

or do not be partially involved in accident. I was born in NH, no seat belt law. Our state will not capitulate to weakness and stupidity.

[@dantheautoman3821]

If insurance costs are a justification to dictate if I’m required to wear seatbelt, why is drinking/smoking/fast food legal?

[@alexm566]

so because we can't fix everything we shouldn't fix anything?

[@dantheautoman3821]

@@alexm566 I lean more towards, you live how you want and I’ll live how I want. Government has no business telling someone how to live

[@purvisvandongen4258]

"it's not the worst thing the government does to you" [so it's a-okay!]. convincing and eloquent argument.