How Churches Should Respond to Scandal - Julie Roys | The Roys Report

[@leonoreburciaga2023]

This is the BEST and MOST NEEDED podcast on any and all Christian podcast platforms. Thank you, Remnant Radio. She speaks much needed truth telling all of us to repent and return to the Lord . ...... that's real "prophet talk" right there. Give me this over all the rest of the "prophetic" anytime. 👍🎉🙏.

[@necieden]

So very interesting. I thought all these years that what i witnessed was me. Nope, follow our discernment and continue to trust God! Thank you for your commentary.

[@rebeccabirk3207]

Thank you Julie for saying that THEY SHOULD NEVER LEAD AGAIIN!!!!!

[@Martihorn]

Not going to court against a brother was for disputes over a cow or a fence line. It was never intended for sexual abuse of a 12 year old. The father should have called the police. This is so awful. And frankly, Morris was in NO WAY a brother of any kind to the family.

[@kimmer5370]

Very inappropriate read of text to support crimes including felonies by and to church members. Abusers have used this verse to stop accountability for perpetrators for years

[@edithgrainger5383]

Yes definitely Cindy 's father as spiritual head of his family , betrayed not only his daughter but he betrayed God by not calling the police. This was and is criminal. He should be humbled to clean toilets with a toothbrush. For 8 hours a daily for community service.

[@time2pray777]

Pedos groom the child’s parents as well as the child to have access to the kids, they are highly manipulative and are overly nice and attentive to get what they want, this is the prey technique. He’s been disqualified years ago!

[@micahbush5397]

Also, it wasn't about avoiding _secular_ courts, it was about avoiding openly pagan magistrates who were notoriously corrupt. (Remember the parable of the unjust magistrate who neither feared God nor cared for justice?)

[@gillianzohnert2323]

Thank you guys so much for this context

[@DeconTheMonkey]

Tears rolling down my eyes. This is my story as well being a whistleblower and speaking out against my church leaders scandals. One of my elder wrote a letter to the church board to take action against me. Im just a youth pastor with a family to feed wanting to do the right thing. These few months have been hard on me mentally. They are telling me to “think about my future and ministry.” This episode is a godsend. I don’t know what’s going to happen to my position but I know i did the right thing.

[@deborahcatalano261]

Praying for you, brother. God bless you!

[@TheRemnantRadio]

So sorry to hear this. Stay strong in having integrity and doing what is right. Praying for you.

[@sjg5994]

God bless you! One thing I've learned of the God we serve in Christ Jesus: if you know you have done what is right before Him, you WILL see the fruit of the righteous seed you sowed for His Truth. You may not see immediate vindication or retribution from where you were that was offensive, but KNOW that God has seen and will take care of you. Don't look back. Move forward to do what He called you to do. 😊

[@DeconTheMonkey]

Thank you all for prayers. I need it.

[@andrearush6209]

You did the right thing. I'm sorry you've been hurt. Praying for you and your family now.

[@braysibley123]

Father, forgive us for prefering the powerful over the weak.

[@greggoch4475]

Thank you Julie for your directness and clarity. And Remnant Radio, thank you for not being defensive.

[@TallyFlOSU]

Julie Roys sounds perfectly qualified for this episode having gone through it and survived. Glad we have someone that is willing to talk about this without fear. A Vineyard sister that is amazing!

[@benjaminyapo2293]

This lady is realy a woman of God. May God bless her wisdom. Amen 😢❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤

[@justmorenoise]

Thanks for having Julie Roys on.

[@Grace.Theater]

Senior Pastor for 18 years here. Several years ago, one of our Associate Ps was arrested for online solicitation of minor. Here's what I'll say: be fully transparent, advise appropriate leadership groups quickly, get in front of it, stay in front of it, and pray. We had two "open forum" meetings--everything we knew was disclosed, the process of dismissal, etc. Despite this...there will still be blow back and criticism as to how you handle it. Not a fun season.

[@TheRemnantRadio]

Good advice - thanks for sharing.

[@terryjames2229]

As a pastor for 38 years, i have a rule to never be alone with a child, teen or a woman. I am accountable to a Deacon board as well. I go through 2 background checks and 2 credit checks yearly. Pastors need to be above reproach !!!!

[@flowergirl-pp7vz]

Right! Thank you 🙏

[@linegrant4605]

That's common sense, especially if the child is not your own😮

[@marlenegreyling8620]

Amen! 🙏🏻 Wish I could attend your church...

[@maryestes9584]

That’s a great rule. However I hope you’re able to do it discreetly unlike a couple pastors I’ve had appointments with. They informed me right off the bat that they can’t be alone with a woman in their office so please come this day or this time etc etc. This of course made me and many other women feel like wonton hussies who might try to attack him if left alone with him for 5 minutes.. so he had to protect himself from us… or couldn’t control himself! In other words don’t put it off on innocent women. Make your arrangements discreetly and intelligently..

[@roberteaston6413]

@@maryestes9584 There are some women out there that are so ugly that nobody could believe that I would have an affair with her. But I guess you cannot tell a woman that it is okay for me to be alone with you because you are too ugly to tempt me. Also I have met women who are so strong that they could beat me up in a fight. I can be alone with them and behave myself.

[@larryclemson5915]

I was a student in the 80's of a mega evangelist failure - was in the Bible College and in the audience the day of the "confession". It was a crazy experience to be there. No man is so important is above it - God can use any of us and we can be replaced. Prayers for the people in the church.

[@thurzaheim]

The guy from Baton Rouge?

[@judijoblue]

Thanks for having Julie. So many of us in Dallas Ft. Worth need these truths.

[@andrearush6209]

🎯

[@sarahsays194]

Never heard about Julie until today. She is doing God's work. The church needs to know what's going on and get their stuff together accountability wise. Just because somebody is a Christian, much less a deacon/elder/paster/prophet, does not mean that they are above reproach. There are so many valid criticisms of the American church right now and rather than get defensive we need to LISTEN.

[@genevieverogers8435]

Thank you, Julie. There are so many cases that never hit the headlines and you are a voice for them. God bless you and your work bringing this evil into the light.

[@777propheticvoice]

How about we get back to praying and fasting for who needs to be in leadership instead of electing by personality or intellectualism?

[@IndianaJoe0321]

🎯

[@peterbrusati8390]

AMEN! I want to be in a church where Jesus is the head, not some well-meaning but woefully inadequate people.

[@thebible3368]

Definitely pray and fast for Leadership Selection. However our Leaders need to be able to exegete and live the word.

[@KJ-lb4tj]

Praying and fasting is needed as is proper understanding of the character the Bible emphasises for leaders and pastors. We cannot overlook character that is both evident in church and outside of church, agreed a upon by many people in the community that know them well.

[@irmarisortega-ramos5031]

Thanks for this podcast. I’ve never heard someone talking that have our service heart. We’ve been excommunicated from a couple of churches for trying to talk about the spiritual abuse in church.

[@andrewmattiewalter]

So glad you got Julie on!

[@stevendonohoe2150]

Nepotism, Hierarchy, Power, Title's, Stages, VIP areas, Green rooms. It's all dung as Paul would say. Thank you Julie for all you do 🙏

[@time2pray777]

💩 💩 💩 😂 yes and amen! Jesus prioritizes victims!

[@MaXgosi]

Perhaps one of the most important episodes ever recorded! Relevant to all of us in the body of Messiah

[@f5743]

While abusive church leader failure gets so much well-deserved attention now, I've seen first-hand and heard so many stories over the years of children in abusive, dysfunctional family situations who found a lifeline in the local church and island of sanity. They found a father or mother figure who nurtured them, set a good example for them, the local church was a refuge from a chaotic family life. There are a lot of quiet, unknown, non-celebrity believers doing a wonderful work with kids and young adults, saints whose works will be known fully only in eternity.

[@iamdisciple9233]

grateful for this episode Lord, hav mercy on each of us and help us all turn to Your Truth, help us live lives that’s pleasing to You in Jesus mighty name. Amen

[@TulindaCalitz]

Enjoyed this conversation. Good sense of humor 😂 I've been saved a Year now and I'm so grateful for that. I really wanted to go to church but having experienced narcissistic relationships in my life I don't feel safe in churches and I'm understanding why as these scandals keep breaking. Luckily there's the internet.❤

[@yoboatsummer]

She is right, how can the people not see it!!! They are intentionally in denial!!! So very sad 💔💔💔 Lack of knowledge of The Word and no discernment whatsoever when it comes to the celebrity pastors!!!

[@Retrorick642]

They operate like kings of their own private kingdom

[@susandumbill8805]

As someone said a while ago to me "Whoever said the anointing is transferable?" i.e. from a retired pastor to a son, or son-in-law ?!

[@Billpeterson4785]

All cults work this way, Gateway will keep the book scam going and harvesting 10% of poor people’s income

[@merrygrammarian1591]

And to add to that the number that get there by anointing themselves. Ain't how it works either.

[@KJ-lb4tj]

Nepotism is alive and well as is big money to be made without needing to do much for it

[@cestmoi5687]

Glad you guys had Julie Roys on! I was so glad that at my Assemblies of God Church yesterday, the pastor mentioned the latest scandals with Tony Evans and Robert Morris. He acknowledged that they had produced some good material but he made no excuses for them but instead said that they had disqualified themselves. He even said that's Robert Morris should rightly be in jail because he committed a crime. He encouraged us not to put our trust in man but in God. I was relieved that we didn't have a leader making excuses for obvious terrible things other so-called leaders had done and talking about restoration to ministry.

[@elainefish2295]

Has he mentioned the AG scandal with Texas chapters of Chi Alpha? They ignored a minister's history of sexual predation--Julie Roys covers him--Daniel Savala. Only 4 AG pastors have spoken out against it all. Generations of abuse.

[@chriselledge1285]

Thank you guys for this. Julie, thank you for your courage. My wife and I had worked for an international missions organization where great abuse had gone on behind the scenes. We approached leadership and were threatened. I eventually connected with the Director of Member Care for this organization and was told that I had two choices......give up my job or be quiet and fly under the radar. We chose to quit and then were lied about by the organization so our reputation with all former colleagues and connections were destroyed.

[@TheRemnantRadio]

So sorry to hear this. Praying for you

[@rebeccanewell3449]

I’m so sorry you and your wife went through that. I also was a part of an international missions group that has a lot of spiritual abuse in it.

[@PyrPupMom]

VOM?

[@deborahcatalano261]

So the church body needs to expect more from their leadership- that the Bible applies to them - by not going to churches which foster a lack of accountability by being mega churches. I applauded Mat Chandler’s role in having the Village Church go to campuses with their own senior pastor and sermons. Hopefully their own boards, too. Also, have to say I am very tired of seeing the next generation replace their dad as pastor and having every kid on the payroll. God’s church is not the family employer.

[@reneemcmillan3865]

You can’t inherit a ministry

[@SB_McCollum]

Absolutely!

[@thebible3368]

Church is not the family business

[@dr_that_guy]

I used to attend Mercy Culture for the last 3 years and the lack of accountability is exactly what I've been questioning. Right now, their website lists 3 external people as "Apostolic Elders" (whatever that means) (Dr. Michael Brown etc), dozen plus pastors that I have no idea what or who they oversee, and two internal elders. One of the internal elders is just the lead pastor's best friend.

[@Mike-q4i]

I just wrote a comment about this church. Red flags for sure… my friends still attend there and I’m just very concerned for them.

[@dr_that_guy]

@@Mike-q4i Found your comment and after watching their video on NAR, I would agree. But that’s only the beginning of my complaints. They’ve become too busy being political activists that it feels like there is no effort in actually discipling their members.

[@trishgoski4944]

I have such a great respect for Julie Roys & her courage to expose the heinous deeds that have been committed & willfully covered up in churches!! She also exposed John Macarthur who, to my knowledge, has never publically confessed or publically repented of what happened with Eileen Gray & her children, as well as other women! John Macarthur has covered up horrible abuses of women & children, but he is still looked up to like some kind of demi-god!! Just sickening….

[@teelastrong8190]

Amen. And MacArthur has his zealots and defenders who argue because he preaches "sound doctrine" everything else about him is off limits. Well not protecting women and children of abusers is not biblical Christlike behavior. He has made several public disparaging and disrespectful remarks toward Christian women demonstrating he views women as subservient to men, perhaps, second-class.

[@matheu1971]

Thank you for doing this interview. I am glad to know more about Julie Roys.

[@songsgardensbyjenniferlynn3242]

Church “membership” is triggering for me -it’s so complicated. Good to hear Julie talk about it.

[@mariakarlson7537]

I loved her passion. !!! What an awesome podcast. So glad you guys had her on.

[@hldvdsn100]

This is a very important and necessary conversation, and the church NEEDS to implement absolute objective accountability!!

[@valerierosproy1255]

" The whistleblowers in Scripture were called Prophets' " 😂 Exactly!

[@Steadfast_Steady_Strong]

💯

[@reconciledHRT]

God bless you Julie!😭 Your passion is felt. We need Christians with this much conscience against abuse. In all honestly, the accomplices have overwhelmed me maybe more than the perpetrators.

[@brendahemphill6957]

You guys nailed it with the Toys Report. Thank you so much for what you do. I am so so tired of the mega church movement and all it entails. You have done well on this report. Julie is one of my go to folks for church news.

[@AwenRebeccaDunning-ld3rz]

This is fabulous in every way. Thank you for covering such a difficult topic.

[@rommym7528]

Excellent! Thank you, very well done. My respect for Julie Roys and all of you at Remnant continues to grow. God bless!

[@lolitacalderon8672]

Good point on how secular jobs will not hire someone who has committed unlawful acts, but churches seem to be more open to it. Aren’t we supposed to have a higher standard for everything because we represent Jesus?

[@marygossard8913]

I was sexually abused by my Pastor Dad- who has since retired but as YET to REPENT! No body is standing up to him - perhaps because he is elderly and in ill health now. I came out with this allegation 3 decades ago though and still...what's worse is I am demonized and my parents have gotten my siblings to ostracize me as well- all the while saying they must honor their parents. I have made peace with the fact, forgive them often and grieve the loss of this heartbreaking saga- BUT GOD! I've never received and apology -yet- but I am left wondering if it is too late. The abuse began happening around the age of 12 for me as well. I really do hope the Church will STAND UP and uphold all aspects of the Gospel and not just cherry-pick topics and sugar coat darkness!

[@TheRemnantRadio]

So sorry to hear what happened to you. Praying for your spiritual and emotional healing.

[@marygossard8913]

@@TheRemnantRadio Thank you- God is good! I will say because of this- I was not born-again until I was 51 years old! But GOD! Thank you Jesus!

[@Raymond-Tora]

Right on! I love this woman!

[@Deacondan240]

Great discussion. Good job JR and Remnant.

[@andre0baskin]

This may be the best video on the subject that I have ever seen. The unfortunate thing is that the cult of personality is so strong in many churches that it will fall on deaf ears. Both technology and modern corporate organizational structures have allowed "church organizations" to amass both power and money in unprecedented quantities with no real oversight.

[@cynthiaponder8905]

Thank you for TRUTH... 👏👏🙌🙌🙏🙏😇

[@bonniehafeman9757]

The problems are not within the beautiful believers. As a James 1:26-27 believer ...a voluntary helper and also a voluntary helper on My local Sherrif department victims service unit...Thank s for sharing. ❤😅

[@t.a.d.7892]

I have officially subscribed! Thank you for giving victims a voice!!!!

[@DD-sz8nw]

What Julie said about having a man of character on our church and Bible College boards is spot on! When the man of high character and integrity gets released from a corrupt board, then there is little that can be done. While he is on board, there is a hedge of protection, and proper action can be taken.

[@KJ-lb4tj]

And the lesson is .. Stay away from any one man show!

[@Ann-mercedesBenson]

Best!!! Best and most timely podcast ever! Thank you!!!!! Keep it up! All that is necessary for evil to win is for good men to do nothing. Thank you for being good men!

[@busroger3349]

I once attended a church conference where it was taught lay elders do not personally lead a church in any real way- that would interfere with the senior pastor's vision. All church matters were to be referred and funneled first through the senior's chosen staff only that he alone overlooked. To do violate that order would cause disunity. The role of the elder was to annually vote yes or no on the continued employment of the senior pastor, pretty much anything else was interference and would unnecessarily hinder the pastor's ability to succeed. I often wondered about this "pastor lead" church model, apparently championed in reaction to an elder lead model which in some instances resulted in a senior pastor feeling too handcuffed by overly close detailed accountability/lay elder second guessing. I'm not sure church elected/chosen lay elders today are really clear on what their Biblical roles should be in relation to church staff.

[@roxiejohnson6813]

Best insight and advice. Thank you. Keep teaching and revealing. (He leads me on the path of righteousness for His Name's Sake.)

[@JacquelineRPrice]

So much this!!!! What drives me nuts is the call to pray for the pastor who has abused someone but has no love or care is for the victim and I 100% agree with her when she says that there is absolutely NO WAY that if you have sexually abused someone that you are above reproach. You are no longer qualified for ministry. You may not be restored to leadership. Period! Boom! I'm so sick of Christians, who out of misplaced ignorance of what real grace is, want to "restore" these abusers to their former positions. Yes, let's counsel them to be restored to Christ but NEVER again to leadership. Never!!

[@maryestes9584]

These same leaders have no grace for anyone in their congregations who have been abused or question their leadership.

[@PyrPupMom]

Amen!!

[@barbarak870]

Precent the scandal: the church structure in the Bible is not like today's church structure. The elders should have charge of the church and hold others accountable. Pastors having autonomy is an epidemic! No one person IS the church or has all of the gifts or is the head.

[@peteryang2633]

julie roys, I’m a fan, what a wordsmith, evangelical industrial complex, that is exactly what this whole thing is, how does it turn into this and what should church look like, that is a topic for another conversation but yes there is definitely a reformation happening and it’s coming from the grass roots level, enjoyed the content and the host you had me cracking up a couple of times with your comments

[@Gradnaimi]

Please, it would be wonderful a video on "how to protect your heart from becoming bitter".

[@TheRemnantRadio]

Forgiveness is the harder thing to do, isn't it? We must forgive. Dive deeply into God's word. Jesus is the healer of the broken-hearted. Praying you experience the Lord's peace and comfort. He understands what it feels like to be betrayed.

[@flowergirl-pp7vz]

⁠@@TheRemnantRadioYes, Jesus was betrayed and abandoned when he was most in need of support! He has been through it all! We have to pray for God to help us forgive, and bring about reforms to prevent abuse.

[@elaineforrest3139]

I am a christian and have been for many, many years ,because of spiritual abuse I have not attended church for 15 years ,but am very strong in the Lord sometimes serving the Lord is sometimes a lonely walk the community we call church is so corrupt it's shameful ,one would never know these people are christians

[@Momoften2011]

Thank you for the MacDonald information. Although he may escape judgement in California, he will stand before God.

[@johncarminati2326]

Thank lady and Gents for bringing this to light. I do not agree with all the suggestions for handling these situations but the church and especially leaders need to be held to the highest standards.

[@DD-sz8nw]

Also, it is not wise to seek secular counselors, especially for personal issues. I have been to both, a true Christian counselor who was very practical and addressed the spiritual issues of what was driving me. I also went to a counselor who claimed to be a Christian, and there was no addressing my true Condition, and why the damage was done, which was me being enticed by my own lust, rebelling my church counsel and falling into sin. This guy had me sitting in a chair pretending to be a little girl again. Thankfully I only had 1 session with him, a complete waste of time. I learned not to go back to that kind of counselor again. But what I did was not a crime according to our laws, although it was quite costly for myself and God freed me!

[@urbanstory1613]

I agree with everything that’s been said. One question I have is how do you find eligible board members that you can trust when starting out? When you start out the people you have on your board are mostly family. Kind of a tricky thing when you don’t have people willing to serve on the board.

[@stevendonohoe2150]

Best to just throw away the current church system, it barely passes scriptural scrutiny anyway. Get back to simplicity, small groups with elders as equals overseeing to ensure correct doctrine, unity & most importantly equality so we don't get back into this situation with one individual lording over all his brother's & sisters. The days of Pastor's ruling their kingdom needs to come to an end. Authority needs to be taken from King Pastor & given back to Jesus where it belongs. Then watch God's people start to gather again.

[@laurenmay2098]

I like that. After our church splitter years ago, we met every Sunday for Bible study and fellowship. And on Tuesday for prayers and lunch. It was wonderful. Then we all founded a church to go to. I can say I'll be in so many, it isn't fun. No one cares about the flock anymore. It is about giving and not receiving, ever.

[@kathyburrell9912]

I am a member of Mercy Culture and I feel it is unfair to bring it into this conversation simply because it is "popular." MC is growing because the members are sold out to God and His presence, not because they are sold out to a man. I agree with everything you have said. Please join me in praying for our church. All the ministers are young and need to stay God centered. Thank you.

[@kwamrak777]

Glad to see this episode from you guys

[@mistybedwell5962]

Love this smash up!! How fun to see you all together sharing wisdom from learned experiences.

[@tisi88]

One of your best episodes💐

[@kathleens.laroche754]

I saw in Julie's anger at the end of the video the power of Jesus' love at the root of His righteous anger. My words are inadequate to express the encounter I had with the depth of Jesus' caring. I SAW Him - not with my eyes but with an understanding of the heart and mind given by the Holy Spirit. He is indeed very beautiful.

[@jefflopez1919]

This was an amazing episode! Thanks guys and Julie

[@DD-sz8nw]

You guys are great! Thank you so much for sharing all this very good information! We are from Ada, OK, but live in Dallas, TX right now. God bless you all!

[@recrutme54321]

Be Emboldened ministry is especially for those who have experienced church hurt and spiritual abuse.

[@anneboyle2240]

Thank you for this. Must look them up!

[@grace4peace]

Guys are you kidding? In asking “What can a church do, to protect whistleblowers”?😳 I am in Switzerland 40 years following the Lord! I attended several charismatic churches: the first I knew from the beginning the leader was a liar, I had dreams about him where Jesus revealed it to me. I confronted him he would not listen: a couple of month later every thing I saw about him came to pass. The church broke apart! The leadership split up. Second church I had also a dream about that leader, and what I saw in the dream came to pass. This leader had an adulterous affair, but he repented publicly and the leadership and another church and leaders helped him to restore. But he never changed his one man show. The third church there was also a leader I knew things were wrong just in his character. This guy got divorced remarried and he became a deconstructionist. He influences on a high strategy level young leaders. He was never teachable! I have witnessed three church splits because of leadership weaknesses. the whole church system as we know it is wrong! As soon as leaders get buildings, too big to fail gatherings, too highly esteemed they have all the tendency to fall! They have fallen into the luciferian snare of worldly acceptance💉 after 40 years witnessing the leadership failings probably we should stop putting money in Church buildings and in a paid clergy! We should raise church planting movements and finish the great mission. Having apostolic-prophetic church planters and trainers and stop with hierarchy. Hierarchy is an invention of the devil to replace a discipleship based structure. The church as we had in the Middle Ages are based in buildings, in everlasting stony structures: we are not called to build temples but being on the move like Abraham. The whole big and mega church concept is a trap. Non of the leaders can handle fame not a single one! Pride is the number one sin, that breaks the neck of the stiff necked! We have to repent of our church doing! In America how many big churches you have with thousands of attendees? Light shows, worship teams according “ot Levitic orders” that is ridiculous. The devil is happy to keep the members busy in their mega churches, which reaches less than 5% of the unreached! Happily indulging in their self satisfying church systems! Believing they play a big part in town because of the size of their gatherings! Ridiculous and all the esoteric and Satanists and humanist post modern in the town get lost because the believers are playing church, celebrating themselves instead of making disciples who disciple their neighborhood🤔🧐 hi

[@maryannblair9784]

Excellent guest! I learned so much. Thank you.

[@dmac6004]

Just so you know there are some churches that do something about these kinds of issues. Several years we had a pastor who we believed was having an affair with the church. secretary. We collected evidence for about 9 months, confronted the issue with the pastor and I tried to counsel him, I was consistently lied to. We were afraid that when the Elder Board submitted to it to congregational approval that we would not prevail and would have to exercise our authority to override. The Lord provided a miraculous exposure of the situation prior to the congregational meeting and he resigned. Put both on church discipline and the ultimately repented and apologized to the congregation, however, we still lost a significant portion of the congregation who were his friends. There are some of us who take our spiritual obligation seriously. We also have turn a sexual abuse over to the police. We also present the finances to our congregation at least annually. You are right we are not unbiased as Elders, we are there to assure that the scripture is followed, we are not biased internally and have demonstrated it several times.

[@AskLaurieT]

Thanks for clarifying the Independent Board member comment

[@gjnether]

In Proverbs 18 we are told that 'Any story sounds true until someone tells the other side and sets the record straight'. It would be interesting for you all to hear both sides of the story concerning Grace Community Church (John MacArthur) and Ms Roys' accusations. As a lifelong Pentecostal, I'm not carrying water for MacArthur and am genuinely interested in what may or may not have really happened. And I recently read a piece by David Morrill (Protestia website) that disputed Roys' conclusions. I don't know who to believe. It would just be good to hear both sides.

[@HollyWrightMinistries]

After each new scandal comes to the surface, do any of you, just sit and wonder how on earth did these sinful leaders NOT have a fear of God, while KNOWING full well what the Bible says about them? With each new scandal, I just sit there with my mouth wide open, my heart broken, and then DEEPLY think about how could they possibly do this in the name of God? I mean, of all places to do your “bidding” and you choose the church, under the God you are preaching about and studying about your whole life? These guys know what the Bible says and what’s going to happen to them. I just can’t wrap my head around it. It’s on a whole other level. “It’s better to be at the bottom of an ocean with a millstone around your neck.” … I guess they just skip over that verse!

[@teelastrong8190]

This is what Jesus warned his true under shepherds about. There will be false shepherds who disguise themselves as sheep, but they are false/fake wolves. The sheep can be easily fooled by the false shepherds because Jesus warned they will claim to prophesy in his name, and in his name drive out demons and perform many miracles. I would add build mega memberships, author Christian books, broadcast over Christian radio and television, serve as missionaries, and make a brand for themselves all in Jesus' Name. But his verdict will be "I never knew you."

[@kathyparadise9218]

There needs to be more godly men who hold spiritual leadership feet to the fire. Each Pastor should be accountable to a few people who pray for them and keep them from making decisions like meeting with women alone, or other compromises that they see. The culture of each church is different and everyone needs to stop hiding their sin and fine trustworthy people to confess their faults to so they can be healed and continue to practice ministry in a healthy manner.

[@house_church]

I have coveted no man’s silver, or gold, or apparel. Yea, ye yourselves know, that these hands have ministered unto my necessities, and to them that were with me. I have shewed you all things, how that so labouring ye ought to support the weak, and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive. Paul the apostle to the church leaders, Acts 20:33ff.

[@JonGardner]

It would be cool to see a collab episode with both Julie Roys and Scot McKnight on this subject.

[@janreason1518]

Excellent discussion. I fear for some of the ministries I loosely follow. It's the celebrity component that raises the biggest red flag for me.

[@ginaannbennett7149]

Love Julie Roys and her passion. But I must say, I am a PR person and we don’t all “lie” all the time ☺️ I am also a survivor. Keep up the good work, but take it a little easy on those of us who made our livings in public relations.❤

[@dennisdatu6464]

He said he looked for vulnerable girls. Is it possible that he had other victims?

[@melodiefleming9148]

Excellent and courageous show. Thank you.

[@brianguerrero5486]

Thank you. Very valuable info as always.

[@gentlespiritnunlu8991]

What is lacking is the Holy Spirit of Truth to reveal the spirit operating. Surely, someone in leadership or the congregation was filled with the Spirit of God with Discernment to reveal this type of behavior. A wolf is a wolf.

[@cindyblodgett2158]

AMEN, AMEN, AMEN!!!!

[@theverystones2643]

Repentance!

[@joshuas1834]

Unfortunately this video is very timely for my church. 😢

[@TheRemnantRadio]

Sorry to hear that. Hopefully there are insights that will be helpful

[@henkv9323]

All these events also exposed not only leadership abuses, but also, those in the seats. I have seen the vitriolic responses from "Christians" and it seems like they completely ignore their own heart condition. I am just blown away with the responses. It seems like the folks use their own measure very quickly and actively. In most comments, it looks like God is more of an after-thought, somehow God is not involved in both the purpetrator or victim's lives during these periods. Surely God deals with multiple people in several ways using such events? I know people love scorched earth when those in authority abuse authority, but I my thoughts at this stage is that "Chruch" is mostly a religion, not a body. Still working through these events myself to align or not with doctrine, Christian practice and if God is really in charge of anything involving "humans".

[@flowergirl-pp7vz]

Yes, God deals with multiple people in several ways… That’s right. And all of us are having our faith in God tested all the time. Jesus said there would be weeds mixed in with the wheat. Jesus said, “In this world you will have trouble, but be of good cheer for I have overcome the world.” We have to persevere in faith, but BECOME WISER and learn what God is trying to teach us in this situation. ✝️

[@cathyc1730]

Monster is the exact right word. How would you restore a MONSTER TO MINISTRY? Absurd.

[@ThorfinnSkullsplitter-fz7ff]

One thing about some of these seeker friendly mega churches, Don't get caught up in their political gear works and don't get in the way of their money flow.

[@Ruby-wise]

Yes yes yes and yes!! Love Julie! Actually,, when the “ two or three witnesses” policy, was utilized as a Jewish law, it referred to witnesses seeing or hearing the event personally. Admittedly, the primary goal of a predictor is secrecy.! Few predators of children are “ caught in the act” ! Let’s get up with the NT times when the whole law is to love and protect…not find a way to excuse the sexual violation of a Little One!!

[@mikerattee56]

independent investigation also protects the accused from false charges

[@chayilevents7979]

Can you put the names of the books she mentioned

[@brookeeggen682]

A word about excommunication: Coercive Control and Abuse and its dynamics are very complicated. Most people I know want the best brain surgeon to operate on them when they need that kind of care. Some people have taken the time to specialize in abuse and as Jesus said we need all the parts of the body. I also ask we go back to scripture and look at the excommunication and church discipline in scripture. How did Jesus react to these circumstances? I ask for humility from all those involved. A willingness of all those involved to listen to voices that have been hurt by the way things have been done and willing to consider the impact of those past actions. Let's come together and think together about what the word says. We may not agree but lets discuss and have our minds expanded by listening.

[@laurenmay2098]

Morris was going to be stoned to death according to the Old Testament. According to the New Testament, he was supposed to be in prison for some time, maybe life?

[@brookeeggen682]

@@laurenmay2098 sorry I was specifically thinking of how excommunication has wrongly hurt victims. Morris should face the law of the land for his actions as you suggest.

[@Encourager-Purpose-Destiny]

💖My suggestion to all Christians: Ask God to show you yourself and your heart. Allow God to work on you. Take your feelings, thoughts, words, and actions to God in prayer. Sift and process them through the Word of God. Let God Have The Final Say! "Judgment must begin at the house of God...the righteous shall scarcely be saved" (1 Peter 4: 17,18). Peter is telling us that the "Church" is going to be judged. And that the "Church" is in trouble. 🙏God, I ask You in Jesus' name to show me myself. God I give You permission to work on me. Sift me through Your Word, change me, prefect me, and conform me into the image of Your son, Jesus Christ. God do the same for the writer of this prayer, all my family, and friends. Bless us with the love, desire, and strength to respect and honor You in our thoughts, words, and actions. Thank You Jesus. Amen, so be it by faith.

[@flowergirl-pp7vz]

“The righteous shall scarcely be saved.” Sobering words!!!

[@Encourager-Purpose-Destiny]

@@flowergirl-pp7vz I know.

[@micahbush5397]

47:00 Joseph wasn’t falsely accused, he was a victim of sexual harassment and attempted assault; Potiphar's wife was a sexual predator who employed DARVO. The unique factor here was that Joseph was an adult male with a physical advantage over his assailant, an advantage that most sexual assault victims don’t have.

[@toddbates1099]

What about the differences in Biblical Justice and Social Justice?

[@therisenteam3054]

Spot on!! Great podcast