Is It Over for MMORPGs?

[@Bylethdev]

9:24 this is my case, i have a limited time to play games and I first quit mythic raiding because I was forced to do Mythic+ and that left me with no time to play PvP. But then when all my free time was to play PvP, the long queues ended up killing my motivation to play because there wasn't many content to do in between each queue time. Nowadays I just play mostly PoE, Diablo or Monster Hunter because I can just jump into the game and play whatever without waiting for anything or anyone.

[@Gerry090]

41 years old here, started playing MMOs when I was around 19. I don't have kids or a gf to take care of but my priorities changed. I don't feel that "wow" effect from MMOs anymore.

[@MalamIbnMalam]

I'm 40 years old and started playing MMOs at 20 years old lol. It was WoW lol

[@RyanakaRyan]

same brother

[@mithrandirthegrey7644]

It’s called growing up. If “gaming” is your life after the age of 16 you’re either a loser or a permanent child. It’s fine as a hobby but if it’s your life you have a problem.

[@mantequillas1278]

Same here. I just turned 42, I do have a wife and kids. I stopped playing wow when I got married, but I started playing phone games. Kind of like an addict that went from one drug to another. I came back for 2019 classic and have played retail and now sod. I feel like sod is the best version for me at this time due to how much time I can actually invest in the game. Trying to rank in solo shuffle or solo bgs takes too long for Qs.

[@kangkongz]

50 year old here, 2 kids, wife, job = responsibilities galore. I still love pvp. I just thank my lucky stars i play healers (usually disc or pally). I can feel the numbers dropping massively. Even with blitz coming on the scene queue times seems so long. Personally for a casual player like myself (on average i play 2 maybe 3 hours a few times per week), i dont think MMR is the issue, its to do with queue time. I also play alot of wildrift, especially with my sons. I feel blizz need to create a pvp game mode that people can jump into easily. Certainly to get the young bloods into this mode its gotta be quick queue times. I love wow pvp, i really hope it doesnt die

[@Undertaker257]

Come on gearing is already super easy and meaningless in pvp, the moment they create separate gamemode for pvp is the moment ill finally quit, this is mmorpg and if there is no slany sense of gear and power progression tjem why arent we just playing battlerite or any moba type of game...

[@LadyTygryComics]

In the 40+ range. Been around since college and once I find a game I like, I stick with it until it's dead. So I'm still here.

[@catalystcorp]

Supatease is on that doomer story arc lately

[@ivartheberserker9918]

Must be watching bellular

[@ssv-y2q]

realistic

[@jorgenf8732]

I quit WoW recently. Been playing since vanilla. I play mainlyPvP and around 1-3 hours a day in the evenings after the kids fall asleep. I’m fed up with the queues to Solo shuffle. And very often missing the pop resulting in another 20-30 min wait. Even had bugs kicking me out of arena before it even began resulting in deserter buff on top of the already long queues.

[@seetheious9879]

Haven't quit but yeah, this is the main frustration, I really like the current state of the game but 10-20 minute queues are not compatible with family life. Give us ranked ffa queues that do not require healers

[@avopeac6300]

Most people suck, I'm tired of being around them. I spend most of my time in-game with other peoples dumb shit muted.

[@madskofod]

Issues with wow pvp = queue times, rewards and skillfloors. Make seasons short, make a pvp trader where you earn skins and mounts. Remove gold entirely. Make eveeything optional grinds. Remove gearing from pvp. Remove addons, except for details. Eveeything that tells you what is happening in realtime Remove it. Prune the games complexity. We don't need to be able to foresee 5 moves with addons or we die. We just need to be able to focus and keep calm or we die. It should not be an e sport game anymore. Make raids and m+ titles stand for what they should = copious investment of time into the game rather than being able to react and understand the game Like Trill. The game is by design not meant to be catering to those who can grasp it's complexity and compete with each other on a skill floor (highly) unreachable to 95% of the player base. Heck when i face a top 10 murlok.io player in solo shuffle they do some incomprehensable ninja moves while i am a standing next to milady the healer in next round, who tells me to uninstall. Thanks, I was pressing defensives, but apparently it was a case of me the 40 something asshole with a fam vs Thanos

[@Undertaker257]

I will never understand "remove gearing for pvp" why dont u just go play league or cod ? Battlerite even?it already takes like 2 houra to fully gear a character and if you completely take out any sense of gear and power progression we arent playing rpg anymore

[@semmer65]

If there is no gearing there is no progression to make, which is the whole thing in MMORPG games.

[@tylerstevensx]

Blizz should hire supa, ven, and zico for $50k each prior to working on each expansion. Get solid goals on how to make pvp fun. All developer time in the pvp department should be spent on those goals. I have confidence you guys would be able to get some great ideas down for their development team to follow.

[@danielsmith2483]

That wud be the worst thing they cud do...no offense to these guys but they represent like 3-5 % of the player base and catering to them wud only make the game worse blizz need to invest in BG's and casual PvP if they want to save it because there is ZERO new players trying PvP only the old guard left still slogging away

[@rutgerkappers4833]

Came back for tww after not playing since legion, purely a pvp player. It felt like the pvp went from playing chess where abilities had intent to a slot machine of random procs that cc

[@nilssonmats2011]

The gamers that i play WOW with and that i know play WOW is around age 40-60. Midd country Sweden

[@jakecurry9526]

I have friends who ride around collecting mounts and flowers and play arenas at a 1200 level. I feel like the game is made for that guy now. But power to him - he actually enjoys the video game. I just disagree with the entirety of anything Blizzard does nowadays and their games are no longer fun to me, unfortunately. I spent my entire childhood buried in Blizzard content. Visiting the campus in 2018 was the highlight of my inner child's life and that magic is just gone.

[@raymondandsweetheart7150]

If blizzard adds rep farms. for the love of God don't daily cap it. like the bee mount it took me a week to get. sure I could done it in a day but knowing I could do it at any point was nice.

[@grifter4175]

I love that Blizzard has catered to the solo audience by way of Shuffle, Blitz & Delves, I absolutely would not be playing if it weren’t for them. The queue times are the same as they have always been, I guess what’s changed is peoples’ patience. However, it would be nice if you could manually pause your queues if you need to take care of something and come back and unpause it. Nothing more annoying than being in a queue for 20+ mins, you go to the toilet and miss the pop up. The other thing that annoys me is the gap between seasons. IMO, they should be releasing S2 this week. However, it’s gonna be another month or two and by then players may get bored and find something else to do with their spare time.

[@sergiosousa2469]

Another problem is the meta “spec” everyone should play however they want the people are crazy lol

[@Ernestas23]

Recently, I bought PS5 and started playing some other games and it feels great. Played WoW for many many years, I still want the game to be good and successful, but it is no longer for me.

[@MrDusteybowls]

New zone with more world quests and new factions 😂 every wow patch is the same.

[@Brodysseus_wow]

Bro, I'm 40, calm down.

[@lobsterpete8632]

Supatease can you cover or play Black Dessert Online?

[@Yawnney]

I would love to play wow but don't have the time to upgrade gear. Did anyone see how excited T1 got when something dropped? That doesn't exist in retail

[@freshfavorites7212]

Twitch lets me watch you play WoW, so I don't have to play it myself to get that nostalgic feeling; otherwise, I'd totally jump back in just to remember the nostalgia.

[@nagasolaire8462]

I dont expect any changes as long as blizzard has "i know better what you need" mentality. They dont hear feedback, they keep silent when people raising concerns about the game (queue time, premaid groups on BGs, MMR issues etc) and it just looks absolutely disgusting in 2024 when developers can actually address player's concerns or at least let players know that they hear them. There are many things that can be done quickly, my personal take for random BGs to make them 8vs8 same as rated BGBs to have better experience instead of zerg chaos. Blitz was a move in right direction but it just stuck with MMR issues, meanwhile they could improve it even more by adding more type of bgs where you would have more 2v2,3v3 pvp on a different points of the map. By that i mean that bg maps can be reimagined in such way that iy would be somekind of world pvp experience. I know that it may sound not very much appealing but my english skills are not enough to express it in consice enough way

[@markk.8485]

Not true..they hear feedback...why do u think srbg queue time is around 15 min?! The community didn't want to play against 3 of the same specc so Blizzard listened..changed it and now we have a 15 min queue instead of a 2-5 min queue. Srbg was fine.. Blizzard listened to the community and fucked it up (again) and we can't play the game (again)...gg Blizzard ... They have to learn when to listen and when not...

[@iiJaRhonNaDeS]

@@markk.8485Doesn’t work that way. The community can’t cry and complain about a million things and expect Blizzard to decipher which complaints are real and which are not. So many times changes have been made to appease players which ultimately made the game worse.

[@markk.8485]

@@iiJaRhonNaDeS well then they are just bad devs..of course they have to do research

[@raymondandsweetheart7150]

I just started playing bgb whent 14-2 3200 mmr. I only plan to get 2.4 and play another toon. There's no point to push. I wish blizzard understand that once most players complete a toon we play another one. if we can't complete the character we stop. we don't play another character.

[@brunosouza4758]

I went to classic because i want to play a game, not a part time job

[@chrisk1458]

Which Classic is

[@9estebansantos]

The doom cycle is real

[@r-e1862]

Pantheon is coming but is going back to old Everquest so most WoW players will probably hate it. Riots MMO is the only new blood people can hope for

[@staei7457]

They need to make arena its own game.

[@ssv-y2q]

I quit after m+ being less pugable

[@theflyest6595]

MMO genre just don’t hit anymore like it used to

[@aic20]

They're just lifeless minmaxing players and lifeless corporations trying to money grab. No soul.

[@JamesDeanoli]

Stormgate isn't a good example considering how utterly mid it has always looked.

[@eislicht2714]

Playing games since ZX81 and c64 and playing mmo's since 1999 (WoW since beta) - I have 1-2 of hours a day to play and I still play wow but usually only at the beginning and at the end of an expansion. So far I kept playing in TWW because of delves and pvp. It start feeling less fun though as T8 delves are very easy and repetative by now and once you only do it for the vault I just run the fastest delve 4 time and are done within 25min per char per week. PvP is for me still most enjoyable content even though it also has many problem. - uneccessary complicated bloated skills for a lot of classes - long queues - random BGs are way too infested with synced premade's (EU) - 40v40 class /gear balance (e.g. having to play with 2vs7healers and crap like that) - Rated is better but queue times are even worse and classes that rely on coordination are punished - Gaining rating after 1800 feels terrible (go 5-1 to gain 15 rating and lose 200 rating with a dsl disconnect) I really hate m+ (did keystone master in legion as friends wanted to do it) but since they stopped playing wow, I have never touched it again. Not a fan of the pull as much as possible to keep it in time concept at all. - So overall I still have fun moments in the game, but I also have moments where I really question if it is time spent wisely. Part of this is also due to the season structure as any gear will be replaced by basically "free" stuff in the next season anyway. So doing something that is not fun for gearing seems utterly pointless.

[@miikkamansnerus5403]

instead of new goblin city with motorbikes u need Illidan.

[@rmalaf]

add FF 14 classes into wow and FF raids into wow and we good

[@WalkingUpsideDown]

No matter how you spin it, the game is just shit. Storyline is awful, content is boring, the new island seems lazy, that mount is buggy, PvP is dead. PvE is okay. Hardcore and only fangs is more interesting than anything the Devs can do (they get paid for this btw)… HEY! At least we have a 90$ mount.

[@rodrigofreitas1316]

Sorry supa, I love wow pvp but the game is definitely dead and blizzard killed the pvp scene.

[@Undertaker257]

Its definatelly not dead it has 5 min que times on 3k mmr eu blitz

[@rodrigofreitas1316]

@Undertaker257 you're in denial you truly think there was no major decline in player base

[@Undertaker257]

@@rodrigofreitas1316 so what if there is? Wow players just rush from fresh to fresh, sod hc classic this classic that... if there was only retail ppl would play, you just seem to be searching for reason no to play, its very simple if u enjoy u play, if you dont then dont....

[@rodrigofreitas1316]

@Undertaker257 I stopped playing because the game is dead...every number shows it. Queue times for SS are 30 or 40 minutes, I do not know where you getting 5 min queue time from in blitz. Also, blitz doesn't not give you glad mount, another complaint everybody made but blizzard doesn't care. You seem like the type to defend blizzard no matter how bad the state of the game is.

[@Undertaker257]

@@rodrigofreitas1316 been playing whole season never had que lomger than 15 min unless i tried queuing line at 8 am in the morning...i swear the only players that complain are the ones that dont even play the game xD even 2v2 ques are instant with least paricipation

[@H4zz10]

I’m just going to say it, casuals make up the majority of people playing mmo’s, the moment you stop catering to the casual audience is the moment you alienate your audience. Mmo’s generally have older player bases compared with fps or sports games etc, these older players aren’t interested in sweating it out after a day at work, nor are they interested in very high difficulty. Obviously this doesn’t cover everyone but I really do believe that this is somewhat true for every mmo. Let’s not forget that wow became the most popular mmo because it was accessible to the casual audience when compared with other mmo’s at the time.

[@Nakmu2]

Makes a lot of sense and is highlighted for me by phase 1 of sod.

[@H4zz10]

@ exactly, sod phase 1 was so much fun, classes had new spells, there was a sense of wonder in the world again, and it was thriving. Don’t get me wrong, I think retail class design is really good, but everything is an aoe lightshow due to M+ and I don’t know the numbers off the top of my head, but i’m guessing M+ participation is a small percentage of the overall player base.

[@dinoureta]

I played both ffxiv and wow very seriously for quite some time and while you think you can compare their communities since theyre both MMOs they are very different. Wow is the MMO where players are sweats or wannabe sweats. FFXIV is a story game where you want to live in the world and RP, yes there are sweats still but its split like 40-60 favoring the "roleplayers". When the story is bad people will less likely want to "live" in that world.

[@Undertaker257]

The game is not dead, this season is the most fun i have had on wow pvp in a while, eventhough arms spec i enjoy the most has not been that great until just recent weeks, queue times are fine the lomgest i had for both shuffle and blitz is 10 to 15 min during non peak hours and its

[@Fortyozkilluh]

FF14 is too predictable, and it has been since RR. the player base knows when a new deep dungeon is coming, they know when the relic grind will start. so im honestly surprised that its held on so long. what they dont tell you is that its roughly back around the same player base before all the wow players left to play it. the hardcore ff14 community has always been around 1 to 2 mil players. also theres 0 customization in the classes so every class has its rotation set in stone and you cant really play around with different builds for a certain class. not to mention they make most of their money from having to BUY tokens to change your appearance. if you look on their shop that and the story skip are the most popular items.

[@AlexTorres-yk9si]

23 thousand solo rounds not 2300.

[@Supatease]

My bad you right miss spoke

[@Zeratul199]

Despite its age, SC2 is doing significantly better than Stormgate. To me and potentially many others, Stormgate just doesn't feel that fun/good to play. I still regularly play SC2 because I think its one of the most fun RTS games

[@alexervin4321]

players like supatease, venruki, peeka etc play all the time. you cant wait for a new release. us general players get left behind. wake up. its not rockest science.

[@miikkamansnerus5403]

retail is just unplayable to some1 with a kid. im playing classic right now because i get to play like 1 or 2 hours at a time when my baby sleeps and questing in classic is possible. In retail i would like to play my MM hunter to high rating in solorbg but the que is so long my baby is awake by the time i hit my first game. I try to play healer in soloQ and the first game i get i have some random melee whispering me to delete the game. This melee idiot has like 700 less exp than me and i started arguing with him then suddenly realize i dont wanna spend my one hour arguing with this kid and leave mid game

Make more money, have more free time. Don’t blame the game, get a better job!!

[@miikkamansnerus5403]

Ermh i dont blame nothing just commenting to the video i have no intrest in choosing my profession based on a game. Its not a huge issue

[@Rynopb]

gaming as a hobby is dying.... ppl that grew up with gaming are now on their second child. we haven't really innovated in the last two decades. Buy console with better graphics, play it, buy new console, play it, buy console, play it. Screen and console is a formula that is dying same with walkmans and point and shoot cameras.

[@jeff230394]

Absolutely not true. Most people are not having kids these days and most people are not married.

[@n8fro234]

Gaming industry is bigger than ever. Just boomer games like these are suffering.

[@danielsmith2483]

Lol completely wrong my dude there's more people that ever gaming

LMAO, FAR FROM THE TRUTH

[@fogismaximus]

As far as story goes, i did really appreciate the war withins story. The only issue i can see, it probably only meant that much because ive played for 20 years. I saw magni get turned to stone, so seeing his story was dope. Newer or casual players probably didnt have the backstory theyve developed over the years so it didnt gave the same impact on them. Not terrible by any aspect but i can see how that wouldnt be quite as awesome for those players compared to vets

[@DoublebrutalCS2]

37 and still pushing 2400 pvp and 2500 M+ and AOTC every season. I do hate the queue times of shuffle though.

[@LucifeRxGoSu]

not surprised at all stormgate is a complete flop, they had a few 60 year old guys that did some work on starcraft, so what?

[@devinsigle1982]

42

[@superhaainomnom8017]

Wow is dead

[@davidalinbleaja4517]

The second month of wow unsubscribed and i feel great 👍,pvp solo waiting time..........

[@Bobbysmith54999]

What a mystery, decades old games are shrinking… who would have thought?

[@alexervin4321]

fastly leaking, developers are only satisfying themselves. each release carried us to far. look at ur real life relationships. we want day to day consistency.

[@perfectalpha]

WoW is $15 a month...there are TONS of F2P titles that are actually good where people can hang out. For others, Game Pass is $20 a month offering hundreds of games for you to find something. WoW needs to make the value prop undeniable. 10+ years ago, the value was starting to get questionable. There were almost 20k games published to Steam last year. There are so many options, that if any aspect of the game is not hitting, there are other options for people to play. WoW was still 12th for MAUs (monthly active uesrs) on PC for November 2024. That's REALLY good considering the games in the top 20...so let's not bury the game yet. Blizz just needs to keep doubling down on getting NEW casuals to the game. There are HUGE opportunities such as not being on Xbox and PlayStation. They have to massively prune, make the game playable with a controller to get an influx of new players, eliminate addons and a lot of the crazy macros people use. They may REALLY want to think about that $15 a month sub too. Games on one platform are unable to achieve maximum profitability.

[@landofsyn2980]

FF14 recent expac is just boring... its not really "Bad" but coming off the streak they where on- this one is just like a dud...