How The Biggest Sci-Fi Franchise Destroyed Itself With The Disco Era

With the release of Star Trek: Section 31, Star Trek's Disco era is over. Now, many are calling Star Trek a dead sci-fi franchise. What happened? To find the answer, we have to look into the past to the debut of Star Trek: Discovery on CBS All Access.

[@khicle]

Picard S3 is great for the nostalgia but pretty sucky for the plot.

[@ijmad]

As a TNG-era kid I definitely liked the nostalgia, but you can't keep a show running on nostalgia. I agree that the actual plot for S3 was just as weak as the previous two, and seeing the Borg defeated was pretty hollow given they've supposedly been around for thousands of years and had trillions of drones in their space in the Delta Quadrant. Force of nature to farce - which started with Voyager and its overuse of the Queen.

[@subraxas]

@@ijmad Agreed!

[@brb1017]

​@@ijmadWell... to be fair... the war with species 8472 and then the actions of Future Janeway significantly sent them into decline. The plot was a mixed bag. But it was nostalgia done right. It's the kind of team-up Star Wars woefully never attempted. The premise of certain aspect were also very intriguing. But there's only so much bad Trek you can undo in one season. I think the one flaw is that this should have been about 2 to 3 season of stuff that was all crammed into one. Bringing back the changelings like that was a fun idea. It could have used to room to grow and breath. Introducing a next generation of kids was definitely fun. The Borg being behind Picard's rare syndrome was actually an awesome idea. But the execution of a lot of good ideas crammed into a single season made it better than what we've seen over the last decade but not fantastic in the big picture. Jack's magical powers don't align with Star Trek. Teleport assimilation does seem flawed and problematic. And the easy reversal of that is far too "barely an inconvenience" for a well written story. The age gap, likewise, is cute but a little too convenient. You ultimately have to suspend a lot of disbelief for a good amount of nostalgia and something that at least feels like Star Trek and acknowledges the past that's come before it. It would have all been an acceptable trade-off is Legacy was made and improved on the formula and took us into a new Era of Star Trek more aligned with the golden age of the franchise.

[@Bobalicious]

I watched the CBS premier of Discovery, but wasn't impressed enough to follow it to the streaming platform. The big screen trilogy was fun, stupid but fun. One bright spot in the franchise has been Lower Decks, which was thoroughly delightful.

[@s13gouf60]

Star trek died when JJ and his minions got their grubby little hands on the franchise. The 09 film is for ADHD ridden big bang theory fans. It was popcorn fare and made money, teaching the wrong lesson that leads to this inevitable result. Everything after that is a progressively worse horrible mockery of Trek. The films were bad star wars with a trek skin suit. Once it went to a streaming show it got monumentally worse. It became dark, uninspired, preachy, violent, hateful, and hyper political. It was made by non trek fans for non trek fans. May it rest in piss

[@s13gouf60]

Also it will forever be STD.

[@SciFiDavey69]

Agreed, it should’ve been renamed Trek Wars. You can’t only blame JJ because I’ve zero doubt Trek owner Paramount long known for creating franchise rights issues with toys and games and stuff so Abrams differentiated as much as possible right down. He just did it so well everyone copies his detrimental success ruining lore and Trek itself

[@merafirewing6591]

​@@SciFiDavey69 although I think Kurtzman is the person that dealt the death blow.

[@DoctorPretorious616]

Star Trek has ALWAYS been preachy and political, since 1966. You're just mad that it's not Trump-y enough for your liking.

[@whyjnot420]

JJ literally said that Trek was like classical music and Star Wars is like rock music and that while classical music is all well and good, it doesn't sell & its not what people want. Then went on to say how he changed Trek to be more rock n roll. I'm pretty sure this was in the directors commentary for the first reboot movie (if it wasn't there, it was an interview I watched). At the least, I'll give him credit for outright saying that this was what he was doing. Also, at least the JJ movies had people who can act and did a great job casting everyone but Uhura. Whereas the stuff since then hasn't had a single person that could act their way out of a paper bag. (I honestly think Yeoh is one of the most overreated actors of the last 25 years or so.) edit: That statement about acting includes Picard. With the exception of Frakes and Dorn. Sirtis was never the best and the rest have really lost it. Maybe Spiner isn't a lost cause, but he needs to go to a summer acting camp or something.

[@figmillenium]

Starfleet Academy is set in the 32nd century.

[@MinhDucPham-y6c]

The best (and only)thing to say about the Disco Era is that it led to the creation of Strange New Worlds.

[@whyjnot420]

I'd prefer to treat it akin to ST5. Where people will literally say "We don't talk about that one here'" when people try to bring it up. I also think "disco era" is too nice. Call it what it is the STD or Disease era. (Yeah, whoever thought up a title that initialized as STD, was an idiot)

[@alpacamale2909]

Species 10C is good sci fi

[@rickbase833]

I'm Luke warm on SNW. There have been some really bad episodes. There are some really good episodes, too. I'll give S3 a watch.

[@achannell362]

It's become increasingly common across several franchises that the best projects end up being written and produced by those who are fans themselves (see Picard Season 3, X-Men 97, Andor), and the disaster projects are made by those who have little background or interest in the IP and are more looking to put their own "stamp" on it (see Discovery/Section 31, She-Hulk, the Acolyte).

[@vapoet]

I'd say that in the case of She-Hulk, that was closer to the proper character than a lot of Marvel characters in the MCU. But it was not going to translate well. A lot of the decisions made where caused by attempting to integrate her own fourth wall breaking into the MCU. And it is brutal when there is another fourth wall breaking hero in Marvel.

[@robertanderson6929]

You're facing two problems. Most of the producers working in Hollywood today have a Post-modern / Neo-Marxist education. The Post-modernisim is significant because they don't believe in creativity. They LITERALLY believe that everything is derivative, everything is just another copy and any attempt to say, "I have an original idea," is heretical. This accounts for all of the reboots, re-imaginings and gender/race swaps. The second problem flows from their Neo-Marxism. They HATE Western culture because they see it as primarily an oppressive, White, racist, patriarchy. And Star Trek is the pinnacle of Western culture and values. It's where we believe Western culture is taking us. It would be like asking the triple-K clan to remake _Bad Boys._ Their biases would ruin it. But on a happy note, Fox Studios has in the works, _Sanford and Son the Movie_ staring Leslie Jones as Fredimena Sanford and Rachel Zegler as LaMonta.

[@GiantFreakinRobot]

Wow, you make an amazing point and yeah it its definitely correct, it definitely explains why we have so many woke movies and race and gender swaps( or just a transgender person altogether) and that just shows you what communist art looks like, in other words, no new ideas. which you would think is interesting from the postmodernist standpoint because when they believe in no original ideas, you would think there would be more variety in movie creativity because reality is determined by how you as an individual see reality, but because they are skeptical of any sort of narrative or truth, they tend to focus on making remakes or parodies of everything just like you said.

[@robertanderson6929]

@@GiantFreakinRobot Thank. But I fear my comment went down YT's memory hole as I can no longer see it. And if you ever question how these producers can continue to lose money just remember if they are Neo-Marxist then what could be better than to use the White man's profits to put out their anti-Western message AND bankrupt the evil corporation at the same time? To the devoted Marxist that is just a Win-Win.

[@johnmeneses7039]

@@GiantFreakinRobot That is why Star Trek in its pure form died after Enterprise. Anything after that went against Gene Roddenberry's vision of the future and purest Star Trek fans detest it.

[@baahcusegamer4530]

What exactly happened to bring Star Trek to this? Kurtzman and JJ Abrams happened.

[@subraxas]

Bryan Fuller

[@Scottlp2]

True but Kurtzman (and I think goldsmith) were both involved in Fringe which was great character driven SF. Point being they can write good stuff, it is just the zeitgeist killing everything.

[@johnmeneses7039]

Franchise Killers, Klutzman and Jar Jar Abrams.

[@TheBillzilla]

Just think, for the price of the S31 movie, we could have got another two (at least) seasons of Lower Decks. They chose ever so poorly.

[@deeacosta2734]

The first two Seasons of Discovery were great. Strange New Worlds. Picard season three. We keep complaining we won’t have any Star Trek.

[@Scottlp2]

1st season SNW was really good (last episode great). 1st season STD was unwatchable-they couldn’t even figure out how to write humor till like season 2 or 3 (the irascible engineer was great fun).

[@martindix1330]

Snw is the trek show i will watch. The rest, even Picard, are a hard pass.

[@johnmeneses7039]

ALL TRASH

[@subraxas]

@ It is officially either 'DIS' or 'DSC'. Infantile prats call it 'STD'. Star Trek: Voyager is also shortened to 'VOY' and not 'STV'. Star Trek: Enterprise is 'ENT' and not 'STE'. Do you finally get it?

[@Interrobang2626]

I was curious about Star Trek Discovery and hopeful when it first came out. That all faded soon enough when I realized that, not only did I not like any of the characters but that they were prone to crying about anything and everything. Tears, it seemed, would flow at the drop of a hat in every single episode. As a fan of early Star Trek, I kept racking my brain trying to think of any other characters from the other shows shedding a tear. I don't think anyone cried when Tasha Yar was killed, I can't say that I remember Captain Sisko even crying when the Borg killed his wife.

[@nixboox]

Section 31 was so bad that I actually stopped watching it about 15 minutes in when it became obvious that it was some teenage fanfic that had zero maturity or depth of character.

[@GiantFreakinRobot]

As someone who sat through all of it, I can confirm that you made the right call.

[@nicktechnubyte1184]

It's literally called STD Who's bright idea was that?!

[@solgoode1]

They were trolling us. They new what they were doing. This is about destruction of legacy. Destroy the cultural touchstone that was Star Trek so that new generations won't be able to connect with previous ones because they share nothing.

[@NeoTechni]

and they had a season dedicated to "the burn"!

[@johnmeneses7039]

@@NeoTechni 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣Best observation of the day.

[@guyaingejr5125]

100 % agree. The era of the Michael Bey school of Star Trek needs to end. And just how many times do we have to be reminded that this show set in space is set in space with a camera flip fro.e upside down to right side up?

[@william2k]

LOWER DECKS!!! LOWER DECKS!!! LOWER DECKS!!!

[@davetomlinson9063]

Always thought a series following Wesley through his Academy years would have been good.

[@subraxas]

The so-called "Disco Era" is actually the second 'Golden Age' of Star Trek.

[@joet7136]

Sure it is. Unlike the original series, TNG, DS9, Voyager and even the unfairly maligned Enterprise NO ONE will be talking about STD, Picard or SNW 10-20 years from now.

[@420Gold]

It’s amazing that they aren’t going forward with Star Trek legacy.

[@TheoWerewolf]

Ironically, Prodigy and Lower Decks - both animated and both cancelled - have turned out to be the best new Trek made. And I hate to say this but PLEASE NO MORE WIL WHEATON. He's not even playing Wesley Crusher anymore, he's playing Wil Wheaton being amused at still being involved with Star Trek for some reason...

[@dussan2]

Passing on Star Trek Legacy is when I cancelled my Paramount + membership.

[@qui-gonrick7002]

I'm sure you would have been disappointed anyway.

[@SciFiDavey69]

All things post voyager have been interestingly disappointing with Enterprise being the closest to

[@dussan2]

@ I don't think so, I thought Picard Season 3 was amazing. A couple of episodes where a little off but overall it was amazing. I really liked the idea of Seven as captain, with Jack Crusher being a briliant but completely off the rails ensign having to be kept in line. Terry knew what he was doing.

[@ScrapKing73]

But... Enterprise (and the first and third Kelvin movies) were excellent. So that part of the plan, at least, was creatively solid, IMO.

[@thewiirocks]

Ironically, the name "DISCO" / "DISC" was pushed by the show runners as the official shortening after fans started calling it "STD" for "Star Trek Discovery"

[@Sykboogie]

People clammoring for Legacy just want that nice feeling of nostalgia. Nostalgia is how good ideas die. Denying nostalgia is how we got TNG, which was tonally different than ToS, which was why fans, at the time, were up in arms.

[@qui-gonrick7002]

Captain Shaw was the best thing in Picard S3 and they killed him.

[@Sykboogie]

@@qui-gonrick7002 He was great. One of those characters you initially hated but then grew on you thanks to an excellent performance. But still, Wolf 359 survivor who also had an axe to grind against Picard? It's like they just couldn't get Avery Brooks to cameo. Memberberries.

[@SciFiDavey69]

The reason people were up in arms is because in all honesty the first season of TNG was shite but Trek faithful rallied hoping for better and TNG rid itself of Roddenberry influence and escaped his lost utopian vision and dived deeper into character development that evolved the series into the success it became launching further franchise expansion with Voyager and the best Trek ever, DS9.

[@GiantFreakinRobot]

I just wanted Matalas. I don't care what characters were involved. I think that's what most fans who were lobbying for it wanted. He gets Trek. In a perfect world, I'd have liked a series entirely about Captain Shaw.

[@SciFiDavey69]

Don’t you mean TNG season 10?

[@kennethng8346]

I tried to watch Disco, but after a while I found that I just didn't care what happened. Picard was just soooooo dddddddaaaaaaaammmmmmmmmnnnnn slow. The entire first season could be done in a TNG episode. And having a black set with black uniforms and black weapons and block instruments left me wondering WTF was going on. SNW has potentials, BUT NO MORE MUSICALS.

[@quubspace]

Thank you. This was spot on. I watched the pilot of Discovery and that was it. Love Strange New Worlds. We need more Trek like that.

[@JohnSmith-mf3dh]

There is already a film about Section 31, it's called Star Trek Renegades. A Fan Film that kicks HARD and the only expression I can use to describe it is "Star Trek"

[@Sykboogie]

Does no one remember the hate that Voyager and Enterprise got when they were on-air? It blows my mind, this rose-tinted glasses phenomena. Maybe you guys were all little kids at the time?

[@Davidgoldenswan]

I must have missed that 😅 I love voyager❤ from the start 🎉

[@kevboss1592]

All new trek shows get a bit of hate at the start.... but only Discovery is still hated after 5 seasons

[@DrewbieBernard]

I don't remember Voyager getting hate. I do remember TNG, DS9, and Enterprise getting hate at first because they sucked for the 1st 2 seasons at least. TNG didn't get good until Riker grew a beard. DS9 didn't get good until Sisko shaved his head. Janeway should've shaved her head and Chakote(sp?) should've grown a beard.

[@DrewbieBernard]

@@kevboss1592 mostly because after 5 seasons it was still poorly written AND still not Star Trek

[@Davidgoldenswan]

@@DrewbieBernard to baldly go where no one has gone before 😂

[@benlime1235]

It's such a shame. SNW and Lower Decks are the only Post Disco ST worth watching. They would have been better off re-instating Enterprise. But I'm glad they didn't; the people they got to run the modern shows would have ruined Enterprise.

[@leglo4996]

What no comments on prodigy

[@RandomNPC001]

We have 80 years of Trek that could have been explored (between TOS and TNG). In those years we could have seen the Romulans retreat back to their usual xenophobia and what made them return to their old M.O., the rise of the Cardasians and occupation of Bajor, Worf being rescued, Data being found.... so on.

[@Tigerhawk30]

I've been saying this for absolutely YEARS. I always wanted to see an Excelsior series, but they passed on that idea, too. I mean, who doesn't want to know about this time period? The Lost Era series of novels, I thought, were fantastic (Especially, "Serpents Among The Ruins", which, I thought, was a great take on the otherwise throwaway reference of The Tomed Incident), and could have taken absolutely tons of angles since it's a wide open space (no pun intended). But, nope...Paramount is apparently much "wiser" than what the fans might want... Paramount said there was (supposedly) no interest in an Excelsior series, so they scrapped it...yet, they have no problem throwing money away on this entire dead end set. I guess I just don't get it, but apparently it's also not for me to get.

[@nunyabizness6595]

"Anyway! Moving on!" Lol. That was great! 😂😂😂😮

[@crispywan]

Disco was a slap in the face to original fans

[@jaydawg7]

STD is *NOT* Star Trek.

[@SciFiDavey69]

Not only not Trek, it sucks as any sci-fi because it is so preachy and what it preached sucked with wokeness and liberalism 🤮

[@DrewbieBernard]

​@SciFiDavey69 if you think "wokeness" and "liberalism" sucks, you obviously have no understanding of what Star Trek has ALWAYS been. smh. That's just sad.

[@khicle]

@@DrewbieBernard It's almost amusing how the critics of DSC all too often end up coming back to 'TOO WOKE' as their issue with it (and I say this as a not-too-much-of-a-fan myself, but for several issues unrelated 'woke').

[@efxnews4776]

Yes it is and it is crap.

[@joet7136]

​​@@DrewbieBernardyeah, making up virtually all the bridge crew with women and the few men they had were either gay or emasculated/feminine is something every Trek show did prior to STD. Yes, Star Trek was very progressive but not preachy and condescending - that's on the new writers who obviously had little if any love of the older series.

[@seanswader7425]

I didn’t know this was referred to as the Disco era, everyone I’ve known calls it the STD era

[@subraxas]

No, not everyone.

[@subraxas]

Have you ever heard of the term "NuTrek"? That one has been used the most.

[@Darkhorse393]

Disco. The name itself should have been enough foreshadowing for anyone to know it would fail

[@RandomNPC001]

STD you mean?!

[@kichigaisensei]

I grew up in the 70s watching Star Trek on reruns. In the 80s, I was a teen and I was at the theater to watch TOS crew movies and I recorded TNG on VHS every week. I collected toys, books, comics, props, model kits, etc. I watched Voyager and DS9 and Enterprise. I saw the first two JJ Trek movies at the theater. I did not enjoy them. I didn't bother watching the third until it showed up on the DVD shelves at my local library. What a waste of time. I wanted to give Discovery a chance. I watched the first episode. I haven't watched any new Trek since and I don't miss it. I watch TOS with my kids. From what I've seen, I couldn't watch Picard or SNW with children...and now Section 31 is more of the same. Yes, it is a dead franchise. They jettisoned Roddenberry's vision of an optimistic future and a human race that's at least attempting to overcome its base savagery. It's over. They don't even care about the built-in fanbase.

[@Tb0n33999]

They canceled LD, I canceled +. I'll be back for SNW but Paramount needs someone who actually likes Star Trek to run the franchise.

[@Sykboogie]

But if LD existed, doesn't that mean the show was supported by the franchise runner? The show ran for five seasons.

[@MrJturner74]

Do you feel like Anson Mount has a monkey paw and he wished to be in a marvel series and a Star Trek series?

[@noahbody9875]

If I need to watch a modern Star Trek show I watch Star Trek: The Orville.

[@garydoyle5755]

I'm 64 and have been a Star Trek forever. Section 31 is so bad it is the very first Star Trek 'anything' that I couldn't watch through to the end. I had to check online to see if Disney had bought Star Trek.

[@TroysMilitaryHistory]

I'm 65 and I thought nothing could be worse than Disgracery or Discard. I was wrong. How Disgracery got 5 seasons and Enterprise got the arse after 4 seasons is a stain on Paramount. Alex Klutzman is a complete wanker

[@rrsjr]

Section 31 was awful, and what a waste of a great actress. I liked Discovery, though.

[@herbertbell9438]

TNG was pretty much the last ST worth watching. It went down hill from there till it went woke and that was the end pretty much. As we know, everything woke turns to shit.

[@mystikmind2005]

There is not a single Startrek movie i have not absolutely loved... but, having said that, screwing with the traditional timeline DID NOT make me happy at all, and bringing in Startrek royalty Leonard Nimoy just to make him watch Vulcan explode... OMG no, this is OBVIOUSLY, OBVIOUSLY, not what fans want to see. (He was of course AWESOME in that role regardless)

[@solgoode1]

Spock's adopted sister who is black and is named Michael Burnham: that killed it instantly for me without ever even needing to watch it. It's an absolute disgrace to Star Trek.

[@SciFiDavey69]

You do mean the sister that was never discussed in the TOS, TNG, any of the movies including reboots? Yeah, dumb!

[@aarondelisle7693]

31 isn't just a bad trek movie, it's easily one of the worst movies ever made.

[@subraxas]

You haven't seen many movies then. 😀

[@BasaiDai]

Star Trek is in the worst state it has ever been, worse than when Enterprise was cancelled. I wanted Section 31 to be good but knew it wouldn't be, Starfleet Academy is likely to be the same level

[@peterdubois7276]

Star Trek (real Star Trek) is optimistic. TOS, TAS, TNG, DS9, Ent, Voy, Picard S3, even moments of the Abramsverse have the optimism that is key to the franchise. And thirty plus years ago Star Trek was bad when they forgot the optimism (ST V, ST Nemesis). STD and most of the STD era of Star Trek are bad because there is no optimism for the future. And the STD era uses woke-ism in place of writing, dialogue, character development, plot/narrative structure, and everything a tv series or movie needs to be successful. Old school Trek had themes of social justice and environmentalism, but had good writing, dialogue, character development, plot/narrative structure, and the themes were part of stories that worked on the merit of the story itself and characters. The STD era has gone the Disney/MCU route of the past five years- release movies and tv shows with high production values and nothing of value in the areas of story, dialogue, character development, etc and claim fans are racist/sexist/____phobic when a terrible movie or tv series flops.

[@joshhardin666]

the first couple of seasons of disco were pretty lackluster, but it did get better. - and it lead to more awesome stuff like lower decks and prodigy (which are both amazing!), and strange new worlds has been *mostly* good too (though there have been a few duds as well... I don't think anyone was asking for a star trek musical (well, unless maybe it was on disco and had Anthony Rapp, but even that's probably not exactly star trek). And when Terry Matalas took over and did picard season 3, that was fantastic... The trouble with modern star trek is that paramount seems to be directing it's production, all the way down, to produce blockbuster action shows and films. the problem is that star trek isn't and shouldn't be an action show... yes, it can and should contain action set-pieces sometimes, but it's not an action show, it's a science fiction show. and when it's at it's best it's a hard science fiction show. - on science fiction shows you introduce one or more concepts (preferably ones found in present day) and then you take a pseudo-science approach to illustrate how when those concepts are turned up to 11, what might happen. this very concept is why section31 worked so well in ds9 when it was an analysis of how and why you cross the moral/ethical line "for the good of the federation" and all of it's implications... this is what the concept of section31 WAS FOR. and even after that point, when they revisited the concept on enterprise years later, it worked really well there too, because likewise, it was an analysis of the consequences of being unencumbered by strict moral codes (and it's always supposed to be either really bad or really complicated.) section 31 was a straight up suicide squad ripoff action movie. there was no science fiction here (other than a poorly explained macguffin)... this action instead of science fiction was also responsible for lots of the initial failings of star trek discovery. it's totally fine to have the flashy graphics refresh, new uniforms, new technology to explain (so long as it's relevant to the show), but stop with the needless blockbuster action movie stuff. I want more star trek courtroom dramas, I want more empathetic characters positing the meaning of existence while drinking tea/coffee, I want complicated politics, I want to have to be forced to think through the scenarios and what could happen if things went in a different direction. this is what tng, voy, and ds9 did so well... yes, they incorporated action into their story telling, but the stories they were telling were about more than that. they were about studying ourselves through the lens of what our protagonists discovered in their universe. that's what scifi is, that's what lower decks and prodigy did reasonably well too, and what snw seems to be getting back to and why that's largely succeeding.

[@TheEvilnickademus]

kurtzman needs a boot.

[@obelix703]

I actually liked the show more after the time jump. The finale still sucked, but at least we got to see the future of the Federation.

[@ThatEnglishGent]

I'm personally glad ST: Legacy didn't go ahead because at the end of the day, it would have been tied to ST: Picard which was tied to STD. It would have just been a continuation of more bad writing and more bad ideas. Star Trek needs to die off. Disappear for 5yrs then come back and make REAL Star Trek continuing on after the events of Nemesis. Its what Trekkies actually want and have been asking for since 2017. No more prequels. No more reinventing the franchise for "modern audiences". Just give us what we want which has proven the test of time at being a timeless classic series.

[@Davidgoldenswan]

I thought an STDs 😂 were a hole different thing😮😂😂😂

[@fatbuckrto8371]

Counterpoint: Nemesis isn't canon.

[@smallcode9981]

Voyager kill Star Trek. DS9 was bold step in story writing, because it introduce side characters as main protagonist, which was unusual. Who is more important - Jake or Gol Dukat, Garek, General Martok? They even introduce a normal Admiral!!! And instead of continue on that path in STV, maybe to create a story around 2 or 3 ships on mission, they made step back. Even worse, STV is closed world, and we hardly know any of 138 crew members! There is one gay on bottom of ship resolving origin of Universe.... Technically, for 7 years, we could see each of them at least once. And that single opportunity to make some change with Equinox was finished in two episodes. Galactica at least use Pegasus for whole season.

[@Oolon_Colluphid]

I wish I had seen this before watching Section 31. Having a lot of issues removing its 'stank'....

[@christopherpike8269]

The last two seasons of Discovery, the last season of Picard, and Strange New Worlds to me were pretty good. Also I really enjoyed Prodigy. Section 31 was not Star Trek it was not even a good sci-fi movie. I have seen better KZbin fan fiction than that dumpster fire.

[@mrfoobarf5670]

Third season missed a great setup, the fourth was lousy with pacing (emo), but the fifth was good one.

[@christopherpike8269]

@@mrfoobarf5670 Yes, I can give you that, thinking back on it. I just remember it changing completely after they jumped to the future. I was ok with it taking the show completely out of the timeline. It needed to fully separate from the disaster it was in the first few seasons. PIC third season was just the nostalgia factor I was wanting. I would have been ok with that being a movie and dump the rest of that show all together. Also, Lower Decks, I completely forgot about lower decks.

[@ncdevildog]

I defended this era for a long time. Disco did have some gems, but like those first couple of seasons of TNG, you have to do a lot of panning. I was excited for S31, I really was. I talked it up, I was excited to see a young Rachel Garett, and well, I digress. But now this movie goes into a special place I reserve for actual garbage; it ranks right down there with ST:V and Iron Eagle II.

[@Cathmoytura]

Star Trek: Section 31 with Michelle Yeoh would have been great if it'd had Star Trek, Section 31, or Michelle Yeoh. Unfortunately it didn't have any of those elements.

[@rustynail6363]

Star Trek/Star Wars & Marvel have all been ruined. Haven't watched any of the rubbish in over ten years. The people working in the "entertainment" business seem to have forgotten how to "ENTERTAIN ME"!!!!!!

[@stormtrooper74]

…it hasn’t even been out two weeks. Chill. No. It’s not a typical Star Trek movie. If you want regular Star Trek, it’s not for you. It’s a heist movie, set in the Star Trek universe. If you watch it for what it is, and don’t bring your own preconceived notions, it’s a decent way to kill an hour and a half.

[@RichardReifsnyder]

Indeed, even if one hates the movie, to claim that a multi-series "era" ENDED two weeks ago (when series are still in active production) is melodramatic fanwank. GFR should be better than that.

[@brnzro]

Hello! I would like to view your review of ST Into Darkness, but im afraid it will lead me.......well......into darkness ;) Thanks for the usually great video! LLAP!

[@khuscroft63]

I watched Section 31 and immediately cancelled my Paramount+ subscription . When you cancel they ask why so I simply said Section 31.

[@dcb_75]

If it took you until the Section 31 "film" to figure out Trek is dead, what took you so long? Trek was killed when JJ made his first film and tries to turn it into Star Wars. But the Kurtzman era starting with Discovery is just horrible. Nonsense plots, hammy acting(no Shatner comments, he also does some top tier acting in Trek), taking Picard and making a series even TNG faithful like me had no interest in watching. This is all Trek in name only, it isn't actually Trek and for sure isn't set in the same universe as the real series. Trek has been dead for a while. Worst part of all of this - they had things like Nick Meyer's Khan series that they never did so we got a bunch of crappy Trek no one asked for or was interested in but they denied us things that could actually be good.

[@BritishRedCoat2025]

It is not dead. It has had some serious issues, but it's far from the worst-condition franchise out there. Kelvin was fine (issues with space being reduced in scale to the size of a county aside) as it was set outside of the original timeline. It was designed to catch new fans through increased action, but you would still know that you were watching Trek when you saw it. Enterprise was also fine - when you accept that it was also diverging from the original timeline. Season 1 of Discovery was poorly-planned, had huge issues, but at least you could tell you were watching Star Trek (although you'd possibly be confused about why the Drazi were fighting the Federation - as they were no Kilingons). Each change that they made on Discovery season 1 would have been accepted on their own - but they tried to change everything and chose the wrong plot, and certainly the wrong showrunners (just look at how they looked at cast and crew on the aftershow and you can see what they were like) for that first season. Adding Pike was a good call, and that led to Strange New Worlds - which is generally great if you're interest in Trek extends further than DS9. SNW and TOS (and The Cage) all fit well so far. They also gave us Lower Decks and Prodegy - which turned out to be surprisingly good. However, leaping back to Suction 31 whilst ignoring the large support for Legacy shows that there is a problem at the top that needs to be dealt with if Trek is to continue. There was nothing in Suction 31 that would let someone know it was Trek if they walked into a room and it was on the tv. Academy is set in the far future, so whatever issues its going to have, it won't be a prequal.

[@kingrix]

At this point, Star Trek is as bad as Star Wars. All the new material being produced is soulless corporate product slapped with a recognizable IP, and shat into existence to dupe fans out of their money. Picard Season 3 and Andor may be rare standouts, but both franchises are dead to me for the most part.

[@iainfreeman5112]

To be fair the Starfleet Academy series seems to be set in the 32nd century with some of the case of Discovery returning. Whether it'll be good or not is different matter, only just saying it's likely not another prequel.

[@blackcyclist]

As a life long Star Trek fan, I was excited when DISCO started & TBH, I enjoyed it, especially the change to the Klingons. Loved it until they jumped 1000 years into the future. It evolved way beyond what I came to love as the values & fundamentals of Roddenberry's Star Trek. The last season was pretty basic. DISCO could have been so much more!!!

[@nriqueog]

Star Trek went off course the moment "The Enterprise" producers decided to ditch the Original Canon and create a whole new line of ships...aka- NX01 Enterprise. This design I understand came from the games and not the Canon set down by Gene. Once Paramount realized these new gamer fans would buy into this the OG ST fans were pretty much swept aside.

[@Tricky117]

The starfleet academy one should be set post discovery

[@marcofabiocarosi2996]

I was intrigued by the 2 first seasons of Discovery, but the 3rd and 4th were a total disappointment. Unearned emotional moments, hollow lofty words sprinkled every 5 minutes, no character development. A real torture to watch, a suicide for the franchise. The 5th season didn’t diserve my effort to watch. Good riddance. A shame that for 3 consecutive seasons not a single good episode was produced. Awful!

[@AEFisch]

Legacy is the direction: Every ST series has a rough 1st season incl Disco. TNG! But Paramount has always screwed it up. Enterprise, cutting it off once figured out. Disco was getting it's stride the last two seasons, ditto? Academy after Section 31? - (should have at least been mini-series).

[@Valkron11]

Star Troke, brought to you by USAID 🤮

[@Sykboogie]

Man, they feed you talking points and you just parrot them. LOLOLOL

[@MbisonBalrog]

Star Trek Strange New Worlds is still good

[@dussan2]

It's ok. It's still suffering the same issues that Discovery did. I will admit that the casting is spot on, but the writing is inconsistent. They need a Ronald Moore, Bryan Fuller.

[@RabbitShirak]

@@dussan2I only watched season 1 of Strange New Worlds, but the tone of the dialogue was kinda bad.

[@Max_Flashheart]

Star Trek Disco felt insulting. burnham could do it all by herself.

[@lexington476]

Although Discovery was overall very subpar, I did like Michelle Yeoh in the Terran Emperor role.

[@GiantFreakinRobot]

As a villain, sure. But as a hero?

[@lexington476]

@GiantFreakinRobot once they got back to the prime Universe yeah the character kind of lost its luster a little bit. still a good actor in that regard. But in the prime Universe She was the character that said the unspoken and more real world solution than highfalutin Starfleet Solutions. Not saying it's a great series overall, I'm just saying I'm kind of like that character a little bit, a little bit away from the goody two shoes of Star Trek.

[@antonyeastham4564]

Yep. JJ killed off this time-served Star Trek fan. Multiple cinema visits, DVDs and merchandise enthusiast for years. A fan of all Trek up to that film. Everything afterwards stinks. I won't watch Discovery, Picard or Section 31 or a fkn cartoon Lower Decks, Strange New World. No thanks.

[@oiyouoverhere1112]

When did Section 31 launch..... I've seen ZERO advertizements for it

[@philiprice7875]

called "throwing good money after bad"

[@stue2298]

It a combination of things that made Nu trek so bad. Too much money which made the writer lazy, too many writers can't make good stories by committee, the writers have certain politcal leanings and put that into the stories which will make dated. They used the Star Trek name for the inbuilt fan base but didn't write stories that had the morals on Star fleet or the Federation, it may have looked like star trek a bit but had no real connection to the franchise. The canon of Trek is a complete mess, what fine up to the the end of the TNG movies, but the reboot changed so much and the NU trek want to be linked to the good Star trek pre 2009 but the stain of the Jar jar movies has infected star trek.

[@Kitsaplorax]

After the Original Series with its two seasons, Roddenberry wanted to escape the limitations of Network censorship and experiment. Anyone who complains about "Woke" Trek didn't bother to read or listen to what he said about his vision for it. He intended to push boundaries as a writer and producer.

[@SciFiDavey69]

Agreed and when he was all but a figure head for TNG, the series finally started getting good

[@Vanyarma]

The complaints aren't only, or even really, about "wokeness" but about the identity of the franchise. Trek was always about what is best about humanity. It could be preachy at times, but always from a better, wiser standpoint. Disco is what a Warhammer 40k fan thinks Star Trek should be, edgy grimdark and ridden not with policy (how to make a better world) but with political identity and rivalry (who to betray and who to befriend to get into power). Stuff like "diversity" and "inclusion" where never foreign to Trek, yet Disco preaches it like they invented the terms, and do so as if the audience where a bunch of naughty kids you are yelling at instead of adults capable of understanding nuance and context (or even of remembering the series basic canon).

[@Kitsaplorax]

@@Vanyarma Please go back and see the comments about the episodes on race in the series from 1967. It had one episode banned in the South and was heavily criticized for being so preachy about Civil Rights and women in the military. I can't repeat those comments here.

[@RichardReifsnyder]

​@@KitsaploraxI believe you that you can't repeat those comments, but can you cite a source? I'm legitimately, morbidly curious...

[@davetomlinson9063]

discovery season 5 , haven’t watched the last season beyond episode three,just hate this abomination they have no idea what Star Trek is,change the recipe change the flavour.

[@TheRealCoolDude1989-nt5ed]

I think current Star Trek stuff has lost its mojo if say that out right , since the Star Trek Discovery Universe , and what the Kelvin are not the main or prime universe .Which has been finally made clear at this point , but Roddenberry would turning into his grave right now . But I did like Picard season 3 as the only real trek in the current time , but I guess it's like Star Wars where it might need a rest or break .

[@tymek200101]

I agree with the caveat that I actually kinda liked most of DISCO season 2 and Pcard Season 1. there were rough episodes and plot points I did not enjoy but comparatively it was at least watchable

[@ChrisBranson]

We love robots!

[@SciFiDavey69]

What does that mean?

[@ChrisBranson]

@@SciFiDavey69 It means we love robots!

[@sragga]

i liked disco. it was different, modern take with a few likable characters, but i hated the change to the Klingon appearance. picard s3 was great, and section 31 was meh. it looked like a series pilot more than a movie. have to see what academy has instore, but legacy had/has potential to be great if they can get some good writing. then again i also like the modern visuals in 4k hdr melting my eyeballs

[@DanielGomez-gw4kt]

After I saw Star Trek Picard season 3, I kind of hoped and had my fingers crossed for two new movies to complete the Star Trek next generation franchise. Because they had done for Star Trek next generation movies, now I want a 5 and 6. And in those movies I actually want to see two of the other starships from the other Star Trek spin-off series to be involved with the movies. Like I want to see the USS Voyager join forces with the USS Enterprise D in the fifth movie, and on the 6th movie. I actually want to see the Enterprise D, the Voyager and the USS Defiant all together on the 6th movie. These are the hopes then I want to see for two new movies of the Star Trek next generation franchise, and I actually want those two movies to be the final completion of the franchise. The next generation franchise that is. And I think I want to see deep Space nine station to be involved within those movies as well, because it will be cool if the Enterprise D can make a space dock at that space station. Along with the Voyager and of course the Defiant. And for the 6th and final movie, I want to see all three starships to get in a battle with enemy ships

[@RichardReifsnyder]

I felt that Picard Season 3 -- the last two episodes, at least -- already was the narrative equivalent to the sixth movie. The TNG cast and ship were allowed to gracefully retire (instead of dying), and pass the torch of exploration to yet another generation. The post-credits appearance of Q wasn't a sneak preview, it was a bookend.

[@sidd_not_vicious2609]

I think they need to stop paying actors these huge amounts of money. maybe if they were payed like the average person they would not be so out of touch and ridiculous. seriously pay them maybe 100 dollars an hour. tops. it would make movies good again it would decrease the hollywood syupidity bubble and so much more. why are these people payed millions of dollars. why. studios band together and make these "actors" worth what they put out

[@nickrican]

Section 31 was a really bad offering to fans, I liked the DS9 Episode with Dr. Bashir was much more interesting, than what we got after much anticipation, I do disagree when it comes to Discovery,, the first season wasn't anything to write home about, but it got better after that, and I do like the storyline of the 30th century, Strange New Worlds I think its excellent, with probably the exception been its musical episode, but they have come up with some really good stories, Picard was very enjoyable to anyway I'm in my 60's and have watched all Star Trek episodes, many of them many times over, My Favorite episode of any Star Trek is "The Inner Light", anyway lets not be so negative, even Babe Ruth struck out once in a while.

[@vitalef]

I think discovery killed it with the Klingons. I quite enjoyed the show, as well as Strange New Worlds. I will not be watching section 31.

[@williamsowers6076]

I would like to see a mirror universe series.....but it would get messed up.

[@Sykboogie]

Picard season 3 was bad. It was pure memberberries. They even managed to slip in memberberries for 12 Monkeys. I like Matalas, but you loved season 3 because they were throwing what you knew in your face, and you were loving it. Also, are you aware that Starfleet Academy is the farthest-flung series to date? It's literally set in the 32nd century...what is it a "prequel" to? That's just shoddy research, and a bit disappointing considering how much I usually love your videos.

[@blissmaster71]

Yes, Starfleet Academy is not a prequel. But no, PIC S3 was not bad! Yes, the callback Easter eggs were eye-roll inducing and unnecessary, but I think people online are making too big a deal of that; the story and the characters were great. Legacy, without the overkill on callbacks would (will) be a great show.

[@qui-gonrick7002]

I agree on Picard S3. It benefited from low expectations. Same for SNW.

[@Sykboogie]

@@blissmaster71 The story and characters were re-used. The villains were literally the greatest hits of DS9 and TNG. It was like a checklist of plots and characters meant to stir up the fans. Trust me, I liked it at first, but it doesn't hold up to any kind of scrutiny.

[@blissmaster71]

@@Sykboogie Well, I have to admit that I went straight from TNG to Voyager, and have only watched a little DS9 in recent years, so whether or not it's JUST a retreading of DS9 and other older shows is something I'll determine in my rewatch of S3 and from watching more DS9. The 'lowered expectations' comment above is probably correct.

[@jimwells4240]

Star Trek Discovery WAS truly awful.....the only thing good to come out of it was Strange New Worlds.....

[@FiliusFidelis]

mm, enough with the frelling prequels already! At least with Enterprise (which was very good) they took pains to make it seem more technologically behind regular Star Trek, these new ones always seem MORE advanced than they were even in TNG.

[@Don-ol8ze]

Prequels, as a genre, suck. When will the lesson be learned?

[@efxnews4776]

The Expanse>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Star Trek

[@timamherst-clark2699]

Poor writing and poor storytelling. You look through Kurtzman's resumé and there's nothing that's particularly outstanding there, mostly "a bit disappointing" to "Nope! Not bloomin' well watching that again!" with a couple of slightly better efforts thrown into the mix. And pretty much the same can be said of his former comrades, JarJar Abrams, Roberto Orci, and Damon Lindelof. I gave up on Lost when the Polar Bear turned up on the desert island. Fringe started out quite well, but didn't take too long to get it's head well and truly up it's own backside. (And when they keep bringing in doppelgangers of the main characters - with or without the legally mandated, distinguishing facial hair! - from alternate timelines/dimensions/pocket universes etc. then it's a pretty decent bet that the writers are struggling.) I'm afraid that, with the exception of Lindelof (since his superb Watchmen series), the involvement of any of these barely talented individuals definitely lowers my expectations, and ensures that I probably won't be rushing out to the cinema on the day of the film's release, or changing my schedule to make sure I'm in when the new TV show is available to watch!

[@jamesstewart7213]

Discovery was good science fiction just not Star Trek. Strange New Worlds is both good science fiction and great Star Trek! 😊

[@kenjiro310]

Star Trek Prodigy was better than Discovery

[@JosephKeenanisme]

Discovery = ST:D and just like syphilis it rots the brain and is insane. When you point out things that suck about it you get called a nazi. How about addressing how it's nothing like Roddenberry or Moore envisioned? Nope, you have a bunch of mindless people who will watch the show just because it has the Star Trek brand name and not because of the quality or lack there of. To start off having someone who committed mutiny being placed back into the fleet? Tom Paris went to prison for less.

[@themoviereviewwarriors939]

I dont get the love that some seem to have for lower decks. I have tried watching it and dont get it

[@LutzAlbrecht-Mylenium]

I don't really agree. When Discovery was first announced I sure was skeptical and called them out for having designed the ugliest ship imaginable, the atrocious redesign of the Klingons and a few other things like everyone being so annoyingly emotional all the time, but ultimately you can get used to it. It gets better with re-watches. Is it the best Trek series there ever was? No, definitely not. Still, it's just not as bad as a lot of people make it out to be. There were some interesting ideas in there. I see it more as an issue of some of that stuff not having been explored deeply enough and thus feeling inconsequential plus the universe somehow feeling small no matter how many new races and places they introduced. A lot of things were unnecessarily stretched out, too. I also don't see the problem for Trek as a whole. I always get the impression that people forget how unpopular and non-mainstream some of that stuff was back in the day and it only gained momentum through endless re-runs with the advantage of not much else being on TV...

[@Claymore5]

The y should have built the whole Discovery series around Jason Isaacs. Far and away the best actor in this 'might have been' great series. A steaming great plie of excrement afterwards.

[@GiantFreakinRobot]

Lorca was great. No doubt.

[@michaelfranz8252]

Kind of like Strange New Worlds

[@alexanderwingeskog758]

Opinions is like "asses" they split in the middle... So here is mine... Love TNG, like/love TOS, like Voy, like DS9, like Enterprise, like TAS, like lower decks (but it's on the lower end of like maybe)... Like Strange new worlds somewhat but it was not exactly what I was hoping for... Then we have Discovery... I tried really tried... watched season 1 and 2 and think I even tried some more with season 3... but then I just had to stop... I tried so hard but got so far... I did like (not love) the new movies... But Discovery made me just more angry and upset then anything... I really wanted (before Discovery) to love Picard (series), but it was also a hard pill to swallow I sort of did not want to ruin my feelings for TNG so I actually stopped watching that too after 4-5 episodes... But I'm thinking I'm going to give that a try after all... It just can not be as bad as Discovery right? Maybe I'm afraid of Picard somehow... will it hurt my love for TNG?

[@RichardReifsnyder]

Picard Seasons 1 and 2 are not TNG-like, and retcon a few minor details of canon. They actually would have been decent stories if they had been written for an all-new cast rather than Jean-Luc Picard and Seven of Nine. However, they are only worth watching if you don't know what follows them, because Season 3 finally gave the fans what we wanted the whole time: a TNG reunion that is better than Nemesis. You can either power through S1/S2 and just admire the ability of Patrick Stewart (and other fan favorites) to act the s*** out of a mediocre script, or you can jump straight to S3 and never look back.