In Discussion with Paul Pope - Alex Toth In Depth Episode 022

[@winternitz_]

How am I just learning that this channel exists. THIS IS PERFECT.

[@comixcrush]

I do not know how you missed it, but WELCOME. Enjoy catching up!

[@christoonist]

Couldn’t have chosen a better artist to talk Toth! Thanks!

[@comixcrush]

Paul's been on my short list from the get-go, and I like all the guests who've joined me.

[@jf1573]

I know Chris Samnee has Toth‘s design rules above his desk. David Mazzuchelli would also be a good guest.

[@comixcrush]

@@jf1573 Both are on my list or have been asked.

[@buzzawuzza3743]

Having Battling Boy and THB come out in large format books is something we wanted but never thought we'd ever see.

[@comixcrush]

BONUS!

[@PabloKMorillo]

"don't do it like space ace" ! would love to hear more about toth's thoughts on ligne claire, herge & moebius. also wish there were more books collecting toth's sketches and notes like the dear john alex toth book.

[@comixcrush]

I'll keep an eye out for Toth quotes on those. More Toth books: AGREED!

[@PabloKMorillo]

@@comixcrush please and thank you!!🙏

[@leestevenson1236]

This talk was fantastic. I’m so happy to have found this channel. Thank you.

[@comixcrush]

Pleased you enjoyed it, Lee, and glad you found it!

[@saintsataniko2116]

Excited to listen to this. I can already see the video is chockful of beautiful illustrations.

[@comixcrush]

It is! I had fun putting together the slides, and Paul provided me high-res files of his work to also feature. Enjoy!

[@stevena488]

Alex Toths design of a page is one of those things that I genuinely have issues describing (no pun intended). I got the massive art book which I've been pouring over the last few weeks now and what's insane is that you realise that Toth's precision is almost unmatched. Toth had nothing to hide behind with his linework, much like Hugo Pratt. And you see DECADES of problem solving in a single line in Toths work. What I would draw with something like a sable brush and, ultimately, make something of a workable mistake out of, Toth has a line where it's unmistakably in the right place. The other thing that I think Toth has is that his style was infuriating to me because I couldn't copy it. I could replicate it but it wouldn't look right, ever. Even when I've done freelance work for years, I CAN'T replicate his work because his style is so difficult to emulate and emulate well. You have to have such a solid understanding of anatomy, line weight (It's there), and you have to know how to make something that was probably laboured over for years look EASY. Plus his comics work was so varied. His plane comics were so full of white space, but you check out his Black Canary work where she's been kidnapped and it's SO claustrophobic. THAT is the sign of a genius. Wonderful interview! I like Paul. The dude just seems super pleasant.

[@comixcrush]

Great points, Steven. Unbelievable that his stuff looks so casual while at the same time is exacting. Makes it look easy, but as you say, not nearly so much.

[@gonzomike100]

That was a wonderful episode. Pope is perhaps my favorite artist of the last twenty years and I could see the Toth in him from day one.

[@comixcrush]

Glad you liked it!

[@randyreynaldo8401]

Great interview. Daddy and the Pie is what opened my eyes to Toth as well and I'm fortunate to have come across and immediately purchased the By Design book as well when I randomly found it in a comic book store shortly after it came out. As mentioned in the interview, it's a great resource and inspiration for character design, esp. for background incidental characters who look like everyday but distinct individuals. I guess it's worth a lot of money now! I sent Toth a few samples of my work as well back in the day and got back similar postcards tearing apart my work---it was tough to read, but I certainly didn't disagree lol. What helped put it in perspective was that when I mentioned it to a fellow pro I knew, he chuckled and said, "Oh, Alex sends those to everyone!" I live in L.A. and regrettably also never had the nerve either to visit Toth at his house, though I think there were many who made the pilgrimmage. Paul is a great guy. Don't expect he'd remember me, but we briefly talked a couple times when we were starting out.

[@comixcrush]

Pleased you liked the chat, Randy. I'm with you on Pie and By Design, especially the incidental characters, what Alex loved to design most. I envy you those postcards - wish I'd just wrote him!

[@randyreynaldo8401]

@@comixcrush And in a funny case of serendipity-just hours after listening to the interview, I was doing some spring cleaning and randomly discovered a kind postcard Paul sent me back in the ‘90s, saying nice things about my work after I sent him a package lol. I noted that I sent a response…I have to admit, I totally forgot about this exchange! Yeah, I have a couple of Toth postcards that I framed.

[@nickelliott1174]

I discovered Toth when he did those early issues of Eclipso in House of Secrets. I began picking up anything he worked on from then on.

[@comixcrush]

You had an eye. I love those stories - Eclipso looks SO MEAN!

[@thomasgreissfan17]

So glad you got Pope to talk about what he's got in store to come out soon! Glad you got that on record

[@comixcrush]

He was ready to share!

[@michaelavolio]

4:36 Pope says "1997" here (talking about when he first came across "Daddy and the Pie") but means "1977," since he was six years old.

[@comixcrush]

I missed that - must have heard it as "1977."

[@mattbellisle2924]

Fantastic interview.... Thank you for the conversation.

[@comixcrush]

Glad you enjoyed it, thanks for saying so.

[@salcho1260]

I love Toth! I got the little instructions that he made on how to animate a tv show and the instructions on how to draw a comic, that is just gold!!!!

[@comixcrush]

Indeed!

[@SmokeyCronie666]

This was incredible! Thank you so much!

[@comixcrush]

Our pleasure!

[@illustratoriusrex5949]

Awesome

[@evolscimoc2888]

Wow, just discoverd this channel. Appreciate the interview as well as the samples of artists and comics mentioned that you share during the conversation. Thank you!

[@comixcrush]

Pleased you enjoyed it, and thanks for saying so, Evol - I have fun making the slides, but it takes a good amount of time, and I've been wondering whether it's worth it, rather to just release more talks/episodes and worry less about the visuals. Food for thought!

[@sonofsound]

Great talk!

[@comixcrush]

Thanks, Lee, glad you liked it!

[@timavers]

Wednesday Comics literally sits on my Tribute to Heroes shelf along with my daughter’s art and my miniature Frank Lloyd Wright window. Pleasure to revisit it for a few moments. Bravo to both Pauls on this episode.

[@comixcrush]

Shine on in the Shrine! Two Pauls thank the Tim.

[@davepraetorius]

Anyone know which podcast Paul is referring to where he said he discussed Heavy Liquid with Shelly Bond and John Workman?

[@comixcrush]

I could not find it, but if I do, I'll let you know here.

[@blacksand6368]

I wonder if Toth got to keep his art. The work not being archival could possible be a factor in that way. “You got me, but I got you too,” in a way.

[@benjaminloudly]

That or it could have to do with the art often being just a part of the production process and not the final product. A comic page or storyboard done in non-archival materials makes sense if the final end result is a published comic or animated short.

[@comixcrush]

He got some back, probably didn't get it all back.

[@comixcrush]

@@benjaminloudly It does, and as Pope said, he got used to those materials working on concept art and model sheets - working FAST! He grew to love them, and could wax poetic on marker tips and juiciness. He got more nuance and character out of markers than most could dream of. But fading is fading, and some stuff is lost. The point you make about the printed object being the thing, is how I look at Toth's work more often than not. Though we can learn something from his originals, he meant it for print, and I prefer looking at his B&W work more than anything, generally.

[@cameronarthur0]

you should get Jaime on here

[@comixcrush]

On my list, tho I'm not sure he'd be game...

[@buzzawuzza3743]

@@comixcrush Los Bros would be GREAT!

[@michaelavolio]

@@comixcrush Yeah, Jaime seems game for interviews in general, despite his introverted nature, but I don't know if he's mentioned Toth as one of his influences, so I don't know if he'd have that much to say about Toth. I've heard Jaime talk more about Owen Fitzgerald, Al Wiseman, Harry Lucey, and Bob Bolling as influences. His and Toth's styles definitely have some similarities, though.

[@landofthesilverpath5823]

​@@michaelavolio perhaps not a big influence on his work in particular. But certainly an admirer.

[@comixcrush]

@@michaelavolio Similarities, and we see Toth sometimes in sketches drawing Magpie or in a Jaime manner. I asked Jaime several years back if Toth was an influence - he said something like, "If someone's good, sure, but it's not like I keep the books around the studio all the time or something."

[@mp77200]

Your channel is an amazing thing! I follow you here and on the podcast addict app since the jp leon episode, it's been an amazing show! I was wondering if you do comics too? I know you teach comics but are you working on something on the side?

[@comixcrush]

Thanks for the kind comments! More episodes in the works... Currently, I'm working on a comic: Blood Orange. 7 chapters up, more to come. It's at www.newdaynoir.com/ In the past, I co-created Trollords, inked for First/DC/Topps - Flash, Fly, 'Mazing Man, El Diablo, Jurassic Park, etc. Also did a picture book in 2010: Night of the Bedbugs. Thanks for asking!

[@mp77200]

@@comixcrush thanks for your answers! I'll check these out! I have another question, I was wondering if you know a website or a book where we can see Toth's process? His inks are incredible but I would love to see his layouts and his pencils. Thanks!

[@comixcrush]

@@mp77200 Copies or scans of his pencils/process are in short supply. Best place is the Bravo For Adventure Artist's Edition, which is pricey ($100 - 14" x 20") but was fairly recently reprinted. I've posted what I can find of his pencils on the ATID instagram, but they're few and far between. I've a few things in the folders, so email me at [e-mail] and try and send you what I can.

[@mp77200]

@@comixcrush thanks you so much! Yes! I've seen the Bravo For adventure on the cartoonist kayfabe channel! Amazing book, I'm thinking on buying it! I just bought the Zorro book, the Spanish version(I don't like the glossy paper) it looks amazing!

[@ottebya]

OMG when are we getting those THB trades? Been wishing for that like FOREVER 😛

[@comixcrush]

Someday soonish, one hopes...

[@thisisowen]

One of my favorite Toth stories that I feel perfectly demonstrates that “messiness” is 39/74 from Witzend #10

[@comixcrush]

I guess it looks messy due to the duo-tone and printing. If one looks at the original art, it's really clean. But the printed version (in whatever form) is all I'd ever known till more recently. I love the look of 39/74, the drawings/compositions/storytelling, and the concept is intriguing, but find the writing/structure perfunctory.

[@rayroberge3667]

Ive always explained hos work (much of it) as "Economy of line", meaningful lines and over time less and less mark makimg to describe form.

[@comixcrush]

Yeah, that's better stated and more specific than "simplicity."

[@billyhynes9798]

So jealous of these chats.

[@comixcrush]

But I do them for you, Billy!

[@landofthesilverpath5823]

Crepax: I really like his style and his storytelling. BUT, I'm just not interested in the erotic subject matter. It's a real turn-off, pun intended. Did he do anything that wasn't pornographic in nature? Obviously, a disturbed mind, at least semi-disturbed. Not that I'm judging him- just an observation. But, I do wonder if back then, there was more money in that genre. Which was a draw for him.

[@michaelavolio]

You might try the first two Fantagraphics volumes of The Complete Crepax, which are collections of his horror comics.

[@robertcook2680]

Tothopath or Tothophile?

[@comixcrush]

Both. Many. I try to use a different moniker every episode :D