How to Build a Fiddle - Part 11: Varnishing and other finishes

[@593Guitars]

I've built my fiddle. Until now, I have avoiding thinking about the 'finishing'. After hours of 'research' I came across this episode. Tomorrow I start finishing. Thank you.

[@grandpasmountain]

Thanks so much for the kind words, Richard! Love to hear how it comes out!

[@eugeneknapik]

This is a fantastic video series. I really appreciate your clarity and your encouragement on the challenging bits. I started watching the series thinking, this is something I'd like to try some day but I bet it is too difficult to do without expert help on-hand, but now I think if I take my time, and take it one step at a time, maybe I can do it. Thank you.

[@st.ceciliasconservatoryofmusic]

Your rant was jolly good fun. It is a lot of fun to experiment with varnish. Your rant is sensible and thoughtful. The cherry is really beautiful! Can't wait to hear her sing. Thanks for sharing. Happy Birthday to your daughter. Our daughter had a birthday yesterday. :)

[@GeeksWoodShop]

"We aren't building a prissy violin..." as alway John, your humor and wisdom is so enjoyable. Those words should be framed and hanging on your shop wall.

[@grandpasmountain]

Haha-- my wife likes your post! Maybe I WILL hang up a sign to that effect! Thankyou, again, for the kind words!

[@GeeksWoodShop]

@@grandpasmountain That would be fun, but either way, another excellent video and thanks again for sharing all your knowledge

[@lad60606]

Thanks for another great video in the series. I’ll be referencing these a lot in the coming months. I finished my mold today and added the Spruce blocks. Just six simple little hunks of wood, but I thought to myself when I was gluing them on, “Hey, I’m not just thinking about it any more. This is actual forward progress on building a fiddle!” I can’t say it enough: Thank you for the instruction and the inspiration. And Happy Birthday to your little girl.

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou very much for that, Lamar! You made my day. I'll tell my girl you said Happy Birthday, too. Thrilled to hear you started your fiddle!

[@domenicorossi2248]

Bravissimo,Complimenti.

[@riccardo-964]

Sir, thank you. You're the best. Your comments are the best.

[@MangAiren]

I could cry right now.... I've seen all the fiddle making videos on this channel and this tutorial, you've gotten so much better at playing and the violins have gotten so much better too, you are so awesome!! Thank you for taking us along!!

[@grandpasmountain]

Those are very, very nice words! Thankyou so much! You made my day!

[@gilbertwilliamson7782]

Love your attitude towards varnishing a fiddle. I nearly got caught up in the secrecy that seems to be around varnish. And now I just try anything and everything. The cherry fiddle looks great, beautiful wood! And the walnut and ceder fiddle looks and sound amazing. Looking forward to hearing the cherry fiddle.🎻🎻👍👍

[@grandpasmountain]

Thanks, Gilbert. Guitar world has gone too far the other way. Layering wood with gobs of laquer, then sticking a huge plastic pick guard on the sound board. Makes no sense. Once I was shown the "secret 1714 Strad varnish recipe compared to "regular" varnish.... a bulb lit up. Carleen Hutchins did a ton of research on this.

[@davidhenderson5051]

You are brilliant...!!! So informative. Well done. I love the rant about varnishes... I have spent the last few months researching varnishes for violins and it literally is secret squirrels..... ! People don't divulge formulas and act as if the varnish is some magical ingredient that turns your violin into a Strad..... so good to hear some sense on this...

[@fishmut]

I have to say mate, your violins are quality , the different species of woods and their beautiful sounds , you should be very proud of your work , I hope you still make these , or maybe doing classes to keep it alive , I loved the whole series ,I’m sure I left comments sometime ago but anyhow this is a new one for ya. Take care , awesome. 👍

[@grandpasmountain]

Thanks a million for the encouragement!!!

[@fishmut]

@@grandpasmountain Your very welcome, really love your work , keep at it mate , great talent you got , keep it shining . 👍

[@bluehoo0]

Thanks again Jon excellent 👍👍👍👍👍 It makes me laugh when I read about these “Secret “ varnish recipes.

[@8BitBrody]

Just finished a mandolin in shellac today. I can only speak the highest praise for it. Shellac is hands down my favorite finish.

[@grandpasmountain]

I love it, too. I'm amazed that its the "secret" covering on Jelly Belly jelly beans!

[@grandpasmountain]

I just got a set of plans for an F5 mandolin!

[@8BitBrody]

@@grandpasmountain I look forward to seeing that series!

[@violinturcan]

Jon, wow I love your skill and your attitude to your work. Love to learn from you! Thank you!

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou so much! Thats very nice to say!

[@TwoCherriesIns]

Love the varnish rant and the Cherry.

[@grandpasmountain]

Haha! Thanks!

[@adamgc73]

Wow the stain on that cherry looks gorgeous....I sware my heart skipped a beat when that finger board popped off 😳😳

[@grandpasmountain]

😁thanks-- haha!

[@josplatschorre]

Great rant :) , lovely fiddle playing and what a beautiful fiddle you are building there. Love your videos. Greetings from The Netherlands.

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou so much! Thanks for writing from sonfar away! It amazes me!

[@ericbanks8898]

Love the sound of the walnut Reminds me of an old Appalachian hym

[@grandpasmountain]

Thanks, Eric!

[@tomupdegraff]

Jon, I have been enjoying your videos . Watched your whole series on building your bungalow while working in my shop last Saturday steaming it to my TV. It was like watching a reality show, very entertaining! good job! I have been on the fence of building a fiddle for the last couple of years only discouraged on the carving part of it. However, after seeing your HD Fiddle build and your latest series of your detailed explanation I am now on the build side of that fence. I was encouraged that I can buy an inexpensive floor joist to practice on and if it carves out OK than that's a plus. Your encouraging comments you gave while carving yours is very inspiring to common sense folks like myself. Your "Tool alerts" are valuable as well, I don't mind buying tools if necessary but i like making them if I can or buying a more conservative solution i.e. small F-clamps for the violin body. I do have a question though, I am going to buy the Violin Template Set, Guarneri Kochanski 1741 like yours (from International Violin) because I trust your lead but I can not find the arch templates for the front and back. What do you use? I know you go by feel but I thought I saw some paper templates on one of your videos. Thank you very much and I wish you and your family the best!

[@grandpasmountain]

Thanks for the kind words, Tom!! I am so glad you enjoyed my goofy videos-- they were mostly to keep friends and family 1000 miles away updated on what we were doing. I have no aspirations of being a tv star :) I can save you even more $ if you go to www.makingtheviolin.com and you can download and print ALL the templates for the Strad Messiah violin for FREE. Just have them printed at Staples or another stationary shop to have them come out accurate. The arching height is important...but there is some leeway in the shape. You can steal the arches from the Strad or do a little hunting on the internet. The Guarner arches are for sale at International Violin.... they're just listed funny and you have to do some clicking around...or call them. They're not expensive. I made my own arch templates from my Strad poster. (www.thestradshop.com) I'm so glad you found my videos useful and if I can help, just holler. I sure hope you move forward and get going on your epic fiddle journey!!

[@ellamyus]

Super nice!! I love the kontrasts of the beutiful woods!!

[@2old4u]

A warmed heart and a big ole' smile. It's beautiful. Love that cherry.

[@grandpasmountain]

Oh, yeah! Me too! Thanks :)

[@sethzinsmeister9201]

Beautiful! I love the finish you used on that cherry. I can’t wait to here what this one sounds like. I can’t thank you enough for posting all these videos. I don’t know if I would have ever tried to make a fiddle if it was not for all the videos you have posted. I have not started making one yet because I am in the process of moving but a fiddle is definitely in my future thanks to you.

[@grandpasmountain]

That means alot to me, Seth. The videos have consumed my life for 7 weeks and countless hours. Thankyou so much for writing. I hope you are able to get going once you're settled. I moved, too, and it took a while before I got into a new project.

[@spndslive1807]

theres something about that walnut fiddle that sings to me, its my favorite one you showcase. i found your page because i want to make a fiddle, but your page has made it so that i dont have a choice, i have to make one now

[@anderleyadv]

It looks beautiful. Good job. I really appreciate your videos. I'd like to see what you can do with woods from other countries. May I suggest to start with Brazilian woods?

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou-- I don't know much about Brazillian woods...but, I am open to suggestions!

[@finnerickson2364]

WOW!!! IT'S SO BEAUTIFUL!!!! I'm in love with the cherry. No need to be oppressed by the "Violin World" with this creation in comparison. Very encouraging video! ;)))

[@grandpasmountain]

Thanks, Finn. Yup-- God made the Cherry already beautiful. All we have to do is uncover it!

[@jaylichty]

Great series Jon. The Tried and True finish is intriguing. I see that they have one called Varnish Oil. I wonder if it would be a more durable choice. Also a tip of the hat to you for calling B.S. on the secret recipe phenomenon in the violin world. If I believed all the things I’ve read about building violins I would never have started any. Cheers.

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou. I have talked with real experts in the study of violins and they fight the same battle of the "mysterious" finishes. I spent time with two men who worked with Dr. Hutchins.

[@GoldPlate29]

Just lovely Jon! I been building violins from all sort of timbers, and I just love to do it, and yes I don't care what experts say about it, because I'm having fun... Cheers! That violin u play at the end sounds great! Thanks to all the effort u put in to this series, just wonderful to watch! PS: I'm using printer colors with great success mix with alcohol base varnish...

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou so much! The great thing about being a maker if fiddles is we don't really care what some folks think! Printer ink! I'd like to learn more about that. Thanks!

[@billstoner5559]

Thanks, Jon, for another great Video. That walnut fiddle has a very deep and melodious tone. I suspect it sounds even more so in real life. Wish I lived closer so we could meet. I don’t know what your work profession is, but when you final finish you homestead, a small teaching workshop/studio might be something to consider.

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou so much. I have thought about a workshop studio-- a fellow had one not too far from where I lived in NH. It would be a lot of fun! I don't know where you are, but if you ever make it out my way, you're always welcome!

[@billstoner5559]

Thanks for the invite! We live in Florida, but like to go to Smokies in the fall. Not sure if you’re close to that part of TN ,but perhaps our paths my cross someday.

[@grandpasmountain]

Like....Gatlinburg/Pigeon Forge area? I'm about 2...2 1/2 hours north. 150 miles. I ride my bike down there during various motorcycle events.

[@billstoner5559]

Yup, we usually stay somewhere around Gatlinburg. Once we stayed over in Cherokee, but that was a special occasion. We don’t ride, so probably won’t see you at a meet. But who knows, the world is small. Stay healthy and God Bless.

[@dennisdorsi9866]

Jon, I have to say, I have attended a number of classes at UNH for bow rehairing, repairing and violin building and set up and have yet to be as excited as watching your videos. You are a natural at teaching and your honesty and integrity and artistry certainly comes out in your videos. I will finish watching this series and then start earnestly from #1 and start building my first violin/ fiddle (wink, wink). Love the subtle sense of humor!! Thanks for all of this. Keep it up! I noticed a couple other videos that you have but I don't want to stray from this series before I look into them. Do you do any bow work? I'd be curious to know your approach.

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou so much, Dennis! I truly appreciate the kind words! I moved from NH to TN 3 years ago!

[@raymondcomeau8780]

Good sound,You're an ARTHIST!

[@grandpasmountain]

Lol. Thanks, Raymond.

[@maxlever9196]

Another informative video, Jon. Have you considered a artist grade linseed oil finish? Very flexible and water resistant. I know it penetrates more than a varnish or a shellac, so I wonder how it would effect the resonance of the wood.

[@grandpasmountain]

Thanks-- I had not thought of that. Yes, if the wood is weighed down excessively it would be a negative. Only some experiments would give a true answer....you'd have to build 2 identical instruments from the same piece of wood...then finish them differently. I know a luthier who did just that to debunk another theory.

[@dandror1274]

Dear Jon, I tried to paint a piece of raw pine tree with organic virgin coconut oil. The result seems to me amazing. Professionally, from the sound point of view, I have not any knowledge if it can be used succesfully on violin wood. What do you think about it? If it may be used because of good sound response, It should be used on the outside and inside of the violin to avoid stress development. Is it possible to try it ?

[@richardstumph7833]

Great tips, love it,,

[@grandpasmountain]

Glad it was helpful!

[@violinteaching833]

Thanks for sharing, your videos are great and you are very talented. I've seen a scientific article showing that oily varnishes penetrate more in the wood, having a muffling effect, affecting negatively the sound. Looking on the website you told about making violins, there's an initial step where they use plaster. I think this step could prevent the eventual penetration of the varnish and consequent muffling of the sound. I'd like to know your thoughts on that if you'd like to share them. Also, did you happen to stumble on any objective measure of a violin quality (something on the lines of the way you use software sound analysis to tune the plates). Thanks again for the videos and keep rocking on :)

[@twistknit1]

I know I am suppose to pick my violins on how they sound, but I am sucker for a different finish!

[@grandpasmountain]

Me too!

[@ChrisOgle210]

There's must be some sort of unspoken etiquette rules of violin finishing. I've been searching the internet everywhere for someone making a fiddle look old, used, antiqued, aged, etc. I feel like a fiddle that represents a 100 years of mountain old fiddle tunes should have a look to match. I just picked up a cheap student violin. Wanting to make it look rustic as hell like a fiddle should be. IMO. Any advice??

[@lintonmeyer]

Another awesome video Jon. Thank you. Do you thin the varnish any? Or just apply it straight out of the can? I'm thinking particularly of the first coat of clear. I am so excited to hear the finished product.

[@grandpasmountain]

I just used it right out of the can. It was thin enough for my taste. They probably alreasy thin it so they can make more money, haha Thanks!

[@Clayne151]

I varnished my electric.. fiddle.. with boat varnish, epifanes. But I found that it is a bit too elastic, making it a bit sticky to the touch.

[@nickfritz8692]

Nice work, as a novice I get a lot of answers to questions here. Since this is the finishing chapter I have one for you and I haven't been able to find an answer on the interwebs, can you put oil varnish over spirt varnish? Could you direct me to someone who could answer that question? Appreciate the help!!!🙏

[@grandpasmountain]

Yes I would think so. They cure differently, but there shouldn't be any reaction between them. I would use 400 grit to prep and apply a thin coat. It won't take much, as the wood is already sealed.

[@katherinejones8515]

I am needing advice on a repair of a cracked off piece of violin top that ive already glued back together and put back on. It was an old break and the edges were matched decent enough but there is a line even though ive sanded it smooth to the touch. I am wanting to give it a finish that will cover it and still show some grain. Painting is not an answer im looking for. I am looking to learn and it was a beat up violin headed for the trash so I am not worrying about failure- i just want to try and learn. I was thinking a few clear coats and then float color of some type. I am wanting to avoid accentuation of imperfections. If i come across a crack like this again i want to know how to make a completely seperated crack nearly invisible. its a crack from bottom of bass f hole to the bottom that was complete in its seperation some time ago so it had shrunk a little bit. What would you attempt?

[@katherinejones8515]

forgot to add that ive removed all finish so its white and ready for new finish.

[@grandpasmountain]

You should be proud of yourself for undertaking an ambitious project! I would have removed the top plate, used hide glue on the crack and clamped it, then added small wood buttons to reinforce the repair. Yes, a coat of clear will prevent color coats from highlighting the repair. You can buy tinted varnish from International Violin or try tinting your own. It is not a sin to use colored polyurethane found at the hardware store!

[@btryba]

I know that historically on guitars they have used nitrocellulose lacquer are there any downsides to using that on a fiddle?

[@grandpasmountain]

Well... "historically"... no. Varnish is the best. Spraying guitars with lacquer has become common, but it is not good for the sound. It's too stiff and imparts a harsher sound. Varnish let's the wood move and is the true traditional finish on stringed instruments. Of course...it's a "fiddle", so anything goes! You make it how you want it and don't worry about what everyone else thinks!

[@btryba]

@@grandpasmountain Great information! Thanks!

[@irenemeno3585]

Be Thou My Vision 🎻 I knew you loved the LORD ❤

[@OldIronShops]

I have heard of propolis from bees have you ever tried it before

[@grandpasmountain]

I know what propolis is-- but I haven't used it.

[@simonecamplani2430]

to have less issues with shellac you can add castor oil, il will be much slower

[@grandpasmountain]

Thankyou--- have you tried this? Maker Michael Darnton says 5 drops per 2 oz only increases flexibility and has no effect on drying time. I will have to give that a try myself!

[@simonecamplani2430]

@@grandpasmountain yes i do, you still have to be fast but it helps

[@simonecamplani2430]

Add 15 ml every 100 gr of shellac

[@grandpasmountain]

@@simonecamplani2430 Thankyou -- I will definitely try that! Also... I would think colder temps would be beneficial.

[@jimmycann160]

What's the song at the end of this video?

[@grandpasmountain]

A tune written about 800 A.D. Translated in English is "Be thou my vision"

[@jimmycann160]

@@grandpasmountain thanks bud! Beautiful song I'll have to look it up

[@danabellefeuille8485]

damn u do great work,, do u know the difference between a violin an a fiddle,,,, well a fiddle is a violin with some beer poured on it lol

[@richardstumph7833]

Yeah polyuriathane,, plastic,, looks like plastic, messes with the vibration, sound,