Is It Okay to Spank Your Kids? | Therapist Reacts to Nate and Sutton

[@MickeyAtkins]

Save 33% on your first Native Plastic-Free Deodorant Pack - normally $39, you’ll get it for $26! Click here bit.ly/nativeatkins and use my code ATKINS#AD

[@aislynnmari]

Also I like your hair!

[@celinelia8127]

Mickey Atkins hi,will you pls respond to 'Mask Off' video by Lindsay Ellis - did she get cancelled? is she taking accountability for all her mistakes and did she address the Raya tweeet and her other comments in a responsible way?

[@m0bz0mb39]

I also want to point out that modeling is SUPER important and hitting your kid because they aren't playing nice or sharing literally makes no sense! If you want your child to "play nice" and respect others then don't hit them! If you treat them with respect and respect yourself then they will learn to respect themselves and others. Also it is absolutely mortifying that they are spanking their kids and locking them in cars and forcing them to share and sit in restaurants and shit when they are all *three and under* like wtf that's not in any way developmentally appropriate! Even if I did spank my kids I would never spank a child that young! (I would never spank my kids, we do a mix of Montessori and RIE parenting and do time outs, *property* btw not just throwing your kid in a corner and yelling at them) but yeah I can't believe she hit her fucking TWO YEAR OLD with a SPOON, which idk where they live but here in Cali that is illegal, you can't hit a child with an object, only your hand on their butt no more than 3 times and it shouldn't leave a mark

[@Luubelaar]

I was so excited to see this offer. I've used it before and I needed to order more deodorant... so imagine my disappointment when I discovered that Native are not shipping to Australia and New Zealand anymore. Maybe in the future, but it's currently "on hold". Bummer.

[@lizf1353]

😂 they Really want you to say you put on deodorant and didn't shower or add new deodorant for 3 days 😂 that's not really a great ad in my personal opinion. Like they are saying "hey if you are someone who can spend $12 on deodorant but doesn't want to shower more than 2 times a week have we got the product for you!" 😂

[@michaelkeller5555]

I USED to say "I was spanked and I turned out fine". Used to. Then it dawned on me that punching walls when I'm pissed off and flinching when someone moves when they're angry is not "turned out fine" in any capacity. I was spanked and I did NOT turn out fine.

[@vintagearisen]

I have fight or flight reflexes when someone tells me a mistake I've made, calls my name loudly, or just like heavy footsteps approaching my door. I used to get so ridiculously defensive any time my husband would try to talk about something I was doing that he wasn't okay with. I've been in therapy for a while and I'm finally breaking out of those reflexes. If I "turned out fine," it's in spite, not because of.

[@Sputterbug]

same, i got anxiety from it and am now afraid to speak out in public to people im talking to in case they react violently. its NOT okay. and its not like i even got spanked every day, this was from a handful throughout my life.

[@jessemiller4953]

I'm glad that you realized this and I hope that you start to feel safe and happy

[@SavageMinnow]

Sorry for your experience. Glad you realized you have a problem and hopefully are working to get better 🙂

[@xenonsan3110]

The thing that personally got me out of this mentality was how I would feel disgusted if someone hit a dog but not if someone hit a kid. It was wild to think I had more compassion for an animal, that has significantly less cognitive reasoning, then a human being

[@Mother_of_muffins]

Imagine if an adult said "I'm not telling you that you have to hit your spouse, I'm just telling you that I've found it works when I hit my spouse. If they do something I don't like I give them a whooping and lock them in the car and then after that all I have to do is threaten them and they comply with my wishes"

[@vintagearisen]

Fantastic way to reframe it. It really is that horrific. More so, because another adult usually has the physical and legal capacity to escape and the mental and emotional capacity to understand what's happening to them. Children have none of those things. It's honestly horrific that people deadass say these things with their own face and their own name on the open Internet and have zero qualms about it.

[@kellin12]

Or your employee? or your student? This is not preparing children to deal with conflict because the only people it';s socially acceptable to hit are your kids. Some people react more negatively to hitting or kicking an animal than hitting a child.

[@baileyb123bb]

Always my biggest argument! Do you hit your spouse? "NO NO I'd never hit a woman" but you spank your DAUGTHER? MAKE IT MAKE SENSE

[@lisamcdonald2877]

Apples and oranges.

[@vintagearisen]

@@lisamcdonald2877 no it's really not. You don't get to hit adults. Why should it suddenly be okay to hit children?

[@queenmotherhane4374]

My mother was a hitter. When I was in my 20s, I got up the nerve to tell her I’d been afraid of her when I was a child. She started weeping hysterically that I could say such a cruel thing to her.

[@tatertotbobaandpieck]

jeeeeesus. I'm so sorry she isn't emotionally mature enough to accept responsibility. I hope you're doing better now.

[@284mbp]

christ what a child.

[@bunnybunny7112]

This is exactly why I don't bring up childhood shit to my mom. I would rather just work on myself than open that can of worms and create drama. It's unfortunate, but after everything I had to deal with I would rather keep the peace.

[@queenmotherhane4374]

@@tatertotbobaandpieck, the fact that she’s gone to her great reward makes it somewhat easier.😕

[@starzzzy22]

Boyyyy does this sound familiar 🙄 I told my parents something similar in my early 20s and turns out some parents cannot handle ANY criticism. They did their best and even if it hurt you, that’s not their problem.

[@hollydawn07]

It’s so absurd to me when people say “maybe you don’t have to spank your kids but I have to spank mine” because 100% of the people who have said this to me, started spanking their children as INFANTS. How do you know they wouldn’t have responded to more gentle correction and guidance? You started physically abusing them before they could even walk away or speak up for themselves.

[@MargauxNeedler]

There's definitely no just walking away or speaking up for ourselves anyway, and I totally agree with you. Spanking is lazy & mean. Unless a kid is being a total psycho & gonna hurt someone or themselves then physical force isn't necessary

[@vanissaberg5824]

Here's the thing that opened my eyes about spanking. Why is it illegal to hit another adult and you go to jail, but hitting a small child is considered okay?

[@Saira124]

​@@vanissaberg5824Right, I was truamatized by beatings. But, Some people are saying that some kids listen nothing and they have to do it

[@lovelysakurapetalsyt]

It's also even worse when they know that other treatment works better and then start hitting. My mom died when I was three, and every time she disciplined me and my siblings, it was more of a "don't be a dumbass" and more positive reinforcement than anything. When she died and my dad's abuse was more easily covered up, he started hitting me and my full sister. He only stopped because he considered us women (at different points) and is terrified of women because they can fight back. We weren't even teens when he considered us women. It was so gross

[@cjl3053]

More than that, if an adult walked up to me on the street and slapped my bottom, that wouldn't just be regular assault; it would be SEXUAL assault. We recognize that that would be a form of unwanted sexual touch on a private, erogenous area of the body. It is BEYOND fucked up that we are allowed to do that nonconsensually to children's bodies.@@vanissaberg5824

[@karinagutierrez7134]

>> Gives a spanking >> Gives a hug/kiss to comfort them because of the physical pain THEY just caused >> Victim blame by telling TODDLERS “it hurts my feelings to spank you” This is one of the most abusive tactics I’ve ever heard of. They’re literally weaponizing trauma bonding against their tiny children. How horrible.

[@EroticInferno]

I can’t only imagine what those babies are thinking T_T

[@LeahDyson-kq4bd]

Setting them up for borderline symptoms

[@4rinstr_]

@@LeahDyson-kq4bd me rn

[@BlertaPupu]

It's a really common thing to do under physically abusive parents.

[@thoughtsonredbudhill]

THIS!!

[@kristenfournier]

I was spanked and I turned out totally fine… except for crying uncontrollably every time I get the mildest constructive criticism and always feeling nervous around authority figures. Other than that totally fine.

[@515aleon]

I don't cry that way but yes to not being able to handle constructive criticism and feeling nervous around authority figures, has gotten better, but yes, true. I feel my confidence level is not what it should be. They were nothing as severe as this guy described. I have never been spanked and put in a car by myself. I can't even my parents doing such a thing.

[@qwandary]

@@515aleon I used to get beaten more than my siblings and isolated a lot. I don't think I was put in a car routinely, but I wouldn't be surprised if it happened at least once while I was having an autistic meltdown which was mistaken as me being controlling and evil. I have a lot of issues with feeling like people don't give a shit about me, and forget I exist the moment I'm not talking to them, and it's probably partly related to that, and a few other childhood things.

[@515aleon]

@@qwandary I'm sorry. No one deserves this! I'm sure this happened to me though, as I think I said, my parents were not severe. But any corporal punishment against children is just wrong and evil. It should be against the law as it is in civilized nations.

[@tinawexler6547]

That’s how my trauma manifests too! I hope you are doing ok!❤

[@anthapersephone7311]

Same, fam. Only just now in my 30s acknowledging how scared and alone I spent most of my childhood

[@isabellarhiner8119]

I've always thought that people who say, "I was spanked and I turned out fine!" are proof that they didn't. They think it's ok to hit a child.

[@necroflowers2244]

It's usually the person slurring their words, holding a cigarette, swaying back and forth swearing they are better parents than their own parents. But at the same time saying things like that.

[@dollinterrupted]

My dad used to justify ‘spanking’ us (he was legit attacking us) because when he was a kid his stepdad would tie him up and burn him with cigarettes

[@necroflowers2244]

@@dollinterrupted Yeah my mom glorifies my very abusive grandmother. She like to retell stories about how her mother would beat them, and laugh about it because supposedly "my grandma wouldn't take disrespectful behaviour". When in reality my grandmother viewed having bodily autonomy, and personal boundaries as disrespectful. My mom is the same way, which is why I keep my kids far from her.

[@Dahlily]

@@dollinterrupted omg that's horrific

[@HarvardChickie]

👏👏👏

[@nervousbreakdown711]

I’m loving Millenials and Gen Z taking a look at how we were raised and not doing that 😊

[@beckiadriaanse6312]

I read recently that less than 20% of parents currently use any form of corporal punishment, which is incredible. In 2000, the number was 50% and in 1980, it was closer to 80%. At this rate, in 20 years, spanking will really be a thing of the past and anyone who does it won't be looked at kindly

[@bkk1996]

@@beckiadriaanse6312 That's very hopeful. I way watching a video by another creator on fundamentalism, specifically the "punishments" used in fundie culture. Punishment being another word for flat out ab*se. I was shocked at the amount of people in the comments condoning "whooping a$$" to teach kids to keep their hands to themselves?? I don't understand their logic there. I'm glad to know that more people are beginning to understand the damage and harm physical punishment does to children's ability to trust others and process their emotions in a healthy way.

[@starzzzy22]

I love the conversation around parenting/spanking but I also have realized that not everyone is in on the conversation. IMO, there are some religious, class, and racial/ethnic dynamics that keep some people from considering alternatives to spanking.

[@mommybreakdown]

We almost have the same channel name @Nervous Breakdown. Us millennials and our breakdowns 💀 😂

[@UlexiteTVStoneLexite]

And just choosing not to do it at all. My husband and I are millennials and we're not having kids at all. He's getting snipped in a few weeks.

[@juliabobeck6751]

In Sweden we made it a law in 1979 that it was illegal to harm children. Therefore hitting as a form of discipline was not legal anymore and you are required to report it. Because of this it boggles my mind that this is so normalized in America (amongst other countries), when it’s literally been illegal for almost 45 years where I live

[@lizf1353]

As a LGBTQ+ family here it's just TERRIFYING for us all the time 😢 we thought things were moving in a positive direction when we started to finally start building out family about 6yrs ago. There was bigotry yes but it looked like things were steadily (if slowly) marching forward with just a very small but loud extremist conservative group that were overall fairly ineffective anymore at spreading their hate to impact policies. That rapidly switched gears with Trump and the extremists who glued themselves to him and movements by these groups to target local political offices and the judicial branch 😢 now we live in compleat terror of what will be next for us. We own our home in south Carolina (right on the border with Charlotte N.C) so republican controlled states but in purple/blue areas. We have had to come to the conclusion that we can't stay in our HOME 😢 that we very literally need to flee for the emotional and possibility physical safety of our children and family. They have a don't say gay bill on the ballot coming up along with several other anti-lgbtq bills, they have dismantled women's bodily autonomy and are going after things like BIRTH CONTROL trying to make access to it more difficult and trying to limit anyone under 18 access to any contraceptives 😢 (we have 2 assigned female at birth child how can we raise them in a place they would be forced to give birth) they are going after ivf and fertility treatment (something that we needed to use to have our children and we still have 2 embryos on ice!) There's actually politicians here that openly advocate not only going after gay marriage but they are saying we shouldn't be allowed to have children! They are saying we are unsafe parents (all LGBTQ people) and that kids should be removed from LGBTQ parents because they are groomers 😢 we can't stay here. It sounds like insane crazy talk that will go nowhere but not that long ago I thought people who where talking about making abortion illegal were just spewing crazy talk and it couldn't possibly go anywhere too😢 but how far can we really run? Will we really be safe just running to a blue state? For how long? If trump wins he has already promised to essentially be a dictator. They already have the 2025 plan that is horrific and would absolutely be a step into authoritarian regime. Already basically no country is willing to stand by international asylum laws when it comes to American citizens who want to claim asylum. If we made the same claims (that our country by objective evidence and statistics charges black people and LGBTQ people with more crimes, more harshly punishes them, doesn't offer the same rights, over policing to those groups, is exponentially more likely to falsely accuse and convict them, has laws that target them, has a large amount of political leadership openly calling for more rights to be stripped from them and to take their children and ban their very existence from public view) but put that it was Brazil doing these things and I'm seeking asylum from Brazil I would be granted asylum in a heartbeat but because it's America nobody is willing to grant asylum 😢 I wish more people in countries like Sweden, Canada, Norway, UK etc would tell their government to stand up and acknowledge (perhaps even call out) the human rights violations of the United States as they would any other countries who behaved this way. To grant asylum to some that seek it to send the message that what is happening here is WRONG and sick! America is like the only country that refused to ratify (sign) the international rights of the child agreement! 😢 WTF! If say, idk, Georgia refused you know other countries would never stop talking about how wrong it is and there might even be international sanctions! America does it and nobody does shit!

[@jenniferb9506]

Sweden is Sweden. Your whole culture is different. Your people are different.

[@moonjudas]

I live in Michigan USA and there are many people here who carried and still carry cognitive dissonance thinking hitting a child on the butt isn't hitting them because it doesn't hurt as much. I'd beg to differ we need our children to know no one should ever touch their butt especially in anger 😔

[@amykrog4264]

Nate and his face when he's smiling and proud about "giving them a whooping" terrifies and enrages me. ... Holding my wild toddler gently and addressing my own trauma, not making it her responsibility, is the most important work I've ever done.

[@Gilded_Cage_Princess]

I get overwhelmed when mine has meltdowns, but he needs physical stimulation, breathing does not work, but holding and rocking and rubbing his back does.

[@fancydeer]

I had to remember they said their kids were "3 under 3" why on earth would they even want to whoop their kids? Why would a spanking cross their mind? These are babies they're dealing with.

[@christinasmith698]

@@fancydeerI was hit with belts when I was three years old so has my brother and we’ve turned out just fine.

[@fancydeer]

@@christinasmith698 I was also spanked with belts and shoes and other sorts of objects and I don't think I "turned out fine". also we're talking about toddlers, not older children. TODDLERS. BABIES. Why do you want a grown ass man hitting a baby?

[@chesneymigl4538]

​@@christinasmith698 Has it ever occurred to you as odd that things that are illegal to do to animals are perfectly fine for babies?

[@lindseystein9676]

I’ve always viewed spanking/hitting as a lazy attempt at parenting.

[@MoonColouredDemon]

It is! It’s a total cop out. Instead of putting in the emotional work, it’s easier for them to haul off and hit the kid into submission.

[@angryunicornproductions2633]

Yep its never made sense that hitting is bad in all contexts except parentiong like no wtf society why r u like this

[@LaCeiba1924]

@@MoonColouredDemon this is why so many people should have never had kids. It’s a huge effort to do it right, and it completely changes your entire life. I understand that there’s a biological drive to want children, but we’re not animals. Popping out a kid and tossing them into the world isn’t something our species gets to do. If you look at everything a human child needs to thrive, almost none of it is stuff that parents know instinctually. The vast majority of people go into parenting thinking that they will simple figure it out as they go, and the end result is billions of people with childhood trauma.

[@jessilovely]

Lazy is one word, abusive maybe encompasses the damage more lmao

[@AmberAmber]

Yep. I've said it so many times. It shows you're more unwilling to afford your child their humanity than to examine other alternatives

[@spatulaoblangata]

Toddlers don't "misbehave", they just behave. Sometimes in ways that should be discouraged, but that doesn't mean they're being naughty

[@Sputterbug]

right, children can misbehave, but not toddlers. theyre barely out of infant-hood.

[@purplepebble3479]

Right! They’re still in the exploring phase!

[@roobard2700]

Before I moved out of my parents' house at 19, I sat down with my dad and told him how scared I was of him as a child. I said that if I ever had kids, I would never hit my child. I told him to his face, for the first time, that him regularly hitting me with a piece of wood was traumatizing. He looked me in the eye and said, without any sign of regret, "I did the best I could." And my family still doesn't understand why I never want to talk to that bastard again.

[@rowanquynn9964]

I'm not sure if you know, or have been told how incredibly strong you are for that. Speaking up for yourself and then holding boundaries to protect yourself is more than a lot of us manage. Well done

[@roobard2700]

@@rowanquynn9964 Thank you. That means more to me than you know.

[@matchbox420.]

To echo what the other commenter has said, you are extremely strong. I have a very similar story. When my dad was dying I told him I forgave him for all the abuse he made me go through. His response? “I don’t remember it that way”. But right before he died, he told me “you always were the strongest one”. My life has been nothing but a tornado of confusion and opposing thoughts.

[@stavenbyrne8010]

Satan 0:1 Your dad

[@moz7173]

I know this and sending my support and love X

[@lindenbree9188]

I'm sure most of you are aware of the Bobo doll experiment. If not, basically it's a study in which they found toddlers who observed adults hitting a doll were more likely to imitate that behaviour. I have a real life anecdote along those lines. My parents hit and spanked me when I was growing up. As a toddler, I remember I caught two lizards, and wanted them to be friends. But, the bigger lizard tried to eat the smaller one. So, I did as I was taught, and I hit the big lizard because it "misbehaved." This happened a few more times, until I accidentally killed it. I felt horrible, and since I was religious back then, was also terrified I'd go to hell for taking an innocent life. I prayed for forgiveness, crying, as I buried the lizard. It wasn't until learning about the Bobo experiment over a decade later that I realised what had happened. It wasn't my fault; I was exhibiting normal behaviour for someone of that age, raised in that environment. It still disturbs me to this day, however. Don't hit your children. It messes them up.

[@hailyjohnson407]

This is how my parents realized they made a mistake. I was tge oldest of my 3 siblings, and I was about 8ish when this happened and my brother was 6 or 7. He was annoying me in the car and just wouldn't stop after I asked him to stop and then told him to stop, so I hit him. My dad pulled over the car and looked at me and said "now why the hell would you think it's ok to hit your brother?" And I said "well he was bothering me and I told him to stop, and he didn't listen, so I hit him to make him listen." And he said "you don't hit your brother to make him listen to you." And I said "yeah you do. That's what you and mom do when I'm not listening to you." And I remember seeing them look at each other with an "oh shit" expression, and things changed drastically after that. I was spanked less than a handful of times after that, and it was for actual bad things I did, not just being an obnoxious child with too much energy. I used to get spanked for simply disobeying when being told to sit still or be quiet and I didn't. I later found out I have ADHD when I was about 12ish, and my parents then apologized for some of the unnecessary punishments I had as a child that they thought was making me a "good" kid when really it was just causing me distress and doubt in myself and made me think I was bad and disrespectful no matter how hard I tried.

[@lindenbree9188]

@@hailyjohnson407 I'm sorry that happened to you, but I'm also glad you parents realised their errors! I hope you have a good relationship with them now

[@hailyjohnson407]

@lindenbree9188 yes, I have a great relationship with both of my parents now, but I think it was due to them realizing their mistakes and making changes. They used to be very authoritarian, but after I pushed back enough and pointed out the flaws in the "it's my way or the highway" logic they used, they started to step back and let us start making age appropriate decisions. I'm very glad my parents at that point chose to listen to me and reevaluate their choices instead of doubling down and silencing me. It was rough, but now we get along great, and they have apologized for most of their earlier mistakes. And now as an adult, I can see they were doing their best to learn from their parents' mistakes, and they really did try, and I appreciate that they at least listened to me and made changes. It doesn't make it right or ok, but it shows me that they really did care about doing their best for me, and as soon as I was old enough to use my voice to tell them it wasn't good for me, they listened and changed. If they hadn't, I doubt we would have a relationship at all now. I actually had a better relationship with my parents as a teen than as a child. We had very few disputes by the time I was a teen, because they allowed me more freedom, and by the time I was entering adulthood after graduating at 17, almost every decision was a discussion instead of them telling me what to do. If I wanted to do something and they said no, their word was still final, but I was allowed to basically "plead my case" and explain why I should be allowed, and it had to have solutions to address the reasons why they said no originally, and then they would consider my input, and then I had more respect when they still said no sometimes, because I knew why they did no, and I knew that they had considered my opinion on it. I'd say I'm a pretty well rounded adult now, but my conflict resolution skills aren't great if there's high emotions because of the early childhood stuff. But I'm great at having calm and rational discussions about outcomes to a decision, and I have confidence to stand up for myself thanks to the later years!

[@thesingerintheshower]

❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

[@ace_of_cakes]

@@hailyjohnson407 I can relate, but on the other side of that. My parents spanked my older sister and I as kids. ]But my sister began to copy my parents so anytime she got angry, she hit. And I was the most convenient thing around to hit. It got to the point that my parents took her (at 7 or 8 years old) to therapy to learn anger management. She stopped hitting me after that, and I don't know if my parents would have continued spanking us, but I was already afraid enough to obey and not give them the opportunity to. I'm still in therapy for anxiety and depression because I feel I have to be perfect all the time and I cry anytime I feel like I'm in trouble with an authority figure. Also recently figured out I have ADHD and probably am also autistic, so that's been fun. My parents have grown a lot since then, and have admitted they regret spanking us.

[@TartanSystem]

The fact that the kids laughed at the spanking makes me ill. Uncontrolled laughter can be a PTSD response

[@saltydinonuggies1841]

Yeah it’s really upsetting. I broke into laughter at my parents abuse a lot which often made them get worse towards me for “talking back” or “being rude.” It’s just an anxiety response to help you regulate. It means literally nothing and is hard if not impossible to control.

[@peek-a-boo1335]

The reminder that I had this response as a child was a PTSD response is both validating and saddening, more upsetting when recalling how I was treated because of it.

[@someoneanyone365]

I know my sisters and I were on occasion told to pull our pants down for “bare bottomed spankings”💔 but I can’t really remember it happening nor my responses to them….must have blocked that part out, but I know exactly how that and other acts of violence from both parents from toddler age to 17 MESSED ME TF UP.

[@Riverrivriver]

@@someoneanyone365me too I even had my grandma tell me “You’re mom hits you because she loves you it hurts her more than you” 🙄she’s a toxic enabler.

[@beckiadriaanse6312]

I have kids the same age as theirs, and they are really really well behaved in restaurants.... Because I don't expect them to sit there with nothing to do! I have a "boredom pack" in our bag with small toys they don't normally get, coloring books, and fiddly things. I also get them something they like and I speak to them nicely. I'm also not afraid to just walk out with them to help them calm down if they need to and I don't feel embarrassed by kids being kids Edit because I wrote this and then heard more. I have a boy. I don't hit him, and I have never thought that I would need to hit him.

[@helenr4300]

Exactly you give them the resources to cope with the situation of being in one place for a long time.

[@joanna0988]

I have 3 kids and my first 2 this worked with but not with my son (who may be on the spectrum still waiting for his assessment) and that's fine. We just do take out or eat at home 🤷

[@beckiadriaanse6312]

@@joanna0988 every kid is their own person, and accepting their limits is how we teach them to accept others. Not every kid is going to be like mine, and I get that, but no kid is going to be able to sit quietly for an hour while adults talk around them.

[@joanna0988]

@@beckiadriaanse6312 I was agreeing with you ❤️ sorry it didn't come off that way.

[@maddie19]

EXACTLY! It’s important to know your kids, this would have worked with me, but my sister, big no! My sister went to bed when the sun went down, if we weren’t out of a restaurant by 6pm at the latest she would have a meltdown because she was tired. People like those in the video teach their kids to operate from fear.

[@christineschorr4647]

I like that you said "children do not manipulate adults." Children want to please by nature, but at their age and knowledge it's not possible all the time. Our expectations are often far above their age.

[@EnaGoba]

Yeah the expectation thing is something I'm trying to deal with. My parents were demanding and I've noticed on occasion that I expect a lot from my kid too. It's always things I know he's able to do, but he isn't always able to do them (especially like emotional regulation etc or tasks that are overwhelming at certain times). You think you've done the work and evaluated the parenting your parents did, but then when you're parenting in the wild? Whole different ballpark

[@naryainc]

Children can and do manipulate adults. Of course not when they're too young to understand but everyone is manipulative and does things that are self serving and children learn this behavior too, and are even taught this. It doesn't have to be malicious either.

[@theanimerapper6351]

​@@naryaincyea this comment section is clearly full of people who don't have kids. Even the person making the video doesn't have kids

[@user-mv5zt8qd9l]

​@@theanimerapper6351 Birthing a child doesn't make you an authority on raising them.

[@jborrego2406]

Well they do( maybe called something else) like they want a toy or u want them get ready they cry then small smile on there face lol . Like stop that ur not getting that toy lol . I just take it they don't no how to communicate well an this show what they want .an way talk u into with the words of a debate .

[@MoonColouredDemon]

Too many people forget that children are not extensions of themselves, they are not little drones, they are not little dolls. They are people with personalities and emotions separate from their parents. Some parents are almost tyrannical in the way they “raise” their kids. They swap out genuine respect for blind obedience and wonder a few decades down the line why their kids don’t talk to them.

[@mst3kharris]

I don’t have kids of my own, but my best friend has kids. I realized shortly after they were born that said kids already had personalities and preferences when they were newborns. It blew my mind.

[@susanoline5823]

The biggest mistake this couple did was to go online with their parenting actions. Everyone is a perfect parent til they have kids. At least they are conscious they have kids.

[@katrinaoliver4167]

The fundie subculture they are from basically encourages this kind of narcissism in parents-even from the pulpit. Your kids need to think like you, have their hobbies from you, believe in Jesus like you, otherwise you aren’t “raising them them in the Lord” well enough. It sounded so radical to me as an adult when I learned they other people just raised their kids to be…well, whoever they were going to be, and a good, kind person. In fundie land, if a woman’s daughter or a man’s son doesn’t follow their exact footsteps, and has a semblance of their own identity, they failed.

[@user-mv5zt8qd9l]

​@susanoline5823 Nobody is asking for people to be perfect parents. They're asking them to be conscious of their methods, be receptive to evidence around best practise and to not peddle abusive guidance as if it were true.

[@LeahDyson-kq4bd]

The people that are convinced their kids are manipulating them are the same ones who will have at least one kid be a scapegoat

[@brynbloom5993]

Its so courteous of them to have these videos done and ready for when their children are in therapy for their trauma in 15 years

[@danika9411]

I think CPS might take them away at one point.

[@ilikecookies9796]

@@danika9411 Here's hoping.

[@saltydinonuggies1841]

@@danika9411cps doesn’t really do their job most of them time sadly. So we can hope but it’s unlikely

[@littlemiranda1199]

I am Swedish and I have never been spanked, because my country was the first one in the world to ban hitting children in 1979. I am extremely proud of my country for that!!

[@michaelkeller5555]

Part of me wonders, if we didn't have an entire generation of people who were taught that hitting is love, would the amount of people remaining in abusive relationships be lower?

[@kristenbarho7463]

Most likely. People copy and/or accept the behavior you know. If you grow up being hit by your parents or watching them hit each other, you don’t think anything of it when someone else you love does that to you or you don’t think it’s a problem to do it to someone else

[@kristenbarho7463]

@@xenonsan3110 you make some really great points here! This makes me want to elaborate more on my original reply. A lot of abusers have been abused themselves, but like you said, abuse can come in many forms, not just physical. So yeah, I think abuse would be less common if we teach people to parent in a healthier way, but this means it’s a lot more complicated than teaching parents not to hit their kids. Parents need to raise kids in a physically and emotionally safe way for us to see a reduction in the amount of abusive relationships

[@xenonsan3110]

@@kristenbarho7463 definitely! Just stepping back and parenting in a different, safer, and healthier way will go a long way. And just to add on we also should teach them (and ourselves) how to recognize early signs of abusive behavior

[@rachelk4805]

I actually think this is the most powerful tool for dealing with domestic violence. Addressing domestic violence that has already occurred doesn't save the thousands of lives lost to it every year. It doesn't keep families intact, it doesn't help abused kids who become parents learn how to raise their kids in a healthy way. It has to start with protecting and nurturing children. A child who is loved and taught the tools like processing difficult emotions, etc... doesn't abuse their partner. It has a root cause.

[@bmoe4609]

Id say yes honestly. Alot of things would be differeny

[@bready2crumble]

I am a 25 year old child of a pastor. My parents have totally screwed me up emotionally. It has been nearly impossible for me to get closure because my parents think they could not have possibly abused me because in their mind they gave me good christmases and only struck me on the ass. I was spanked, screamed at, and called manipulative since I was probably in the second grade. “I didn’t call you a bitch! I said you were ACTING like one!”

[@Helen-oi7qm]

I am very sorry you had all this happen to you. I wish you the best of luck with navigating all these hard feelings and thoughts

[@ashyboo74]

Wow that just reminded me of when my dad said pretty much the exact same thing. He would say "you're being/acting like a bitch right now" (I was 14-16) and when I would respond with anger or sadness he would say "I didn't say you ARE a bitch I said you're BEING/acting like a bitch" like ??????? That's the same thing you just called your teenage daughter a bitch dude. Semantic word games don't change that fact.

[@jamestheshameless2275]

Strangely my parents were mostly atheist but still did this exact thing? I learned to answer to "asshole" and "dumbshit" whenever I did something slightly wrong and then got spanked and told that I was being ungrateful. All attempts at closure (for me) were unsuccessful. Hope you're doing ok.

[@shistyWolf]

My dad was a born-again Christian construction worker. “He works overtime, even when he is sick, so that you can have food on the table. There are kids out there who don’t have parents that love them.” -my mom, to her sobbing daughter, after he grabbed me, kicked me, and called me a stupid bitch.

[@chesiresays]

I grew up in a similar situation, I was gaslight to the point that I even started questioning if the physical pain I felt was real or if I was just making it up.

[@efnfen]

It's crazy that the most abusive monsters are always the most self-righteous and think they're the "good people" surrounded by bad people.

[@danika9411]

Sounds a bit like narcissism 😅

[@thesingerintheshower]

💯

[@SMCwasTaken]

My dad is a hero

[@kp-da]

So many flashbacks of being hit by my dad while my mom yelled at him to stop it. They divorced, thankfully, but somehow my dad ended up with primary custody. And I cut him out of my life one year ago. ♡

[@kp-da]

I was also always mocked and made fun for being upset from toddler to teenager to full grown adult in my twenties. It's not cute or funny to upset me just because I'm conventionally attractive. My defense mechanisms are not for anyone's entertainment. 😒

[@cornchipluvr]

❤❤❤❤❤ sending love

[@Nexibis]

I’m 100% with you on the spanking conversation. Every time someone says to “well I was spaniel I turned out fine” I counter with “obviously not, because you think it’s ok to hit your kids when you’re feeling heightened emotionally”. I’ve never seen someone stop so fast in their tracks.

[@Merrymouseis13]

I'm a toddler teacher. I've experienced so many teaching assistants or parents worried that their child is being manipulative or is acting out to get something. Toddlers just don't think like that. If they are crying because they don't want to wear shoes or sit for lunch or stay on their cot during naptime. That's their real true emotions. Teaching kids that they are safe and making things easier for them so that they don't worry about shoes or staying seated is our biggest goal. There is nothing wrong with the kids for being upset. And there's nothing wrong with the parents for being frustrated. Baby steps and boundaries are just way more important

[@morgianasartre6709]

Maybe toddlers are not yet at that point but there does come a point where children learn patterns and start to utilise them, like my nephew (6) clearly admitted to my boyfriend that he usually doesn't really want to cry if he falls or wants something or whatever but he just does because the women will run to his side and do what he asks, he acts differently with the few male figures he has in his life because he has learned it does not work on them.

[@necroflowers2244]

@@morgianasartre6709 That's not manipulative though. Your nephew has understood that women are more empathetic and caring and he enjoys that. Whereas the males aren't. It's called social conditioning, he has been socially conditioned to not show pain or discomfort around other men because the men in his life sadly don't respond in a caring manner to a hurt child. You have to understand your nephew doesnt have the articulation nor psychological understanding to clearly explain his behaviour, but it's definitely not manipulative. He's just aware of gendered behavior.

[@Merrymouseis13]

@morgianasartre6709 toddlers are generally 18 months to 3 years old. So your 6 year old nephew has developed significantly more than any of my toddlers. I also agree with the commentary that it may be due to socialization. It's harder for little boys to get through I need to be strong and boys don't cry messaging, and much easier to notice how his caregivers respond to his actions.

[@jadziajan]

@@necroflowers2244 Yep. And there's a non zero chance said nephew was trying to act tough in front of this person's boyfriend. "You may see me crying but actually I don't need to." Kids don't always lie but they sure do imitate the adults in their lives.

[@morgianasartre6709]

@@necroflowers2244 I think everyone who says "manipulative" in the context of children does not mean that they are these little masterminds that understand perfectly what they are doing, my example is as far as it gets. As you say he's aware of gendered behaviour and uses it to his advantage - most people would label that simply as "manipulative" for conveniance because it is pretty self explanatory, at least imo. And please don't make assumptions, the men in his life do respond in a caring manner to a hurt child, they just also don't needlessly coddle him and know when he is faking or over exagerating it which is not a bad thing at all. I do know that he is doing it because he is lacking the attention from his biological mother and tries to compensate it elsewhere but that doesn't change which attention and reactions are helpful and which are not.

[@kurzwaren9304]

The part where you said that children are incapable of maniupulating adults was really comforting to me. When I was maybe 3 years old we had a little dog that bit me and we had to give him away, I was sad about him having to go and I asked my mom after my bedtime if I could have a cookie because I was sad about the dog, and my mom interpreted this as me guilt tripping and manipulating her AS A 3 YEAR OLD. This interaction I had no control over caused my mom to believe I had a manipulative personality for the rest of her life. And whenever I made her feel bad she assumed I was guilt tripping her because I wanted something??? But yeah, thank you for helping me realize that I had no real control over the situation as a 3 year old and there was no way I could consciously be guilt tripping her.

[@lsmmoore1]

And the funny thing is these same people will accuse autistic adults of manipulating people AFTER said autistic folks carefully chose their words to be something a manipulator would never say (because said phrases are carefully designed to cut off any possibility of the autistic adult having control over their audience beyond not being bothered). And I guarantee that if children had the skill to manipulate, neurotypical kids as well as autistic adults would be performing this sort of "anti-manipulation" like a champ across the board because any kid has motivation to ensure that their needs are framed honestly without demanding one iota more than necessary (so as to not anger adults). But no young kids have the skill either to manipulate (in ways that wouldn't be instantly spotted) OR to do this sort of "anti-manipulation". And even among elementary/middle school kids, that level of skill is relatively rare.

[@TracyTodd2199]

My boomer parents were taught that infants could manipulate the parents. Imagine that type of thinking and how that encouraged abuse and neglect in those days.

[@dellybird5394]

@@TracyTodd2199 I've heard that too. Had a sunday school teacher who said that babies crying when they "don't need anything" is sinful (e.g. crying to get attention from mom/dad and stopping the second they see them) As if she felt like a baby was manipulating her or something. Some people REALLY resent their kids

[@TracyTodd2199]

@@dellybird5394 Weird times in that era. I forgave my parents cause their intentions were good. They were loving at least.

[@lfleia]

"And whenever I made her feel bad she assumed I was guilt tripping her because I wanted something??? " You're also never the one 'making' her feel bad, what she feels as a result of something is for her to feel and for her to manage. I'm having these kinds of conversations with my spouse now, how they don't want to say something to me that they think I might feel bad by, but I reassure them that it's my job to identify my feelings, figure out what's UNDER those feelings, and what in my past has happened that might cause me to feel that way by extension of previous reactions. From there, I can figure out whether or not that's reasonable, or if I need some type of reframing or discussion with them or a therapist to sort out. My deepest desire as a parent for my child is to NORMALIZE having conversations about awkward subjects and modeling how to process those emotions either in the moment with someone or to be able to step away to process, and then come back. It's a skill that I didn't learn as a child, that I think a lot of people from dysfunctional families don't learn, that the whole world would benefit from.

[@Mels0103]

It's crazy how some people are so OBSESSED with hurting their children. And not only that, but will fight and argue to continue to hurt their children while rejecting any alternative methods.

[@cclockwise_ll3]

Yeah seriously, if there are evidence-based ways to raise a healthy child without hitting them why would anyone still insist on hitting? I can't even think of hitting a child. Especially because my parents told me as a toddler never to hit anyone and I followed through into my adulthood never hitting anyone.

[@Toskrr]

I’ve met people like this. It’s like the only reason the have children is to punish them.

[@user-mv5zt8qd9l]

_And_ they'll run their mouths telling the whole world that it's everyone else who is actually "hurting" kids despite the empirical evidence to demonstrate that what they're doing is abusive and morally bankrupt

[@jewels3400]

I saw someone in this comment section like that. They defended their, "right," (they didn't say that but that was the sentiment) to spank hits. They even defended their son who is now a father who hits his kids. I think it's pride. It's a defense from embarrassment. It's a defense of the people around them. Being better, being educated, it doesn't matter to them. Only themselves and their perceived honor. If that ideology cracked down then they would feel the shame of all of those years of damage they caused. It's either that or stubborn, "well they're wrong and IM RIGHT." So, still ego. Just with none of the fear and all of the anger.

[@jcfreak2007]

So, as a child who was spanked and physically abused, I can 100% verify her statement here that the only thing that a young child learns from spanking/hitting is "STAY FAR AWAY FROM MOM/DAD/CAREGIVER WHEN THEY ARE MAD BECAUSE THEY MIGHT HIT ME!" Also, does it rub anyone else the wrong way that he's talking about how to teach his kids to trust him and in the same breath talking about hitting them? Like, why do you want them to trust you more? So you can hit them more? 🙄

[@Perilous_perils_forrest]

Exactly 💀💀

[@annam9534]

This reminded me of a Rupi Kaur quote: "Every time you / tell your daughter / you yell at her / out of love / you teach her to confuse / anger with kindness / which seems like a good idea/ till she grows up to / trust men who hurt her / cause they look so much / like you."

[@Riverrivriver]

@@annam9534I agree I was with abusive men who spanked me, I even had one guy say if I was into punishment (he meant spanking) I was like spanking? Sure because of how I was raised now I’m disgusted that I let men treat me like that, not even a small pat like a violent spank. This shouldn’t be normalized as “discipline”

[@riverwolf6482]

I got into a fight at school when I was about 8-9years old … apparently telling my parents “I told him not to touch my pencil case and he did so I hit him” was not a response they were expecting… The only thing I learned from getting “spanked” was that hitting people was the only response to them doing something after I said no

[@mageofmagic870]

The parents who spank their kids are always looking like the surprised Pikachu meme when their kid actually copies the behavior they're shown every day at home. Like....what did they think was going to happen?

[@danika9411]

I felt that so much. I had a phase end of elementry school, beginning of middle school where I wasn't a very nice person. Because I started to copy their behaviour. I'm glad I unlearned it as a teenager.

[@brimarie4196]

Man I remember feeling so angry and grossed out when my parents would try to cuddle with me after physically punishing, as a comfort. It also made cuddling into adulthood feel super uncomfortable, and now it makes sense why.

[@brookep4464]

ooooof that hit too close to home. do i, a now grown ass adult, hate being touched because of my own personal quirks? or just because my parents used to try to comfort me immediately after hitting me?

[@akiadima3814]

Same, I'm a huge cuddler and hugger but when it comes to my mom it's only on occasion because it feels wrong. Realizing being hit to make me comply was wrong was a big thing.

[@karriqueen]

I have been wondering if the kids who get hit and then cuddled as a child can see abuse as an adult as normal. I mean when they grow up and get a partner. If that partner hits them, then say i love you blablabla after if they have a higher chanse of thinking that is normal. I don’t know if that’s what it’s like or not. Just a thought i have had when i hear parents punish their kids like that.

[@polimana]

oof i have always hated physical affection from my parents, it has made me viscerally uncomfy since i was a child. my cousin mentioned to me recently that she always saw how i would shrink away from my parents' hugs as kids and i was like 💔 "i didn't think anybody ever noticed"

[@abisummers6789]

yeah, this gives me the same vibes as "we hit you because we love you" which is something I was told. "we wouldn't do this if we didn't love you." that's so messed up to tell a kid that you're hitting them because you love them. that's like abuse 101 lol

[@raspberryitalia3464]

I casually mentioned to my husband that my dad used to spank me and my siblings with drumsticks and brag to other adults about how much they stung and the red marks they left, and my husband was so horrified, it was the first time I realized how fucked up my upbringing was

[@MaidMirawyn]

So many of us have those moments. When I was six, my dad chased me around the house with Tabasco sauce. I tried to barricade myself in the bathroom, but he got in and force fed it to me. He laughed as I screamed and cried. Then I vomited on him. Fortunately my mom got home literally as this was happening, so she took me to the other bathroom and cleaned me up, and insisted he clean the bathroom. This story horrified my friends when I mentioned it last year, which is when I realized how absolutely horrific it was. We definitely have problems separating the quirky stories from the traumatic ones.

[@loafiest]

I was spanked as a kid and once I was an adult in therapy, I began to realize a ton of the stuff I was disciplined for were symptoms of my ADHD that I didn't have great control over (because I was a literal child). Even knowing that though, it's still been really difficult to try to wrap my head around the idea that I'm not a bad person.

[@Toskrr]

I too have ADHD and frequently feel like a bad person. I wasn’t hit but screaming, condescending, name calling did the trick of destroying my self esteem. I could write a book about how not to raise a child with ADHD based on my childhood.

[@lokcachte]

I feel this. I was an autistic child and hit for walking away by myself, bursting into tears or tantrums, gagging from most foods, not being able to read, not being able to do any kind of hygiene or self care etc. i was forcefed and beaten often, it sue didn’t help with the trickier ASD issues and I no longer speak to my mother.

[@vanissaberg5824]

My dad beat and verbally abused my little brother who is autistic for being "different" (stimming and not talking) as if he could beat and shame the autism out of him somehow while he cried and cried trying to run away from him😢. Every time I think about it I get so angry at my dad for being such a giant piece of shit to his own kids with literally something they have no control over. And seeing how rampant abuse towards kids with disabilities are by a lot of parents for not having a "normal kid" is absolutely infuriating!🤬 God, I feel so bad you guys had to deal with that too. Sending virtual hugs your way. ❤️

[@Person-ef4xj]

As an autistic person I was spanked as a child and in addition seeing my friends and brothers get spanked also affected me. I do remember sometimes being hyper being a reason I was spanked as well as the way I talked being another reason. I do feel like those of us who have Autism or ADHD are probably more likely to get spanked than neurotypical children for our behavior, and so one reason I'm against spanking is I feel like it affects those of us with developmental disabilities more than neurotypicals. I think trying to spank autism out of an autistic child is incredibly counter productive as spanking is associated with worse social skills meaning there's the effects of spanking on social skills on top of neurological differences.

[@isabellevigil3512]

my parents used to say’ “it hurts my heart to do this” as they spanked me as hard as they could. i’ll truly never forgive them doing that to me and my siblings and im just now starting to work through all the things that being spanked as a child has done to me.

[@user-mv5zt8qd9l]

So not only were they physically hurtful, they then handed the responsibility for their own emotions onto you. That's messed up.

[@jborrego2406]

My parents used to say this hurts me more than it hurts you like okay you're like four times my size let's have Shaq come hit you with a belt and let's see if it's going to hurt Shaq more than it hurts you

[@applepie823]

I was spanked ALOT as a kid. My mom’s reasoning was “it’s hard being a parent of twins” to me it just sounded like I was being punished for existing. My mom would spank me so hard I couldn’t sit down. My husband and I have decided that we won’t spank our future children. It makes your kids fear you. Not respect you. My older brother has tried to change my mind. That I “turned out fine” “you were just afraid of what you actions would do”. I wasn’t fine. I went to therapy. Nope. I knew what fear was. I was afraid of my mom. I told her as an adult and she was stunned. She thought she was doing the right thing.

[@Trysaratop]

Tbh don't be so mad at your mom, 2 very small children is hard to establish h over especially if yiu have no support system and sleep deprived and they get into constant trouble, hurting each other or almost killing themselves, your mom might of tried the nice method but it's not lazy parenting it's really hard to control 2 toddlers by yourself and you can't always just pick them up and restrain them while one is diving off the table or getting into knives. Just forgive her and realize it is very hard and prepare for a support system where you can take breaks and don't feel you have to reaort to spanking like she did.

[@applepie823]

@@Trysaratop my mom wasn’t a single parent. My dad was also present. He didn’t agree with spanking as a form of discipline. He only went along with it for consistency

[@naaaaaaatalieeeee9620]

​@@TrysaratopEw. Lot of assumptions here. Maybe a little self projection?

[@awkwardukulele6077]

@@Trysaratoptbh your excuses are shit and it sounds like you’re just as bad as OP’s mom. You don’t deserve your child’s forgiveness if this is your attitude.

[@watermagegurl627]

​@@TrysaratopJust like we don't get excused for being kids, they don't get excuses for choosing proven methods that cause more problems down the road. They either do better or don't have kids or hand them off to those who can do better.

[@suajjf]

Makes me LOL when people think having 3 kids in 3 years makes them experts. My biggest parenting advice is not to have a kid every year. But also, if your own experience is all you’re using to inform your “advice” at least wait until some of your kids have developed through a few different phases, wait and see how your “strategies” play out with school aged and adolescent children before your start awarding yourself any parenting awards.

[@stevedorecharley2849]

This^^^

[@Emcostanza]

For realllllll

[@irishlizzie]

I had 3 kids in under 3 years and I did not feel like I knew what I was doing, I felt like things were out of control and I was surviving by making sure we simply ate and slept on a schedule, I didn't think I knew anything about discipline and teaching a kid to pass on to another family. People often find out how many kids I have (I have more now) and assume I'm an expert on organization and know everything about kids. I do not. I am not. I fail, I struggle, I don't have a perfect home or routine but it's better than it used to be. After being a parent for 13 years I'm shocked at the AUDACITY of Nate & Sutton acting like they know anything! Maybe they know how to begin being consistent with a baby and toddler but that's literally nothing in the grand scheme of parenting. This impulse to feel like you know the "true" parenting way at sooo young is dangerous. Arrogance is dangerous.

[@KoharuMacchiato]

As a 27 year old who was spanked constantly by my parents (I wasn't a bad kid. I am autistic and no one understood that due to lack of research of girls with autism in the 90s and early 2000s), I have MAJOR trust issues with my parents. I NEVER felt like I could be open and honest with them because if I tell the truth, I get spanked. If I lie, I have a CHANCE of NOT being spanked if I presented my case good enough. It taught me I had to lie to avoid being hurt. That is a completely WRONG message to send to a child and that child can grow into an adult that internalizes and applies this behavior in their adult life. I'm going to be a mother myself this year and I am so happy that I recognize this behavior is wrong and abusive. The generational abuse cycle stops with me and that makes me hopeful for the future.

[@HaizeyWings]

I'm almost certainly autistic and a woman as well, my mother's rages taught me to be a phenomenal liar ;-;

[@allibell6795]

Same I got diagnosed with autism and ADHD as an adult. I got smacked by my dad alot

[@FunFilmFare]

Best of luck managing both your autism and motherhood . Gonna be really hard, but with the right support it’s not impossible ❤️

[@chesneymigl4538]

OMG! This is my life exactly. The only thing I ever heard, and this was years later, was my mother asking the doctor and being told "oh no. Girls don't get that"

[@awkwardukulele6077]

It’s wild that I just had this kind of conversation with my parents a while back, when I finally told them I’m queer and an atheist. They acted like it was unbelievable I had kept that secret from them, and said “if you can’t be honest with people, you’re never going to have connection with anyone, and your life will be unbearably lonely.” The thing is, I’m mad honest with people, especially my friend and crushes. I don’t have much filter, and I’ve only recently started figuring out how to tell whether something is TMI for others. The only people I’m a consistent liar to is my parents, because they would pull shit like this, like the parents described in these comments and the ones in this video. These “you got spanked and turned out fine” crowd are almost incapable of understanding how they’ve measured up kids. They see the damage _they’ve_ done to you, and their response is, “how dare you act like that?!” They see how their actions affect you, and then blame you for it, just like they blamed you as an infant, toddler, child, teen, etc. The projection never stops for them.

[@alinesarabia1544]

My parents laughed at me a lot. Not necessarily at my feelings, but if I said something with conviction. Sometimes what I said didn’t make sense, but sometimes it was just something that was outside of the norm like I wanted to be a baseball player. It was hysterical to them. To this day, I find it very difficult to say anything with conviction. I’m 51.

[@pauline_f328]

Oof. This already hurts when done to you during adulthood, but repeatedly as a kid? 😬 That sounds so upsetting omg (likely a euphemism, but I don't know how else to say it). Wishing you all the best 🥺

[@adnamafett7862]

Here’s a potential side effect of spanking based on my personal experience: My dad used to make a show of giving us spankings. He’d tell me/my sister to wait in the office for him, and we would. It built up suspense like a horror movie and we’d get a pop on the butt. I don’t even think it hurt, it was just spooky and then it stung. My dad is a pretty reasonable guy. I know the difference between punishment and abuse because I’ve experienced both(my mom is not so reasonable) and I think he just followed a bad parenting book in regards to how to deal with punishment. Because it was effective but the side effect wasn’t noticeable and it was hard for me to link to this experience. The side effect in question? I’m 19 now and whenever I have to talk to a professor about my grades or even when I went to talk to a sorority sister about financial issues, I feel a little anxious but start uncontrollably crying. I had no clue why for the longest time. Even throughout high school talking to teachers about my behavior or discussing extra credit/scheduling assignments so that I can complete my work and catch up, I’d just start openly weeping. And I’d have to explain “I swear I’m ok please just ignore the tears” Anyway if you’re considering spanking your kids, think about if it’s worth it to give them some weird authority anxiety

[@thegreypoet9518]

Wait... this is why I had that side effect? I thought it was just my anxiety. Fuck. Thanks for commenting this.

[@ItRemindMeOfHome]

Makes it exceptionally difficult when you enlist in the Army. Every time I get told "Hey, I need to talk to you" by anyone, especially by my NCO's and Officers, the first thing I say is "Am I in trouble?" because my mother would do that shit too. She'd make me wait, knowing my punishment was coming.

[@kayhaven4710]

@@ItRemindMeOfHomeDUDE YES

[@saltydinonuggies1841]

@@ItRemindMeOfHomeyup I have that effect too. It’s a rule that my friends and partner can’t text me “I need to talk to you” without at least a little context because I will spiral until they actually talk to me. None of them have ever been mean to me and the worst is we just needed to clear up a miscommunication but because of my childhood phrases like that make me ill.

[@LinkChow8150]

My dad had the same "my kids are idiots" attitude with us, his whole family is like that. 10 years of therapy later and I'm just now feeling like a whole person who has a right to exist. Pro tip, don't treat your kids like idiots if you don't want them to feel like idiots.

[@powderandpaint14]

Their approach basically goes against all the current research about how to bring up emotionally healthy, trusting, secure children. Great.

[@vintagearisen]

This mindset says "I'm already right because I believe in the Bible" so any objective facts that come along are summarily rejected if they are perceived to be out of line with what they think the Bible says. It's basically the exact opposite of the scientific method.

[@Nemshee]

And let's not forget that research was already conclusive in the 60s so much so, that hitting children has been illegal in a lot of european countries since the 70s. Thank you Astrid Lindgren. 💚

[@JustACitrus]

When they just said "flip that switch" from friend to discipline... That's so confusing and traumatizing. Doing that leads to so much instability because a child feels like their parents' actions are unpredictable.

[@danika9411]

Yes, I completly agree. It can lead to "splitting" and black and white thinking. Which causes huge trouble in relationships later when someone fluctuates between idealisation and devaluation. It can be a symptom of BPD and NPD. They are really setting their children up for failure.

[@loboinu]

@@danika9411 Exactly! I was abused by my mother and a lot of her behavior was back and forth between lovebombing and then abuse. It’s confusing and terrifying for a child. I developed BPD which is very much a result of behavior like that from parnets, usually…

[@planepower8523]

My mom used to "spank" me, but it was more an assault. She had anger issues and because i was a "handful" her spankings were always beatings and always resulted in continuation until i was laying limp. Once her hand got sore, it always passed onto the wooden spoon, or bamboo poles that held up the ferns. The only time it ended when the implement was broken or frayed beyond use. Her favourite term was "my hand is loose!". I never recall bleeding, but i certainly had welts and bruises. She was kind enough to never hit me in the head. SO when it came to my own son who had much more severe ADHD, i swore to never, ever hit him. Instead, discipline involved problem solving and quiet time. A practice he uses on his kids today. Violence only means more violence. Using "spankings' only enforces violence towards others to get your way - a self-propagating prophecy.

[@planepower8523]

Just teach your child respect, by respecting them and that will be reflected. They will then in turn be able to respect their peers and others.

[@kristinccha]

This is terrible I'm so sorry. Did she ever take responsibility?

[@planepower8523]

@@kristinccha I really only realized this as my son and i were dealing with her (at the time) undiagnosed dementia and he expressed how vocally abusive she is. Then it dawned on me on how historically abusive she was, not just in words, but physical assaults too. I never spanked my son as that is a weak approach to problem solving!

[@kristinccha]

@@planepower8523 I appreciate you sharing and hope you are able to get some healing

[@planepower8523]

@@kristinccha It all has come to light recently, but explains why i hate physical violence towards others and why i hate when people say its ok to "spank" their kid - that infuriates me!

[@Dragonbleps]

I got into an argument with my parents about spanking not too long ago. They did spank my younger brother and I growing up. What effect it had on us, I can't begin to speculate, but I know it was wrong. But my parents were like "You'd understand if you had kids" and that made me SO angry. They think, if I have kids, I'll want/need to HIT them??? My dad has a terrible habit of speaking in hyperbole in order to "win" arguments, which is what he did. He said that spanking is restraint. It's a restrained form of taking out anger/frustration compared to drowning children in a bathtub or a lake (LITERALLY HIS WORDS). And I was so fucking baffled I couldn't continue. And I'm sure he doesn't think at all about the HORRIFIC thing he said to me, but it haunts me still. If, when your child is being a child uncontrolled, and your rage or frustration is so great that you think about drowning your children, you should not have fucking had kids in the first place. And you shouldn't be "taking out" ANYTHING on your kids!!!

[@ludwig8474]

My parents always said the “when you have kids you’ll understand“ thing. Now I have kids and it made me realise even more how the things they did were wrong and I would never do the same to my kids. Actually made me hate them tbh.

[@danika9411]

​@@ludwig8474 I feel the last sentence. I have a weird love hate thing going. I hope one day I will judt not care about them anymore.

[@delusion5867]

If you at any point are so enraged by your child that you contemplate drowning them, you need your children taken away and should immediately seek anger management therapy. Only an unwell person would consider murdering their own child. I'm sorry, but your dad's argument is so fucking insane and barbaric.

[@quit3118]

Fr, my dad would say “once you have kids you will understand” still I’m not gonna spank my kids, my parents did gotten better over the years and they were young when they had me But still I question their beliefs today, and I don’t even need to have kids to know how bad this is Spanking did not make me any better but worse

[@julianaroza7465]

Yea whenever I bring spanking up to my parents they hit me with the “you wouldn’t understand you’re not a parent” or “kids can be really hard sometimes” like WTFFFF and I just tell them ok so it’s socially unacceptable to hit your spouse or a friend who isn’t doing what you want them to do but it’s ok to hit a small child who doesn’t know what they’re doing is wrong/unsafe or maybe they are just over stimulated and don’t know how to regulate themselves because they are literally growing their brain still!! ! It’s crazy ridiculous!

[@emmamoose-dragon1110]

Not me realizing in my thirties that hearing anger come from someone bigger than me still makes me want to run away.....

[@marenq4138]

This is such a US American moment. In my country physically hurting a child is both very frowned upon and very illegal. If a german KZbinr made a video like N&S people would surely inform child protective services. This is sick!

[@misssargasm286]

Same here. Corporal punishment has been illegal in all Nordic countries since late 70's or early 80's. It's highly frowned upon and you'd definitely end up in big problem both with law and child protection services if you'd go around telling you spank your kids or even that you think it's a ok way to raise kids in general even if you didn't admit doing it yourself.

[@515aleon]

It is actually written into law in some states that spanking (or should I say state sponsored child abuse) is legal not only at home but in public schools. I agree it should be illegal!

[@tristenhood3167]

@@LostSoulchild89 my high school still did spanking until I was a junior. I graduated in 2018.

[@T0ya]

Yeah... Spanking is still infuriatingly common here. That said, leaving the child in the car as a punishment is legally abuse and the CPS in their state should be notified.

[@katrinaoliver4167]

I hope these clowns get a wake up call and change their ways before they lose their kids.

[@alisonmartin3856]

How messed up is it that their oldest kid is 3 and they think they have parenting figured out. Love you, Mickey!!!

[@jannettb7930]

I was raised like these people are talking about. I was in my 20's before I could have a loving relationship with my dad. We would go to coffee, hang out, it's not like I hated him (anymore, at that point), I didn't think anything was 'wrong'. One day we went to the beach and we were just chit chatting. He got kind of emotional, which he never did, and apologized. I was shocked. He apologized for being so hard on us, for spanking us, for being so strict. He said he regretted how he acted, he felt like he missed out on our childhood and kept us from just being kids. This wall of caution and fear I didn't see before started to come down and we could actually connect. I still have the effects of how I was raised, it's hard for me to have a confrontation with an authority figure or even disagree without feeling like a 5 year old who's about to get a whooping. I get an anxiety attack and I get emotionally fearful, and I'm 43. I work through it but I don't think I'll ever be able to confront my boss about something without internally having a meltdown because it feels like I'm breaking the cardinal rule of do what your told and be seen and not heard.

[@webofstarlight]

I'm so sorry. I'm glad your dad apologized, but I know it doesn't fix everything.

[@Nemshee]

I was starting to read your comment and thought why the f are they still in contact with their parent until I got to the point where your father apologised on his own volition. There you can see that he's a good person who probably went through the same shit you did but didn't have the tools to rid himself from the effect it had on him. Education on the subject would have been a lot more difficult without the internet and surrounded by like minded culture.

[@nuclearwessels2078]

My parents were fundie and believed in spanking. I got threatened with the belt because I was afraid to let my parents pull my first tooth. If I was too noisy at church, my parents would take me outside and spank me. When I cried when I got overwhelmed I would get spanked. When my parents didn't spank, they screamed at me. My mom spanked me in middle school because my room was messy because I was struggling to balance homework and housework. The last spanking I got was when I was a freshman in high school, my mom would not let me go to winter formal because she felt I was too young. She spanked me for verbalizing that I was upset about it. Watching your commentary on this was very therapeutic. I was either spanked or screamed at for having negative emotions and expressing them. I've done a lot of suppressing and feel exhausted. Watching this made me realize it's not me. It's how I was parented.

[@tessapowell3156]

As someone who got spanked a lot for stuff that didn't feel like my fault, that "take em out to the car story" is horrifying to me. Sounds like those kids are not learning anything about their own behavior, even if they needed to. But they're sure learning a hell of a lot about their dad and how bad they are for having feelings dad can't handle.

[@aquariusqueen44]

this was hard to watch but i really wanted to as someone who grew up in a religious household where spanking was very common. it surprises me to see the amount of people who defend it and even encourage it and say the reason that kids these days have no manners is because they're parent don't spank them enough its scary. spanking never works. i lost so much respect and trust for my parents every time. thank u for this your videos make me feel so validated.

[@caseyw.6550]

You're so right. I am 40 and my dad still terrifies me. I was so secretive and hid everything from him and still do. I have no doubt that being spanked as a kid is the root of my anxiety disorder and caused my relationship with my dad to be irreparably broken. But, hey, at least I was a "good" kid, I guess. That's quite a high price to pay for your child to have good behavior. Smh.

[@joanna0988]

That generation may have had better manners but what about addictions, spousal abuse, bullying, physical fights with random people, etc, etc. Most of my friends were spanked (I'm 34) and a lot of them say it was good for them but they definitely struggle with issues as adults that I think can be attributed to the parenting they had. Personally it made me scared to speak up and scared of my own ideas and feelings.

[@Nameless-ny8nk]

The thing about kids today missbehaving because they don't get spanked is the most stupid thing to me, I live in a country were it is normal to hit kids, and the ones who do are always the lost violent and disrespectful kids, at some point they just laugh when their parents hit them and what then? what are you suppossed to do if spanking if the thing that suppossedly fixes bad behaviour?, hit them harder until they bleed? I never understood hitting- in most cases you would get in trouble for hitting and adult that doesn't behave like you want them to even if they are in the wrong and completely understand their behaviour is wrong, so why do people think it's okay to hit CHILDREN who not only can't defend themselves, but also most likely don't even understand why they are being hit?

[@vintagearisen]

Used to be every time we saw a kid acting up in Walmart my parents would be like "this is what happens when you don't spank your kids" and shit like that. Once when my son was three, THREE, I was in a checkout line with him and my mother was there. He screamed "No!" at me for some reason, not even sure why, no big deal, he's THREE, and my mom reached down her hand like a claw and put it on his head. Really weird and menacing and creepy. Another time we were at church and my son was five, running back and forth in an EMPTY row of seats after the service was over, not hurting anybody or anything or even doing anything particularly irritating like screaming or shouting, and my grandma turned to him and said, "Aren't you a little old to be doing that?" Ma'am he's FIVE Kind of brought home the fact that these people never really had age appropriate expectations for kids, and had no concept for how to handle COMPLETELY NORMAL behaviors appropriately.

[@vintagearisen]

@@joanna0988 i wasn't calling you names, it was meant to be a hypothetical calling the rude ass boomer a Karen I get how it was poorly worded though

[@tinakilloran]

the emotional damage from being spanked as a child by my evangelical parents is still in my brain. i constantly feel like i’ve done something wrong. i wish parents would stop doing this.

[@webofstarlight]

I'm sorry you had to go through that. You deserved better.

[@czickgraf]

I feel what you're saying. That damage made me a poet--which has helped me deal and heal.

[@c.lineofficial]

My mom isn't evangelical per se, but your words perfectly summarized my thoughts on this.

[@nicolehall694]

If someone hits me, it's assault. If someone touches my backside without my permission, it's sexual assault. Please explain to me why when something is done to an adult it's sexual assault & a crime, but when done to a child, it's discipline and perfectly legal

[@megdalena01]

My teens are 16, when they were little I spanked them because that's how my parents punished me. When they were 2 or 3 I switched to the "naughty spot". AKA time out. I noticed that spankings didn't actually work. Time out seemed to work a lot better because sitting still while your sibling is still playing really sucks. We also talked a lot about what had happened. I still sucked at motherhood though because I yelled a lot. I mean A LOT. My dad used to yell. Any time he interacted with us, it was yelling. I tried really hard to change. To get my own shit together and figure out what it was that was making me so mad, because my yelling was like an intolerant explosion of irritation at the kids. The slightest issue with them and I would lose it. I learned I was depressed, anxious, and stressed out. It took a lot of self reflection to grow to a point where I could talk to my kids instead of yelling every time they "messed up". Then I had another kid. He is 10 years younger than his siblings. Raising him has been much different because I have learned so much about being a parent, and about myself. I'm a much better mom, but it really amplifies the difference between the childhood my teenagers got and the one my son has, and the mother my teens got when they were little and the one my son has now while he's little. But, my teenagers are no longer afraid of me, and I count that as a win. I try every day to be a better mom to them than I was when they were little, or even just yesterday.

[@jadeekrueger5499]

I was raised by a mother who constantly yelled at me (she is also a marcissist), and now whenever I have any emotion that I don't know how to process I raise my voice at my fiancé. It's gotten a lot better over the nearly 4 years we've been together to the point that I can take the time to process and regulate my emotions before I talk to him, but there are days where I slip up. I am so grateful that I have been able to work through a lot of my own emotions before having kids (and I still have a few years before we plan on having kids). I've told him that I do not and will refuse to spank our children, and we've agreed that we will do punishments like the ones his parents did (holding a tissue box straight out for 15 minutes, wall sits, picking up apples from the tree) and we won't use chores as punishments either.

[@FunFilmFare]

Your teenagers must hate your other son for being raised much more gently than they were .

[@kruff169]

@@FunFilmFare You're not wrong but I also think we should be wary about wielding that fact against OP like a cudgel. They're obviously aware that what they did was wrong and have taken real, tangible steps to change it. It'd be worth talking to the older children openly and saying "Hey, I made a massive mistake. The way I treated you guys early in your lives was informed by my own wounds and was not your fault, and I also recognize it's unfair and hurtful to see your youngest sibling get the upbringing you should have also had from the beginning"-- then repeat it as often as they need for them to feel their wound's been recognized OP can't take back the abusive actions against her older children, but she *can* take back her shame from them. Being validated by a parent who owns the hurt they caused is hugely healing, even if it can't undo the original abuse

[@Trysaratop]

I am so proud of you because I feel everything you said to my soul 100 percent. I am here today because I yell at the time and I'm not a spanked but resorted to it when I couldn't handle the hair pulling and biting but I am trying to change and I don't like hitting at all and I love my kids and I feel bad every time I yell and have been going to therapy lately to learn coping skills. Thank you for sharing your story

[@EnaGoba]

You can't undo your upbringing without a Ton of work. That's why it makes me uncomfortable when people say "how could you ever hit a child??" and me thinking "well you learn from what you see." And also, I was the best parent before having kids. "You just need to be patient with them, they aren't doing it to upset you!" Fast forward to having a kid and him pushing all the buttons you didn't even know you had, doing a lot better than my parents did but still needing to work really hard and keep improving. It's important to say that you shouldn't hit kids but it's also important to be aware of the reality that a lot of us were hit/yelled at when we were kids and that shit is ingrained. It's not lazy, it takes a ton of work to undo it.

[@kellykapp0wski870]

Thank you so much for pointing out mocking tones and their effect on children. My mother was bipolar and unmedicated, and would constantly repeat answers to her questions back at me to make it obvious she didn’t believe me ALL the time. To simple banal questions and to me expressing my feelings. I’m 30 and that tone still instantly makes me feel unsafe and will send me on a one-way train to disassociation. 😅

[@lyricholmes1827]

It’s easy to beat your kid into submission. Being compassionate and understanding when your kid is overwhelmed and struggling to regulating their emotions is much more difficult. But being a good parent means putting your kids needs above your own. It’s important to set boundaries with children, but setting boundaries doesn’t mean you have free reign to slap your kid about when you feel like it. Lead with love, not fear.

[@lexihopes]

The cognitive dissonance between "it's tempting to spank and punish them for feeling their feelings but that's not right, they have a right to their feelings, etc" and "if they're crying in a restaurant I hit them and lock them in the car" is wild. You're probably right that one is more Sutton's style and the other more Nate, especially given the person leading the conversation in each instance.

[@violet18]

The thing that I noticed was that they said they would spank and then give the kids a hug. How confusing!

[@i361x3]

@@violet18 isnt this kind of like a trauma bond? First you traumatise your children and then you are also their source of comfort afterwards? Really not a good dynamic to set up 🥴 there is probably also a distinction between trauma bonding and creating actual repair in the relationship. But I dont really think it is creating repair if the parent doesnt think they did sth wrong and will also do it again the next time. Just yikes 🤮

[@violet18]

@@i361x3 That's exactly how to create a trauma bond or a child with an anxious attachment style. These types of things are carried by a child into adulthood and then they are the ones who have to go spend time and money in therapy to understand what happened to them. 👍 The only difference is that people don't really have compassion for you when you become an adult and struggle due to trauma.

[@vintagearisen]

Nate strikes me as an extremely toxic dude. Obviously Sutton also bears responsibility for going along with it and supporting it, but there's a video they did where he's basically fat shaming her, and people called him out for it, and then he got online and held a big pity party about the backlash.

[@FunFilmFare]

I noticed. Wouldn’t surprise me if Nate hits Sutton just like he hits their kids.

[@AMFibers]

"I've only had to do that less than five times." THEIR OLDEST CHILD IS THREE YEARS OLD. That means he started doing this when they were two years old. Maybe even younger. I cannot. That would be terrible to do to a ten year old, but a two year old. Disgusting.

[@Jmmmmama]

Got to say, as someone who was humiliated/threatened/whooped/intimidated that I did NOT turn out fine. After years of therapy and self healing I have two kids under 5 and honestly, gentle parenting and working on self regulation through my triggers has been the most transformative and just meaningful work of my life. I have never raised a hand to them in anger and if I raise my voice I apologize and make it clear, it was never their fault I did that and I will work harder to do better. I was so afraid to have kids bc I didn’t see any other way of parenting other than how I was raised, and I didn’t wanna hit kids. Can honestly say I am loving parenting and working on myself in this way ❤

[@thingslaurasays9995]

Everything you're saying is so relevant to my job as a high school teachers. Too many teachers rely on fear as a disciplinary tactic but like, students aren't primed for learning if they're too busy being afraid.....

[@literallywhy6162]

I’ve literally been in therapy for three years and I just now, watching this video, realized that I was physically abused. I thought because it wasn’t “bad enough” or “often enough” that I was “only” emotionally and mentally abused. I thought everyone’s parents hit them with a belt at least once. I knew my mom slapping me in the mouth for not understanding what I was in trouble for and asking questions about it (a thing grownups in my life loved to call talking back, but now I know as an adult the same questions would absolutely not be regarded as talking back) wasn’t right, but it never really clicked that that was truly abuse. Just because it wasn’t severe enough for other people to notice or to get me taken away doesn’t mean it wasn’t an adult physically harming a small child. Cool so now I have some trauma to bring to my therapist this week that I didn’t know I had 🙃

[@dopex89]

I'm so sorry you went through this and got no help. To be honest it's baffling to me that corporal punishment is legal in some places. I live in a backwards country but hitting your child here is a no-no. Of course only if you're seen doing it. Being hit once is trauma enough I think. The funny thing is, my parents tried to spank us once but my dad didn't have it in him and it was funny to me because he hit us with my mums fancy belt and it did not hurt at all. I had to stifle my laughing. It was the one and only time. On the other hand, a random woman on the street slapped me on the cheek because I had tried to scratch off a sticker from a parked car. It was painful but more importantly, humiliating AF. I was afraid to walk down that street for years and still felt enormous guilt for that damned sticker. I don't know why parents think it's okay.

[@lexihopes]

Yeah, I was only hit a handful of times, generally not very badly (like one was throwing trash at me which btw is still assault and abuse, especially in the middle of the night when I'm sleeping because parent can't stop being bothered by my messy room and has to address it right then (and was almost certainly drunk)) plus rather more verbal and emotional abuse but even that was not a regular thing. I don't have cptsd over it, but it was enough that my psychiatrist evaluated me for it. And that's not the same as it not affecting me, of course.

[@cristakampert8740]

I am relieved that you go to a therapist. So many people are abused but do not recognize that as 'real abuse' because their view of abuse is a 100% abusive situation all the time. It is never healthy to be attacked by a (drunk or sober) parent and it will make you feel unsafe and you do not have to be kicked or slapped in the face daily to be able to say you were abuse. Hope you are able to work through this, lots of love!

[@mikusheadphones]

I'm so sorry you had this realization but I'm glad you are in therapy and can unpack it 💜 One major thing you need to accept is that your experience is valid, even if your brain tells you "it wasn't THAT bad", "it wasn't as bad as others", "it only was a few times", etc. Hope you are doing OK ♡

[@rachelk4805]

When the line is not a clear line, it is easy for abusive people to cross it. I don't even TOUCH my child gently when she doesn't want to be touched, because sometimes she doesn't. And I want her to never doubt that she is entitled to bodily autonomy. I wish you well on your path to healing.

[@The_Original_LBSwanson]

As a new mom at 35 who was beaten and emotionally tormented as a kid I want to spare my child from that, period.

[@jordy_muhnordy]

I really didn't think it could get worse, but Nate just kept going. So you're not only spanking your child, but restraining them in a car seat and isolating them to figure out... What exactly? How do you justify doing that to your kids, especially on a public platform?

[@CostumedFiend_Audio]

It really bugs how calmly they were talking about it too.

[@jordy_muhnordy]

@@CostumedFiend_Audio and how they could be all "we want to validate our kids feelings" one minute then "we love our corporal punishment" the next. Nate doesn't seem like he's enjoying parenthood at all

[@lsmmoore1]

Especially since children have been known to die being locked into car seats on a hot day. So the intrusive mental response I have had to this sort of garbage in which an image of me wringing a faceless child's neck comes to mind really isn't that far from the truth of what their "discipline" can achieve. Death of children. For being children.

[@user-mv5zt8qd9l]

@jordy_muhnordy as Mickey pointed out, they don't validate their kids' emotions because they care; they openly only do it when it produces the desired outcome for themselves. Hence the disconnect between them spanking the kids in one case and seemingly gentle-parenting in another.

[@otherwise9934]

18:15 “children do not manipulate adults” my mom has constantly accused me of my feelings being performative even when I cried hysterically in front of her. I know that sounds ridiculous and doesn’t make sense, she would laugh at my face and convince my enabling dad that I was just trying to manipulate them, well now I don’t feel much at all and am afraid to show weakness, but this felt so validating finally

[@melissabennett6571]

For those of you wondering how kids raised the way Mickey advocates for behave - I was raised the was the couple in the video advocates for. My siblings and I were terribly behaved, unless my dad had a belt in his hand. We all grew into adults with serious problems. My kids were raised the way Mickey advocates for. They are incredibly well behaved, sometimes I almost have to pinch myself. They are just entering their teen years but already they have more emotional maturity and healthy boundaries than I did as a 21 year old (pre-therapy). What Mickey says works so much better than hitting your kids.

[@mackzp]

In my parent words, "if you hurt someone, i hurt you" was how i was raised. It taught me from an early age to avoid everyone and everything because I didn't want to get hurt. As well as i was TERRIFIED of my dad for the longest time. My parents aren't religious but this video made me think of that lol

[@high-bi-password]

I could write a novel about this video but these two nonchalant giggling sadist parents bragging about their sadism with their whole mouths just really took it out of me. Thank you Mickey for allowing me to confront these unhealthy mentalities in a way that still feels safe and validating bc it’s through the filter of someone I trust. Almost like that’s an excellent metaphor for how children should experience the trials and hardships of life as they grow, how bout that??? Thanks Mickey ❤️

[@thesingerintheshower]

💯

[@jazz1282]

If I was their kid, I would associate speaking at all in a restaurant with getting spanked! Thanks for connecting this feeling with kids’ reaction to mute their own emotions because their parents can’t control their own, Mickey ❤. I have to pause to come back to the video bc Nate and Sutton brought up some repressed childhood memories for me, but I’ll try to finish when I’m in a better headspace!

[@LaCeiba1924]

“To mute their own emotions because their parents can’t control their own” Holy shit you just described my childhood. And young adulthood. 😳

[@lizabethhampton4537]

@@LaCeiba1924 honestly I still feel like this. The basically constant refrain of my life is "oh, so I'm not allowed to have emotions. Cool. Great. Fun. 🙃"

[@HaizeyWings]

I'm 25 and still live at home, and still get an overwhelming fear and stress response when my mother gets mad, whether that anger is directed at me or not. She would yell at my siblings and I a lot when we were younger, and her form of corporal punishment was squeezing the hell out of our upper arms. I still get that panic of expecting pain when she's angry. Our father left most of the parenting up to my mother, so he has no idea how to deal with us in a healthy way. Our upbringing was sheltered in the sense that our parents didn't guide us in learning autonomy and independence, and now they expect us to just know how everything works and to be responsible for our own lives and housework. As a result I'm having immense difficulty becoming independent enough to move out. Over the years, my siblings and I have come to realise that our parents did the best they could with what they had and their own trauma, and they do love us, but they maybe shouldn't have been parents, at least not without therapy and parenting classes.

[@stephanipeloquin4631]

I'll be 55 this week and I'm still afraid when my parents get angry.

[@jborrego2406]

I live with my parents until I was 27 2 weeks before I turned 28 I moved out because my parents believe it doesn't matter how old you are you still a child even though I was a nurse and help pay the bills I was still getting spanked until I was 27 and the sad thing is is I thought that was normal until I was talking to my neighbor and we became friends and it's like you said that to your mom she didn't spank you she's like I'm 30 I'm like I left the house when I was 27 and I got spanking the look on her face and that's when I realized it's not normal to speak anyone that's an adult

[@dellybird5394]

My experience with spanking growing up: I didn't get it as much as my brothers (some benevolent sexism, also I was naturally a quiet kid). However, both of my brothers, who got spanked/hit well into high school, had anger problems for a long time. The one who got the brunt of it (likely due to his undiagnosed ADHD) had significant anger problems until therapy in his mid 20s. He used to be so jealous that I never got hit. He would tell me things like "Dad needs to beat you more". I don't think a punishment that makes your kids wish violence on each other is appropriate.

[@starparodier91]

I wasn’t raised this way, but it always terrifies me to hear about this type of parenting and imagining it happening to me. I’m autistic and certainly wasn’t the easiest child, but I can’t even imagine how it would’ve been growing up in a house like this.

[@kfcoyote]

Same I wasn't either. I already have a lot of mental health issues and problems that don't have much to do with the way I was raised so I cannot imagine how I would've turned out if this was the kind of parenting I got.

[@starparodier91]

@@kfcoyote I also have other mental and physical health issues and I feel very lucky my parent’s were able to provide me with great resources at a young age.

[@starparodier91]

@@uncannedspaghetti I also have ADHD and some other conditions both mental and physical. My boyfriend (who’s also autistic) was just diagnosed with ADHD and he feels like he’s just unlocked so much potential from meds and little tips I’ve given him. I’m almost 32 and have been on meds for it since middle school so I can’t completely relate, but I know that feeling is very normal and it’s never too late to discover yourself. 💜

[@rachaelentner4290]

I am a preschool teacher and practice conscious discipline. Whenever I hear that parents spanking their kids it triggers me so bad. Especially knowing what the research says about spanking.

[@user-mv5zt8qd9l]

Haven't finished the video yet, but notice how they're fully centering their wants and needs over the children's when talking about locking them in the car. "You're interrupting the meal that *I* want to enjoy." Children don't exist to satisfy the desires of their caregivers. I also like the "I know people are going to come at me for spanking" only to backpedal his own sentence 10 seconds later, specifically to highlight that spanking is part of the routine. It really plays into the whole "self-ostracisation" thing that cultish groups feed off - he knowingly spouts opinions that he knows he's going to get hate for so that he can mentally justify leaning deeper into his convictions, no matter how wrong they are. Edit: and now they're mad that their kid makes a joke of it, despite them making a very clear joke about it themselves at the start of the video. These two are so transparently too full of their own egos to be decent parents.

[@roccafille]

Very well stated ❤️👌🏾!

[@tigerloaf3319]

i was spanked as a kid at one point i stopped being honest with my parents and fearing making them mad, now as an adult i no longer speak to them

[@lordfreerealestate8302]

Checking after the 8 Passengers arrests ... they boasted about their abuse too and advocated for abusive practices. Then they got caught committing disturbing criminal behaviour. I think CPS needs to watch these people. This is disturbing.

[@kaviweaver5152]

I appreciate the reminder that "it happened such a long time ago, I should be over it" is a fucked up thing we tell ourselves. So many times other people who want the family system to be peaceful want trauma survivors to be quiet

[@noyesbonne]

I feel like Josh Duggar definitely lived a version of this in his family.

[@icanpotatetothat]

I hope I'm not the only one who noticed this but i think you can tell that nate enjoys hitting his kids, the way he speaks about it sounds like he gets a power trip from it. I think Sutton could have the capacity to be a good parent but imo nate is an abuser through and through

[@dopex89]

Yes! He looks sooo smug it's gross

[@rachelk4805]

I think she is too far the other way. The Jekyll and Hyde thing isn't cute. You can be a firm authoritative parent without being an abusive p.o.s.

[@athenaamethyst8385]

I get having a power trip when parenting (not okaying it, but I get it). I've said no to something to my kids and realized I only said no because I wanted the power. I apologize and change my answer when I recognize I do it. That's the difference (and the fact that I don't hit my kids). I learned from my parents that parenting was about power, and I'm working to unlearn it. I stop myself and correct myself and sincerely apologize. He's just reinforcing the power trip over and over and it's gross. I agree. I think Sutton could be a good parent...but Nate is SO deep in his power trip to realize that's what it is.

[@r.j.whitaker]

He probably slaps her around too. Many "Christian" men do so 🙁

[@voxxy6108]

honestly, it took me way too long to realize these people are not the same people as the other fundie channel Mickey talks about.

[@magnificloud]

They're like carbon copies of one another - same couple, different font 😭

[@hannerikruger7216]

@@magnificloud 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 different fonts😂😂😂😂😂 I'm dying

[@user-js2cg7xs6c]

i genuinely thought sutton was one of the girl defined sisters

[@joanna0988]

Wait what? 🤣 I thought these were the no consent people 🥴

[@dollinterrupted]

Their voices are identical

[@rosie5627]

The way you broke down Nate’s punishment(abuse) of his son in their van was really eye opening to me and brought back some memories of being young and going through the same treatment from my parents. Could you do a deep dive on How To Train Up A Child, and how that can lead to severe consequences for the children as they grow up?

[@lacey892]

I'll admit I feel like I fall short as a parent pretty often... but finding myself aligning with your outlook on child development is really validating. I know a lot of parents will relate to that feeling of uncertainty or guilt about if you're doing the right thing for your kids... So I just want to say thank you for putting this content out there.

[@maggiedk]

Oh, those poor babies. I can't imagine the kind of damage it would've done if I had been spanked and locked in a car as a punishment when I was a kid.

[@spiceupyourafterlife]

Did he SERIOUSLY just admit to shutting his kid into a hot car?! That is so dangerous!

[@Goat.Cheese]

He did specify that he wouldn't do it if the car was hot. But honestly, that doesn't make this much better...

[@lsmmoore1]

@@Goat.Cheese Especially since, news flash, sometimes it's cloudy when the car is parked, you lock your kid in there and, lo and behold, the cloud goes away, the sun peeks out, and the car gets so hot it kills your kid. Because that can happen.

[@aw7145]

When I was a kid I loved staying in the car while my parents were in a store or something (I was left with the keys so I could turn the AC on if I needed to and I was old enough to just get out and walk into the store) and when I was really young sometimes my mom would take me to the car to cool down and get a snack if I was feeling overwhelmed or crying while we were shopping/eating out. So I was thinking "oh that's not *too* bad" at the very beginning but strapped down in the car without turning it on?? After beating them??? Jesus christ, I'm so thankful for how my parents handled me being a very overwhelmed and anxious kid now goddamn

[@stevedorecharley2849]

I knew he was gonna spank the kid, but to add on being strapped in the car ALONE afterwards is just bizarre and horrible.

[@soritaholtzhausen6740]

Imagine telling an adult thats upset, angry, crying etc. to stop this instant or you're going to smack them. Then after you smack them telling them how much you love them, carr for them and it hurt you that they made you do this... ABUSE in its purest form.

[@joshuabuchanan1141]

The fact that they blatantly said on camera that they spank their kids but then after that they 'hug' and 'kiss' them after is absolutely fucking disgusting toxic and unacceptable behavior, that is NOT love at all😡🤬😠🙄

[@feliciam1091]

When he was talking about kids misbehaving in a restaurant, I couldn't help but wonder what he was describing. I could be very wrong, but it sounded to me like he was just talking about kids being loud or doing kid things in public. If your kiddo is just overwhelmed and loud in public, taking a walk or finding a quiet place can be extremely helpful. It can allow them time to calm down and, if they're old enough, you can explain what you would like them to do and trouble shoot a way to make that happen together. I teach 5k, and I do things like that all the time when my kids are being energetic at an inappropriate time. Doing those things helps them learn how to self regulate. There's no reason kids should be punished for being kids.

[@nervousbreakdown711]

There’s a reason why those little kid coloring sheets are so popular in family restaurants. No body but the parents are expecting small children to be well-behaved angels

[@brittneylyntalks]

The way he smiles when he says “I give them a whoopin”

[@515aleon]

I could hear in his voice. He enjoyed that!! Sick.

[@shaylafey]

@@515aleon while its not an excuse for the behavior, I think the more likley answer than enjoyment is just that they know its a controversial topic, some part of them knows its wrong so its awkard to talk about. Smiling or laughing when feeling guilty, awkard, etc, are incredibly common behaviors.

[@515aleon]

@@shaylafey It's been a long time since I watched this and think at the time he sounded a little too happy about it. BUT, I do concede your point.

[@jborrego2406]

Because he was stressed out and he released his stress by hitting their kid but they don't want to admit that they get Happy feelings after relieving their stress on their kids that can't defend

[@gracemiller3861]

As a child who was spanked it was very traumatic. I still have icky feelings from thinking about it and it contributed to a poor relationship with one of my parents. I am all for removing a child from a situation when necessary, because sometimes they may need to leave, calm down, and come back to try again. My parents would take me out to the car, but we just sat in there together while other people were eating. I cannot imagine strapping a child in a car seat and leaving them alone!!! I would feel so trapped, scared, and helpless. Plus they were just hit! Isn't that punishment enough (not that it should be a punishment in the first place). My family is also fundamentalist, and there is a huge issue with how they view children as purposely doing things wrong. Kids are often not trying to make their parents mad. Sometimes they just don't understand social cues, appropriate behavior, and they might be curious, and they can be impulsive. The dad reminds me of my own dad and many others. If you were crying for any reason you were told to stop and get over it. Stop belowing like a donkey. As you got older if you were crying no one really came to take care of you. It's neglect to some extent, and would that be a form of gaslighting? To deny the severity that your child perceives something to be My heart breaks for those kids. I remember what that was like and I'm sad that they have to go through that. Thank you for talking about this. I feel like people know about it, but don't talk about it enough.

[@strawberibuni]

Your emotions being chronically invalidated as a kid (in my experience) causes a lot of problems down the road including bottling your emotions, self esteem issues anxiety (especially around authority figures, when receiving criticism or people getting angry)and/or feelings of helplessness.

[@eggybaconbits]

The "making kids responsible for their parents' emotions" thing is underrated in how much damage it can do. I've been trying so hard for *years* to try and not feel responsible for how my parents feel about my life. I live two hours away from them and I still have to remind myself that the majority of my life choices will have absolutely zero consequences in their day to day life and I shouldn't feel bad for not doing things they would want me to do, or doing things they wouldn't want me to do. And then, any time either one is upset, I have to stop myself from trying to solve their problems for them and try to make them feel better. There's so many compounding problems that come from teaching kids to obey to please their parents/to be responsible for how their parent(s) feel(s). Also, getting swatted? Spanked? Hit? Only taught me to hide things more. It made me terrified of getting in trouble. It made me scared to need clarification and ask questions. It created an unstable environment, and it made me lose respect for my parents as people. That did more damage to my relationship with my parents than they will ever realize.

[@ProblemSolvedTutoring]

It took me years to stop feeling responsible for my mother’s emotions. She was so angry all the time! I had to learn to not be angry and learn that the only emotions I could control were my own.

[@sambastien6083]

people really took the line from the big book of stories and metaphors that said "spare the rod, spoil the child," and thought that meant it was ok to beat their kids... I grew up with parents like this, and my brother IS a parent like this to my nephews, and it breaks my heart for them bc I KNOW the trauma they're gonna fight against when they get older - I'm fighting it right now Thank you, Mickey, for making these videos; it helps immensely with the healing process

[@TheDisell]

the absolute inconsistency of "kids can have emotions. Let's validate them." and "kids can't have emotions in a restaurant/when it's inconvenient for me so I will beat them." wild.

[@user-mv5zt8qd9l]

Even in thw situations where they validate the kids' emotions, it's still all about their own convenience. They openly do it because it's the quickest route to pacify the kid, not because it's the best way to teach them emotional control and self-regulation.

[@mindajane]

Wow I thought Nate was a really horrific husband but I've learned in this video he's an even worse father! Their poor kids! That breaks my heart. I was spanked as a child and if I ever had kids I would never do that to them. I'll always remember how scary that felt for me and I just can't imagine doing that to a child. My parents and my grandma will all say "I was spanked and my kids were spanked and everyone in my family was spanked and we're all okay." and then my grandma will tell stories about two of her cousins who are siblings getting into a literal fist fight at a hosptial when their other sister was sick and being dragged out by secruity...they were in thier 50's! There is another story about an uncle who beat a horse to death for no reason in font of his kids. My grandfather died before I was born but the stories I've been told about him makes my stomach churn. My uncle had a horrific temper and threw things and my mom is only slightly better. My grandma, my mom, my sister, and I all suffer from severe anxiety and other mental health issues. I always wonder at what point they look at all these stories and realize that it didn't work as well as they thought it did.

[@necroflowers2244]

My mom very much holds toxic ideas about being a parent, passed down to her from my very abusive grandmother. At this point she has glorified my grandmother's stubborn, cold attitude as if it was something to be revered. She holds to the idea that my grandma had good intentions in all the horrible things she did. It's very sad my mother has internalized these ideas and really believes boundaries are the enemy of proper motherhood. She really doesn't vibe with my own parenting.

[@rivka8576]

Something that people who were spanked as children often say is "it worked on me". Really? Because all I can see is that it taught you it's ok to hit someone smaller and weaker than you when you're upset with them.

[@amandamandamands]

I love that the things that you were saying to help toddlers to regulate are the kinds of things that neurodivergent people say that they need. Hopefully the next generation will realise that needing these additional supports doesn't stop when a child is X age and will be more accepting of seeing someone that currently is considered too old to still be doing the thing (think carrying around a stuffie, needing fidgets etc).

[@brittanywilcox7377]

Nate and Sutton managed to successfully create a crash course on how to make gentle parenting as abusive as possible. Just when I thought it couldn't be done🤯

[@catsmom129]

I’m guessing their family & church pressure them to do the harsh, old-school parenting. Sutton wants to be the best mom she can be, because she genuinely loves her kids and because “women are sanctified by motherhood.” So she reads all the parenting books and blogs. She knows some gentle parenting techniques. Her husband doesn’t totally get it, and he’s not going to do the reading. But he’ll notice when something works. Add all that together and you get this weird mishmash. I’m in a more progressive circle, and I’ve still struggled with all the mixed messages that parents get - and had to unpack my own upbringing and harsh inner parent voice.

[@brittanywilcox7377]

@@catsmom129 to be quite honest, they're straight up abusive. This is a prime example of why not everyone should have children, why women shouldn't be forced to become mothers just because they get pregnant, and why the brainwashing of the church is so problematic. Both of these people have been conditioned since birth to have kids, and yet have absolutely ZERO innate ability to be a caretaker, and dare I say- based on the resentment seen in several of Nate's statements- something they secretly loathe. Especially him. I grew up in the church but I'm so damn rebellious by nature that I didn't fit in, and thank God for that, looking back. 😅

[@czickgraf]

They have kids 3 and under. They dont know that they dont know what they're doing.

[@brittanywilcox7377]

@@czickgraf imagine defending child abuse in the age of Google

[@Xkittyloverr1997]

Sutton strikes me as someone who doesn't _want_ to be abusive, but is and doesn't think she is. This doesn't make her _not_ abusive, and it doesn't erase the impact her parenting choices will have on her kids, it just means if she had the opportunity to get help, she could be a really good person and a really good mother. Nate reads as a sadist. I still don't think he thinks this is abuse (I feel like someone who's aware they're an abuser wouldn't announce it on the internet), but he certainly enjoys it

[@LaCeiba1924]

I can confirm that getting spanked and yelled at as a kid only made me resent my parents, lie and hide things from them, and bottle up my emotions, which lead to a bunch of therapy as a young adult. Luckily, my parents have since learned how much they fucked up and have not just apologized for spanking us but admitted it never actually worked to correct bad behavior. I specifically recall being scared of making them angry and never actually agreeing that I did anything wrong. It was never explained to me, so I just concluded my parents were irrational and mean. In fact, even as an older teen, if my parents said I was in trouble and I asked why, it was taken as me questioning their authority and disrespecting them, and then I’d be in more trouble. I eventually started saying, “ok, I understand that I’m in trouble, and I will obey the punishment, however, I also want to understand why what I did was bad so that I can avoid doing it again.” You should’ve seen the look on my dad’s face! He was so taken aback at the question and was stunned for a moment. Luckily this worked, and he explained things to me.

[@webofstarlight]

I'm sorry this happened to you. You deserved better.

[@mageofmagic870]

It's always been baffling to me the way some parents just expect their kids to automatically know why what they did was wrong, even if they never took the time to explain it. Children aren't mind-readers! How are they supposed to know? This honestly should be common sense, and yet here we are. I'm so sorry this happened to you!

[@jewels3400]

​@@mageofmagic870it reminds of a short I watched where the lady was like, "I told my friends we were going to chili's. We have a family friend named chili. They were very very upset when we got to the restaurant." Like, kids don't know shit unless you teach them. You also have to tell them the same thing repeatedly. I didn't know how to "fold socks" until I was 18

[@essimathews9056]

I always hated the “you know what you did” line. Luckily my parents didn’t use it that I remember, but I distinctly recall being baffled by it at daycare and after school care a few times.

[@-Nibbles-]

No, it’s never okay and that’s a hill I’ll gladly die on

[@brittanywilcox7377]

Saaaaaame

[@c.lineofficial]

Me too

[@MusikGirl23]

Me too.

[@Geechee_Chick]

My mom wasnt a hitter but my dad was. His tool of choice was usually a belt with those metal accessories on them, but sometimes he would improvise if he was mad enough. Once he hit me in the face with my math steps homework book(it was medium thickness and paperback) Here in my community, the line between child abuse and discipline is very blurred. A few days ago my father told me a story about how his mother threatened to pour bleach on his brother's penis and my father CONDONED IT. he used the excuse that times were hard and unsafe and his mother did what she had to do to keep her sons safe and in line. When i objected he told me that i would understand once i have children. Like no sir, what i have gathered is that you had an abusive childhood. You grew up believing that physical abuse was discipline (as what most Black parents believe) and decided to emulate your mother's actions and teachings when you had children. My father wasnt as horrible as his mother was, but he was still very hard. I honestly blame him and my mom for the mental illnesses that my siblings and i have. My mom had acknowledged her part in making her children mentally and emotionally unwell, but my father hasnt since he is very sensitive to criticism, even when its in a joking manner