How can Magha be anywhere but Leo???

In this video, Part 4 of my Refutation of Sam Geppi's presentation against tropical signs and sidereal nakṣatras, I answer the repeatedly asked question, "How can Magha be anywhere but Leo???"

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

The point is simple: if you accept the definition of nakshatras as a combination of signs and navamshas and dasha planets, then there is no way you could see magha outside Leo. But if you are willing to see the nakshatras the way the Vedas describe them - as deities - it is easy to see them in different rashis than what the sidereal zodiac pins them to. Then you wouldn't have to ignore that the Vedas take Krittika, not Ashvini as the first (thus putting Magha outside of Leo).

[@olah8536]

@@sacredflames07 this sounds like a curse 👀

[@INNIMA]

revolt 07 your a religious Zealot

[@paerarru]

@@sacredflames07 As opposed to you who are ALREADY blind, refusing to see reality as it is.

[@paerarru]

Well said, very simple: nakshatras ARE NOT (solar) signs. The idea that nakshatras can only correspond to certain signs is at best silly. Why (not to mention why this or that particular sign...), just because?? Nakshatras are at best "lunar" or "star" (sidereal) signs, but more properly they can be understood as lunar HOUSES, and just as houses fall on different signs depending on the ascendant, so also nakshatras fall on different signs depending on the grand cycle of the zodiac, the ecliptic.

[@KillShot-ln6mn]

@@paerarru So in Western, my Moon is in 13 degrees Aries, Sun in 6 degrees Cancer, & Ascendant in 22 degrees Leo, in Vedic it's Moon in 20 Degrees Pisces, Sun in 12 degrees Gemini, & Ascendant in 28 degrees Cancer. What are my Nakshatras according to Vic's calculations?

[@creamstein]

lol I love how everyone comes to listen and then mostly end up just spreading death thru language anyways....... When they indeed first came here to listen for information that they did not know. Then their mind is made up, because , I would say, that you are a free thinker, they need more stringent , confining guide posts in life. I fucking love you Vic. I respect you and aim to uphold such freedom of teaching and learning while along this life path I find myself on now, within this age. You are 1 of my favorite souls to connect with over KZbin. Thanks teach. The ones who are receptive love you dearly

[@More_readings]

I was feeling that this correspondence Sun sign and Nakshatra is not tough. I read your book, it’s a true gem. Your video gives a breath of fresh air. Finally. 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@bombon825]

Great explanation Vic. Even those who disagree with you, have to admit that your deep understanding of Nakshatras is admirable. I believe in your approach and will continue to rely on it moving forward.

[@FernandoRaulAstrology]

This is the biggest hurdle to jump in order to change from sidereal to tropical. The idea of separating the nakshatras from the rasis is iconoclastic as we can see by the backlash and name calling. Probably both zodiacs were fused together at some point in the past and nakshatras being more relevant to muhurtas and ceremonial astrology, got overshadowed by the rasis and their horoscopic usage. Maybe thats why nakshatras don't make a whole lot of sense except for timing. The question here is how are nakshatras used siderealy in the tropical zodiac and with what ayanamsa. That would seal the deal. We are either in the beginning of an astrological renaissance or the beginning of a great astrological schism.

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

They were fused together at the time of the 12 rashis rising in prominence suddenly, along with the appearance of natal astrology, which is roughly 2,000 years ago, coincidental (?) with Alexander the Great's term, when the descending equinox was in close coincidence with Spica (Citra's yogatāra).

[@FernandoRaulAstrology]

VicDiCarasAstrology yes but as I understand chitra paksa ayanamsa came to usage after Indian independence to homogenize the Indian calendar. Correct?

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

no, it existed since the beginning of rashi usage. After Indian independence it was accepted as the official ayanamsha for the Indian religious calendar. All the other traditional ayanamshas are within a very small margin - placing the descending equinox very very close to Spica at the time the rashis began to be widely used

[@FernandoRaulAstrology]

VicDiCarasAstrology what ayanamsa do you recommend to calculate nakshatras sidereally with tropical rasis?

[@Howtorockacampfire]

Fernando Raul Astrology That's a hard one to answer. Check out the work of Ernst Wilhelm if you haven't already, his "Vaultoftheheavens" seems to have a workable tropical ayanamsa which seems to be a Nakshatra scheme dialed back a few degrees, i believe to account for the stars having also moved a bit since vedic times. Apparently it works dependably by his own reckoning, more so than the classical sidereal schema... Sigh, at least I hope so :/

[@rudiedear4462]

Vic, no one is battling you anymore. They have all stopped making videos on the subject. Can you not let it go? Us lovers of astrology don't want a boxing match. If we did, we would be watching pay-per-view. Please let it go. There is more dignity and grace in that.

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

There is no boxing here, there is an explanation. Sam and KRS released hours of criticism of myself and my system. I am entitled to reply in full.

[@Ribble.B087]

Why should Sam Geppi & Kapiel Raaj publicly apologise to Vic? Mind you, both of them had'nt mentioned his name, not even once in all their videos..I think that's a mature & peaceful response. If Vic hadn't aggressively attacked these guys & their gurus in Facebook & his blog, I doubt they responded with strong emotions bcos clearly they got really upset with his posts. Vic can present his views & arguments in respectable tone & manner, both of them couldn't care less if Vic wants to challenge them with his opinions & logic. Like I told Kapiel a few days ago, all astrologers are free to use the Sidereal or Tropical zodiac. We, their students/followers are adults. We will decide for ourselves which areas of astrology we prefer or agree upon.

[@Sarah-Arlow]

Vic my thoughts exactly....it's funny how all of a sudden they decided to do that video - coincidence I think not....and more to the point how did they ALL not see any of this coming?? You have openly used your own chart on several videos - so logic wasn't working for them then and if they depend on intuition (for readings or otherwise) it appears not very good either as you were still invited on to the their channels before they even saw your chart (and possibly after). You're better off on your own because from my own knowledge and experience of group dynamics that is one group you are lucky to be excluded from - 'if anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, as you leave, shake the dust of your feet'....just make sure you do it after the last video!! lol

[@Ribble.B087]

Yeah, I agree..Kapiel Raaj makes a great talk host than an astrologer. As time goes by, I find a few of his guest astrologers have more in depth knowledge of Vedic Astrology than he does. I follow those guys ...but still I do find many of Kapiel's videos entertaining. 😊😄

[@matthewharkleroad3871]

As a beginner, my jury is still out on this fascinating issue, but, intuitively this point makes sense. My understanding is that we are talking about layers of circles drawn in the heavens by bodies of widely ranging distances, movements and pathways. Doesn't it make sense that the relationships would change and evolve as the varying layers moved on their independent journeys, changing the overlay and the meanings and interpretations along with them?

[@paerarru]

Exactly, Sir! Signs and nakshatras are simply not the same thing just because they have a close relationship (same as signs and houses, for example). When you force equality like that as I'm sure you know you just lose a whole layer of meaning. How much wrong has been done due to short-sightedness...

[@RoseOfTheBear]

In sidereal zodiac my lagna (same both systems) lord sun is deeply debilitated in Libra, in tropical it is in Scorpio, in a better house, where it would be much happier. In sidereal zodiac my Jupiter is in Sagittarius, in tropical it's in Capricorn, debilitated, in a much worse house, 6th house. My sun mahadasha was the worst period of my life. I was living under the poverty line for most of it, lost my job. Very low self-esteem, couldn't get anywhere in life. It was a real struggle to pull myself out, Moon mahadasha brought immediate relief. I can tell just by how I feel when I have a Jupiter bhukti, which brings good fortune, great feelings, travel, and good money. I'll be feeling wonderfully joyful and check my dasha and sure enough, it'll be Jupiter or the other planets influenced by Jupiter. My chart and personal experience have made it clear to me that the sidereal system is the correct one. Fundamentals.

[@PeachyKins]

Yessss! ☆☆☆ I can relate 100% - sidereal natal chart is, without question, the *accurate* story of my life, too! Additionally, in observing the way different astrologers read charts, sidereal Astrology = meat and potatoes (substance), while *IMO* western is so shallow, it reminds me of grocery store birthday cake, mostly cheap icing. The worst was recently saw one western astrologer attempt to analyze Kevin Spacey, she completely overlooked the fact that he's in his 2nd saturn return aka saturn AND jupiter return TOGETHER. Seriously, that in and of itself says a lot, and that it happened last time Saturn was in Scorpio. She completely missed that. Bright Blessings ✌ ☺💕

[@leticiapaz94]

Yes i got mars exalted in sidereal and mars Maha dasha was the best time of my life

[@xxaerot1cc399]

@@leticiapaz94 mano ao mesmo tempo que eu quero acreditar nele, eu tbm duvido.

[@gabriel2011biel]

Ok but what does past life karma, ancestors, and regulus (star of recognition) itself can be put anywhere but in leo??? that's a great question indeed, leo is connected to the 5th house of heritage, dna and pitra dosha, it does make a lot of sense actually, just the symbol for royalty itself is leo matching. How come bharani be taurus? taurus is allegedly materialistic and mundane, beauty and money hungry, bharani is about death, judgement and duties (?) this becomes very confusing, because the tropical signs although very shallow are very fixed in terms of definition, the vedic system always seems contradictory. And how come ardra be cancer??? destructive and negative energy, when gemini itself is connected to the third house, and mithuna means sexual intercourse, repsented by woman and men, rudra and rudrani (?) it makes more sense to me idk. the third house which corelates with anger and temperamental behaviour, kama and courage. The sidereal nakshatras with rasis is more accurate in my opinion. I've never felt cancer energy in my life, yet on tropical astrology i had cancer rising??? with virgo moon, which i completely refuse because it just don't make sense. I feel like people don't get the nakshatras right, but i don't think it has to do wityh the rasis, it's just that the deities are wildly buried in mystery, and it becames very harsh to connect with them. For example with you try to educate about the pitris, there is little to nothing about pitris to find online, unless you by a book or whatever, but thatmakes the nakshatra system hard to sympathize, cus not everybody would care enough to go search about so deeply. the sidereal connections put the nakshatras in some light, that even let's say ashlesha don't go along with cancer that much, it does become more didactic for ordinary people to understand. IDK my opinion.

[@paerarru]

Good question. Here's the simple answer. The nakshatras can be in different signs the same way that different planets and different houses can be in different signs. Yes, the nakshatras may carry the energy of certain stars, gods, grahas what have you. But this energy is expressed in different SOLAR signs differently. The same as the energy of planets and houses can fall in different signs (rashis). Vic is not saying that this nakshatra "belongs" to this sign "as opposed to" this other sign. He's saying that every nakshatras can and eventually WILL belong in EVERY sign. Is that really so difficult a concept? The idea that nakshatras are fixed in their rashis is dogmatic to the point of ridiculousness.

[@MJ-ix1nh]

Vic, I think you're doing a good job, hold your own space, deflect the negativity...because you are on to something. Your report wouldn't be so accurate if you weren't. After some contemplation: Internally, I am more a Virgo Moon than a Leo Moon (also 'Mind' wise)...I'm definitely classically introverted (Jungian---INTJ). Also emotionally very Virgo (keep overly emotional outbursts to self--not super dramatic, nor do I like a lot of outward attention, not really...I hide a lot). In occultism Virgo is considered the 'exalted' sign given to the "Magician" = Master Manifestor (Hermes=Mercury= hermetic code)....(the behind the scenes manifestors--the puppet masters). People don't realize these are the current rulers of this world. (A lot of Virgos-Geminis run corporations/banks). So, if Magha is in Virgo, this would make sense!! For me personally, adding in the variable of my Masculine Gemini-asendant (talk to strangers--chatty--out-going in a "curious about people" way not "attention seeking" way--versatile/quick--easily adaptable)...it does come together very accurately. I say empirical evidence is the best remedy. Lol. I'm following this debate closely...because its extremely interesting to me!

[@omtatsat7]

if we take Brihat Samhita of Varahamihira, then it says that the Magha Nakshatra is in Leo, and all the others, respectively, do not change signs. As now, one zodiac for signs and nakshatras (sidereal). If you are a Vedic astrologer, you must accept his opinion.

[@RaviSingh-vf3he]

Om Tat Sat yeah... exactly... vahamira was right maybe vedas are wrong to put krittika as the 1st nak.

[@sacredflames07]

The white won't stop adultrating every corner of the existence of the universe so that people are mislead and devolved of spiritual growth....

[@paerarru]

You said "nakshatras do not change signs". Let me ask you, which sign do Kirtikka, U. Phalguni, U. Asada belong to, then? When you truly understand an answer, then you understand a question. Then you realize how questions themselves, not just answers, can be "wrong", they can be incomplete. Just as you can get better, more accurate answers, you can also learn to ask better, more accurate questions. The question "which sign does such and such nakshatra belong to" is wildly inaccurate, it's a terrible question. Before you accept ANY opinion, learn to accept TRUTH. Learn to accept facts, learn to accept reality.

[@leelaindrani3371]

Wow, I was surprised at how lacking your argument was... First, you denounce use of Vimshottari dasha lords and only a few minutes later pronounce that "for some reason" Bharani seems it'd fit better in Taurus and Purva Phalguni in Taurus or Libra... that made me laugh actually, seeing as those nakshatras are both Venus-ruled in the system you just denounced, and that would tie everything together even how your own intuition is matching. They chose the Vimshottari dasha rulers not arbitrarily, but because the qualities of the rulers are inherent in the nakshatras. Also, your understanding of the rashis and nakshatras is very elementary, and this video truly proves your inexperience (since you've only been studying for a few years now and have admitted it). Ardra, the nakshatra of antagonism can't fit in the sign of Gemini, duality? Why do you think it's called the moist one? Do you have any idea? There's a much deeper meaning than what you're thinking there, but you clearly don't know what you're talking about. It has nothing to do with Cancer whatsoever. It frightens me that people listen to this very childlike and even incoherent garblings compared to the beautifully complex and integrated system that is being used with sidereal.

[@deepaktripathy1]

This is what happens in this Dark Age ruled by Rahu !! Someone comes up and jumbles up everything and acts as if he is some "New Age Reformer" and a hell lot of people start blindly following like a herd of sheep. Some are saying " Guruji, without looking at the video, I know you are right", some are saying " This is the issue I faced with Vedic" etc. etc. etc. without reading literature, without even predicting stuff using both zodiacs. They refuse to see the inaccuracy of Tropical in making any prediction or even giving an accurate reading to a person. Now he is telling people that Nakshatras can resonate with any sign. Wow !!! Not to sound racist, but I really feel at times that some of the followers are hardcore westerners who refuse to believe that such accurate, perfect and complex science of Sidereal astrology can originate out of Vedic India. Hence "white" saviors like Ernst and Vic have incarnated on this planet to reform. People like them come, try hard for their fame and go away but wisdom of enlightened sages will remain the eternal truth for ages and ages.

[@imaginationland474]

I think Vic devoting his whole life to learning about this philosophy of Jyotish proves that he is a Sag ascendant rather than Capricorn as tropical would have it. haha

[@christinapissanidou2504]

ImaginationLand He looks like a Capricorn, though. I am with you Vic. You make total sense. And i don't think you need to be flaweless or anything in your conduct, for you to be right or at least have a truly valid point.

[@anthonyb.7836]

ImaginationLand vic’s tropical rising is 25 degrees Capricorn, so his sidereal rising would be 1 capricorn, try again stupid.

[@INNIMA]

Deepak Tripathy tropical astrology is Vedic just like in the west. New age reformers you say? More like relying on revision of ancient Vedic texts rather than “tradition”.

[@shaunakm8830]

I am a Ketu Leo Magha ascendent.. I am follwing your videos and respect your vast knowledge on this subject of Nakshtras

[@garima2759]

Appreciate the way you are bringing forward these points! Thanks! For any faculty based on calculations & formulae, Reliability/Consistency/ Repeatability are the important validating attributes. I am wondering if we could look at a few famous charts & link the events in their lives with the methodology we are listening from both the sides.

[@drege8510]

Anyways vedic knowledge is time tested.we shouldn't however totally alienate ourselves from other views

[@aleadender1123]

Meister Eckhart's quote “The eye through which I see God is the same eye through which God sees me; my eye and God's eye are one eye, one seeing, one knowing, one love.” came to mind while contemplating this explanation... If the lens I use to see God (gods, eternal) is from Earth, through the Rashis to the Nakshatra's where they live; then the lens they use to see me is the same (in reverse).... I'm struck with the image of how they might see me... what that horoscope chart might look like... if in some way, the dot that is me on their map has some meaning similar to the dot they embody on mine has meaning..... Thank you and Namaste'

[@kristine6996]

No, I can connect to G’d I can never be G’d. So her eye and mine are different and yet the same.

[@benrokh]

While the argument that the vedic nakshatras and the babylonian zodiac are seperate is very much valid, it does create a very practical mathematical problem not found in western astrology when it comes to tropical vs siderial:If you try to use tropical signs with siderial nakshatras without modern software, you make your job much more complicated in terms of navamsha and similar calculations required in the BPHS methodology. In basic terms it creates twice the work for you in regards to the math.Now certainly one could argue that a great guru would not be deterred by such a problem, but that argument flies out of the window once you use arguments like "kali yuga" during which according to most calculations the 12 sign zodiac was actually invented and used!So thinking realistically, what would be the likelihood that astrologers would have used the tropical zodiac at the time the classical texts we follow today were written?Please note that i am not dismissing the usage of the tropical zodiac in modern times, but i do doubt its historical usage in vedic astrology and its classical teachings.

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

I think this is a very negligible problem. All you have to do is add or subtract one value (ayanamsha) to go back and forth between tropical and sidereal.

[@benrokh]

Thank's for the reply. I agree that the math itself isn't any harder as a single modifier will solve most problems, but adding it manually every time is quite a lot of work in the long run. I still remember the shock of calculating manually the divisional charts for the first time, because of how easy it was with the way the siderial zodiac is tailored into the nakshatra system. In fact, it wont surprise me if the nakshatras were the whole reason why the siderial zodiac was so widely integrated into standard vedic astrology yet never adopted by the tajika system for example. what do you think?

[@alf4006]

Radically deep.

[@rhythmsofnaturewellness]

Is there any correlation between the collective consciousness being Rasi based in the Kali yuga and then more Nakshatra based in the Dwapar yuga?

[@based9930]

No.

[@divulgedspirit]

8:00 but if u shift them into the dynamic in which u propose. (Cause all have to shift) then how many don't make sense then?

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

how many already dont make sense in sidereal? please see vicdicara.blog/2023/03/13/how-can-rohini-be-in-gemini/

[@divulgedspirit]

@Vic DiCara's Astrology you present a good logic. I have had similiar thoughts. But moola is the roots...and it sits in the galactic center I think that's exactly what was intended and that fact has not changed... I think the issues crop up because neither tropical nor vedic use true constellation degrees. I have 4 planets 1-4 degrees from Another sign. I think the fact neither system implements the logic of cancer being about 18 degrees and taurus being about 35 creates issues on many levels.. from people arguing about cusps ,house systems and obviously the point at hand. I think focusing on the 12 signs while there's a much more detailed system called nakshaktras is a huge set back as well. If you use true constellation degrees you'll find in some charts (like my girlfriends) you get placements that 3-4 placements are like her western while the other half looks like her vedic placements. And if we are implementing the logic of the main point concerning the signs shifting through time then there's alot to hash out. I would be very interested to see a video where you talk this all out. I study alot of occult and observe magic practices and have noted weither tropical or sidereal seems to have a better effect in planetary magic and I think vedic has shown more results. That's just a side note anyways.. I'm not an astrologer nor do I k ow too much of scientific astronomy. I would be very interested in a video on this. I think so would others

[@divulgedspirit]

@@VicDiCaraAstrology I have 4 planets pretty tight and so I feel like I can feel what resonates. The general description of aquarius fits me very well. I do not resonate with pisces. Yet I feel like purva bhadrapada resonates just as much as shatabishta even though I am considered the latter. It's quite a conundrum.

[@mashiachadonai]

U rock dude! Merci.

[@sheilathefighter]

We got the zodiac is different than nakshatra problem is in tropical and sidereal is : in calculation even pada changes and also the houses .

[@nadiyasamanich4390]

I'm convinced that your approach is logical and not intuitive at all.

[@gilesoffray9346]

Astrology is based on science so intution helps but should not be the primary guidance used.

[@nadiyasamanich4390]

Maybe but in readings if there's no intuition the accuracy is about 50% that's all

[@nadiyasamanich4390]

yeah it's not addressing anything in any real way.

[@nadiyasamanich4390]

I'm still contemplating the possibility that these guys made this shift to Vedic astrology using tropical signs just to get publicity. I've seen this happen a lot where they come out with something off the wall just so that they get attention anyway you guys have seen it before too. But I like him and I have liked his work for years and what he says about nakshatras in and of themselves is very useful.

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

logic is the foundation on which intuition thrives. Yoga and Nyāya darshans are founded on this. Logic and intutition are not at odds.

[@Solarian25]

I have moon in magha 0 degree 5:15 🌟💛

[@miha2863]

Thank you so much! That was exactly the issue I faced with vedic astrology and you answered my questions.

[@rationalityrules111]

A lion personified.

[@catherinemurray2211]

How do I get my chart done I’m 22/11 and my name is 11/3/33 I have this also in my chart

[@TungaroPlau]

Very Interesting. In an ideal Astrology-debate classroom the formidable rival would be in Claire Nakti's work. All interesting for certain

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

he declined even to be interviewed by me, much less to debate.

[@TungaroPlau]

@@VicDiCaraAstrology well the 3 of you are appreciated by many and bring light to darkness so thank you. If i have the debate in my own head, summing up, one side explains how moon being a satellite brings special rules to the calculation vs planets. The other side shows examples of how valuable gandanta points are. I say we're all needed, trying to decode God's instructions book

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

IDK, it seems like you are on a different page entirely from either argument, or at least mine. I never say anything about the moon brings special rules, etc. Also Gandanta is not a sidereal-specific consideration - it is the border between water and fire signs.

[@mariya9076]

Maha is mine nd leo also by where is my kingdome

[@alf4006]

Source materials.

[@MM-uv6kb]

excellent..thank you

[@saicolozi]

I am a bit confused. I recalculated my vedic chart with tropical and my lagna nakshatra (Bharani) didnt change but my venus and mars which I had known were in Magha are now in Purva P. and my previous Cancer Jupiter is sitting in Magha 😖

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

Maybe you used Vault of Heavens? That site uses a very atypical method for determining nakshatras.

[@jehan8860]

Vic DiCara's Astrology, I was wondering the same. What software do you use? Is Kala any different?

[@saicolozi]

@@VicDiCaraAstrology yes I did 😆. You got it right! Because I found another (Korean) astrologer who changed from sidereal to tropical in vedic. So I visited the site as she recommended :)) Thank you for the reply 🙏🏼

[@aditiraulia5417]

Is it beneficial to learn the vedic astrology nakshastras only?

[@d82713]

Hi Vic, could you also explain how the dasha systems need to be calculated. Do they get affected by the tropical zodiac use?

[@VicDiCaraAstrology]

d82713 those that are nakshatra based are not affected by having tropical rāśi.

[@williamweir4494]

Thank you, I've Sun in Magha pada 2 ketu/ Rahu and Saturn in Magha pada2 ketu/Sun and ketu in Svati pada 3 Rahu/Venus. In Rasi Sun Leo Magha 2 Direct Saturn Leo Magha 2 Direct and ketu Libra Swati 3 retrograde lol x

[@gnostie]

Why not keep saying it, but not strive for loudness? Whoever has ears ready for the message will hear you still.

[@atulkamath6627]

Hence QED..! Bravo..!