How to Structure Your Magic Like Allomancy

[@oliverhutson8172]

This video has been INSTRUMENTAL in me being able to turn my vague idea of a magic system into an airtight hard rational system. I had 0 idea of how to approach the problem and actually structure my magic system to actually be understood by a reader. After watching your video, I've managed to develop the entire thing in just a few short hours and everything just MAKES SENSE. I know that this was Sandersons format, but you have translated it into something digestable and given us a method to apply it to our worldbuilding. Incredibly insightful and honestly just genius. Thank you so much for this video.

[@themagicengineer5314]

I'm so glad to hear that, Oliver! This is exactly my goal with my content so I am THRILLED that it has been so helpful to you. In the future I'm planning to do some videos specifically on how to create rational and irrational magic and I'm gathering notes to do a deep-dive analysis of the Powder Mage series. Is there anything else you would like to see or would find helpful?

[@oliverhutson8172]

@@themagicengineer5314 That's great to hear and I'm excited for the new content! I would love to hear your thoughts on magic origins (a gift from the gods, natural occurance, curses etc.) as well as genetic vs non genetic systems (magic bloodlines, divine favour, born under a specific constellation, pact with a demon and so on). I see these two topics debated and talked about everywhere online. What tropes they involve, what cliché's you often find in these systems, as well as the various ways they can be executed and the implications that can have on how a magic system functions. Those two topics are something I spent a very long time thinking on for my magic system, and eventually settled on 'man killed god and gave magic to humanity', so everyone can do magic. But the societal and economical impacts of this magic system made it so that only a select amount of people are actually allowed to practice magic (since it's resource based and the ruling figures for the most part have a monopoly on this resource.) But beyond that, there few people who would want to use the magic anyway due to its inherrent implications on morality.

[@briesullivan883]

@@themagicengineer5314can you do a video like this for the magic in Avatar the last Airbender? The animated series, not the live actions of course.

[@themagicengineer5314]

@@briesullivan883 I don't have one, but I certainly could do one. Thank you for the suggestion!!!

[@crapphone7744]

It's a good thing that Seamus is there to protect you from mailmen and those dangerous passers by!

[@themagicengineer5314]

I know, right? They might just be going about their day, but they might also be serial murderers! Better to be safe :P

[@MegaGlaive]

I took your nanite idea, and did a bit of a redesign. It starts off with this setup: - Build (TopLeft) - Rending/Autonomous = Rend (Force Nanites Apart) - Binding/Autonomous = Bind (Force Nanites togethor into a specific shape) - Subnet (TopRight) - Binding/Command = Listen (Sniffs surrounding traffic like wireshark) - Rending/Command = Broadcast (Issues command from another module to all owned nodes) - Code (BotLeft) - Rending/Autonomous = Format (Clears the node of all custom code) - Binding/Autonomous = Program (Writes a program to handle any moving parts) - Combat (BotRight) - Binding/Command = Guard (Protect an area) - Rending/Command = Attack (Assault an area or target) You may notice these quadrants (modules) alternate .. one has Autonomous, and the other has Command (which replaced personal in your chart). This is because these modules are cheap low quality variants, but the modules are physically designed to hide the fact that they are incomplete. This allows half the nanite system to be hidden until a later part of the story

[@MegaGlaive]

Later on, the protagonist can acquire upgrades to the modules, and every single one can be upgraded like so ... - Utility (TopLeft) - replaces Build - Rending/Autonomous = Rend (Force Nanites Apart) - Binding/Autonomous = Bind (Force Nanites togethor into a specific shape) - Rending/Command = Stop (Orders the nanite automoton to stop whats its doing) - Binding/Command = Move (Orders the nanite automoton to walk/run/slither somewhere) - Network (TopRight) - replaces Subnet - Rending/Autonomous = Connect (Links an automoton to a local network. there can be multiple subnets in this network) - Binding/Autonomous = Disconnect (Opposite of connect) - Binding/Command = Listen (Sniffs surrounding traffic like wireshark) - Rending/Command = Broadcast (Issues command from another module to all owned nodes) - AI (BotLeft) - replaces Code - Rending/Autonomous = Format (Erases AI models) - Binding/Autonomous = Train (Trains AI models to control the nanite construction) - Binding/Command = Deploy (Activates a trained AI model) - Rending/Command = Test (Puts a trained AI model through a unit test trying to break it) - Security (BotRight) - replaces Combat - Rending/Autonomous = Decrypt (Attempts to break through encryption of a protected automoton) - Binding/Autonomous = Encrypt (Protects an automoton from being modified by others) - Binding/Command = Guard (Protect an area) - Rending/Command = Attack (Assault an area or target)

[@MegaGlaive]

My thought process goes like this: The story starts with the acquiring of the Build module and nothing else. The two abilities there, Rend and Bind are already enough to play with the creation of inert objects. For basic combat, this would be swords, shields, armor, crossbows, even guns if you have the knowledge on how to make one Next, you acquire the Code module, which gives you a way to control nanite constructions that have moving parts (like wheels, actuators, etc ..). While the idea of gaining access to programming is potentially overpowered, this is balanced by the tediousness, and complexity of such a task. Realistically, the protagonist is going to be limited to stealing useful scripts during his journey Next, you acquire the Combat module, which gives you the Attack and Guard commands. Combined with the code module, you now have enough to create autonomous robots that can defend an area or attack, but their intelligence will be very limited (your scripts will only get so complicated) Finally, you acquire the subnet module, which provides a basic means to control a swarm of nanite constructions by allowing you to network them --- At this point in the story, the protagonist is to have the impression that he completed the full set, but he meets an opponent that has one of the upgraded modules. This could take on a different form depending on the module in question ... - Utility: the opponent is able to control his automotons better to gain a tactical advantage (the Protagonists Guard and Attack commands are useless because both of them are auto-engaging the enemy, and so he can't reposition his robots for a tactical advantage, while the enemy is routinely doing exactly that ) - Network: the opponent is able to control multiple groups of automotons independently (like multiple control groups in starcraft) - AI: the opponents automaton's routinely make complex decisions, leaving the protagonist thinking that his enemy is a scripting genius - Security: the protagonist is unable to take control over enemy nanites (whereas he became somewhat dependant on this ability before this point for maximum drama)

[@themagicengineer5314]

Very nice! I like the autonomous vs command inversion. That's not something I would have thought of and is super cool!

[@kovobanga1559]

Attempt for mobility: Personal bind ability: Pulling - moving object by contacting it with the defined point. (Grappling, grabbing, hiking or even just walking or sliding in mechanical reasons) Personal rend ability: Throw - pushing away subject to use kinetic force in certain direction. (Launching, hitting from distance, or using just blown energy to generate force. I think that implementing rocketjump to this certain point would be fun.) Autonomous bind ability: Move - relocating, mobilising static force due to its own control. (Some bots or machines using its own power without direct control or any kind of participation. For example for self aware mobile vehicles or transport. Pretty basic but necessary at some point. Depends on the rules you want to create.) Autonomous rend ability: Paralyze - disable movement, freeze object, or just seaze process. (Also wanted to use alternative Evacuate - reaction to certain circumstances which will break protocol of movement, but it's somewhat not proved enough.) P.S. In the video, Combat part was reversed in lines of Autonomous and Personal abilities. Pretty sure you noticed that before, but still it can complicate explanation for others, because discussed topic was reversed to the picture on the screen.

[@themagicengineer5314]

good catch. Sorry about that. If only KZbin would let me upload a new video file without creating a whole new video... oh well

[@LupusSolitarius590]

@@themagicengineer5314 You can edit in YT Studio, does that let you upload a new clip that you can insert to replace the part with an error?

[@themagicengineer5314]

@@LupusSolitarius590 As far as I can tell, KZbin Studio only allows you to trim or cut out content. There doesn't seem to be a way to re-order pieces. Easy to do in Premiere Pro, but not in YT Studio

[@ThomasWarhammer]

I don't know if you'll read this but I really loved this video, and I was wondering if you could do another one, of a similar nature? Every magic system video out there says the same thing, hard vs soft, costs etc. but this was a very tangible "how to actually craft a system" kind of video, and as someone who wants to create a magic system I get the principles, I just don't know how to begin, how to come up with abilities and how to STRUCTURE it. This was helpful though and I'm wondering if there are other ways of going about it.

[@themagicengineer5314]

There are lots of ways to go about it and I'd love to make more videos that are useful to you. Feel free to reach out to me through crrowenson.com/contact-me/ so I can learn more about where your struggling. Oh, and check out this video, if you haven't already. studio.kzbin.infoW4Czzz7NX7E/comments

[@ThomasWarhammer]

@@themagicengineer5314 Hi there! First of all I really appreciate you reaching out and responding, thank you for taking the time! I'll absolutely give the video a watch and write up something that might explain where I and possibly other writers might struggle, I hope you can find the time, and want to give it a read but if not I understand! :D

[@drewhead1]

I just made a comment on another video of yours about mistborn. Lol Nice. I should not have doubted you.

[@themagicengineer5314]

lol. No worries, man. And yes, I LOVE Sanderson's stuff

[@ajaxthepibble5453]

Damn dude, this is the exact video I was looking for

[@themagicengineer5314]

Happy to help! How are you hoping to use the structure, if you don't mind me asking? I love hearing how people implement these kinds of things.

[@ajaxthepibble5453]

@@themagicengineer5314 Totally my man! My wife and I are building our own world. I wanted a magic system in it, but had no idea how to build one. We doing it for cosplay, stories, etc. Hope u kept up the great content.

[@juanra85]

This is EXTREMELY helpful!! Thank you for sharing this way to structure magic systems. I'm really good at just throwing out more and more and more ideas (ADHD brain) but, like you said, it's hard to stare at a blank page when trying to structure it.

[@themagicengineer5314]

So glad it was helpful! Don't hesitate to let me know if you have questions or ideas for other videos you'd like to see in the future

[@juanra85]

@@themagicengineer5314 yeah! I'm actually currently doing world building, character designs, and story drafts for a graphic novel I want to write and illustrate. It's going to be influenced by the manga/anime magical girl genre, so I've been thinking it would be great to learn more about how to adapt magic systems like that into a Western novel or graphic novel.

[@jonleonard1555]

Not sure if this got mentioned by someone else, but I noticed that when you described Combat Personal effects, you listed them under the Autonomous, and vice versa. I know you've reposted before to correct videos. Don't know if this would be a reason to or not. I still followed along. I'll likely revisit this video, as I'm trying to develop a TTRPG with nanobots being the primary source of world creation (they built the races, creatures, structures, etc).

[@themagicengineer5314]

It did get mentioned. Since everyone still seems able to follow along, I'm inclined to leave it the way it is instead of creating/reposting a whole new video. The KZbin analytics and algorithm are NOT friendly towards that. And be sure to let me know when you're working on that TTRPG system. I'd love to hear more

[@lucasfv1357]

First thought: this structure is perfect for magic with a small thematic universe; if necromancy is the only magic in the world, mediating the life-death axis, a structure like this can do a lot to explore what may appear as a limited field at first sight. By the way, I an no fan of sci-fi but this is one amazing system.

[@themagicengineer5314]

Thanks! I really hope to write a novel with it someday. That is a great point about exploring small themes and specialties. A huge part of building a rational system is breaking a single thing into is component parts, and this is definitley a solid framework to start that process for sure

[@lucasfv1357]

@@themagicengineer5314 Alright... so I've found out this structure is deceptively simple. It's not for everyone: I feel you actually need a pretty good understan ding of what you want your magic to do and feel like (even if you're not yet aware of how much you know yet) for this to be effective. If your idea is ill-defined or vague, trying to make it fit into the categories might be hard work (I tried with my personal versions of necromancy and earth-magic just to try it out). It might be that it's just not for me... but there's more to this structure than what it shows at first sight.

[@themagicengineer5314]

@@lucasfv1357 Most definitely! "Simple" is seldom actually "easy". You could try doing some intense idea generation to come up with as many different ideas as possible. That should make it easier to start finding patterns and things that can fit into place.

[@lucasfv1357]

@@themagicengineer5314 that's solid advice, sir; will keep it in mind

[@jonleonard1555]

Example of another set: Life. Personal Bind: Obviously healing yourself from physical injuries (stab, shot, etc). Personal Rend: Though you wouldn't want to self-destruct, there could be foreign bodies inside you, so it acts like your immune system, destroying invaders. Autonomous Bind: Either heals an ally or creates simply life form (or animates a corpse). Autonomous Rend: A swarm that just tears enemies apart at the molecular level. Could make for interesting combat dynamics. Can your Personal Bind heal yourself faster than their Autonomous Rend? Or do you risk not healing and hope you survive as your Personal Rend rends their Autonomous Rend?

[@themagicengineer5314]

Interesting, especially if we scale that up to account for an entire space ship. These could be a big part of personal and ship-based combat. Launch automaton into an enemy ship to tear it down and assimilate their nanites while their own systems try to counter and repair

[@thatnerdygaywerewolf9559]

Personal Binding Mobility: The nanites support your own movement (either via infusion or something like lightweight armor; haven’t decided). Or maybe artificial limbs for mobility purposes. Personal Rending Mobility: I’m thinking the Axiom Verge 2 power where you become a swarm of nanites able to move through vents. Has… implications. Autonomous Binding Mobility: A nanite-made drone of varying size able to fly around. Can be used as either a vehicle or remote viewing. In some ways opposed to the personal rending mobility, because your body remains intact while a solid nanite structure moves around (versus your body becoming non-solid and floating around). Autonomous Reding Mobility: opposition to the personal binding mobility, where you command nanites to hinder someone else’s movement.

[@themagicengineer5314]

Now I've got an image of a swarm of nanites turning into a person with a dozen+ spider-like legs bristling over their bodies as they climb the hull... love it! I hadn't actually thought about using the autonomous effects to control the form of the automatons. That could certainly be interesting

[@LupusSolitarius590]

Mobility: Personal Bind: makes a vehicle, anything from a bicycle or jetpack to a spaceship. Combining this with personal combat could make it an armed and armoured vehicle. Personal Rend: enhances the (broad)caster's body for strength and speed, usually with some damage to the affected muscles and bones. Autonomous Bind: receiver half of autonomous rend. May sometimes spontaneously produce items. Autonomous Rend: the nanites record and transmit the relative positions of every atom that makes any object that enters their sphere of influence, dismantling the object in the process. the paired receiver nanites (designated with autonomous bind) then assemble an identical object at their location. It's an open question if this is teleportation or rapid destructive cloning. DO NOT ENTER IF NO BIND NANITES ARE PAIRED!

[@themagicengineer5314]

Those autonomous effects are super cool! Incredibly powerful with lots of creative applications, but easily limited and constrained to prevent it from getting overpowered. Very Nice! And that's almost exactly what I was thinking for the Personal Binding effect

[@adamroquemore6410]

ooooh, I can never say no to a prompt. Let's see what we can do for "mobility"... Personal, Binding: Lock. Attaches the individual to an surface they're in physical contact with. Can be combined with Armor to shore up defenses. Personal, Rending: Absorb Fuel. Similar to the unbound version of Assault, but it converts the matter into energy instead of more nanites. Autonomous, Binding: Construct Thrusters. Generates ion thrusters designed to move the user or anything else in space. Autonomous, Rending: Remove Obstacles. Eliminates or absorbs movement-hindering objects in a direct line of sight.

[@themagicengineer5314]

Interesting. I especially like the Absorb/Create Fuel option

[@TheZiiFamily]

Wait whats allomancy? I thought it said economy Ok it sounds like metal magic

[@themagicengineer5314]

Lol. Economics is it's own kind of dark magic

[@TheZiiFamily]

@@themagicengineer5314 mr.crabs: agegegeegegegegeg

[@themagicengineer5314]

@@TheZiiFamily rofl

[@themagicengineer5314]

@Diego Palacios paiva thank you kindly *blush*

[@vottak5964]

Mobility: Personal rend: rendering any momentum a user has. With something like gliders, parachute and so on. Mayby even gravity if user that good. Personal bond: enhancing user`s ability to move with new muscles that are made from carbon fiber-reinforced siloxane rubber and have a coiled geometry Autonomous rend: Rendering other nanitis to move. or put them on hold. Autonimous bind: mobile vehicles/transport.

[@themagicengineer5314]

Nice. I especially like the personal effects

[@Valosken]

Great video. Just commenting to make sure you get a boost

[@themagicengineer5314]

Thanks!

[@FelineElaj]

Like the video. I find having a structure easier to work with than a blank page, too. One thing, though: do you think people are going to get a bit tired of other people copying/getting inspired by Brandon Sanderson? I'm not casting a shadow on your example here, just asking.

[@themagicengineer5314]

I honestly don't think so, at least not everyone. There is a large audience that is always looking for something new and interesting. They will definitely get tired of it. But there are people that know what they like and just want more of it. Repeats of their favorite story will keep them happy forever. I'm hoping that with videos like this, and some others I have planned, people can find ways to use and be inspired by their favorite systems while still developing something new and unique

[@FelineElaj]

@@themagicengineer5314 in that case, could you do a video on naming magic in A Wizard of Earthsea by Ursula K. Le Guin, at some point in the future? I believe that this softer, more myth-like, poetic kind of fantasy is sadly lacking on the modern fantasy scene.

[@StarlasAiko]

People will get tired of everybody copying/being inspired by Sanderson at about the same rate and severity as people get tired of all fantasy being copy of/inspired by Tolkien or D&D. I would not worry. There are a ton of awesome magic systems around that are not based on Sanderson that themselves are inspiring other systems. The big thing about magic is, details in flavour and principle make all the difference, even the under-the-hood worldbuilding mechanics are the same. After all, in all of roleplay and gaming, there are only seven quests and in all of fiction there are only twelve stories. And yet, nobody gets tired of yet another boy-meets-girl story or travel-from-a-to-b story

[@FelineElaj]

@@StarlasAiko people are not getting tired of twelve basic stories because they are ingrained in our collective subconscious so deeply. The magic systems in fantasy, on the other hand, are not that. They are a much more recent human invention that does not have such a profound resonance in human minds. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy Sanderson's books. But I also observe the trend of so many writers, both professional and amateur, following his example but lacking his expertise and turning magic in fantasy books into something so predictable, bare-bones, ubiquitous, clinical and safe it becomes as wondrous and exciting as flipping a switch or firing a gun or using a microwave. It becomes, in a word, mundane. Which is the complete opposite of fantasy, as I see it. I hope you are correct about your Tolkien/D&D prediction. Too bad I won't live to see the day the trends change, though, because, if you're right, it will take abother fifty to seventy years.

[@themagicengineer5314]

@@StarlasAiko exactly right!

[@briesullivan883]

Can you do a video like this for the magic in Avatar the Last Airbender?

[@themagicengineer5314]

Thank you for the suggestion! That would be a wonderful one to break down the structure on. I've actually been doing a deep dive breakdown of Allomancy as a test format. Depending on how people feel about it, I'm likely going to use that moving forward for a variety of systems

[@briesullivan883]

@@themagicengineer5314 also I’m listening to one of the podcast interviews you did and you brought up the time turner in Harry Potter as an example of irrational magic. Time travel in Harry Potter (ignore the Cursed Child - most of the fandom does and that just messes everything up) is a closed loop. You can’t change what’s already happened. The things that Harry and Hermione used the time turner to stop (you know what I’m referring to but I’m avoiding spoilers) never happened thanks to them. They didn’t change what happened- they just stopped it before it did. That’s why Dumbledore became so frustrated that Fudge and Snape kept trying to interrupt him with frivolous stuff and why he told Madam Pomfrey that Harry and Hermione couldn’t rest lie down. That’s why he just gave the instructions in a rushed manner- he knew Hermione would understand enough with just a couple sentences (although it was Harry who put it all together after they went back in time). Time was of the essence because if they waited any longer, then they wouldn’t be able to go back in time far enough to prevent those events. This is because using the time turner to go back anymore than a few hours causes disastrous effects. This article explains more. www.wizardingworld.com/writing-by-jk-rowling/time-turner

[@themagicengineer5314]

@@briesullivan883 That is a good point, but that is not clear from the book alone. That's an important part of discussing magic systems is understanding the reader's experience and understanding of the magic vs the creator's experience and understanding. It's just like Lord of the Rings with the eagles. There are LOTS of reasons they couldn't simply ride them to Mordor, but the readers weren't given any of those reasons. And this brings up something I find endlessly fascinating with building magic systems. You can have it be fully hard and rational to YOU but then PRESENT it in such a way to turn it into a soft and irrational system