How To Turn in the Powder Trees Moguls and Steeps / Snowboarding Tips

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Turning on a groomed run is easy.
But why is turning in the powder or on an ungroomed terrain so difficult?
Let’s forget about the terrain for now.
But focus on our turning skills.
Do you know which phase in a turn is the most difficult to control and makes turning uncomfortable?
It's at the beginning.
While a snowboard has an edge angle, we can use this edge as a base of support.
In the beginning phase, the snowboard becomes flat while changing edges.
For example: heel edge to flat, flat to toe edge, and, toe edge to flat, flat to heel edge.
We can't get a solid base of support with a flat base on the hill.
For example, beginner snowboarders start edging in the middle of the turn.
So half of their turn is unstable but it’s still fine on the gentle slopes.
Intermediate snowboarders start edging somewhere between the beginning and the middle of the turn.
So their turns are more stable but only on groomed terrain.
Advanced riders try to eliminate this flat phase.
They change edges directly to the other edge at the beginning of their turn.
So they always have a solid base.
Now you have learned that if your turning skills increase, the amount of time spent on the flat phase between turns, will be decreased.
Powder, trees, moguls, and steeps. They all require the rider to make quick edge changes due to unstable riding conditions.
This is what we can focus on to improve riding in the beginning phase, and why advanced riders are strong on varied terrain conditions.
Now let's find out how we can reduce the flat phase.
Here’s a question.
Which of these do you think is better in the beginning of the turns to change edges?
● Standing tall or low?
We want to reduce the flat phase as much as possible because we are unstable while being in this state.
So changing edges should be done quicker.
To change edges, our head and hips move from the one side to the other side.
Now once again, which of these do you think is better in the beginning of the turns to change edges?
● Standing tall or low?
Obviously, standing low is quicker than standing tall to change edges due to the moving distance of your head and hips, right?
Also standing low to change edges makes it much easier to manage your balance while moving your head and hips.
So now you understand that we should be standing low in the beginning of the turns to change edges quicker and to maintain balance.
Most of my students were not familiar with getting low while turning, because they learned to stand tall while changing edges which is effective only on the groomed terrain due to the reason I’ve already mentioned.
So if you wish to improve your riding on any ungroomed terrain, riding with a lower position is the first skill to learn.
However for riders who haven’t ridden with a lower position, it’s not easy to do so.
But here are some exercises to get used to it.
1. Try touching the ground with your front hand
When you are finishing your heel side turn, try touching the ground with your front hand on the toe side to change the edge.
When you are finishing your toe side turn, try touching the ground by your heel side to change the edge.
And try to keep your hips at the center of the board and on the back leg.
So you can prevent pressing too much on the front leg and prevent sliding tail of the board.
(So you can prevent the tail of your board from sliding caused by pressing too much on the front leg.)
Since this is just a practice to get used to changing edges while being in a low position, please don’t worry about your posture while riding.
2. Visualize riding under a low ceiling
Picture in your head, a low ceiling that is above the slope and by your hip level.
You can try to avoid hitting your head on this ceiling and make turns while under this ceiling.
Remember, these exercises are to learn how to change edges with a lower position.
So even if you are riding with a low position while turning, but then stand up when you are changing edges, you will not learn what you want here.
“Downward unweighting” is also one of the skills used to manage pressure while riding.
With this skill, your legs are extended from the middle to the end of the turn.

[@cibko]

Been snowboarding for 15 years, if only someone taught me this from the beginning, would learn much faster :)

[@mr.persnicketyreviews4655]

Love the physics breakdown as to why certain techniques work so well. Getting nerdy with shredding, love it!

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Glad you like them!

[@seperrooo]

This is high level good quality snowboarding lesson. Thank you

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment SNOWBOARD SURF FOR LIFE!

[@hakangencer]

really deep knowledge and skills, big thumbs up

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment hakan! Please feel free to share this video if you liked it!

[@wentaGT]

Love that you guys break it down to a much more technical level. Very very very well thought out!

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment wentaGT!

[@-tr0n]

Great way to explain the things that experienced riders do naturally! This will really help getting a friend or two more comfortable on the hill.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment tr0n! Please share this idea and the video with more your friend!👍

[@nitchananprapaitrakul5141]

Love your tutorials, easy to imagine and follow. I am not a native but these vdo i could understand easily by your clearly talks and words. Thank you so much 😊

[@dcho6310]

This is the best snowboarding channel. This really helps me to understand why my turns are not working.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Duncan!

[@wwang2806]

oh my god !!!!! best teaching video I had ever seen when riding steep ungroomed terrain and description for dynamic turn for. Thank you so much

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks Wess! Learning the downward un-weighting might not that easy but just please keep practicing on the groomed terrain, and when you get used to it try riding on steeps first. Moguls and trees are more for advanced riders since you can't make turns with your pace and rhythm.

[@matthewcheung5136]

I'll have to get a lesson from you next time I hit up Whistler!

[@MrPurpdrank22]

Holy crap this is a great video. Very detailed and well thought out!

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment MrPurpdrank22! Please feel free to share this video if you liked it!

[@dirkgeyer322]

Very good. Downward unweighting also opens up the path to really good carving technique, for example if you want to do lay down carves.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Dirk! As you said Downward unweighting is very useful and yes it work with Euro carve too!

[@Aircaird]

It did helped me a lot !! Please keep going for this channel.Thank you,guys.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Edward!

[@stevieboy826]

Just fell upon this vid, great tutorial thanks!

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Steve!

[@G2thesecondpower]

Jesus Christ I've been hunting high and low for this information! And I've taken a number of lessons; basically they tell you to stand tall into the turn and then bend your knees through the turn--we literally practice this on one of my last lessons where we were bobbing up and down like that through the turn--tall then bent. You are now telling me something I've kind of suspected all along for the steeps--stay low! In fact; when I adjusted the forward lean on my bindings to a more agressive lean; holy crap I got faster! I also went against advice and got lower on my straight runs, and I started rocking back and forth on my edges a lot faster and with a lot more confidence. I'm going to spend some time practicing these quick edge-to-edge turns on the steeper terrain--(especially since this is the best video I've seen on the actual board mechanics--most just focus on body mechanics) and I'm going to stay low to do it. Cheers :)

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your feedback with your actual riding experience Gilliam! This comment will support more riders certainly! Just I want you to remember that what your instructor taught you is not wrong. Both techniques are to manage pressure while riding. And they can be used properly depends on situation. But the downward unweighting is very useful technique if you are above intermediate as you have just experienced so.

[@reinaldoreyes5631]

Great tips snd video. Big thumbs up!

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment reinaldo!

[@sebastianmopardo8681]

Thumbs Up for this lesson!!!

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Sebastian!

[@lucifermorningstar4448]

Interesting information Shu! I’ll give this a try today 🙌

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Hi Lucifer! Thanks for your comment!

[@Boardrider3x1]

Great channel, great explanation and visualization! Thanks a lot!!

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

You are welcome!

[@Matt-gl5fj]

Great video

[@brianparrott1918]

Down unweighting is an excellent skill that has been around as a concept for over 50 years, but, having ridden acres of moguls on twin tip and carving boards, it is one skill of a number that an advanced rider will utilize. Extending off the back side of a mogul is very helpful to absorb the next large hit and the demo rider extends from time to time in the “down unweighting” demo. Caution not to fixate on one skill only, as good as it is.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your extra advice to people Brian! Your comment will help many snowboarders for sure!

[@brianparrott1918]

Snowboard Dojo Wiz I would have enjoyed seeing the down unweighting in moguls where everything is accelerated. And, to be fair, you do talk about the legs extending from the middle through the end of the turn which delivers flexibility to absorb terrain as required. Good lesson!

[@RyanBrown01]

Great Video!

[@johnwcso]

Good stuff

[@juniorsve]

super nice video ! thanks for explaining the steps !

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment juniorsve! Please feel free to share this video if you liked it!

[@Yurii.M]

Thanks this is what I been looking for! Exercise for low posture ride 👍🏼

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Hi Yurii! Wish your improvement with this tutorial!

[@joshandthejam7806]

Great info. Smash life.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Josh!

[@milau2097]

Awesome and Deep and details knowledge, thank you

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

You are Awesome too MI!

[@seperrooo]

Now can you please make a video applying these techniques on the actual powder run? And show the differences on how effective these techniques are when applied on powder tree run .

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your feedback! You are right! We will start working on it soon as possible!

[@lucifermorningstar4448]

It worked well, it was tricky but I made Turing and control much easier! Funnily enough my coach (I’m currently on a week long camp in Austria shredding off piste and trees), suggested this very thing before we hit the tree runs today! Keep up the good work Shu! (Please correct me if I’m getting your name wrong 🙌

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for leaving comment twice here Lucifer! Since this is not full tutorial it might be tricky to do just with this video. Hope you could learn Downward unweighting with your instructor. Have fun snowboarding in Austria!

[@Youknewthatalready]

Very good tutorial

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Christopher!

[@eliotzeyn]

good stuff. though i think you meant to say in minute 5:25 that the internal force is created when the leg is pushed in from the beginning to the middle of the turn, instead of "pushed out from the middle to the end of the turn"

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment and for pointing it out! Yes, you are right! That's my mistake and I've just noticed it! I hope everyone can understand what I'm trying to say here by watching my demo in the video.😭

[@eliotzeyn]

@@snowboarddojowiz2928 no probs my man.. yeah i think we all understood regardless by the demonstration..

[@kamshokar9328]

What if conditions aren't favorable or if it's super steep, moguly and tight? If I keep my nose pointed down while switching edges, I'll catch too much speed. But if i cut the bumpy hill sideways I don't get enough space to do a good turn. I end up having to do pivot turns by using my back leg to counter-steer. I have also struggled with shaving speed on mogul/bumpy runs while slicing the run. I usually do a few turns and then slow down by spraying forward to slow down and then repeat process.

[@carlmueller9701]

One thing that helps me on steeper runs is to look more across the mountain and to visualize a spot perpendicular or even slightly up the fall line and think of making a turn to that as fast as possible. This helps me make a more clean edge driven turn compared with a pivot turn which, by it's nature, disengages your edge.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

It seems like you first need to learn ... 1. Speed management 2. Timing & coordination skill Then, something you see in this video. Good luck!

[@jahblesssss]

great video. I know how wide your board is plays a role in how you carve. My boots are size 11 and my board is 257mm wide. You think i'll be alright making tight carves?

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment ChaseMansano! I think you are fine making tight carving turns with your board and boots. If your toes or heels of your boots are aligned with the edge of your board changing your edges will be heavier. You can check if your toes and heels touch the ground when tilting your board about 45 degrees. If your toes and heels are still not touching at 45 degrees tight carving turns will be harder.👍

[@aceyee]

Thanks

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment ace!

[@babybiscuit11]

I do the downward unweighting thing without knowing why. I think its mostly because it takes pressure off my leg muscles lol.

[@Chaseaction-outdoor-activities]

very usefull

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment chase!

[@eshmekov]

Also, on 5:45 you're actually making upper unweighting. Its a common mistake to make micro uplift before you sit down because of bad posture and not extending enough in straight layback carve. In other words, your body feels that you don't have proper centrifugal force to activate edge change with downward unweighting, and compensates with little "swing".

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for pointing my BAD example Кирилл! What you are pointing here could be an idea for others who are finding new idea to improve. So thanks again. This demo is taken to show people getting lower while changing edges. So I think demo is appropriate and I believe that people could understand what I mean in the video. What you can do from here is checking top pro riders performance which you can find on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and so on and try to analyze them as I do so. I strongly believe that what they do is the best since they are strong at anything which we can learn from. This is how I'm learning and improving. Demo that top instructors are showing is great but that are not the only performance we can learn from. Try to be flexible and accept any style of snowboarding in your mind. And watch those with positive attitude as finding what you can learn from them. Try not to find what they can't do. Go to snowboard addiction and snowboard pro camp channel and try to check their demo too. If you are still finding what they can't do you are minimizing the chance to improve your riding. Analyze more top riders performance and try it by yourself. And film your own riding and analyze it as I do so. Even if you found those ERRORs(?) on my riding, I was very comfortable while filming this video clip. You should understand that you will never know people's feeling while riding because all of us have different body posture as well as balance and you are obviously not them. This is why I recommend you to analyze and to try by yourself as much as possible. So you will understand that there are more cases you didn't know. Once again, try to learn from more snowboarding style and find the skill which works on any snowboarding style. Thanks again!

[@neilbenmc]

i've been snowboarding for 2y but i'm still struggling with initiating a SMOOTH toe side turn...

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for sharing your issue Neil! Have you checked our tutorial "How to initiate Toe side turn - Pat 1"?

[@edoson01]

@@snowboarddojowiz2928 Really good tutorial. I'm a beginner and I also watch Snow professor instructions, and he said not to use the upper body for turns as it leads to breaking of body alignment. Instead he advised to use only pressure of the toe/heels and knee movements to initiate and complete the turns. Which advise is more suitable for beginners? Loved your video though, why was part 2 never released?

[@Wiem1731]

Downward unweighting is not effective when the movement stops at the hips. When your knees don't bend, the downward unweighting won't effect your board... Also, why would you shift your weight to your backfoot to make the board turn on steep bumpy terrain/a groomer or moguls?

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment again! Keeping your balance over the board will be much easier with your weight in the center of the board. At same time, while bending our board with this position weight is pushing out directly toward the center of the board. This causes bouncing your board easier since there is no way to release the pressure. Many people have been experienced it while riding on steeps, moguls and so on. If your weight is more on back foot, you can gently give a pressure from the nose and pressure will be maximized under your back foot. Thanks to more pressure toward the tail releasing the pressure forward is possible. Also thanks to lighter weight on your front foot absorbing pressure coming from your front will be much easier to keep your balance stable just as surfers and skaters. You can visualize that you are going over a small obstacle with your weight in the center of the board and with your weight more on your back leg. Directional board and powder board allows us to stay standing straight with equal weight on both feet thanks to the longer nose and shorter tail. And these boards makes our turns certainly easy with the reason above. But recently people set up their bindings in the center of the board. For those people to get closer feeling with directional board and powder board, putting more weight on their back leg will help. In the big moguls for example, you will be required strong footing and balance while riding, thus, staying in the center of the board is suggested since this is the most easiest position to keep balance. But if you are intermediate or higher riding on the intermediate slopes (steep, moguls, trees at intermediate level), it should be easier to keep balance in the center of the board. So you can try putting more weight (even a little) on your back leg just like many pro riders is showing. If you are still not feeling well with this position you can stay in the center of the board but you need to manage pressure by lots up and down motion and must to be ready for unexpected pressure from your front. If you are riding any steeper slopes (groomed terrain, moguls ...) putting more weight on back leg might be happened naturally thanks to the angle of the slopes. Putting more weight on the back leg is about pressure management. It's up to you if you apply it on your riding or not. Also people might be seeing downward unweighting as standing up toward the center of the turn arc. This way to visualize it might reduce giving pressure to the board while extending their body. But my understanding about it is extending whole body toward the outside turn arc. This is the one of the point that I should add in this video. Or are you talking about bending and extending legs when changing edges with posture being small?

[@Wiem1731]

@@snowboarddojowiz2928 Good explanation, we apply pressure on the tail to 'block' the board and to create a rebound from the tail. That's a technique to gain momentum to shift our weight to the front foot. When applied correctly, you create a point of pivot underneath the front foot. This will make the board turn easier. It's a technique that is applied on really steep and icy terrain. The pressure on the back foot is applied right AFTER your turn, From your video I thought you meant to put the pressure on the backfoot DURING the turn to push out the board. My bad if i misinterpreted :-) In my comment I was pointing out the effect of the downward unweighting is only effective when the downward movement goes all the way down to the board through the knees. The demo in te video shows that the snowboards bends the upper body and not the knees in the frontside turns (5:18). I like the way we can discuss techniques! Thank you!

[@zephyr707]

Snowboard Dojo Wiz feel like your comment could be its own new separate tutorial video

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

zephyr707 Thanks for your comment zephyr707! There is actually tutorial talking about it but it's not published yet as a video. It's available to read in our blog.👍 www.snowboarddojowiz.com/blog/3-keys-to-get-an-all-around-riding-position

[@zephyr707]

Snowboard Dojo Wiz great, will check it out, cheers!

[@luzblanca4256]

How to carve*

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Luz! Actually I'm finishing editing the How to Carve - Step 1, and it will be published tomorrow. Please come back again and leave your comment, feedback and so on!

[@realirishspirit]

Where is all the recordings of actual tough terrain riding? That's all easy smooth ground

[@Famdockevin1]

Good tips. But here's an even more important take-home: Don't ever ride without a helmet like the one joker in this clip.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Kevin!

[@eshmekov]

So, your advice is to unweight downwards on steep moguls and in powder? I'm sorry, but that is bullshit. On bumpy steeps you gain speed in each turn, and after that, when you close turn, you're ending up with straight legs, which will allow bumps to kick you off. More so, when snow is covered with crust, you have no pressure on edge with this. In powder down unweighting may lead to burried nose and tomahawk even after small mistake. For struggling beginners the key is to learn upper unweighing with knees fairly bent and without body counter-rotation. Donw unweigth is only a cherry on the cake for advanced riders.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for your comment Кирилл! If you are having hard time riding in those challenging terrain, try staying low and reduce time that your board is flat. This is the main focus talking in the video. If you are required quick edge changing like in steep moguls then there is no time to extend legs obviously. Therefore, you should stay low while riding in steep moguls as it's introducing in the video as the first skill to learn. I actually don't recommend downward unweighting to any beginners at all as you don't hear it in the video. However, for intermediate riders who started challenging powder riding and so on, downward unweighting helps a lot certainly. If you are riding in deep powder without this skill, it should be hard. If you had failed while riding powder I think it's not by this skill and there must be the another reason. My students at the intermediate level are actually working on this skill in the challenging terrain. They keep learning it with groomed terrain and improving. This means that this skill is not just for advanced riders.

[@Wiem1731]

That's true, but in steep and large moguls, upward unweighting is way too slow to maintain speed. Downward unweighting is the way to go, BUT without fully extending your legs. That way, you will be able to keep balance and prepare to absorb the next mogul. It does take a lot of practice. A good place to practice this technique is on the side of a groomer, going over the bumpy boarder of the groomer and getting back on the slope. Makes you absorb the bump and extend the legs to a slightly bent position.

[@snowboarddojowiz2928]

Thanks for the extra tips Wiem1731!

[@eshmekov]

Wiem1731 then why nobody rides like this in real?))

[@Wiem1731]

@@eshmekov lots of People should ride like this on that kind of terrain. It's the only way to turn your board ON TOP of the mogul. Extending your legs when Sliding of the mogul helps to brake. When you turn the board between 2 moguls you can use upward unweighting. If they moguls are sitting really close to eachother, you can't turn between to moguls. If it's too steep, you can use counterrotation against a mogul to generate a rebound and prevent gaining too much speed. Try it ;-)