Is the Gait D Legal???

[@MindMotivationYT]

Had my friend using this as a D pole, never been more scared in lacrosse having to go against him with this. I think it’s cool though

[@ECD]

It is a really innovative concept very interested to see how the rules will turn out.

[@knack2086]

That’s the point you should never be scared to play lacrosse, things like the gait D’s can openers and the Stx x20’s strike plate are meant to hurt and intimidate players (no matter what spin the company puts on its “intended” use is)that should never be allowed which side note is why I also believe the slap check should be illegal because the defender rarely wins the ball from the opposing attackman and is primarily and can be used as a way to hurt and intimidate but that’s just what I think

[@miles.dhueskis1092]

@@knack2086i have taken the ball away with a slap check more than with any other check be quiet

[@knack2086]

@@miles.dhueskis1092 pov: you play low level lacrosse🤡

[@miles.dhueskis1092]

@@knack2086 pov u know how to throw a check

[@SteadyPVisuals]

So the way I see it as a goalie, defense as of right now has no edge on the game. It seems that offense is getting all these advantages and defense has no counter. Sure if you have an amazing defense then you make it difficult to score and all that but offensive heads are just getting better and better allowing them to take faster shots, hold the ball better in their sticks, do more and more crazy moves with the stick seamlessly staying in their stick, and defense has to stay with the same playing field that they always have with their gear. Lets say hypothetically that a defense and offense of the exact same skill level do everything right, slides from defense are perfect, rotations, the throw all the right checks at all the right times. The offense dodges and passes a shoots and feeds all at the right times. The offense comes out on top every single time because when a offense plays perfectly, there is no possible way a defense can counter that even when they play perfectly because they obviously are controlling the pace with their play. The gait gives defense a slight boost to their arsenal and level the playing field. With that they can dislodge the ball easier from the sticks that were designed to keep the ball in the stick no matter what. In my eyes it levels the playing field some and should be kept in.

[@carsenwinters5791]

It’s true that a good offense will beat a good defense every time, but this will always be true no matter what. Lacrosse is an offense sided game. The hooks on the gait d are intended for hooking the stick for a can opener, but it rarely happens. In order to hook a stick with a long poll you would have to be about 5 or 6 feet from the other player to get a proper hook. From that far out can openers are barely used. What’s more likely to happen is a defender slashing the wrists or shoulder putting bruises on the offensive player. At the end of the day the only thing the hooks are good for is causing unnecessary pain and that isn’t how defense should be played.

[@alanusher17]

@@carsenwinters5791 Most defenders dont intend to hurt the opposing player and i think it goes both ways. Like Edward said, offensive players get all the new tech and defenders are there to react, i personally think this is the only head that can make the playing field somewhat "even" in that regard. look at all the Faceoff tech that came out, the plastic that inserts inside the head to lock it in and have a shorter throat of the head to have their hands higher, more flexible heads, more options when it comes to heads and the slight advantages they give, and a stringking shaft with a damn lever on it.

[@nomore7285]

@@alanusher17 innovation wise its good though depending on the new rules that will be put in place that always happens we can only wait hopefully though the hooks can be innovated to hook on sticks not pads bcs ppl are getting their pads pulled down or even ripped off

[@ECD]

Just as a counterpoint what kind of offensive innovations have there been in the last 3-5 years that are giving an unfair advantage to offense? I believe the intent of these rules is not to limit competitive advantage but to ensure safety.

[@schaafb32]

Years ago all the rule changes were in the favor of defensive players. Heads had to get wider and shooting string rules changed. Both rules were intended to make it easier for defenders to take the ball away. Interesting cycle of rule changes.

[@colecarter533]

my best friend has this head and it is so scary facing him with this thing. it can rip your gloves or arm pads off, if the hook gets in there, and slap checks are soooo much worse, since all of the force coming down is concentrated in the hooks.

[@ECD]

That is why this topic is controversial.

[@chrisfreter3629]

I'm torn between wanting the development of new ideas, technology improvements from the manufactures; But knowing the rule makers trying to keep things fair, holding on to tradition, but not smoothing development. I have dealt with these same issues in bicycle racing over the last 30 years.

[@ECD]

Interesting, how does this compare to the bicycle development?

[@chrisfreter3629]

@@ECD Here is two examples: (1) Bike manufactures started using carbon fiber as a frame material over four decades ago, some of those early frames were fragile and broke easy during crashes/impacts. So the UCI (cycling governing body) put a weight restriction on the bikes of 6.8K (14.999 lbs) to help the bikes have more durable by using more material in the construction of each frame for durability. Four decades on, the manufacture's have developed the carbon weaves and resin glues where the bikes don't break with normal impacts. Carbon fiber of today is much stronger and lighter and the manufacture's can easily make bikes in the 10 to 12lbs range that are 1000% stronger than for decades ago, but the UCI will not change the weight rule. You deal with the same issue for weight, strength and durability on carbon shafts. So far Lacrosse governing bodies have not instituted rules stating weight and construction, but they have rules on length. (2) The bike manufacture's started making bikes looking very futuristic, but the UCI stepped in and said a bike has be look traditional bike and be made of two triangles and a fork to be able to race. The Triathlete world is not under UCI governing rules and is starting to see some of these futuristic designs with improve aerodynamics. Most of the top bike manufacture's now make a UCI Time Trial (TT) bike and one Tri bike that breaks all the UCI rules. Before every UCI TT race the bikes have to be checked by the UCI officials to make sure the bike is legal to race. I have had back to back weekends where the bike was legal and with no changes being done, the next weekend the bike was not legal and had to make last second changes to be able to race. We have dealt with the ever changing rules our whole lives, weather it is highway speed limit in your car, FIS's length and shape of skies, tennis racket head size, NHL's size goalie pads size, lacrosse 2022's shoulder pads heart safe protection rule, etc. - - Please keep pushing the developing and design on best Lacrosse products on the market. I can't weight to see what ECD bring out next! Keep growing the sport!

[@MOHvsCOD]

This shows how scoring oriented the NCAA rule committee is. D players are continually put at a disadvantage as offensive head and stringing technology has advanced. This combined with players getting bigger, faster, and stronger has made it almost impossible for defenses to dislodge the ball from an offensive player. I’ve been playing box with the Gait D since it was released and, while it does provide some interesting benefits, it does not make up for bad defensive fundamentals. That being said, I would only disallow the Gait head if it were a matter of player safety. Making the argument on the grounds of “tradition” in lacrosse seems a little silly considering that most modern lacrosse gear is so far removed from the traditional game. Under the same logic, mesh should not be allowed since traditional stringing was an integral aspect of the sport from its inception.

[@alanusher17]

I currently play Defence and LSM in the NJCAA but have played at both a D2 and D3 NCAA school. I bought this head as soon as it hit the shelves at Lacrosse Unlimited and love it. I think that this is one of the only innovative products that defenders can get. Im not sure on everything but personally I feel it should be legal. The offense has always had the advantage and gets more innovation than any other position. This isn't a full comprehensive and chronological list but the first thing was new lightweight heads and shafts with different materials, textured shafts, a shaft with an angle(crankshaft is now illegal), then carbon fiber, then extremely flexible heads, heads that can clamp on a FO right over itself (CEO) then heads that have a shorter throat and interlocking that inserts inside the shaft to help put a FOGOs hand higher and closer to the ball, the Warrior Warp, then a shaft with a protrusion that acts as a lever for faceoffs. The only commonly used technology for defense is lightweight or heavyweight shafts with grip or texture, and stiffer and wider heads. A good perfect Defense loses to a perfect Offense and it's as easy as that. This doesn't give any crazy advantage, if anything it evens the playing field where we can go on the Offensive(by taking the ball). We are no longer playing the old school lacrosse with wooden sticks made from a single piece of wood. We use equipment today in lacrosse that is safer than the old equipment given to NFL players decades ago. This is a load of BS if the NCAA decides to make this illegal and they should just embrace innovation.

[@ECD]

Alan, Thanks for the awesome feedback! I think this biggest thing that may come out of the entire situation is heads being approved before they hit shelves and hopefully they will give a clear cut definition of what these specific terms mean.

[@koenreiff9166]

From a defensive stand point I really dislike the head. I use the rebel d my self and I like the firmness and depth of the head. The gait d gets rid of the depth in favor of the hooks. Which in theory a defender would like but it removes the stick handling capability. The ball comes out way easier and the catching and throwing feels like a girls head. And being a LSM I have seen both ends of the stick. Getting checked by it feels just like any other stick when playing at a fast pace and the hooks are very difficult to land on a moving target. A team mate of mine bought the head to try at practice and by the end of the week went back to his old head. He said it had no really benefit to make up for the worse handles.( it might have just been his lack of stick skills though).

[@404graphics]

I have the Gait D and love it I was a ECD guy till gait came out with it. I can say it’s easier to pick up groundballs not by using the hooks. My opinion and having friends who have it agree that the it throws is different but that different is better.

[@Hibasaurus]

Review on armor mesh !

[@ECD]

I will see what we can do!

[@alexcampbell1070]

One of those written law vs spirit of the law kind of deals. Excellent on Gait for operating within the confines of the written rule. But there is no way they didn't see this risk coming. Generally the kid that goes "but technicallllllly....." winds up having a rule made about them. They are smart. They saw this coming

[@ECD]

You can't score if you don't shoot. We will have to see how this situation unfolds.

[@alexcampbell1070]

@@ECD fully agree. I'm all for the bold strategies, Cotton. I'm also one of those "but technicallllllly" people. So I hope it wins out

[@calloutballout6340]

I am a D pole and interested in buying that head. I think it should be legal.

[@tommybrian1]

Hey Greg thanks for the update, stay safe brother🥍

[@ECD]

I'm trying ! Thankfully the men's league season is over

[@richmonschumann4218]

I applaud the innovation and it basically takes the X20 to the next level. My son plays defense and had an X20 prior to playing with the Gait D. I feel bad for Gait in putting in the cost and having the clarification from the NCAA just to have it made illegal the following season. The issue with the rule change is the vagueness. Can an edge be sharp from use?

[@ECD]

That is the real question moving forward. What counts as a sharp edge? Is that texture etc...

[@toddsouder6232]

Gait is going to be out some Mega bucks on this situation. They should have never done an initial approval if it was going to need to be further evaluated.

[@ECD]

I feel bad, they keep going back and forth on this head. As a manufacture we all need the clarification

[@Ethan-qe8pe]

I want this type of stuff to be legal because head geometry hasn't really changed a whole lot in a while besides the tighter face shape and offset. But on the other hand do I really want to get ripped apart by heads like this?

[@ECD]

It will be interesting to see how this unfolds and if they are able to clarify what a sharp edge and protrusion really means..

[@chrisbucci2816]

Fully against the head. I wasn't before but, in my game last night I went for a ground ball and the guy using the head went for a lift and missed and the edges got caught in my facemask and yanked my head.

[@ECD]

I think part of that is what the rules committee is trying to address. Not so much about competitive advantage but safety.

[@charliehart4941]

Do you know anything about where MCLA stands for it being legal

[@ECD]

I don't... I will make Jackson find out

[@ratfink5749]

MCLA uses NCAA rules. So I would assume they will be illegal there as well

[@Luke-yk9yo]

Played against this head a couple times and always had scratches and cuts from my chest to my wrists from the protrusion

[@ECD]

When it hits, it leaves its mark... Only time will tell how they rule this and men's heads moving forward.

[@wxllstevens]

I want to a pll camp a kid had the gait d and the checks hurt twice as much

[@bosw678]

I have heard of the head hooking peoples arms and actually injuring them

[@ECD]

That is why this topic is so hot

[@Levveeyy628]

Do u know how to do a top string like chris gray does

[@ECD]

What top string is he using?

[@Levveeyy628]

Idk what’s called but if u look up his replica u will see it

[@barclaydonaldson8863]

B4 the brine edge...all the heads were great...1990s stick technology...should come back

[@ECD]

The EDGE is goated

[@barclaydonaldson8863]

@@ECD stx turbo, stx Excalibur, hi wall,...the orginal brine super lite 2 was good cause of lace locks. The edge ice, was horrible, the edge once peeps learned how to string it was great...but all you needed twas stx turbo/ hi wall/ Excalibur/ sam and brine SL 2.. leather or mesh...these sticks could b rigged up awsome...off set heads...big deal...watch cuse Princeton 1993 championship on turf...the game was awsome, not flashy, not even to exciting..but equal and fair...on any given Saturday!!!

[@chadreeves403]

Funny story, my 10 yo son decided to create his own Gait D. He took an old Nike Vapor D head and cut it to have hooks. I told him that it was creative but not useable as it was sharp and could cut somebody lol.

[@ECD]

Sounds like a young engineer in the making. Do you think this head becomes illegal ?

[@chadreeves403]

I have seen people using it in various tourneys this summer and I did not really notice it giving defenders a big advantage. In fact, I have heard numerous people think that it is causing some players to chase sticks because all they try to do is use the hooks. I do know a few kids who play attack and they are not fans of it as they said it hurt more than a normal head when checks were thrown. Another kid said a defender accidentally hooked his jersey with it. My opinion is they will probably ban it at some point but I could be wrong.

[@barrysimmons2657]

Does USA club lax nlf and all those use nfhs rules

[@ECD]

I am not sure if they follow these rules exactly but they do follow the majority of them

[@barrysimmons2657]

Have you heard of the gait d 2.0 for if the gait d gets banned they will ship it free to the people who already have the gait d

[@old_bayrailfan5312]

it won’t be illegal, just holding calls for the player using it

[@ECD]

Only time will tell, this will really change the game on how this is ruled

[@gavindsouza817]

PLEASE DO A STRINGING VIDEO FOR IT PLEASE

[@ECD]

I don't think we are doing a stringing video for this but we do have an impact stringing video coming out this week

[@gavindsouza817]

@@ECD i’m not a goalie i’m a defender

[@beastmode7519]

Love the vids

[@ECD]

Thanks! Any thoughts on this topic?

[@beastmode7519]

@@ECD me personally being an attack man I think it should be banned just because of how overpowering it would be and how it could begin to change the game. But it is pretty awesome and I feel like all defenders would love to have their hands on one

[@philipgoldfarb1318]

Heard a story about someone who sharpened the hooks which caused another kid to get 8 stitches. Be careful with this one

[@Ethan-qe8pe]

Why would he sharpen the hooks?

[@Myer_Stovall17]

@@Ethan-qe8pe so cut ppl

[@ECD]

Ouch! Let me know who that is so we can avoid them haha

[@Ethan-qe8pe]

@@Myer_Stovall17 but why, it's a game. That would be considered aggravated assault.

[@Myer_Stovall17]

@@Ethan-qe8pe yeah

[@Georgeadams844]

I hate this head so much every defender on me plays with that head and it hurts!

[@ECD]

Can confirm this head does hurt

[@camdynhughes9761]

O players just mad that defense finally got a advantage

[@ECD]

It could go both ways, super cool innovative design but I can see both sides of the situation. We will just have to follow this to see how it unfolds.

[@nickrobbins6136]

to me it seems that it will be legal for this season alone, then once the 2023 season comes around it will no longer conform to NCAA standards

[@ECD]

Typically there is a grace period once the ruling is made..

[@Hudson_captures]

Gait should refund the people who got it or let them get one of there heads for free if you have the gait d

[@ECD]

I did see a press release today that depending on the way this shakes out players who have purchased the head within a certain time frame could be sent a new model if this is truly rule illegal for play.

[@dfheyder]

It’s really not that gray….

[@carson.rainey]

hi

[@ECD]

Carson! What are you thoughts on this topic?

[@NoToBigBro]

The fact that they are questioning the legality of this head suggests it must have an advantage. I see a lot of PLL players using it.

[@ECD]

I agree, I am very curious how this shakes out for the men's game. Does this mean all heads need approval now?

[@huckfin1598]

That doesn’t logically follow at all

[@ECD]

It is possible. I believe a lot of the rule may be about safety as opposed to competitive advantage. But again not much detail was given.

[@huckfin1598]

Questioning legality doesn’t mean there is an advantage

[@NoToBigBro]

@@huckfin1598 No, questioning legality doesn't mean there is an advantage, but it usually does. Nobody complains about athlete's supplement until it shows unfair advantage. No one complains about race car's upgrade until it shows unfair advantage. Back in the 80s, no one complained about pinched lacrosse heads until it showed advantage and rules were implemented to limit the amount players can pinch. All kinds of shooting string setups were allowed until they showed advantage and rules were implemented to ban them. Many rules came after advantage was shown and someone complained. The list goes on and on

[@mrnubbs8965]

Oh naw rip the stx arrow

[@ECD]

Lol, it was a super cool concept.

[@joefinance]

GREG

[@ECD]

JOE?

[@huckfin1598]

Many womens lacrosse heads are shaped the same way

[@ECD]

It does have the feel of that, but the protrusions and sharp edges are the real elements in question

[@Coover90210]

Good athletes don't need gimmicky heads to play good D. Great athletes don't even need a pole.

[@stormz2779]

This head hurts so much

[@ECD]

Can confirm! As a fellow attackmen I don't like to see poles using it

[@LTColonelAnnngus]

its just bush-league

[@cidcanada]

This is how innovation dies

[@chefandrew4065]

Review on armor mesh !

[@ECD]

I will see if we can do that soon!

[@stormz2779]

Hi

[@ECD]

Hey!