How Bankrupt American Cities Stay Alive - Debt [ST04]

Watch this video ad-free on Nebula: nebula.tv/videos/not-just-bik...
For centuries, cities used to be built incrementally. Improving and building on successful places, and changing or abandoning unsuccessful places. This changed in America in the 1940s, when whole neighbourhoods were built on the edge of town, to a completed state. After several generations, many of these places are financially insolvent, but are propping themselves up with an ever-growing mountain of debt.
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---
Sources and Image Credits
Thumnail photo:
Suburban Sprawl, Vegas Style
www.flickr.com/photos/johnkay...
This video is based on the work of Strong Towns, especially the "Growth Ponzi Scheme":
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
Aerial view of the Napa River where it divides Vallejo, California
By Dicklyon - Own work, CC BY-SA 4.0,
commons.wikimedia.org/w/index...
Historical compilation of photos from Brainerd, MN
Downtown Brainerd, then and now:
www.crowwinghistory.org/braine...
Penny Postcards from Minnesota
www.usgwarchives.net/mn/crowwi...
$3.2 Billion to Fix Tampa's Aging Pipes? From Where?
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
The land of the FREE [Backus, MN]
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
Transactions of Decline, Lowry Edition
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
We Need Growth. But Only If It Generates Real Wealth.
www.strongtowns.org/journal/2...
Branch Closings and Budget Cuts Threaten Libraries Nationwide
americanlibrariesmagazine.org...
We Can't Afford To Keep The Streetlights On
www.businessinsider.com/we-ca...
Cost of deferred maintenance for U.S. infrastructure tops $1 trillion, new report finds
transportationtodaynews.com/n...
U.S. and UK on brink of debt disaster
blogs.reuters.com/great-debate...
Mortgage Debt Outstanding, All holders
Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis
fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MDOAH
---
Chapters
0:00 Intro
0:05 Strong Towns
0:14 Why isn't suburbia bankrupt?
1:12 Traditional incremental development
3:13 Growth and financing through debt
4:54 Why increasing taxes isn't enough
6:44 Successful cities need successful services
7:41 Growing cities with debt
9:32 Conclusion
10:29 Patreon shout-out
10:39 Outro
#StrongTowns #MunicipalDebt

[@NotJustBikes]

Watch this video ad-free on Nebula: nebula.tv/videos/not-just-bikes-how-bankrupt-american-cities-stay-alive-debt-st04 Or visit: go.nebula.tv/notjustbikes

[@fulkske]

"Deferring road maintenance so much that their roads become worse than Belgium's" As a Belgian, I have never been so offended by something I don't have any counter-argument against

[@casper6800]

Maybe they'll get fixed when the government figures out how to, well, government?

[@hydrusje]

The thing is, If you cross the border to France (and stay of the toll roads) then it's even worse. :D Anyway, we are starting to take some influence from our northern friends on bicycle infrastructure, so that's good. We are also way, way better then the US of A on infrastructure. (but that isn't that difficult)

[@Shoikan]

@@casper6800 First they'll have to figure out how to create a government, period. I believe Belgium holds the record of being 'in between governments' and keeps on raising that record too, at regular intervals (like every election cycle). And that's disregarding the fact that you've got something like 2 more levels of government than most countries have, due to it being tri-lingual and its unique structure. Yay. Really like the country, love some of the cities, but absolutely HATE the roads there.

[@michaelnajera7958]

As an American, I really appreciate the Belgium sense of humor. Unfortunately, the humor in American suburbia is also low density

[@ethanpet113]

At least if anyone tries to roll tanks through Belgium it will be difficult.

[@Marketplace-Media]

I'm the Mayor of a growing community on the front range of Colorado. This video is dead on accurate. Planners know this, elected officials should know this, but the prevailing mindset of building fast and cheap residential still dominates.

[@shaungordon9737]

America is soon heading for a big reckoning. It will get to a point that the debt is so high that the whole country will crash.

[@Marketplace-Media]

I will add we just switched to "Transects" in our comp plan which is much more sustainable and allows for mixed uses.

[@certaindeath7776]

i wish u good luck on changing things.

[@dinamosflams]

As someone who has direct contact with this at your work, please be the change and help spread the word to the people, companies and agencies that work with you and with other mayors. For a better future for america with less costly maintenance and for more beautiful, effective and sustainable towns and cities.

[@6z0]

Holy shit Im from Berthoud and you’re my mayor

[@marresjepie1887]

"Buy now, pay later"

[@Twister-V1]

@Pro Tengu we are the people we owe debt to... thats how it works most of our debt is owned by the citizens

[@ottifant64]

…also Nazi Germany.

[@Lzrdman91]

So we all live in a rent a center lol. That the American way

[@mara10na4ever9]

It’s actually most of the world, deficit spending is actually extremely common. Every major country does it

[@lily_littleangel]

U$

[@Drummerx04]

Whenever I hear the argument that cars are the great source of freedom in the US, I get pretty annoyed. It doesn't look like freedom when you HAVE to buy and maintain an expensive, heavy, and bulky vehicle which you must bring with you and store somewhere every single time you want to do anything that isn't in your house already. Freedom has to realistically include the option to opt out of something. You REALLY don't have that option if you live outside a dense city with actually decent public transportation.

[@hge437]

This was my thinking the entire 8 years I lived in the US, car-free

[@theonlymegumegu]

thank you so much for putting it like that.

[@clarkbruce_swe91]

And how many cities in the US actually has decent, wide-spread public transportation, besides NYC maybe? Cars were perhaps truly a source of freedom when they were a new invention and just recently affordable for most people, before cities started getting bulldozed over them.

[@Drummerx04]

@@clarkbruce_swe91 Well according to channels Not Just Bikes, public transportation and/or walkability used to be pretty good in most US cities, then car companies basically bought out the infrastructure and removed it with prejudice making cars the only viable choice.

[@clarkbruce_swe91]

@@Drummerx04 Yeah, I've seen that.

[@seanbauer9180]

this is giving me a massive vibe of "america is literally a ponzi scheme"

[@darkranger116]

yeup..

[@ITFxXDJDawgXx]

If people lived within their means, it wouldn't have to be. But alas, greed and entitlement reign supreme because humans are shitty

[@nunyabusiness3786]

Its too big to fail and unlike Enron we have the military might to threaten whoever takes a closer look

[@guy-sl3kr]

@@nunyabusiness3786 Yuuuuup it's no accident that we have BY FAR the biggest military budget on the planet and have been in nonstop war since WWII. America stays afloat by keeping everyone else beneath them

[@ldl1477]

@@guy-sl3kr That's a bit unfair. Those of us who talk about having America pull back from military interventionism (pro-isolationism) get it from both ends. Conservatives say we're making America weak and allowing some other nation to take over the world, and Liberals accuse us of racism/xenophobia for not helping/protecting other peoples.

[@sevsev4078]

Watching this series really sounds to me as if city-planning was specifically designed to finance specific industries instead of providing sustainable city growth for every part of society.

[@Coolguy98765432q457]

Correct

[@nashi_shuai]

more specifically, car-related industries and empires of huge department stores

[@plantagominor722]

Almost as if that were exactly what happened huh

[@Bluecho4]

Hmm... * Strokes Chin Thoughtfully *

[@marlak4203]

thank you. Glad someone else is seeing this. Looking at just a few of this man's videos, besides what I am seeing in my own state, I came to the conclusion to that this is profitable to some big wigs behind the scenes. Maybe even foreign ones too that want to see American this way. It is beyond tiring. Its lazy, slumlord type of constructing. Easy lazy, unethical money to make. They don't care, its not that its impossible to do things like make the roads out of better material, they don't want to, they love getting by. Million/Billionaires who like to just 'get by' on making money this lazy, careless way is how it seems to me.

[@kevinmccabe7263]

Not sure if you've already done this, but the city of Rochester a few years back became the first ever city to remove an urban highway and start genuinely investing in densification of our urban core. We removed the eastern half of our downtown "Inner Loop" and today I actually live in one of the thousand new apartments and condos that were built on the reclaimed land. We started filling it in in 2014 and already there are three new neighborhoods that are dense, lively, and bustling. If you haven't already you should do a video on this!

[@hds66nl29]

It isn't rocket science. Built neighbourhoods with enough people living in it to support local businesses, create besides roads a cycle and walk infrastructure and you have a nice pleasant livable, bustling area. Like humans have been doing for millennia until the (failing) suburb experiment.

[@MrSomecrackhead]

You live in a fucking apartment and you are making it sound great. What is wrong with you?

[@tylerives5198]

Rochester, MN or Rochester, NY?

[@gaspersb]

This is giving me amusing flashbacks to Sim City when I was a kid. I knew I HAD to have certain things in my city, and it had to "look" a certain way, but I couldn't fucking afford it making it look like the cities I was familiar with in the real world. I always had to take out fucking loans and incur massive debt or resort to cheating. (Which is funny because real cities go screaming to higher levels of government to magically save them with them dollarydoos like magic). It seems unsettlingly realistic as an adult now. I couldn't do a "realistic" and solvent city in a game about city building, real city planners apparently can't either.

[@dinamosflams]

As from someone who didn't grow in the US I also played simcity as a kid and tried to make things look similar to what I lived in. The funny thing is that even though I was awful in the game (I tried to make multiple roads come out of the main road, do tunnels and etc., Yes I was that young and bad at the game), I still constantly made huge profits constantly. Heck, I didn't even know what those loans and tarifs were for xD.

[@witoldschwenke9492]

that's what happens when you let noobs run the real cities

[@matthewgladback8905]

A similar thing happens in Cities: Skylines if you use the Realistic Population mod, without also using the built-in Unlock All mod. Since high-density zoning isn't unlocked until you're quite large, you end up sprawling outrageously and spending way too much money on roads and water, much less any other services. I tried to provide fire and police service, and education, and ultimately stalled out and ended up bankrupt. I covered my entire starting tile (you can unlock a total of 9 without mods) without reaching the milestone for high-density zoning. Mind you, I had a profitable industry area, but it couldn't keep me afloat on its own. You see, the unmodded game actually "cheats" for you in several ways. Those low-density residences that look like single-family homes, secretly morph into multiplexes (as high as 4-plexes IIRC) as they level up. The devs must have known, but they still built their game on an assumption of American-style car-dependent development. The whole suite of road hierarchies is there, and most guides will suggest that you use it. Naturally, traffic is the true final boss in that game. Truth be told, with Realistic Population the high-density zones are insanely lucrative. You can definitely support large swaths of low-density residential if you want it for aesthetic reasons. There's no gameplay reason to build any, though. I was over 20k population in my last game with only a single fire and police station (and can probably support quite a bit more with just those.) I rarely see any cars on my roads, except the people moving in. (Even those are still a big problem!) I'll never go back.

[@Drag0nfoxx]

@@matthewgladback8905 The need to build car-centric in Cities Skylines makes it much less fun to me. You can skirt around it by investing massively in walkways, buses, etc., but ultimately you need to build car roads everywhere. That's not how cities in many countries are built in real life.

[@shannonpincombe8485]

My SimCity cities were always a huge success....One reason. I NEVER built a road. Not one square of tarmac. Rail everywhere and high density housing with loads of parks.

[@scoobertdoobert1377]

I loved the line about how Urban Services and Rural Densities do not mix. Its unbelievably expensive

[@NotJustBikes]

Yes! A lot of people watch these videos and think that I'm saying everyone needs to live in dense urban cities. The density is irrelevant; what matters is that the infrastructure liabilities are proportional. There's nothing inherently wrong with rural or suburban places. The problem is low-density car-dependent suburban places with high-density urban-level services.

[@ME-hm7zm]

Makes me wonder why they bother at all, honestly. The county I live in has two real "urbanized zones", and those are the only ones with (to use this vid's example) water and sewer systems. Everywhere else outside of that has well water and septic tanks. Seems like those places in MN did it the hard way for no apparent reason at all (unless they thought they were going to suddenly have 50 thousand people move in or something).

[@trashrabbit69]

Waukesha County Moment

[@Froboymike]

@@NotJustBikes wow this comment really makes the light bulb turn on for me. It seems so simple just to keep the infrastructure and services proportional to the context. On the local level, it is possible in many places to get the political will to think about this if the city leadership really understands the issue. Your videos certainly help make it clear and easy to understand!

[@kyriacosstavrinides893]

@@ME-hm7zm In discussing this specific sewer project in Minnesota mentioned in the video, Strong Towns pointed out that this small rural township didn't build a system like this out of choice, but because of a mixture of necessity and federal and state grant stipulations. A long time ago, the town built a water and sewer system that seemed relatively cheap at the time, but they didn't take into account replacement costs as many municipalities across the US do. When the time came to repair they didn't have the money so they turned to the state and federal government for grants. The grants came with the stipulation that the system would be expanded. An analogy would be that a family can't afford their payments on their car so the bank loans them money to go buy a more expensive car.

[@raresuta5895]

I remember when I first went to the US and stayed in a friends house in the suburbs. As an European, I was used to walking everywhere but I quickly realized that i couldnt do that there. Firts of all, everything i needed like a shop or a bank was really far away and it took forever to walk there and back , secondly, the sidewaks were in very bad shape or unexistent in most places, wich meant that I had to walk on the roads and finally, people really were wierded out by me just walking around lol, they would slow down their cars and stare at me or even ask me if im lost or something haha. Long story short, ihad to uber everywere which sucked

[@nataliekhanyola5669]

Yikes!!! That sounds terrible.

[@CaptinHoot51]

You did not have to walk on roads.

[@CaptinHoot51]

You chose to walk on roads.

[@CaptinHoot51]

People don't get "weirded out" by others walking.

[@Techdolphin200]

@@CaptinHoot51 I take it you don't live in rural america LOL

[@chalklead]

My jaw opened when I saw the picture of what Brainerd's Front Street looks like today compared to how it looked like 100 years ago. How could people possibly view this as progress? Even removing how fiscally irresponsible this style of growth is, its just disgusting aesthetically and makes life so much harder for everyone, even those with cars.

[@Phazon8058MS]

That bit where you went from Brainerd in 1905 to today was just heartbreaking. That used to be such a lively looking street! Those were some really handsome looking buildings! That looked like a place I would want to stroll through and enjoy. Now it's a parking lot.

[@juliancalero8012]

Counterpoint: anything not the cookie cutter style that's 'modern' is blight that needs to be destroyed and replaced/s

[@alipainting]

Some towns didn't bulldose those delightful main streets and are now reaping the benefits. Grand Junction co, Latimer Street in Denver. Mount Airy NC, the town Mayberry was modeled after 😊

[@juliancalero8012]

@@alipainting I know and was making a joke, it's a shame the good parts of modern American cites as so exclusive because of the mindset that car dependency means prosperity

[@alex_blue5802]

The postcard thing made me so sad.

[@tinyasianman3695]

my town still has a old European themed street that's the downtown area of my town

[@idc237]

"We need more money to pay for infrastructure!" - city "Ah, let's build another development outside of town to finance that!" - city "Isn't that like getting a credit card to pay off another credit card?" - responsible person "...................." - city *throws them out the window - city

[@kyriacosstavrinides893]

Now we have to build another city hall to replace that window

[@MasticinaAkicta]

That is indeed very short sighted planning. But a quick solution is in the eye of many better then a long term painful plan that will fix a problem long term! The way americans think about debt, also goes way up to the cities and states.... debt is seen as good. So more debt is better right?

[@jonomoth2581]

Remember kids, defenestration is only occasionally the solution

[@c5quared626]

Capitalism is based on debt, so understand that these great liberal enlightened lives we lead in the new world are not financially viable. Never were.

[@karenfreund5098]

It's a Ponzi scheme

[@lawrencefan6933]

I'm from Montreal, Quebec, and if you've ever been here in the summer, you'll notice the sheer number of construction sites littered everywhere across the city. Yet, streets are still in horrendous condition and filled with potholes. People here usually blame corruption in the construction industry for this and why construction seems to move at a snail's pace. While that may be a part of the problem, I don't think the other part of the problem is talked about enough: all the crumbling infrastructure built in the late 20th century that are in desperate need of repair. We are now paying the price for the rapid building of roads and infrastructure to support car-dependent suburbia. The Champlain Bridge built in 1962 had to be completely replaced in 2019 with a new bridge, the Turcot/Ville-St-Pierre Interchanges built in 1967 have been undergoing a complete rebuild for the past decade, and more recently, the Dorval Interchange overpass on Autoroute 20 had to be completely shut down for 6 months for emergency repairs. And that's only a handful of projects that make the city seem like a huge construction site, and most people don't realize that suburbia is one of the main causes.

[@pawebernaciak1581]

Wonder if REM will fix some of this problems?

[@xavierguilbeault991]

Amen to that. I'm still waiting for a political party to expose this in a meaningful way that will go to the root of the issue and not blame the previous parties... Pretty much what this channel is doing I guess... is "Not Just Bikes" the political party we have been waiting for.. ?!

[@MrCalls1]

@@xavierguilbeault991 well with him living in the Netherlands he needs 70k votes to get a seat. So if we all move to the Netherlands we can get him elected and maybe 1 more.... not sure how we can use that to fix our home nations, but at least we get to enjoy decent infrastructure there now.

[@Trackpad_User]

While I'm down to go and complaint about the idiotic highways that crisscross the city and make no sense (Highway 40 being the worse offender), a lot of the infrastructure issues and construction going on in Montreal are related to local streets and water distribution infrastructure. A major part of the issue is just years of neglect and not fixing anything, resulting in large parts of the infrastructure needing emergency repairs at about the same time. The large projects of the 60s and 70s make the news because they're major pieces of infrastructure, but the issue isn't just limited to them. Now we just have to hope they remove the toll on the 30, and/or add tolls for cars getting in the city. At least the city seems to be going generally in the correct way, with the construction of the REM, new bike infrastructure, and the suburbs building a lot of medium density residential around transit hubs (mostly commuter rail stations)

[@svelobikes9049]

I'm no urban planner but I think that it would greatly help if more long-distance railway was built, or rebuilt. It's sad to see Via Rail cutting routes every year.

[@ccsmooth55]

Never considered our development practices like a Ponzi Scheme but it makes so much sense. It really explains why there is so much suburban overdevelopment and why inner cities in America are in much worse shape than most inner cities in Europe.

[@Puschit1]

Basically everything in the US is a ponzi scheme. Capitalism in general needs constant growth which is why it is bound to fail. It's a web of ponzi schemes built on top of ponzi schemes. The sad/dangerous part of it: Before it fails and collapses there is the option for one last growth: taking over other countries. The US is already trying that for decades economically but sooner or later they might use their military for these purposes.

[@your-oven-is-still-on1292]

I live in America and your channel just fills me with rage against the way the cities were built haha

[@tehamill1]

Thankfully we can fix this problem! It’ll take a while though.

[@Iquey]

Built and demolished. It's a shame that older mini-urban places at human scale were BULLDOZED for car centric scale.

[@trans-octopusspacealien8883]

I will whatever I can to help people stop moving to my area in harmful droves!! Traffic is a nightmare because stupid outsiders wanted to move here.

[@askewcat3209]

@@tehamill1 hopefully once the older generations start to retire or become unfit for a government job the younger people who take over those positions actually try and improve things for once instead of kicking the debt can down the road

[@farhanibrahim5925]

@@dalton6108 but isn't it dangerous.

[@notgad3130]

As a Minnesotan I always wondered how we paid for the mass amounts of construction each summer, then I realized, we don't 😅

[@NotJustBikes]

Strong Towns is based in Brainerd, so they're _all_ about the Minnesotan examples! :)

[@johnfritchey6233]

@@NotJustBikes They also like to pick on Kansas City, though I will admit we have a lot of parking an roads for a population our size.

[@aidancollins1591]

@@ltg8382 Republicans aren't going to fix it, they're not about fixing problems, just culture war bullshit and tax cuts. What we need are progressives in the Democratic party to oppose these measures.

[@alexwilsonpottery3733]

@@ltg8382, so you’re not just a European Fascist, but a racist as well. All right then.

[@chubbymoth5810]

@@alexwilsonpottery3733 Sadly they're an issue here as well.

[@aapjeaaron]

I am Belgian and I've been to Massachusetts. Their roads are already worse then ours.

[@NotJustBikes]

Yup. Way, WAY worse.

[@MrMarkusmulder]

Is that even mogelijk 😳

[@JoseAlberto-sk9lq]

@@JacobBax that's why rent control and public housing should exist

[@EmperorNefarious1]

Massachusetts is one of the worst as a state, but many cities are worse. One of the most Jarring changes is crossing the bridge into Philadelphia from New Jersey, its a minefield. I've seen multiple cars with flats within a few miles in that area. And don't even think about driving in DC without an SUV and meaty tires.

[@seneca983]

@@JoseAlberto-sk9lq Rent control is a bad idea.

[@kingkas1740]

Every time I get angry about german government and citybuilding-rules and the municipalities, I watch your videos and recognize that I am living in a paradise and it could be much worse. Thank you for this eyeopener.

[@Who-vt9oh]

"Everybody expects urban services, with near rural densities...but they're not willing to actually pay for it." That's America, right there: entitled. They want it all, and they want it for free.

[@Ballaurena13]

This makes me wonder if the real issue is what services are offered and where traffic centers are located. Local streets, phone and power are the only services that I know of that are universal for homes to exist. My suburban childhood neighborhood had septic systems and no sidewalks. The more rural home my family moved to next also had to rely on well water and had no cable, high speed internet (the buyer went with satellite anyway), or even paved roads. Garbage service was a half-mile away and my cousins who lived nearby just hauled their own. The freeway already existed to connect cities, though I will get to that more in a minute. In other words, how about not providing services beyond what the taxes can cover, and also not pretending we have to provide other services for humans to have healthy-sized habitats that can only exist outside of town. Back to the freeways, I suppose we did add to the traffic there, but some of that isn't a problem of sprawl so much as an issue of the government directing new jobs to the cities because they already have loud voices to speak for them. For example, when a new four-year college was needed in the county, sites near the new growth areas were suggested that would have moved the traffic out of town. This further made sense because those in the county seat were already close enough to other four-year colleges. But instead they went with the current city center - counter to wise planning according to what I learned in ecology class.

[@jeebusk]

If people are able to do it, then they're going to do it. The one annoying guy saying you shouldn't take out loans that are available (eg Rand Paul) never wins in congress.

[@nigelft]

That kind of mindset comes from wanting high quality public service ... ... but don't want to pay for it through higher taxes ...

[@nigelft]

@@Ballaurena13 There's your problem ... you thought in terms of ecology, not economics ... That isn't an attack on you, because you're smart enough to understand ecological impact ... ... but, when dealing with city planners whom think in terms of economics, and public taxation, unless you live somewhere like Washington State, and not, say, in Arizona, then all I can say is ... Good luck with that one ...

[@J0eMega]

It’s not that they want it for free, but literally can’t afford it. As they said, the cost of road repairs would have required a tax on the community equal to their Median salary. And when you have shit legislation and idiot voters like in California, where people vote against high density housing, there’s literally nowhere to live EXCEPT suburban houses. Getting really sick of this brain dead sentiment of “it all comes down to American entitlement”. We were born here. We didn’t ask for this shit.

[@luis_zuniga]

Ok, we really need that video on Belgian infrastructure.

[@tirobo]

so it isnt just me?

[@davidvandenbergh6795]

Belgian infrastructure is easy to fix. Only needs one step: have a government for longer than 1 year

[@hdroman5659]

But what would we talk about there is no infrastructure

[@bsfoxo3329]

@@davidvandenbergh6795 that’s what you get with democracy. The government changes every year or two, and nothing gets done.

[@TurnInfinity]

@@bsfoxo3329 Ah that's why democratic countries are such a mess compared to the rest of the world /s

[@Mannhovf]

The scary part is that this crap has slowly been creeping into European towns too. The last 25 years have seen more and more sprawl suburbia pop up in various places in Europe.

[@Plan73]

I think there is nothing wrong with this type of suburbia IF it's max 10-15% of a city AND if you build schools, shops and public spaces inside.

[@vlt96]

@@Plan73 the American suburban places look like they're residential satellites that require you to go down to Earth (the nearest city) to even get a drink. Around here, suburbia is still car dependent if you want to be efficient, but even villages around small cities have shops, a bar, church, primary schools and some kind of public transport to the city. Within walking distance from everyone.

[@Spockkker]

Almost nobody who has the resources to live in their own home outside of a high density city wants to continue living in said city. Once a certain amount of material wealth exists in a society, it's a universal that people want to escape the crowded and poor quality city life. You can't blame them, it's what they want and they have the means to do as they please.

[@prashnaveetprasad8339]

@@royale7620 if you think suburbia is a quite and busy place....well you haven't been to most suburbs.

[@comradepolarbear6920]

@@Spockkker that's just not true. Many prefer the city life over a boring suburbia.

[@Zedek]

It is strange how a videogame like Cities:Skylines basically "visualize" that: If I let the simulation run, the virtual citizens build and upgrade on existing land and only minor new services are needed (a bit more water consumption or maybe a few more Megawatts of electricity). If I start to rebuild a new quarter from scratch, it costs so much and the cost take literally several real-life days to come back. It happened even in my latest savegame where I would've been better of managing existing portions instead of trying to create another suburbia with the same standards (bus services, 3-lane roads etc.) as the dense city that actually works profitable. I needed a new hospital etc. because the one in the city were too far away (response time) and thus I actually did make a net loss in the end of my project.. I had new places, yes, and new citizens, yes, but the budget took a dent.

[@witoldschwenke9492]

yea to make money in that game you need to balance services well and build tight dense cities so your services get great coverage without being too expensive pr citizens, that drives the property costs up so you make more tax money. its really shitty because it forces ugly, dense city design and its not that realistic in the game, a hospital can actually reach the entire map quickly depending on your traffic but in the game you need many clinics and hospitals everywhere even if you have medical helicopters that can go anywhere really really fast.. but it does get some things right, i like it. once you get the dlcs though you can do what you want, its like infinite money, design good industry areas and raking in 200-300k city earnings with tax rate 1% with 30000 people haha.. then build parks at major pedestrian paths and take in thousands a week just for crossing a street to a stadium. you can also waste money on things with zero return like the unique buildings, earnings from tourism is a complete joke, you recoup less than 10% of the unique buildings costs. You can't make money with public transportation. You can make money with the university dlc but only when you have a gigantic city and only one university which means bad university coverage. you can save money by making education pay for. . in the end its extremely unbalanced, its very easy to exploit the game and its unplayable without mods in my opinion.. heck things don't even work without mods, the industries dlcs industries don't function like they should without modding a fix. And you can hardly run the game fluently without a fps mod to make the game engine work.... also did you notice nobody ever gets sick in that game? all the hospitals are for nothing! all you need to do is provide clean water and air and your get zeroo illnesses. The game is way too inaccurate. Besides i can rake in money even without the exploits or dlcs, new areas most definitely pay off in cities Skyline. my first city was mod and dlc free and raked in enough to buy all of the unique buildings, it was possible trough constant expansion and optimization

[@lzh4950]

In Singapore where ~60% of households don't have a car (since it's heavily taxed) our development is also lopsided, with outlying suburbs being denser than inner ones due to history; as the former were built after the post-WW2 population boom & the latter were built before (& include some legally & culturally protected low-density buildings e.g. shophouses) e.g. _Bt Panjang_ town has 120k residents spread over ~3.65km^2 in apartments up to 30 storeys tall, & is surrounded by 3 sides by forest, while being ~17km/10mi from downtown & separated from it by the lower-density & prime _Bt Timah_ housing region. This makes infrastructure dev't more expensive as you have to stretch your heavy rail far out from downtown to serve where most people are living i.e. the outlying suburbs, but intermediate stations have lower ridership as they're in less dense inner suburbs. Though this might be less of an issue with decentralisation, if it means residents go less into downtown but to other suburbs/satellite towns for work & other activities, unless the suburb they've to go to is on the other side of downtown, then that's another form of inefficiency as they have to travel further & consume more energy

[@ironboy3245]

@@lzh4950 and that's why we have the other lines

[@yahyarajaee5883]

7:11 I went to Belgium from France by car countless times and I confirm that the moment you see the sign “welcome to Belgium”, you feel like your car has turned into a tractor.

[@moosesandmeese969]

Those American highways at 4:50 look like the first time you try to build highways in City Skylines. "Ah shit not enough space. Fuck it, bulldoze some shit and build it higher and higher until it fits."

[@chaosmagican]

@Frafra Zoomer The verticality (and often spaghetti appearance) is still a thing that seems to be uniquely american. Like where is this going? Everything there looks flat af I don't believe there is suddenly a mountain left and right. According to wikipedia this is the most heavily used interchange in the European Union, look at how high those bridges are in comparison. de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurter_Kreuz#/media/Datei:Frankfurter-Kreuz-Luftbild.jpg

[@BLY99]

You should see what they did in Egypt.

[@chaosmagican]

@Frafra Zoomer We have barely any stacked interchanges. Even with enough space. Elevated feeder lanes are somewhat common but are still reasonably high. Well speed... We have enough speed otherwise I guess? And as I said according to wikipedia "With approximately 320,000 cars daily,[1] it is the most heavily used interchange in the European Union.[2]" I also live next to a brand new interchange with loads of space and nothing else around but they build a y-trumpet which has 90-degree-ish turns but the ramps still don't go to the moon

[@moosesandmeese969]

@@chaosmagican fuck I live in only a medium sized city in the US and I have those "ramps that go to the moon"

[@Blackadder75]

Actually Americans are thinking about the future with those high stack interchanges. New settlements can use those high ramps for safety after the nuclear apocalypse 😉

[@fy1727]

07:09 You're assimilating very well into Dutch society! You're even shitting on Belgium and their roads! I'm proud!

[@cccpredarmy]

I am a russian living in Germany atm and I still got proud...

[@RoyMcAvoy]

Are Belgium roads really that bad?

[@DanielWW2]

@@RoyMcAvoy Yup. It is not like that picture because that is a side road that barely will see any traffic, but the difference is clearly there. The moment you drive over the border from the Netherlands to Belgium, you literally feel it. You don't even need the border crossing sign, you know it instantly. And generally speaking the highways are better than other roads. It doesn't help that Dutch roads are so good. They might be the smoothest roads in all of Europe while in Belgium they have arguably some of the worst maintained roads in at least western-Europe. I driven over plenty of French, Austrian, German and Italian roads. They usually don't match Dutch roads but all beat Belgium roads with some ease. Even the everlasting building pit/permanent traffic jam called German roads are better.

[@sjorsvanrijswijk358]

@@DanielWW2 I drove through Charleroi, from France in to NL recently, and it was insanely bad, it was shocking. reminded me of Cambodia after the rain season 20 years ago. WTF.

[@DanielWW2]

@@perfectsplit5515 Yea, I have my doubts... Because that form of colonialism is nothing more than imposing a new foreign elite on top of the local elite you gets co-opted, with the sole purpose of resource extraction for profit. Good roads would be purely for that purpose or military usage. So if you live along the road from for example a tin mine or oil drill to a harbour, sure you will have a good road. Other than that, forget it.

[@86_percent28]

My question now is “how do we undo the damage that post ww2 urban planning has caused, and how do we move away from suburbs?”

[@jascrandom9855]

Eliminate Single Family Housing zones, Height limits and Parking lot requierements. Government should no longer subsidize these res nor back any finance/mortage for homes in them

[@trans-octopusspacealien8883]

As someone who grew up rural I want to ban single family homes. The amount going up is ridiculous!!! I freaking hate the mentality of city dwellers.

[@Hadvar]

Or how do we make suburbs sustainable?

[@jacobreich2443]

@@Hadvar Cant without magic or 1000 year from now tech

[@gengis737]

Eliminate business / shops / housing altogether, just keeping industrial zones separated. Mix schools, shops, small companies like in traditional towns, so that you can live your daily life without cars. Provide public transports to city center in dedicated lanes, to make it faster and more comfortable than traffic-jam. Densify suburbs by replacing family house by 4 stores building, as comfortable, easier to maintain and much less expensive. Resell unused facilities to recycling industry.

[@brigham2150]

I live in a city of 25,000 and work for a local CPA firm. It just so happens we finished auditing said city recently. and I was shocked, for a city of this size, there is a LOT of debt. Specifically for sewer and water refunding bonds. So they pay off some of the bonds, sell the rest, and issue new bonds. And of course, to pay off those bonds, they charge residents more for water and sewer, which is why my bill is higher than it should be, and it’s all an endless, stupid, pointless cycle.

[@wewillrockyou1986]

"This street was bulldozed for the car" I'll be keeping that one good sir.

[@sirisaacnewton3755]

Never knew i needed this channel. I’m from puerto rico and we have such a weird development style, I really do wonder how much of our economic circumstances can be attributed to it. Puerto rico has literally the most roads per square mile in the world, we prioritize cars in a country with a 45% poverty rate with very faulty infrastructure. It’s very weird and I think you would enjoy investigating it.

[@CaptinHoot51]

Puerto Rico is not a country.

[@CaptinHoot51]

Puerto Rico is a territory.

[@properuser]

Puerto Rico is part of United States so that is where all this shit comes from.

[@agentjeb4103]

@@CaptinHoot51 I think he knows that technicality, since he LIVES THERE. Maybe consider he calls PR a country for *other* reasons.

[@whoishim2998]

@@CaptinHoot51 yeah “technically” but it’s a country

[@DarkJonas33]

I'm a storm water engineer and kind of tempted to present a paper like this at a conference. It would really put a cat among the pigeons. Anyone got recommendations of books or journal articles that give a bit more technical information around the concept of residential development basically being a Ponzi scheme?

[@catsaturday9900]

The wild thing is that for me and everyone I know in my generation in the US, we'd much much rather live in cities anyway, but as this channel has noted, everyone who wants to live in walkable neighbourhoods gets priced out. A service we don't even /want/ (living in isolated, alienated pods in an asphalt wasteland with no place to grow subculture) is subsidized against any dense community center we'd want to live in, which gets priced out of accessibility.

[@Hadvar]

I've always wondered what could bring someone to want to live in a city. The suburbs are built up enough for my tastes; I'd prefer rural living tbh. And I'm Gen Z.

[@catsaturday9900]

@@Hadvar I hate driving. And I'm gay, so a lower population density means a much lower chance of finding partners to date or subcultures to engage with; a higher population density means a higher variety of smaller communities generate distinct activities to participate in. There's just less of interest to do in the suburbs and it costs more for me and the environment to get /to/ any of it, which effectively shrinks the horizons of my world around me.

[@Hadvar]

@@catsaturday9900 Interesting, I guess me being a homebody perfectly content entertaining myself is what allows me to take no issue with the boredom of the suburbs. But I can see the draw of cities for someone who prefers to "go out on the town".

[@catsaturday9900]

@@Hadvar Yeah. While there's nothing wrong with being a homebody, suburbia /enforcing/ a high barrier to forming new adult friendships outside of your nuclear family is I think a serious societal issue.

[@Silvarret]

Interestingly, Belgium has shitty roads in some part due to urban sprawl (specifically, ribbon development) causing similar issues as in the US :)

[@NotJustBikes]

Yup. Belgium has a huge number of kilometres of road per capita for a European country. They also have a lot of cars. It used to be so common for your company to give you a lease car; not just the executives, but everyone. So every office worker basically had a "free" car. That is slowly changing, but I remember all of our neighbours in Brussels had two cars (all of them company lease cars) even though many people didn't even need or want a 2nd car. Crazy.

[@Silvarret]

@@NotJustBikes Word! As a fellow ex-Brusseleir, I still cringe thinking of the traffic there 😖 There are some other interesting historical reasons for the sprawl, too - rural home ownership was traditionally promoted by the Catholic church, and Flemish people sometimes like to say they're born with "a brick in their stomach" in regards to how many young adults build their own houses when they move out of their parents' places. Which in part of course has led to the beautiful Ugly Belgian Houses!

[@cabalco83]

@@Silvarret Are the dutch all that different though? Knowing both countries it seems to me that they both have their city centers with huge suburbs area around them. I'm really curious since i don't know much about the economic side. I also think the biggest difference with the USA is the fact that here in Europe houses don't have to get demolished after 20/30 years and that the governments are pushing for home renovations instead of new buildings.

[@timpauwels3734]

@@cabalco83 The Netherlands has always had strict regulations on urban planning, where Belgium had very few (some politics behind this, but beyond scope here). Vehicle tax is also much higher in the Netherlands, and company cars are relatively rare compared to Belgium. It’s actually noticeable that Dutch cars on the road are generally a little older, smaller and less flashy over all. Also, Belgian driving licences are easy and cheap compared to Dutch ones. (You can learn from your parents like in the US). Due to said roads, Belgium has smog problems most winters when the wind is low. A suggestion was made to allow less company cars, but the counter argument was that people would then commute in their own, older, more polluting cars. The smog is also worsened by many years of heavy promotion of diesel cars. Many if not most company cars are also diesel (due to faulty pollution research that neglected particulates).This is not the case in the Netherlands. Belgian sprawl is haphazard and often results in 1 row of houses lining each side of a main road all the way to the next town. Wastewater is managed with sceptic tanks because building regulations don’t require a sewage connection to the site. While in the Netherlands, a large plot of land is bought by a developer who will build an organised neighbourhood of similar houses, Belgian plots are sold to individuals who will each build their own house, with architectural designs beyond the wildest of dreams. Belgians tend to associate sameness with public housing projects, so aspire to build their own house.

[@marcelmoulin3335]

@@NotJustBikes Very sad! On holiday in Belgium in 1971, I recall vividly how breathtakingly beautiful it was with its vast green areas, farms, charming villages, and bustling cities without the ubiquitous motorways, sprawl, and strip development of today. How Belgium could have replicated the worst aspects of American cities so successfully... continues to horrify me.

[@alexwilsonpottery3733]

Zoning laws have become a major problem here in Des Moines, Iowa. Just a couple of blocks from us, a neighbour’s house burned down, then he was refused a permit to rebuild - not a bigger house, but in the same footprint. All around the city there are empty lots because of this ludicrous, suburban thinking. Meanwhile, next to the river in the ‘desirable’ downtown, new high-priced condos are being built on a floodplain next to a superfund industrial pollution site. Ya gotta wonder.

[@SeaCowsBeatLobsters]

Geez

[@TheSiprianus]

Noone care about zoning laws because the buzzwords these kind of channel keep repeating is blaming 'the system' and proposing more regulation to strangulate people.

[@SeaCowsBeatLobsters]

@@TheSiprianus did you even watch the video?

[@ANTSEMUT1]

@@TheSiprianus this is saying regulation are bad, as in only certain kinds of buildings can be built.

[@thomaslipstenstien5282]

That's by design. No houses, just boxes. A condo prison awaits your grandchildren.

[@CaseNumber00]

Yeah, country boy here. Rural areas hate the urban elite and vocally want nothing to do with them but they want all the luxuries. And of course this cost money to build and almost as much money to maintain, but "my taxes must be low" and the politician keep it that way to be re-elected. After several years, commonly decades, the costs never went down and the debt just ballooned. That water treatment part really brought back all my memories. Instead of being settled with the debts of the previous generous, I just left.

[@monalizzy]

Absolutely eye opening video. I started getting interested in urban planning once I realized how dangerous it is for me to ride my bike in the city. And how many of my neighbors use a mobility scooter. Our roads are not made for people, they are made for cars. they are absolutely inaccessible, and also are crap. pot holes everywhere. Can't wait for your next video in analyzing cities.

[@TheFriso1234]

Thumbs up for the Belgian roads joke. The most clear sign you've cross a Schengen area border in all of Europe.

[@ouicertes9764]

The true schengen border, no need for a sign you've crossed a border, the specificities of culture, even road culture, inform you of it.

[@kushal4956]

wait till you hear about indian roads

[@MegaLordlego]

As someone who's daily commute (which tomorrow is the last day of) has been going in and out of Tampa, Florida for nearly the past 5 years, I cannot express how much I despise car-centric infrastructure

[@DASDmiser]

I've always been suspicious of the coziness between taxing bodies, the real estate "industry" and mortgage lenders.

[@Asmr_kungfu]

Thanks for the mention of our terrible roads. Sincerely a belgian

[@napoleonibonaparte7198]

American Suburban Infrastructure: Once in a generation debt-trap.

[@sdprz7893]

You're everywhere dude

[@vladiiidracula235]

@@sdprz7893 He’s all over Europe as well

[@usarkarzts4207]

@@vladiiidracula235 XD I'm sure everything will be fine for him.

[@baashi3578]

You hear people complaining about crumbling infrastructure in the US, this gave me a fresh perspective on the issue. Thank you for this well-researched and brilliantly presented video.

[@pattijesinoski1958]

School districts are propped up as well with infused loans. I had a guy from Texas come into my school district that was on debt. He told me how they loan money to the school districts that they will never be able to pay, so they are paying the interest only. He was so proud of his job. Back in 2012. The actual USA school district, town, state and federal debt was really 70 trillion.

[@andrewharris9302]

Bro we elected a good city manager in my town and we went from negative 10 million and now we’re at 6 million dollar surplus and now we pay competitive salaries for public employees.

[@meh23p]

What city was that?

[@Fidel_cashflo]

Yeah what city? I call cap lol

[@TheRatyzuma]

7:10 Ragging on the Belgians? INBURGERING COMPLETE

[@NotJustBikes]

Where's my passport!?

[@therealdutchidiot]

@@NotJustBikes Your credit ran negative when you tried to pass off the French flag as the flag of the Netherlands.

[@therealdutchidiot]

@Golden Romanov Inburgeren means integrating, and Dutch people have a national policy of bashing Belgium, same as Belgium has for the Netherlands.

[@BlitzsieLDiscoLSnow]

@Golden Romanov Like Ben said, we made it a sport to bash our southern neighbours. A little historical background: Belgium used to be part of our country until 1579 when they made the Union of Atrecht and sided with the Spanish overlords we fought against for independence. As a result, the Southern Netherlands (what we now call Belgium and two other provinces which have returned to the Netherlands) were split off, were only allowed to practice Catholicism, and later on had loads of problems with debt and government. We took two provinces back, Limburg and Noord-Brabant, but they were given the status of "special provinces", meaning they weren't allowed to have a representative in government. We still like to take a piss at Belgium and those two provinces for that, as they are still more influenced by the Catholic church due to their allegiance with Spain, compared to the more strictly Protestant northern provinces.

[@typhoidtyphoon]

It'd be like an American moving to Canada and everyone cheering and lining up to hug him as an honorary true Canadian when he first said "Sorry" and meant it :). Actual history is quite interesting as well, as Bellaen explained above.

[@raveli1125]

the cities in New York that have declared bankruptcies are the saddest ones bc they are overwhelming dense urban places, but are saddled with so much subsides to the suburbs plus industrial decline they collapse.

[@AsiaMinor12]

New York used to be an amazing state, probably the best state in the nation. It used to have multiple bustling cities full of life and prosperity. Suburbanization weakened the cities, but the real killer was the high taxes and the politics centered around wall street. Now most of New York is full of crime ridden, abandoned cities struggling with the opioid epidemic. People keep moving out to the suburbs or flee from the state, which means that NYC is increasingly going to have to pay more into upstate. And NYC is also losing people due to the corruption and living expenses. Oh how the mighty have fallen.

[@raveli1125]

@@AsiaMinor12 not true. Deindustrialization was the main killer, not high taxes and crime. Ppl who scream about crime do not know about the situation in NYC or the rest of the state and are usually partisan hacks who have ulterior motivations to say that. Corruption thou, will agree on! But that is anywhere with power!

[@MustacheDLuffy]

@@AsiaMinor12 it’s not suburbanization. People are leaving the city due to covid

[@ANTSEMUT1]

@@MustacheDLuffy covid19 hasn't been around for decades.

[@pchavez8833]

@@raveli1125 Wasn’t crime in NYC way worse in the 70’s/80’s/90’s? I think crime for the most part has gotten better in NYC iirc.

[@brishahowe2655]

As an American, I literally hate this place. We always have enough money for the few to stay wealthy, but not for the many to build wealth. Thank you for helping me articulate some of the source of that problem.

[@woyaochinidedoufu2753]

There's plenty of opertunity in the US to make a lot of money. Poor people are often to blame for their miss fortune, not the rich

[@Victor-tl4dk]

Everyone in the US could be living a prosperous non-sharcropping, non-workaholic life. It's the 21st century. They were talking about people not even needing to work 40/week in the early 1900s. Instead, people work MORE now for slightly better standards...

[@omzy8700]

Tbh some people need to realise that it is a lot easier to became rich in America compare to European countries ,many European countries are not even close to being good ,I live in Europe every country has some trade off ,for example many European countries don’t get has much pay as American for the same job .

[@SonKunSama]

"The roads become worse than Belgium's" Spoken like a true Dutchman.

[@Alex_Plante]

I'm a municipal engineer in Quebec, and I design municipal infrastructure. The funding model seems to be very different here than in the USA. In Quebec, cities do not borrow money directly, the province of Quebec borrows the money for the city, and the city has to repay the province over 20 years. To do this, the city has to present a funding plan to the province, and explain how they will pay for the annual amortization of the debt over 20 years. Also, the province limits the amount of debt a city can have (although the debt is technically provincial debt, the city owes the money to the province in the form of a future stream of revenue). The only sources of revenue Quebec cities have are property taxes and user fees. So the city cannot borrow money from the province unless they present a feasible taxation and user fee plan to the province to demonstrate how they will pay for the infrastructure over the next 20 years. Cities cannot declare bankruptcy, but the province can place mismanaged cities under tutelage and run them directly. The City of Montreal came close to coming under provincial tutelage in the 1990s. This probably explains why Quebec cities, even suburbs, are far more densely populated that most US cities.

[@kyriacosstavrinides893]

He did mention that in Canada since cities are capped on their debt spending that a lot of the debt is taken on by the province instead.

[@Quickshot0]

The provincial debt was mentioned in the video, yes. How ever Alex here was explaining how this isn't an unlimited debt acceptance from the province, but instead a, how will you repay the debt with in 20 years. Which obviously puts it within the lifecycle replacement time for the infrastructure. And also notes that in response to this requirement apparently Canadian suburbs are substantially more dense then USA ones. It's an interesting point I think, possibly showing that when required to keep debt sustainable, what gets built changes in to something a bit saner.

[@Alex_Plante]

@@Quickshot0 My comment was specific to the province of Quebec. I`m not sure how it works in other provinces, but Canadian cities generally are more densely built than US cities.

[@Quickshot0]

@@Alex_Plante I see, so that's how Quebec does it, unknown for others. So at most we can speculate that maybe they have something similar, but that would be just a guess based on the idea that 'surely'* provinces have similar policies.

[@Crazy_Diamond_75]

Back when I was in high school my family visited Quebec (city) for a few days. This was a long time ago and I wasn't exactly up on my urban planning when I was 14, but Quebec seemed so much denser and more European than anything I had seen at the time. I loved it though, it's one of the best trips I've ever been on, despite its brevity.

[@CalvinG4919]

“Tampa FL needs to pay $3.2 billion to repair its water systems...” 😬😬 Well that explains a lot...

[@SkySong6161]

It's money ill-spent. The water out here is disgusting and we get boil-water notices every four months.

[@hrford]

Isn't that money going on paying for paying for mending the water systems? (Yes, I did say "paying for" twice) :)

[@src175]

@@stephenpowstinger733 Haha what? That's... legimately awful. Holy crap.

[@kayo6689]

@@SkySong6161 Wait, the rest of the world doesnt have constant boil water notices???????? I've never even noticed them, all of my house's water is filtered and I'm a minor, but the dirty water rings true

[@charlesdao7812]

@@kayo6689 I’ve never gotten them, but we have filters anyways.

[@streetscience8646]

It would be cool to do a series of videos where you only lay out solutions for specific cities . Pick a city as an example and then go through key infrastructure changes that could have it on track to better city design. I'm sure there are certain general things that any city can do but there are also nuanced issues that are city dependent. Something like a "How to fix city X"

[@jasonriddell]

I would watch it but I doubt a LOT if "fixable" due to private ownership of all the properties and the city does NOT control the properties outside of TAX code and zoning laws but I doubt ether will get a MASSIVE expenditure from a large lot of property owners with differing financial means

[@mildsauce5019]

7:38! Oh my! What is this town!? Those buildings are BEAUTIFUL!!!

[@devynclaybrooks5338]

I’m glad he made the distinction “in any sane country” when talking about the waste management, because the US most certainly is not one of them

[@devynclaybrooks5338]

@@andrewlove3686 just because other places in the world do stupid things doesn't mean the US is doing things right by any stretch of imagination. Our cities are poorly designed, we have a broken education system both k-12 and college, mass shootings every day, you can get bankrupted by a hospital bill, a housing crisis and an opioid epidemic as well, you want me to keep going

[@huskytail]

@@andrewlove3686 I'm pretty sure you'd prefer compare to other developed countries, not those in the world that have waste issues of the same order of magnitude and complexity as the States right now.

[@blancavelasquez9859]

@@devynclaybrooks5338 literally most developed countries have shitty problems but yea “murica third world!” most countries also have problems with maintaining their infrastructure etc, our education system may be bad but certainly not one of the worst in the world plus it varies by state as do most european countries, housing crisis yet we keep building more and more affordable housing that’s being solved at the local level, cities poorly designed, yea every country has that dumbass, yea we do have a problem with affordable healthcare but we do have programs that help the elderly and the poor, literally there are tons of things the us is doing right but yea let’s just keep shitting on it, we’re also trying to help opioid victims as most states are taking it serious now, our colleges while they are not cheap by any means they are the best in the world with lots of scholarships for students that deserve them, we do have mass shootings but we’re striving to work on that by passing more strict gun control laws at the federal level and at state levels, we’re literally about to pass an infrastructure bill that will literally try to take on the problems you’re literally bitching about but yea US does nothing right😂🤦🏾‍♀️

[@qjtvaddict]

@@andrewlove3686 you accept mediocrity it’s ok

[@qjtvaddict]

@@andrewlove3686 so bury your head in denial?

[@ZackMensinger]

I find it hilarious that Backus, MN was used as an example - I know the town well as my parents have a lake cabin nearby! Definitely the type of town I never expected to see in a video like this, but also definitely a great example of this problem. Unfortunately, it's the kind of place that at one point was actually probably productive and "strong", despite its small size.

[@NotJustBikes]

Hah! I must admit, I've been to a lot of places in the US, but I've never been to Backus. It does look like the kind of place that could have been "strong" at one time, for sure.

[@iamtrash288]

It's fascinating how the indebptness and gdp look exactly exponential. It's like a textbook example of the simplest growth model. This can't be healthy

[@phil_matic]

As a person from Fairfield, CA, I chuckled and also cried when I heard the mention of Vallejo.

[@ArK047]

A strange thought struck me at around 2:45, it reminds me of fungus fairy rings. The fungus mycelium saturates a growing patch of land and sprouts fruiting bodies at the edges, pushing outwards because the land inside is already occupied by the fungus.

[@jackolantern7342]

just like...capitalism :).

[@thomasjamison2050]

I have always thought of human life on earth in terms of a fungus growing on a piece of fruit.

[@cariad561]

​Just thinking about how you'd even build a coalition to sort this out under American politics worries me, suburbanites are too important electorally to do anything other than keep pumping federal dollars in

[@NotJustBikes]

The only way is to get rid of the regulations that are holding back cities, like strict zoning and minimum parking requirements, and start making cities better.

[@cariad561]

@@NotJustBikes I mean sure, but white suburbanites are a privileged (as in they get special political attention, they tend to be quite swingy and important geographically) demographic in the US, and as policies lead to densification, or neglect leads to them having to consider installing septic tanks, then there's a huge political premium for jumping in and maintaining their lifestyle. Like it seems to be a total nightmare trying to build a stable coalition that either excludes suburbanites, or gives enough of them enough that they don't vote for the other guy. FPTP makes this massively difficult, because the dems are already maxing out urban seats, by and large, and a urban/as much as possible from rural areas doesn't really work because there's a huge gap to build up there. Probably not impossible but there needs to be some great strategists to nullify the temptation to chuck more money in the ponzi scheme as an election strategy.

[@C.Q.Q]

@@cariad561 As you densify the cities and let more people live in those, the ratio of population living in suburban places will decrease and their political influence will also decrease. But it's something that will take decades to show their effect

[@langhamp8912]

@@cariad561 Well, there's solutions and there's outcomes. Suburban debt eventually results in defaults, whether it be obvious bond forfeitures or less obvious maintenance debt.

[@AlRoderick]

A lot of suburbanites do not want to be suburbanites. They want to be in a townhouse or on a farm. They'll back you if you offer them the right way to get those things.

[@EmilyKresl]

I can't help but think of George Carlin talking about how embarrassing our country is now that everything is a shopping mall (in the 90s!) And I wish he were here today to talk about how they're empty.

[@TexasGunslinger9]

So glad I found this channel. I’ve felt this way for soooo long. Especially living in the DFW metroplex

[@ulrichspencer]

Honestly, I had recently been wondering why exactly the housing crisis can never seem to be resolved, and I had arrived at the answer that zoning was likely a huge culprit, driving up the prices and limiting the possible supply within a commutable distance of a city center. But this definitely would help explain why housing prices are skyrocketing: we're paying the long-overdue debt of our existing suburbia.

[@krombopulos_michael]

The suburbia problem and zoning issues are very often the same issue. Many of these cities have highly restrictive zoning policies that basically mandate suburban sprawl. When you zone huge swaths of residential land and make it illegal to build anything except detached single family houses, this is what you get.

[@bubba842]

Not just the house prices but taxes too. I pay $4000 a year for taxes, that is high for where I live. In Calgary a house that is much smaller than mine is $6000 a year. My sister in law in Ontario pays over $8000 a year for taxes. And after COVID we are all expecting those figures rates to go up. So in essence they are finally taxing us to death for suburbia.

[@rafclaassens9725]

You know someone has lived in the Netherlands for some time when they make jokes about the roads in Belgium.

[@chrisd725]

So interesting. I never noticed before that UK motorways have very little electrical infrastructure. I mainly know the M11 and A11, only some parts even have lights, the occasional information board which is not essential, and otherwise, only painted road and fixed signs (wish we could have more cats eyes if no lights though).

[@joaopedrobittencourt9524]

6:02 i think that's the best picture that represents north american urbanism: A tennis and a playground area where the it's PARKING LOT has the same size as the two

[@KaaimanProductions]

In Belgium. Everyone drives on the grass because the roads are more holes that road

[@MrMarkusmulder]

Yep, and they have a knife in the car to cut off the corners

[@tealmer3528]

I believe you are describing Philadelphia. We nearly went broke after white flight & factories (especially train and ship) going overseas caused our population to plummet from 2 million to 1.5. We have made progress in recent years... we are now at 1.55.

[@jwhite5008]

This actually happens in Russia in some places. Routinely. In fact I walked on grass for similar reason just yesterday.

[@FeedsNoSliesMusic]

Bit like the swiss cheese paradox I suppose.

[@MrMarkusmulder]

This picture of Belgium highway going to the Netherlands 😜

[@BlitzsieLDiscoLSnow]

As a Dutch person going on holiday to France, I always dread the moment I cross the border to Belgium, because they make their highways out of crumbling concrete slabs. So instead of a smooth black asphalt layer you have a thudthud-thudthud-thudthud of driving over badly fitting slabs of concrete. Although the Flemish (western) part is slowly catching up again and actually maintaining their roads. The Wallonian parts are still horrid. And then you get to France. Don't get me started about France. Some major highways are okay, but the moment you go to the side roads.... Let's just say there's a reason why all the old French cars had nice supple suspension.

[@guilhem2350]

@@BlitzsieLDiscoLSnow The big problem in France is that highways are private so they are really expensive

[@Andreas4696]

@@guilhem2350 Aren't French highways pretty nice though?

[@jwhite5008]

@@BlitzsieLDiscoLSnow Maybe it's their idea of traffic calming?

[@andrebartels1690]

Belgium is so small, everything goes to the Netherlands. When you come from Germany and don't brake hard enough, you'll miss Belgium and stop in the Netherlands. Just kidding 😉

[@DarthScrewtape27]

Terry the dog’s (Toto from the wizard of Oz) grave was destroyed when they put in a superhighway where he was buried. I don’t have many places to complain about this. This channel seems appropriate

[@MalletCNCWorks]

This is a great series and many people need to watch this. I spent 6 years on a board for a small Wisconsin City of 2500 people. We were somewhat lucky being small and not really a suburb. But all these issues we faced.

[@larshelmin]

Every serious car manufacturer has a replica of a Belgian cobble stone road section on their proving grounds. It's the ultimate shake test!

[@cccpredarmy]

Russians: Hold my kvas

[@MrRedberd]

We just use Detroit. They should change it from Motor City to Rim and Suspension City!

[@marianamelo8844]

My extended family lives in a small town in Brazil, the town has 5k people on the countryside but on a high density plan. Pretty much everyone has a septic tank, that is manteined and its fairly cheap.

[@doonerknight8169]

so basically, cars literally inflate the size requirements of anything & everything they touch to the point that the infrastructure needed to accommodate them is a debt inducing, wasteful, innefficient, costly for public & private nightmare that if people just used cargo bikes, mini cars at most (delivery for the big stuff) & public e-trains/trams to urban / sub urban places, ppl wud pay less, travel over less distance to get to places of interest, save time & money (no car payment or insurance, wow. that wud save me alot of money rly) & reach businesses especially small businesses which are/can be more efficient & just...better, wud hav a chance. dont get me wrong, as a american i greatly value my freedom to do "anything". but this videos series points out our real lack of actual, middle ground, viable options on how to live. not that i wanna live in the city. hell no. other people are hell. t-shirts have been made saying that for a reason. getting AWAY from others is a blessing. BUT! if it hurts my overall accessibility of living a more financially properous (efficient) lifestyle. (you know, save money, dont go into debt, pay up front for a house & stuff, anything really. you know...being a responsible person) then yeah. that sux. id like to hav my job not b 45 minutes away that demands i drive 2 hours a day 5 days a week not including shopping for food or other stuff. tldr, americas mentality of excess = success is a bankrupt concept from the start.

[@Albanach-je1nk]

I live in Perth Australia. And I find it the same as you describe When I lived in Edinburgh everything was at hand where I lived and I miss it.

[@katherinespezia4609]

I love that Strong Towns is one of your patrons. They're literally paying you to duplicate their content and that's hilarious to me.

[@shaungordon9737]

Well he does a lot of Europe specific stuff that they don't do

[@kristopherloviska9042]

Why is that hilarious? Maybe their goal is to spread their message by any means possible and not building obscene piles of cash.

[@milandavid7223]

@@kristopherloviska9042 I am often amazed by the amount of people who would rather build obscene piles of cash, than do anything beneficial.

[@Taudlitz]

@@kristopherloviska9042 heresy! :-D

[@dj_koen1265]

Money is pretty important I wish i had it

[@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent]

Fun fact. Many states relies heavily on other states for money. California, New York and a few other states are essentially life support systems for some states which depends on the wealth these states provide.

[@username16129]

Another fun fact, some states rely on other states for food supply that they could not produce on their own.

[@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent]

@@username16129 yep. A shame most US citizens that preaches how much they hate certain states tend to usually forget that they need those states to insure the one they live in survives

[@lennartgosman3640]

@@username16129 lol rubbish, still those states dont earn money enough with their food to pay for the roads. Just dumb republicans who cant think ahed. thats the whole game mate...

[@Dalton93H]

@@lennartgosman3640 They would if they started charging more money for the goods they produce. But in order to keep prices low for uneducated people like you most farmers operate at a net loss per year. The government then subsidizes these farmers every year to ensure they can still stay in business. All to keep corn at $1.00 a can and not $10.00.

[@qjtvaddict]

The money making cities should dump their homeless back in the shithole states and leave the union

[@TOH_Fan]

Me, a Minnesotan, crying about how cool Brainerd looked, and now it's literally the same as every other shitty rural town in North America.

[@gailjoe7217]

I like the shout out to maintaining your own septic, lol. People HATE paying for things they can't see* even though they use it everyday and need it working. They would rather get that 4K TV or vacation. Water wells and aquifers are in this category too. Good arguments to make people think about what "normal" is in their everyday experience for the US, Canada, and else-wheres that are run similarly.

[@amcaesar]

Excellent job as always distilling a complex matter, Jason.

[@jspicecue1463]

Who Jason?

[@rishi-m]

@@jspicecue1463 TIL NJB...uhm... person is named Jason. Surprising how long one can go without bothering to think of what a person's name is!

[@earlysda]

Bill, what is great about calling for higher density? Do you wish Corona to spread faster or something?

[@amcaesar]

@@earlysda I'm not sure what you're getting at -- I was complimenting him for a clear essay.

[@earlysda]

@@amcaesar Bill, Why do you agree that we should have greater density? Do you think it is good to have pandemics?

[@jblyon2]

I grew up in a house with a septic tank. Cheaper to have it pumped out, even if you do it every year (which is overkill), than what I pay for sewer now. If they're properly maintained they should never need expensive repairs or replacement.

[@Jenny-tm3cm]

I guess it probably depends on the ground too, my old one is in the ground but I also live in a place where everyone has a basement. Idk if you could install underground tanks in say, Florida or Texas where people don’t have basements

[@womenfrom0202]

@@Jenny-tm3cm mind you, sceptic tanks are used all around the world so I do not know what you are talking about

[@Ballaurena13]

@@Jenny-tm3cm It just depends on the ground's drainage and certainly requires a particular amount of room. You test this by digging a hole, filling it with water and timing how fast it drains. It's called a perk test. There can be issues on hills, though, if the ground has been cut away for like roads. I've never heard of an issue with a basement, but I'm sure that is because such things are accounted for in planning. In fact, our house pumped it uphill from our basement.

[@hoxiefam6731]

Septic is horrifyingly dumb in a place like Florida with a water table as high as 6 ft. The sewage just goes straight into the ocean and causes red tide.

[@xaiano794]

"but they're not willing to pay for it" - but that IS the american dream, to leech off the hard work of others, even future generations labour.

[@kristopherloviska9042]

But the people who live in these suburbs all would consider themselves "hard working Americans". How else were they able to afford to move to the suburbs in the first place?

[@xaiano794]

@@kristopherloviska9042 because the infrastructure they use is paid for via debt, they haven't actually paid for it, that's why they can afford it.

[@aaron5222]

@@xaiano794 the city I live in made a deal with companies including Facebook and Google to pay for infrastructure. Hundreds of millions of dollars. I own an acre and we have a septic system. City management can be handled much differently just most haven't had much planning ending in a mess

[@xaiano794]

@@aaron5222 it's not the purchase price that is ever the issue, it's the cost of maintenance and inevitably replacing the infrastructure that almost always is uncovered in us towns and cities. I mean check your local town budget and see what kind of surplus they are running (to fund replacing your current roads etc in about 25 years and for increasing maintenance costs) and I'm betting that it will be virtually non existent. Your town is simply pushing the problem onto the next generation and having very low density residential areas means the cost to a single property when these costs become due is 5 to 25 times higher than higher density residential districts.

[@Jenny-tm3cm]

@@xaiano794 I guarantee you, every American you see that flaunts “being rich” has insane amounts of debt just to pull off that “look”. I mean most Americans have debt (student loan debt) but literally I met people who were in their early 20s and already had over $100k in credit card debt. These same people would show off the fancy stuff they would buy and attempt to shame others for “being poor”

[@reel9877]

My city (Saginaw, MI) is a typical example of suburban sprawl and car dependancy and for most of my life (I'm 20) with no opportunity to leave the U.S. I had no idea that there were different ways to develop cities. Your videos are addressing all of the things that I hate about North American cities and mine especially (stroad is such a useful term!), and I really am considering moving to Europe after college after seeing how much better a walkable city plan can be (and how really, really awesome trains and public transit can be).

[@Spockkker]

Saginaw being a terrible city has nothing to do with suburban sprawl, but with terrible demographics and a declining economy for decades.

[@Victor-tl4dk]

I too am considering moving to Europe after earning some money after college... braindrain Btw the US can still tax your income when abroad if you make more than a certain (albeit kind of high) amount. AND you still have to file a tax return with the freedom gov. when abroad.

[@Zmaenlplibi]

Why not just move to Europe during college! Safe money, make friends super easily and enjoy university language classes. In Germany for example students from the U.S. can study basically for free, you just have to pay for housing (between 250 to 500€ per month depending on location). There are also universities that teach entirely in English.

[@wraithwrecker_]

Another fucking banger. The American debt economy necessitating "infinite" growth is literally a death spiral that signals civilizational decline. It also drives ecological collapse as the "need" for infinite expansion intensifies. Certainly a huge topic, but you've done a masterful job explaining this small sliver of that problem. Can't wait for the next installment!!!!!!

[@pierren___]

True: we must protect the life of the commoner, using the money of the wealthy.

[@pierren___]

@@ASS_ault yes, or that country will collapse and the rich will abandon you

[@monk-us8439]

Look into Chris Hedges if you’ve got a moment

[@diablo.the.cheater]

@@trol4889 Well, when they try to leave, you execute them for treason, a rich leaving the country that made them rich is a crime against its people not better than homicide, the rich are to be enslaved.

[@MishaFlower]

@@diablo.the.cheater this but unironically. Seize their money if they migrate. You can’t take advantage of a country’s labour and resources and then just decide to move to China and give a middle finger to their country

[@michaelnajera7958]

(Watches next strong towns video) Now what am I going to do for the next 2 months of my life?

[@NotJustBikes]

Hopefully the next one should be out in 2 weeks. ;)

[@666Tomato666]

@@NotJustBikes you're spoiling us!

[@gennadyzyablitsev5031]

Suddenly, I found this channel. It took me about 5 or 6 videos to realize that this is not the Cities Skylines tutorials, but anyway, thanks for your service.

[@SadisticSenpai61]

One of the rural towns in the area my family's from actually moved the town 10 miles to the NE after the railroad came through and missed the town. They voted and dismantled their houses and all the buildings except the one-room schoolhouse and rebuilt along the railroad. I'm not sure why they didn't move the schoolhouse, but it's still at the spot where the town used to be - it's been turned into a house and my grandparents actually rented it for a couple years shortly after they were married.

[@jasonriddell]

in BC there is a wine available called "blasted church" and there was a Church left behind when a town moved once the local boom ended and they placed dynamite in the church to loosen the nails to disassemble it and MOVE it to the next town

[@user-ms7gt2km5f]

The addiction to debt is a worthwhile topic. We need a solution

[@IvarDaigon]

Excessive debt = inflation which is essentially a hidden tax that disproportionately affects people who do not hold assets, these people are usually the poorest. So really, people who demand services beyond what local and regional governments are able to provide, with the taxes they are able collect, are sowing the seeds for themselves and future generations to remain poor.

[@theme7363]

the dollar is debt nothing is real blah blah

[@Josefsson9013]

I live in a small city in the middle of Sweden called Östersund, and the city is in so much debt, so one year they tried the thing with shutting off the lights at night, worked great in the summer not so much in the winter and someone got hit and died and they now have them on at night

[@jaineas]

I wish this type of story would be shown in the international news. It's so absurde.

[@fjp3305]

The American dream? No, thank you

[@quitendam]

I really got a hang of this "suburban nightmare" kind of feeling.

[@ej28]

Even the Soviet city layout of microdistricts, as ugly as it may be was so much better than modern suburbia.

[@CCMqueretaro]

Probably not...

[@issecret1]

@@CCMqueretaro as someone who has lived in both (in the same country), yes, suburbia is way worse

[@CCMqueretaro]

@@issecret1 interesting! Went to Ukraine a few years ago and it was a fascinating experience. What part of Eastern Europe you in right now? Or indeed, Russia. Hoping to visit at some point didnt make it for the world cup sadly.

[@psychout3481]

True. Can confirm. Soviet cities were better planned than those sprawling suburbia.

[@issecret1]

@@CCMqueretaro Romania. I'm not a great person to recommend touristic attractions, unfortunately

[@amenmodhafar9493]

Just discovered this channel, and loving your content. Thank you

[@albertastro3761]

Insightful videos. I enjoy watching and correlating them to my current town/city/state. Good stuff!

[@yewnew]

Funny how I learned all this by playing SimCity 3000 as a kid. Don’t grow too fast or you’ll go bankrupt. Usually I had to ‘call cousin Vinnie’ which is enabling the money cheat 😄

[@OhNoNotAgain42]

I have worked for a medium sized city for 30 years. In all that time, I only know one city planner who played Sim City. He was the most creative of all of them.

[@ogad84]

The money cheat applies in real life, the dollar cheat!

[@MartijnterHaar]

Watching this in Amsterdam, where the city needs €2 billion to prevent the city from crumbling into the canals and mortgage debts are infamously high for the world. Still, the city of Amsterdam can't complain about density or tax revenue. Actually, I have been expecting a video from this channel about the crumbling canals for a while now.

[@robeleco1]

The difference between Amsterdam and the North American cities is, that Amsterdam is still able to pay for the repairs of the canals and bridges, since it is a very wealthy city. It has more than enough revenue, certainly after COVID, to pay its bills. It was just a mistake made in the past to not allocate sufficient money to maintain the water infrastructure. Due to how things were organised. It has nothing to do with lack of money in general.

[@tmnvanderberg]

Both of these things are problems but neither is related to insolvency of the city, but rather just to political decisions

[@ronaldderooij1774]

@@tmnvanderberg Poltical decisions can lead to insolventcy very quickly. Or the opposite. That is the nice thing about politics.

[@groundzero_-lm4md]

This video is showing how suburbs cannot pay for their infrastructure. Per household, they alone cannot pay for the roads, sewage, garbage, and potable water. Amsterdam (political shinangans aside) could in theory pay for these without external funds. Or borrow money and be able to pay it off later.

[@MrJimheeren]

Also our canals are 400 years old those American suburbs are barely hitting 60. Plus we can easily pay for it. Amsterdam can just borrow it and pay it back in 50 or so years

[@juancampbell269]

I feel special that my home town of Jefferson county Alabama was called out for going bankrupt.

[@pstolee]

What a great analysis that is simply stated and to the point.

[@DrSpychology]

Uh oh, he's talking shit on Belgium, don't let him know that Belgium also has a serious issue with urban sprawl which results in endless traffic jams, problems with supplying enough clean water, getting rid of excess rain water, building cost, noise and light pollution, social conflict, climbing upkeep costs, crime AND excessive use of natural resources. Luckily we can shrug the commentary off from the Dutch because of their silly accent!

[@NotJustBikes]

I used to live in Belgium. ;)

[@DrSpychology]

@@NotJustBikes uh oh, he knows, distract him with fries and beer!

[@daanwilmer]

Dus wij moeten ons een Vlaams accent aanmeten om door u serieus genomen te worden? So we have to acquire a Flemish accent to be taken seriously by you?

[@DrSpychology]

@@daanwilmer Denk dat de gemiddelde vlaming dan toch een ander excuus vind, echt open voor kritiek staan we niet

[@complainer406]

There's an island off the coast of Newfoundland that's part of France called St Pierre. Going to the town there was pretty eye-opening. Everything about it except its government is the same as Newfoundland: same age, same climate, same terrain, same building materials. And yet, it's totally different from any Canadian town. The French maybe aren't on the same level as the Dutch, but it's definitely a lot more walkable and dense.

[@QemeH]

And the interesting thing there is: That's not even a cultural thing - it's simply french laws preventing the local government from going crazy with the debt and zonign laws and such.

[@chuckyb_]

7:09 Crossing the border into Belgium literally feels like going from on to off road XD