Rome's Gay Emperors and Soldiers DOCUMENTARY

[@InvictaHistory]

Ancient sexuality rarely gets talked about and its yet another aspect of daily life in the past that I am excited to explore. What other "How They Did It" topics would you like to see us cover? Inflation, natural disasters, vacations...?

[@VieneLea]

Inflation sounds awsome. The story of Portugal going bankrupt 4 times in a decade is always fun to hear.

[@seandawson5899]

​@@VieneLea yeah but remember how good we were at sailing?

[@jerryjohnson4008]

Welp. Up until this moment, this was my 5 year old's favorite history show, this and kings and generals. But I see, our agenda in modern day is being pushed now, I doubt we will see the brothels and other sexual services of the Roman empire which were vast, unfortunately, which goes to show the modern influence in reading the past. This crossed a line where now I have to prescreen it for him. 🤦

[@emmaarmo379]

@@jerryjohnson4008 So emperors like Elagabalus were totally straight, right? 😂 The gays have always existed. You can talk about agendas all day long, but every time a gay person comes in history, that's too much and we have to revise history to exclude them? You're the ones trying to rewrite history, and hopefully one day your 5 year old learns that you don't have to hate people who are different from you

[@jerryjohnson4008]

@@neroxen_ um. No. I'm not. I'm not speaking nonsense. You know I'm not speaking nonsense. The fact that EVERYTHING has to be sexualized to appease a specific group of people be that whoever it is...is becoming...borderline abusive at this point. Everyone knows Rome was a sexualized, and the reason become corrupt, in some cases can be directly linked to its over sexualizing of their society...it did rot...from the inside. Pretty much every society that over sexualized, became weak and collapsed. We can tell by pottery, we can tell so well by images in pottery, we can now guess within a century of a particular kind of warrior when it's sexualized it's signs of internal collapse. 🤦 But we don't want to say what it meant when warriors in pottery went from being soldiers thrusting spears to soldiers looking feminine in couchs. This is a direct link to collapse. We know, it wasn't just Athens and Rome, it was also the Minoans, who preexisted both, too, show this effect. 🤦 But we won't mention it, cause it doesn't suit our modern agenda as a society. But those are signs of society in the process of eating itself from the inside. 🤦 Want to talk about the history of the sexuality but they don't want to tell you the effects were detrimental to those societies in the long term 🤦...and it's almost 100% of the time.

[@nickshaffer80]

“Rome wasn’t a society of straights and gays; it was an empire of Tops and Bottoms”

[@sandeepatwalspeaks]

Absolutely, the fact that (in Roman opinion) a Roman has full control over his body and no one else controls him but he controls others like s!aves, youth and poor by being Top in relationship, being Top is status symbol of being the controller of others' bodies, it was not like today where for a woman is on top (cowgirl) of dominant male in a heteros*xu@l relationship is seen as not controversial, but for Romans it was evidence of that man's lack of control and "dominance" over others be it female, and so explains the logic of why their s*xu@lity was in terms of Top and Bottom

[@geemooney2229]

Well said!

[@rosiehawtrey]

Reminds me of so many blackadder quotes... "I don't care if he's been rogering the Duke of York with a prize winning leek..." + And the whole situation with Percy and the Bishop of Bath & Wells And male Hooker Baldrick + that aged well 🤦‍♀️😳

[@qetoun]

Not to mention that because slaves were ''non-people'' sexual acts between them and their masters where not regarded as substantial. Even in relation to marital faithfulness.

[@theobell2002]

Based Romans?

[@stevenalvarado-doc7334]

Biggus Dickus was noted for his generosity under the stands in the Colluseum.

[@legateelizabeth]

How can we be sure Biggus Diccus was gay? He had a wife, you know…

[@stevenalvarado-doc7334]

@@legateelizabeth so did Nero.

[@The_Caledonian]

@@legateelizabeth His wife was actually formal centurion, Titanus Testus, but she transitioned and married Biggus Dickus, who we now formerly know as Tightus Absentus Cervicus.

[@marsultor6131]

@@legateelizabeth oh really, didn’t know. Do you now what she is called?

[@ramenbomberdeluxe4958]

Yeah, his cousin, Testicules the Huge, was rather unlucky in this department, and swore vengeance upon him one day. Testicules would eventually be found dead in a ditch, bleeding profusely

[@conorcrowley6256]

>Nero involved in a love triangle with a man named pythagoras The writers of this stuff just got lazy at times

[@nvmtt]

lol, didnt even notice that.

[@nunyabiznes33]

@@nvmtt That's the first thing I noticed, like "WTF was his name again?!"

[@deboralee1623]

Bah-dum-dum-tsss!

[@Bottleofwater-n5y]

feels like they were just obtuse people, thinking this was a good joke

[@edwardmiessner6502]

Bada bing!

[@marolyn6319]

"Found him when stripped to be equal to his reputation" The amount in which the scandalous undertones are kept downplayed in this delivery is amazing.

[@damonmitchell8088]

What the hell that even mean???

[@TimOLearyOnline]

@@damonmitchell8088 The guy's reputation was that he had a big dong. When Elegabalus saw him naked, he learned the rumors were true.

[@Imagionis]

@@damonmitchell8088 Dude was hung

[@damonmitchell8088]

@@Imagionis #AmeriKKKa

[@edwardmiessner6502]

@@damonmitchell8088 "He wanks as high as any in Rome!" That's what it means 😆😆😆

[@konstantinriumin2657]

If there is one rule to human history, is that if you are powerful enough, every social rule becomes a suggestion

[@scintillam_dei]

Glad that Alexander the Great destroyed the gayest city in Greece.

[@olorin1710]

When you are a star they let you do it, you can do anything - 🍊

[@froggykekinson4365]

It's funny, because as history enthusiasts we spend hours studying about laws and traditions when some of these mfs simply don't give a damn.

[@staC-wh6ik]

It takes only one man to change the course of history.

[@timoverdijk3176]

As a soon to be historian i do have to say that roman emperors were often portrayed feminine, subservient etc by sources like cassius dio due to their bad relationship with the senate. This makes some claims quite dubious by the ancient authors.

[@InvictaHistory]

That's certainly valid and many of these accounts are likely exaggerated. But even if the claims are not true they still help give us understanding of sexual mores.

[@timoverdijk3176]

@@InvictaHistory also true. If you need help with research in the future i might be able to help to a certain extent. Especially ancient history is my forté

[@lucidmemez9634]

They knew this and still made the video. How bastardly.

[@gianlucarossi5672]

@@InvictaHistory We have to be careful not to romanticize Roman homosexuality that was about power, dominance, and masculinity. Free, upper-class Romans imposed their power over usually unfree men with a lower status. The free Roman should always preserve the masculine role in every sexual encounter. Otherwise, he will be mocked, humiliated, and despised by the Romans. Hence homosexual relationships between free Romans were a big taboo.

[@InvictaHistory]

@@gianlucarossi5672 we included this context in the beginning portions of our video

[@elemanuel6079]

Roman Grindr profiles would be like: "Masc4Masc, no fems, no fats, no twinks, Str8 acting only"

[@Akimittsun]

Also basically everyone would label themself as a top even if they weren't

[@lawrencestrabala6146]

🤣🤣🤣

[@septimiusseverus343]

Kek

[@storyspren]

@@Akimittsun "I'm a top. Except if you're of a higher social class than me, in which case I will bottom, but only for the sake of propriety. Not a bottom. Equites and Senatores hmu"

[@rsmith7912]

Same as today then really emanuel. The Romans did have the luxury of having no mobile phones back then though and had to actually meet each other in their daily lives. It was like that until about the year 2000 really which was so much more fun. Then everything changed in how we meet partners to just a lazy finger swipe. Prince was so right back in 1983 with his hit song '1999' when he sang '2 thousand zero zero, party over, oops, out of time'. That man saw the future.

[@yannsteunou-murray6512]

"It's not gay if you're a top' - Ancient Rome (Great video in all seriousness, deals with a complex topic in a very accessible manner)

[@caesertullo1824]

Yeah I'm sure the rainbow flag in the thumbnail doesn't make a mockery of gay men. And this video doesn't push any agenda. Tomorrow's the day all the Twitter profike pics stop being rainbow colored and go back to their normal logos. I'm always amazed how much pandering people can take without seeing it as demeaning.

[@yannsteunou-murray6512]

@@caesertullo1824 que

[@caesertullo1824]

@@psyssi actually yeah I am. and I find pride month to be extremely pandering. I just want to find a husband and live in peace. I don't need companies trying to woo me, I don't need historians to create videos for me. I'm an educated gay man. I understand how things worked in rome, we've been hearing about it for decades. This video isn't new or interesting.

[@plasticene7713]

@@caesertullo1824 How is it hard for you to realise other people might not have the same knowledge around this topic you do? for an educated person you seem to lack common sense.

[@allancastellon9248]

@@caesertullo1824 how are you so self centered you get annoyed that people make content for people who ARE interested in it.

[@gianlucarossi5672]

In contrast to the modern view, social class mattered greatly in the acceptability of homosexual relations. In ancient Rome, sexuality for men was related to ideas of masculinity and male domination. The upper classes were much more likely to indulge in homosexual acts, and masters had the sexual use of their slaves. But homosexual relations between freeborn Romans were regarded as disgraceful. There was no equality between the sexes in regard to homosexual acts. While subject to certain strictures, male homosexuality was tolerated in many cases. Lesbianism, however, was much less common and seems to have been universally considered reprehensible. Hence, unlike in Greece, relationships between two freeborn males of the same status were not typical and indeed, the Romans disdained and condemned such relations as demonstrating the participants’ effeminacy. Instead, ‘acceptable’ same-sex relationships were between freeborn Roman men and slaves, prostitutes, entertainers, or foreign men as long the Romant is the active, dominant, and not the passive party during intercourse. Furthermore, according to the Romans, the necessary attribute for sexual intercourse was the phallus. Because females were seen as unable to take on an ‘active’ role in a relationship, lesbianism was generally taboo throughout Roman history.

[@InvictaHistory]

This is great additional context. Thanks for posting

[@stevenhuffnagel]

What about the actual era of the Roman Empire? Obviously the scandalous history of Elagabalus happened during the late and decadent period of the empire. When we look at the history of the Roman Empire, the timeline or era does actually matter. I don't think it's different when it comes to history from a sexual point of view. (Obviously I understand it is a very difficult subject to research with an independent sight because sources are biased.)

[@BacklTrack]

Wow the elite have always been degenerate freaks

[@kimashitawa8113]

I'm curious, why was it taboo if they didn't even really count intercouse between women as real sex?

[@colddarkness1798]

It was bisexual empire tbh

[@stalwartteakettlepotato9879]

"I'm not gay. I have relationships with women... and sex with men" Emperor Trajan

[@PackHunter117]

Therefore bisexual

[@Aphelia.]

Fellas is it gay to have relationships with women... and sex with men -Emperor Trajan (probably)

[@huntarthebarbarian8407]

“And I got news for you; that means you're gay” Some Christian living in Roman

[@PackHunter117]

@@huntarthebarbarian8407 😂

[@nunyabiznes33]

@Tacidian The Christians were too prudish LOL. I heard they also complained about all the abortions the Romans were having. Just yeet them into the Tiber!

[@legateelizabeth]

Hadrian lost his lover so turned him into a god and nearly wiped an entire cultural-religious group from existence because he was in such grief. Talk about relationship goals.

[@zawwin1846]

Well he did drown himself to save the emperor's life out of love.

[@eduardolombello1776]

if only it was more than nearly...

[@Michael_the_Drunkard]

@@eduardolombello1776 dare I say based?

[@eduardolombello1776]

@@Michael_the_Drunkard thank you, basileus. how is Basil doing?

[@septimiusseverus343]

_I learned about it from my tutor. I took mental notes and applied the lessons in full when in Caledonia. My trigger though was them leaving their women and children to us. As a dedicated family man, that made me _*_very_*_ angry. Too bad I couldn't finish the job. >:(_

[@marvinbone1379]

The good illustrations, with just the right amount of subtle movements, sincerely helped my ability to process the names, circumstances and details. I have trouble paying attention, and this animation was like a light-bulb, going on, this late in life.

[@hippo440]

my jaw dropped hearing "he gave political positions to men according to the size of their genitalia" holy shitt 😭

[@haku7335]

Ah yes. Elagabalus. The femboy goat

[@_kreetch9231]

@@hippo440 such a diva

[@kennypham3856]

I know that there was no such thing as 'gay' or 'bisexual' back then, but today most of these men would be considered bisexual rather than gay.

[@BiblicallyAccurateToaster]

Yeah, like Invictus said & from what I've read it was more of a dominance thing among the males that participated (mainly the upper class who did.) One thing I don't think I heard in this video was that it was generally looked down on within Roman society if they were the male in the "passive" role. Of course social views on same sex relations in general back then went through various changes over the many many centuries of the Roman Empire. Imo our modern lens on these things don't allow us to hold a proper perspective from which to truly understand how they culturally viewed this subject. There's too much modern baggage surrounding same sex relations to ever allow us to grasp how every day average Romans honestly viewed these things.$

[@innitbruv-lascocomics9910]

@@BiblicallyAccurateToaster He actually did mention this in the beginning of the vide

[@blitzkyyy]

it’s an umbrella term

[@shnilikmw]

They would sexually fluid or homo-flexible by todays standards. To be bisexual, you need to know their intentions or active attractions. Two straight guys can play with each other without being bisexual. He said in the video, sexuality wasn’t based on gender but dominance. It’s why today they say its “masculine” to top another guy.

[@ivanrodriguez268]

most men today are bisexual but dont act on it, no need to as women are free to sleep with whoever they want

[@waplington]

"How they did it" takes on new meaning in this video 🤣👌

[@ktheterkuceder6825]

Romans:its okay to be gay as long he is lower than you in hierarchy and you are on the top.

[@arrow1414]

That is the Prison Ethos today.

[@ktheterkuceder6825]

@@arrow1414 And navy.

[@arrow1414]

@@ktheterkuceder6825 Mostly the Marines.

[@ktheterkuceder6825]

@@arrow1414 Come on. We bothknow the navy is gay butt of the jokes in us military.

[@Michael_the_Drunkard]

Still not gay. Bisexual. I have to say, that our binary sexual identities didn't exist back then. Pure homosexuals were rare. Usually you had dominant males with wife or sometimes multiple, who banged effeminate low-status males for pleasure. That was the way of pagan sexual morals, atleast until the arrival of Christianity.

[@Moribus_Artibus]

5:58 Id like to clarify here that the word you're looking for is "Catamite" not "Sodomite" which would creep up in the Latin vocabulary much later.

[@jtgd]

I learned that from HBO’s Rome “Do you not see that Pompey may be broken like a Dacian catamite and still be dangerous?”

[@joellaz9836]

Yeah. Sodomite is a biblical word. A bit weird for early Romans to be using it.

[@Moribus_Artibus]

@@joellaz9836 Im blown away by how we still use it. Like every now and then you'll hear a report saying someone got "sodomized"

[@Valmontst]

Correct

[@TheMeanGirlz]

@@Moribus_Artibus 😏😏

[@icarus372]

Vercingetorix: "Why are you gae?" Caesar: "Who says I'm gae?" Vercingetorix: "You are gae."

[@MaxwellAerialPhotography]

Caesar to Vercingetorix: why are you running, why are you running?!?

[@wxj5640]

LGBTI, where is the H?

[@arnaldoenriquez6191]

LMAO

[@TheMania56]

confusion of da highest orda🤣

[@nunyabiznes33]

Caesar: "I'm not gae!" Vercingetorix: "So who is gae?"

[@youvebeengreeked]

Listening about Nero made me think, it would be good to see a mini series on the Years of the 4/5/6 emperors: 4 emperors in 69 AD (Galba, Otho, Vitellius, Vespasian) 5 emperors in 193 AD (Pertinax, Didius, Niger, Albinus, Severus) 6 emperors in 238 AD (Thrax, Gordian I, Gordian II, Pupienus, Balbinus, Gordian III) Byzantines too I guess: 4 emperors in 641 AD (Heraclius, Constantine III, Heraklonas, Constans II) 4 emperors in 1042 AD (Michael V, Zoe, Theodora, Constantine IX)

[@alessandrogini5283]

Yes!!! Also, should be made a video about the First Roman sassanid war,with hatra Armenians and parthians joined Roman Side

[@youvebeengreeked]

@RadBaeron lol

[@praetorianguard5696]

As a Pretorian Guard I can confirm. Moreover as Pretorians we don't discriminate between sexual orientations, we just slay them all equally! For the Glory of Rome, of course!

[@Sharp931]

And increased salary

[@PraveenJose18551]

One of the funniest bits of info is how the Romans we often associated the most with ultra-masculinity, were famous for their romances with their boyfriends. Sulla/Metrobius and Hadrian/Antonious comes to mind.

[@markmuller7962]

Alexander the Great tho on the Greek-culture front

[@PraveenJose18551]

@@markmuller7962 Alexander's is a bit more contested, ancient sources vary from calling him gay and hating women's bldies to saying he's straightest man ever who kept large harem of women

[@markmuller7962]

@@PraveenJose18551 Yes and I don't think the different sources are mutually exclusive

[@gianlucarossi5672]

This is a modern interpretation of ancient history. Early Romans called homosexuality a Greek import, a costume that has weakened the Romans. Hadrian was criticized by the Romans for not quitting his relationship with Antoninus. Plus, in Roman homosexuality the "preservation of a man’s masculinity" was predicated upon his taking the masculine role in every sexual encounter and that "the slur was to have taken on the woman’s role in such acts."

[@luiscastaneda5250]

@@PraveenJose18551 yeah large harem of women for the guy who spent most of his life surrounded by men 😆🤣

[@rahman9749]

This kinda explained why quite the number of the old Roman emperors had no biological successors (Trajan, particularly). Those emperors had to adopt a man to succeed them while in later era people with the same kind of power and position would've had succession problems because they had too many biological sons.

[@somethindarker]

Don't matter, Hadrian might've been gay but he was probably the most based Emperor of his era.

[@leonardodavid2842]

Not really. First of all, it isn’t at all clear what Trajan’s sexual habits were, and no evidence whatsoever to suggest he was against having children with a woman. Instead, it was actually expected of the emperor during the era of the five good emperors to not pass down the throne by inheritance but instead choose a candidate which the senate could agree with. The Nerva-Antonine dynasty was after all was born out of the dethroning of a spoiled brat born in the purple. In this circumstances to have a son was not advisable. To have a son meant to out one’s child in danger, as the successor might inevitably have to do something about a potential enemy. Marcus Aurelius was the first to have many sons, and was also the man whom ended the reign of the five good emperors by allowing his son to become emperor. Antoninus Pius (a distinguished senator, in fact the richest private citizen and perhaps the most popular senator) for example, was chosen in part because he had no living heir: Both his sons had died and his successors were not chosen by him.

[@dmorgan0628]

@@somethindarker Exactly

[@rahman9749]

@@somethindarker I wasnt arguing about the quality of the emperors. Its just the fact about the lack of biological heirs for quite a lot of Roman Emperors.

[@rahman9749]

@@leonardodavid2842 interesting, I might look it up later. Thanks for the insight buddy.

[@rosiehawtrey]

To paraphrase Cohen the Barbarian... "Never enter an ass kicking contest with a Roman Emperor who just buried his bit of rough trade..." And look up the LOTR secret diaries, I'm sure you'll appreciate it. Do not be eating or drinking. *I MEAN IT*

[@EntropicTroponin]

Very interesting topic. And it seems like the animator had a field day

[@Eddie-wr2fh]

"What happens in Germania, stays in Germania" 10/10 quote

[@SimoLInk1698]

One take I can get from this is that Nero threw some WILD parties.

[@xijinping4418]

Probably a lot of fun

[@adriansz343]

Honestly this is just another one of those tiny slices of life that I know so little about, but makes ancient history so nuanced and interesting! Good job Invicta and team!

[@justjohn1121]

Invicta! Please make a long video about the death of Antinous. What the theories are, who disliked him, who benefited from his death, all and everything you can dig up. 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@philiplarussa6104]

As Invicta mentioned, themselves, it's not entirely clear how Antinous died. The sources conflict regardless of relative reliability, and obviously there's no archaeological evidence almost 2000 years later. All we know for sure is that he died in Egypt, probably on the Nile, and that Hadrian was so devastated that he deified Antinous. It's unclear who (if anyone) may have benefitted from the death of Antinous.

[@bigbluebuttonman1137]

Rome's sexuality in a nutshell: "Never be a reciever."

[@Frenchfrys17]

Unless you were a child or young teenager in which case you were considered more desirable than a woman. Or if you were a slave.

[@patrickluchycky1172]

At least never admit it. I'm sure the roles were fairly equal in private.

[@patricknielsen6329]

9:30 "in his relations with boys he harmed no one" i'm curious, what do "harmed no one" mean? that he didn't straight up abused them? that it was consensual? what were the standards for no harm done. seen as I can not imagine any of the boys would have been in any position to refuse

[@dimitartodorov4826]

He literally had sex with boys which were probably under 18 years old. Disgusting, I cant believe people see this and act like there is nothing wrong.

[@sungjoonchang5127]

Harmed no one as in didn’t offend anyone, unlike Nero or Elagabalus

[@patricknielsen6329]

@@dimitartodorov4826 i don't, I was just asking for the Roman standard of not harming. Besides it happened in the past so we can't really change anything about it. I don't have to begin every sentence about the topic by saying "this disgust me" And there more hetosexual people, so these things happened even more to underage girls. But people become more outraged when it's boys, I don't get it.

[@chrissibersky4617]

They got candy when they were sent on their way. No harm done.

[@mortache]

Well compared to other sex slaves, that is

[@kissanminttu---]

I have always thought that Cassius Dio's writings about Trajan and Hadrian being lovers was just anti-Hadrian propaganda. Senators really despised Hadrian, so it's not suprising. But if i remember correctly, didn't Dio also suggest something that Trajan and Nerva had relationship too? Anyway usually roman historians should be taken with huge grain of salt. Edit: Found that quote. It's from wikipedia so idk reliability "Trajan's putative lovers included the future emperor Hadrian, pages of the imperial household, the actor Pylades, a dancer called Apolaustus, Lucius Licinius Sura, and Trajan's predecessor Nerva."

[@huanquocmanh416]

Cassius dio sure sounds like a degenerate fujoshi

[@marocat4749]

Or there was a relationship that was gossiped about and they straight up used that as propaganda material. Or to use that to mock him. It does not mean that they werent lovers , at least not at a point. Hell the rainbow press drags real relationships the most around. Which , i dont think gossip worked different then.

[@Gizzatow]

Прежде всего Траян и Адриан были родственниками,а императором последнего сделала жена Траяна подделав усыновление мужем Адриана.

[@DarkSamael55]

Roman legionnaire: dominant and infertile Greek femboy slave: submissive and breedable

[@lifeisexhausting1069]

my toxic trait is wishing i was born during this era to live my bottom fantasy

[@blondebishonen]

me too bestie

[@bispo5671]

BRO?????

[@jamiesnack]

tfw will never have roman boywife

[@xijinping4418]

Real

[@jacobv3396]

Thank you for discussing this topic. This video was very interesting and educational. Too many people think that Ancient Roman culture reflects the Christian-dominated Western societies that we are familiar with.

[@orkhepaj]

shutup woke

[@Saintofloneliness]

THIS!!!

[@loowick4074]

When the ancient pre-christian society were in fact not a carbon copy of Christian societies.

[@uhbaoifuhoiafj456]

? Realy ? The Romans are very diffrent from the Roman church especially in their values. War, Sex, Partys the Romans were full of sin in the eyes of the church. They were indeed labled as heathens by the later roman church.

[@kpaxchocho3327]

This is all lies

[@Jean-LucPicard85]

In a book "Caesar Against the Celts" by Ramon L. Jimenez there's mention that Julius Caesar's enemies sometimes mocked him by referring to him as "Queen of Bithynia" over an alleged scandal from his youth during Rome's war with Mithridates. Quote: "Caesar was dispatched to Bithynia on the southern coast of the Black Sea to persuade King Nicomedes II to make his fleet available for use by Marcus Thermus in the Aegean. In return for the use of the fleet, Nicomedes desired that Caesar share his bed and, reportedly, Caesar complied. Although sexual encounters of this kind were commonplace in the Mediterranean world, the idea of a patrician playing the role of a male prostitute caused a scandal in Rome." Caesar always denied this and there's no way to know for sure if it's true but it stuck with him to an extent and it tracks with the idea of Roman sexuality revolving around social standing and role.

[@RomanFanboy]

Tominus Maximus did an excellent video about who was gayer the Romans or Greeks

[@LGBTR3naissance]

Great well researched video on the subject and I was glad you focused on three of Ancient Rome's notable gay Caesars while there was a whole plethora of them. Even Julius Caesar was referred to as "Every woman's man and every man's woman." Nevertheless it is intriguing how attitudes towards same sex relationships predating Christianity were, how they fit within the structures of societies at the time and did not carry the ramifications as they did in later periods. Yet when it comes to sex in Imperial Rome, it presents a timeless hard truth of the effects that rulers, good and bad, can have on world superpowers.

[@Elzimbabwe.]

gross

[@LGBTR3naissance]

@@Elzimbabwe. Hey, that was Ancient Rome for you.

[@Elzimbabwe.]

@@LGBTR3naissance yup, we should stay away from it, totally agree, thanks

[@LGBTR3naissance]

@@Elzimbabwe. I am not sure what you are implying. If you do not approve of LGBT relationships then you are entitled to your own beliefs (if that is what you meant). Correct me if I am wrong. The main point I was making in my comment is that when you have people who can satisfy their passions with no moral or legal accountability coupled with corruption, it can create monsters.

[@Elzimbabwe.]

@@LGBTR3naissance true

[@Itcouldbebunnies]

Unfortunately, Hadrian's autobiography was lost to the sands of time. On the bright side, there is still the wonderful novel 'Memoirs of Hadrian' by Marguerite Yourcenar, which provides us with a very vivid account of Hadrian's affair with Antinous.

[@doweetoz3607]

So a woman born in 1903 gives a very vivid account? Huh.

[@Itcouldbebunnies]

@@doweetoz3607 Oh look, a pedantic child on the internet found an insignificant writing error to whine about. Wow, such a rare occurance! Thank you so much for this unique experience!

[@mikhailvarkovsky4150]

No thanks, i don't feel like reading some obscure fujoshi fanfiction literally pull out of her ass

[@napoleonibonaparte7198]

I speak Spanish to God, Italian to women, French to men, and German to my horse.

[@Gideonthestargazer]

And you type in English to KZbin.

[@skyhappy]

404 funny not found

[@Yan-mr5pp]

lmao of course this comes from a guy called Napoleon

[@ramenbomberdeluxe4958]

I know where this is from and I approve lmao

[@scintillam_dei]

There are different versions of that quote, and you chose the degenerate one. He said "Hablo latín con Dios, español con las tropas, francés con las damas, italiano con los músicos, alemán con los lacayos e inglés con mis caballos y perros". I SPEAK LATIN WITH GOD, SPANISH WITH THE TROOPS, FRENCH WITH THE LADIES, ITALIAN WITH THE MUSICIANS, GERMAN WITH MY LACKEYS, AND ENGLISH WITH MY HORSES AND DOGS.

[@Dorian-lq3up]

Thank you for putting this out there, the good, the bad and the ugly. As with things now history is complicated.

[@pgroove163]

This is like a happy pride month video... 🤣🤣💅

[@mutsuzawa]

@@pgroove163 History is not that complicated. We just looking at the past and interpretation it through a modern lens that makes it seem complicated.

[@bigbeefy1]

@@mutsuzawa what do you mean?

[@mutsuzawa]

@@bigbeefy1 What I mean is we need to stop including the minority as if they are the norm they are not. Even in antiquity homosexuality was not the norm and was frowned upon. Besides why does a minority group get a whole month of celebration just because of who they sleep with. It's stupid. It's a slap in the face of Black Americans and a slap in the face of all peoples in the world. If a person is a homosexual who cares. It is nothing special, nothing to be celebrated. Focus on what the people from the past did and their contribution to world. Just being a homosexual means absolutely nothing. Just the same as being heterosexuals means nothing. The same sex community needs to get over itself. Focus on history, not who they slept with.

[@Dorian-lq3up]

Before people get mad, notice I said often and not all straight people.

[@Endariel]

A history Professor once told me, the Romas had a large book were all thinable heterosexual and homosexual "poses" were described and judged if the manly man would be regarded as "on top" enough.

[@rezq9109]

Hadrian and Antinous relationships sound the most legitimate overall. Other pieces of history have more to do with "rich people being crazy" rather than being homosexual.

[@michielvoetberg4634]

I already knew Hadrians story. But this went into great detail. Fascinating and very well presented

[@Michael_the_Drunkard]

How is Hadrian exclusively homossxual, if he had a wife as well? Makes no sense!

[@The-Plaguefellow]

@@Michael_the_Drunkard I mean, you *can* marry someone without loving them... Point of fact, such was the norm for almost all but a handful of nobles until fairly recently... Marriage was more about producing legitimate heirs than it was about love or s*x...

[@septimiusseverus343]

@@Michael_the_Drunkard They did have a notoriously poor marriage, which Hadrian only put up with for convenience. From the ancient sources, it seems that he did have a clear preference for men, but there's still a lot we don't know about the guy.

[@XMeK]

@@Michael_the_Drunkard Marriage was often used for political reasons. Marrying into a powerful clan raised man's social status, and was considered a sign of capability since he had to be accepted by the patriarch.

[@huanquocmanh416]

He was a femboi enjoyer This is well known He wasnt gay at all. He didnt take dicks like plenty mentioned here He and trajan were cousins so its normal trajan favored him more than others

[@ancientsitesgirl]

Finally there will be something about my beloved TRAJAN! I have recently admired his buildings in Egypt, Turkey and Greece!💗

[@marcmarc7454]

I just love your channel!

[@KrisvanLaar]

Yes, finally something about Trajan. All they ever talk about is Hadrian

[@nicart004]

My complements to the person who animated the Roman citizens, it was very chic and stylish, very great presentation.

[@cennon]

So it's like prison. If you're pitching, it's not seen as being gay.

[@williambenner5550]

Basically they were bi, not truly gay. This is what I get from observing Roman history.

[@emmaarmo379]

bisexuality was more tolerated than homosexuality, but there were still gays. there are multiple sources that indicate trajan preferred men, and from all accounts it seems like hadrian had a very deep relationship with antinous

[@avalonv6559]

I think our modern terms in general are way too rigid to encompass human sexuality. This understanding and rigid categorisation is literally not even 200 years old, and I think though we have a general obsession with rigid categorisation in the modern age, every human regardless of their label is much more fluid than we are led to believe.

[@GoErikTheRed]

I get the impression from some of these stories that they were gay, and just trying to keep up appearances by having wives

[@thatoneguyii5458]

There's also the fact that ifu were dominant role during sex regardless if they were copulating with a man or woman, the emperors were still straight in the eyes of their Roman peers

[@andrewsuryali8540]

@@GoErikTheRed Correct. Both Trajan and Hadrian had wives who made a name for themselves (especially Pompeia Plotina, Trajan's wife) but there's a reason they were both childless.

[@BornofIron]

So are you guys in the comment section just really *passionate* about the topic or just *uncomfortable* about yourselves?

[@Finkeren]

It's almost cute how mad they get.

[@handlessuck777]

Who, all the gays?

[@arielschant9841]

Incredibly interesting video! Great content! Thank you

[@gringlebandersnatch]

Of course the emperor gets to bring his twinks with him.

[@mrrandom1265]

Remember: It ain't gay if he's your slave

[@SisterWomen]

I am refreshed by the comments here. Laughing at their own corny jokes is much better than a prejudiced meltdown. I applaud you, fellow tone deaf comics. The channel is awesome for their unapologetic addressing of this topic.

[@purplebrick131]

The backlash on this video is the best example of why it's important to make these videos.

[@F40PH-2CAT]

That is totally.....not the proper take here

[@aarizaaban6082]

@@F40PH-2CAT then what is?

[@emprahsfinest7092]

"My audience doesn't like something... hmmm the solution must be to do more of it!"

[@aarizaaban6082]

@@emprahsfinest7092 cope

[@baneofbanes]

@@emprahsfinest7092 yah I wouldn’t want a audience of homophobes who get butthurt over historical facts. If you want to be a snowflake go be one somewhere else.

[@xtremeranger30]

You forgot Constantine the Great's youngest son, Constans I who had male favorites among his among elite guard and barbarian hostages.

[@andreascovano7742]

And was killed by the sadly heretical but very capable Constantius II.

[@xtremeranger30]

​@@andreascovano7742 Constantius II didn't kill his brother, but they did have an uneasy alliance as co-emperors. It was the usurper Magnentius in Gaul who managed to turn Constans legions against him and killed him.

[@maximusmedia8412]

That would be interesting, after all, he was the son of the first Christian emperor when gay stuff was beginning to be seen as sinful

[@sherlocksmuuug6692]

@@maximusmedia8412 Small correction: Constantine *legalized* christianity and allowed religious freedom through the empire, but it is still unclear whether he himself ever converted.

[@jerryc8096]

@@sherlocksmuuug6692 Good point; in fact the overwhelming material evidence indicated that Constantine's 'deathbed conversion' story was a later fabrication.

[@ethanstewart4577]

I was born in the wrong era… like man i wanna be deified by my emperor boyfriend 😩

[@DarkSamael55]

For real brah I need a femboy wife

[@ewest4817]

@@DarkSamael55 ask and you shall receive

[@DarkSamael55]

@@ewest4817 Ayyyt you'll become my femboy wife

[@Valmontst]

😂😂😂😂😂

[@MystaKilla33]

You grossly missunderstand the word love And how it was used in ancient text.

[@samym1694]

There is a game called "Expedition Rome" that even as a "Male" Main Character, have a romance option on male characters from the start such as Bestia and Caeso. Speaking of a game, Invicta, can make a review about "Expedition Rome" like you did to "Rome 2 Total War"?

[@danielchequer5842]

Hbow good would you say this game is

[@hughle9617]

@@danielchequer5842 excellent! Very immersive and if you like turn based rpg this would be a near perfect game. Every choice has consequences as well

[@baronghede2365]

I am Pagan and straight but I fully support the LGBTQ community, Blessed Be.

[@TetsuShima]

*Fun fact:* Nero and Sporus' relationship was actually depicted in the docu-series "Ancient Rome: The Rise and Fall of an Empire". The scene in which Sporus gets castrated by the order of Nero (brillantly played here by Michael Sheen) is extremely uncomfortable to watch, actually By the way, Caligula should be also in this list, as he was known for having a bis*xuality so open, he basically banged everything he saw. In fact, some legends say he once ordered the Praetorian guards to p*netrate him one by one

[@TiberiusGracchusII]

I vividly recall that episode. And from that point on Michael Sheen will ALWAYS be NERO to me....Wonderful performance. Also James Darcy as Tiberius Gracchus previous episode was awesome as well, hence why I took the name.

[@TetsuShima]

@@TiberiusGracchusII Yeah. Michael Sheen's Nero is one of the best portrayals of the historical character without any doubt. Only surpassed by the bratty Peter Ustinov in "Quo Vadis" and the calculating Anthony Andrews in "A.D.". I also loved the way Vespasian, Titus, Constantine, Alaric and Honorius were portrayed in the same docu-series "DON'T YOU DAAAAAAAAAARE"

[@KaizerRemix]

And of course Julius Caesar. A husband to every woman and a wife to every man.

[@TetsuShima]

@@KaizerRemix "All the men will be women and every woman will be a man". That's how the ancient prophecy of the six Caesars written by the priests of Apollo referred to Julius' bisexuality

[@starcapture3040]

@@TetsuShima Tiberius too had sex with boys as its rumored in Capri Island in his villa while Octavin was rumored to have had sex with Julius thus becoming his favorite. but all in all these stuff are written sometimes to be propaganda against these emperors. but from social point of view I can trust the satyricon a roman novel

[@justheretocommentonvideos3013]

Mad respect for you, man. This topic is often very much conveniently ignored by a portion of today's individuals, who also idolize Rome. Glad to see you aren't afraid to shed light on a thing the self designated romaboos hate to hear that it's not a recent development in society and instead has existed ever since we have.

[@Papa_Susej]

@@sunwheels I think it's the association of a romaboo is also a homophobe. I have heard this accusation get thrown around, but I've never actually seen it in the wild. Mainly because I avoid the weird internet forums.

[@BoarhideGaming]

@@sunwheels It's not about "those who are infatuated with Roman history". It's probably about all those fascists that repaint roman history to fit their fascist ideals, and there are many, many, many of them.

[@justheretocommentonvideos3013]

@@BoarhideGaming You are the one who gets it.

[@ramenbomberdeluxe4958]

@@BoarhideGaming Yeah, like, people think Rome was this perfect superior society that did no wrong. If they were so civilized and their neighbors so barbaric, why did they have to resort to so many unjust conquests? Why not trade and share technology for gains in wealth and so on? If you're supposedly civilized, isnt it your job to "civilize" others, as you so arrogantly say? Seems like the Romans, like all empires, were not morally or societally superior to others, all they had was better technology, and I'm tired of people treating Rome and other empires like it, such as the British, like paragons, and trying to white-wash their atrocities.

[@BoarhideGaming]

@@ramenbomberdeluxe4958 I mean, Rome had tons of qualities that clearly elevated them above their neighbours, or they would not have been able to...elevate themselves above their neghbours as they did. Technology was indeed not among the greatest advancements. Significantly more important than technology was the fact that Rome, despite their usual arrogance which you so rightly describe, was not ashamed of simply COPYING superior technologies whenever they encountered them, especially concerning the military. They had no martial tradition which limited them with ancient and outdated legacies. If something worked, they used it. They were also fantastic at logistics. Roman legions lost hundreds of battles, but they just kept coming. Motivated, decently competent troops marching unendingly along strategic roads they fortified themselves. The fact that trade and information flowed along those same roads, highways really, was a great boon. But chief amongst Roman qualities was probably (and ironically in this context) their inclusiveness. Being a Roman Citizen, owning land, holding office, taking part in- and actively shaping the Roman future was not exclusive to a few highborn people in actual Rome. As Starship Troopers put it: Service guarantees Citizenship. Anyone from any colonised province could partake in Roman life as mostly an equal, and as such had huge motivation to uphold that status quo. If you conquer people, and instead of dominating them, you include parts of their culture into yours and include them in your system, your empire wins more than if it eradicated native population. Almost as though diversity and new ideas as benificial to all. For its time, Rome was in many aspects a fantastically progressive concept. They were of course still an imperialistic, warmongering source of untold tragedy. But portraying them as anything less complicated than they actually were does great disservice to one of the most fascinating times in European, African, Arabian and Asian history. But even this last sentence will enrage plenty Rome-worshipping fascists who don't understand that Africa shaped Rome as much as Rome shaped Africa. Arabia shaped Rome. Asia shaped (and ruined lol) Rome.

[@trifarianboi3043]

I've always thought that the Romans only had heterosexual marriages but could have gay lovers, partly because marriage for most of history was a social tool, and most often not a product of love. But also because for obvious reasons gay marriage does not result in children. Strange to learn that they did have gay marriages.

[@splitfries69]

u dont have to have kids to get married

[@InvictaHistory]

I'd have to dig but I think since marriage was seen as a social function to generate children it was typically between different genders. But there were some cases, like the ones we mentioned, where the same rites could occur between two men.

[@trikitrikitriki]

Keep in mind that Roman emperors were the most powerful and could do whatever they wanted.

[@napoleonfeanor]

They didn't have it but if the Emperor demands something, he would usually get it. Marriage was about connecting two families and have common offspring. Love was optional but existed as ideal. Just look at Roman and Greek theatre plays and numerous myths.

[@Oxtocoatl13]

One of the perks of being the most powerful man in the world I guess.

[@socalchago]

Elagabalus was not "born into the purple." I'm not sure the term was used at all prior to the 6th Century, and when it was used it generally meant an heir presumptive born while their royal parent was reigning. Although perhaps Elagabalus was born into the purple of the Royal House of Esme.

[@InvictaHistory]

Yeah that may have been a bit of sloppy language. As you say they weren't born with the title lined up for them yet.

[@phillips9738]

Comment section isn't as funny as the one under al Muqqadimah video on homosexuality in the Islamic world, now that was a shit show 😂

[@totalwartimelapses6359]

Exactly I'm a Syrian Arab lemme tell you why they get offended by that A big portion of Muslims, specifically the Islamists, like to think that every single Caliph was generally a great man with only minor flaws So to tell them that that caliph either was homosexual or tolerated homosexuality is akin to telling them he's a horrible Caliph And another factor is this: since they're not a power in the modern world, a lot of them believe that the entire world is controlled by the west in a dystopian 1984 way, meaning the entirety of the historical narrative is controlled by westerners, ergo any claims about homosexuality in Islamic world are western propaganda to smear Islam

[@phillips9738]

@@totalwartimelapses6359 Well thank you for giving me some insight as to why they view it that way, I did indeed see what you mentioned about them viewing it as western propaganda.

[@lordwhyte]

@@phillips9738 It's not western propaganda and never will be, this is propaganda by a certain tribe

[@phillips9738]

@@lordwhyte i didn't say it was western propaganda, I said they viewed it as such.

[@starcapture3040]

@@totalwartimelapses6359 Well honestly The west control big part of narrative and moreover the media is really controlled by different lobbies the Zionist being the strongest especially in world banks it is not a lie or delusion

[@anotherwesley7661]

This was a lovely, thoughtful episode and the art in particular was fantastic-- it always is, but in this episode it was especially sympathetic and tender in a way that gave me a lot of big feelings. :') Thank you for discussing this topic.

[@mrfangs9299]

I’ve been subbed this channel ever since the Roshar special, I have to say I’ve been hooked. I never in a million years thought it would lead to learning about naughty femboy Emporers of Rome though. This was an altogether fascinating episode, I love when you all cover aspects of daily life or other areas like this that are easy to overshadow in “traditional” history content. Keep it up!

[@The_Daily_Tomato]

A true historian and lovers of history speak of all subjects and ignore none. Children look at the "Cool" bits and lash out when they see something they don't like. You and your team have my respect, now and always.

[@scintillam_dei]

That's why I cover the mass murders of atheists in history, which this propaganda channel of liberal extremists probably would never do because they have a liberal agenda.

[@napoleonibonaparte7198]

Thanks to Christianity, no one’s allowed to be fruity for nearly an entire millennia.

[@nunyabiznes33]

They were fruity in Renaissance Florence and they had to form the Office of the Night to deal with.

[@chrissibersky4617]

As far as I know it was only the Greeks and Romans that were allowed to be fruity back then. In other parts of Europe, at least, it was mostly punishable by death. I recently read about Viking laws and there it was a death penalty for even behaving "unmanly" or call someone unmanly or even write love poetry which was seen as unmanly. And if you didn't kill someone calling you unmanly you became an outcast. 😆

[@emprahsfinest7092]

@@nunyabiznes33 Dante was right about them, although notably what you're refencing was sourced by only one historian and so I wouldn't take it to heart.

[@baneofbanes]

@@chrissibersky4617 no

[@chrissibersky4617]

@@baneofbanes Facts don't care about your feelings. Lol!

[@luisturaga1059]

Very informative video. Thanks 😊

[@JootjeJ]

I don't understand why people feel the need to complain or whine at this video. The full subject is literally in the title. If you don't like the content then simply don't watch and just come back for the next one! As for Invicta: thank you for a really interesting end of the month. 🏳️‍🌈

[@CraicDealer]

Its also mens mental health month...

[@gingerlicious3500]

@@CraicDealer Good thing humans are capable of holding two thoughts in their head at the same time then, eh? I was able to recognize and appreciate both during June so I expect you could as well.

[@monkewiththebottle6940]

Hi I really enjoyed the video. A part of this video feels disingenuous, by leaving out the part that not all of these relationships are consensual. Often times a “dominant partner” is just simply a rapist and the “submissive partner” is a victim. Clearly people of all walks of life and all forms of attraction lived throughout the ages but, neglecting to bring this point up to me comes off as disingenuous to me. Again I love the Channel and the work you do but I wanted to bring up this point because it is often swept under the rug when talking about ancient relationships

[@monkewiththebottle6940]

And it is mentioned briefly in the video the man who was poised and kidnapped clearly wasn’t a willing partner or participant

[@boarfaceswinejaw4516]

i think it should be taken for granted when discussing any historical relationships that, through a modern lens, it can be seen as toxic, abusive and downright rapey. the average "and then he married the princess" story usually involves force. Consent was generally tetiary.

[@leonieromanes7265]

Most marriages were arranged in ancient Rome. So you have to wonder how many relationships were really consensual.

[@marocat4749]

We talk about historical emporers, and sadly they got the most history recorded there. Dunno the formercwere pretty much with consent and wholesome. Relstive, of you are a lover of a king, there is power imbalance. Also the mention he was a freed slave, yeah power imbalance technically, but thats rome, that had slaves and huge sexism and opression. Yeah it wasnt equaliterian, dah.

[@paulgoodridge2269]

All I know is that a few emperors were assassinated because they enjoyed being the receiver, not the giver.

[@zakareeradzak6821]

Such a cool video, thanks for making it! I'd love to see more similar

[@deanteasdale8261]

While both 'gay' and 'bi' would be misnomers, perhaps the title 'Rome's Bi Emperors' would be somewhat closer to the facts, since none of these men seem to fit gay at all.

[@isaactate9853]

well gay is often used a bit broadly anyways, even if it is quite erasing of the Bi community; however, human sexuality doesn't really tend to fit into the neat categories we think in. Like everything involving humans, it's more of a spectrum of attraction rather than a categorical set of attractions: add on the complication of generally being expected and pressured into producing an heir and things get even more complicated. Flaming homosexual men and women through out history have married and had children with people of the opposite sex, but maintained their primary romantic relationship with a same-sex lover regardless: much like how invicta mentions in the video that Romans tended to view love and marriage as separate concepts.

[@bold7473]

Over-all a good video but I think you misunderstood the quote at 10:48. The implication seems to be that Hadrian became involved with a boy that Trajan was also interested in, not that Hadrian and Trajan were involved with each other

[@baronrichardharkonnen]

super gay tbh

[@LegioXXI]

@@GyroGarrison The gayest gay of all gayness. And cheese.

[@subira8518]

Wait... so that means the Roman Empire technically had an empress for a while. Neat.

[@infoscrolls]

no

[@KaizerRemix]

By modern standards, yeah pretty much.

[@legateelizabeth]

It had another - Aurelian’s Wife, Ulpia Severina. She did not claim a regency over anyone, and coins were minted of her. That would make her an Empress in her own right.

[@santymartin7383]

They had two,zoe and irene

[@teogonzalez7957]

The eastern Roman Empire (so still the Roman Empire) did have several empresses.

[@AkselGAL]

Thanks, you gave me an introduction point for a journey into more knowledge.

[@Ye-Hu]

From all the examples in history you had to choose Nero, he literally castrated and groomed sporus.

[@Ye-Hu]

@Thisis Gettinboring Its not about ignoring, its about putting the good examples paired with, well Nero, he was a terrible person and in my opinion he is second to Caligula in terms of how horrible they were.

[@mercistephens7325]

@@Chrytin Probably because most aren't actually groomers and no amount of projection on your part is going to change that

[@ramenbomberdeluxe4958]

@@Chrytin No it isnt, you people are disgusting! Being called a groomer and taking offense to it isn't a sign of "deep down they know", its a sign of being offended at your harmful, wrongful stereotypes that get innocent people cast out or even killed. Shame on you and all other bigots.

[@ramenbomberdeluxe4958]

I get and agree with your sentiment, there needed to be a better balance in here.

[@Gabriel-hy8be]

@@Chrytin 90% of people calling gay groomers are groomers themselves that are just projecting. Like Matt Gaetz and anti-LGBT conservative preachers.

[@TheArchaos]

Welp, this going to be an interesting comment section. Try to stay calm.

[@handsomeboi3767]

dude most comments are going to be fine

[@TheArchaos]

@@handsomeboi3767 Yeah I hope so as well but the other part of me knows how the comment section can be.

[@marsultor6131]

@@TheArchaos and you are absolutely right the further down you go in the comments :)

[@richpontone1]

What did one of his Enemy say about Julius Caesar? "He was a Husband to every Wife, and a Wife to every Husband".

[@heychrisfox]

I finally got to watching this video. And I happened to look at the like/dislike ratio. And that's just hilarious. It's so funny how quickly modern history lovers will instantly reject actual historical evidence when presented with something that disagrees with their modern views. It's history for a reason bro. Just because the past was less conservative than you are doesn't make it bad. Deal with it.

[@barwar7707]

ok groomer

[@barwar7707]

@@heychrisfox keep coping groomer

[@heychrisfox]

@@barwar7707 You're coping with being a groomer? Jesus, that's awful. You really need medical or police attention ASAP.

[@barwar7707]

@@heychrisfox groomer keeps groomsplaining

[@off3416]

@@heychrisfox He is a troll with lack of brain on his head. Don't be bothered with him.

[@RuYourBoat]

This was a fantastic and informative video! It's fascinating to see how other cultures perceived something as fundamental to humanity and natural as homosexuality across millennia. Really beautiful, if you think about it. Thanks for taking the time to make this :)

[@philipthegreat7230]

Fundamental to humanity??????

[@ramenbomberdeluxe4958]

@@philipthegreat7230 Fundamental as in its natural to us, I believe is what they mean. It’s biological.

[@olorin1710]

We all gay

[@MIKE_THE_BRUMMIE]

As a pederast groomer I feel seen

[@olorin1710]

@@MIKE_THE_BRUMMIE you started from the bottom now you're top?

[@vinecat8451]

Gotta say I love the video, great work and thank you for giving us the rare insight not often talked about!

[@jodyw1]

I imagine that, much like today, there was a lot of “don’t ask don’t tell” going on between freeborn men of any stripe.

[@firestorm1088]

Ok, there needs to be a “Our Flag Means Death” style of show about these guys.

[@terminator572]

I rather not. More often than not these kinds of stories are grossly taken out of context and the persons' sexuality being if not the sole focus then a huge part of it, whilst leaving the historical figure behind to cultivate a modern, sanitized version that neatly aligns with Americacentric views on social progressiveness.

[@boarfaceswinejaw4516]

@@terminator572 yeah. as much as i think that the more "human side" of historical figures should be explorer, Our Flag means Death is a bit too cutesy.

[@EFO841]

I knew about Hadrian and Antinous, but Hadrian and TRAJAN? now that's a power couple!

[@huanquocmanh416]

Thats bullshit tho

[@Swedishmafia101MemeCorporation]

You don't have to understand women if you're only into men 😎

[@froggystyle642]

“Men are for lovin', women are for babies. “ - some gay dude

[@gingerlicious3500]

Is there anything more alpha than domming the fuck out of a hot muscular dude? Obviously not.

[@Caesars_Legate]

Very interesting video, thanks a bunch for all you do man! You’re channel has been invaluable to me expanding my knowledge, leading me to look deeper into topics I hadn’t thought of. You’ve Kept my Amazon cart stocked that’s for sure

[@InvictaHistory]

Awesome to hear! We definitely aim to cover a range of topics besides just military history

[@meduseld6610]

Mate, Trajan rubbing Hadrian is even making me uncomfortable

[@TitusVarus]

Yes, that bit was curiously unsettling, and I'm not averse to buggery.

[@huanquocmanh416]

It is bullshit tho Dont take it as truth

[@windsoftime]

Here is a list of the most mentioned by different sources: -Adrian -Nero -Heliogabalus Although there are more, those are just accusations and nothing is really "confirmed", so you need to be very skeptical of other accusations

[@baneofbanes]

Maybe in these specific cases but there’s plenty of proof of homosexual behavior being fairly widespread in Ancient Rome.

[@esper6119]

Nero said trans rights...?! EDIT ELAGABALUS WAS AN (EVIL) TRANS ICON?!? also, I'd love to see more in this vein! Especially as a lesbian, it's easy to feel like queer women are just this blank spot in history, near-completely overlooked. It's nice to see, just- normal, everyday things in the past. Food, growing up, The Gays™-- that might be my favorite sort of history, to be honest. Certainly it contextualizes the rest, at the very least? It's what brought me to this channel, in fact, and you guys do a wonderful job of it! Keep up the good work!

[@lucascoval828]

Okay. Settle down.

[@AYVYN]

They just hated simps, or any submissive character traits

[@syndicalist-0]

We often forget just how alien to us most historical cultures can be.

[@theEddieworld]

oh the nazis did NOT like this vid lmfao! anyways keep up the good work!

[@a.a.p1952]

Excellent reporting! Cheers🇨🇦

[@ImperatorAugustus]

You should do a video on the daily life of Roman emperors.

[@echostar2007]

The minute you mentioned under aged boys. Alarm bells blared in my head

[@justinehercthehuman]

Damn. I was not expecting poetic historical smut when watching this. Those last few minutes were intense.

[@50PullUps]

male-on-male sexual violence is very different from our modern concept of being LGBT. Those are two completely different things.

[@RAAM855]

Yup. Rome was basically Prison Sexual Violence between males And Greece was actually more romantically platonic than today or Rome.

[@benl2140]

@@RAAM855 The Greeks also had quite the interest in young boys...

[@RAAM855]

@@benl2140 as they did with young girls also? Keep in mind this was a time when it was rare to live past 40. It's no excuse and it's wrong. But there was certainly no waiting for a certain age on those times

[@Grordonblixt]

Are they really?

[@baneofbanes]

To say all homosexual activity in Ancient Rome was rape is false.