Hybrid Wood Stove Burn Process - Woodstock Soapstone Ideal Steel

[@andrewlippincott]

The fact it can cook for 24 hours...... Man I wish we had that when I was younger 😂 I had to split 20 cords a year just to make it through 😂

[@mdocod]

I enjoy hearing other stover owners process. I can tell you're super enthusiastic about your stove and enjoy the technical aspects of its operation! I run our Mansfield Hybrid in a similar manner. The lowest burn rate setting on it isn't really low enough to "choke" the flames out of a box full of super dry ponderosa. I think it might settle down into catalytic mode with harder wetter wood sooner, but either way, I agree that letting the secondaries do the work is actually better for these stoves. Let the catalyst perform cleanup and let visible flames do most of the heating work. This reduces wear and tear on the catalyst and probably burns cleaner. Visible flames are the most free and effective way to convert wood gases into thermal energy.

[@maxgra5416]

Very similar to my experience I have mine since 2016

[@a.w.w.728]

This will be my first winter with a wood burner. Open on using it as supplemental heat. To help lower the electric bill. What part of the country are you in? I'm in Kansas. Bought two ricks of wood. 1 Oak and the other is half Osage Orange and mixed hardwoods (Ash, Hickory, ect.) I'm hoping that will be enough but it sounds like maybe i need to buy some more of your going through several cords.

[@ProductiveRecreation]

I’m in NH and heat almost entirely with wood. My large stove has a firebox over 3 cubic feet in volume. I load it every 12 hours through the dead of winter and burn 24/7. I’m burning 5-6 cubic feet of wood per day, or a 1/4 to 1/3 of a cord per week. Shoulder seasons are less. Overall between October and may I will burn 5-6 cord between my two stoves to heat our 2600 sq ft house. I assume your rick is 1/3 of a cord? You may want more. Can’t hurt to have it and not use it.

[@wobdeehomestead]

Woodstock makes a great product. I prefer their older soapstone models.

[@ProductiveRecreation]

I was looking hard at the Progress Hybrid (cast iron/soapstone) because I initially didn't really like the looks of the Ideal Steel, but ended up getting the Ideal Steel based on price, fitting the space, and the flexibility of being able to load logs front to back or side to side from the front door (instead of only side to side with the end loader). Cleaning the glass and using the cooktop is also easier. So far, the stove has not disappointed.

[@aurora04444]

@ProductiveRecreation ... yes, having both North South and East West loading is very nice.

[@MattBell_USA]

Thanks for the update!

[@chrisE815]

Newbie here- Never operated a woodstove but interested in a Woodstock Hybrid for my house. In your opinion, is it at all dangerous to run this stove for a length of time in bypass mode? I was looking into the Blaze King stoves, but read that forgetting to switch bypass off may damage the stove or worse. I'm hoping the hybrid stoves are a bit more flexible in this regard. Also, looks like the Ideal stove is rated for 9k to 43k BTUS. Is it easy to set the stove at say around half capacity 20k BTUs in catalyst mode? How do you keep from over-heating your house in the shoulder season (newbie questions maybe?). Is the btu output of the stove simply a function of how full the firebox is?

[@ProductiveRecreation]

Wow, there's a lot here. Yes it could be dangerous in bypass mode. Bypass mode allows significantly more airflow through the stove, and thus would facilitate a faster burning, hotter fire. On minimum air with a full load of wood in the Woodstock Ideal Steel, it would probably be controlled enough to be safe, but I wouldn't want to try it. Leaving the bypass open sacrifices efficiency. Closing it should be part of normal operating procedure, same as backing down the draft control as a fire gets hot. It becomes habit pretty quickly. Wood stoves do require some babysitting on reload until they are set properly for a controlled burn based on the fuel load. The one time I was in overfire territory was when I got sidetracked briefly before getting the air control backed all the way down (it was at half air with a full firebox and bypass closed). My point? Any wood stove has the potential to be dangerous or damaged in burning via overfiring, bypass open or closed. Its up the to operator to get to know the stove and operate it safely. Blaze Kings run a little different than the Woodstock stoves, as you set the air based on stove temperature and then its thermostatically controlled. I believe some Vermont Castings stoves work that way as well. What this means is the stove will automatically open the air as the fire burns down to maintain heat output, whereas the Woodstock Ideal Steel won't do that. If I want more heat as the fire burns down, I need to open the air a bit to increase burn rate. Regarding BTUs, that represents burn rate, not necessarily heating output. I always burn my stove with a full firebox at a pretty low air setting, and the stove cruises along as hot as I want it for hours (450-650F on top - this is a good cruising range for a stove). If I want to burn out a deep bed of coals, I might put in 3-4 pieces of wood and burn at half air. Never higher than that. With a wood stove you have to accept and get used to some heat swings. When the fire is first cranking, it will potentially be a little warm in the house, but after that its really about when you reload to maintain temps you are comfortable with, or whether you open the air more as the wood gets to the coaling stage to increase the heat output before the next reload. Yes you can put less wood in, but that mostly changes burn time - I will still get the stove top above 500F, it just won't be there as long because there is less fuel to sustain it. For example, last night I loaded the stove full. Today was sunny and in the low 40s. I didn't load the stove again for 20 hours, and that was with just a few pieces to heat it up and get a nice hot coal bed for my next big reload tonight. I've never run the stove at absolute minimum air, but presumably that might lead to cooler stove top temps and definitely longer burn time. Just bear in mind, a hot fire maintaining active catalyst temperatures is a clean and efficient fire! In shoulder season I just make a fire at night, or when its needed, and otherwise let it go out. 24/7 burning with 12 hour reloads runs from sometime in November until late March or early April for me. And at the beginning and end of the 24/7 burn season, some of that is with 24 hours reloads using kindling on the remaining embers to get the stove going again.

[@chrisE815]

@@ProductiveRecreation thank you so much for your detailed response. I will be reviewing this post when it comes time for me to pick out a stove

[@aurora04444]

Hi again! I ordered my Blue/Blue Ideal Steel. Now, I am doing research to buy my stove pipe, connectors, etc. I think I see you got the pipe shield? I assume the pipe shield is a female... the stove pipe goes inside, down into it? Did you get double walled stove pipe? I see there is a stove adapter in double walled pipe.

[@ProductiveRecreation]

Congrats on your new stove! I don’t have any of the shields because mine has masonry below it and the masonry chimney behind it. No clearance issues with combustibles. What you are seeing on top is just the standard flue collar that comes with the stove. I set up my stove for top venting, but it can also be set up for rear venting with the same flue collar. Yes, pipe slides right inside the flue collar. I just have single wall pipe. Because the stove is centered on the chimney, but the flue is to the side (there are two flues in the chimney), I have an elbow at a shallow angle at the flue collar, then about a 1’ straight piece, then a 90 degree elbow into the chimney. The chimney is lined with an insulated 6” diameter stainless steel liner inside of a larger rectangular clay tile liner. So basically it’s double lined and interior to the house. Drafts very well and no issues with the flue gas staying warm once the chimney is heated up. My chimney situation coupled with the ease of monitoring single wall pipe temps with a magnetic thermometer is why I stuck with single wall. A side benefit is it sheds a little more heat into the house. I just got generic black pipe locally. If you get pipe from Woodstock, you can get it color-matched to the stove. The way we run the stove, the chimney is dirty after burning 5 cords through the heating season, but not in an alarming way - it’s as expected. No glaze, just the easy stuff to brush out. The chimney sweep says it’s burning nice and we’re running it well given the amount of wood burned compared to the amount of creosote buildup.

[@aurora04444]

@ProductiveRecreation , I'll ask them their thoughts on needing the shields. I am placing my stove close to my chimney. Thanks again!

[@ProductiveRecreation]

@@aurora04444 Mine is 6” off the brick, but there’s nothing combustible behind the brick, it’s all masonry chimney, and wider than the stove, floor to ceiling.

[@sebbakoledis3447]

Your videos are absolutely excellent! I just got my i2400, do you mind doing this type of video for that? I’m still learning the best burn process but you seem to have it down!

[@ProductiveRecreation]

Thanks! We’ve moved and I don’t have the i2400 anymore. The process is very similar. The best video I have that shows it is one of my first - an overnight burn video on the i2400. It shows the loaded wood, and backing down the air control with time. Yours may perform a little differently depending on your chimney setup and draft, but the basic process is the same. I painted marks on the air control rod on that unit so that I could know where I was and readily get to consistent burn settings that worked well.

[@sebbakoledis3447]

@@ProductiveRecreation thanks for replying! I actually found that video of yours right after asking, extremely informative information. Helped me a ton. First wood stove and I really didn’t know about secondary combustion so I was treating it like a normal fire place not putting enough wood in or controlling it correctly. This morning I followed your steps and I’ve got excellent secondary combustion. Thank you so much! How did you like the stove?

[@ProductiveRecreation]

@@sebbakoledis3447 The i2400 was a great insert. We loved it. That’s a big reason why we bought the Regency i1500 for our current place. So far I’m much less impressed with the i1500. Fortunately we don’t burn it as much because we mostly rely on the big Ideal Steel wood stove. The Ideal Steel is the most impressive wood stove I’ve ever used.

[@aurora04444]

What do think about the ash pan? I'm used to not using one with my past old 1990s Hearthstone Mansfield. It had a horrid ash pan grate system, hated it.

[@ProductiveRecreation]

I like it a lot. Ash falls through the grate when I rake the firebox, coals don’t. In my experience, shoveling ash kicks up more dust than emptying the ash pan. If you have an ash pan, you don’t have to use it. If you don’t, it can’t be added later… it is one more gasket to maintain… but that’s not a big deal.

[@aurora04444]

@ProductiveRecreation...Yes, as long as the gaskets and ash door system are wicked tight and not allowing air in, as that can cause overburning, chimney fires.

[@aurora04444]

@ProductiveRecreation...The other thing I saw in a video was that to close the ash door, you needed to use two hands. That you had to be sure both sides were locked and that the grab bar was level. Otherwise it leaked air.

[@ProductiveRecreation]

@@aurora04444 This stove has gone through two winters of 24/7 burning on the original gaskets. All still tight. The ash door requires one hand to open and close. No bars involved. In fact, I don’t think you could do it with two hands. The latch is a semicircular incline plane, it draws in tight, especially at the top. If it’s going to leak, it would be in a bottom corner. The stove is highly controllable. An air leak would be obvious right away.

[@aurora04444]

Ok, the video I saw was the Progress ash pan. I assumed it was the same ash pan for the Ideal. I would love to see the ash pan door, how it works, what an ash removal looks like. I've been searching for videos. Thanks for talking about your stove with me!

[@BuffSheep7]

I have an opportunity to get an Ideal used, or buy the Survival new. My space is small so I don't want to burn my family out. On Woodstock's website they claim the survival BTU output at low operation is almost 15,000. While the Ideal Steel is 9,000 even though it's their largest stove. Do you think the Ideal cranks down low enough to be used in smaller settings? Say under 1,500square feet?

[@ProductiveRecreation]

How tight is your house? I’m fully heating 2600 sq ft with the Ideal Steel for much of the heating season. Insulation in the house is good, but not up to new build standards by any stretch. Right now, overnights are in the 40s, days around 60F and it’s on the line of too much heat if I get the Ideal Steel going in the evening for an overnight burn. Thus, I’ve mostly been using our small fireplace insert instead. Yes it has good turn down… yes you can make a small fire in a big stove… but you still need to get the stove hot for efficient burning, which inherently will take a bigger fire to do in a bigger stove. BTU/hr is the fuel burn rate. Not the temp or heating ability of the stove itself. Imagine a big 600lb steel and soapstone box at 400-500F for hours. It throws a lot of heat, even on low. If you don’t mind temperature swings, you might be able to stretch to 24 hour burns in an Ideal Steel. Personally, I like having slightly hotter fires with more flame to watch, which in your case would dictate a smaller stove. But if the deal on the used Ideal Steel is good, I might jump on it if it’s in good shape and hasn’t been abused/overfired. If it makes too much heat for you, you can always sell or trade and get the other stove later.

[@BuffSheep7]

@@ProductiveRecreation Good points. I don't want to subject my pregnant wife and children to temperature swings and it does make sense to run the stove at optimum temperature, which wouldn't be the absolute bare minimum. I'm hoping to run the Survival similarly to how you've demonstrated running your Ideal, if the operation is the same (I think it is.) Thank you for your response and your videos, they were a blessing to me and i pray the Lord blesses you and your family!

[@ProductiveRecreation]

@@BuffSheep7 The survival is pretty small. Make sure you have a reasonable expectation on burn time. It won’t be as long as the big stove does.

[@BuffSheep7]

@@ProductiveRecreation Yes I realize that, I am content with at least an overnight burn which it's supposed to manage that. I'm more concerned with the proper BTU output for my home.

[@ProductiveRecreation]

@@BuffSheep7 Unless your house is super tight, the Survival may be a little small. I’d expect 8 hour burn out of it, max. My small insert is a similar size firebox (very different design), and reasonable max hot reload time is about 4 hours. What about the mid-sized Absolute Steel? I know it’s more expensive… but it’s a nice medium size unit.