How to Create Villains for Your TTRPG Campaign

[@WhatisTableTop]

How do you create Villains for YOUR Campaigns? Let us know, down below!

[@Waggadudewagga]

That depends on the type of villain I'm after. With a miniboss-type villain I usually craft the base character (class, stats, skills) I need first, then I imagine him in the setting as vividly as possible and assign one or two defining traits and exaggerate them (e.g. a fat sweaty goblin chief, a haggard greedy elf). That's fairly fast and entertaining. For villains that should stick around and that are a part of the story the process is different - I start with motivation, assign key traits and at least one vice and create the "mechanical" side of the character afterwards. If I get carried away I might consider a web of supporting characters of the miniboss-type (I'm a writer, I tend to overdo these things a bit. Leads to a fair bit of depth in the game, though).

[@thegreatkamikaze]

I let the party/campaign develop their own villains. The villain of a single arc will become more complex as the campaign goes on, whether through a hook they set aside for a bit or someone they didn't defeat fully. If the villain is clever, they might mock characters for thibgs they rolled poorly or bad decisions they made (such as accidentally burning down a temple). It really helps the party HATE the villain.

[@WhatisTableTop]

I love when the party makes their own villains (whether in game or via backstory) cause I can then turn and say “it’s your fault”. I know a lot of people like the Batman villains for this same reason! - Frank

[@thegreatkamikaze]

@WhatisTableTop It really gets rid of the heavy lifting of getting players invested in a plot by making personal.

[@WhatisTableTop]

Also, once you start to allude to it, the player’s face light up with excitement and terror!

[@thegreatkamikaze]

@@WhatisTableTop I'd love to see an episode where you guys get deeper into how to get players to hate a villain or how to make the villains matter.

[@LorgarAurelius]

"Anakin is not sympathetic" I've heard enough, thank you👍

[@jesus_nakama]

All I do when making dungeons, villains, monsters etc. is think "well this sounds fun". And it works so far

[@WhatisTableTop]

Honestly, that’s all you need sometimes

[@dweizle4210]

A good example of a good villain without a sympathetic backstory is Necron from Fire and Ice. He's evil because he wants to. He wants to rule the world cause her wants to.

[@WhatisTableTop]

I have not heard of Nercon (unless you are talking about 40K) What media are they from?

[@dweizle4210]

@WhatisTableTop Ice and Fire. And old Rotoscope movie from the 80's it's actually not bad.

[@WhatisTableTop]

Gonna put that on my Movie Watch List

[@YawdroGaming]

DMing is putting roadblocks in front of your players and watching how they either move around them or break through them. Some satisfying villains are ones that have put several blocks in front and the party can't wait to break through them for good.

[@WhatisTableTop]

For sure! It’s also a great way to make your players really hate that villain!

[@whynaut1]

While I think the monsters in Flee Mortals makes the most dynamic and challenging combat encounters, I like the Tome of Beast series because they craft each monster as sort of a puzzle that the heroes need to figure out. Needless to say, I like to take monsters from both depending on the what the encounter calls for

[@WhatisTableTop]

Agreed, both are great books!

[@DreamTiger5]

The villain for the main campaign I’m running is simply a greedy bastard attempting to orchestrate a war between two large nations so he can profit off the conflict. Is he being manipulated by demons, kinda sorta maybe, but he is still doing it for selfish reasons. I’m also running a module where one of the PCs has dreams of being a brutal vampire in a past life, so I want to work that in somehow. Either by having her fight a shadow of her former self, or bringing in a victim of that vampire to confront her for revenge. I’m planning another campaign with a crazy occultist villain, just haven’t fleshed them out to any degree yet.

[@WhatisTableTop]

Yeah I love this kind of stuff. For your vampire PC, I’d honestly just do both! Those are great ideas and you shouldn’t let them go to waste

[@larsdahl5528]

I have over the years developed some rules of thumb. The most important here is: *Do not be a BBEG (Big Bloated Ego Gamemaster).* It is a failure I have seen far far too many times. Game masters are so obsessed with their ego trips that they do not leave much space, or any at all for the players to play their characters. I am interested in those who quit playing role-playing games. (An often-overlooked group.) Why did they stop playing? And here the BBEG is a quite common reason; they wanted to play but got reduced to mere spectators of the BBEG. --- Game masters sometimes ask me questions similar to: *I have created this antagonist, how do I start the game with it?* To me that is only half of the info, so I ask for the other half: Who are the characters in the group? Quite often the response is that they have no (InsertYourFavoriteSwearWordHere) idea. I then ask what this antagonist's view of the group is. Most often the response falls into one of two categories: (1) *The group is uninteresting nobodies.* I think this case is both easy and good, as then it is simple: The antagonist has more important things to do than care for a handful of nobodies. -> *Keep the antagonist out of the game, and let the players play!* (2) *The group does contain some who are interesting to the antagonist.* This can be done, but again we have to look at it from the antagonist's viewpoint: The antagonists need more henchmen (cultists or whoever). -> *Let the antagonist try to recruit the group to the cause!* --- If the story needs a villain, it will emerge from what the group does. -> A good rule of thumb: Cook first, then add salt if needed... Erhm... I mean... Get the group going first, then add a villain if needed. --- As said, BBEG (Big Bloated Ego Gamemaster), is one of the reasons why people quit playing. Half-quitters are in some sense even more problematic: People who stay in the game, but have accepted that any attempt to play only get bad treatment from the game master. I call this player type "zombie" (Wait passively, never says anything/only grunts, attacks everything (NPC) that moves, and eats the brains of those (players) around them.). Often they are victims of background abuse. - Ok, I have seen game masters commit background abuse without a villain doing it, but the most often reason is the BBEG (Big Bloated Ego Gamemaster) takes background characters, hostage, to force the players away from caring about their own character to focus on the BBEG (Big Bloated Ego Gamemaster) instead. Getting a zombie player is frustrating, they are a really tough task to get back into role-playing again. One of the common first signs is their character background: Growing up in an orphanage, with amnesia and thus no memory of their past. Yes, the background with nothing for a BBEG (Big Bloated Ego Gamemaster) to abuse! I try to shake them out of it, but it is really tough. My: "If you do not remember anything about your past, then what makes you believe you grew up in an orphanage?" question often only gets a few zombie grunts as a response. (Some incoherent mumbling about that is not important.)

[@callumdixon5177]

Good villains have one thing in common in my opinion and that is they are correct. From their point of view they will die on the hill that what they do is for the best. Maybe it's an us and them mentality, a greater good mentality, an any cost is worth the prize mentality where the conflict arises. Even if they are just greedy or powerhungry then their worldview should be that "might makes right", and they should say it with their whole chest

[@WhatisTableTop]

Interesting point you bring up. How you feel about anti-villains? That is Villains how know what are doing is wrong but feel it’s the only option

[@xaviersandoval1765]

​@@WhatisTableTopI am not the original commenter, but I would argue that kind of villain is ultimately another form of one who believes they are right. Even if they know the action itself might be wrong, by appealing to it being the only option left, they are ultimately appealing to the utilitarian idea that it is justified to take that final action they believe is the only way to the goal. I think Ozymandias from Watchmen fits this idea well.

[@BCMZeroZero]

I'm surprised you didn't mention Fabula Ultima - several of your talking points sounded like they came right from that rule book. The rules include three different tiers of villain, Including minor, major, and supreme. It's got rules for letting your villains spend a finite resource to escape. It even includes a system for the villains to power up.

[@WhatisTableTop]

With the amount of TTRPGs out there, we are bound to have some blindspots. Fabula Ultima is one of them but I’ll definitely be looking into it! - Frank

[@BCMZeroZero]

@@WhatisTableTop good point! It's funny how there can be subcultures within this niche community - some of the circles I'm in talk about things like Fabula Ultima or PbtA games regularly, but then I watch one of your podcasts, and you frequently discuss things like Traveler and Lancer that I don't know anything about. It's a great time to be a TTRPG fan because we are spoiled for good options.

[@WhatisTableTop]

Absolutely!

[@58002]

There's nothing like a Star wars hot take to increase engagement in the comments

[@WhatisTableTop]

You gotta do what you gotta do