Is A 50/50 Weight Distribution Ideal?

[@tlaps3033]

This is the reason you often see wider tyres on the rear. They have a higher cornering stiffness and can cope with more weight allowing the COG to be moved back. As mentioned, moving the weight back is benefitial for traction and braking, but also steering performance. The distance from the COG to the front axles makes a longer lever arm.

[@randomname9283]

I think there needs a prequel for this video explaining how to take a racing corner. You did briefly mention neutral throttle during the corner and yet people are still arguing about acceleration. I think clarity is needed in regards to braking point, turn-in, neutral throttle, apex, post-acceleration and how the 50/50 fits into that.

[@stijnpeeters8430]

Can't you make a video about over revving? That would be nice! Greetings...

[@sweetdreams1DIAM0ND]

Stijn Peeters what do you mean by over revving? if you are asking if its dangerous to over rev then the answer is different from car to car, some cars can do 5000 max and some even 9000, the only thing they all have the same is that you have to let the engine warm up before revving.

[@RadioACtiveN3Rd]

sweet dreams I think what he was referring to was revving past the interval which would yield the optimum average power output, not necessarily the peak. Again though, this would also differ per vehicle. +Stijn Peeters please elaborate :)

[@sweetdreams1DIAM0ND]

RadioACtiveN3Rd thats simple , changing map of the car to be able to rev more than stock means more heat and less reliability, in some cases because the valves dont match the high rev (9000) you may even get less power than you did at stock rpms (7000) so if you increase the rev without touching the engine then you dont deserve to drive, it doesnt need a long video.

[@RWoody1995]

sweet dreams I dont think he meant taking a car with a 7000 redline and delimiting it so it can reach 9000 I think he meant more like whether or not in a normal car its faster to go all the way to / slightly over the redline before shifting up or to always keep below the redline.

[@wclutch]

You want to shift right at the redline, or right after you reach and exploit your cars peak power point. Hitting the redline just halts acceleration. To be honest, I'm not sure what would happen if you changed a car's redline from 5000 to 9000. I imagine that you would hit the peak rpm, you would have the same amount of power from the peak for the rest of the rev range. (I'm just guessing)

[@Dane33781]

Like you said, 50/50 is only ideal while in a constant turn/speed. Under breaking and acceleration (corner entry/exit) a rear weight bias is desirable. Although a 50/50 distribution allows for a more predictable car its not what racing teams want. Take formula one for example. An f1 car has closer to a distribution of 30% front 70% rear. Most "top tier" vehicles like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, koeniggsaig, Lotus, McLarren and others have a rear weight bias. Watch a video that shows a race driver's feet while they are driving and think about what percentage of thier time is spent on the breaks or gas as opposed to coasting at a constant speed. That being said, I like your videos.

[@patrickfargie1146]

Currently building and setting up a car in BeamNG and looking up some information based on my initial tests and this is the first video that comes up haha

[@mutasemCarD]

I'm really impressed. I noticed a KZbin plaque behind you. Thank you so much. You deserve the best :)

[@davidmitchell5638]

After watching the videos in the description i said "ALIGHT ENOUGH ENGINEERING FOR THIS WEEK" thank you for the great explanation!

[@EngineeringExplained]

David MuscleGuy That's a lot! Come back next Wednesday. :)

[@thomaspinder8869]

Could you do a short video on wheelbase vs track in terms of handling and stability? I've looked all over and the only thing that I was able to find was "shorter cars turn better and longer cars rock less under acceleration."

[@Carking97]

how do some cars like the Mazda Miata an s2000 which both have front engine and front mounted transmissions have a 50-50 weight distribution? All the weight is in the front.

[@edge21str]

kevin soos Aside from the RWD, which makes you place the differential in the rear and a drive shaft in the center of the car, they try to move the engines as far to the back of the engine bay as possible, so you'll get a so called front-mid-engine set-up, where you have the engine behind the front wheels. You'll notice that the Miata and the S2k both have pretty long hoods relative to their size and they both have their engines over or even behind their front wheels. This also moves the passenger cabin further to the back. I don't know much about the S2k but in the Miata NA and NB for example you also get an aluminum hood and the battery in the trunk.

[@FreeUpTheWeed]

Short answer = brilliant engineering ;) But yeah like this guy said, all the heavy items have been pushed as far back as possible, the driver even nearly sits on the rear tyres(in an mx5)as a result. IIRC slightly over half the S2000s engine sits behind the front strut towers.

[@AR-rk9nn]

Tail shaft, diff and body design champion.

[@Bigwaffles84]

So this may be a silly question but here it goes. If a car had a 50/50 weight distribution, and in the rear, the car had a lot of down force, would that make a big difference in the rear brakes ability to slow the car. Would more downforce in the rear even thought the car is balanced 50/50 enhance the braking ability of the rear tires?

[@BigE1205]

If properly biased with enough stopping power, yes.

[@jeromehattkronen2305]

of course it would - that's basically what downforce gives to the tyres - more grip. Also wings for downforce will likely generate more drag which will also help the car to stop. eg: Just lifting off the throttle in an F1 car causes more braking effort than a normal street car with the driver hard on the brakes.

[@jeromehattkronen2305]

Last statement was wrong. Moment of inertia is not lowest at 50/50, it's Reduced by moving the CofG toward the rear. - because cars do not rotate around the C of G, they mostly rotate around the centre of the rear axle, especially at low speeds. Gaining a lower moment of inertia is actually one more reason for moving the CG towards the rear axle.

[@Stand00Alone97]

Pretty much the reason why the Miata and RX8 are the best handling cars you can buy.

[@mattymag2394]

Stand00Alone97 on a budget

[@Abhishek-150]

Lotus Elise

[@MostlyLoveOfMusic]

Beautifully explained. Top video buddy

[@mazin2892]

Question: does a mid engine car with a 50/50 weight distribution still accelerate better than a front engine car with 50/50 weight distribution, with all else being equal?

[@mazin2892]

Accelerate better as in due to having more traction.

[@crxdelsolsir]

All else being equal (tyre material, rim size etc) maximum traction you can achieve will largely be a product of the weight placed on the tyres of the driven wheels. If we were to have two identical vehicles (total weight, engine power, transmission gearing etc) the vehicle having a biased weight distribution on the driven wheels of say 60/40 rather than 50/50 means that at any given time there will be greater maximum traction on the vehicle with a biased distribution. This also means the vehicle with a biased weight distribution will have more ability to plant more power should the engine power be increase as in modifications. A biased weight distribution also means the driven wheels have a higher threshold of traction in motion such as the lateral shear forces experienced in a turn. This makes the car safer as the car has a higher threshold before losing traction and control. So in short a 50/50 is not the best for traction. A biased weight distribution has better traction, much safer in everyday driving, ability to reduce wheel spin when ground pressure is reduced such as when wider tyres are fitted and is also more economical with less minute slippages experienced.

[@MartinKovacik]

​@Engineering Explained Most weight distribution discussions seem to focus a lot on "something / 100-something" weight split front/rear but completely ignore the impact of weight being more centrally located. Any chance to make a video on that? When I imagine a standard gym weight in 2 setups a) O - - - - - - O vs b) - - - OO- - - , the weight distribution is 50/50 in both cases, also center of gravity is the same. Nevertheless if they would be hanging by rope attached to CoG and I should turn it around by pushing towards side on one of the ends (basically what front wheels are trying to do 😅) the result would be different. The difference could be major for vehicles with engine in the middle...

[@Unb3arablePain]

The Corvette C7 is an almost perfect setup. It has a 49/51 weight distribution. So it's read biased but only ever so slightly.

[@johnryan6658]

@Cole Lee Aerial so, in other words, it's worse.

[@globalforce]

This has to be one of the most informative videos i have ever watched on YT. Thanks!

[@EngineeringExplained]

globalforce I've got about 200 of them! :)

[@globalforce]

Well lucky me! :) #Faith_in_humanity

[@crxdelsolsir]

Biased weight distribution is better in everyday driving as it is generally safer, more economical, responds better to engine modifications and wheel/tyre modifications. Here is why... All else being equal (tyre material, rim size etc) maximum traction you can achieve will largely be a product of the weight placed on the tyres of the driven wheels. If we were to have two identical vehicles (total weight, engine power, transmission gearing etc) the vehicle having a biased weight distribution on the driven wheels of say 60/40 rather than 50/50 means that at any given time there will be greater maximum traction on the vehicle with a biased distribution. This also means the vehicle with a biased weight distribution will have more ability to plant more power should the engine power be increase as in modifications. A biased weight distribution also means the driven wheels have a higher threshold of traction in motion such as the lateral shear forces experienced in a turn. This makes the car safer as the car has a higher threshold before losing traction and control. So in short a 50/50 is not the best for traction. A biased weight distribution has better traction, much safer in everyday driving, ability to reduce wheel spin when ground pressure is reduced such as when wider tyres are fitted and is also more economical with less minute slippages experienced.

[@mx-5driver406]

"So in short a 50/50 is not the best for traction.", unless it's a 4WD then...

[@psions555]

I don't like it. I had a 520i E39 touring (rear air suspension) and it was nasty in the snow. Coming down a steep icy hill the rear wheels locked up just from compression braking. The smallest movement of the steering wheel caused rapid and unpredictable responses. Front midship is nice when you have traction. When you don't give me a lump over the front that forces a predictable result every time. Same reason I don't like mid engined cars. I actually prefer F/F layouts despite perrolheads generally preferring RWD. I find F/F to be fun at the limit and forgiving to mistakes

[@Gigabomber]

not sure how but my front wheel drive front engine golf oversteers and I love it.

[@s2korpionic]

The way people say 50/50 being ideal is misleading. They usually forgot to mention static weight distribution. Look at the GT-R for example. IIRC, it has a weight distribution of 54/46 when it is not moving. However, when it is moving, this weight distribution shifts closer to 50/50 throughout straights and corners.

[@RWoody1995]

Kalsonic during acceleration it would have 50/50 but at a constant speed its weight distribution will be equal to the static weight distribution and while braking it would be even further forward than the static weight distribution so maybe 58/62 under braking.

[@davidbrentdrums9890]

My 2014 Mazda6 isn't too bad it's 58/42 weight distribution and since its front wheel drive that helps the acceleration. Still corners beautifully though!

[@lovesoccerr11]

What's the unit of cornering stiffness .. Or is it a constant

[@EngineeringExplained]

I believe a constant, yes. I dive a bit deeper into the derivation in the video linked in the description, with the graph illustrating where it's from.

[@HATECELL]

Does the size of the tires matter? I once read an article about a car (I think it was the V8 Vantage) that has a 50/50 weight distribution and the author said that it is completely pointless because the rear tires are wider than the front tires

[@Cesar-ey7wu]

+HATECELL larger tires give better grip. So you can theorically unload more the back of the car, and thus, (if i'm not mistaking) braking harder in a corner. the balance of a car is defined by several things, larger tires aren't pointless. The author probably mean that balance wasn't at his taste because of the addition of 50/50 weight distribution and larger rear tires.

[@TheHm3]

I don't understand how loading the front tires equals more understeer. Loading the front tires during a corner takes away weight from the rear, thus the rear tires should kick out given it's the lighter end, right?

[@Cesar-ey7wu]

+TheHm3 the centripetal force of the weight of a car in a corner is applied were the weight is. If the weight is in the front, the force your tires are fighting against is on the front, so it's the front tire that slip.

[@TheHm3]

César Chaussinand I mean I understand the concept but still can't wrap my head around it. Like mid/rear engined cars have a ridiculous amount of understeer and snap oversteer because of all the weight in the rear. You can turn in easily because of the lightweight nose but by apex you'll have all the weight in the rear and the car will start pushing and won't want to rotate. So wouldn't an FF car be the polar opposite of that (off throttle).

[@Cesar-ey7wu]

from what i understand, over and understeerare mainly results of the driving. How you tranfer load during the corner is the key and weight distribution of the car is just part of the reason your car is more or less likely to oversteer.

[@sanc9808]

FWD with light back ends can experience lift-off oversteer more easily and other kinds of oversteer in certain situations when all the weight transfers to the front. I also deliberately do this on my FWD rallycross car on the gravel by braking hard (weight goes to front, off back tires) and getting the back end loose. I recommend watching the introductory iRacing videos about understeer and oversteer if you want to learn more basic principles (short of having a good instructor or class). FWD cars do tend to understeer because of all the work being done by the front tires. The videos help. Also, manufacturers will tend to want to make stock cars of both FWD and RWD understeer from factory because of liability and safety. Hence why you don't see FWD cars oversteer much on the road.

[@dearkant2799]

"loading the front tires equals more understeer" no it's not but "Cars that have more weight distribution to the front tire equal to more understeer by normal characteristic". It simply came from when load applied more on the tire, much heat, much stress occur they reduce coefficient of friction of that tire so it will lose traction and slide make it understeer/oversteer. Load is another story. You can make 60/40 weight distribution car understeer or oversteer as you want by transferring load to front or rear. You have to separate between normal case(no additional force) and specific situation(braking, push throttle, off throttle, handbrake or other actions that result in load transfer).

[@cstUvg]

Engineering Explained what do you think about Lexus LFA weight distribution Front 48% Rear 52%? this is the perfect weight balance for stability in the corners and better handling?

[@CRVB7]

Can you do a video on your calculations and how do usually tackle equations and derive them? How do you know which equations to work with given that there are many determining factors for real world situations? I've seen your "Slip angles Math" video, but my question is in general. Do you start by looking through a specific book/website? I'm in my Jr. year (Mechanical Engineering). Best regards, Loyal subscriber!

[@EngineeringExplained]

CRVB7 I typically don't derive anything. Much smarter people than myself do the heavy lifting, I simply try to understand it and relay what I learn.

[@mworx6446]

Surprisingly this is the result of the formula used above for my bmw e46 m3. The 3 answers are measured at 30 50 and 70mph and given as front/rear percentage 49/51 52/48 46/54 On Michelin pilot sport 4s tyres at 255/35x19 front and 275/30x19 rear 35psi front and 38psi rear

[@Miggys.Garage]

Amazing.

[@JasonWMorningwood]

I fins it funny that the CoM symbol in blue whiteboard marker looks like a BMW emblem, and I happen to have an E36, which is supposedly 50/50 :D

[@JasonWMorningwood]

hiimbrandon100 That's why I added the "supposedly" :D

[@RST9413]

yes,bmw kids make everything look like bmw is the best of the best just because he use a bmw. He is completly wrong.

[@SoheilG]

I love your videos man. So good.

[@EngineeringExplained]

Thank you!

[@AzNgiftedkid]

Doesn't 50/50 weight distribution also help with tyre wear consistency?

[@T1mok]

Hi, please make video about tire types like road, semi-slicks, slicks and such.

[@sloth4urluv]

Great video. I think you should expand on this and describe how a car's weight distribution impacts how you would attack a corner. For example in an S2000 you would do your breaking before entering a turn so that the car is 50/50 through the turn, and in an 911 you would trail brake through a turn to achieve 50/50.

[@Gus_Gus_Gus]

Should make a video on how different types of oils

[@hachiido1905]

Hey i have a question. Does it make a difference in handling and weight distribution if the center lock of the wheel was at 0 offset or not? And why?

[@joshuaschmidt3038]

Do a video on the magnetic suspension of the new Corvette Z06 please!

[@jankan4979]

ty for that video.

[@HyperFragHD]

1 word. AE86

[@joro407]

E36!

[@evgenystepantsov3397]

RX-7!

[@revswithasupra4748]

1M

[@rileyflanagan7754]

G8 GXP

[@tysonmaggio6345]

You mean two letters and two numbers

[@TheKeatyBear]

How does it apply to drift cars? What is the ideal balance for them

[@jose2x784]

Would you consider video about weight distribution for low powered cars drift cars?

[@JTTTTT850]

How does center of gravity apply laterally? Wouldn’t that only apply vertically?

[@DankosDIY]

Mate, i will just copy word for word what you saying in to my college work. :D

[@EngineeringExplained]

YAMAHA FACTORY Professors love plagiarism! :)

[@DankosDIY]

trust

[@nickamarit]

Moving the CG towards the front increases the probability/ease of lift-off oversteer, right?

[@hafeezhamama9580]

I was watching Carlos Lago from motor trend magazine take the c7 z06 around the figure 8 and it appeared as though neither the front end or the rear end were moving faster (no over steer or under) but the entire car seamed to just be sliding in the same direction. Just watch the video, it's kind of hard for me to explain. But is this the result of its near 50/50 weight distribution?

[@filipabramczyk8831]

I don't understand one thing. Sometimes I hear that more weight on the rear causes oversteer tendency. I get that, that's beacuse of inertia, but sometimes I hear that more weight on the rear tires means better traction which reduces oversteer. So... um... what? Can anybody explain?

[@Abhishek-150]

More weight on rear in RWD = Better traction off the line because of weight shifting to the rear.. Also more weight in rear cause vehicle to oversteer because of inertia..

[@RST9413]

mid engine and rear engine incrase grip due to the weight on the wheels and better turn in because of pendulum effect. Same thing with front weight bias like ex Audis. Car just turn in very well. Porsche with rear weight bias,obtain a lot of turn in with pendulum effect. Thats why they are so good.

[@eternalblue2119]

What about a 50/50 AWD electric car with the batteries and most of the weight under 15 inches from the ground? with torque vectoring

[@remotaurog]

Got any videos on Asphalt compaction, like best practice rolling pattern.

[@RSdailyshort]

hey i was working on a project for FSAE and we have lot of weight to rear , around 70 % but during very high acceleration and turning our car is behaving to much of understeer , may front Tyre are not geting enough traction. our car was tuned for understeer.

[@Abhishek-150]

If 70℅ weight is in the rear.. No doubt car will understeer crazy..

[@KobyMathews]

Also I really wanna know why muscle cars are front engine rear wheel drive? Because isn't a muscle car focused on straight line speed? So why wouldn't it put more weight towards the back if that's the case?

[@yuanlyu8475]

I can't find the slip angle equation anywhere. Can anybody give a help? Thank you

[@quintessenceSL]

While not the focus of this video, you really need to put this in to context with spring stiffness, i.e. this explanation only really applies if the springs are equal all around.

[@EngineeringExplained]

***** And a thousand other factors haha, which is why I simply isolated one to demonstrate the logic behind the idea.

[@projetocoop]

you always made sure you said "going in a constant velocity" adter saying its ideal, does that mean that its not when you are either increasing or decreasing speed?

[@EngineeringExplained]

Gleb Gameplays Correct. Gets more complicated then as you have load transfer to the front or rear, which means the instantaneous "weight" distribution is no longer 50/50, and the tires are unevenly loaded.

[@jordandescend156]

Awesome

[@gregkvye6006]

Good weight distribution is important. Yet you control weight distribution with your pedals and knowing of your car.

[@sajjawatlaorhasontichai5630]

Why does moving CG towards to front gives understeer? Doesn't front tires get more traction when there's more load?

[@EngineeringExplained]

Sajjawat Laorhasontichai All variables equal, because the front slip angle will be larger than the rear slip angle, and that's the definition of understeer: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eaS5mGV6epWYnJo

[@sajjawatlaorhasontichai5630]

Thank for the reply, love your channel btw. Keep up the awesome job!

[@mlouie]

This still doesn't make sense to me. It seems that more weight on the front tires means more traction, thus less oversteer. Your video that you reference here says one way to reduce oversteer is to increase front downforce.

[@MrMelgar2000]

How does the Lexus LFA have a 48:52 weight distribution being an FR car?

[@RWoody1995]

Carlos Melgar i would assume they pushed as much weight rearward as possible, being RWD the differential is already in the rear, they would also move the gearbox back as far as possible and I think i heard they even have things like the aircon in the rear or middle of the car rather than anywhere near the front.

[@guilhermeguelfi761]

So why when you brake into a corner your car tends to oversteer if the weight is transfered to the front?

[@12th.jahlil]

The rear wheels get light. You might be turning while braking and it’s upsetting your car. Try being straighter on the wheel and smoother on the brakes

[@swayingGrass]

What's F1's weight distribution? They don't seem to understeer/oversteer much.

[@seb5945]

Indra Ida Bagus Because of the way they drive. They want no under or oversteer when racing which hurts laptime. On top of that, they have to look after the tire ware too.

[@RWoody1995]

Indra Ida Bagus I think they do their best to modify the weight distribution for each track, which they can do since the base car is probably significantly lighter than the minimum weight requirement for F1 and so they can add ballast which they can position wherever they want so for a track where cornering is more important than acceleration they can move weight forward for more front grip and if they decide acceleration is more important than cornering they can move the weight back for more rear grip. 50/50 is just a good guide because it means the car is relatively stable in any possible condition but different biasing is better for certain specific conditions (which is what this video teaches above anything

[@borasaygac7015]

Bro, can you explain us how W12 engines work ?

[@EngineeringExplained]

Bora Saygac Check out my video on VR6's. Essentially it's two of those. I also have a video on W16s if you're interested.

[@vintageman91]

Mid engine, 4wd and gearbox in front is as close as you can get to have 50/50.

[@J.T323]

Hi,what tipe of weight distribution will be best for drifting?thanks

[@RST9413]

close to 50 50

[@jamesavery6671]

I believe the corvette c7r racing version is 50/50 like the production car.

[@johnryan6658]

@Cole Lee Aerial not at the 24 Hours of Le Mans. In 2018 and 2019 it finished behind the Porsche and Ford GT.

[@johnryan6658]

@Cole Lee Aerialconsidering that GM moved the engine behind the driver, that would be a case of "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em." Again this reveals how "perfect 50/50" weight distribution isn't perfect.

[@CSteven59]

My 74 914 is 50/50!!!!

[@Disco_Potato]

CSteven59 What is it with you in the car?

[@papayaman123]

eSZee 90/10

[@pumpkinpot672]

Would 51.9/48.1 be considered 50/50?

[@EngineeringExplained]

samchoochiu Sounds like 52/48 to me. :)

[@pumpkinpot672]

Good to know, ty!

[@B4DMANNN]

How does dude have that touch of grey look going on already lol.

[@stefannedeljkovic8511]

Mine porsche 924 have a 52/48 :D

[@EngineeringExplained]

Stefan Nedeljkovic Spoken like a true German. :)

[@ODIOPOWER]

38/62 here, i dont see the problem :)

[@Regalia157]

How do you calculate that, and how did u determine the mid point of your car?

[@cris25840]

Isn't 53/47 better for a track?

[@TheEVGAftw]

Yeah because under acceleration, weight is transferred to the rear wheels pretty much makin it 50/50 for track

[@RWoody1995]

TheEVGAftw not really, for acceleration specifically you want the weight to be balanced to whichever end of the car has the most power so having a car that has a 50/50 weight balance would only benefit acceleration if it had AWD and 50/50 power distribution.

[@TheEVGAftw]

megaspeed2v2 I was responding to a rwd post.

[@RWoody1995]

TheEVGAftw noone mentioned rwd. and as i said 47/53 static changing to 50/50 while accelerationg doesnt benefit acceleration on rwd anyway, only benefits acceleration for a car with 50/50 power distribution awd.

[@Kimoto504]

polar moment.....

[@PezTheDude]

The answer is miata.

[@dcrypter87]

i wonder if the BMW logo has anything to do with this video =D

[@jakecamplin3205]

Your hairs not grey !!!!

[@chrisanglin]

Wanted Kangaroo Probably used a black sharpie this morning.

[@stevenolson95]

Chris Anglin hah ya

[@Stue-e]

Wanted Kangaroo no seriously its a property of some hair fibres under light, my cat is midnight black, but some parts of the hair have less pigmenting, sorta like people with fair arm hair, its blond onder some light, but its get darker the steeper the visual angle is, or Angle of incident.

[@DirceuCorsetti]

+Stewart Mckinna I think a video should be made about this phenomena. Engineering Explained

[@pkonneker]

You are a smart guy.

[@edge21str]

Peter Konrad Konneker ...for you.

[@antonio3736]

edge21str oh come on give the devil his due

[@MeLinhLam]

And this is why race car is never gonna 50/50. Why? going around the track is all about accelerating/braking from corner to corner. The most preferred WD is 40/60

[@doc7000]

It is actually not that simple, a car that has only 40% of its weight on the front and 60% naturally wants to understeer due to less mechanical grip on the front end. This is made worse when accelerating through a corner causing power on understeer, accelerating through a corner a car that is 55/45 will have an advantage as it can be 50/50 in that situation making it neutral. Having a car that is 40/60 has an advantage going into the braking zone as under hard braking the car may be 50/50, I remember reading a Ferrari technical brief from some years ago that actually put ideal weight split at 45/55 which means all of those rear midship cars (Ferrari 488, Lamborghini Hurcan) are actually not ideal. That this gave the best balance in all around track performance. There is interesting reading on how Porsche has reduced understeer issues on the Porsche 911, it has a lot to do with suspension geometry.

[@KobyMathews]

Ain't the Dodge Dodge demon 58/40 or something like that and it has the fastest stock quarter mile