Is A High-Speed Rail Possible In Australia? | Utopia

SUBSCRIBE: bit.ly/3RnrsXU
The NBA investigate the feasibility of a very fast train connecting Melbourne, Sydney & Brisbane.
Season 1 Episode 3: Very Fast Turnover
Watch Seasons 1-5 of Utopia on
Stan: bit.ly/UtopiaStan
Netflix: bit.ly/UtopiaN...
Buy Seasons 1-5 of Utopia
iTunes: apple.co/3VG9dPD
Google Play: bit.ly/3pinZ2O
Follow Working Dog on Social
Facebook: / workingdogprod
Instagram: / workingdogprod
Twitter: / workingdogprod
Working Dog Website: workingdog.com
Set inside the offices of the “Nation Building Authority”, a federal government organisation responsible for overseeing major infrastructure projects, Utopia explores that moment when bureaucracy and grand dreams collide.
Starring Rob Sitch, Celia Pacquola, Dave Lawson, Kitty Flanagan, Anthony 'Lehmo' Lehmann.
#Utopia #WorkingDogProductions

[@workingdogproductions]

A new season of Utopia is coming Wednesday 7 June 8pm to ABC TV + iview!🚆

[@rodlytton765]

The show is great, Utopia is one of the best comedies to come out of Aussie. Brilliant writing, characters are perfect. Rob Sitch excels himself .

[@NinoShlemon]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/mpvTg4iXm8-rbcUsi=618YWmgMpI7zmKVy

[@HouseholdDog]

My dad was the deputy director of the Bureau of Transport Economics. I think their report was in this episode. This sounds like a lot of the stories he used to tell me. Particularly about the cows.

[@darrenrobinson9041]

Apparently a fast train hitting a cow will dismember the animal and send the pieces flying 30 metres. And the pieces are lethal.

[@viniciusmarchetti6924]

@@darrenrobinson9041 Yeah, but what about the train?

[@TheCaptainbeefylog]

@@viniciusmarchetti6924 they're much worse.

[@eldrago19]

Plainly Difficult has a video on a train collision with a cow. It resulted in 13 fatalities and 61 injuries, and that was at 85mph on a fenced line.

[@shykorustotora]

"Just gotta flatten out a few hills... ... The Blue Mountains, yeah.. that is a bit of an issue.." That's never going to be not funny

[@AL-ss4vr]

I say drill through them. Blue mountains haven’t done much for us lately, except being an underwhelming attraction. To be fair it always was underwhelming, not just lately.

[@xzdrtxyzxvn]

Should ask China to drill it for Australia.. They done many already.

[@Sakura_Best_Girl]

​@@xzdrtxyzxvnproblem with that is our genius government just labelled China as our num 1 enemy 😂

[@jemthompson2019]

As a New Zealander who has just watched our government piss away hundreds of millions on a light rail study this hits close to home. Even the part about the standalone agency for land acquisition is spot on.

[@marc21256]

The report said light rail was easy. All the corridors exist, it would just take money, and everyone screamed at the top of their lungs. Reminded me of all the people that said SH-20 was "impossible", then as soon as it was live, started complaining about crime in West Auckland, claiming all the minorities were driving the new "shortcut" to commit crime in West. Turns out the Westies are a bunch of criminals too. Everything is impossible, until it's done. Light rail is "easy", just "expensive". And the only way it would happen is if the government sold Kiwirail (again), but kept all the rail lines in Auckland and Wellington commuter lines, and started calling those obsolete sections of rail "light rail". When private "Tranzrail" or whoever needs to get freight from south to north, they can lease timeslots on the Auckland network from AT. It's a perfect plan, other than it is politically impossible. Also, we need rail along SH1 from CBD to Wellsford, to meet up with the western line, for a northern rail loop, and get trains going both ways in a circle around the north. I can also fix the HArbour Bridge issue, but it's not cheep, and everyone hates my idea, but it would work and make everything better. But that's only tangentially related to rail, because rail would take over the inside lanes, and leave the clipons for cars.

[@Matthew-zv8qe]

​@@marc21256 Light rail makes actual sense though and would have happened if the government did not change, it is politically viable just needs right chance, national could even run on it if they wanted for Auckland votes like Liberals backed Syedey Metro. Regional rail in NZ, not really. The business case for Auckladn to Hamilton upgrades was below 0.6 CBR even the cheapest options.

[@oliversissonphone6143]

Better to waste the money on a study than to build something that makes no financial sense

[@Stigcrafter]

Utopia isn’t a comedy, it’s a documentary

[@anthonywatts2033]

It is! I feel there MUST have been recording devices in my office over the years

[@captain61games49]

Just like Yes minister was a 'comedy'

[@Macro105]

Cometary

[@brianjensen5200]

Oh it's back in the news today! Inland rail haha on ABC news! Incredible.

[@MrAljosav]

Truer words have never been spoken

[@carlanderson7618]

This sounds like how California High Speed Rail got started Source: NYT Oct. 9, 2022 "The state was warned repeatedly that its plans were too complex. SNCF, the French national railroad, was among bullet train operators from Europe and Japan that came to California in the early 2000s with hopes of getting a contract to help develop the system." "The company’s recommendations for a direct route out of Los Angeles and a focus on moving people between Los Angeles and San Francisco were cast aside, said Dan McNamara, a career project manager for SNCF.‌ The company‌ ‌pulled out in 2011." “There were so many things that went wrong,” Mr. McNamara said. “SNCF was very angry. They told the state they were leaving for North Africa, which was less politically dysfunctional. They went to Morocco and helped them build a rail system.”

[@eldonad]

The Morocco High Speed Train system is also doing great as far as I know, trains have been purpose built to handle the dust and heat of the more desertic areas or continental Morocco. It has only one line for the time being, as most of the Morocco population resides along the coast, but it is also currently the fastest on the African continent.

[@111_Chromia]

Hope Texas gets it right

[@carlanderson7618]

@@111_Chromia Lot depends on using existing right-of-ways, listening to the engineers and not every politician insisting that it run and stop in his/her district.

[@111_Chromia]

@@carlanderson7618 are they going for the Japanese train sets? Every article related to the tex hsr shows an n700 rolling stock but there's no mention of it's confirmed use

[@jbudlo2]

I work on California High Speed Rail. This is my life, but without the kangaroos.

[@onothankyou]

Are... Are you asking for kangaroos? Because I've seen what Californian taxpayers will pay for, you can get yourself done kangaroos. Just tell them the 'roos are environmentally sustainable and you'll find yourself wishing you had FEWER kangaroos!

[@dericofdorking]

How do American trains deal with deer? They're like our kangaroos I imagine

[@sirnonapplicable]

...we're still working on that? I thought that had already been killed. Any promise?

[@photosynth359]

​@dericofdorking If the deer die they die, also fences that sometimes work.

[@somethinglikethat2176]

​@@photosynth359 hitting a deer at 300km/h does more than just kill a deer.

[@lesliekingsley4993]

Australia cannot even manage high-speed internet.

[@nicholascharles9625]

The more you learn about Australian political history the more you realise its just a series of missed opportunities for the dumbest reasons

[@warboyrb]

That's why he had the NBN lanyard 😅

[@genevieve.annabelle3296]

​@nicholascharles9625 as a Canadian I feel this in my bones. We're sitting on all the resources...all of them. Instead of miners, industrialists, manufacturers etc we've got...timmies and mcds. Fuckin eh...

[@99Plastics]

@@genevieve.annabelle3296 Maybe instead get one of those free educations as to why most of those things are worthless to extract unless you're willing to bring in ships of "unpaid Inters". If that still doesn't convince you, go look at the salary that you would get for any of those jobs, go work that and job. Untill then stfu, watch a few more useless tiktoks and drink your latte.

[@brandon27025]

​@@genevieve.annabelle3296natural resources accounted for 19.2% of your GDP in 2022..

[@Dan-re7go]

It’s funny because its true. Interestingly, the corridors for high speed personally operated vehicles are in place. Seems we’re going to do the autobahn in Straya before the DeutscheBahn.

[@bazza2540]

a bogan in a v8 commodore doesn't count

[@liam3284]

Those corridors come at great taxpayer expense. Making them autobahn high speed would double the cost, you would need tolls, and they would not be cheap.

[@hiramhackenbacker9096]

​@@liam3284 naesayer

[@brianparker4858]

Where are they in place? lol

[@0Zolrender0]

Japan does it... and their geography is worse than our east coast.

[@namanish450]

Taking the development slow makes a lot of sense given the scale of the project and the number of people it would actually serve being small compared to other rail systems. I'm just glad that a permanent body has been set up to at least do the groundwork

[@AskAkseli]

Haha! That’s exactly what I was thinking.

[@OfAngelsAndAnarchist]

The number of people it would serve could actually expand IF there were a rail network So much unused, inaccessible and perfectly useful land

[@OfAngelsAndAnarchist]

@trapd00rspider so build it carefully with engineers willing to border on the artistic

[@noticedruid4985]

I hope folks know that HSR is a different kind of beast compared to regular rail right? HSR is way less tolerant to turns than regular Trains. Next the specialized rail they need. Needs more maintenance and is more expensive to build. You just can't slap some rails and some ties and call it a day. The Trains themselves are more expensive to build and maintain. You see all these don't include the more stringent geological issues. But this will make it more expensive to build and more expensive to maintain. This in turn drives up the cost to passengers meaning you need more population density who will actually take the train just to maintain the HSR network. Like a good example of this playing out of you just ignore all this, is the situation in China. Basically outside the Shanghai to Beijing area, the rest of the network is unprofitable. There is simply not enough people using the train like in Tibet for example. But these areas still need to be maintained, the trains still need to be maintained and the expenses for building them in the first place still need to be paid. So it's like a literal Money pit for them.

[@Foxingg]

@@noticedruid4985 Trains are a public service. They do not lose money, they cost money. I mean you did say "cost" but there is a specific difference. The NYC subway is supposed to make money but it never does because the city pours 4x its operating cost on police to "stop fair evasion." As long as we think of public services as business they'll never go anywhere, the question isn't "will this make money" but "will the good this does to our infrastructure/people justify its cost of operation," like anything else your taxes pay for

[@lizy4372]

So Melbourne to Canberra (660km) then to Sydney (280km) , by car, that's a long distance combined. Now with 840km distance in mind, lets dream about the time required. If the rail operates at 300km/hr, I might be able to get from Melbourne to Sydney with 3 hours. That's awesome. I would be happy to pay twice the plane tickets for such ride. Especially considering Melbourne's airport is not connected to public transport, every time the airport travel is very exhausting. If the rail operates at 200km/hr, the trip might take 4.5 hours, that's reasonable, I am still prefer the train over plane at this situation. If the rail operates at 120km/hr, the trip might take 7 hours, now that's bit awkward, but if the timing is right, say I can hop on a train at 7am then off at 2pm, I am still happy to take the ride with same price of a plane ticket.

[@obliviouz]

It's not whether you, or anyone else, would be willing to pay it. It's that there's not enough people in Australia to make it viable. Rail is persistent infrastructure - you have to build ALL of it, maintain ALL of it, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, at VERY high levels every single centimeter because there are no tolerances at those speeds. Air? You only need to build and maintain the planes, and you can even move the planes between different routes based on changing demand.

[@wavavoom]

If it's 7 hours, take the night train, do your meetings and then head back on a late train

[@akaraven66]

@@wavavoom The fact trains now take some 11 hours from Melbourne to Sydney, at cost upwards of $190, should be enough of an indication that high speed won't work for many reasons. Mostly because I can fly Jetstar for $119 and be there is under 2 hours. The only reason they allow pedestrian rail travel interstate in this country is because we have the infrastructure in place already and that's only because we need it for freight. True that planes can now carry more than freight trains, but the cost is also higher and since the rail network was put in place well before planes became a viable option, as the cost is lower, they just kept going with it. And since the rail network is already in place, why not make some more money out of it by allowing pedestrians to use it?

[@daleviker5884]

When they say trains go 300kmh, those are not average speeds. A "300 kmh" train isn't going to do 900 km Sydney to Melbourne in three hours, because getting in and out of the cities will take forever. I recently took a fast train to Madrid that was advertised at about 50 mins, and after only 25 mins I could see the building that was my destination. I thought great, we will be there in 30 mins. But no, it took the expected 50 mins, because the last few kilometers were at snail pace on crowded suburban tracks, and took as long as the rest of the journey.

[@thatxmas]

Why isn't Melbourne's airport connected to public transport? How hard can it be to get a train or even a bus line out to the airport?

[@devarmont87]

I love how he says "It's bringing Australia together" "Its building the nation" Only referring to Brisbane,. Melbourne, Sydney.. like the other states dont exist. To be fair Brisbane is lucky they were mentioned 😅

[@Whatsuppbuddies]

Be funny if the only historical worth of Australia day was when sydney was founded, wouldn't it?

[@nicholassmith7984]

Like in movies where aliens attack Earth, it's usually only the US.

[@devarmont87]

@@nicholassmith7984 or London hahaha 😂

[@NickJohnCoop]

There’s a reason why WA really couldn’t care less about what happens to the rest of Australia and that’s it. The amount of politicians who seem to think ‘Australia’ is just Melbourne and Sydney.

[@daleviker5884]

@@NickJohnCoop Whereas I'm sure the state pollies in WA barely think about Perth and the south west corner, but only care about the impact of their policies in Norseman and Exmouth.

[@HardstylePete]

Even an average of 160kph would be a massive upgrade.

[@JTrained]

Thats already the speed of regional trains to Canberra XD

[@ntal5859]

Not when it stops every 2km to pick up one passenger and the train already full.

[@sniper.93c14]

@@JTrained average speed of 160 not top speed. Canberra avg is more like

[@Trave13r]

best Australian documentary ever.

[@dieseldavetrains8988]

I couldn't stop laughing from start to finish, excellent work, the politicians have been resurrecting the Fast Rail between MEL-SYD-BNE for how many years and how many studies costing millions of dollars? I will be on Boot Hill by the time it's ever, if ever, built!😃

[@jaidanielparker]

Add the Bradfield Scheme to that. Every single report trotted out over the past ~80 years has concluded that it will be unbelievably expensive, nowhere near as effective as envisioned due to evaporation, cause any number of unintended consequences to existing agricultural land due to proliferation of invasive species etc etc. Yet every time there's a drought some genius politician screams "WE HAVE TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN!" Sometimes the screams land on deaf ears, other times a report is commissioned to shut them up and more of my taxpayer dollars go down the drain.

[@obliviouz]

So long as they only waste money on reports, it'll only be millions, not hundreds of millions or billions. In government terms, that's basically a surplus.

[@aluisious]

I think that this is how high speed rail in California worked, just with different accents.

[@blaiseutube]

"That's a steam train Jim!" "Jim, are you alright?"

[@adrianhempfing2042]

"Even if petrol is $7 per litre" ... we're not far off of it

[@45641560456405640563]

Yep. Only $2.20 at the moment. That's heaps close to $7 isn't it sport?

[@ggttjjnn]

Lets hope theres another season!

[@marvindebot3264]

Starts in a week or so

[@cameronmenegoni2406]

Heard this verbatim on the news once.

[@kotgc7987]

Now that hyperloop seems proven to be unviable, by the time Maglev is affordable, electric planes and autonomous vehicles will run the route. So just sort out the plane and car industry and local electorates...and done Curious on the science efficiencies and sustainability though, with legacy corporate narrative and politics aside. The Japanese post WWII military supposedly built the bullet train, without enough clout to beat the Keiretsu corporate powers with car and plane interests. Hard to see Australia even implementing the automated swivel bench seats which are fantastic.

[@rogermouton2273]

Reminds me quite a bit of the plots of Yes Minister episodes.

[@liam3284]

1st class XPT+1 hour coach to Canberra right now, $100 each way. Flights (economy class), $247 each way. Make that a 6 hour trip, rather than 9, and you are ahead.

[@carolinetaylor5594]

They can't even get the standard interstate freight trains and commuter trains going properly. 🤦‍♀

[@goodshipkaraboudjan]

I work in this scope, Inland rail is going to apparently link Standard, Broad and Narrow gauge into a link. Problem is it's going terribly and CrossRiver Rail in Queensland is a disaster because Victorian Companies were given the lead. So it's a gravy train (pun intended) for everyone working the project because Inland Rail can't really go ahead until CrossRiver is done, that's a shit show in itself that no one is in a rush to complete.

[@iJigarThakkar]

Airline mafia will be out of job so to protect those poor people who live in Toorak and Bondi

[@goodshipkaraboudjan]

@@iJigarThakkar quite a few people that have worked in the rail are moving into aviation. I'm one of them. Inland rail is never intended to be capable of high-speed rail nor support anything beyond token passenger services. It's a freight corridor, a passenger corridor is decades away.

[@benkloosterman7934]

I bet actual cost will be like 3K per ticket ... isnt state rail costs $28 per trip ?

[@goodshipkaraboudjan]

@@benkloosterman7934 ARTC run the blue thing from Sydney to Brisbane. Apparently they keep the price pegged to the Airlines but their costs are through the roof. Still nothing compared to the utter complete shit show that is Cross River. Last year I was told that ticket sales on city rail in Brisbane (QR) don't cover 20% of the cost. To give you an idea... Then the ALP here decided to help the ALP in Victoria and bring up a bunch of useless overpaid arseholes that give all their mates, cousins and uncles a jobs to stretch a job that takes a month into a year bludge. End rant. Anyway, I'd be surprised if inland gets 1% revenue off passengers.

[@ASD128London]

Our High Speed rail "HS2" in UK is now expected to cost about £65,000,000,000 for 140 miles from London to Birmingham. And

[@jumpinallans]

3:53 to say Yeah, Naah... Very Australian.

[@barashah1171]

mix of the office and yes minister....it looks great...

[@greggreyes6869]

as my boss said once, the government's job is to create that tunnel but its in their interest to make that tunnel as long as possible

[@aboubacaramine8689]

This is some good writing "But they know we know they know we know!" "What?"

[@jf7243]

One minute in and I find myself having to stop, to control my laughter and make this comment! Absolutely hilarious!

[@MarksElectricLife]

I’m getting an ice cream headache.

[@KieranShort]

This will still be a thing in 2063

[@Dave_Sisson]

Exactly. It looks great and will be dragged out at every election for the feel good factor. But sadly even the fastest train would be slower between city centres than planes and it would cost a fortune to build and require massive subsidies to operate.. But the dreamers and people who failed high school economics will still advocate that it be built.

[@Wally1967]

Yes I waited for Melb Airport rail to be built since the 1970s until now.

[@eddielong8663]

That's OK. Melbourne's Suburban Rail Loop isn't due for completion until 2085 anyway 🫠.

[@Sultanofdarts]

As a former public servant, this is exactly what happens

[@rodlytton765]

I do remember Rob Sitch at the time of Utopias first series saying Brisbane's Cross River rail would never get built. Almost finished now Rob !!! Anyway Utopia was a great show and I never missed an episode of the Late show. Anyone responsible for these two is allowed a few missteps.

[@nitramluap]

Just because it is being built, doesn't mean it should be. We still don't have enough rail corridor space for proper express services, and the need for every line to go through the CBD is a joke.

[@rodlytton765]

@@nitramluap Good Onya mate

[@Zzyzzyzzs]

@@nitramluap Yup. The lunacy of continuing to centralise a city that has the fastest growing population in Australia, when they should be looking to aggressively de-centralise, something that is already happening sort of organically anyway. Could've spent all that money incentivising development in the satellite cities (Redlands, Logan, Caboolture, Springfield/Ipswich) and/or the old industrial suburbs (Coopers Plains, Salisbury, Woolloongabba, Hemmant, Murrarie, Darra, Inala, Virginia, Banyo) and boosting public transport connectivity between and within them, giving people a network that actually will have higher capacity than a single inner-city train line and access to places that might actually be closer to where they live than the CBD. But no, keep shoving everyone into a CBD that's less than the size of UQ, pretend that so many people would willingly take a train (sorry, two trains; you have to switch from the regular train at Boggo Road or wherever) that costs even more than the daily fuel they'd spend driving in traffic and takes the same amount of time to get there, and not even give them so much as a car-park at the train station or a regular bus to get there. Oh but *slaps head of course, the Olympics are coming. Gotta find a way to move those people in and out of town for the one month they'll be here. Never mind the next 100 years, let's worry about a month ten years from now.

[@ttgg1564]

​@@Zzyzzyzzssensible person... suburban/ metro sprawl... arterial access... make it up as you go= engineering disaster

[@ttgg1564]

Succinct

[@Punkologist]

This show is pretty close to reality, but it's also pretty sad that high-speed rail is seen as impossible here. Especially after experiencing the Shinkansen from Tokyo to Osaka (501km in 2.5 hrs).

[@excrubulent]

This is an excellent supplementary piece to Bullshit Jobs by David Graeber.

[@redrock1963]

This appears to be triggering to some people - I love all the serious debate and serious questions below.

[@Sam-wl4uc]

The pnly thing missing in this show is Russeell Coight.

[@DiHandley]

Rob Sitch is a genius,

[@IndigoIndustrial]

He studied medicine but barely practised after graduating. There is one less doctor in this country because of Rob.

[@111_Chromia]

The Chinese would've completed that 400 mile rail in 2 years

[@TPRM1]

With zero* deaths. (*Margin of error: one million deaths.)

[@amyself6678]

The Americans would point out that planes go faster, so why are y'all idiots building trains and media acting like it's a genius move. Planes exist, vroom vroom.

[@skillmeup53]

You would have to build elevated lines (with protective barriers), then route to key hubs. It might work then. Maybe the next series can explore using labor from our jails as well to 'lower' the cost and instill national identity resulting in fewer criminals etc. Particularly leading up to an election - you know "we're not just getting tough on crime; we're solving it" etc.

[@coffeefish94]

Literally how HS2 came about in the UK

[@jay-em]

It sounds like the script writers actually spoke to engineers for this.

[@ButteryBao]

It sounds exactly like this. “Have you ever had ridiculous moments in your day-to-day?” “Oh, how long do you have?”

[@davideaston6944]

Where can I find FULL EPISODES of this show... looks fantastic!

[@StephenHENDERSON1]

Apparently on Netflix also via vpn on abc I've in aus

[@warboyrb]

Explains why we can never have nice thing..over the forward estimates

[@bethl.atcheson]

😂👏 so accurate

[@justinebooth5123]

Love Jim

[@dulganman]

After seeing episode 1 i got so embarrassed i couldn't continue with episode 2. 😳 The thought that this is probably closer to reality than I'd like gave me a slight anxiety attack. 😨

[@Capt182]

As an electrical contractor for a local council, I can confirm it takes 23 people to change one lightbulb. No exaggeration. The waste on bureaucracy involved in a single lightbulb change is astonishing. Anyone who pays tax to fund these leeches is a fool.

[@ntal5859]

You forget to the 22 people above you are all getting a 100k and are totally unqualified morons.

[@the.parks.of.no.return]

No money for trains - we have a 1 trillion dollar subs to pay for now.

[@Joaquin2028]

Yes exactly, Australians need to think what $368 Billion would buy instead of 8 submarines, 3 of which are second hand. Albanese has turned out to be such a disappointment.

[@scotthawke7828]

So true it’s not even parody

[@bucket6386]

halarious

[@yellowgreen5229]

RailTransitNow And the train should be called the #ElectricEMU and run on the Cucaberra Corridor

[@dux2508]

wherte to find season 5? Outside of AU?

[@jaydenritchie1992]

what about in a tunnel, in a vacuum and pressurized carriages does the simulation work then?

[@akj3388]

It's amazing that the nation would not agree on anything but one thing - lining up for the vaccines.

[@45641560456405640563]

Yawn... Let it go.

[@pkre707]

Lol this must be based on California’s high-speed rail debacle. They announced a high speed rail “authority” from LA to SF back in the late 90s. Since then it's been California’s resident money-pit. Construction only started in 2015 with a 2030 estimated finish date. But funding for it has been piece meal, and I has had so many serious problems. Its very likely it will never be completed, and based on the way things are going now, dozens of BILLIONS of dollars will have been wasted.

[@Munrubenmuz]

Everyone spruiking a VFT needs to watch this.

[@thirddan3]

I'm sorry, is this a documentry?

[@georgtomazic791]

The bald guy is funny. 😂

[@mattmiller4]

Okay but how do I watch this show in the UK?!

[@gaoxiaen1]

It worked for California, right? Right?

[@htspencer9084]

Someone should just get Jim a model train layout.

[@UnikCyberNinja]

In Ulaanbaatar they did the same thing for Metro hahaha

[@111_Chromia]

Who financed that project?

[@UnikCyberNinja]

@@111_Chromia They didn't build it, it is political scam at this point ... but the challenges are similarly overwhelming, yet since the idea is popular politicians are making it look like it's possible for every election

[@antonbrum5492]

Sorry, is this the same as the Melbourne to Tullamarine fast rail? Whoosh, wow that was so fast, I didn't even see it coming. Maybe, Labor want to reuse it for the twentieth time as an election promise.

[@zeroth2092]

what about canberra

[@grogery1570]

I feel like this video could have just explained England's London to Birmingham high speed rail. With all the problems and diversions for a billion pounds they have a rail line that goes from London to Birmingham in exactly the same time as the current line!

[@kristieslater]

ha ha brilliant

[@djtan3313]

LOL

[@Jotari]

What exactly makes it so unviable to build compared to somewhere like China? Is it purely that the population density wouldn't offset the cost until well after production or is the environment more hostile to such a project compared to other places that have done it?

[@notsureyou]

They left out the "WOLO" issue.

[@TheDesertraptor]

Labor just keep pushing it.

[@beeble2003]

Is *A* high-speed rail possible? You generally need two of them.

[@rodrigoserafim8834]

I can't believe how on the nose this is.

[@Daz555Daz]

Absolutely love this series. If you like shows like this then check out. Yes Minister/Prime Minister The Thick Of It. Twenty Twelve W1A

[@infiniteloopcounter9444]

One day it will make economic sense, just not yet. The population is growing in Australia, the land isn't subject to earthquakes and mostly empty and flat compared to say Japan where people are everywhere, mountains are more numerous and serious (I know and have been to the mountain ranges in between), and they still can do this. As time goes on progress is made on superconductors (materials/understanding of basic theory) which make the 600+ km/h trains feasible. It makes sense to wait until closer to room temperature or cheap materials/cooling or electrical supply becomes orders of magnitude cheaper. This and tunnel boring techniques and equipment, materials and assembly for tracks/etc. This is all seeing progress and one day this should happen.

[@bernadmanny]

The eastern states would have to reach 65mil population minimum, to make it viable, the distance is just to great and the medium to large cities to few.

[@nicholascharles9625]

I hate this argument so much. Like we refuse to do anything bold or progressive unless it makes a handful of people rich. Absolute joke of a country.

[@daleviker5884]

@@nicholascharles9625 Ripping up hundreds of billions of dollars to build something that would lose billions more every year is not "bold and progressive". It is just lunacy, and the fact that you weren't told "no" as a child is not justification for the rest of us jumping off a cliff.

[@nevamind68t23]

Best 👊🏾💥🤎😂

[@DAVA653]

Can somebody explain how places like Japan, China, Europe can manage high speed rail but we cant?

[@45641560456405640563]

Well, population differences for starters.

[@LexyLexer]

Europe proves that's bullshit​@@45641560456405640563

[@geoffreyrichardson8738]

No, with new submarines, can’t afford it

[@donnyazoff980]

I actually get triggered watching this because this shit happens in government organisations every day!!!!

[@Lord_Sunday]

Ahh yes, let’s abandon all future rail and public infrastructure projects because of ONE TYPE of train out of dozens. It would be cheaper than our entire roads budget to simply upgrade the existing network.

[@jameswhite7693]

The one and only way to build a high speed train from Melbourne to Brisbane is to give all the money to a Japanese company and it would be built in 2 years, I have it from a reliable souse that they have built one or two with the trains going over 600 kms. Per hour in the last 20 years without government interference, it has been 45 years since they talked about a train from Melbourne to the airport, as Wilson parking are paying big money to the labor party to stall it while they charge the highest parking fees in the world.

[@Danioton]

It won't ever work in California either. Huge boondoggle.

[@SoteksChunkyProphet-dg7io]

Japan managed to do it. They cut through mountains.

[@daleviker5884]

Building it is not the problem. Having about 100m fewer people and an area ten times bigger is.

[@jdrancho1864]

Can we make it sustainable by making it solar-powered.??

[@45641560456405640563]

LOL. They should have put that in the script somewhere!

[@1979RayDay]

Just because something worked in Japan and Europe, doesn't mean it's going to work in Australia.

[@mathewferstl7042]

A straightened out and optimised corridor (that doesn't mean boring tunnels through the blue mountains either) could put a corridor in the 600-800km range which is optimal for HSR. This combined with the demand for travel between the two cities makes the route very suitable for HSR

[@45641560456405640563]

@@mathewferstl7042 Yawn.... How many times does it have to be shown that it's not. How many times and how much money on studies will it take before people get it that it just isn't feasible. Get over it Mathew.

[@pelican9802]

Fast train equal to affordable land price. Its not going to happen!

[@theockle]

Utopia acting like there wasn't already reason lines all around the country a century ago

[@Phi1point62]

I still can't believe there are still people in the comments section who still insist we can build a high-speed train in Australia if only we look at Europe, China, etc. Those countries are dealing with far higher population densities. Not all Chinese high-speed rail lines are profitable.

[@nicholascharles9625]

The thing is the Chinese rail isn't meant to be profitable. Its meant to serve a social need. The Chinese haven't got the same fetish we do with putting a dollar sign on everything. They would rather they lose some money for greater social gain. Which ironically in the long run generates more money from its indirect affects. Cheap transport means more money in the pockets of the average Chinese. It means people can travel further to get gainful employment without having to move among many other benefits.

[@Hutcho72]

You also forgot to mention the European Lines, construction started in the late 70's in France with the TGV network. Plus the population density is allot closer in Europe compared to Australia.

[@fluoroantimonictippedcruis1537]

@@nicholascharles9625 If the BCR of chinese rail lines is not one or greater, then they aren't actively improving productivity of the country and they are a drain on financial resources. Miss us with this "social needs" nonsense. And before you spout any more nonsense: The only tangible way to improve the quality of life of anyone is to improve productivity so that they can aquire more material goods for the same amount of labour. If productivity doesn't improve, nothing has improved.

[@fluoroantimonictippedcruis1537]

The biggest problem with comparing ourselves to the Europeans or Chinese systems is to even assume we could construct each mile of track at the same price point as those countries. Labour costs in Australia are enourmous compared to those regions (including all of Europe bar Switzerland and Norway). On top of that, our suppliers aren't domestic, unlike in Europe or China where you aquire what you need the next city over. There are so many train and rail parts we have to aquire from Europe because they aren't a standard item in Australia.

[@nicholascharles9625]

@Fluoroantimonic Tipped Cruise Missile serving a social need is nonsense? How horrible imagine the government spending money to make peoples lives more convenient. Also, it really shows how shallow your view of life is. Like to you buying material goods is what makes a good life? Gross outside of things you need, happiness isn't endless consumerism. Also the Chinese have see major increases in living standards every generation so I'd say they know better than you. I do agree that increased productivity meaning more produced for less does have the opportunity to massively benefit the lives of workers it's just it almost never does. In the western world productivity has consistently gone up and wages have not met this. Hours haven't declined proportionally. The only people seeing those profits and benefit of increased productivity are business owners.

[@KTo288]

I know this is meant to be a joke, but one solution would be to build the tracks on top of a causeway ontop of a seawall in the sea from Brisbane to Melbourne. The dike could be positioned to double as coastal defences to protect against rising sea levels, and through the use of lock gates it could also be used as a tidal barrage to produce electricity from both the ebb and flow of the tides, which should be more than enough to power the trains with a surplus to send into the cities. Panamax sized locks could be positioned to allow ships to enter the new lagoon when the levels between it and the sea are equal, but a new port would probably be needed to be built, probably on an artificial island for larger container ships. Such a causeway would be similar to the Dutch Afsluitdijk on a massive scale, and you'd probably want Dutch experts on your planning team. If you really want 600kph trains, the Japanese maglev technology is the only one capable of this, maybe wait a couple of years and allow the Japanese to iron out the bugs in the system. A branch line from Sydney could link Canberra to the causeway. I'm not an expert on roos, and don't know if they would are able to swim out to the causeway to cause problems. If you must add a roadway for cars and other motor vehicles.

[@gregarroinalidadavich9220]

The European sea walls are ridiculously expensive and 0.1% of the size of what you're proposing.

[@grahamyates2490]

Great! Get a targeted scoping study on to that straight away.

[@casschellis9296]

That would be such a wonderful idea if it didn't involve building 2500km of seawalls, doing irreparable damage to the Australian eastern coast, destroying millions of hectares of marine ecosystems, completely cutting off 60% of Australia's ocean access for trade, with an expected build time of 150 years without delays, 400 years with delays, and with a cost slightly greater than the sum total of every other infrastructure project in human history.

[@captainpoppleton]

@@grahamyates2490 And announce a Dyke Authority.

[@fluoroantimonictippedcruis1537]

Sea levels might rise perhaps one metre by the end of the century, maybe 2 if we keep the status quo with regards to carbon emissions. Not worth building a seawall anywhere in Australia for 1-2 metres of sea level rise.

[@captainpoppleton]

It just takes the (INSERT ENVIRONMENTAL GROUP NAME HERE) to declare that the (INSERT ANIMAL NAME HERE) will be in danger of extinction and the whole thing stalls by 2 years.

[@dcollins850]

Doesn’t there already exist a railway line, (southern Aurora), why not upgrade. Is this show sponsored by Alan Joyce?

[@Aermydach]

How's Labor's fast rail from Sydney to the Hunter Valley coming along? I've heard nothing about it.

[@lukehollis4317]

Isn’t that a lib plan?

[@Trains_Travel_NZ]

Didn't they just get voted in?

[@lukehollis4317]

@@Trains_Travel_NZ yeah, I don't understand the point though. NSW Liberal gov has made successive plans for this which haven't happened over the past decade. Labor got elected like 2 days ago, are they at fault for not delivering it now?

[@DandamanV]

You clown they just got elected

[@louiscypher4186]

The odds of it happening are slim to none. The Libs/nats will be against it as an election strategy. The Greens will try to block because some endangered fungus will be found along the route. The Independents will use it to extort the government into putting them on committees and a bunch of other junk blowing the budget. and even if it somehow get's all the way through both houses a bunch of demented misanthropes will tie it up in courts for years.

[@ianjones7740]

Place your bets and PUT YOUR MONEY DOWN !

[@sylviaelse5086]

What are Rhonda and Jim's roles in the NBA? They seem totally political, which is not what the NBA is meant to be about at all.

[@danielharvison7510]

They're not actually part of the NBA, they're more like political liaisons or something like that. They report to the federal gov of the day.

[@dimvoly]

Is this the car-brains attempting "comedy"?

[@foxlee5515]

Making money is action. keeping money is behavior. Growing money is knowledge

[@nicholascharles9625]

This is exactly why we don't have high-speed rail everyone is so concerned with making it a business

[@45641560456405640563]

Spamming is a hobby....

[@allenjenkins7947]

It'll work if the Chinese build it, but I think that's too high a cost at any price.

[@45641560456405640563]

For sure, if the Chinese build it that means there will magically be a population large enough to support it. And if I order a cheeseburger a butterfly will die in Siberia. Or something.

[@tankatim13]

viaducts

[@elliotlambert3817]

With the rip off sub deal money China could build a high speed railway and have a heap of cash leftover

[@45641560456405640563]

And then nobody much would use it and it would lose truckloads for little utility and we'd have a white elephant on our hands and be in debt to China as well. Think it through before commenting in the future.

[@paultrout4736]

Extreme climate of Australia prevents this been commercially viable option

[@peterrobinson6872]

Not really; high speed trains are already operating in extremes of heat and cold.

[@bucket6386]

not really