ILIAD BOOK 9: Everybody Begs Achilles to Come Fight, and He Says "NO" Because He's Still A Child.

[@Ian-yf7uf]

Achilles is 100 percent right not to fight. I think the most redeeming part about his character is that he chooses to fight only for selfish reasons, whether it's immortal fame or to avenge his cousin. If he is denied his warbride he should say no. It's like if your boss didn't give you your paycheck or took the paycheck back.

[@oliviadement6116]

This helped me sm!!! Its like im sitting down with you having coffee listening to the drama going on in our friend group haha so i actually understand what is going on!!! Thank you sm

[@MoAnInc]

I’m SO GLAD!!! Thank you for watching 🫶🏼🫶🏼

[@adrianem3095]

I love Greek mythology and rn I'm taking a class. THIS IS THE BEST THING EVER I LOVE YOUR VIDEOS!

[@MoAnInc]

I’m SO GLAD you’re in the classroom!!!!😍 and thank you for watching my videos! ❤️ x

[@_.Joyy._]

You’re an amazing story reteller and explainer! Thank you so much for this it helped me a lot with the small details!!

[@MoAnInc]

Thank youuuuu!! 🫶🏼

[@ayajensen3784]

Love your videos!! They are so helpful and make me understand it so much better! could you maybe do a video explaining The Aeneiden and a little bit about song 1?

[@MoAnInc]

I’ll be getting to The Aeneid once I finish doing the Odyssey - have no fear!!! ❤️

[@ayajensen3784]

@@MoAnInc Perfect!! thank you!

[@JonnyChapelow]

Looking forward to your video on Book 10. I remember reading and thinking what an absolute lad Diomedes is.

[@MoAnInc]

I really just fan girl in Book 10's episode ... it's definitely the nerdiest in the series thus far haha

[@Prometheus4096]

The funny thing about Phoenix is he fled his province because his father had a mistress and his mother found out and his mother asked him to sleep with his father's mistress. And this girl then having slept with Phoenix, didn't want to sleep anymore with his old ass dad. So his dad then became really mad and they wanted to kill each other. But only Athena stepped in to prevent Phoenix from killing his father. So he went in exile and Achillis his father, Peleus took him in. And even worse is that Patrochlus, who is alwys described as being kind and compassionate and gentle, also was exiled. But Patrochlus did actually murder someone. He 'accidentally' killed his own childhood friend over a game of dice when he was a kid. That's like, absolutely horrible. Not even sure if for the audience this is supposed to be absurd, of if this was actually normal and believable back then.

[@MoAnInc]

ALRIGHT GUYS, I'VE FINALLY UPDATED MY WEBSITE! You all can find the written summary of Iliad book 9 via this link :) I hope these help xx www.moaninc.co.uk/homers-iliad/book-9-summary

[@apezcal432]

thank you so much for making these you help so much

[@MoAnInc]

I’m so so glad these help! 🥺

[@ShavaleGilchrist]

Achilles truly loves the people in his life that’s why whenever they introduce the idea of hurting ppl he loves he changes his mind!

[@reydemayo8906]

Great storytelling....❤

[@MoAnInc]

:))

[@trtrsqr4666]

Phoenix's speech (which was probably the longest someone was talking uninterrupted so far) gets really confusing in the second half, at least in my translation, when he starts telling about Meleager. At one point (verses 550-553) it seems that the Curetes are inside the walls of Calydon, when it was said before (verse 531) that Calydon was the city of the Aetolians. Even more confusing, why does Meleager get mad at his mom and to spite her decides to sleep with his legitimate wife (verses 555-556)? What!? Then it is said that his mom's brother was killed, but who is even that dude? I went to wikipedia and read Meleager's tale and understood what was going on, but from the book itself I just got confused by the whole thing. Sometimes tales from the past are mentioned in the Illiad, about Heracles for example, but it's usually just a couple of lines so you either get it or it doesn't affect the main story too much. But here, Phoenix actually went into much detail into the whole Meleager's story but then skipped half of it... It would be cool if this was a character trait of Phoenix, every time he would show up he would just start rambling on confusingly about something, but I doubt it. Do you have any thoughts on this?

[@MoAnInc]

Oh so the micro-narratives are actually INSANELY important for the symbolism of the Iliad. If you want to learn more about them, I’d recommend Gregory Nagy’s “The Ancient Greek Hero in 24 Hours”. They’ll blow your mind (especially Phoenix’s story!!!!)

[@Sikandros]

I never knew Achilles was such a drama queen.

[@MoAnInc]

Oh just you wait.

[@alecvillavilla9978]

Read and enjoy the Iliad throughout and you will find out that Achilles is everything but a drama queen, unless his character is manipulated.

[@Prometheus4096]

I think you aren't really doing my man Achillis justice here. He says he doesn't care about earthy fights or earthly fights because if he accepts them and fights, he will die. So the gifts don't matter. He doesn't say he can easily seduce someone more beautiful than Agemenon's daughters. He also doesn't say they aren't good enough for him. He says, he'd rather want a boring ordinary plain wife AND ACTUALLY BE ALIVE. to live and grow old with her. He also says that the only way he can get level with Agemamnon is if Agememnon is as humiliated by him, as he was by Agamemnon. And Agememnon offered nothing of that. He also says that yes indeed the Greeks are fucked without him and that none of them can stop Hector and that if they also don't wanna die, they better leave with him.

[@durrangodsgrief6503]

how is he a child if they have the courage to disrespect him then they have the courage to win without him

[@ShavaleGilchrist]

Disrespect him and no one consoled him smh

[@mikeramsay5964]

In the list of things Ag is going to give Achilles (which is a lot of crap to haul around on a boat) he offers one of his three daughters in marriage. But, according to Aeschylus, he only has two daughters because he sacrificed Iphianassa (or Iphigenia) to the gods for favorable sailing weather to Troy, which pissed off his wife, Clytaemnestra, which is why he thinks Briseus is much hotter than his wife (because he obviously doesn't give a rat's ass what she -his wife- thinks).

[@mikeramsay5964]

I would love to know what all those editions of The Iliad are you have on your windowsill.

[@johncgibson4720]

I liked one of your episodes about one of the Olympian gods/goddesses . But I am having trouble keeping up with your other videos. I had a very short relationship with an Italian woman and I will never give up on Greco/Roman things. I am going back to college this fall in a week. I hope I can pick up Lliad again sometime.

[@Bloodyshadow1]

the thing with achilles is that he could be very sympathetic if you listen to his words alone. However, his actions, both in the Iliad and before, he is just trying to look good. I'd feel more for him about Bresis if he actually cared about her, but when he makes up with Agamenmon he blames her for everything, the slave girl who didn't ask for her family to be slaughtered. He also falls in 'love' so easily it's hard to take him seriously. He fell in love with at least 1 corpse. If he refused to fight because he was tired, or because of Agamenon's slight, I would get it, I would understand if he left the battlefield because he was done. But he didn't, despite his threats he's staying, he wants them to beg better and to make them sweat until he saves the day. It costs him everything he cares about, but it was his choice

[@eaaaiu]

poca acción

[@OrangeLmao]

im ready to absolutely destroy my ap lit discussion tmr

[@MoAnInc]

⚔️🧨👀

[@angeliquegraves5881]

❤❤❤

[@MoAnInc]

☺️

[@codyt8541]

Man Achilles was making me mad in this book, although i do get where he's coming from with his glory beint stolen. great video as always!

[@MoAnInc]

Thanks for watching! 🌷

[@alecvillavilla9978]

I totally disagree with your analysis of Achilles, that is the most problematic, multi-faceted, fascinating character in Homeric stories. You say "... why you hated Achilles ... " Says who? Why imply this hatred? And what follows is nearly alarming, you state that this hatred is motivated by the fact that he is being childish. Is that a reason to hate someone? Unthinkable. And above all, why hate a character whose chief feature throughout the poem, besides his immense bravery and fighting skills as well as his violent wrath is sufferance, pain? Achilles is the character who suffers the most in the Iliad, his short, fated life is imbued with pain up to its end. Book IX, to me the most handsome in the poem, contains one of the earliest statements on the absurdity of war in Western literature and who utters it? The man who, up to that moment, had been living to fight, slay enemies and raid towns to get his own glory, Achilles. This very man has realised that glory is not worth of life of a human being and it is precisely for this very reason that he no longer wants to fight. And you find him childish? Unbelievable. Incidentally, reason one to avoid fighting (the misconduct of Agamemnon against him) was a good enough motive, within the heroic code. But reading the poem, one finds out another very good reason: Achilles does not respect Agamemnon because the latter does not fight in the battlefield and yet he takes the lion share when it comes to share the battle booty. But then again, the very, great reason is the result of his meditation on war and life. Achilles is one of the first, huge fictional characters (if he is thoroughly fictional) in Western literature: surely the commentary, books and essays written on him over more than 2.800 years are pure evidence of this, yet the sheer reading of the marvellous Iliad shows the complexity of this personality.

[@wagwanyute]

Well said

[@durrangodsgrief6503]

finally you get it

[@ShavaleGilchrist]

Exactly correct!

[@codyt8541]

They're also losing, being killed left and right, because Achilles went crying to his mommy

[@goatpower321]

Achilles is like that one toxic ex girlfriend trying to prove that you “can’t live without her”

[@shantoreywilkins651]

#13th ☀️☀️🌝