I was Recently Challenged by a Jehovahs Witness on the Deity of Christ

Much of this information is referenced from my book,
A Lie Told Often Enough Becomes the Truth, Exposing How the Watchtower Deceives Jehovah’s Witnesses.
Available in paperback and Kindle
www.amazon.com...
#jehovahswitness #jehovahswitnesses #watchtower #jw #cult #apologetics #christian #christianity #trinity #bible

[@eyeswideopen8570]

Great video! Former JW here, born into the religion, 3rd generation. Christ called me out a few years ago and accepted me into His fold. He is my Lord and Savior! I am no longer a slave for Watchtower, but free in Christ. Whom the Son sets free is free indeed! JW's are taught that Jesus is a created angel. Reading the book of Hebrews pretty much debunked all the JW theology I had been taught all my life. I have studied the book of Hebrews 3 times in small groups. The New World Translation is a faulty translation and has corrupted the truth about Jesus. This video helped me tremendously. Thank you

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Great testimony!

[@ericschaeffer8288]

@@Mr.DC3.1914 most of us know what the Watchtower has to say, but let me point out a key difference between what the Bible teaches and what the Watchtower teaches. You, as a Jehovahs Witness, have to use all of these wordy and bizarre excuses to justify your doctrine. But the better approach is to simply read the Bible for what it plainly says. Allow me to provide an example to help you: JESUS IS CALLED: "mighty God" (Isaiah 9:6) "God with us" (Matthew 1:23) "my Lord and my God" (John 20:28) "great God and Savior" (Titus 2:13) "God and Savior" (2 Peter 1:1) JESUS SAID: "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58) "the Father and I are one" (John 10:30) "he that sees Me, sees the Father" (John 14:9) "I am the First and the Last" (Rev. ‪1:17-18‬) "I am the Alpha and Omega" (Rev. ‪22:12-13‬) JESUS DID THINGS ONLY RESERVED FOR JEHOVAH: Raise Himself from the dead. (John ‪2:19-21‬, ‪10:18‬) Receives worship. (Mat. 2:11,14:33, 28:9, John 9:38, Heb. 1:6) Forgives sins (Mark 2:5-7) Only name by which to be saved (Acts ‪4:12‬) This is only a sampling , but the point is, these things do not make any sense, unless of course, Jesus is God. Hope that helps.

[@eyeswideopen8570]

@@ericschaeffer8288 The Bible is so clear that Jesus is God. Love your reply, can't argue with truth.

[@eyeswideopen8570]

@@Mr.DC3.1914 Do you remember what the 1st of the 10 commandments is? "You shall have no other gods before me." Yet your Bible at John 1:1 plainly says Jesus is a god! Not only that, he is a God who is worshiped by angels. Hebrews 1:6. The Father commands the angels to worship Jesus! John 1:3 says "All things were made by Jesus and without him was not anything made that was made. Let that sink in for a minute.

[@eyeswideopen8570]

@@Mr.DC3.1914 Worship is only for the true God. Jesus was and IS worshiped. Do you worship Jesus as the Bible and the Father command? Do you bow your knee to Him, accepting that He is your Lord, Savior, Judge, Redeemer, King, Shepherd, and worthy of your worship?

[@spooksya]

Been out almost 10 yrs now and came to this conclusion as well🤦🏾‍♀️. Jesus saved me and is slowly working his way through the family I have in still.

[@ste-fitzgerald]

I will pray for your family to have the realization and revelation of what Thomas, one the Jesus' followers, said. "Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!” John 20.28

[@ShamiAhmathofYasharahla]

@@ste-fitzgerald My daughter has shunned me most of her adult life, she won't let me have any connection with my grandson who's eight years old now. Please pray for me as well

[@ste-fitzgerald]

@@ShamiAhmathofYasharahla That is so sad praying Robyn. God bless you in Jesus name.

[@UniteAgainstEvil]

🙏🙏🙏✝️❤

[@scottgrey2877]

@@ste-fitzgerald Thomas said not called

[@jeffcolt9185]

The Jehovah's Witnesses do a really good job of trying to make sense out of nonsense

[@markusbrauns4274]

Really good job at covering up child sex abuse, but not for much longer.

[@gwendolynandrefsky4043]

If Jesus is god almighty, who was he praying to when he was on earth? Why his he called the son and not called the father. U are the ones he going say I don't know u. Idiots common sense shows defgently

[@ghernandez2263]

@@markusbrauns4274hahahaha the Catholic Church is brought up on a new case every second, by the thousands if not millions of effected children

[@michaelhaigh9182]

No they don’t sir the same word at John 1 v 1 is the same Greek word used at act 28 v 6 and it’s a god the same word sir so the trinitians have changed in the bibles the Word was God to try and say that Jesus is God but he’s a god like John 1 v 18 reads begotten God God was never begotten

[@ghernandez2263]

@@markusbrauns4274 lmao sex abuse in the JWs? The Catholics abuse children at higher rates than Muslims

[@scottbrandon6244]

When I used to do Bible study with JWs years ago something bothered me. They always referred to Jehovah (God) and rarely to Jesus Christ. That was a red flag. I am so glad I never was baptized into the Watchtower Society. I also never liked the NWT of the Bible. JWs would remove key verses of the Bible if it was not convenient to their theology.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Jehovahs Witnesses have been known to mimic orthodox Christianity until their protégés are more thoroughly indoctrinated… I’m glad you saw through the deception before it was too late

[@archangeljesus4369]

@@ericschaeffer8288 That mere angel Jesus who fell to his knees and prayed and cried for God's help will never in a billion years be God.

[@scottgrey2877]

@@ericschaeffer8288 Being MADE better than the angels was God MADE??

[@bookerjoned7293]

@@archangeljesus4369 where is Jesus call Michael the archangel in the word of God .or Where is Michael ever call Jesus in the word God

[@archangeljesus4369]

@@bookerjoned7293 Open your eyes and read 1 Thessalonians 4:16.

[@joegonzalez842]

Good work , I woke up from this nonsensical JW'S nightmare

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Glad you made it out!

[@discoveringlisa486]

My mum became a JW 20 years ago when I was 18. 2 lovely women knocked on the door and befriended her, made her feel special and spent alot of time with her. She was lonely and isolated at the time and didn't really know the Bible. A perfect target for the JWs. I studied with them a while and went to some meetings but I didn't like it. I had born again Christian friends and these people did not seem like Christians to me. The teachings were never about Christ, you never heard about the mercy and love of God or the testimonies of those who had experienced it and everything seemed hyper focused on their house to house scenarios and practicing for them. The other thing was, we weren't studying the Bible, we were studying watchtower material and occasionally going to the Bible to 'confirm' what the watchtower was saying. Nope. I was 18 at the time and knew it was wrong. 20 years later I became born again in Christ and am trying to get my mum to see His way but I might as well be talking to the wall.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Bittersweet story Lisa… I’m thankful for your discernment… my Dad “saved” me when he made me take all the JW litterateur back to our neighbors. I was getting hooked and he said “No.” May the Lord bless your Mom eyes to see.

[@rmorris334]

I hear u. I went thru the same thing with my Mom. My baby brother died n my Mom was very vulnerable. She was told if she became a J W then she would see her little boy again when he was resurrected. That’s all she lived for. She died a J W. She also left them money. Like u, I m a born again Christian. I had to go to the Kingdom Hall when I was a kid, but when I turned 18 I got my own apt. The other kids at the KH were so mean n unloving n racist! I hated going to meetings!

[@discoveringlisa486]

@@rmorris334 That is strangely similar to my mum's position. My sister died when I was 6, she died suddenly at age 21... They told her they would all be together in the 'new system' because dying means you've paid for your sins!? My sister was heavily into the occult. It pains me that I may never see her again and it angers me that she's been fed so many lies. The JW organisation is completely demonic in my opinion, it doesn't free souls, it puts them in bondage. I'm so sorry for you and your mum and for the loss of your brother ❣️

[@777Tralfaz777]

Preaching about the kingdom is what God's will is for Jesus' disciples. If your religion is not focused on preaching, then you are not in the correct religion. It is not about "feeling", but about thinking, and truth. The Bible is the touchstone.

[@markusbrauns4274]

I feel for you. I've been out awile, my mom will stay one till she's dead, unfortunately. I heard a woman say once, the JWs use the Bible as a "prop. In the cult of JWs, Watchtower is " the Bible. You were very smart to steer clear of this dangerous cult.

[@markweatherill]

Don't forget the nwt was partly based on Johannes Greber's 'translation'. And Greber was talking to spirits.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

One of the dirty secrets JWs don’t like to talk about

[@AndyBCCA]

and Hebrews 1:8 reads the same as the NWT in Grebers version, not a surprise.

[@AndyBCCA]

@@scottgrey2877 the Father is God, and the Son is God. scripture teaches one God. thats why christians talk of the triune God. "these three are one". .

[@scottgrey2877]

@@AndyBCCA One God has a God 😂

[@AndyBCCA]

@@scottgrey2877 The Hebrew word for "god" in the Old Testament, Elohim, is a word that implies plurality. "let us make man in our image". The Bible clearly teaches in both the old and new testament that there is only one true god. It also gives Jesus both the titles and qualities of God, as it does to the Father. Jesus is even given the title, "eternal Father", and "mighty God". He is called Immanuel, "God with us". we need to take into account the whole totality of scripture, and also consider the historical record of what christians have taught and believed over the past 2,000 years. The evidence supports the deity of Christ, not the teachings of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society.

[@alanburchardt1045]

Left in 2017 my lord and Savior Christ Jesus opened my eyes so happy not to be a part of their blood sacrifices anymore horrible cult leaders don't have the love of the Christ

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Yes! Love and power are surely missing

[@rebeccabrooks4948]

I agree with you on that one 100%, they are evil I never seen such an unloving bunch of people in my whole entire life I was born in glad I'm not in it anymore glad I Found Jesus I still believe in Jehovah's the father but now I know the real truth about Jesus they don't teach that

[@rebeccabrooks4948]

Jesus is God's son

[@rebeccabrooks4948]

@@scottgrey2877 Jesus is God's son so what is your point

[@exjwlaura]

New subscriber thank you for your content, amazing work Praise God!

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Nice to meet you Laura :)

[@exjwlaura]

@@ericschaeffer8288 if you ever need any testimonies on your channel me and my husband would love to talk about coming out of the Watchtower and how we came to Christ.

[@XYGamingRemedyG]

Had a JW tell me only 144,000 are getting into heaven. I found the passage that she was talking about-which is IMMEDIATELY followed by passages about countless others also right there by the throne. 🤦‍♀️

[@777Tralfaz777]

Was that verse Rev 5:9,10?

[@XYGamingRemedyG]

@@777Tralfaz777 Revelation 7:1-15 I believe. But that appears to be pretty good, too. :)

[@scottgrey2877]

@@777Tralfaz777 I think the 144,000 are a separate group from the great growd

[@777Tralfaz777]

@@scottgrey2877 Me too.

[@undyne4032]

​@@scottgrey2877yes they 144.000 are jews 12.000 from each tribe of Israel, great crowd depicts gentiles who got baptized and believed in Jesus Christ

[@nancyduhalde4679]

Thank you for this and keep up the good work!!!

[@ShamiAhmathofYasharahla]

As an exjw who finally knows Christ Jesus, Thank you. Excellent!

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Thank you for the encouragement!

[@ShamiAhmathofYasharahla]

@@ericschaeffer8288 You're welcome brother💜🙏 OH yes and your book is a valuable keepsake for many of us exjw's.

[@michaelhaigh9182]

@@ShamiAhmathofYasharahla Jesus ain’t God he never said that and more than lightly when he said to Jesus my lord he Thomas probably looked up to the heaven and said my God

[@Episcopalianacolyte]

@Michael Haigh You deny CHRIST based on your assumption? Have you not read that JESUS is Emmanuel (GOD with us) in Mathew chapter 1 which fulfilled Isaiah chapter 9? Why does the FATHER send the HOLY SPIRIT in CHRIST'S name and not in his own in John 14 : 26? You can Google the verses that say GOD is a Trinity. There are many.

[@michaelhaigh9182]

@@Episcopalianacolyte I no my scriptures read rev 3 14 in your bible and it will read Jesus speaking that he is the beginning of the creation of God it wud be very silly to read God is the beginning of his creation ? So no trinity there ?

[@urpo90000]

Love your videos. Keep up the good work🙏

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Thank you!

[@paulinerelph]

One only has to read the oaths they agree to at baptism to know what spirit is directing them. I am sure there are many sincere people amongst them and pray that they will be saved from following men and truly follow Jesus Christ who will set them free. John 14 🙏

[@discoveringlisa486]

What are the oaths they have to take?

[@paulinerelph]

The wording has changed many times over the years, just as their bible translation has also demoted Jesus Christ, they have gradually removed Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit, whilst adding ever stronger baptism vows to the organisation itself. Nothing whatsoever like the simple examples in God's Word.

[@discoveringlisa486]

@@paulinerelph Totally unscriptural then...disgusting

[@alvinlevy5502]

​​@@paulinerelph matt 28 v18 to 20 all Aurthority has been given to me in heaven and earth 🌎 go make disciples of all nations baptising them in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy spirit teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you and lo , I am with you always even to the end of the Age.

[@user-wg1ks6mk6x]

@@alvinlevy5502 "in the name""..........notice be baptised in one name......actes 4:12 " one name has been given under the heavens a,amongs mankind by wich we can be saved........... The apostles ONLY CLAIMED (They claimed they brought forth the NAME OF GOD TO THE NATIONS)THE NAME OF JESUS TO THE NATIONS and ALSO ONLY BAPTISED IN JESUS S NAME...period,end of the story.

[@melleetheka]

OMg! Use their kingdom Interlinear! It’s too easy to prove them wrong with their own literature . Their 1965 edition is great

[@edwardbarnard5830]

Show me how the KIT does this please.

[@richbaker7187]

Don't forget that when the WT cites a "scholar" in order show that the "scholar" believes the SAME interpretation as the WT, but then that very same "scholar" rejects the main tenets of the JW theology. That is the definition of straw man.

[@Chenzo-sb6zu]

Good research brother. Many thanks.

[@trevormanakira5700]

Eric I like the way you search the scriptures, I also think nowadays people are lacking Devine encounters ,if it was though they wouldn't argue with Jesus's deity.Jesus is the Word of God,he is God,he was always there in the bossom of the father

[@anonymousprofessor8866]

I can not understand why folks have a problem with Jesus being God. I know the word trinity does not appear in the Bible but it is very obvious that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit have an uniquely divine relationship. Also God is only a title which based on the scriptures is a title that can be applied to anything worship/revered. If there is only one true God and The Bible is clear Jesus is God John 1:1, then Jesus has to be the True God along with the Father. Which means that God is a title of a divine organization comprised of 3 members whom we are to be baptized in their names. Matthew 28:19

[@timd3895]

Jehovah said _he himself_ will become a stumbling stone and a rock of offense in Isaiah 8:13-14 which is confirmed to be Jesus in 1 Peter 2:4-8 (specifically 8). So that's why, they stumble over the stone of stumbling and get offended by the Rock of offense. 🪨🤴

[@anonymousprofessor8866]

@@timd3895 Honestly JWs are a man led high control group comprised of lowly educated members lacking critical thinking skills to reevaluate their doctrines with integrity. Bible studies with JWs are simply indoctrination sessions that have built-in questions to steer someone away from actual Truth i.e. Jesus.

[@jeremiahrowesr.3130]

I agree with you on that however these three members are not members they are persons because the Bible mentions their personhood. Jesus is not the father the father is not the son and the Holy Spirit is not the father. And I will send you a link that explains this. kzbin.info/www/bejne/m3LZiqB7Z76Mf7c

[@paganinios]

As a Greek Orthodox who speaks the original language of the New testament, i can assure that the man in the video is right. The verse says "ο θρόνος σου ο Θεός " which is translated "your throne oh God".

[@benz8421]

Love your videos mate!

[@xjdub3824]

Everything happens TO a cult member and not because OF the fact they're in a cult.

[@toddhayes3506]

Great Job 👍

[@rockpadstudios]

so glad I don't have to argue about religious nonsense anymore

[@yvonnesmith2335]

The WTs 1984 big Reference Bible cross references Hebrew 1:8 and Psalms 45:6. The governing body knows both scriptures are referring to Jesus.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Wow! That’s info worth saving! Thanks for the share!

[@ScottHindle-qv6mq]

I never hear jws speaking about what Jesus said" you must be born again to even enter the kingdom of god" that is very fundamental truth.

[@777Tralfaz777]

Because JW believe those who accepted the truth in the first century were part of the first fruits, the 144,000, the would rule in that kingdom. They were born from holy spirit, *anointed* by holy spirit, to be part of that group.

[@timd3895]

Interesting. I usually skip Hebrews 1:8-9 because arguing about translations is unproductive, although unbiased non-Trinitarian Jews ✡️ easily prove the standard translation is the correct one (although I'm sure the non-Jewish JW translation committee knows Hebrew better than the Jews 😂). I like to use Isaiah 44:24 + Psalm 102:25-28 + Hebrews 1:10-12 as the easiest and most obvious irrefutable scriptures. Adding Isaiah 44:24 is what makes it irrefutable because YHWH says he did it *by himself* but also that his Son did it? 🤔 One has to be really stubborn and blind to not see it at that point but what can we do? God himself said they will keep on hearing and seeing but but understand. 🤷‍♂️

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Good stuff Tim! Amazingly, they still cling to bizarre scenarios to overlook all of those passages you shared… it’s like they are willing to ignore a plethora of passages that agree with each other, in favor of a far-fetched scenario just because the Watchtower says so

[@scottgrey2877]

By myself not ourselves

[@user-wg1ks6mk6x]

So you think jewish JW translation committee knows hebrew better than the jews????????hilarious statement founded on wind................The NWT "committee" is no more than a copy of spirit medium johannes greber new testament bible..........................the watchtower does not have anyone abble to translate any greek to nothing.............you re very naive at best.......

[@marysalinas3961]

It means that Jehovah God is the Almighty God: Read psalms 83:18 That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah. You alone are the Most High over all the earth.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

When you say “it means that Jehovah…” What is the “it” you are referring to?

[@ricklee5802official.1Rope_fan]

Nary fails to give a proper reply.

[@ghernandez2263]

@@ericschaeffer8288I’m glad you can pick up on mistakes. A little ironic considering you’re a KJV guy. Why don’t we expand on the over 7,000 mistakes made in the KJV Bible?

[@lori342]

They actually believe Jesus in Michael the Archangel. How can they believe that and also that he is greater than all the angels?

[@ericschaeffer8288]

I find it remarkable that they ignore 30 verses that say Jesus is God… while forcing the Bible to say He is Michael…

[@archangeljesus4369]

We believe he is Michael because nothing that mere angel Jesus who fell to his knees and prayed and spoke so many servant like things proves he's God.

[@nurrettemich]

@@archangeljesus4369 First, note that there’s no scripture that ties Jesus to being an angel. But there are a plethora of versus that easily contradicts your viewpoint of it. One being in Revelation 1:8 when God, or Jehovah God as the NWT says, “I am the alpha and omega, beginning and the end,” and then a few verses later in Revelation 1:17, the Son of Man, or Jesus, says, “Fear not, for I am the beginning and the last, and the living one.” That being one example from John himself. Second, Hebrews 2:8-9 says that Jesus was made for a while LESS than the angels, which would signify that there is a level of hierarchy amongst the angels to God. Archangels being the top most tier of angel as Michael was simply described as ONE of the four chief princes in Daniel 10:13. There would be 3 other with this rule and with similar duties amongst the earth as protectors; Daniel 12:1 is actually further proof that he and Jesus are not the same. His role is to “have charge” of the people, not to deliver them. This details the end of times, and is most likely linked to 2 thess 2:6, which would be Michael, the archangel. As he’s already been described as a protector of the people, (think what the angels jobs are, as there are many). When he’s taken out of the way, then the lawless one, or THE AntiChrist, will be revealed. But not before “he who restrain it until he is out of the way” vs 7. Third, Philippians 2:5-10 tells us that “though he was in the form of God, he did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, by taking on the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men.” And as Hebrews would note, that would be less than angels. There’s plenty, and I mean PLENTY of scripture that puts Jesus as God/Son of God. Not to be confused with God the father, who is not Jesus, but is still God. Or God the Spirit, who is not the Father or Jesus, but is still God. All the same God, but all different aspects of such. All the same at the same time, in different forms at the same time. It is a unique relationship that God has with Himself. Elohim, is a plural form of God, yet He is still one God. I urge you to compare the OG Greek with the NWT to find the flaws, as well as the other translations that have been looked at by people who are scholarly in the original languages. And see the manipulation that comes with being apart of the WTS, ie what you can read, what you can watch about the WTS, etc. Matthew 10:16, “Behold, i am sending you out as sheep in the midst of wolves, so be as wise as serpents, yet as innocent as doves.” They seek only to steal souls, so that they might not see salvation from Christ. Who is the only one to give this free gift; by having FAITH in Him, and by the GRACE of God.

[@archangeljesus4369]

@@nurrettemich That mere angel Jesus who fell on his face and prayed and relied on God for strength will never in a billion years be Jehovah.

[@archangeljesus4369]

@@nurrettemich Any person that relies on an angel for help like in Luke 22:43 is not an all powerful God.

[@thetrap6073]

"Jehovah's chosen organization" is still waiting for "new light"... but when they get it, they'll give you that kings name. Maybe the sand has to shift before new light is revealed.

[@thronesdominion]

The light they seek is lucifer, this organization and the masons are closed related in spirit evil, there passover ceremony is one of the satanic rituals done today in open modern world and it seems no one sees it or understands. if it was done in the middle ages these people will be burn at the sake with right reason.

[@richb.48]

I have a question that addresses the validity of what you said, and if it was really "wrong". You said the words, "on the shelf". So, are those 2 other fringe translations even in publication anymore? If they are not on the shelf, then what you said really isn't wrong.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Agreed…

[@Tomas-cambs]

Over the years I’ve seen lots of these types of videos where one Chrisian attacks other Christians for some reason or other. The protagonist expressing their viewpoint has a ‘knowledge based’ faith and is still developing the Christian character. A faith clothed with Holy Spirit leaves no room for anger, malice, slander, and the like, but is manifest by a compassionate heart, kindness, meekness, and patience - Col. 3:5 - 16. ESV. Tears are a language, God understands - Rev 7:17

[@ericschaeffer8288]

For starters, Jehovah’s Witnesses are not Christians… secondly, can you tell me where I spoke in anger or malice?… lastly, what would you say to Paul who said: ”Let God’s curse fall on anyone, including us or even an angel from heaven, who preaches a different kind of Good News than the one we preached to you. I say again what we have said before: If anyone preaches any other Good News than the one you welcomed, let that person be cursed.“ ‭‭Galatians‬ ‭1‬:‭8‬-‭9‬ ‭

[@Tomas-cambs]

@@ericschaeffer8288 Your inability to see the good in individuals is a trap many fall into. I suggest you re-read the message to the seven churches in Revelation and see how discernment is used to show how those who had the spirit and those who did not.

[@Tomas-cambs]

@@ericschaeffer8288 Again, you show yourself as a man of limited thinking ability. Many JW's are very good Christians as you will find in many different denominations. The work of the Holy Spirit does not stop because a person does not fully understand 100% God's plan.

[@wissanor]

might as well be debating on whether Gandalf the grey or Gandalf the white is real 🤦🏽‍♂️

[@randyg.7940]

of course he is !!!! havnt you ever seen Lord of the Rings???

[@wissanor]

@@randyg.7940 😂😂

[@sweatt4237]

You dont believe you are a created being?

[@randyg.7940]

@@sweatt4237 Sure I do. What does that have to do with this discussion? before you answer, keep in mind, that I asked a muslin and a Hindu the same question. please be mindful of your answer.

[@sweatt4237]

@@randyg.7940 Well I was actually asking the OP but I'm glad to hear you believe in a creator. God Bless.

[@1962diamond]

i am so surprised that after so many thousands of years we are still trying to make sense of tribal gods that evolved by people rationalizing that they truely exist.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

I’m thankful that I experience the God you say evolved… He is a Just and Holy God who speak to His children. Hallelujah!

[@1962diamond]

@@ericschaeffer8288 i agree emotions and emotional perceptions can be very comforting to people. i am happy you found yours! as for evolved i mean how humans made gods and their gods changed with time and needs of humans.

[@777Tralfaz777]

If Jesus is a representation of God, then he is not God. Heb 1:8 is showing God back Jesus' rulership. As it was God who anointed Jesus above his partners. What did the apostles believe? (1 Corinthians 8:6) there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.

[@kevinfromcanada4379]

God subsists in three persons-the Son came as the representative of the Godhead. If I'm the representative of my family does that mean that I'm not part of the family? You've got faulty logic. Heb 1:8 - The Father calls Jesus God and identifies him as the King (ie. the ruler of humanity). Therefore, Jesus isn't an angel since humanity has not been subjected to angels (Heb 2:5). 1Cor 8:6 - Paul is taking the Shema* and applying it to the Father and the Son. Paul believed that God is triune. * The Shema is from Deu 6:4 which in Greek is Ἄκουε, Ισραηλ· κύριος ὁ θεὸς ἡμῶν κύριος εἷς ἐστιν· (Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one). Paul takes this verse and applies it to both the Father and Son-giving the title Theos to the Father and Kurios to the Son. Now for JW's, if they were consistent (which they aren't) they would translate 1Cor 8:6 like this: "there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Jehovah, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him."

[@777Tralfaz777]

@@kevinfromcanada4379 Look up the word Godhead, and find out where it came from, and what it originally meant. Jesus did represent God. God sent him. The Jews always believed God was one person, and so did the first century Christians.

[@kevinfromcanada4379]

@@777Tralfaz777 Godhead: According to Etymologyonline, Godhead originated from "c. 1200, 'divine nature, deity, divinity,' from god + Middle English -hede (see -head). Along with maidenhead, the sole survival of this form of the suffix. Old English had godhad "divine nature." Parallel form godhood is from early 13c., now chiefly restricted to 'state or condition of being a god.'" The Jews did believe that God was multi-personal. Daniel Boyarin, a non-Christian Jewish scholar, points out that "one of the most characteristic differences between Judaism and Christianity as we know them is the belief in or denial of complexity within the godhead, but in these early centuries there were non-Christian Jews who believed in God's Word, Wisdom, or even Son as a 'second God'" (Borderlines, 89-90). In other words, as Boyarin states, "the Trinity and incarnation are not some crazy, pagan influences on Christianity, but rather that they lie at the deepest roots of the Jewish heart of the Jesus movement.”[1] So yes, Jews did believe that the one God was multi personal. They got that from verses like Gen 1:26, etc. The NT writers were thoroughly trinitarian. *Which is why Paul takes the Shema and applies it to both the Father and the Son in 1Cor 8:6... the verse you have failed to deal with.* [1] “A Conversation with Daniel Boyarin,” University of Toronto Journal of Jewish Thought 1, no. 5 (2015), 4.

[@777Tralfaz777]

​@@kevinfromcanada4379 You said "Godhead: According to Etymologyonline, Godhead originated from "c. 1200, 'divine nature, deity, divinity,' from god + Middle English -hede (see -head)." Yes. It has to do with Godship. Yet trinitarians seem to use it to denote the committee of the trinity. It had no such intent. The Jews believed God is one person. They also understood others were rightly termed gods. But Jews did not, and do not believe God is multiple persons. Saying otherwise is an attempt to rewrite history. And neither did the apostles, who were also Jews. You said "Which is why Paul takes the Shema and applies it to both the Father and the Son in 1Cor 8:6... the verse you have failed to deal with. " Because you were totally off base changing the word "Lord" into "Jehovah". God made Jesus Lord of the Christian congregation. Yet God is the highest title, and only one is referred to as God there. No mention of a holy spirit at all. Ironically, you used this verse, yet it speaks against your belief. (1 Corinthians 8:6) there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him. God created through, and saved us through Jesus, but only one is God!

[@777Tralfaz777]

@@kevinfromcanada4379 The dude you quoted said "Jews who believed in God's Word, Wisdom, " What Jews, other than Christians used "Word" as a title? Regarding Wisdom: Prov 8:22 Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way, The earliest of his achievements of long ago. 23 From ancient times I was installed, From the start, from times earlier than the earth. 24 When there were no deep waters, I was brought forth, So, Jesus had a beginning. And thus, ironically, you defeated your own argument once again.

[@barbunderdahl4873]

Their Bible shows who Jesus is: God. Start with Rev. 22:20 He that bears witness of these things says, 'Yes: I am coming quickly.'" "Amen!, Come, Lord Jesus." Rev. 22:12-13 "Look! I am coming quickly, and the reward I give is with me, to render to each one as his work is." "I am the Alpha and Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end." Rev. 21:6-7 "And he said to me: "They have come to pass! I am the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. To anyone thirsting I will give from the fountain of the water of life free. Anyone conquering will inherit these things, and I shall be his God, and he will be my son." Jesus is God, by there own book!

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Amen!

[@roeltingzon758]

Not so fast!

[@johncolage1651]

Eric Schaeffer The truth is, Jesus never claimed to be God, but he repeatedly spoke of himself as "God's Son." Even his enemies acknowledged this. (John 10:36; 19:7) Jesus was ever conscious of exalting the Father and subordinating himself to him, as he confessed. "The Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he beholds the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son also does in like manner. I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him that sent me." Again, he said: "I am a representative from him, and that One sent me forth." He also said: "From God I came forth and am here."(John 5:19, 30; 7:28, 29; 8:42) Jesus never even suggested that he was God or was equal to him. So to teach such a thing dishonors Jesus.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Actually they saw Jesus being God’s Son as making Him equal with God. Read Philippians 2 to help you with everything else you wrote. Jesus was very careful with His words when referring to Himself as God or the Son of God but His message was clear… that is why His Disciples and the Early Church called Him God and worshiped Him.

[@ucanliv4ever]

Eric Schaefer, actually no... Phillipians 2 contradicts your position. This is from the margin of the New World Translation: although he was existing in God’s form: The Greek expression rendered “form” (mor·pheʹ) basically refers to “nature; appearance; shape; likeness.” Jesus was a spirit person just as “God is a Spirit.” (Joh 4:24 and study note) The same Greek term is used of Jesus’ taking “a slave’s form” when he “became flesh,” or became a human.​-Joh 1:14; Php 2:7.

[@johncolage1651]

@@ericschaeffer8288 Matthew 4:10---Then Jesus said to him: "Go away, Satan! For it is written: It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service. Eric, you are an enemy of the Bible and immature to discuss Bible principles.

[@timd3895]

@@ucanliv4ever NWT 😂 thanks for the laugh. Check the Kingdom Interlinear Philippians 2:9 and confirm Jesus was given the name above every -other- name. Then compare Philippians 2:10-11 vs Isaiah 45:23 in the NWT 1984 (aka "Reference" version which has better footnotes) and read Isaiah 45:23 in the LXX (found in footnote) which is directly quoted in Philippians 2:10-11, and pay attention to how the word _me_ changes in Isaiah to _Jesus_ in Philippians. There's a reason NWT didn't list this as a reference verse...

[@timd3895]

@@johncolage1651 JW always reading without any context. Jesus said to not worship Satan. He never said he himself is not God. Jesus _is_ worshipped many times. Even in your pxrverted Bible he is still worshipped in Rev 5:13-14, receives prayers in Rev 5:8, and in Deuteronomy 32:43 in Reference version (1984) in footnote it's confirmed this is the source of Hebrews 1:6 quote which was for Jehovah in Deut and said "let all the angels of God *worship* him" in the LXX and you cannot change the quote to obeisance because it's said to Jehovah. Also Paul prayed to Jesus in 2 Cor 12:8. Jesus said to pray to him in John 14:14 (Kingdom Interlinear). And many other references of Christians calling on the name of Jesus which means prayer.

[@kalasatwater2224]

If he's deity he didn't do a good job of making it very clear instead of confusing

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Pretty clear to me: JESUS IS CALLED: "mighty God" (Isaiah 9:6) "God with us" (Matthew 1:23) "my Lord and my God" (John 20:28) "great God and Savior" (Titus 2:13) "God and Savior" (2 Peter 1:1) JESUS SAID: "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58) "the Father and I are one" (John 10:30) "he that sees Me, sees the Father" (John 14:9) "I am the First and the Last" (Rev. ‪1:17-18‬) "I am the Alpha and Omega" (Rev. ‪22:12-13‬) JESUS DID THINGS ONLY RESERVED FOR JEHOVAH: Raise Himself from the dead. (John ‪2:19-21‬, ‪10:18‬) Receives worship. (Mat. 2:11,14:33, 28:9, John 9:38, Heb. 1:6) Forgives sins (Mark 2:5-7) Only name by which to be saved (Acts ‪4:12‬) These things do not make any sense, unless of course, Jesus is God.

[@roeltingzon758]

Those bible texts can easily be refuted one by one.

[@kalasatwater2224]

@@roeltingzon758 Yup but they're too brainwashed to even bother wasting your time with them

[@Episcopalianacolyte]

GOD will be your throne for ever. I have a serious problem, that seems to be saying that JESUS is superior to GOD. You made an excellent observation that all the translators are believe lrs in the Trinity.

[@randallwittman2720]

Evangelium nach Johannes (S. Schulz, 1975); 1978: "and godlike sort was the Logos" - Das Evangelium nach Johannes, by Johannes Schneider, Berlin 1985: "So the Word was divine" - The Original New Testament, by Hugh J. Schonfield.[18] 1993: "The Word was God, in readiness for God from day one." - The Message, by Eugene H. Peterson.[19] 1998: "and what God was the Word also was" - This translation follows Professor Francis J. Moloney, The Gospel of John, ed. Daniel J. Harrington.[20] 2017: "and the Logos was god" - The New Testament: A Translation, by David Bentley Hart.[21]

[@randallwittman2720]

They seem to have the correct understanding already. It lines up with verses like Proverbs 8:22 “Jehovah framed me first in line, foremost of his works in the past. 23 Of old I was constituted, at first before the origins of earth.” (Bylington) “Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way, The earliest of his achievements of long ago.” 23 From ancient times I was installed,..” The tile of “Only Begotten” seems to indicate he was begotten, born, created before everything else which is also indicated in John 1:18 “No man has seen God at any time; the only-begotten god who is at the Father’s side is the one who has explained Him.” This scripture indicates that God created Jesus as a god, or spirit person. Notice the lower case “god” when it speaks of Jesus. Some might say “see it calls Jesus a god!” The bible also calls Satan a god. (2 Cor 4:4 ) The bible says that Jesus is the image of God and that if you have seen Jesus, you have seen God. Naturally, because he was created in God’s image. Man was also created in God’s image, meaning we are intelligent beings who have the ability to reflects God’s qualities of love etc. Jesus and God are one! Just as Jesus and his disciples are one. John 17:21,22 “so that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in union with us, so that the world may believe that you sent me. 22 I have given them the glory that you have given me, in order that they may be one just as we are one” Seems pretty straight forward that God’s son is talking to his Father. Sons are born after their fathers. Plain logic.

[@azazelsgoat]

I was a JW for 38 years before I disassociated 2 years ago. It is apparent to me that the writer of Hebrews thought Jesus was God. That realisation thrilled me for a while. I was taught as a JW that Paul wrote Hebrews but found out that the writer is unknown. In fact, scholars can only confirm Paul wrote 7 of the letters attributed to him. This shocked me at first. So while Hebrews 1:8 says what you and the JW want it to say in your respective bibles the writer's background, agenda, credentials etc cannot be verified. This makes bible "truth" relative to the interpretation of bible translators

[@melleetheka]

JW’s think a lot like Muslims. Not many realize this but it’s 100% true. There are several comparisons that a huge even down to “new light”

[@ericschaeffer8288]

I often thought the same thing. Both Muslims and Jehovahs Witnesses have to either ignore or change Bible passages to defend their doctrine

[@melleetheka]

@@ericschaeffer8288 their culture is similar too but Islam is far worse

[@ericschaeffer8288]

@@melleetheka yes, Islam kills you for leaving… JWs just cut you off

[@archangeljesus4369]

As for Jesus not being God we do think a lot like Muslims except we're less violent and not crashing to world trades.

[@archangeljesus4369]

@@ericschaeffer8288 We're peaceful

[@missmartpants2269]

Who is the King that fulfilled Psalm? Jesus King of Kings amen? God bless!🌱🌾

[@johncolage1651]

Even a Christian cannot brush aside the worship of Jehovah as God. In Revelation 1:5 the Son of God called himself "Jesus Christ, 'The Faithful Witness.'" When on earth as a man he was a Jew, an Israelite, to whose nation the words of Isaiah 43:10 were written: "'You are my witnesses, 'is the utterance of Jehovah, 'even my servant whom I have chosen.'" Jesus demonstrated that he was a faithful and true witness of Jehovah God. His genuine disciples today must be the same kind of witnesses, Jehovah's.

[@kylew5456]

You woefully misinterpret scripture. Stop listening to those satanic men in NY, and wake up to the truth.

[@timothystoneham3234]

Jeremiah 17:10 NWT ( Jehovah) 10 I, Jehovah, am searching the heart, Examining the innermost thoughts, To give to each one according to his ways, According to the fruitage of his works. Revelation 2:23 NWT ( Jesus) I am the one who searches the innermost thoughts and hearts, and I will give to you individually according to your deeds

[@DEADn1]

I am sure a JW has another version to squeal out of such a comparison?

[@timothystoneham3234]

@@DEADn1 To maneuver on to other scriptures and disregard this poof text is most likely, even to redefine the words from its definition. But so far not one translation that we can see has a different perspective from who Jesus is claiming to be within these two scriptures or proof text. Edited: It's possible for them to have a hidden version only they will share privately to each other though?.... Yeah in a way your right

[@DEADn1]

@@timothystoneham3234 In my dealings with JW they also seek those rabbit trails even if they make no sense. That is why I asked what I did.

[@ucanliv4ever]

Timothy Stoner, so if I say the same thing as you, does that mean I am Timothy Stoneham?

[@timothystoneham3234]

@@ucanliv4ever Actually it doesn't really matter if you say the same things as me or claiming to be me, because the standard of Jesus claiming to be him ( Jehovah) is much higher then our own standards. The devil can say the same things as me and address himself with my name in his deceitful manner, but he can never search the innermost thoughts and heart of a person. We know that the devil is a liar, we know that you and I are sinners but Jesus is neither a sinner nor a liar. Making Jesus claim or statement to carry out more weight and having a higher standard from the scriptures that I posted above.

[@wilbursmith2955]

I wish they would challenge me. If a JW knows me , he flees in terror.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Lol! Keep gettin ‘em brother!

[@777Tralfaz777]

You appear delusional. You are so powerful in your speaking and teaching that you cause terror in others? Egotistical much?

[@markusbrauns4274]

Calling me an apostate, you better have all your affairs in order, get my drift

[@ghernandez2263]

Ik very little of the JW but I do know we shouldn’t celebrate pagan holidays is there a reason most people celebrate these holidays?

[@randallwittman2720]

The Godhead and Godhood Christians do love their spiritual jargon, especially when it is has the epic overtones of the King James Version. Jargon is only useful when we properly know what it means. One such theological word found in and popularised by the KJV is “godhead.” The problem I have with it is that it is used synonymously for the Holy Trinity. As far scripture is concerned it isn’t. The word “godhead” appears only three times in the KJV at Acts 17:29, Romans 1:20 and Colossians 2:9. [1]The word is from Middle English and means the same as godhood, that is, the state of being god. The -head suffix is the same as -hood which we still use in modern English in words like fatherhood, the state of being a father. [2]Three different Koine Greek words, theion, theiotēs, and theotēs, in order of their appearance in the KJV, were translated as “godhead”. Modern translations of the Bible do not use godhead but tend to use words like deity, the divine nature, or divine being depending on the context. The Greeks used such words to talk about god without referring to any specific one in particular. This particularly makes sense in Acts 17 at the Areopagus where Paul was addressing a Greek audience and presenting his arguments on the true nature of God. Even in somewhat formal English today we refer to God in sort of an impersonal manner by calling him the Deity. So where did this association with the Trinity come from? On account of the continued popularity of the KJV, the word “godhead” continues to stay in currency. The word was actually introduced into English translations by John Wycliffe, the great English Bible translator and Reformer. [3]As early as the 12th century B.B. Warfield remarks that it was used as a technical term used to refer to the ousia or the substance of God in the doctrine of the Holy Trinity. Since this predated Wycliffe it was probably an influence on why in his translation of the New Testament the term. It was chosen because of its Trinitarian connotations. The KJV was heavily influenced by Wycliffe’s why is why the godhead was probably used in the translation. Its popularity continued in later documents like Thirty-Nine articles of the Church of England and the Westminster confession. Even though godhead is used to refer to Trinitarian doctrine, in the KJV it is used to translate words that have nothing to do with later theological developments. Even the basic meaning of the word is not Trinitarian and just means being divine. I fully recognise the meaning of a word is determined by how it is used and the word has for a long time assumed that technical theological meaning. All I am saying is whenever we pick up the KJV and read the word, we should not immediately assume it is a reference to the Trinity. [1]

[@nuniegomez2970]

I left and never looked back and I’m glad to say I never did read the bible all the way through like they kept saying to do.

[@777Tralfaz777]

You said "I’m glad to say I never did read the bible all the way through" And this is a badge of honor???????

[@javiushampton6537]

I finally found my father after looking for 28 years, through ancestry DNA only to find out my father and my entire extended family are jw. Idk what to do I know I have the truth but it’s like they refuse to see it

[@777Tralfaz777]

The Bible is the touchstone. JW believe what the Bible teaches.

[@markusbrauns4274]

In their eyes, you are an apostate

[@777Tralfaz777]

@@markusbrauns4274 You do not know what an apostate is, do you?

[@gennaropannelli7138]

Anchio ho una figlia tg ,gli ho fatto vedere i video della commissione reale Australiana sui pedofili tg all'interno delle congregazioni 3 video gli anziani che scaricano le responsabilita sulla filiare la filiare messa alle strette scarica sul corpo direttivo ,uno del corpo direttivo Jackson e Australiano depone con dificolta 1006 casi accertati ,Mia figlia dice che e tutto vero pero non vuole lasciare i t g e non vuole ascoltare altre cose sulla societa WATCHTOWER, si rifiuta tappandosi le orecchie da L'ITALIA SALUTI.

[@gennaropannelli7138]

@@markusbrauns4274 no ai loro acchi e uno del mondo ,apostata e uno che va via dai tg .

[@roeltingzon758]

Hebrews 1:8 as translated by 'Trinitarian' scholars could clearly contradict some portions of the bible where Jesus plainly says he has 'a God' as in Revelation 3:12 and also earlier as in John 20:17 right after Christ was resurrected he tells Mary Magdalene and in no uncertain terms that he's not God because he said that he not had yet ascended to his Father whom he called "my God". God cannot have a god.

[@777Tralfaz777]

Heb 1:8 is a quote from Ps 45:6 that says "’ĕ·lō·hîm kis·’ă·ḵā", in English "God your throne is" At Heb 1:8 "ho thronos sou ho theos eis": English "The throne of you the God is" So, it appears the NWT is closer to the literal word for word intent. Why some say "O God", I am not sure. As the same definite article is use before throne and God.

[@pfevrier01]

Johannes Greber Bible. A formal Catholic priest. Starting his own bible and if you do some research you will find that he was into the occult.

[@lwmaynard5180]

Most Protestants have a Catholic Doctrine foundation ? And still retain the pagan practices of the Catholic teachings ? The CROSS , IMMORTALITY OF THE SOUL .? EASTER . etc

[@pfevrier01]

@lwmaynard5180 there was pastot Charles T Russell. On his graveyard, from 1916, there the watchtower builded a pyramid. So, jw arr liying about the cross, but they are accepting a pyramid? A pyramid with masonic symbolson it So. There's a connection from watchtower with the free masons. The free masons are hating the churches. They would like to destroy every church. But they have a connection with JW and watchtower. And.,that's a fact!

[@pfevrier01]

@lwmaynard5180 Johannes Greber is excommunicated by the church because of his occultism. The watchtower and the Jw took over the Johannes Greber Bible., and thereby his occult practice. Yep!

[@havolinehavoline4079]

Honestly both sides of this debate have valid points. verses in the in the bible and things that jesus said and did support both arguments. It's all about how you want to interpret it. This debate is pointless

[@renatovasquez6041]

1st, Cor,15:24-28,Jesus will handover the power given by Jehovah, that is why the Apostles did not hesitate to preach that Jehovah raised up Jesus, Acts, 5:28-31,

[@ericschaeffer8288]

How does that address this video? But to answer your remark, it will hep you to understand 1 Corinthians 15… kzbin.info/www/bejne/onSuhGWdmZmsfqs

[@level_earth_observer1986]

I'm not a jw. And I know that christ is not equal to his father.

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

Functional subjection does not necessitate ontological inferiority.

[@JasonWhite-ti1ej]

Equal in essence and nature

[@renatovasquez6041]

Most Christian theologists were unfortunately stabbed by Jesus SWORD, his divisive figurative statements, @ Matthew, 10:34-35, the apostles never said, Jesus himself raised the temple in three days,@Acts, 5:28-31, /Deut, 32:39 /1st, Sam, 2:6-7 /2nd,Kings, 5:7,

[@nicklewis9299]

I noticed this man went from Hebrews 1:4 to Hebrew 1:6 but I wonder why he skipped Hebrews 1:5🤣😂 Hebrews 1:5 New International Version For to which of the angels did God ever say, “You are my Son; today I have become your Father"? Or again, “I will be his Father, and he will be my Som That concludes my thought of the day

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Yep… Father, Son, and Spirit= Trinity

[@nicklewis9299]

@@ericschaeffer8288 this was God having a conversation with his son, where was the Holy Spirit even mentioned in that verse .. the holy spirit is not even mentioned in that chapter, it seems like if they was a Trinity, the holy spirit would have got some play or talk or something right, just a little acknowledgement 🤣😂 but keep on pushing your lie and your wicked false teachings, you know you will have to answer to Jesus for it👍

[@ericschaeffer8288]

@@nicklewis9299 I am simply sharing what the Bible says… and it says “Jesus is God” many times… I am curious, are saying the Holy Spirit does not talk?

[@nicklewis9299]

@@ericschaeffer8288 but why didn't you share Hebrews 1:5 because that actually says that Jehovah at this point in time "today" he became his father, but if they have always been a trinity forever, he wouldn't have had to become his father on this day, he would have always been his father right? Well no I didn't say the Holy Spirit didn't talk, but I'm just curious if Jehovah God Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit were all one, why didn't the Holy Spirit get any play in this conversation, why didn't the Holy Spirit get mentioned in that whole chapter at all that's my poiny, he didn't even get mentioned, more less talk to Jesus, but if they're a trinity, the Holy Spirit should have got some kind of acknowledgment or infant in that conversation in that chapter somewhere but it can't be found only Jehovah God acknowledging that on this particular day Jehovah God became his father, but the day before he was not his father because he became his father on this particular day.. the day before this happened Jesus was considered to be just like the other Angels, until Jesus was given a name greater than the angels by Jehovah God ( or the father) and they was told to worship him by Jehovah God, I'm just wondering how could they be a trinity if the Holy Spirit didn't get mentioned and the day before this happened Jehovah God or the father didn't consider him to be his father, because obviously on this day he became his father but I ask where was the Holy Spirit during the coronation, he's part of this false wicked 3 person God but he didnt give any words or take any part in this joyous ceremony, not even a congratulations, hey I'm glad you're part of me now, im glad you're part of us, he didn't even get mentioned in the chapter

[@randallwittman2720]

3. God's God A very serious problem with the Trinitarian translation is the resulting implications of their translation. "But to the Son, [God] says, Your throne, 'O God, is forever and ever. The sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of your kingdom/kingship. You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; therefore God, your God, has anointed you with the oil of gladness beyond your partners.'" (Hebrews 1:8-9) The result of this translation is that God has a God and God's God anoints God so that God's God would make God to be above God's peers. It's unbelievably ludicrous in multiple ways. Even further, if we follow the "O God" translation to it's logical conclusion, we have even more preposterous consequences. Consider verses such as Psalm 43:4, "I shall praise You, O God, my God." In Scripture, when anyone addresses the God of Israel as "O God" it means they are acknowledging that the addressee is their God. For this reason, it is absurd to suggest God the Father would address anyone as "O God" since it would imply the son is the Father's God. The Trinitarian translation results in a situation where God addressed someone else as God and then says that God's God anoints God so that God will be above God's peers. Let the reader appreciate the utter implausibility of such a claim. 4. Translation Inconsistency Another problem with the Trinitarian claim is translation inconsistency. At Hebrews 1:8-9, the Greek term ho theos ("the god") occurs three times. The term ho theos ("the God") is the usual Greek way of referring to God in the Bible and our English word "God" without the article is the normal way to translate this Greek term with the understanding that capital "G" God is an English way of referring to "the God" (although we sometimes translate it as "the God"). Trinitarians inconsistently translate ho theos as "O God" in verse 8 but as "God" in verse 9. More technically, they are inconsistently interpreting ho theos as "O God" in verse 8 but as "the God" in verse 9. Your throne ho theos to the age of the age A scepter of righteousness the scepter of your Kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness Therefore ho theos, ho theos of you, has anointed You With the oil of gladness above your fellows. Now observe how Trinitarian translators interpret/translate ho theos in one way at verse 8 but another way in verse 9. Your throne O God to the age of the age A scepter of righteousness the scepter of your Kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness Therefore the God, the God of you, has anointed You With the oil of gladness above your fellows. The Greek term ho theos normally means "the God" but Trinitarians would have it that here it means "O God." But there is no reason to translate this Greek term in this manner except to promote a man-made tradition, that is, the doctrine of the Trinity. It should be clear to every reasonable person that the above facts demonstrate that something is very amiss about Trinitarian claims concerning Hebrews 1:8-9 (Psalm 45:6-7). Trinitarians admit that "Your throne is God" is a grammatically viable translation. Some also confess it also makes contextual sense. And their standard objection to this translation is based on a naïve presumption. Hebrews 1:8-9 quotes Psalm 45:6-7 which is about an ancient Davidic King on his wedding day. If these words identify Jesus as "God" then they also identify another human being as "God" who lived hundreds of years before Jesus. And if Jesus is being identified as God, then the Father is being identified as God's God which is ridiculous. The implications of the "O God" rendering catapults the passage into absurdity. By definition, God cannot have someone else as his God when there is only one God. And again, it is also clear that Trinitarians are inconsistently translating ho theos in two different ways within this selfsame passage. Even further, it is clear that this chapter is about a man who became superior to the angels (1:4) not the one God who always is/was superior to His angels. Facts like these show us that the Trinitarian claim is based on spin rather than facts.

[@mannyflores470]

That's the whole point of Psalm 45:6-7 to show that this king prophetically speaking is no ordinary king but is called God WHO IS THE anointed messiah. Even with that mess up they can't get away from hebrews 1:10-12 where the father calls him LORD from psalm 102:25-27. Or even hebrews 1:5 showing he's the begotten of the father but in a Messianic sense quoting psalm 2:7...... read psalm 89 as well. Jesus is begotten from the father in the king Messianic sense because the throne was promised to an earthly king not an angel which they also believe. Read hebrews 1 thinking of jesus as the messiah and you will see how this human messiah is exalted equal to God...All of hebrews destroys their ideology.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Amen!! Right on point!

[@randallwittman2720]

Biblical Hermeneutics Was the text of Matthew 28:19 changed? Asked 9 years, 10 months ago Modified 2 years, 11 months ago Viewed 84k times 28 Scholars such as F. C. Conybeare1 have claimed that the Trinitarian baptismal formula of Matthew 28:19 was not original to the text of Matthew. Matt 28:19 (NIV) 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, In other words, was the phrase in the text "In the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" inserted at a later date (say, for example, by the First Nicean Council of AD 325)? The correct reading of Matthew 28:19 appears to be in Luke 24:47: Luke 24:47 (NIV) 47 and repentance for the forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem. Another question

[@glencoward]

question for those that believe in the trinity, so satan attempted to get God to do an act of worship to him? when he was created by god and when he was dying he looked up to heaven and said god forgive them for they no not what they have done. please help me understand. thanks

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Glen, I believe many questions about the Trinity (more specifically, Jesus’ Deity) can be seen in light of Philippians 2:6-8 where Jesus emptied Himself of His Deity and took on the role of a servant. He came down to earth and was obedient to the Father. He became our perfect example... praying to the Father, watching to see where the Father is at work, relying on the Father, etc. And yes, He was even exposed to temptation as we are (except He never sinned). In other words, we have to remember that Jesus was in a temporary lower position while He was here on Earth. This is shown in John 17:5 where He says, "And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was." Hope that helps

[@glencoward]

@@ericschaeffer8288 thanks for responding appreciate the response

[@johnryan1798]

Are we as humans part of the trinity? Jesus did ask of his father through prayer that his disciples will be one with him, as he is with his Father.

[@anonymousprofessor8866]

There are 2 problems that are seriously frustrating with debating JWs!! 1. JWs debate using the Watchtower false teachings, while true Christians debate using just scriptures from the Holy Bible. 2. When a JWs is ask a critical thinking question they know is going to prove they're in a false religion they'll simple just ignore or evade the question entirely. Then start using circular reasoning. I can ask any JWs two very simple questions that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the JWs group is in fact a false religion. Do you or any JWs have the courage for the challenge?? Keep in mind Only 2 very simple questions. 😊

[@johnryan1798]

@@anonymousprofessor8866 Again, the 2 questions being... Do Jehovah's Witnesses engage in war? If so, which side do they believe God is on?

[@nojw7940]

HLC-Members give medical "advice," actually dictate, without being licensed to do so. Simultaneously they threaten their members with eternal annihilation. They blackmail them into deadly decisions. TAKE LEGAL ACTION against all HLC-Members. Make them LEGALLY ACCOUNTABLE/RESPONSIBLE! File a CRIMINAL CHARGE against HLC Members! Don‘t argue, do NOT „discuss“! FILE a CRIMINAL CHARGE against HLC-Member, the legally responsible of your Branch and each of the Governing Body Members.

[@joJo56976]

In daniel 11:1 an angel says that he stood up to strengthen and fortify him (Mikael). So there is NO WAY Mikael is Jesus.

[@randallwittman2720]

Act 5:30 The God of our fathers raised Jesus, whom you killed by hanging him on a tree. Romans 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 1Corinthians 15:15 We are even found to be misrepresenting God, because we testified about God that he raised Christ, whom he did not raise if it is true that the dead are not raised. 1Peter1:21 who through Him believe in God, who raised Him from the dead and gave Him glory, so that your faith and hope are in God.

[@Tomas-cambs]

Do you know what the word "representation" means? Do you have a good dictionary in your library? Where you once a Jehovah's witnesses? Would you call yourself a Christian today?

[@samanthagoddard9476]

Look up Johannes Grebber’s influence on the NWT, who he was and what he became.

[@jahtruthdefender]

Yeah look up truthfully and you will find he had *no influence* whatsoever over the NWT

[@archieliburd3794]

BROTHERMAN, Jesus is the first born of all creations. GOD MADE JESUS AND USED HIM TO MAKE ALL OTHER THINGS. For example,, IF the Toyota company makes a robot and use it to make all its vehicles, who made the vehicles, the robot or the Toyota company? ( Hebrews 3 v 4) IF the Holy SPIRIT is a person, 1 Corinthians 11 v 3 says, THE HEAD OF EVERY MAN IS CHRIST, THE HEAD OF THE WOMAN IS THE MAN AND THE HEAD OF CHRIST IS GOD, SO if the Holy SPIRIT is a person, who is he the head of? IF THE HOLY SPIRIT IS A PERSON, HOWCOME JESUS DID NOT TELL THE PHARASEES THAT HE HAS THREE WITNESSES? He told them he has two witnesses, the father is one witness and he is the other.( John 8 v 15 to 17) SO AGAIN, IF JESUS IS GOD, DONT YOU THINK HE WOULD KNOW? SO WHY THEN DID JESUS SAY AT MARK 10 v 18, WHY DO YOU CALL ME ( me) GOOD, NOBODY GOOD BUT ONE, THAT IS GOD. does that sound to you like Jesus is God? HOWCOME GOD HAVE TO GIVE JESUS EVERYTHING IF JESUS IS GOD? JOHN 5 v 26 says, THE FATHER HAS LIFE IN HIMSELF, SO HE HAS ( GRANTED) THE SON TO HAVE LIFE IN HIMSELF, SO WHAT HAPPENED BEFORE THE SON WAS ( GRANTED) TO HAVE LIFE IN HIMSELF? IF SOMEONE GRANT YOU SOMETHING, OBVIOUSLY YOU DID NOT HAVE IT BEFORE? CAN YOU PLEASE EXPLAIN 1 CORINTHIANS 15 v 24 to 28 to the people you are misleading?

[@melleetheka]

So if God is Jesus’s throne then Jesus is king over the father because a throne isn’t the king

[@oweltingzon4470]

Read 1 Corinthians 15:27 & 28

[@melleetheka]

@@oweltingzon4470 Jesus is Yahweh but not the father.

[@oweltingzon4470]

@@melleetheka nope...not by a long shot. You have no proofs. Do not promote those erroneous ideas.

[@randallwittman2720]

Col. 1:15, 16, RS: “He [Jesus Christ] is the image of the invisible God, the first-born of all creation; for in him all things were created, in heaven and on earth.” In what sense is Jesus Christ “the first-born of all creation”? (1) Trinitarians say that “first-born” here means prime, most excellent, most distinguished; thus Christ would be understood to be, not part of creation, but the most distinguished in relation to those who were created. If that is so, and if the Trinity doctrine is true, why are the Father and the holy spirit not also said to be the firstborn of all creation? But the Bible applies this expression only to the Son. According to the customary meaning of “firstborn,” it indicates that Jesus is the eldest in Jehovah’s family of sons. (2) Before Colossians 1:15, the expression “the firstborn of” occurs upwards of 30 times in the Bible, and in each instance that it is applied to living creatures the same meaning applies-the firstborn is part of the group. “The firstborn of Israel” is one of the sons of Israel; “the firstborn of Pharaoh” is one of Pharaoh’s family; “the firstborn of beast” are themselves animals. What, then, causes some to ascribe a different meaning to it at Colossians 1:15? Is it Bible usage or is it a belief to which they already hold and for which they seek proof? (3) Does Colossians 1:16, 17 (RS) exclude Jesus from having been created, when it says “in him all things were created . . . all things were created through him and for him”? The Greek word here rendered “all things” is panʹta, an inflected form of pas. At Luke 13:2, RS renders this “all . . . other”; JB reads “any other”; NE says “anyone else.” (See also Luke 21:29 in NE and Philippians 2:21 in JB.) In harmony with everything else that the Bible says regarding the Son, NW assigns the same meaning to panʹta at Colossians 1:16, 17 so that it reads, in part, “by means of him all other things were created . . . All other things have been created through him and for him.” Thus he is shown to be a created being, part of the creation produced by Go, not by JW’s but by those who embrace the false doctrine of the trinity.

[@Volleyball_Chess_and_Geoguessr]

Good refutation of the JWs but Jesus' name wasn't remembered until he came, so saying it's the messiah still works for the Jews.

[@robertblackmon1]

subscribed Sir😇

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Nice to meet you Robert!

[@robertblackmon1]

@@ericschaeffer8288 And you also my brother in Christ. God is gathering His ppl. Thank you for all you do. May our God continue to bless you & yours😇

[@freethinker2964]

I only have one question for you that believe the Jesus is the almighty What was the use for Satan to ask Jesus to make an act of worship? Offering him all the kingdoms of the earth when Jesus been part of a Trinidad already owns everything?

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

So Satan can be God.

[@freethinker2964]

@@kardiognostesministries8150 what? Are kidding me Your answer doesn't make any sense Please give me an intelligent response

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

@@freethinker2964 It doesn't make any sense to those without sense. If Jesus worshiped Satan then Satan would be His God.

[@freethinker2964]

What? How can Satan offer Jesus the kingdoms of the world to make Jesus do an act of worship When Jesus been part of the trinity was the one that gave Satan the authority over those kingdoms? It's like me giving you $1,000 and you turn around and tell me, if you slave for me for an year I give you a thousand dollars That is practically what you are selling by telling me that Jesus is the Almighty

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

@@freethinker2964 Because Jesus also became a man and was tempted (Hebrews 4:15).

[@billjones261]

People get screwed up by reading the NT where Jesus is called lord but he in bible theology is the son of god (Yahweh)

[@johnryan1798]

What's the difference between "mighty god" and "Almighty God"?

[@ericschaeffer8288]

It’s about the same as someone calling Michael Jordan a great basketball player or calling him the greatest basketball player. A Jordan fan can believe both without it being a contradiction.

[@johnryan1798]

@@ericschaeffer8288 And one who knows Jesus will not confuse him with another individual.

[@anonymousprofessor8866]

There are 2 problems that are seriously frustrating with debating JWs!! 1. JWs debate using the Watchtower false teachings, while true Christians debate using just scriptures from the Holy Bible. 2. When a JWs is ask a critical thinking question they know is going to prove they're in a false religion they'll simple just ignore or evade the question entirely. Then start using circular reasoning. I can ask any JWs two very simple questions that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the JWs group is in fact a false religion. Do you or any JWs have the courage for the challenge?? Keep in mind Only 2 very simple questions. 😊

[@richbaker7187]

You said something that I need to check. You said, "The NWT is the only ONE on the shelf...". So, is the NWT actually on a shelf somewhere in a store? Like, can I walk into a Bible store and even FIND a NWT?

[@ericschaeffer8288]

I bought mine from a used book store😅

[@richb.48]

@@ericschaeffer8288 Yes, that's where I'd think you might find one. I got all 3 of mine off Ebay. Both of their KIT versions, and the original 1951 New Testament.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

@@richb.48 nice!

[@isabellmariarobles1906]

@@ericschaeffer8288 I have a Library of Bible...IN MY HEART I COULD NOT KEEP THE (NWT BOOK) FOR IT IS NOT A BIBLE ITS A BOOK THAT DENIES JESUS IS OUR LORD...

[@ericschaeffer8288]

@@isabellmariarobles1906 I totally understand that

[@ralfwittke9503]

The Byington versión at least says the same

[@randallwittman2720]

with the blood of his own one" or "the church of God which he bought with the blood of his own Son"(N[ew]J[erusalem]B[ible]), with [HO IDIOS] construed as a christological title. According to this view,[HO THEOS] refers to God the Father, not Jesus Christ. If however, one follows many English versions in construing [IDIOS] adjectivally ("through his own blood"), [HO THEOS] could refer to Jesus and the verse could therefore allude to "the blood of God," although on this construction of [IDIOS] it is more probable that [THEOS] is God the Father and the unexpressed subject of [PERIEPOIHSATO] is Jesus. So it remains unlikely, although not impossible, that Acts 20:28 [HO THEOS] denotes Jesus." - Jesus as Theos, The New Testament Use of Theos in Reference to Jesus, 'D. Conclusion', p.141, Baker Book House, Grand rapids, Michigan, 1992.-italics ours

[@colonalklink14]

Jehovah's false witnesses have another Jesus that can't save anyone and another gospel of faith plus works equals salvation nonsense. Jesus is Lord God Almighty clothed in unsinful humanity and He is the author of eternal life to all who trust Him alone for salvation. This means that saving repentance is realizing that you are a sinner deserving of God's just punishment in Hell and turn (repent) from whatever you trusted in before, if indeed you trusted in anything; to trusting in the person and finished work of Christ "alone" for salvation.

[@rehcoorijola1086]

Unless one of you had no anti COVID-19 vaccines you have no difference to each other (Romans 11:4)

[@jahtruthdefender]

Really just goes to show the depth of the lack of knowledge some people put out in such videos as this. Psalms 45:6 words are applied to a human king. Now if the use of the verse makes Jesus God as it was applied to him then the same application *has* to also be to the human king. Therefore, by your religious theology both Jesus and the human king are God!

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Well said! Now watch the rest of the video… I address that

[@jahtruthdefender]

@@ericschaeffer8288 Yeah but there's no surprises with that faulty reasoning and attempt to deflect with verse 17 when we are talking about verse 6. However, Let's look at what you skipped passed to get to verse 17 and also apply this to Jesus the Almighty God, Who is the queen at the right hand of Jesus that he will desire that is led to the king? Let's look at potentially many *Trinitarian* sources for answers. These are those in your camp that are highly respected: The footnote of the NASB, reference edition (*TRINITARIAN BIBLE*) states "Probably refers to Solomon as a type of Christ" Applying your translation understanding based on the NASB means Solomon is God too The New American Bible, St. Joseph Edition, 1970, footnote for this verse states “The Hebrew king was called ... ‘God,’ not in the polytheistic sense common among the ancient pagans, but as meaning ‘godlike’ or ‘taking the place of God’.” Now I'd accept this view even if your translation is correct. This make Jesus "a god" or "godlike" which agrees with the bible. The NAB goes on to explain, however, that others have translated this verse as, “Your throne is the throne of God” and refers us to 1 Chron. 29:23 “where Solomon’s throne is referred to as the throne of the LORD [YHWH].” Lastly the *1991* revised edition of the NAB translates Psalms 45:6 as “Your throne, O god.” The Easy To Read Bible's footnoote "“God .... here the writer might be using the word ‘God’ as a title for the king.” (Cf. NIV Study Bible f.n. for Pss. 45:6 and 82:1, 6.)" The Oxford professor and famous Bible translator, Dr. James Moffatt, has been described as “probably the greatest biblical scholar of our day.” His respected Bible translation renders Hebrews 1:8 as “God is thy throne for ever and ever.” Just as this makes it clear that the ancient Israelite king was not God but was anointed by God, HIS God, to a position above his fellows, so does Heb. 1:9, as figuratively applied to Jesus, show that he is not God, but was anointed by his God to a position above his fellows! Context, then, shows that the person addressed in Heb. 1:8 is not God, but one who worships God and was anointed by his God! Smith & Goodspeed, An American translation, The Bible in Living English (Byington), NSB, Mace Bible, Twentieth Century Translation and The Message bible all read similar “God is your throne....” Noted New Testament language scholar, Dr. C. F. D. Moule writes that Heb. 1:8 may be “construed so as to mean Thy throne is God” - p. 32, An Idiom Book of New Testament Greek, Cambridge University Press, 1990 printing. . Dr. William Barclay, another world-acclaimed scholar of trinitarian Christendom has translated this verse similarly and made some interesting comments. Note what was said about him “world-renowned Scottish New Testament interpreter, was noted as a profound scholar and a writer of extraordinary gifts .... He was the minister of Trinity Church, Renfrew, Scotland, and, later, Professor of Divinity and Biblical Criticism at the University of Glasgow.” Dr. Barclay, in his translation of the New Testament, has also rendered Hebrews 1:8 as : “*God is your throne for ever and ever*.” what this renowned trinitarian says next is a massive blow for the wishful thinkers Hebrews gives evidence and support to Jesus is God... Dr. Barclay comments as follows: “The letter [of Hebrews] was written to a Church which had had great days and great teachers and leaders.” - p. 6. “Moreover, it was obviously written to a scholarly group [who] ... had long been under instruction and were preparing themselves to become teachers of the Christian faith.” - p. 7. *What was Heb 1:4-14 which includes vers 8 to teach this group of long-term dedicated Christian scholars* The Letter to the Hebrews, Revised Edition, 1976, The Westminster Press. P.16 says “[The author] is concerned to prove [Jesus’] *SUPERIORITY OVER THE ANGELS*.” “[The author] is concerned to prove [Jesus’] SUPERIORITY OVER THE ANGELS.” - p. 16, The Letter to the Hebrews, Revised Edition, 1976, The Westminster Press. Here we have a Trinitarian scholar stating the truth of Hebrews chapter 1 of how it was conceivably understood by 1st Century Christians. The later century belief of Jesus is God was foreign to these learned Christians. Let's say the did, then it would be nonsensical that Paul would have to write a letter to prove Jesus was superior to angels The highly renowned Trinitarian (Southern Baptist) New Testament Greek scholar Dr. A. T. Robertson acknowledges that either “Thy throne, O God” or “God is thy throne”/“thy throne is God” may be proper renderings: “Either makes good sense.” - p. 339, Word Pictures in the New Testament. He also tells us that the inspired Letter to the Hebrews was written to a church of Jewish Christians whose Jewish neighbors “... have urged them to give up Christ and Christianity and to come back to Judaism.... These Jews argued that the prophets were superior to Jesus, the law came by the ministry of angels, Moses was greater than Jesus, and Aaron than Jesus. [The writer of Hebrews] turns the argument on the Jews and boldly champions the Glory of Jesus as superior at every point to all that Judaism had, as God’s Son and man’s Saviour, the crown and glory of the Old Testament prophecy, the hope of mankind. It is the first great apologetic for Christianity and has never been surpassed.” - Word Pictures in the New Testament, Vol. v, pp. 331, 339. ,

[@naturalstate8539]

I didn't even make it 60 seconds in the video before I heard the interpretation of Scriptures. Jesus is God? So this is him praying to himself for his own will not to be done but his will to be done. Yeah I think not Luke 22:42 New International Version “Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done.”

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

You refuted Modalism, not Trinitarianism.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Yes! You need to listen to my last video… explains it all just for folks like you!

[@ericschaeffer8288]

@@kardiognostesministries8150 exactly!!

[@tongakhan230]

Schizophrenia became a normal behaviour after the RCC came up with the Trinity notion. How hard can it be to figure out Jesus talking to himself and answering himself. The RCC is an authority not to be questioned.

[@salms77]

Read verse 9 of Hebrews 1:7-10

[@Goonapachamoothoo]

Read ISAIA WHO IS SAVIOUR See ISAIA 43V11. see EZECHIEL CH 6V10 PS 91V14

[@PapaGeorgio23-111]

Amen 🙏🏻 ❤

[@ScottHindle-qv6mq]

Oh wow the jws the Muslims the scientologist the Mormons the Hindus. It goes on and on and on........ect.

[@truthseekerKJV]

Eric, the NIV, along with all other modern English versions is subtly as corrupt as the J.W's New World translation. Get back to the King James version.

[@cyber.marshall]

So then, based upon what you said, what is the difference between a scheme and legitimate apologetics?

[@rationalrabbit797]

Can you really make definitive judgements about what any passage in the Bible actually means? The Bible, a conglomeration of fragments of text dug up in the sand, written by people from centuries ago, using their memories of bits and pieces of conversations, perhaps taken out of context and misremembered, then translated from dead languages and interpreted by people with who knows what agenda's, in fact probably the worlds vaguest ever book!! I think that anyone who makes definitive statements about what anything "really means" is skating on very thin ice. What does the Bible mean? My answer is "anything you like". When people say that this cobbled together collection of bits and pieces is the perfectly accurate "word of God", my reaction is that surely God, if he is a God of truth, would never expect His servants to accurately follow such a vague and open to interpretation book. Also, if God has protected the Bible from alteration, as many believe, and that it is infallible and inerrant, why did God not prevent all these different religions based on the Bible to believe it meant so many thousands of different things? How can all these different teachings from different churches be the truth? Why go to all that trouble to protect the word on paper but allow His so called followers to get the wrong message from the paper? It's all nonsense. None of it makes any sense. My advice is don't believe anything men wrote about God - wait to hear it either from God's own lips, or from one of His prophets. In the meantime, what difference does it make if Michael is Jesus, or there are 2 archangels or a billion archangels, or Jesus rode into Jerusalem on a donkey or parachuted in from an airplane. Who cares? Until God reclaims the Earth and establishes his rule over the Earth once again, it's all just so much religious bs. When God comes back, we will find out if God is Jesus, or Jesus is Michael, of if Daniel really existed. Until then, it;s all just a lot of irrelevances. In the meantime, we all know we are supposed to love our neighbor, speak the truth, be non violent and kind to everyone regardless of race or color of skin. If you feel the need to go into a building to act out righteousness and make a public performance of being religious to other humans, then that's up to you. Will God be impressed? I doubt it. But maybe He won't mind.

[@georgelopez8653]

In your video at around @5:30 you should have just ended your video when you admitted you were wrong because your retort wasn't satisfied at all.

[@watchtowerdefence571]

Hebrews 1:8 , when read entirely on it's own can legitimately have 2 different translations inot English. 1 ) "God is your throne..." and 2) " your throne o God..." Why is that? Because in the Greek there is no verb. In English every sentence ce must have a verb, so translators have to I sent a verb. The verb that is used is the verb "IS". Now a translatkr has to decide where to add it. There are two ways to decide that. A) onse theology, and B) context. The translators of the NST allows the context to Hebrews 1 determine where to add "IS". The context shows Jesus is not God. Hebrews 1:1,2 tells us God spoke THROUGH his Son Vs 3 tells us Jesus is the image of God. An image is not the real thing. An image comes after the real thing, Vs 4 Jesus gets an inheritance from the Father Verse 9 God anointed Jesus

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Yes! The context tells us all we need! heir of all things through whom also he made the universe the radiance of God’s glory the exact representation sustaining all things by his powerful word superior to the angels angels worship him Thank you for reminding us to look at the context. God has a name… JESUS!

[@watchtowerdefence571]

@@ericschaeffer8288 an heir inherits from someone. What did God inherit and from whom? Nothing and no one Jesus inherits a kingdom from God. The Greek word translated as through referes to an agency. Who was God an agent for? No one. Jesus was God's agent whom God used in creating the universe. Whose glory does God raduate? No one's. Jesus radiats the glory of his God Who does God represent? NO ONE. Jesus is the representing of his God. As God's heir, reflection, and agent he God uses Jesus to sustain all things. Yes Jesus was elevated to a position above the angels (Philip. 2:9), and the angels show him honour and respect (the Greek word prskuneo) but they do not ever give Jesus Religious type worship that belongs only ro God. Now read verse 9 in any Bible, it tells us that Jesus *_has_* a God. That God is the Father who alone is the ALMIGHTY and which nome is JEHOVAH. Jesus is NOT God. A

[@watchtowerdefence571]

@@ericschaeffer8288 Yes the context tells us all we need to know, Jesus is NOT the ALMIGHTY GOD. Nor is he apart of three who belong to some sort of "God" nature. God is one person. The Bible teaches that there are many gods The word god simply means "a mighty one" or "a strong one" or "a powerful one" There is only one ALMIGHTY GOD (Almighty mighty one) who is to be given "religious type worship" and that is the God that Jesus served - his Father.

[@davidevans9992]

I'm sure Hebrews is a great book and all, but Jesus' own words are conspicuously absent from your video. That's really suss to me because Jesus told us everything we need to know about himself and his father who sent him. All you had to do was tell us what he said. All one need do is read his words, accept them, and bring one's thinking in line with them. There is no creativity and no scheming needed for that. All you need to do is read the words that are there and not twist them. And it just so happens that this one passage of scripture contains within itself the key to the entire mystery - John 10:33-38 in any translation you like: 33“We are not stoning You for any good work,” said the Jews, “but for blasphemy, because You, who are a man, declare Yourself to be God.” 34Jesus replied, “Is it not written in your Law: ‘I have said you are gods’ (Palms 82:6)? 35If he called them gods to whom the word of God came-and the Scripture cannot be broken- 36then what about the One whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world? How then can you accuse Me of blasphemy for stating that I am the Son of God? 37If I am not doing the works of My Father, then do not believe Me. 38But if I am doing them, even though you do not believe Me, believe the works themselves, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I am in the Father.” The scripture Jesus cited is Psalms 82:6, "I have said, ‘You are gods; you are all sons of the Most High.’" Just read this honestly a few times and let it digest for a while. If you let Jesus' words be true, you will see that the entire mystery is solved in this one passage. By all means read the chapters around it, and all the gospels for the context; I will not be accused of any trickery. Before the urge to accuse me of that gets the better of you, go ahead and read the whole Bible so you can see all the context you like. I'm not playing any tricks on anyone, I'm just asking you to read honestly these few verses that state the whole case most succinctly. Just read the words as they are, and own up to them. Jesus is a god and the Son of God just as all who have received the word of God are gods and sons of God. Jesus is the firstborn and foremost Son of God. His godhood is greater than ours because the word of God came to him first and most fully, but his godhood is like ours in that it came about upon receipt of God's word in the beginning. I trust this will be a relief to you after such a time lost in the wilderness of false teachings.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

David, you speak as if Hebrews is not the Word of God? Do you doubt it’s validity? But as for what you said, yes! Please read the context of Jesus’s words, “you are gods.” It deflates everything you just said. Then read the following: JESUS IS CALLED: "mighty God" (Isaiah 9:6) "God with us" (Matthew 1:23) "my Lord and my God" (John 20:28) "great God and Savior" (Titus 2:13) "God and Savior" (2 Peter 1:1) JESUS SAID: "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58) "the Father and I are one" (John 10:30) "he that sees Me, sees the Father" (John 14:9) "I am the First and the Last" (Rev. ‪1:17-18‬) "I am the Alpha and Omega" (Rev. ‪22:12-13‬) JESUS DID THINGS ONLY RESERVED FOR JEHOVAH: Raise Himself from the dead. (John ‪2:19-21‬, ‪10:18‬) Receives worship. (Mat. 2:11,14:33, 28:9, John 9:38, Heb. 1:6) Forgives sins (Mark 2:5-7) Only name by which to be saved (Acts ‪4:12‬) These things do not make any sense, unless of course, Jesus is God.

[@davidevans9992]

@@ericschaeffer8288 I'm sure Hebrews is great, but all words are subordinate to Jesus' own. You argue that Jesus is God. So, if we want to know about Jesus, why would we prefer any words to those he spoke himself? Why would we consider Jesus' words about himself inadequate? Was he lacking insight? So, let's not stray yet from Jesus' defence of himself when accused of blasphemy. The Jews, holding stones, charged him with the words, "Thou, being a man, makest thyself God." What did Jesus reply regarding his godhood? He likened it to the godhood spoken of by Asaph in Psalms 82:6 - don't get your hopes up, it doesn't support the Trinity thesis at all. With verse 7 added for context, it shows that these gods are very much lowercase and mortal. "I said, 'You are gods, sons of the Most High, all of you; 7nevertheless, like men you shall die, and fall like any prince.'” Psalms 82 is talking about God's judgement of the wicked. Jesus' interpretation of it was that it was the receiving of God's word that made men gods (John 10:35) and sons of the Most High. As I'm sure you know, the Hebrew word Elohim is used both for God and for human "rulers, judges, either as divine representatives at sacred places or as reflecting divine majesty and power" (Strongs 430). It is in that second sense that it is used in Palms 82, and it was with that qualification that Jesus defended himself. No doubt that Hebrew grammar has caused a lot of people a lot of confusion over the centuries. What did Jesus say about himself from the beginning to the end of his ministry? "I am the Son of God!" He said it countless times including on this occasion on trial for blasphemy in John 10:36. Is Jesus wrong? Do you know Jesus better than he knows himself? Did the early church fathers or the CofN know better? If what they say contradicts what Jesus said, who invalidates who? You accused non-Trinitarians of using lots of clever tricks. I think it would be clear to anyone reading that I am being very plain and transparent with this. I am starting my argument from a very pertinent scripture, and asking you simply to read the words that are written there, accept them as they are, and discuss them with me. Let's be fair; not only have you misrepresented Psalms 82 in quite a startling way that contradicts Jesus' interpretation of it, you have also tried to deflect attention away from these most pertinent words of Jesus about himself and scatter us all over the Bible. Let's not muddle things with all this scripture hopping - I for one had enough of that nonsense at the Kingdom Hall - let's knuckle down with John 10:33-39. There's plenty to be getting on with there, and we can actually accomplish something if we study it in depth. There are several reasons to consider this the most pertinent scripture in all the Bible to Trinity doctrine. We should all know from the constant page flipping at the Hall that such superficiality is a waste of time and energy. Let's focus on John 10.

[@ericschaeffer8288]

@@davidevans9992 interesting that you refuse to address all His claims to Deity as well as all His disciples claims He is Deity as well as all the times He accepted worship… your stance forces you to ignore many passages… we agree He is God’s Son… and God Himself

[@davidevans9992]

@@ericschaeffer8288 I will demonstrate herein why it is of vital importance to approach the scriptures with utmost care, humility, and integrity. I don't see that in your Trinity videos, Eric. I am not avoiding anything, I am confronting the haughty dogmatism displayed in these videos. Everyone should know by now where the use of unreasonable force in scholarship leads. John 10 shows clearly that Trinitarian scholarship is like an iron rod where a razor is needed. If you would stop avoiding it, John 10 will take that rod and make it the razor it needs to be. As anyone familiar with the scriptures knows, you could come away thinking every other person or thing was God if you read without discernment. For instance, I could apply the same logic and standards of evidence you have used to justify the worship of Satan. 2 Corinthians 4:4, clearly says that Satan is the God of this world. Satan accepts and even demands acts of worship. Jesus himself knows that all the kingdoms of the earth belong to Satan. They are his to give, and he gives them gladly in exchange for worship. If Satan is the God of this world, why should we who are in this world not be worshiping him? To demonstrate the importance of discernment in Bible scholarship, could I not go to church, believe in the Trinity, read the Bible, and reasonably conclude that Satan is the Holy Spirit? Should I not get baptised in that name? After all, the Holy Spirit lacks all mercy and forgiveness, does it not? No sin against the Holy Spirit will ever be forgiven despite Jesus' sacrifice. There is something different and mysterious about the Holy Spirit, and it would make a lot of sense for it to be Satan. I mean, Jesus himself knows Satan is the God of this world, so it makes sense that Satan is the third and earthly part of the Trinity. Or maybe God's nature is actually fourfold, and Satan is that fourth part. I could say that Jesus only came to earth to make sure Satan still has dominion over it. The fact that Satan had God himself (sic) crucified when he challenged Ceasar's deity shows that Satan indeed has dominion, so Jesus' mission was indeed accomplished, just not in the way people think. I could become Trinitarian, harden my heart, and prophesy this strange gospel to the world. I could go and baptise in that name, and preach that I am returning the world to the worship of its own true God. How could you possibly convince me that I was wrong and prevent or repair the damage of that blasphemy? Cannot Satan appear as a being of light? Why not also as a dove? If you can ignore the clear evidence of John 10, I can ignore anything you say that might contradict the doctrine of Satan's being the Holy Spirit, and God's earthly presence. Is it not Satan who patrols the earth and questions God about the sincerity of his people's devotion? Is it not Satan who tests God's servants to prove their integrity? I hope I have demonstrated well enough the importance of care in Bible scholarship. So, let's turn to John 10, and read from verse 33. What do you see there, Eric? What does Jesus say?

[@ericschaeffer8288]

@@davidevans9992 this is a lot of talk for nothing being said… again, I showed you 20+ verses with no reply. But hey, I get it. You have to do that to justify your stance… you are forced to avoid verses that say Jesus accepted worship, or that He created “all things” or that He was specifically called “God” many times… you even hint at discrediting Books of the Bible. I have found that folks like you will eliminate any and all evidence that contradicts your false teaching. I’m sorry but you have deceived (willingly deceived)

[@alvinlevy5502]

The phrase God is your throne, dose not make sense.

[@joannsmith9]

If you understand the context it does. God was CONTRASTING , in that chapter , what HE was doing for Christ. God had told to Christ sit at his right hand and he would place Christs enemies as a stool for his feet. God was going to give him a kingship that Norman can ever take away; because GOD HIMSELF would be the throne upon which ChristsKingdom would be established Gods throne is in heaven a no man can go to heaven to conquer his throne. Pharaohs of Egypt and Caesars of Rome sat on thrones that could be conquered- it not so Christs throne because his father in heaven-himself is his throne-or AUTHORITY UPON WHICH HIS KINGDOM IS BASED. In the Bible THRONES represent ruling authorities or powers. You can’t get a better source of authority or backing than the Almighty God His Father is his source of authority. God has never give that kind of power or authority to any other being-the angels included.

[@joannsmith9]

WHAT A LACK OF HUMILITY-you compare yourself to Goodspeed and Moffats ! They were the most renouned Greek scholars of their generation. You could write a Bible ????

[@alvinlevy5502]

​@@joannsmith9 Moffat tenselation dose not support your NWT John 1v1 in Moffats translation reads the word was divine , divinity is God it supports the word was God noting christs diety

[@LaMOi1]

Ye are gods Moses was called “like a god” gods by the tonnes like peas on a pod. That’s what they counter. There are many places in the Bible where heavenly beings are called “gods”…. Problem is that ultimately there’s no getting around it they believe in polytheism. Because they believe in Jehovah God, but they also believe that Jesus is a lesser God. He is a true God, but not a God like Jehovah. So that’s polytheism.

[@michaelhaigh9182]

Eric learn Hebrew and Greek then you will no the answer to your questions if your no Greek then you will no what it says so learn Greek sir😊

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Yes! That is very helpful! That is why we should question the New World Translation. Not only does it contradict the research of credible Greek and Hebrew scholars, but it was created by men who only had a few Greek and Hebrew classes and were not scholars… I’m glad you agree with me on this!

[@michaelhaigh9182]

Well if you have a copy of it and read it to your own then you can check the verses that your not sure about ? Then you will be better a quipped when you next talk to jws ? rember we have to check the facts first as we can all say this and say that as in law of court they go on facts ?

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Amen! Check the facts… if everyone would do this unbiasedly, the Watchtower would come to an end immediately.

[@michaelhaigh9182]

@@ericschaeffer8288 don’t no if you have read the text I wrote but in acts 28 v 6 is the same Greek word used and it reads a god it’s just the the trinity scholars who have put God at John 1 v 1 as that’s what the belive but I’d ask why they haven’t used God at acts 28 v 6 ov there not very good at translating but want to deceive people by say the word was God instead a god but they will be judged for it especially takeing yehovah name out of the scriptures

[@riveravon5296]

I was JW for more than 40 years and thank you for an interesting video. Anyway, I can’t understand that the so-called holy spirit should be a God. I think that much of the confusion comes from the fact that we as God have a spirit or is one. More than 100 scriptures in the Bible mention that we have a spirit or is one. I think, for one thing, it’s really difficult to read the Bible if we confuse the spirit of God, holy spirit, with our own spirit. “For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.” 1 Corinthians 2:11. “The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:” Romans 8:16.

[@scottgrey2877]

God is not three persons but he is spirit soul body

[@riveravon5296]

@@scottgrey2877 Yes, the Father and the Son is made of the same substance, exactly as we are, the spirit. We are from outside of this realm and meant to learn something, the truth. "They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. " John 17:16-18.

[@scottgrey2877]

@@riveravon5296 the spirit of God is the power of God in action it influence believers

[@riveravon5296]

@@scottgrey2877 Yes you are right that spirit is a force. But spirit is much more than this. We can as spirits communicate with God from our spirit to his spirit. God is spirit as well as we are. "God is a spirit, and those who worship must worship in spirit and truth.” John 4:24. or Romans 1:9 "For God, to whom I perform service in my spirit in carrying the gospel of his Son, is my witness how I uninterruptedly make mention of you at all times in my prayers,"

[@scottgrey2877]

@@riveravon5296 the influence is from a person Jesus and Jehovah

[@santiagojironpadilla]

Awesome explanation!!!!

[@xjwcurious]

The New World "Translation" is actually a revised bible, not a translated one. Even their own Kingdom Interlinear shows the errors located in the NWT.

[@tongakhan230]

Very curious. Where exactly are these so called errors? Google 'Errors in the KJV' and wade through the hits.

[@isaiah30v8]

YOU ARE WRONG! . Understand and put faith in what Jesus Christ explicitly said to the Apostle John while quoting Psalm 2 about someone other than himself: . Revelation 2:26-27 And to him that conquers and observes my deeds down to the end I will give authority over the nations, 27 and he shall shepherd the people with an iron rod so that they will be broken to pieces like clay vessels ** THE SAME ** as I have received from my Father, . A man will become THE SAME as Jesus Christ! . No one can be the same as God! . Isaiah 42:8 I am Jehovah. That is my name; and to ** NO ONE ELSE ** shall I give my own glory, . So Jesus Christ is NOT God. . Also when what Jesus Christ said above happens, the Trinity mathematics will no longer work! . Do the math! . and read Psalm 2. . .

[@ericschaeffer8288]

Very interesting comment here. I struggle to understand how this disqualifies Jesus’ Deity? But I understand why this is difficult for you. The Watchtower goes to great lengths to deceive Jehovahs Witnesses. That is why we need to have a good translation of the Bible and read it for what it plainly says. As I was reading my Bible, I noticed some verses: Revelation 1:8 - Jehovah said He is the Alʹpha and the O·meʹga. Revelation ‪22:12-13‬ - Jesus gave Himself the same title. Isaiah 44:6 - Jehovah said He is the First and the Last. Revelation ‪1:17-18‬ - Jesus gave Himself the same title. Acts 3 - Jehovah raised Christ from the dead. John ‪2:19-21‬ - Christ said He will raise Himself. Matthew 4:10 - Only Jehovah must receive worship. Matthew 14:33, 28:9, Hebrews 1:6, and Revelation 5:6-9, 12-14 - Jesus receives worship. Romans 10:13- Whoever calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved. Acts ‪4:12‬ - Jesus is the only name by which we must be saved. And then there are verses like Thomas calling Jesus "My Lord and my God" and Jesus saying "When you see Me, you see the Father." The list can go on and on. The point I’m trying to make here is that there are many Scriptures that show Jehovah and Jesus as One and the same. From everything I read, it appears that the New World Translation has adjusted it's interpretation of the original to make these things less noticeable. Have you ever researched the NWT with unbiased sources?

[@isaiah30v8]

@@ericschaeffer8288 So you are going to have a problem when a man becomes THE SAME as Jesus Christ. . A problem with the Trinity math. . You could make the problem go away by NOT putting faith in what Jesus Christ said. . Or . Realize that Jesus Christ is NOT God! . No one can be THE SAME as God! . .

[@isaiah30v8]

Why did Jesus Christ say nothing good about his kingdom? . Who is this Christ: . Revelation 12:10 Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the AUTHORITY OF HIS CHRIST, . When Jesus Christ had already been given authority: . Matthew 28:18 And Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: “All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. . . Who is this child born who brings peace: . Isaiah 9:6-7 For there has been a child born to us, there has been a son given to us; and the princely rule will come to be upon his shoulder. And his name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. 7 To the abundance of the princely rule and to peace there will be no end, . When Jesus Christ said this: . Luke 12:51 Do YOU imagine I came to give peace on the earth? No, indeed, I tell YOU, but rather division . . Who is this child born without birth pangs: . Isaiah 66:7 Before she began to come into labor pains she gave birth. Before birth pangs could come to her, she even gave deliverance to a male child. . Why is this male child a disfellowshipped Jehovah's Witness: . Isaiah 66:5 Hear the word of Jehovah, YOU men who are trembling at his word: “YOUR brothers that are hating YOU, that are excluding YOU by reason of my name, said, ‘May Jehovah be glorified!’ He must also appear with rejoicing on YOUR part, and they are the ones that will be put to shame.” . [Name of person] is no longer one of JEHOVAH's Witnesses ----->> excluding YOU by reason of MY NAME . An end time prophecy that is now being abundantly fulfilled all around the world. . What Jehovah said would happen, is really happening! . .

[@billjones261]

Jesus is the son of god through whom the almighty god (Yahweh) made all things in the universe, is what Hebrews 1:4 says so Jesus is not the almighty one or father, which to the ancient Hebrews/Israelites would be Yahweh or Jehovah in are latinized language

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

The Son of God (John 20:31) is "my God" (John 20:28).

[@gwendolynandrefsky4043]

Jesus is god Bhai utility his he god almighty ? His he called most high??