I Forgot About Scale.... Did It RUIN My Model House?!?!?

[@modelermark172]

I've been building models for more than half a century (static display and dioramas, not wargaming terrain) and for what it's worth, I think your model looks pretty good, and that it serves well as wargaming terrain. If you're worried about the scale looking a bit "off," it's still a nice, well-crafted "stand alone" display piece. Bottom line? As long as you had fun building it, that should be enough.

[@Strkr3]

Bah...its an outpost for a squad on the frontier or at a town entrance. Looks pretty good! I keep a mini on the table as I'm crafting just for scale. Good job! 😊

[@markegelston5672]

missed you but glad you are back and that you are both feeling better

[@douggillespie747]

From the looks I would use it as a barracks for troops or a store house for a keep at which point scale wise it could work fine.

[@stephenwyant2217]

If you're making a set piece where the players are never going to be inside of the structure then I wouldn't worry so much about scale. If the characters have to be inside of the structure then you have to really pay attention to scale. Because of the 5 ft is 1 in rule. A building will have to be bigger if you're going to play inside of it. I've made a few buildings and they were usable inside and that's how it is there bigger than they might otherwise have been. You can build a tower out of a Pringles can, but would you actually be able to play inside of that? It's really not to scale but it looks great on the table. If you're building a village and the players aren't going in, the house is to fight stuff then you don't want the buildings to be as big. Otherwise you're going to take up too much of your table

[@rayslover8526]

I missed you last week.... I look forward to Thursdays and your videos.

[@silverdragon1314]

Scale is something I'm struggling with as I start to build houses but there's in game implications that I think you're skipping in this video The first quest I designed for my homebrew, a rich family was having a house built and an old bunker was discovered where they were going to build. A ghost was around, building got scared, my players were sent to deal with the ghost and set explosives in the old bunker so it could later be back filled safely. This bunker was so ridiculously old (see note), well well well before the time on my continent where the different races intermingled. This bunker was made by dwarves with the intention that no taller races would ever enter it In fact it was weird that one of the ghosts was a halfling. I did the math, dwarves average 4 to 5 ft tall That ceiling was only 6 ft. I had two humans over 6 ft and I had a dragonborn that was well over 6 ft mostly due to his horns, All of these characters had to crouch through this dungeon because they weren't supposed to be there, it just wasn't designed for taller races. So if your society is fairly intermingled and races like goliaths and orcs and firbolgs are common in your cities and most of your towns your ceilings aren't going to be 8 ft That's how tall they are, it would be perfectly logical for all homes to be built with a minimum of a 10-ft ceiling because that accommodates the larger races. Your "medieval" style homes might be larger to accommodate those stocky dwarfs and orcs, the various bird folk with their wings, the various races that have tails. Your basic architects might be keeping all of these things in mind. when you design a basic house they don't have to say the same scale as a medieval home just because that's the style we're going for. (Note: for anyone that wants to do an ancient bunker be aware that your players are going to want to take every piece of furniture and cutlery and everything they can out of that bunker because it has historic value. I did not think that through. I guess my players have a storage unit now....)

[@BillAllanWorld]

First, congrats on 20k subs. Second, I agree with you about scale being hard. I have a lot of building that aren't to scale. But ultimately, my players never complain because having tons of terrain and minis just makes games fun.

[@markymark3228]

For me scaling was one of the most important things, after I decided to use minis and terrain when we play. We play Warhammer Fantasy and the size is all the same...means 1 inch equals 5 feet, 1,5m in the metric system, and therefor a mini which resembles a warrior with 6feet height has to bee 28mm high, and that size has to fit to the surrounding buildings and props too. I bought a 3d printer to print my own minis, so I could choose how big they are, because many minis out there are way to big and dont fit in the scale of the buildings. It takes more time in the actual planning time on buildings (measuring etc) but pays off in the end...and nevertheless...in the end - all that counts is fun, when you play!

[@michaelyork2292]

I see a military outpost and for that the scale would be appropriate I think. Military buildings would have to contain sleeping quarters, kitchen and eating area, and store all of their equipment. So I think that sized building is correct. You can build a stable to go with it and everyone would think that’s the way it was always supposed to be.

[@ryansullivan5854]

Nice to see you back. I think about scale quite a bit, but if I'm ever off (usually as a result of project creep), I just change how I think about a building. Too big? Now it's an inn. Too small? It was built by gnomes.

[@dungeonscronics3191]

Feel better soon

[@iknownothing-49]

It’s a merchant’s home and warehouse. The door could be taller and maybe a large door in the back for the merchandise. I visited my father’s home in a rural part of Spain, built about 1904. The house was huge and made of massive blocks of stone. Half of the home was actually the barn. It was long and it was deep. When the kitchen door was open you could watch the cows coming in for the night, walking through the hallway.

[@janetcameron4652]

Thanks SC.

[@capnskustomworks]

Looks nice! I think I follow ye, like the “feel” of that build seems like a 3-room house, but mathematically it’d be the size of a decent barn. Honestly for gaming I wouldn’t stress much, I think the fun is most important, and that one looks cool to game with!!! 😊

[@IWFarrar2]

Seems like you missed an opportunity. You should have built some crazy Fey house/keep/building and let your fever dream run wild 😂

[@proft7211]

Nice video. I struggled with this when I began building - How big should a house be? When I build, I often tend to the larger size because I consider playability. I don't build playable buildings (with magnets and such that open up to interior space) but I do like to lift the building off the table to reveal a playable space drawn on the game mat. I find if you build to a realistic scale (12x20), it is impossible to have minis enter the space.

[@reneesteeves3698]

scale is relative though right? And since people come in all sizes, I think it's totally fine for buildings in a fantasy game be scaled differently. I think all these building are perfectly fine. But if it's bothering you a bit, then maybe not place them side by side as the differences might become more apparent. I agree with you and the other posters that say this new stucco building looks like a keep or a stronghold. Much more civic in nature than the wooden buildings that appear to be more "homey." If the blockiness is an issue, then I think i'd look to the style of architecture known as "brutalist." In my mind brutalist buildings look strong and imposing. All that to say, "don't beat yourself up, it looks awesome!"

[@michaelreeves6565]

Looks amazing to me...reminds me that keep where you find the first dragon outside of Whiterun in Skyrim. Nice job man!

[@olebrogger]

Good video and topic :-) hope you are feeling better and will get well soon :-) I'm not thinking so much about scale, more playability, so if one of my models is to big, it does not matter if it is to big, as log as my players have the best access to move around to the model. i tend to over scale my models a bit, but again it is to access them better:-)

[@VingloLeClerc]

Scale is such a big problem. While it is true that 1 inch is considered to be 5 feet in D&D, the scale of figured varies considerably from that particular scale. If I take typical Games Workshop fantasy miniatures, the scale is closer to 1:48 high by 1:35 wide for which it's very difficult to create scenery. And if you go into the various miniature vendors, that scale is definitely off even among their own products.

[@kgoblin5084]

I think what matters for scale is that the building needs to feel rightly sized compared to miniatures, for the implied fictional purpose... so a house should be big enough we can see the people of the world actually living in it, as should a shop, as should a tavern, etc etc. One thing to bear in mind for 28/32mm scale minis... the 5ft/in metric is a lie. If we assume the fantasy characters retain the modern average of 5-6ft average male height, then minis should be around 1 inch tall... but they're not, they're more typically 1.5 to 2. IMHO the actual rule is closer to 3 feet/in... making the fever built building 24feet long compared to the minis; the shopkeeper house 18x18 square, & the small house a mere 9x7. With that in mind, the small house actually begins to feel the least realistic, because it becomes a stretch how you would fit in a stairwell to get to the 2nd story. It's doable... & from some knowledge of historic residences (& how many people they expected to house in said residences) it's not too far off from being IRL accurate... but it's starting to stretch believability.

[@muzzynat]

Scale in D&D is impossible to get right- I'm not being hyperbolic, because a mini's base is going to be 5'x5' if you use 5' to 1" as guide, minis will dwarf furniture like beds and doors- but if you scale buildings to match Minis, they end up huge- and if you get into inside and outside of buildings, it gets even harder. If it looks good, and is playable, its good enough. As for your building, it could easily be a store house, Barracks, blacksmith shop, or even an Inn to justify its size on the table. Ultimately, it's there to draw in the players, and perhaps make combat more interesting- and I think it absolutely succeeds in doing that.

[@alexkilgrow725]

I agree 100%. Real people take up only like a 2'x2' square, unless they're spreading their arms out wide. Add to that that most miniatures have a "hero" scale component, and that mini heads are oversized to help communicate something at that scale....lots of reasons why true scale doesn't make as much sense for D&D as it might for more realistic diorama-type efforts (like model train terrains). IN the end, D&D terrain is intended to ease the imagination burden of your players so they can spend more energy on the fun of the game. Perfect scale doesn't really matter for that end-goal. Also, Garmin, each of these buildings looks cool with their own aesthetic. So, no worries!

[@TimothyEdwards]

A lot of minis these days are bigger than the floor scale of D&D, which is why we keep seeking Wizkids making monster models too big for their statted base. The five by five space is the kind of space you need if you’re skirmish fighting to avoid clocking your mate on the back swing. I have done LARP fighting through both houses and actual cave systems - it’s claustrophobic and cramped and difficult to manoeuvre. Most D&D battle maps are much more spacious to give ranged casters and archers space to do something tactically.

[@ChristopherDunkle]

The 1" equals 5' came from wargaming which Gygax and Arneson were both involved in before they created D&D. Wargaming used 25mm miniatures. True 25mm miniatures. There has been a lot of scale creep since then. Most minis today are "heroic scale", and may claim to be 28mm, 30mm, or 32mm. I have some that are supposed to be 32mm, but are actually closer to 40mm. this is why scale is impossible to get right. The minis are way too big.

[@LB_adventurer]

I always scale up and make my structures bigger so that the mini's can move around on or in them easier. Then I just build everything bigger so they are all at the same scale.

[@AndyJohnson3leftturns]

These buildings are great and you bring up great points. But DND scale isn’t a true scale. Minis vary in their proportions and heights between true and heroic scales. But if you think about DND scale for combat, a big blocking thing longer than player character movement is great. Forces the players to dash if the movement around the building is over 20-30 feet, or 4-6 inches. As for storey height, I’ve standardized on 2 inches. It makes all my buildings modular but you’re limited on over hangs/bridges because you need at least 4 inches to get your hand in there. So bridges have to be on the 3rd floor if that makes sense, or they’re impassable underneath.

[@Spark_Chaser]

Scale is important when you're worrying about realistic accuracy, but in a fantasy game, it may be better to have verisimilitude. Does it make sense in the context of the game world? A larger building than would be historically accurate may still fit in that world simply because it works for a playable area.

[@ChristopherDunkle]

Interesting video. As far as the building I think it looks fine. It may not have turned out as you originally intended, but as far as the details of it, it is close enough to the other two that it would work with them. As a couple of other people said it looks more like a barracks, or government building then a home. As far as scale ... ... ... there is a huge can of worms. To start off with, the 1 inch equals 5 foot scale that D&D uses today is the same that D&D used when Gygax and Arnerson first created D&D. This scale came from wargaming which used 25mm miniatures. True 25mm miniatures. Scale creep has been a thing for a long time. Even back in the late 70s early 80s a lot of your 25mm miniatures tended to be a little bigger than that. probably closer to 28mm scale. (there were also differences in style with some being thinner and some being chunkier) Then we have the whole "heroic scale" thing. I have some minis which are supposed to be 32mm scale which are really closer to 40mm scale. What that means is that the 1 inch equals 5 feet scale isn't really accurate anymore. It doesn't look as if any of your buildings are meant to be playable inside, so the interior scale isn't an issue.

[@metajock]

Love your work. You are so far overthinking this build. Yes, keep your world story in the back of your head, but I don't think this one is out of scale at all. I think you might be applying european design/history to a middle eastern style build. (English in particular, they charged tax by the square foot of the ground level, but not the above levels or the basement.) Also, it's a fantasy world, have fun. True, lower and lower-middle class would have smaller buildings, but who's to say this isn't someone's workspace AND home. Remember, its terrain, so it makes for more options for your table setup. Keep up the good work, we love what you do.

[@zeugenberg]

So... about that mystery Box....

[@DarkoStojanovickgkid]

Well, this is still ok. The use of the house, the owner, the race of the builder... It all comes into account. So, zour big building might actuallz be a big building. Still awesome! Thanks for being such an inspiration!

[@iamtheomnimonkey]

Just food dor thought. A 40ft wide by 20ft deep single story building is 800 square ft. My house, which is a pretty average 3 bedroom house for my area, is 1600 square feet. That grey building is a good size for a small guard house or small store house.

[@lilcwa]

With respect, I think you’re wrong about scale and your advice to scale down. Medieval peasants didn’t have 5-foot discs glued to their feet and giant hands reaching in through the roof to move them around; your minis do. Playability is as important as aesthetics for terrain made for RPGs and wargaming. Most commercial minis are sculpted over scale these days (compared to 50 years ago when D&D got started), which can further complicate issues of scale when building terrain. I use a 1.25” grid as popularized by Wyloch’s Armory for all my dungeon tiles and terrain, because it eliminates problems caused by the inclusion of dungeon walls when using 28mm minis mounted on 1” bases; thus, everything I build is 1/48th scale, and the scale still looks appropriate even at 25% over. Playability is greatly improved compared to a lot of commercially available terrain products, which have limited interior areas or are made so small compared to even the standard 1” grid that they are more representational than accurate to the real-world size (as with traditional wargames terrain). Regardless, I look forward to watching your next build video, when you reveal how you made this super-easy house for the tabletop.

[@looselycollected7505]

There's a reason it's called fantasy gaming. It's never going to be totally realistic. And it doesn't need to be. Get it close, make it look good, and make it useful/useable. Then move on and make more.

[@drewbakka5265]

Not unless you are wargaming

[@tablezero]

Looks more like a governmental building instead of a house. It's a perfect size for a government building. Stop hating on yourself.