INCREDIBLE Fusion 360 Probing Trick that I did not know!

Fusion 360 can update your part position by probing ANYWHERE on the part - regardless of where your origin (aka WCS) is located! This is a huge win for in-process probing and making excellent parts. In this example, it let's me first deck off the top of Op2 which exposes better surfaces that were machined in Op1 to probe to make minor adjustments to the part's Op2 position - automatically with ‪@adskFusion‬a Renishaw probe!
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[@timpaul7000]

@John, If you probe the X and Y width instead of just the two surfaces it'll account for the center of the part. This allows you to use the outside profile tolerance of the part less error. Many people control the tolerance of their first op tighter than required by the print to minimize the second op location error. Great work as always John and team!!!

[@Garrett_Wade]

Happy to see a quick video about this! I actually sent you a message on IG recently about this topic and suggesting it as a video.

[@donutfpv]

This is how I've done my second ops for years in fusion!

[@ryanwarner2990]

Dang John, you've been missing for a long time! That's one of my favorite uses of probing in Fusion.

[@scottwatrous]

I actually did sort of figure this out one day while working on a project with a similar issue. I do a lot of that roughing the part and then come in to probe specific features and get on target for finish passes. Ultimately I tend to put points in space as an origin that generally match the intersection of my different probes planes, just so that in the machine when I'm initially setting up that origin I can probe those same surfaces manually with the control routines without a big chance for error. But there are times like this where some pin or other thing is a good origin to probe on a fixture but not for when the part is installed!

[@ttgtomr]

Hey John, I started using that as well. Works really well, especially on parts that I don't use softjaws for! Learn something new everyday!

[@3073Sean]

Stacked Tolerancing........ I have been using this method for over a year, it does work great, however....... Let's say you're machining a block that is 1 inch square. If you measure the part in X at 1.001 and use this method when you flip for opp two you're going to be off by 0.0005. The same applies to Y. You have to be perfect on the surfaces your measuring from other wise it's going to transfer over to Opp 2. The math... If your part in X is over by .001, you would / I would set stock to leave at -0.0005. Meaning it removes 5 tenths from each side = 1 thou off. Hope this helps. Food for thought, I use the hole method a lot when it allows as John showed, but I don't use a drill bit as they walk. Here are some things I do that has worked really really well and does not do the stacked tolerancing. I model a 0.6 hole thru the part. I drill it with a 0.5 drill, then I bore it with a 1/4 really good endmill. Kennametal or Iscar or Gurhing (sp?). When I bore it, I slow it WAY WAY down. I typically do .001 IPT, 3500 RPM, 230 SFM.... Extremely slow. The reason for this is in most machines, you can put a dial indicator on a vise corner, then push on the table and you can get .001 to .002 movement. When you bore a 0.6 hole, the table is slinging around in a circle and under its own weight can push / deflect out ever so slightly due to centrifugal forces, your table is going in a circle. If you slow it way down, those forces are gone resulting in a near perfect hole. Now, let's say the hole comes out to 0.598 but it's almost perfectly round (nothing is ever perfectly round). Your WCS does not care about the size, it only cares about the very center. I do realize machining advise is like getting 3 redneck truck owners together, one with a Dodge, one with a Chevy, and one with a Ford and asking them,, "What's the best truck I should buy?" Then taking 5 steps back to watch the fight and oh by the way, no one wins.

[@davidawaters]

Interesting 🤔. Good to know that you don’t have to probe the 0,0,0. My only issue with in process probing is when it probes a chip after roughing. I had a process going similar to this and on one part, it probed a chip and moved things way too much (0.015” or so). So I ended up putting a manual stop in place for the operator to check for chips. Most of the time now I probe just the first part and count on the stops to locate subsequent parts.

[@spazzywhitebelt]

You can run a tool path around the probing area cutting air above the part but blasting it with coolant, works pretty well to get chips out of the way

[@pdx_vert4271]

Can you use the same probing in fusion to find an angle? I see the angle along axis in the probing page to allow you to stop the program if it measures over a certain degree out. But is there a way to post that angle to a variable and then use a g68 coordinate rotation to square up the wcs. Would like to be able to toss some parts in and clamp down not perfectly indicated in and probe them, and rotate the wcs angle but can’t figure it out. Thanks

[@jcournoyer2]

At the 1:00 minute mark, what did you mean “probe that coordinate system”? Are you saying, probe the hole and have the coordinate WCS zeroed in x and y, automatically?

[@levikab]

I am wondering, how do you guys survived all this years without knowing this type of stuff in the modern CNC world.

[@customsolutionsinc]

gotta say that is pretty cool.

[@P1-Engineering]

Would love to give this a try but my postprocessor doesn't support the Fusion Probing. Any info out there to incorporate this, doable for some one relatively new to PP editing?.

[@alex_yates]

I do an alignment probe as well along the longest edge. The thing with doing an alignment probe is this though: you have to post the probing cutting toolpaths separately to the probing. For some reason, you can't post any toolpaths along with an "alignment" probe*. So, I post my probing as Op20, and the toolpaths that follow as Op30. *I'm using the Haas post processor for Fusion 360 on my Haas UMC500, so this may not be an issue for everyone...

[@Coert94]

Are you saying you can't post 'align along x (or y) axis' in combination with cutting toolpaths? Because I can do that without any problem.

[@alex_yates]

@@Coert94 Yep, I get an error every time I try and post.... although i can't remember what the error is, and i'm not nex to my machine right now. Your comment gives me hope though! Are you on a on Haas, NGC, standard Fusion post? I'm posting directly to my machine as well (which appears as the Z drive on my laptop), although i can't think that would make a difference...

[@Coert94]

@@alex_yates Strange! Yes I operate a 2021 UMC750ss, so NGC yes. And I use a standard post. I'm posting trough net share on a network folder, I'm not using the 'Haas driver' add-in.

[@alex_yates]

@@Coert94 Interesting... I'll have to take another look at this then. I'm not using the Haas driver add-in either. Thank you for giving me the heads up, it's much appreciated!

[@Coert94]

@@alex_yates any luck so far?

[@steinarne79]

Did you implement probing into your Okuma postprocessor yourself, or does the post processor natively support probling right out of the box? We just bought the Okuma Multus U4000, and got the postprosessor from 3dtechdraw for F360 through Massif. I struggle getting in contact with them to get answers. We are looking for a new way of getting a Okuma postprosessor .

[@nyccnc]

Probing in the fusion post worked out of the box! I have a friend at www.dsi-mfg.com/ who works on posts - I'll see if I can get him to chime in here.

[@dsi-mfg]

We'd be thrilled to help out! There is a post-processor request form at www.dsi-mfg.com/fusion-360 as well as a few other options for getting in touch. Let us know how we can help 👍

[@KonstantinFedosejev]

In the cam module you have the coordinate system so that the tool axis is along the Z-axis, and on your machine the tool axis is located along the Y-axis. Have you made any changes in the postprocessor so that it changes the Z-axis to the Y-axis? Or are these settings made on the machine? Is it possible to change the tool axis by making a setup in the cam module itself?

[@loupitou06fl]

Hi John, thanks for sharing. Could you explain how you update the work corrdinate after probe is done ?

[@precisionc3656]

When you use WCS (work coordinate probing) routine in fusion, it automatically updates the work coordinate during that probe cycle

[@MrRctintin]

@@precisionc3656 so if the original WCS for opp2 was the hole in Johns part, if you then use a probe cycle after the top hat has been removed, and say you do a full new XYZ probe, does the work offset now move to the new probed location, away from the hole? (I’m soon to buy my first electronic probe, rather than using the Haimer I use now)

[@RobMasek]

This also works in hsm works

[@toddmolloy311]

I'm wondering why wouldn't you probe a machine feature like the nice and true jaw Chuck and cad your setup your in your manufacturing model? Now you can standardize machine set up across the shop relative to a vice or jaw no matter the geometry and no searching for coordinates on the floor? The only real thing you would have to watch out for is orientation of opp 2 and perhaps haveing crisp coupons to put in?? I understand it's going to either be hell at the computer or hell at the machine..

[@zajawamotocykle9256]

Hi folks

[@mortcs]

This probing technique assumes that the part was cut correctly in OP 1. Can you use F360 to probe the features of OP 1 to verify that key features are in-spec before removing the part and transitioning to OP 2?

[@mortcs]

Looks like F360 can also do part inspection with the probe. This would allow you to inspect your reference features in OP1 so that you know they are good for probing in WCS on OP2. kzbin.info/www/bejne/qJiXfWSNhN94lck

[@R.Daneel]

Your face cam looks like it has some weird interlacing going on. At least for me. Pause the video while you're moving around. It looks like two overlapping interlaced fields. Easiest to see on your teeth. (Once paused, you can use '.' and ',' to frame forward and back in KZbin). Compare this to the machine in motion, or the computer graphics.

[@jeffl1356]

That's actually strange that the hole doesn't work... why?

[@donutfpv]

The hole will work but if you have a probe tip that's too close to the diameter then your overall calculation won't be very accurate. You get better results from a larger hole or from flat surfaces.

[@jeffl1356]

@DonutFPV I feel dumb... why would the probe size matter when it measures within 0.0001 or something....

[@jst6757]

​@@jeffl1356 because the closer the diamter of the probe gets to the diamter of the hole, the bigger the contact area will be. This will result in a bigger error due to misalignmentin the real world. Imaging probing a 3mm (or 3.001mm) hole with a 3mm probe, theoraticly possible, but the real world result will vary.

[@donutfpv]

@@jeffl1356 What JS T said below. You can do it, it's just not as accurate or reliable.

[@jeffl1356]

@DonutFPV after reading additional posts as well as really thinking about what is happening when probing a hole I have to disagree with both of you... I believe the real problem he is having is hole accuracy and the actual location in the corner of his plate... when he probes the 2 sides of his plated in the center he is halving the error of any out of perpendicular of the machine his plate ... he is actually adding to his inaccuracies by not probing all 4 sides. He is introducing cutter wear inaccuracies into the mix...

[@seanwolfe9321]

This sounds too good to be true…. Let me guess, this all works ONLY if you pay the $1500 fee for the add on….every year?

[@SELG88]

this guy keeps pushing fusion 360, what about other softwares

[@JackFilmTube]

First