Is Luthen Rael a JEDI? Andor Theory!

#StarWars #Andor #andorshow #cassianandor #luthenrael #luthen #breakdown #andortheory
I think Luthen Rael might be a jedi… now I know this might be a bit of a far fetched theory and the chances of me being wrong is pretty high, but looking over all the episodes of Andor so far there does seem to be signs that point towards this possibility.
The first thing that points towards Luthen possibly being a jedi has to be the number of force related artifacts Luthen has in his shop. We got to see both a jedi and sith holocron sitting on the shelf behind Luthen’s shop. Keep in mind these are incredibly rare objects especially for a non-force user to be in possession of. On top of that there’s also a possibility that this might be plo koon’s mask, and in the last few episodes we got a few brief shots of a jedi temple guard mask.
Now all these items under Luthen’s possession could simply be chalked up to the fact that he is a very good artifact dealer. However, during this time period of Star Wars, having possession of any of these items is actually illegal. It was in fact outlawed by the Empire following the fall of the jedi order in order to prevent any potential threats from rising up. Much of the force related artifacts were either kept hidden by the Empire or outright destroyed. While it's not impossible for non-force users to get their hands on such an extensive collection, they were usually achieved by powerful individuals such as Grakkus the hutt the criminal lord of nar shaddaa. Simply put, to achieve such an extensive collection would require enormous amounts of resources. Resources which I don’t think a guy like Luthen would have. So what if Luthen managed to collect all these items not through his use of resources but through his own personal history and connection. Simply put a former jedi would absolutely be someone who would know where to find all these items without having to spend massive amounts of resources. Using his own personal knowledge Luthen would easily know where and how to get these items.
Also, the fact that Luthen managed to acquire relics related to the ones which was a family of extremely strong force users shows how deep his knowledge of these things are. In fact these types of relics were actively sought after by Palpatine who would send out his dark side acolytes to acquire and study these items in hopes of gaining more power. So the fact that Luthen not only managed to acquire them but also knew what these items are suggests that he is far more than a simple artifact collector.
On top of that Luthen’s willingness to put some of these items on open display in front of everyone despite the fact that it was outlawed, suggests that he is almost flaunting it in the face of the Empire. Not to mention his shop is also located at the heart of the Empire on Coruscant. So it just seems like a super ballsy and reckless move to pull while being surrounded by imperials. A decision not lightly taken by the likes of Luthen who values discretion, unless he had something to prove.
You can almost view Luthen’s shop as a sanctuary for galactic history. His little shop holds so many important pieces of jedi history, the sort of history that the empire would like you to forget about. So in a way if Luthen was a former jedi, then this could be his way of keeping the memory of the jedi alive despite the desired eradication by the empire. And the choice to keep these artifacts out in the open is completely irrational, the type of irrationality that you would only find with someone who has a personal history invested into it.
And if we are going to talk about Luthen possibly being a jedi, we have to talk about his most prized possession, the Kuati Signet. Now it's not impossible for a non-force user to get a hold of a kyber crystal as we did see Jyn Erso possessing one in Rogue One. But the difference between the kyber crystal that Jynn has and the one possessed by Luthen is the rarity. The blue and white sky kyber crystal that Luthen possesses has a bit of a history with the rakatans as Luthen explains. Making this no ordinary crystal and unlike the one Jynn has which is purely translucent, a much more common crystal. Now we don’t exactly know where Jynn’s crystals originated from, whether it is illum, jedha, or somewhere else, but it does tell us that based on the unique properties of Luthen’s crystal, it must have been pretty rare.
Luthen doesn’t exactly explain to us why this particular crystal was so important to him, but if we assume for a moment that he was a jedi, then the significance of the crystal suddenly makes a whole lot of sense. Now we know that the signet represents a key uprising against the rakatan empire which could be why it's so important to Luthen as it celebrates a common cause, that being resistance against an oppressor...

[@stevelindstrom4830]

He could be a Gungan. There is a Gungan shield in his shop too.

[@iamtunfisch4879]

maybe hes Starkiller cause he got a Starkiller like armor in his shop

[@DaftRabbit09]

LOL this is the perfect answer. I was going to go on a rant about how utterly DUMB the concept of being a former Jedi and sticking out like a sore thumb with all that highly questionable Jedi memorabilia in your shop would be, and as smart as the show's writing has been so far, nobody should ever have this notion... but then I read this comment and just laughed it all off (sort of). Thanks for that.

[@yogicyd]

and perhaps a wookie

[@joefish4466]

@@DaftRabbit09 You got the DUMBEST content on your channel. Why do so many people down vote your crap. P.S. His theory is probably correct. Watch the show smarty.

[@DaftRabbit09]

@@joefish4466 First off, I'm not a hard-core content creator or anything like that. My "channel" was created merely as a space to save some silly videos from when my friends and I used to goof off playing games. The views are mostly from friends and random passer-byes. I'm shocked there's some random subs to be honest. But just because you don't know what you're looking at doesn't mean it's "dumb". Do you make your ego feel better by attacking people at random because you think you're safe from physical retaliation? Also, I watch the show and know what the fuck I'm talking about, and I understand the writers and directors and the seriousness they are bringing. Also, he can defend his own theories, I was just providing some common sense for context. Go bother somebody else with your teenie-bopper-fanboy bullshit. Or just grow up, whichever comes first kid.

[@andrewstewart748]

After episode 10, I’m convinced you are correct. His speech about what he says about sacrifice says it all. He describes what he gave up when he had to hide as a Jedi and choose this path (calm, kindness, inner peace), what he gave up to be a Jedi (kinship, love), and what he is giving up now (I’ve made my mind a sunless place). “I share my dreams with ghosts.” The ghosts of all his fellow Jedi. The “equation” is basically him looking at the Jedi purge and deciding to be “a coward” (in his own words) and hide his identity (the idea of him being a temple guard is really interesting). All the things he mentions that that decision has resulted in are things that Jedi avoid as they lead to the dark side… “My anger, my ego, my unwillingness to yield, my eagerness to fight, they’ve set me on a path from which there is no escape.” Sounds a lot like what Yoda says to Luke. “Anger, fear, aggression, the dark side are they. Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny.” “What is my sacrifice? I’m condemned to use to tools of my enemy to defeat them.” His sacrifice is he gave up the light side of the force and being a Jedi and is using far darker methods to defeat the empire and the Sith. The other thing I noticed was when he shouted “everything!” It echoed very weirdly almost like a force-backed shout. I’m convinced!

[@x340x]

we can only hope! it would be extremely cool

[@jrobertlysaght]

that is when it started seeming possible to me as well.

[@ic9310]

Search: Rael Avarass. It can't be a coincidence Luthien last Name is Rael. It would explaine what his motivation is knowing Count Dooku.

[@lorenzog7811]

Also it looks like he's carrying a concealed light saber

[@cielielombrou8319]

@@lorenzog7811 Yes. I thought it was a peppermill at first, wondering why they would draw attention to something like that. Then it clicked. They are revealing these bits of information to show Luthien's motivation and show us who he is before he sacrifices himself for the rebellion that is to come.

[@oldered5663]

Luthan is part of the "Jedi Agricultural and Survey Service Corps" he was not force sensitive enough to be a knight, but he can READ people which is WHY he picked Andor

[@servidorcarrillo444]

Maybe Survey, that could explain how did he get all the Jedi and Sith artifacts, but a temple guard or Librarian are other two options.

[@dchmpayne]

He would also be a historian that worked in the archives, like Ju casta.

[@MrJH101]

Nah, he was definitely a Jedi. He had the Kyber Crystal that he made very clear to Andor was incredibly important to him and that he would get back from Andor no matter what. Then when he walks into Saw’s camp for the second time, he literally brings a lightsaber with him. So I don’t know how much more clear cut we can get about him being a Jedi besides him actually using his lightsaber (which he knows is a last resort that would mark him for death by Inquisitors/Vader).

[@Feverdream7777]

Luthen's monologue is my greatest evidence. His words, each sentence, are words that can only come from a jedi. His motivations, his sacrifices, his fears, his laments...these are all so specific and directly revealing he is a jedi. No other being or type of person in the galaxy would have such feelings for any other plausible reasons.

[@2Scribble]

Also the date - 15 years ago The First Empire Day - obviously - but, also, Order 66...

[@01talima]

everything he says is a huge no no for jedi, but perfectly in line for a sith

[@IsaacKuo]

If he's a former Jedi; former temple guard, then he has fallen from his former ideals. The Luthen we know is all about fear and suffering to further his cause. That's the Dark Side.

[@darthdredd4148]

No that's how you get people angry its how you seed a rebellion!

[@michaeldunwood5907]

im guessing the jedi who survived order 66 reacted in all number of ways, some more in keeping with their jedi teachings than others.

[@dylanturner3216]

Not necessarily that black and white, really. When you’re kind is all but wiped out you find yourself at war.

[@dekulruno]

Well he does call himself a coward... maybe thats how he feels about his hiding in the wake of his fallen order... if that is the case.

[@Ulyssestnt]

It's neither here nor there ,it'pretty standard real politik and OPSEC put into practice via tradecraft.

[@ingy421]

I like this theory. Definitely an interesting character for sure and absolutely has a good back story that I would love to learn about one day. Love Stellan as an actor and what he's done so far in Andor.

[@DanteYewToob]

Honestly I don’t want more light/dark side jedi… I’m much more interested in grey jedi and neutral people like Ahsoka.. I’d like to see more neutral and nuanced characters who don’t obsess over good and evil, I’d like if Luthen was an ex-jedi if he takes a more grey and neutral path, a more realistic viewpoint!

[@OuterRimPride]

That would be like Bruce Wayne running a Batman merchandise shop with actual artifacts from the batcave.

[@oldered5663]

No way Bruce Wayne is Batman, the guy runs a batman trinket shop... If you think he is batman that is because he is selling trinkets with batman logos on them.

[@pavelsarneki354]

Worked for Palps🤷🏼‍♂️🤓😎✌🏻

[@davidjones595]

@@pavelsarneki354 he gives off a similar vibe as palps and he is doing it while hiding in plain sight

[@OuterRimPride]

@@davidjones595 But Palpatine didn’t decorate his office with Sith holocrons and art from Korriban.

[@jonathontoney2338]

@@OuterRimPride Actually he did, the statues in his office were sith urns with the ashes of his master in it.

[@patchase5530]

I think , although his weapons on the ship were some of the best I’ve seen in a small ship in any StarWars franchise visual, the episode where he out guns & out runs the Empire was enough for me to know that he’s been through serious battle tested situations. The way he got away was “PURE JEDI FORM” but no KZbinr mentions this… can’t remember what episode it was but it reminded me of ‘REBELS’ and how many times they were able to get out of those types of situations w/ basically 2 Jedi’s on board and a crew that has been and has an understanding of THE FORCE

[@j.f.fisher5318]

Also his ship has frickin lightsabers. Granted they are red ones, but still. I kinda wonder if he took the lightsabers from sith he killed and then repurposed them. Maybe putting several together to make extra-large versions.

[@jujuboohoo]

It'd be one of the most needed changes in SW if he is. Finally, a Jedi who said fuck the bs. Ima get off this silly horse and win. A jedi we can relate.

[@yvonnesmith6152]

1.) who was the last person with a Sith and Jedi holocron? 2.) who hates Palpatine with a strong intensity? 3.) who has an obsession with force related artifacts? 4.) who would have the money to fill and rent an upscale Corusanti storefront? 5.) who has an entire crime syndicate that one could draw volunteers, arms and agents from? That’s just my little theory….and wouldn’t it be marvelous??

[@gangetabellen]

idk, who?

[@GIE18-01]

Maul is definitely a possibility

[@ForTheLinKuei94]

Your theory on Luthen is a jedi gaurd is awesome!! Those characters are so mysterious and it is a perfect opportunity to explore more characters in the Star wars franchise. We've already got enough Jedi and Sith. It would be awesome if there was a show on Luthen as a Jedi signing up to be a gaurd and undergo their training process. Imagine a scene if there's a season 2 where Luthen walks up to that gaurd mask in his shop, puts it on, pulls out that wooden sabre handle looking thing from one of the episodes of andor and and a yellow sabre ignites. It would caught a lot fans off gaurd in a good way coz everyone is suspecting he is a jedi. I finished the whole season in one night and day Ive never done that before thats how good the show it was to me. Can't believe I've never heard about this show before. I love Rouge One when it came out, its 2023 and I've never heard about this show all this time

[@apotheosisbetz]

Here is your next episode. Luthens speech as known as a former member of the Jedi Order. Calm. Kindness, kinship. Love.(JEDI TRAITS) I’ve given up all chance at inner peace,(TRANQUILITY THREW MEDITATION) I’ve made my mind a sunless space. (JEDI LIVE IN THE LIGHT, HE NOW IS IN DARKNESS) I share my dreams with ghosts. (ALL JEDI/FRIENDS ARE GONE Or. 66) I wake up every day to an equation I wrote 15 years (ORDER 66) from which there’s only one conclusion: I’m damned for what I do.(THE GALAXY, HISTORICALLY BELIEVES THE JEDI WERE WRONG) My anger, my ego, my unwillingness to yield, (HE KNOWS THE JEDI WERE RIGHT AND DEFENDERS OF PEACE & FREEDOM) my eagerness to fight, (HE HAS TO PROVE SHEEV PALPATINE IS EVIL) they’ve set me on a path from which there is no escape. I yearned to be a savior against injustice without contemplating the cost, (COMMITMENT TO THE JEDI ORDER) and by the time I looked down (TRAINING DEDICATION AUSTERITY TO THE ORDER), there was no longer any ground beneath my Feet . (WORK A LIFETIME FOR NOTHING) What is... what is my sacrifice? I’m condemned to use the tools of my enemy to defeat them. (THE DARK SIDE, EVIL AND MANIPULATION) I burn(DARK SIDE TRAIT) my decency(LIGHT SIDE TRAIT) for someone else’s future(JEDI TRAIT, SELFLESSNESS) . I burn my life, to make a sunrise that I know I’ll never see.(THE LIGHT, ""A NEW HOPE"") No, the ego that started this fight will never have a mirror,(HE'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO LOOK AT HIMSELF FOR WHAT HE'S BECOME, A DARKSIDE User, not lightning bolts, but deception and manipuation) or an audience(NO APPLAUSE) , or the light of gratitude.(NO LOVE) So what do I sacrifice? EVERYTHING.(HIS LIFE)

[@jcbvortex22]

No Luthen was a former Jedi cook who also served in the galactic special forces and once fought Tommy Lee Jones

[@dubbleplusgood]

Andor Seige.

[@damianparra6236]

I don’t think he’s force sensitive just because he has those objects that you’re mentioning. My theory is, is that he might have those artifacts there to collect, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that he’s for sensitive

[@rashworth080]

Luthen being a former Jedi Temple hiding in plane sight does sound like it's makes more sense. With Jedi like them who's duty is fully to the Jedi Order with zero attachment, which meant no one knows what they even look like under their masks. Hence, hiding in plane sight. The kyber crystal that he lends to Andor, must've been from his old lightsaber as a Jedi Knight. From what understand, if you choose it, Jedi Knight's can become temple guards after they they've been a knight after a while. The artifacts that he has in his shop, likely he managed get out of the Temple during Order 66. Yes, having them displayed for everyone to see is highly risky, especially in the capitol system which is the heart of the Empire. But just hiding them somewhere close to him, like behind a bookshelf of his home or something would be even more so if he chose a different front position to help with the Rebelion. But maybe with him having them displayed will help throw people off. Plus, with both the Jedi and Sith holocrons placed close to each other, and having no reaction like what happened in Rebels. I think it's safe to say that they must've died out or lost power or something. Since this is taking place fifteen years after the Empire rose and the Jedi Order fell, it must've deffinitly changed Luthen greatly about his views on things. Especially how a jedi's duty is to help people. With how he's helping, yes, it seems a bit shady but necessary. And during that time of fifteen years, his view on things most likely changed too which is why it would seem out of character for a Jedi to do such a things in the name of a good cause. Look what happened to Obi-Wan at the beginning of his series. After his duel with Anakin, he though that his friend and former padawan was dead when he turned to the dark side. Obi-Wan spent ten years feeling broken and guilty for what happened, and tried to focus on watching over Luke and keeping himself hidden. He lost his faith, he wasn't the Jedi he once was and he pretty much gave up on hope to fight against the Empire. What happened to the other surviving jedi after Order 66, it effected all of them differently. Obi-Wan was a broken man, Kanan did live by not getting involved with fight for a time and went on to being a cargo pilot who kept moving. How Luthen is doing now, it is questionable, but in away he's helping in the fight against the Empire.

[@2Scribble]

I mean, Palpatine HUNG literal Sith Murals, urns and statuary in his Office the minute he was voted into the Chancellorship and nobody questioned that for DECADES... Hell, some of the Jedi even scoffed at it - because he couldn't POSSIBLY know their value or meaning -snor-t

[@FlyRideBeemer]

Don't forget when Luthan arrives to meet with Cassian, he walks with a cane than he at one point retracts into the handle. Very lightsaber style.

[@DarthPlaya]

Yeah that staff is very "lightsaber style" ... if Luthen had visited a Disney theme park souvenir stand, LOL🤣

[@DarthPlaya]

Yeah very "lightsaber style" .... If Luthen had visited a Disney theme park souvenir shop! LOL! 🤣

[@celtickitc]

Ooh great observation FlyRide 👍

[@shannonedens7854]

The red lasers coming out of the side of his ship while it spins certainly is a nod to the inquisitors light sabers.

[@scotthogan6057]

Could he have been a Sith?

[@j.f.fisher5318]

Oh wow, I was thinking that didn't make sense those were basically lightsabers. It makes them more sensible if he was a jedi.

[@HeatherSpoonheim]

I think of him like Connor MacLeod in Highlander - a warrior who has lived through the ages, collecting trinkets along the way, and hiding in plain sight as an antiquities dealer. Jedi, maybe - but I think his story goes back much further than his apparent age would imply.

[@kevinmccarthy2793]

You didn't mention him walking through a "rough area" with his cane, as if it were a weapon and not just a crutch for an older man. I kind of like the hypothesis.

[@leonu70]

He also retracted it into the hilt. From that scene on forward, I had my suspicion that he was Jedi.

[@aad6632]

I think he could be a jedi, he has the kyber crystal, which he could have taken from his own lightsaber just to avoid getting caught, and he said he has planned the rebellion for 15 years, which is supposed to be the time that has passed since the order 66.

[@lcflngn]

Yes

[@Wyldling]

This is an interesting theory, but I believe that he is not the guardians of the temple, but from another organization affiliated with the Jedi from "Legends". They had organizations with Librarians/Archaeologists, Spies/Diplomats, Agricultural Workers and Pioneers. (I don't remember the exact names). Luthen could belong to the Spies/Diplomats or Librarians/Archaeologists and hide in plain sight, posing as a artifact dealer. And during Order 66, he just got scared and it weighs on him.

[@Matman2099]

That would be a great reveal!

[@Westwoodchronic]

Luthen seems like a remix of Rahm Kota from the "Force Unleashed" game.... He perhaps was a jedi general that didn't use clones during the war and the female that works with him is his padawan..... they went to ground after order 66 and that's why they're in their current roll.

[@WD-41469]

Luthen and Kleya do seem to have a master/ apprentice vibe. Dark side though.

[@jackmorris7755]

Yeah... Maybe he's a secret Sith

[@WD-41469]

@Invalidcookie i’m hoping we get to see him put on that Sith armor at the end of season one

[@x340x]

not really a sith when he fights for good (even tho with questionable tactics). more like a grey jedi or something. but they definitely give master/padawan vibes

[@MrJH101]

He hates the fact that he has to use deceitful tactics. During his monologue about his sacrifice, he mentions that he hates how he has to use the methods of his enemies in order for a greater good to prevail and how this has tainted who he was. This double life of his runs parallel to how Palpatine was hiding and plotting in plain sight to overthrow the Jedi. Now it’s the Jedi’s turn to do the same from the shadows and it isn’t very noble, but it’s absolutely necessary to win and he loathes himself for having to use these methods instead of dying honorably in the open with all the other dead Jedi.

[@j.f.fisher5318]

​@@x340x I was a bit puzzled by their dynamic. They are so close but not romantic, the age difference but Kleya has a definite sense of personal power even to the point of bossing him, and he doesn't react to it in the way most men who aren't a husband ore something like that would. But the master and padawan angle fits.

[@stuartgrier5605]

I don't know, but if Luthen is force sensitive, I doubt he is a Jedi or even a Sith. If he is force sensitive, I suspect he is a Grey Jedi, or a follower of the Whilles. Palpatine, Sidious hated all Force users, he viewed them all as his enemies, even Vader. Sidious made Vaders suit to weaken him, so he could not stand against him. Sidious viewed all Force users as an enemy and wanted all of them destroyed, even other dark siders. He wanted to rule alone, the only being in the galaxy who could touch and control the force.

[@Lakota238]

I agree. A Sith wouldn’t be able to stay so rational and humane even if he we’re trying to undermine the empire and Sidious’ rule. His relationship with carefulness with innocent life and recklessness when against the empire put him in a gray area between dark and light side force user.

[@basementmadetapes]

I think this is likely. And, in his monologue at the end of E10, he talks about how he shares his dreams w ghosts. Thats obviously a poetic turn but also potentially a nod to us because we know how the Jedi can live on in the afterlife. There's a lot of ppl who think he's too dark to be a Jedi, and that he's fallen because of his situation, but to me, this is an ethic foisted on him as much as he's chosen to lean into it. This show deals w grey morals. How fitting for a Jedi to be in that space too when they normally aren't. But if he ain't Jedi, that's fine. He's a great character

[@dubbleplusgood]

You convinced me that he is a Jedi Temple Guard because when Saw Gerrera asks Luthen who he is, Luthen answered he was a coward. That's exactly what I would expect a former temple guard to say because of the guilt and shame of being alive following the massacre and destruction of the Jedi Order. Luthen also said he started on this path 15 years ago which I believe falls in the timeline of the Temple massacre, does it not?

[@caelincoolz5814]

I really hope that he isn't a Jedi. I like how Andor has steered clear from the usual force and extreme good vs bad stuff.

[@x340x]

well thats the thing, if he was a former Jedi, they could finally show us not good vs bad foce stuff but the grey ambiguous "Jedi" people that were more radical, dark, without being sith. so i think that theory would be great if true

[@johnchristopher8727]

It would be kind of cool to see Palpatine visit his shop and see a sort of threat exchange, but they can’t do anything open since there will many onlookers, and it forces Luthen to flee….fleeing to a stronghold run by the Bridgers

[@oatlord]

Palpatine at that point could walk into Luthen's store, murder his family, the dogs, then make him give him his store, and no one in the entire galaxy would say a word.

[@71Chevelle1989]

The way he threw his hood over his head tells all. Plus he has a lightsaber weaponized ship powered by kyber, it's pretty obvious but who knows. He might be a Dooku type character as well. Loving the show so far

[@danielbalfour8493]

He is not a Jedi 😂😂😂 why would a Jedi believe in suffering?

[@arounor]

@@danielbalfour8493 he may be a gray Jedi now

[@danielbalfour8493]

@@arounor grey Jedi aren't canon. And why would he become a grey Jedi anyway

[@x340x]

@@danielbalfour8493 what kind of question is that? why? because he survived order 66 and felt like a coward and only way he saw to fight the evil was through very evil-like tactics and deeds, hence why he gave the speech in ep. 10, that his mind is sunless place. he became grey jedi because he couldnt do anything if he was just doing good things. and yes, grey jedi might not be canon (yet) but they can make them canon anytime they want

[@danielbalfour8493]

@@x340x the concept ain't canon. Your theory is just stupid. Tony Gilroy wanted to create a series that has little cameos or stupid characters. Not everyone needs to be a Jedi. And absolutely anyone could be a grey Jedi by your logic. Who's saying that cassian , kino or maarva are former Jedi. No one. It's a ridiculous theory and it's so far fetched. Don't set yourself up for disappointment for an amazing show because it's never happening

[@chrisobrien9375]

Former Jedi Consular if you ask me. Add the items he has, the hints and conversations, his skills in diplomacy and piloting .... temple guard doesn't cut it.

[@timthewombat1]

Luthen's shop is a big mock-up, staging his theatrical role he plays in it. He hides in the glossy superficial corouscant upper-class and sells (my guess starts here) mostly replicas or forgeries to the non-suspecting wealthy customers (e.g. the holocrons, Whills temple murals, the war club, stuff that reminds of real world meso-american art forgeries, the 'historic' souveniers market in all parts of earth, etc.) because they let the buyer indulge in a promised memory of more spiritual, romantisized times. There are genuine artifacts for sure, too. And he has clearly some Force knowledge, though - but exactly that's what makes me believe he isn't just selling stuff that is so deeply important to Force history. And if discovered by the Imps to be genuine could imprison/kill him.

[@DarthUmbreon]

I think they made this purposefully ambiguous which is a really cool angle for this character

[@davidstewart6388]

He is probably a Sentinel shadow. They lived in bigger areas, and were there to help the common folks. They would be vigilantes, and relic seekers. They would hunt sith, and destroy the sith/ sith artifacts they came across. They would also hunt for old jedi artifacts, and place them in safe areas, for the jedi council. The shadows were able to learn how to use their force powers, without being detected, and could use force powers to make themselves undetectable, even versus other force powers. The Sentinel group, of the jedi, were the ones Palpatine wanted hunted down first, because they were trained to blend in with common people and not be able to be detected.

[@vincenthernandez1646]

I want to like this theory. I’d pose a variant: he was a member of the Service Corps. It would explain the reason why he seems to not be as proficient as a Knight. I can’t think of any members given the spotlight at least in live action.

[@Drrck11]

I suspect Luthen Rael maybe a grey jedi or maybe someone who worked at the jedi temple.

[@111havok]

I was thinking the same thing. Every Star Wars show and movie had a lightsabor in it. If a lightsabor didn't show up would be a first. I thought that he could have one and uses it cuz he has to some how. I hope so !

[@CamGaGa18]

I love love love this theory. A rouge Jedi like Ashoka. Or what if he’s rahm kota from TFU?! I’d die

[@celtickitc]

OCDing this series reviews on KZbin. Thanks for analysis and predictions. All good 👍

[@dannybodros5180]

He might have been a jedi archivist, or a temple guard.

[@SilvioJ]

He did say he was a coward. Perhaps running away when order 66 happened.

[@eaglessixersfankeepingitre3247]

I think Luthen is a very strong Force sensitive akin to Mace Windu walking that tightrope between the light and the dark sides of the Force, and he has been able to fly beneath the Sith and Jedi radar being able to suppress his Force attachment when needed, and I'm thinking that there are many more Force sensitive just as Luthen still in the galaxy.

[@devinallen4708]

I don't think We're not getting any force or lightsaber weilding in Andor

[@tim-jim760]

ooh I like this: maybe he had a Jedi sibling and he himself has a weak connection with the force that helps him get a feel for people (Andor's motivations). Or maybe he had a secret lover who was a Jedi.

[@x340x]

yeah, maybe he had a secret wife, she was a Jedi, killed during order 66, he started plotting revenge, carries her cyber krystal with him, she gave him a lot of useless Jedi stuff because he liked artefacts (functioning ones would get her in trouble). maybe she tought him some jedi stuff and knowledge. he took a "padawan" - his shop helper girl (possibly secret daughter? but thats too far). it makes maybe even more sense than this video suggested.

[@ideagame3633]

A lot of things in the series indicate that he is force-sensitive. Take, for example, his ship control skills, when he uses lasers to dissect two fighters. Perhaps he was close to the Jedi High Council, was related to someone or was personally acquainted with them. But he has the highest motivation to fight the empire because he has created resistance. And it was the Jedi who suffered the most from the empire. He told Lonnie that he constantly sees ghosts in his dreams. And only the Jedi can see them.

[@D4C_Gaming]

I think that’s both absurd, ridiculous, and definitely not gonna happen. Though I wouldn’t mind him being a little bit Force-sensitive enough to read people.

[@ryanbodmer7810]

I love the idea of him being a Jedi Temple Guard that betrayed the order and is now trying to make amends!!

[@jiffypoo5029]

Luthen is aound 70 years old and could have left the Jedi Order many years before The Phantom Menace. Jedi that left the Order before Palpatine became Chancellor could have gone under the radar during Order 66.

[@stuartgrier5605]

Hmmmmm,no I wold say Luthen is in his 50's, so he would be approx 35 at the time of RoTS and Order 66.

[@jiffypoo5029]

@@stuartgrier5605 The actor that plays Luthan, Stellan Skarsgård, is 71. The character could be in his 60's but Ewan McGregor who plays Obi-Wan is 51. 50 seems pretty young for Luthan.

[@stuartgrier5605]

@@jiffypoo5029 sorry, but the age of the actor has no relationship to the character. Michael J Fox was 27 when he played the 16 year old Marty McFly in Back to the Future. I will give you up to late 50's for Luthen, no older.

[@jamieharr4459]

@@stuartgrier5605 mmmmm,no, he's definitely in his 70s. Sorry you were wrong about all that. Hope this helps you gain clarity. You are obviously confused. Good day to you.

[@stuartgrier5605]

@@jamieharr4459 What is your in universe proof that he is that age? You don't have any, just as I don't have any. We need to continue watching until we get evidence.

[@rexavakian1]

He is a Jedi for sure. In episode 11 we saw his lightsaber. The riddle is where did he get his fighter training? Don't think he could have gotten it as a night.

[@godlikemonolith]

Your theory is proving more and more accurate.

[@cozcamedia3250]

Did anyone else notice the Aztec calendar in Luthen’s shop? Did the Aztec exist in star wars cannon?

[@TheLostAcolyte]

I think that's an indiana jones reference!

[@redbeard365]

He's actually my great aunt Val Doo's weekend bridge club partner. She says, "He always wins, but he's a terrible conversation starter."

[@TheLostAcolyte]

Wait you mean Skellan?

[@thomasbrown3793]

This isn't far-fetched it makes tons of sense and is possibly the only way to include anything force-related into the series without it ruining the gritty, realistic tone.

[@BlueJazzBoyNZ]

It all depends on which haircut you believe in.. The Swank Shop Swoopy Doo is pure Solo While the off the grid short cut could be a Jedi cut. Love the speculation Time will out...

[@DarthPlaya]

I don't know why and I don't have any proof but I get the feeling most of Luthen's artifacts are replicas and copies. The Jedi and Sith Holocrons he has are far FAR larger than any ever seen in any previous SW content. Every (almost) art dealer I've ever visited has a bust of Nefertiti. I wouldn't suspect them of being former palace guards of the Pharoahs, just sayin' 🤷🏽‍♂️

[@2Scribble]

I mean, Palpatine LITERALLY dressed his office with Sith Murals, Sith artifacts and Sith Urns (one of which contained the CREMATED remains of his late master) for YEARS and the most the Jedi ever thought about it was that there was no way this feeble old man would know what these things are worth or what power they could even hold...

[@Txhalfnote]

I was talking to a friend a few years ago when discussing Rebels. We both agreed that for years and years, we thought that the Rebellion was successful without Jedi until Luke. (We are both Gen X) I really, really hope that they DON'T bring in any (former) Jedi for that reason.

[@Jason-gt2kx]

He asks more like a Sith than a Jedi

[@lorenzog7811]

After episode 11, it certainly seems he's former Jedi

[@dadofalltrades1972]

S1E7 10:20 watch closely

[@richardlahan7068]

I think some fans want to see Jedi and Sith everywhere because we've been seeing them since 1977. The galaxy isn't split up into Jedi and Sith. There are WAY more ordinary, non Force sensitive people out there than there are Force sensitive people. Luthen could just be a damaged, ordinary human bring who is very good a his job.

[@JeffMoak]

He also has what appears to be a saber hilt in episode 11 when he goes back to meet Saw.

[@EdgarJFeliz]

You should update this video as in EP11 when Luthen goes to see Saw he appears to have a lightsaber hilt when he is patted down. Oh and that ship!!

[@blackraven171971]

I agree on his dark side vibe. I think he's Plagus in disguise plotting against Sidious for revenge. If Sidious can keep coming back...why can't plagus?

[@homerwitham768]

I think the Jedi is the guy that meets with Mon Mothma at her apartment and again at the party.

[@charlesaugustussteeniii2701]

that would be rad.

[@simonjandrell5897]

i hope so.. nice logical theory, all the traits of a temple guard

[@alimarquina4855]

I agree, and being one of them is similar to the Jedi Sentinels, more specifically with the Shadow Jedi; the experts in computer systems, manipulation of technology, hacking into and disabling security mechanisms, sabotage and espionage, on missions that require stealth and infiltration. That particular group of Sentinels known as the Jedi Shadows serve as the Order's assassins and excel at sneaky, less combat-oriented tasks.... all similar to him, don't you think?

[@carlcromwell8713]

Kleya Marki, “Luthen's assistant”, is also a Jedi, perhaps a fellow Temple Guard.

[@mikeglisson4912]

After watching this I’m so frigging convinced

[@thedanishviking88]

I like the theory... but I hope the writers don't go in that direction. I actually like that the entire show is from the perspective of regular people. Most of Star Wars is told from the Jedi and Sith points of view, its refreshing to remember there are regular people fighting for what they feel is right as well.

[@mrbackjr3938]

It's funny bc earlier today I saw a video with the description "Luthen is def a sith" hahahaha

[@DisturbedGeneration]

Luthen hiding the fact he's a jedi the way palpatine hid being a sith. If you open your eyes, you can see clearly. But most people just ignore most things

[@JOE_XD]

Are some of these items named in Rogue one? (when they're scrollling down top secret weapons, including the darksaber..)

[@jaredaustin1172]

Could be the other Temple Guard that was with the Grand Inquisitor at Ahsoka's trial. One breaks bad and the other goes on to try and guard what artifacts he can find. Maybe also a precursor to Lor San Tekka or part of the Church of the Force.

[@embarcadora]

I just wonder how Palpatine can’t sense Luthen

[@akiyawynter2170]

grey jedi, hence posession of both kinds of holocrons and the conjoined light and dark side behaviours

[@ic9310]

He could be Count Dooku aptrentice: Rael Avarass.

[@Chewychaca]

Adding to your theory. In ep 11, it's interesting how adept a pilot he is when taking on multiple tie fighters. He also basically uses a ship sized lightsaber lololollllolool111

[@infamousfleetwood5218]

He's either Snoke or a clone of Sheev. The point of smoke would be to tie lose ends to certain degree with him. The clone would be solidify the fact that clones of jedi are not prone to being able to use the force. The last would be the son of Palpatine, father or uncle of Rey. Either would be great lure divers and story continuation. This season may not end at the beginning of Rouge One.

[@infamousfleetwood5218]

Original Snoke

[@ianonymous3524]

I’m reminded of the sith artifact dealers discribed in the darth bane novels. I mean he is dealing in extremely expensive objects, most of which would be force objects. Though I will say I think your onto something. Because like if he dose understand the theory and ideology of the Jedi and there forebears then he knows what’s at stake and what happened when we the dark side forces have siezed power. He knows who the sith are even if the galaxy has forgotten

[@ianonymous3524]

So not a Jedi but someone who understands who the sith are in a way even the Jedi didn’t… and given that he is dealing with force artifacts he did have contact with Jedi in his life. He’s not going to just fall for the propaganda

[@ianonymous3524]

Though story teller wise I would make him someone who left order prior clone wars after all not everyone made it through Jedi training. This is this his way of atonement

[@radiosilence599]

There is more to more to support him being a former jedi, than there is to support he isn't.

[@24revealer]

I would bet more on the woman in the shop being the Jedi. He may need the crystal to run the light sabers on his ship.

[@Minifig_studio]

Skeen is the jedi. It's unlikely he could see the stone under andor's clothes. Maybe he could see the chain, but that would tell him nothing. The explanation, skeen, is force sensitive

[@rc59191]

It's a good theory but I have my doubt's. When you become a Jedi you forsake everyone from your family to friends and any possible connections your family might of had unless you're someone like Count Dooku. Only way I see him acquiring the credits to open his own shop on Coruscant especially the nicest level of it is if he left the order way before Order 66 possibly before The Phantom Menace then went into artifact collecting on his own.

[@Y2Kr4SHM4N]

1. Luthen Raels’ cane is too symbolic of a lightsaber. In all probability it is a lightsaber, and once the SHTF, the blade disintegrates the cane in a break-glass-in-case-of-emergency scenario. Use it, and your disguise is compromised. 2. Raels’ markmanship is the best we’ve seen in the series, aside Cad Bane. 3. He hoards too much Jedi memorabilia. Thus, he either is Jedi obsessed or alternatively, is in fact a Jedi. If he is a Jedi, he is now a dark Jedi. Not by choice, but necessity. He has hard choices to make, choices that would paralyse any true Jedi into inaction. Do you choose the potential near-term death of millions through overreaching tyranny to initialise your Rebellion, or do you choose to do nothing, whereby, ultimately trillions will die? Do you choose Machiavellianism and deception to maintain cover, or do you reveal your intentions with ethical transparency? Do you put aside your ego and ruminate, or do you take action? Do you eliminate your pawns, as their ongoing survival will lead to your own capture, and potentially, the ultimate death of trillions. Just because one is making the choice of the lesser of two evils, doesn’t mean there isn’t an overarching darkness. Only the darkside can take action here. And if he is a Jedi. Luthen knows this, and he knows that inevitably it will cost his life, and that forever it will dominate your destiny.

[@ObsidianCrane]

Nothing in his store is identifiable particularly to most people, unless you know exactly what it is - Luthen has quite possibly been dealing in this stuff for decades and is a well trusted fence/agent/broker for those who seek such items. Which is far more sensible given the tone of the show than he is a former Jedi. Not that the idea hadn’t occurred to me. 2 big mysteries remain: Who is the third member of the circle (Luthen, Mothma and ???. Most assume Organa, but is it?) How did this group form and decide to act together (If Organa is the third how did Luthen get involved?) All that said, I expect Luthen to be dead by the end of the Season. Of the principle actors in the show he’s the only expendable one.

[@jonbryant8708]

When he goes to see Saw in the most recent episode, what is the object that the guard takes from him?

[@Ulyssestnt]

Don't conflate comic continuity with live action canon . I know they paid lip service to comics nominally being canon back in 2014,but rest assured it's not considered top tier canon if at all. 2014 was a marketing push year for the new movie,they were liable to say anything back then . This show would do well to stay far away from the usual stale Star wars tropes. And it's doing a top job at that..love 💕 this series.

[@TheHavnmonkey]

I think being a former Jedi and possessing prohibited items on prominent display in the middle of Coruscant is not very likely... In actual canon logic. In Hollywood producer logic? Maybe. This show has been so good so far, I would not bet the writer would tarnish it by introducing another force user as a main character in the first season. It's much more powerful of a story if he is a normal man that has a connection to the republic (or even to Jedi) that chose his current path and uses intellect and skill to accomplish his goal.

[@jeff37801mf]

I think he probably is but they won't reveal it until the final scene to setup season 2. OR He'll reveal himself, save the day and be killed so season 2 can erase/bury the lore that a Jedi started the whole rebellion.

[@01talima]

red lightsabers on his ship, driven by anger rage and ego about as un jedi as you can get, but it does describe a Sith , 15 years ago ... Palps previous apprentice? cast aside to make room for vader surviving the assassination attempt , he is behaving a lot like palp was working within to bring down.

[@jeslynlane]

OR - he was once in love with a jedi who was killed in order 66 and now wants revenge on the empire for that too - and the his kyber was hers

[@Thumbnailsquid5767]

It might have been illegal but if Luthen is as rich as they portray.. Im sure it’s an parallel to our world where the incredibly rich play by entirely different rules

[@hunchoboss5099]

i think him being the NON FORCE SENSATIVE sibling of a jedi who he secretly kept in touch with until order 66 would be better for the series

[@dadofalltrades1972]

S1E7 10:20 watch closely

[@jjakehicks]

I agree with your theory, if he was a temple guard that ran, that would explain the coward comment.

[@Tman1776]

Unless he was an aide in the temple library

[@crackin2000]

This has been my theory that a kleah was one of Padmes handmaid's \guard.

[@davidponseigo8811]

I'm a military antiques dealer and I own or have owned many many rare antiques and antiques formally owned by very famous historical people but that doesn't make me a famous historical person.

[@ericriggan1453]

This is a verey good theory, I think he is correct.

[@godsfamilyhomechurch7215]

the best way to hid something is in plain sight