How To Get The Most Out Of Transcribing

[@JensLarsen]

How do you work with Transcriptions: Do you write it out and/or learn to play it with the recording? And Why :) Content: 0:00 Intro 0:27 Transcribing - What You Learn 0:47 Transcribing - Do You Write It Down? 1:12 It depends on the focus and what you want to learn 1:44 #1 Learn To Play The Solo With The Recording 1:55 Phrasing! 2:27 How To Start Sounding Like Jazz, not Just Notes 2:39 Smart Phone - Swing Feel! :( 3:15 Are These the biggest benefits? 3:27 #2 Learn New Vocabulary - Analyze The lines 4:01 Analyzing Lines and Melodies 4:53 #3 Analyze the Phrases 5:09 Zoom Out - Understand the Phrases 5:23 Wes Montgomery Example 6:47 A General Thing for Wes Solos that we miss 7:38 #4 Analyze the Form of The Solo 7:48 Zoom out (More) 8:05 The Form Of The Solo 8:16 Wes as an Example 8:37 Other things used in a larger form 9:18 Like The Video? Check out My Patreon Page

[@captainkoo]

I don’t write them out - it’s too time consuming. I have found that transcribing the licks that you play on your videos is the most helpful. We have the added advantage of listening to you explain your thought process, something that we cannot sadly ever have with Joe, Wes, Miles , Bill or George.

[@jamesbanks4073]

You're simply A BADASS🤔🤨🤔!

[@justbluesguitar4399]

I sometimes end up writing down the transcription for one major reason. Phrasing. Writing it down helps me figure out the note rhythmic values, especially when there is a mixture (example straight notes, triplets and dotted). It also helps me decipher when the phrase actually starts and the rhythmic interplay of the call and response. I totally agree with your outlook and I now only write down small parts of a solo or a phrase that end up hard to remember and to recall. Having a visual "screenshot"of the score helps me recall a particular rhythmic part until I practice enough so as not to need that anymore. Thanks for the great lesson.

[@gitarmaniak]

One of the Best channels on youtube. Your channel inspires me and influences my channel. Thanks!

[@JensLarsen]

Thank you! Glad you like the videos!

[@Cheezburgers959]

That's true！I‘m learning jazz and im a saxophone player.I Sometimes come up with kinda rythmn or melodic stuff, and then go improvise in a tune with ireal pro , and few minutes later i feel like i can play nothing,all that ideas just run away.And now i usually intenerlize the chord of a tune and then practise solo just by myself without backing track

[@ishaq24722]

I stop playing 25 years ago. Learned from a friend, a drummer, supposedly Stevie Wonders ex-drummer and the late, great Harry Leahey, who hooked me up with diatonic scales and a lot of things. Just retired and started to pick it up again. Oh boy, it's like playing with boxing gloves! Going to take time to even remember what I learned 25 years ago. Now with Jens, I got a teacher again!

[@JensLarsen]

That's great go for it :)

[@ibji]

Transcribing gives you back the feeling of hearing your favorite music for the first time.

[@JensLarsen]

Ok. That's not how I experience it :)

[@ibji]

@@JensLarsen If nothing else, you're bound to hear things you've never noticed before, like that weird note @ the 1:29 mark of the studio recording of "In The Mood"

[@JensLarsen]

That is true :) I do recognize that.

[@imalamboman12]

Well said!

[@SpartanLaserCanon]

Thanks, I really have not gotten good enough advice until recently and wanting to super get better at transcibing stuff. I am glad I didn't give up searching for the right teachers though plus didn't give up music. I am glad you went over some of wes's stuff and it's from a song I like. I agree that great does not always equal complicated even if something is fast.

[@Ana_crusis]

the thing is I agree with you writing it down isn't really necessary but sometimes we need to if it is fairly long, just to remember it. or to help us remember it

[@ldomanuel]

So true! What I memorize stay longer than what I wrote down. Transcribing is so important but not all the thing. But when I began to do that, I did a big progress. Also it was hard to do the first time and now it's easier. Thanks

[@DovidM]

I find transcribing a favorite solo shows how far off I am in thinking which notes were played or how they were played. Transcription can help you feel that you are getting more insight into their style.

[@JensLarsen]

Certainly! :)

[@xziolpsyxe9573]

I'm more of a Rock/Metal guitar player, but your videos are helpful to my guitar journey! I'm actually planning to learn how to play Jazz guitar one day because of your vids! Thanks, mate.

[@JensLarsen]

Thank you! I hope you get around to learning some jazz!

[@vcroman]

I find transcribing just as difficult as it is to learn the solo directly from the recording. The times I've done a transcription, I felt it was a lot of effort that didn't pay off unless I were writing a book or preparing it for a lesson or trying to keep an archive. For me it doubles the effort. The analysis you pointed out seems really important too. Many years ago I studied a method where I had to learn to sing great solos (don't have to be a vocalist) to help acquire the feel and phrasing you mentioned to apply them to your own playing without necessarily taking them to the instrument. That frees you up to concentrate on the feel and phrasing without the technical issues of an instrument. I had to once sing Bird's solo on Donna Lee. That was the toughest one for me. Never learned to play it, but then I discovered the Omni Book which already had all the transcriptions. Now I'm trying to take that to the guitar. Made it through the 1st chorus (along with the head) without yet playing it up to the tempo of the recording. I would like to suggest if there are already transcriptions out there perhaps it would be better to work from them.

[@JensLarsen]

It is certainly difficult. I would also recommend starting with simpler things than Parker. I don't think you gain nearly as much from learning the solo reading it,, in fact I would guess that you may save time by learning it by ear if you also want to play it with the recording.

[@jackhickman3551]

I really needed this video, especially at this point in my jazz education. Thanks for posting!!

[@JensLarsen]

You're very welcome! I am glad you like it :) Do you transcribe solos?

[@jackhickman3551]

Jens Larsen I’ve started transcribing solos in the last couple weeks/months, and I’m already noticing huge differences in my playing and understanding of jazz vocabulary. I always wondered whether or not it was necessary to write out the solo every time, or if I could just learn some by ear. Thanks for touching on that subject!

[@JensLarsen]

What did you transcribe? (or learn :) )

[@jackhickman3551]

Jens Larsen one of the ones I checked out was Wes’s “Days of Wine and Roses” solo, as well as parts of “Deluge”

[@JensLarsen]

Solid choices! Keep at it :)

[@jimkangas4176]

For me there's two paths. For solos and licks, I think I'm pretty close to what you describe - I'm trying to get some ideas. But I've also encountered tunes that don't show up in any fake books (this seems to happen when I listen to one of the "jazz all night" radio programs) and I want to learn the tune and be able to play it with others, so that path is basically writing a lead sheet. One thing I have trouble with notating is odd note groupings like five notes over two beats, although you can cheat a little in a lead sheet and say, "that's just the idea, not the real music"... Good video!

[@JensLarsen]

Learning songs by ear is very useful! I do that too. I doubt if many jazz songs have quintuplets though?

[@grobertabidbol4005]

Good lesson Jens'

[@JensLarsen]

Glad you like it 👍

[@JohnSmithiuyytw]

Great advice for learning by ear, a skill so many lack.

[@JensLarsen]

Glad you like it 🙂

[@JensLarsen]

What was the last thing you learned by ear?

[@SamBellGuitar]

Great video. I love transcribing.

[@SamBellGuitar]

I was wondering how long you spend working on any given solo you've transcribed?

[@JensLarsen]

These days I mostly transcribe for videos, and I don't do whole solos. When I was doing a lot of transcribing working on phrasing I spent days on playing the solos to get them really together with the recording.

[@SamBellGuitar]

@@JensLarsen awesome, thank you for getting back! I understand. I'm currently working on a Michael Brecker solo that I transcribed , I'm enjoying it! Getting a lot out of it. Do you find that certain phrases start to manifest themselves in your improvisation sub- consciously a few months later?

[@JensLarsen]

I rarely find that I just get phrases sub-conciously. Usually I fall in love with some and start trying to make similar lines. I really like some Herbie Hancock stuff for an upcoming video so I mess around with that a lot these days :)

[@davidskinner8351]

I admit when I transcribe I usually write it down. I can see the benefit of learning by ear and playing along with the recording and will do more of that from now on. Would you do the same for comping as for single note soloing?

[@JensLarsen]

I have done that for comping as well, but not nearly as much.

[@JoshuaPatrickGarrett]

Hi Jens. I find that you are published by Fundamental Changes. Would you recommend their publishing service?

[@JensLarsen]

Sure! Joseph is great to work with :)

[@JoshuaPatrickGarrett]

@@JensLarsen thanks

[@TimBoulette]

Jens, your warning about playing with backing tracks is interesting. What do you think about Band in a Box, iReal Pro, and similar playalong apps/programs?

[@JensLarsen]

I was really talking mostly about iReal. It is so often that people play with horrible swing feel on top of a horrible midi swing from a phone. You can better not do that. In general I actually don't use backing tracks that much for practice. A metronome, some good time and a little imagination is a much better solution in my opinion. I have a video coming up on the benefits of practicing like that.

[@Lindemanchannel]

Yes, since I stepped away from backing tracks I've spent more time thinking about what I'm actually doing instead of just letting it happen and repeat the same bullshit.

[@jensclarberg6419]

@@JensLarsen I find that some backing harmony is essential for hearing the colours against the chords you are playing over. Of course if you use a looper or such you can create your own backing track.

[@fox-school-of-music]

You mentioned 3 albums in the video. Do you recommend solos from those albums for a beginner to start transcribing, or do you have other recommendations for beginners?

[@JensLarsen]

I have other recommendations: Take something that you really like, that is not too long and if you already know it very well that is a bonus!

[@AuthenticatorMonkey]

2:45 Really good point. I hate playing with things like iRealPro because it feels like absolute shit. Drumgenius is really fun to practice with though.

[@JensLarsen]

DrumGenius is not midi swing feel though 🙂

[@AuthenticatorMonkey]

@@JensLarsen Exactly!

[@edwardhill5745]

Unit 7!

[@JensLarsen]

Exactly! :)

[@marcelllengkey2652]

Do you havee any jazz songs recommendation to transcribe ?

[@JensLarsen]

The first version of Four on Six, Grant's Greenery, Chitlins Con Carne

[@meruemu]

I use Transcribe! software a lot, because it's convenient. But sometimes for fast lines i find myself no other choice but to slow down to 30% speed (for a Benson or Joe Pass insane line...). Is it bad ? Should i try more without slowering down ?? Thanks for your vid as always Jens :)

[@JensLarsen]

There's nothing wrong with using Transcribe! I do, so does Levi Clay and the transcribing heroes from the #11 channel! :) You can always try to do it without slowing down. I think I mostly do that while not actually transcribing so listening on the bike on in the car.

[@DizzyKrissi]

Guitar Pro always reminds me on how bad I transcribe rhythmically - some licks are very hard to transcribe but it's a challenge to fit the right notes into the bars to get the correct results.

[@JensLarsen]

The rhythm is by far the most difficult part to get right (and in most cases the most important)

[@DizzyKrissi]

@@JensLarsen :yesterday I spent 4 hours to figure out a BB King lick - next week I will try it again :D

[@Lindemanchannel]

Yes this is a huge problem, glad I have guitar pro

[@DanneoYT]

Dizzy Guitar What helps me a lot is tapping my foot

[@DizzyKrissi]

@@DanneoYT : I tap my foot all day long :D

[@gabbo9795]

Do you slow it down, when it is too fast? Becausw Bob Reynolds for example says that it is better to not slow it down and just repeat it very often until you got it. Any thoughts?

[@JensLarsen]

I don't always slow stuff down, but a lot of transcribers do. I would do what works. Try to hear the whole phrases and don't pay too much attention to details, but slow down stuff that you really can't hear :)

[@gabbo9795]

@@JensLarsen cool, thanks a lot for your advice! Thank you Jens you are the best! Cheers from Italy

[@pandorasstyle5567]

Hi Jens, At the start of your video you warned us about apps that don’t swing. Presumably there are apps that do swing? Or do you think it has to be a human recording, or live setting to generate the swing feel. I ask, because you seemed fairly absolute on this question, in this video. Thanks

[@JensLarsen]

Yes, that is tricky. I think that you do indeed have to be careful with automatic midi stuff for backing tracks. They can be really bad for your swing feel, and you are better off just using a metronome to be honest. I know that is not the popular answer, but it is true.

[@mathiasschoenning]

What about transcribing in all keys? Is it fine to just learn many solos in their respective keys instead of learning one and transposing

[@JensLarsen]

That depends on what you are trying to work on doesn't it?

[@rockychieng88]

I found out transcribing helps you a lot in sight reading.

[@JensLarsen]

Do you then also find that you internalize aspects of the music like phrasing and time-feel?

[@rockychieng88]

@@JensLarsen yes :)

[@kukumuniu5658]

What we can say about this progression? F A C E | F A C G | Em Em7 Which key it this (modal interchange,modulation etc)?

[@jarrilaurila]

That chord progression do not make much sense to me. F, Amin, C, Emin/ F, Amin, C, G/ Em Em7 would be in the key of C: 4 6 1 3/4 6 1 5/ 3 3

[@brunom3478]

What do you think about using software to slow down the music?

[@JensLarsen]

If that makes it a lot easier for you then that's fine, but watch out that you don't end up trying to only hear single notes. You will learn a lot more by hearing phrases. It is similar to trying to spell every word in a conversation, it causes you to miss what is being said.

[@brunom3478]

@@JensLarsen Makes sense. I used (try) to transcribe basslines by Jaco Pastorius and would sometimes loop single notes just to hear what was being played. Not the best strategy I guess.

[@JensLarsen]

@@brunom3478 not the first choice at least 😁

[@BrettplaysStick]

Hmmmm to me (and I admit I am an outlier) transcribing has almost always been a waste of time, because I have never internalized anything I ever transcribed. If I could internalize melodies I would transcribe a lot more.

[@JensLarsen]

Go for something really simple and make the goal to play the solo, something like Kenny Burrell's chitlins con carne or a short Grant Green solo.

[@BrettplaysStick]

Jens Larsen do you think I would need to learn the head and changes first?

[@JensLarsen]

Yes, but in this case that is fairly easy :) Just give it a listen

[@BrettplaysStick]

Jens Larsen hmmmm.... not easy for me. If I’m going to take 4 years to learn a short solo I’d rather learn part of one I really love. I’ll try Hank Mobley.

[@JensLarsen]

Sure! Do what works for you :)

[@Lbvg]

love your videos. i'm a player who form early on got some bad habits of fretting chords with root note on 1st string with my thumb. i've since found this habit to handicap me when playing maj9, 11th chords etc with the root on the lowest string. do you know any best practices for fretting chords with the root (or lowest note in general) on the lowest string? or something for a future video?

[@JensLarsen]

Thank you! I don't have one "best way" to play the chords, in fact I rely on many ways.A middle of the road approach could be what I use here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/m6S6qpVnlM2EiKc

[@SuperMegaKisan]

How much should you be transcribing? Is one solo for every new standard you learn a good amount or should you spend that time on something else?

[@JensLarsen]

I don't know. I haven't ever had a schedule, it has been more tied to exploring or working on some specific topic.

[@cbolt4492]

I've been dreading having to transcibe things...

[@neebs4964]

Is that a Johnny A behind you?

[@JensLarsen]

Probably not, if that is a guitar at least 🙂

[@Marunius]

If you want to benefit from writing jt down, you should minimise use of any instruments for verification, would you agree?

[@JensLarsen]

No, that is another skill. I list several things that you can do with the written out solo in the video :)

[@songfulmusicofsongs]

To me writing down helps when there are a lot of notes, and they are sometimes difficult to remember...

[@JensLarsen]

Yes, but a lot of the benefits don't really appear until you know how to play the stuff by heart and then reading it can be working against you.

[@xFliox]

That I real pro stuff is really contradictory with the advice Aimee Nolte gave us in a video. It really helps you to learn comping harmony, it ain't really about the swing feel.

[@JensLarsen]

I don't know what she said, but if you want to learn the harmony then maybe try and play the chords? You don't need an app for that..

[@xFliox]

@@JensLarsen at 2:29 kzbin.info/www/bejne/jp3Gl2qhj8-Wmrs (I didn't find the other video where she talks about it, but she uses it to develop comping, and I don't think it kills your swing feel if you are transcribing solos and chords from actual recordings on a regular basis.

[@xFliox]

This one you can watch from the beginning kzbin.info/www/bejne/j3maeHWEm66bers

[@xFliox]

In thid one she talks about it at 0:40 kzbin.info/www/bejne/aZC2ZWiGfadjgLc

[@xFliox]

@@JensLarsen and yeah I get it that you can practice those chords without any app, but it is so much better to learn rootless comping with a walking bass.

[@drcool56]

You just killed irealpro and band in a box alltogether... but maybe you're right ;)

[@Kevinschart]

do guitarists really just memorize all their licks? they don't have them written down anywhere? you'll never realize when you'v forgotten that nice lick that you learned 5 years ago.

[@JensLarsen]

Do you go through a book of licks to check if you are still using them?

[@Kevinschart]

I don't have a book. the only licks i have are the ones that are top of mind. I'm not at that level yet. I'm just trying to develop a strategy for capturing and remembering everything that I learn. I have no idea how to go about this.

[@JensLarsen]

@@Kevinschart think of you vocabulary in Jazz the same way you think of which words you use when you talk. That is probably a better way to go about it 🙂

[@captainkoo]

Sometimes I’ll record myself if I come up with an interesting lick. Saves me the time and work of writing it down and it helps train my ear

[@Aurora-oe2qp]

@@JensLarsen Thesaurus of Scales and Melodic Patterns. Apparently John Coltrane was very fond of it.

[@Soberan]

Disagree! They are not either ... or. Writing the music down helps you a lot with rhytmic analysis (which is not easy at all), and then you can play or practice overlaying the recording, just as someone who wouldn't write it down. Writing the music down also acts as a form of archive after you move on to other pieces and the memory of the old piece starts to wane. Finally, if you write it down it is easy to analyse what is going on. I don't see any reason why not writing it down is better than writing it down. And writing it down is hard-work but a lot of fun too!

[@JensLarsen]

What are you disagreeing with? I am pointing out what I use both for, right? 🙂 I am clearly not saying either or.

[@Soberan]

Maybe you didn't, let me watch it again :)

[@willsims2009]

I’ve never liked the backing tracks. A lot of them have the wrong changes.

[@JensLarsen]

Fair enough :)

[@willsims2009]

@@JensLarsen I’ve been listening a bit more and what I hear from the pros are different then what’s written in some of the fake books and backing tracks.

[@JensLarsen]

@@willsims2009 But the pros also all play different changes, I wouldn't get too hung up on it, chords are a part of the interpretation.

[@willsims2009]

@@JensLarsen true because there are alternate changes such as in Have You Met Miss Jones…some play Fmaj to the F#dim, but a couple of artist such as Ellis Marsalis and Kenny Barron play Fmaj Bbmaj7 to Am9 to D7b9. I guess it’s a matter of what feels good!

[@JensLarsen]

@@willsims2009 Yes exactly. Actually the Kenny Barron version I know is with a Bb7 :)