Is This Our Earliest Surviving Christian Text Opposing Paul's Claims to be an Apostle?

[@Ilm-o-agahi]

Hello, saba muhammad from pakistan. Have come across your channel recently and am enjoying your perspectives immensely. Though the religion i follow is islam, and i take it very seriously but many decades ago, i also set out to discover what the quran actually says and what we are told quran says. To say that there is a huge dissonance between the two will be an understatement. Slowly and surely, i decided to follow quran only, and now i adhere to a more universal islam where everyone is considered a believer, and we have no right or need to pass judgement on anyone’s faith. My own understanding has led me to conclude that jews and christians are all believers as are sisters and brothers of other faiths. I believe what you are doing is similar to my own journey that is find out what the words/texts/phrases meant when they were revealed/used, and then take those meanings to understand the message. Hopefully that may lead to a more authentic and integrated understanding of the message and also to a more peaceful and united world. Prayers for you and your effort, Sister Saba Muhammad.

[@saburrashid5566]

Your belief that all religions are correct is Kufr . You must not read the book of Allah obviously .

[@Hosea3_1992]

The Koran is not what imams teach ive read the Bible an koran the vedas RELIGION MEANS TO BIND UP JESUS CHRIST SAID HOW MUST YOU ROB A STRONG MAN UNLESS YOU BIND HIM FIRST CHRIST IS FOUND IN YOUR KORAN AN IN ARABIC IS DESCRIBED AS DIVINE AS THE BIBLE STATES I WALKED AWAY FROM ALL RELGION AN STUDIED THE HOLY BOOKS RELIGION IS A WAY TO BIND YOU UP ITS NOT ABOUT RELIGION BUT FAITH CHRIST SAID GO TO THE MOST HIGH THAT'S WHO YOU TURN TO NOT MAN PLEASE DON'T LISTEN TO ME SEARCH THIS OUT WITH ALL YOUR HEART. WHO CHRIST SETS FREE IS FREE INDEED

[@saburrashid5566]

@joshuawilliams9276 Let me address your lies and confusion first . 1. What you say about religions may be true but frankly Islam is not a religion as you think it is. It is unlike Christianity , Judaism , Hinduism and Buddhism to name a few . 2. In Arabic are any translation is Jesus ( as) described as divine . Why do you lie ? He is described as a prophet , messenger and Messiah but never divine . The only divine in Islam is Allah . 3. We Muslims do not go to or depend on any man not Jesus or Muhammad . You are truly and absolutely misinformed about Islam which is the true Way of All prophets from Adam to Muhammad , including Jesus ,Abraham ,Nuh,David,and all of the rest . Some we know and some we do not know as Allah says ," He sent prophets to every nation ', all with the same message being worship God without partners ,associates , idols nor images . Unlike other so called religions , Islam is the only one with just laws and governance for the whole of mankind . No other " religion " can ever make this claim but as I said before Islam is not like them . Islam is the Truth . Period ! Point Blank !

[@saburrashid5566]

@joshuawilliams9276 Now tell me more about Quran please the book I have studied and read for 30 years .

[@saburrashid5566]

@@Hosea3_1992 Yo man I'm waiting

[@HH-pv9ex]

(3:02) Exactly .... anyone with personal ambition can make any uncorroborated claims about having a vision of Jesus. Yet who is qualified to speak on behalf of Jesus more than those who were truly his pupils , especially James ?? And if James was at odds with Paul potentially that led to his death, then James had a very good reason.

[@jeffmacdonald9863]

It's generally not "personal ambition" that would lead someone to fake a vision supporting the claims of a tiny marginalized sect. That only makes sense in retrospect, where we see Christian dominance, but why would Paul in the early 30s think it would be a good career move?

[@UnimatrixOne]

Good question!

[@HH-pv9ex]

@jeffmacdonald9863 desperation for recognition is a potential driver. (1 Corinthians 15:9-10) “For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I labored more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.” The passage inherently implies self glorification shrouded with deceptive humility.

[@forYAHSglory]

​@@jeffmacdonald9863Paul needed to protect his family King Herod. People making Jesus King was against his families intrest. So Paul needed to destroy Jesus's message so that Jews wouldn't follow Jesus. Gentiles are not knowledgeable in the Law and Prophets so it was easier to lie to them to grow his gospel separated from Jesus's... Romans 3:7 (KJV) For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?

[@forYAHSglory]

​@@HH-pv9exIt's a play on his name. Paulus means least. So Jesus actually named Paul when he said... Matthew 5:19 (KJV) Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least(Paul) in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

[@HandofOmega]

On my first read through of the NT, I was taken by Paul's mention of an apparently very popular Apostle named Apollos, whose followers were apparently clashing with Paul's own...How amazing would it be to find letters from Apollos, to learn what he believed, how he differed from Paul, and what he even perceived Paul's teachings to be! Perhaps his side of the early church was an entirely different philosophy...

[@Hambone3773]

He is mentioned in Acts as being unaware of the Holy Spirit until Aquila and Priscilla educate him.

[@bobirving6052]

@Hambone3773 Misled him.

[@bobirving6052]

@HandofOmega Yes it’s too bad we don’t have his writings. We do have some pretty awesome writings from Paul’s opposition though. Mathew is an anti Paul book. John’s gospel, letters, and revelation are DIRECTLY anti Paul. James Is Purely an anti Paul writing. The Damascus Document is an anti Paul writing from his time. Even the facts that Josephus writes about Paul exposes Paul.

[@Hambone3773]

@bobirving6052 too bad you miss out on grace. The gospel was always cross cultural. God doesn't need or want everyone to be culturally Jewish.

[@longcastle4863]

Thank you for another thought provoking video 👍 _!_

[@vikingdemonpr]

Dr. Tabor, since you've made books on Jesus, Paul and even Mary, have you consider writing a book on James? Yes, we have Eisenman, Chilton, Painter and others, but it would be awesome to read a book on James by you.

[@modaud358]

Dr Tabor sees James as the beloved disciple, so I would second that suggestion.

[@terryhunt2659]

Thank you as always, Dr. Tabor. Regarding the question of the title, I have speculations about the Didache. Although probably a composite text (an 'updated and revised edition', if you like), I suspect (as I believe do others) that elements date back to the Jerusalem Church under James, particularly as its version of the Eucharist makes no mention of symbolically consuming (human!) flesh and blood, ideas probably repugnant to all mainstream Jews (including Jesus) but less problematical to Graeco-Roman (etc.) Pagans (and known to Jews brought up amongst Pagans, as Paul presumably was in Tarsus), to whom Paul had appointed himself apostle. The Didache passages warning against false apostles 'grifting' from church communities sounds to me as if they might have been prompted by the activities of Paul and his 'disciples'. If so, it would be a very early example of the Jerusalem Church's opposition to Paul. If only we had further such material that could be more firmly dated!

[@jn8-32]

Great stuff as always , thank you

[@Steve-u9k4p]

Thank you. This is interesting, but I also like looking at some of the "M" material in Matthew and in the Epistle of James to see the early Law affirming emphasis as well. Thank you for your time.

[@heavenswindsong]

Dr. Tabor, I have been researching Paul's authenticity now for over 5 years....I was raised as a Sabbath Day & Feast keeper from the time I was 4 years old, thru World Wide Church of God, Herbert W. Armstrong....they preached Paul, so I just adopted it, not knowing any different. I'm now 68...and was baptized on Easter Sunday when I was 30....and from that time forward, could never put the Bible down...I hated going to church and all the church dogma and eternal boredom of the thousands of hours I was forced to sit and listen and take notes every Sabbath....all the strict rules for rules....but once baptized, that all went away....however over the past years, I strayed away from the Sabbath and was involved in a few born again Sunday keeping churches, but always fought in my mind and struggled with the Sabbath conflict, never believing that Sunday was to be observed....I was presented with the Paul issue about 15 or more years ago & completely rejected the though and rebuked the person who shared that concept with me and disassociated myself with him....until about 5 years ago, when my late husband, a college professor and scholar who knew the Bible back and forth revealed to me the disparity between the teachings of Paul and the teachings of Jesus & the 12....When I finally listened and saw for myself the deep divide, it all began to make sense to me and was as clear as day that Paul was antinomian and taught that the law was a curse, in straight contradiction to what Jesus said, "I have not come to do away with the LAW, BUT TO UPHOLD IT"..."Anyone who teaches against the law will be the LEAST in the Kingdom of Heaven, and anyone who teaches these things will be the GREATEST in the Kingdom of Heaven"...."Matthew 5:18: "For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished". That is a pretty stout DECLARATION from Jesus....Jesus was the creator of the Law....Paul teaches Grace without Works, and it is by faith that we receive faith....Paul was the father of Catholicism....and Simon Magus and Marcion's teachings followed in Lock-step....As Dr. Robert M. Price suspects, that Paul and Simon Magus may actually be the same person, which I am doing my own research on at present....Paul contended with James & Peter and elevated himself above them and the Apostles....and he was responsible for the death of Steven, or was it actually James, the brother of Jesus, as we know there is the account of Paul throwing James headlong down the steps of the temple...Whoever wrote the Book of Acts, I believe was written in a "cipher" manner, as it tells both sides of the character of Paul, and not very flattering....Even Tertullian claimed Paul to be a HERETIC....Paul doesn't even make it into the early Christian writings until he was introduced into Marcion's canon, mid 2nd century....and it is unclear if Clement's writings can be trusted as bonified or merely redacted or pseudepigrapha

[@davidrodriguez4016]

Thank you for sharing that my friend

[@willempasterkamp862]

drusus germanicus

[@JamesTaborVideos]

Thanks for sharing this personal quest and the paths you have taken. Yes, it is all a tangled web to try and sort out, as the "Victors" shaped the canon...If you are new to my work you will find a lot on James, Paul, and the entire conundrum of so-called "early Christian literature." What surprises me is that even a thin thread of evidence reflective of James and the Jerusalem HQ Assembly makes it through all the re-writing and overwriting. I invite you to join my patreon group, see description, as we have a diverse group to whom I present this overview, who like you have taken multiple paths from faith, to skepticism, and even landed with modified forms of faith. Also in my book Paul and Jesus I try to explore in some detail these very questions, as well as earlier in The Jesus Dynasty. .

[@heavenswindsong]

@@JamesTaborVideos Thank you Dr. Tabor for taking the time to consider my comment. Paul has been my greatest research project as of late... I enjoy Biblical history and I am thankful that I had the experience of being an Air Force historian during the later part of my career with them....knowing how to analyze history is essential and putting details into chronological order. I watch History Valley a good amount of the time, picking the brains of the numerous scholars he interviews, but more important, is the advantage of the relevant source documentation they bring to the table to search into....I have never joined a Patreon group as of yet, but I plan on joining yours...up until now, I have listened to some of your podcasts, but were in disagreement with you on some details, but now that I understand you are objective to taking a different view on Paul, I feel more comfortable and I can certainly learn more...A few years back I followed a Yale KZbin course lectured by Dale Martin on New Testament History, and found it of value but very disappointed when I found out he was gay... I scour the internet continually for new viewpoints on Paul...and have found some other individuals who pretty much agree 100% with my viewpoints and have brought up the exact same target points that I have recognized...One thing that stands out are Paul's subliminal deviations, misquotes of the OT scripture and that it is obvious that he quotes the Septuagint Manuscript frequently, which I find ODD, considering he was supposed to have learned at the feet of Gamliel...however Paul spent no time in Jerusalem while he lived in Tarsus and was schooled in Rome along with his Herodian buddies...(another belief I have and have put much research in, his Herodian/Edomite genealogy in connection with Herod Antipas)...Strangely enough, in Acts, Gamliel is mentioned, but does not know Paul...If Paul was a contemporary of Jesus and all of the other Apostles, they would have surely known Paul....Paul was a Pharisee, and as Rabbi Tovia Singer points out, the temple during that time was run by the Sadducees and they had no authority to request Paul to go to Damascus to persecute, imprison, or kill anyone, that Rome was totally in charge of those territories, that that in itself creates another insight as to Paul's Roman Citizenship and how he acquired it not to mention how Rome catered to him when he was arrested, providing a garrison of horsemen and soldiers to protect him when he was escorted to Herod's court or temple and put up there....He was high up in the Roman Government, or a member of the Herodian family... A couple other thoughts that comes to mind, is that Paul says, there are NONE RIGHTEOUS, but we are as filthy rags, while John the Baptist's parents were considered RIGHTEOUS...Paul calls Jesus, THE SECOND ADAM....Jesus never claims this as WHY WOULD HE, this would make him a CREATED BEING....It was he who created Adam...

[@tbishop4961]

​@@heavenswindsongit can be a little difficult to ditch paul as "an authority". Some things he says are really good

[@athousandplateaus6598]

For anyone interested in the conflict between the Jewish and Pauline Jesus movements discussed here, I definitely recommend Tabor’s book ‘Paul and Jesus’. It is a fantastic and fast-moving book that helped me understand Paul’s theology a lot better. Although Paul remains quite a challenging read, he will be much less obscure when you go back to him after you have read this book.

[@Ammeeeeeeer]

Just got my copy of the book!

[@robusc4940]

What's challenging about Paul ? He wrote 13 books of the NT. Luke confirmed him in Acts eg 14:14. Peter confirmed him in 2 Pet 3:15-16. Was Christ unable to stop the writings of Paul being included in the Bible we have today ? Or did Christ purposely allowed Paul to be in the NT so believers could be tricked into hell ?

[@ShemaHaTorah]

Most cult leaders, like Joseph Smith, get their tactics from Paul.

[@iguanapoolservice1461]

Like EGW

[@brianphillips5576]

@@ShemaHaTorah you mean saint Paul?

[@ShemaHaTorah]

@@brianphillips5576 saint to the greco-roman polytheist/trinitarian world, Apostate Paul to the Monotheist world

[@WildBillCox13]

The Greek influenced world (circa 500bce-100ce) was agog at mystery cults and their spurious wonders. They were all the rage, just like Spiritualism was for Victorians and Cultimulcheralism* is today. Thus comes the creeping in of mysteries and signs to a generation promised no such wonders. *Recharging my energy crystal with a mantra stolen from Hindu scripture in hopes that my horoscope will be more favorable. If not, it's back to the Tarot for me!"

[@ChantalArnaud-b8y]

Dr. Tabor, What do you think of Robert Eisenman's books about the Dead Sea Scrolls, James, and the New Testament?

[@kenswanson8222]

We have no reliable information on who Simon was from his polemicist. It might be that Marcion’s Paul was a vehicle for promoting Cerdo’s Simon Magus. All the texts here are post-Marcionite historical fiction. There might have been pre-Marcionite Pauline letters, but their content is uncertain given the probability that they were edited/re-written by Cerdo and Marcion. Their collection is the only surviving source material 24:34 of “authentic” Pauline letters in the Canon

[@Maxfr8]

I have no idea what I just watched/heard.

[@daPain812001]

Mr. Tabor the clementine homilies i use doesn't match the chapters you have in your slides. Which Clementine Homilies are you using?

[@stevenschmitz8901]

Paul does teach that our lives are a living sacrifice. I believe he teaches that gentiles stop offering sacrifices to other gods and to their new God. However, he does say that someone with an enlightened conscience can eat food offered to idols, even going in their temples. He cut off sacrifices initiated by gentile believers. So where do they get their meat? From the meat market or temples. He both disproves and approves.

[@michaelmcclosky1142]

Seems according 2 what we have in the Gospels, regarding Jesus' sayings & work eggs & fish may be fine, or is this a misunderstanding?

[@nordoflobsquipple3121]

Or maybe Peter has his own opinions despite the vision of Jesus showing him animals and saying "Kill and eat* which aligns with some Paul actually said, "There is nothing unclean of itself."

[@stevendebernardi8291]

James…who chooses your advertisers? For me it is a representation of your support of them.

[@forYAHSglory]

Paul clearly teaches multiple times that there is nothing wrong in itself eating meat sacrificed to idols. Paul reasoned that a "strong" conscience knows an idol is nothing. Thus, eating meat sacrificed to nothing can have no consequences. Those who thought otherwise Paul says were "weak" minded in thinking the fact an idol was involved meant eating meat sacrificed to an "idol" made it wrong to do so. (1 Corinthians 8:4-13, and 1 Corinthians 10:19-29. See also Romans 14:21.)

[@Joe-pc3hs]

Exactly

[@forYAHSglory]

@Joe-pc3hs Thank you for the endorsement. Not many in the narrow way. May YAH favor you with peace and love.

[@Joe-pc3hs]

@forYAHSglory And to you

[@bobirving6052]

Yes. That’s why John calls Paul “Balaam” for this. I wonder if Balaam taught, “it’s not really adultery if you close your eyes and don’t think of it as a sin or let it bother your conscience”

[@forYAHSglory]

@@bobirving6052Balaam also taught men of Yisrael to be immoral with Moabite women. Paul teaches... 1 Corinthians 7:29 (KJV) But this I say, brethren, the time is short: it remaineth, that both they that have wives be as though they had none; Paul is definitely our Deuteronomy 13 v1-10 test to see if we love YHWH. Nice to find those on the narrow way. Sh'phe berakhot.

[@johnmann8659]

Luke writes Paul is a chosen instrument (Acts 9:14-16). Peter writes Paul was beloved and his writings are scripture (2 Peter 3:15-16). Why do we need additional documents? (2 Timothy 4:1-4).

[@FilthyXylophone]

Luke was Paul's travelling companion and obviously biased. The authorship of Peter is greatly contested and the academic consensus is that Paul did not write Timothy (although if he did actually write it, of course he'd be biased towards himself lol).

[@johnmann8659]

@@FilthyXylophone In other words, you’re wandering into myths as prophesied (2 Timothy 4:1-4) instead of just sticking to what is written. Do you reject the Old Testament also? The Old Covenant was broken, correct? 1 Kings 19:10 Deuteronomy 31:16 Jeremiah 11:10 A New Covenant was prophesied, correct? Jeremiah 31:31-34 Ezekiel 16:59-63

[@randatatang9222]

​@@FilthyXylophoneAnd the materials on which you rely to make these conclusions are not contested? Even these positions about Paul are so fringe and debated that I'm shocked you're bringing up these flimsy excuses

[@Cr-pj8bz]

@@johnmann8659 Acts was not written by an eyewitness of Paul or the apostles and 1 and 2 Peter were not written by Peter, according to the consensus of scholars. Galatians 2 12 to 14 says the true apostles left Paul and wanted Gentiles to keep the law.

[@johnmann8659]

@@Cr-pj8bz No, Galatians 2:12-14 is referring to Acts 15:5-20. Should gentiles become circumcised to follow Jesus? That was the question. The Laws of Noah is what applies to the nations according to the Jewish sources. Acts 21:25 (New Testament) Sanhedrin 56A (Talmud) Seder Olam Rabbah 5 (Midrash) 1 Chronicles 29:29-> Gad the Seer 9:8

[@LarsPop-Tartus]

I have a question: the someone who wrote a gospel say Luke- did they write anything else say another book ?

[@chrimony]

What would the Teacher of Righteousness say?

[@longcastle4863]

That some living in his time would not die before the kingdom of god came in power. He was wrong.

[@notanemoprog]

He would say "clean your room"

[@vikingdemonpr]

​@@notanemoprog But mooooom 😩

[@notanemoprog]

@@vikingdemonpr It's for your own good.

[@williamarends7138]

What about Abel's animal sacrifice being seen as more acceptable to God then Cain's sacrifice of his crops? Surely that event in Genesis had happened before the flood. No doubt if Abel raised animals they would not have been for sacrifice only but also for the meat to be shared and eaten by himself, possibly also his parents, and probably his brother as well. This seems to make the arguments of this group about abstaining from meat because eating flesh was not done before the time of Noah, to have been contradicted by the scriptures that they supposedly were following.

[@therealjasonbueno]

We need a new reformation.

[@Benjamin-jo4rf]

I agree but we can’t just wait for someone else to do it, we should gather together with other like minded people and be the difference we wish to see. Local fellowships made up of followers of Jesus would be wonderful

[@jeffreylehman1159]

@@therealjasonbueno Better, a new Enlightenment

[@longcastle4863]

Evangelicalism and Fundamentalism are destroying Christianity. Not allowing it to grow and mature into a healthy and helpful religion, but insisting, instead, that it be stuck in the relatively ignorant past-when we knew so much less than we know now. And even trying to enforce those beliefs on unwilling others by becoming involved in politics.

[@longcastle4863]

@@Benjamin-jo4rf I’m no longer a believer, but I still enjoy biblical scholarship. For those who want to believe without having to ignore the findings of science and scholarship, I would recommend a KZbin Christian channel called CentrePlace. I enjoy the over 200 videos Lecture Series that can be found under their playlist, but there are also regular type church services and sermons too. I have often thought, if I were ever to join a Christian church again, this would be the church I would join.

[@pinkys2347]

Did Jesus follow the Essenes way of living? If he did, is this the correct way to follow the teachings of Jesus?

[@longcastle4863]

I’m no biblical scholar, but my reading of the NT and Qumran scrolls, suggests to me that Jesus followed a more liberal, less structured law based version of what we see in the Essene community of the scrolls. Maybe a break-away version of Essene beliefs? They both seem, however, to have had a disdain for the animal sacrificial system found in the Temple.

[@sirlancealittles]

Thou shalt not eat the beasts of the field nor make folly of their flesh...Unless its bacon...mmm 😊

[@ktermalkut8332]

Speaking of VISIONS - I was brought up in a NON Christ honoring religion. As an adult I followed Acts 2:36-39, with REPENTANCE to become BORN AGAIN of and filled with The HOLY SPIRIT (The HOLY SPIRIT is FATHER and The LORD JESUS (John 14:20). The only EVIDENCE (not the Gift described in 1Corinthians 14) of the INFILLING is that of speaking in other languages/tongues given by The HOLY SPIRIT according to the Promise in Zephaniah 3:9 and Joel 2, Acts 2, 10:44-48, 19:1-6. I developed a PERSONAL Relationship with The LORD GOD incarnated in the flesh as The LORD JESUS CHRIST, as is HIS WILL to be taught by HIM and to know HIM as Our Only FATHER and TEACHER - Matthew 23:8-10. I saw many amazing things happen as I learned my IDENTITY and Authority in The LORD GOD. Many years later I had an intermittent pain in the left side of my chest which many would diagnose as a heart issue. I prayed in Tongues in The HOLY SPIRIT - 1Corinthians 14:2,4, and while praying I saw a VISION of my ancestors with my mother who had passed in the front of the line. I knew my mother had been diagnosed with a heart condition which she never took seriously in terms of diet etc. When I saw the vision I knew I was dealing with a HEREDITARY Bloodline issue. I prayed through and was healed. A few months later, the pain seemed to come back and The LORD GOD told me to reject it and that was the END. The LORD GOD Himself Who is The FATHER and The LORD JESUS CHRIST living in the believer speaks from the BELIEVER'S spirit that is ONE with The LORD GOD when the spirit of the believer speaks in tongues using the vocal facilities (vocal cords, tongue, throat etc) of the believer - John 14:20 reading from verse 15-21, Romans 8:26-27.

[@robusc4940]

Acts 14:14 "Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul," Is Luke who wrote Acts lying about Paul being an Apostle ? If so, then do we also mistrust anything else that Luke wrote in Luke & Acts ?

[@Cr-pj8bz]

Apostle means messenger. Someone who is sent by Someone. Jesus only had 12 apostles. Acts 1 says in order to be an apostle, you have to have witnesses Jesus ministry. So in Acts Paul and Barnabas are only sent by other humans. But Paul claims to be an apostle of Jesus

[@robusc4940]

@@Cr-pj8bz Acts 14:14 Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, Is Acts 14:14 a lie ? Did Luke lie in Acts 14:14 ?

[@Hambone3773]

All of Luke-Acts is a defense of Pauline ministry to Gentiles. So those who would use it to denounce Paul are self-defeating.

[@JustinMay74]

Paul met the qualifications to be an apostle, he spent some of his time in various letters defending his apostolic authority. He was recognized by the other apostles as an apostle, this is shown in Acts and Paul later clarifies this in Galatians. Peter in 2 Peter 3 even defends Pauls writings. At first glance, this sounds like a defense of Catholicism and papal authority to me. After looking up James Tabor, he’s of the same ilk and even colleagues with Bart Ehrman, who rejects the divinity of Christ. In his book The Jesus Dynasty, James makes the tired and debunked claims that Jesus was not divine, his father was a Roman soldier, that he died and did not resurrect and that he established a familial dynasty through his brother James. This is absolute blasphemy and should be avoided, unless you also like to believe in this junk. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYLSfqSFhZKMY5o

[@Cr-pj8bz]

@@JustinMay74 no Paul didn't met the criteria. Did he follow Jesus during his life? No.

[@robusc4940]

Are Luke & Acts also to be avoided & possibly Peter since they also reference & support Paul ? If so, the NT will be a very small book consisting of Matthew, Mark, John, Jude & Revelation

[@ghostriders_1]

Mark is Pauline, he is euhemerizing Paul's Jesus.

[@robusc4940]

@@ghostriders_1 Acts 14:14 "Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul," Is Luke who wrote Acts lying about Paul being an Apostle ? If so, then do we also mistrust anything else that Luke wrote in Luke & Acts ?

[@ghostriders_1]

@robusc4940 We don't know who wrote Luke/Acts & yes we should not trust the information presented in Acts.

[@robusc4940]

@@ghostriders_1 So to be safe we need to ignore Luke, Acts, Romans-Philemon and some of Peter. Why would Christ through His holy men allow the NT to be so flawed ?

[@ghostriders_1]

@@robusc4940 because fictional characters do not have control over their Creators.

[@WildBillCox13]

23:20 Jesus as a vegetarian? The miracle of the loaves and fishes takes on a disturbing twist. It suggests He seems to indicate that fish (an animal, last time I checked) is just fine for his believers. Otherwise, it's like a lung doctor handing out cigarettes* at a family picnic. *Including candy and bubblegum cigarettes for the kiddies.

[@PistisAdelphos]

Can anyone actually tell me the main text all of Paul's writings he used to get his theology?

[@stevenschmitz8901]

Paul does not lead a moral life according to his own words. He says he deceives, he uses guile, he steals from other churches, he boasts, he lies, he is a people pleaser, and he is a hypocrite as he morphs into whatever person he thinks his audience will accept.

[@teahilton]

Jesus and Mary Magdala taught matriarchal family the 50th Gate of Understanding to Torah as did Zipporah and Moses as did Khadijah and Muhammad. Judaism Christianity and Islam all chose the Golden Calf the Golden Scepter of Judah instead of the Tree of Life the blossoming Staff of Joseph. This is what Jigonsaseh the Mother of Nations and Tekanawita the Peacemaker taught. A Sanhedrin of those sharing the Womb of Mother Earth replacing all forms of pharaohship.

[@crimson90]

17:08 Lol, I think they're forgetting about Genesis 9:3?

[@Bowdon]

I think it's a stretch to say this is Paul, especially considering Simon Magus has a whole backstory.

[@sp1ke0kill3r]

Isn't Peter condemned for ignoring a revelation in Mark?

[@mrd90x]

Ebionite Christians had wandered down strange paths.

[@longcastle4863]

Imo, all religions wander down strange paths and none end up being unequivocally helpful for humankind.

[@scripturalcontexts]

Interesting discussion, however I'm not really that convinced that the Clementine literature is implicitly criticizing Paul. What would be interesting is if we saw any indirect citations from the Pauline corpus or perhaps quotations from the Pauline corpus that are being polemicize against. I honestly didn't see anything in the discussion that seems to indicate Paul was the intended target, but I admit I could be wrong

[@forYAHSglory]

John called Paul antichrist... 1 John 4:3 (KJV) And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 2 John 1:7 (KJV) For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Jesus is called son of man more than any other title. Ezekiel is called son of man by GOD and Daniel is called son of man by Gabriel. Son of man means human. For instance... Genesis 5:1 (KJV) This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him; Adam is in the likeness of GOD but is not a god himself. Paul teaches Philippians 2:7-8 (KJV) But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Romans 8:3 (KJV) For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: Paul teaches Jesus was something like a man, reducing Jesus's suffering experience since angelic beings are tougher than human. Paul also said... Galatians 1:11-12 (KJV) But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ. He is saying Jesus is not a man but spirit. The angels said... Acts 1:11 (KJV) Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. He went up to heaven after man and will come back the same way. Paul is a liar so why believe a tactical evangelist... Romans 3:7 (KJV) For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?

[@scripturalcontexts]

@@forYAHSglory Romans 1:3-5 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name: Galatians 4:4-5 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. Paul not only affirmed that Jesus was God's son and therefore a supernatural being, but also made incarnate in the body of a man by physical birth through a woman. Therefore Paul could not be called an antichrist given the criteria which you have laid out above as he acknowledges both the humanity and Divinity of Jesus. Not only does Paul say that Jesus had a physical birth, but that he even was a descendant from the tribe of Judah and therefore in the lineage of David. Further, the term son of man in the time of Jesus had taken on referring not merely to the human being but was also used as the title for an eschatological judge who would execute judgment at the consummation of the end of time. See Daniel 7 and 1 Enoch 37-71 for the use of the title as applying to an end times judge, a role which Jesus seemed to consider himself occupying.

[@Hambone3773]

​@@forYAHSgloryJohn spoke against gnostic, not Paul.

[@forYAHSglory]

@Hambone3773 Paul is a gnostic. A gnostic is a person who believes knowledge will bring them salvation. Like believing the death, burial, and resurrection is the way to salvation. What I posted is verbatim KJV. Paul clearly teaches Jesus was not human. You are trying to change the definition of antichrist but John laid it out it is those who teach what Paul taught.

[@forYAHSglory]

@@Hambone3773 Jesus says Paul is the synagogue of Satan. 1 Corinthians 9:20 (KJV) And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; Here Paul clearly states he lies about being a Jew. Jesus is not fond of this behavior... Revelation 2:9 (KJV) I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan. Revelation 3:9 (KJV) Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

[@cletuspiper4999]

Link to documents doesn’t work

[@CaliRaveBoi]

So every passover meal they never ate meat?

[@jennifersilves4195]

Isn't Simon Magus Paul?

[@jdaze1]

John the baptist prepared the way for the coming of the spirit of Truth not another prophet after him. As noted in Isaiah 40:3 in hebrew. John the baptist was exalted, given a new name Phillipians 2:9-10, was the apostle john and also John the Revelator. He came in the spirit of Elijah (spirit of Prophecy). He revealed the words of truth given to him by the Father. He didnt speak of himself. He lived a long life and saw his seed as noted in Isaiah 53. The Jesus character is simply John speaking by the Spirit of Truth. The new man. The whole virgin birth narrative in the gospel is a lie and never happened. Easy to prove. The trinity is lie concocted by Rome also easy to prove. And the resurrection has absolutely nothing to do with the physical body. Also easy to prove.

[@neclark08]

...I have- & will continue to challengen the contention that Saul/Paul deserves to be called the "Sole Eye-Witness to Jesus' Resurrection-- a Real hat HIS 'Visionary ConFab' with Jesus already DEAD for 4- to-7-YEARS. that HE was entitled to 'Run to the Head of the #JesusMovementParade' by contending somehow "trumped" the

[@WildBillCox13]

16:27 So by this reasoning (until after the flood) those men among whom the Nephilim lived did not eat meat? That seems odd for the children of angels who supposedly fell from grace because their desire for pleasure trumped God's edict. As an interjection, may I point to the rich archeological and paleontological evidence of ancient human habitation and camping, including cave paintings, indicating that man was both a hunter and eater of flesh?

[@_Archambaud]

👍

[@michellecollins290]

2 Peter 3:15-16 He was good enough for the Apostle Peter.

[@FipsAsmussen-m8f]

Most New Testament scholars regard Second Peter as a very clear forgery Whoever wrote 2 Peter, it was not the Apostle Peter.

[@DynamicGracer]

In the Greek he clearly says there he speaks non sense

[@jonny9998]

I cannot make sense of your references. The recognitions are divided into books and chapters, not verses. Recognitions 1:71-72 refers to what book and chapter?

[@daPain812001]

I don't know which clementine homilies or recognitions he is using because it doesn't match the ones I have

[@jacquesvincent3897]

BEHOLD ! THE SCRIPTURES TALKS ABOUT YOU ......2 Timothy 3:13 “But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.”

[@forYAHSglory]

Paul writes epistles not scripture.

[@theomnisthour6400]

Some folks just can't abide anyone not being puppets in their happy happy clown car, eh? Ancient addictions to the sin of creating false flag overdefinitions of sin die hard 😂

[@JonHurley-o4o]

sounds like fables to me.

[@tbishop4961]

No way

[@scottscheper]

But where there's smoke...

[@pursuingtruth13]

Algorithm support

[@TPOsborne77]

I see no basis in these passages as being against or anti-Paul or any resemblance of Simon Magus to what Paul taught.

[@alexina4567]

Paul: persecuted church. Simon: persecuted church. Paul: opposed the apostles. Simon: opposed apostles. Paul: claimed to see Jesus and become an apostle. Simon: called the father of those who claimed to see Jesus and become an apostle. Paul: instructed to go to Antioch to preach obedience to the gentiles. Simon: instructed to go to Antioch to preach obedience to the gentiles: Paul: opposed Peter, James and John in Antioch and taught doctrines like eating meat sacrificed unto Idols. Simon: slandered the apostles from Antioch so Peter had to go and oppose him. Peter also addressed Paul’s false claims in these writings, about him withdrawing from the table of the gentiles out of pride. His response to these false accusations was that Simon taught many wicked things like eating meat sacrificed unto idols, and that they needed cleansing from Baptism before he could sit with them. Very clearly Paul.

[@Hambone3773]

It could be an illusion to Paul. The material sounds distinctly Ebionite and they were definitely Anti-Pauline.

[@TPOsborne77]

@@alexina4567 Sha'ul (Paul) was vetted by the Assembly of Antioch for years and from there went on his first missionary journey with the very one who introduced him to James and Peter. Again he is confirmed by the Jerusalem Assembly and sent out. His writings have no appearance to the doctrines that Simon Magus was preaching. "Some" Ebionites disclaimed him according to the polemicists of the Roman Catholics. What they may have rejected was the churches mistranslation, misuse and abuse of Paul's writings. In effect, they they created a mythical "Paul" to replace the real Sha'ul. Sha'ul admitted himself that he, in the beginning, had persecuted the Assembly but was transformed. Some of your claims simply are not true.

[@alexina4567]

@ not true. All of those are his own claims, which his own writings disprove. By his own words, he hated john enough to separate from John. His false accusations against Peter were addressed by Peter to Clement and his false claim of being the apostle to the gentiles was refuted by Peter in Acts 15

[@TPOsborne77]

@@alexina4567 You just make things up. I perceive the you are caught in the "gall of bitterness" yourself and making your own false accusations.

[@barnsweb52]

Common sense and the upright words of Elohim, especially as found in The Moses Scroll or The Valediction of Moses, prove Paul a total ignoramus and liar. Common sense and the upright words from Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount - also prove Paul a rank liar. Paul's own writings prove Paul a rank liar and enemy of God and Jesus. Let's interject some good old common sense. Read: "Romans Proves Paul Lied - Have We Inherited Lies From Our Fathers?"

[@Joshua123N]

UNTOLD MILLENNIAL LIES AND THE TRINITY (NO. 9) HOW JESUS EXPOSED THE TRINITY AND CHRISTIANITY Christology, in its futile attempt to save Jesus by claiming that Matthew 27:46 is a fulfillment of Psalm 22, actually condemns him and its own Trinitarian theology. Let's take a look at Matthew 27:46 (Mark 15:34) first. Matthew 27:46 "About three in the afternoon, Jesus cried out in a loud voice, ‘Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?’ (which means ‘My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?’)." This verse, or last cry, not only negates the so-called "Co-equal/Co-eternal" doctrines of the Trinity but also exposes another contradiction in John 10:18, where he claims that "no one takes his life from him," that he has the power to lay it down and to take it back. Why cry to the Father for help if he can easily take it back? And why remain dead for days if he can take it back-why not immediately? To top it all off, if he is truly the source of life, the question of dying does not arise, nor is there any need for a resurrection, because death cannot occur. John 10:18 "No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father." Not only was he ignored, but God did not save him from death either. If the verse refers to his resurrection, then neither his resurrection nor the resurrection of those who supposedly crawled out of their tombs is mentioned in Paul's letters. Nor was the Sanhedrin aware of such an event. Stephen, who was stoned to death a year after Jesus’ death, also did not use the opportunity to mention the resurrection to the Sanhedrin. Similarly, Paul's conversion a year after Jesus’ death does not include any report of Jesus’ resurrection or the open tombs. Hebrews 5:7 "During the days of Jesus' earthly life, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the One who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverence." It is very clear that the claims made by Christology about Jesus crying out in Matthew 27:46 as the fulfillment of Psalm 22 are not only nonsensical but foolish. Psalm 22 speaks of David’s lament for his people (Israel) in the future, his trust in God, and their eventual salvation, as seen in Jeremiah 31, Ezekiel 37, Isaiah 11, Jeremiah 30, and other passages. Meanwhile, Jesus died accursed. Psalm 22:1-5 "For the director of music. To the tune of 'The Doe of the Morning.' A psalm of David. My God, my God, why have you forsaken me? Why are you so far from saving me, so far from my cries of anguish? My God, I cry out by day, but you do not answer, by night, but I find no rest. Yet you are enthroned as the Holy One; you are the one Israel praises. In you, our ancestors put their trust; they trusted, and you delivered them. To you, they cried out and were saved; in you, they trusted and were not put to shame."

[@lisaking4291]

I'm trying to follow along with what your saying, but it's all very hard to be clear about what you're saying precisely, I know you're very studied with all this stuff, as your an academic teacher in the field of this stuff, are your saying believe what Paul said?? As I believe that Jesus was a teacher of the law of God, and not God in the flesh, like many Christians are saying about Jesus was, I believe that Jesus was a pointed to teach them the law of God, the Moses commandments

[@Hambone3773]

He's saying that a second century Ebionite forged a letter in Clement's name as a repudiation of Pauline Christianity and used the biblical Simon Magus as a stand in for Paul. Every accusation made against Simon in the letter is really a jab at Paul.

[@jacquesvincent3897]

SO, GOD FAIL TO REMOVE PAUL TO HIS HOLY BOOK??? .....YOUR ALMOST FUNNY!! PSALMS 12:6-7...The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. 7-Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

[@jacquesvincent3897]

2 Peter 3:15 “And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;”

[@FipsAsmussen-m8f]

Most New Testament scholars regard Second Peter as a very clear forgery Whoever wrote 2 Peter, it was not the Apostle Peter.

[@jacquesvincent3897]

@@FipsAsmussen-m8f Scholars are modern days pharisees!!! Titus 1:16 “They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.”

[@JustinMay74]

Paul met the qualifications to be an apostle, he spent some of his time in various letters defending his apostolic authority. He was recognized by the other apostles as an apostle, this is shown in Acts and Paul later clarifies this in Galatians. Peter in 2 Peter 3 even defends Pauls writings. At first glance, this sounds like a defense of Catholicism and papal authority to me. After looking up James Tabor, he’s of the same ilk and even colleagues with Bart Ehrman, who rejects the divinity of Christ. In his book The Jesus Dynasty, James makes the tired and debunked claims that Jesus was not divine, his father was a Roman soldier, that he died and did not resurrect and that he established a familial dynasty through his brother James. This is absolute blasphemy and should be avoided, unless you also like to believe in this junk. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYLSfqSFhZKMY5o

[@charlesiragui2473]

What is the purpose of focusing on these texts coming from well after the 1st century? As Tabor agrees, these are pseudepigraphical texts, not from Clement of Rome. They seem to have been used by the Ebionites, as testified to by Jerome in the 4th century. No one seems to believe they could represent eye witness accounts of events happening in apostolic times. They would seem to inform us about the beliefs of the Ebionites but they would not reasonably inform us about the historical Paul, Paul's belief or his conflicts with James and Peter. Also, Simon Magus inconveniently first appears in Acts, a distinctly pro-Pauline work. How are we to then transpose Paul onto references in the Pseudo Clementines to Simon Magus?

[@jacquesvincent3897]

THE WHOLE BOOK OF ACTS WAS WRITTEN BY LUKE ......AND IT'S ALL ABOUT PAUL😉😉😉😉 .

[@bobirving6052]

@jacquesvincent3897 Yeah. For example, how did Luke know what “Steven said” before his stoning? Paul told Luke. Paul was the “witness”. And the worst part about it is that Paul lied about Steven’s last words. “Law given by Angels” is Paul’s and the Herods’ own heresy.

[@jacquesvincent3897]

@@bobirving6052 BY THE HOLY SPIRIT WERE THE SCRIPTURES WRITTEN ....JUST AS MOSES WROTE THE FIRST FIVE BOOKS (TORAH) OF THE BIBLE HOW DID HE KNOW ABOUT WHAT BOAH OR ADAM SAID????? ........CERTAINLY NOT BY THEIR PERSONAL MEMORIES...HE WASN'T THERE !! . 2 Peter 1:21 “For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.”. 2 Peter 3:15 “And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;”

[@jacquesvincent3897]

@@bobirving6052 SO! YOU THINK THAT ALMIGHTY GOD COULDN'T KEEP PAUL'S 13 EPISTLES FROM ENDING UP IN HIS HOLY BOOK ,THE BIBLE🤣🤣🤣.....WE DON'T HAVE THE SAME GOD !! ....MINE CAN DO WHATEVER HE WANTS ....INCLUDING KEEPING ANY FALSE APOSTLES PUT OF SCRIPTURES IF HE WANTS TO !! PSALMS 12:6-7...6The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. 7Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

[@ronskrobutan7635]

James, I appreciate your scholarship and the work you’ve done as a writer. However, I’m concerned about the direction your interpretations seem to be taking, especially regarding figures like Paul. Your critical lens on biblical texts often seems to imply a unique, exclusive insight. This makes me wonder-what is the purpose of your work? Are you guiding people closer to an understanding of God’s word and salvation, or is there another goal? As a teacher, your influence is significant. But the Bible also cautions us about teachings that stray from its inspired truth. I’m curious, is your current approach truly helping people draw closer to God, or is it more about presenting your distinct perspective? Please help us understand your vision for this path, and please explain what you are trying to achieve. Thank you.

[@Hambone3773]

He is not a follower of orthodox Christianity anymore. But he is still a biblical scholar so he still knows his source material very well. So he has no desire to defend or reinforce traditional doctrine. He is into critical theory.

[@samersalka8852]

Great presentation, Dr. Tabor It resonates extremely well with the teachings of Islam It is so sad that the original Jesus movement was crushed by both rogue Jewish clergy and pagan Romans, then Trinitarian Christians But seemed to experience a revival of ideology, six centuries later among their brethren in Paran, and now a dwelling in one fourth of the world population

[@Hambone3773]

That's a wild take. Crushed by? Why would you assume Islam some 600 years later has a better understanding of the Jesus movement than the first century disciples who actually wrote the New Testament portions of the Bible?

[@happytofu5]

Dear James, I like your videos, but please reconsider the usage of AI images. Their creation is unethical since the developers took artwork without consent to create a technology that is not putting artist out of jobs. Nothing against progress, but taking people's work unasked and throwing said people under the bus is not cool. Thanks for reading.

[@notanemoprog]

"not" *now No artist worth their salt will lose their job to AI garbage. Nobody using AI "art" now was willing to pay artists before, and will not pay them now if AI art becomes unavailable. Also "took artwork without consent" is nonsensical. It's like complaining that people see artwork made by others, analyze it learn it dissect it and the way it was made, and that then influences the way they themselves produce their images.

[@wolfblaide]

​@notanemoprog ​I think pretty much everyone disagrees with you on this, unless they have a vested interest. We've already seen good artists lose their jobs. A lot of corporations have already layed off their in house artists, and use AI instead, for example. And yes, copying other people's work is copying/stealing. Doesn't matter how you phrase it.

[@tbishop4961]

​@@wolfblaideall artists are inspired by other people's work. That isn't stealing If I work all year to plant a beautiful flower garden that nobody would have ever paid me to come see and a passerby is inspired by it to make a famous painting, did he steal from me?🥴

[@wolfblaide]

@@tbishop4961 Inspiration is not the same thing. The AI is literally regurgitating a mashup of the artists' works it analyzed. AI of this form, by it's very nature, isn't using inspiration, it's direct copying. And for the AI to learn, it needs to be trained on direct copies of the art, i.e. a 1:1 copy. The analysis process is legally and ethically a minefield. BTW, the term 'AI' is not really correct for these kind of computer models. It gives the impression that more is happening than there actually is behind the scenes, that there is some form of transformation of the art. Sure the computer models are complex, but there's no innovation or intuition happening, it's just replicating what it's been given.

[@tbishop4961]

@@wolfblaide wrong

[@Jethro-b3f]

Ever look into William Whiston's Primitive Christianity Revived? Vol 4 gets into a long writing in the Greek about Simon vs' Peter. Also in Vol 5 is what is called "The Constitutions of the Holy Apostles" which is a longer and more detailed form of what is already passed around in the mainstream ..but apparently this longer form Whiston claims was Apostolic, and genuine.

[@gjhigle77]

That ai image of white people definitely threw up some flags for me

[@ziploc2000]

Especially the apparent use of hair products by the guy in the foreground.

[@KennisRussellMusic]

Throws up flags for ai. Ai only generates on what it has knowledge of. Some of these ai models need to be feed more “Non-European” depictions of Biblical figures. The problem is there is a boat load of preserved European depictions in art that far out way other ethnic depictions, so ai skews it this way when it generates images.

[@nothinghere1996]

Paul was a fraud, and Jesus knew it, spoke of it to Paul directly and it was included as a quote in Pauls own writing. Paul was so dense, he didn't get the gibe. You don't know enough James. Eyes blinded by doubt.

[@robusc4940]

""spoke of it to Paul"" can you list the verses and do we also reject Luke & Acts since Luke also confirmed the role of Paul ?

[@nothinghere1996]

@@robusc4940 2 thessalonians 2:7 kjv, Luke i don't know. really only pay attention to both moses and Jesus as no one else matters, except as a witness.

[@robusc4940]

​@@nothinghere1996 Acts 9:10-15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles," Acts 14:14 "Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul," Is Luke who wrote Acts lying about Paul being an Apostle ? If so, then do we also mistrust anything else that Luke wrote in Luke & Acts ?

[@nothinghere1996]

@@robusc4940 i do not know about Acts. it has many mistakes, it's all hearsay, and jesus doesn't speak. I am only interested in quoted speach of Moses and Jesus. Real words, not the the mind of anyone else, as that mind is still human. i suspect what happened after his death and ressurection would be mayhem.

[@robusc4940]

@@nothinghere1996Is Luke lying about the words of Jesus in Acts 9:4-16, Acts 26:14-18?

[@babisbabinos8075]

Debunked: You said Paul was accused for being against the law. But Paul himself said that he was only talking about non-Jews. And not about the ten commandments, but about the Mosaic Law. He also said that we have to work on our salvation and that just because we are saved, it doesn’t mean we can just sin. 4:54 "We do not deem him a god", they are talking about false Christs. Not about Paul. Paul always claimed to be a servant and gave his life to God, Jesus. They are talking about magicians like in the days of Elijah, not about Paul. 5:06 ",by their fruits you will know them". Ok, talk to us about the fruits of Paul. 5:58 Never did Paul say that Christ is for him alone. What he said is that God chose him to share many things with us. 6:20 If it is something serious, of course they disregard the Holy Spirit. 8:15 Of course you have to believe those things, but those things are not for all of humanity but for the Jews. 10:10 The lord our God will raise up a prophet like Moses, but what you don't consider is the divine eternal nature of the Messiah. 10:50 But Jesus also said that Satan wouldn't go against his kingdom. So when Paul was on his way to persecute Christians, why would this miracle happen to him to make him a Christian? When was Paul against the Ten commandments? When was Paul against Jews keeping the Mosaic Law? 13:18 So why did Paul appeal to the Old Testament and to what he learned from the disciples and the 500 that he implied he knew instead of just himself. And why would people trust him with those letters? 13:44 Again, let's talk about the fruits of Paul. 15:15 Doesn't the Old Testament say God will judge the nations? Is Jesus the eternal judge, a king that was not from our world? See the trinity yet? 17:30 Didn't God want to seperate the Israelites from the rest of the pagan nations in Old Testament? It was so that they wouldn't do similar things to them that lead to idolatry and they would remember their old life. If you read history, you will see that that there are so many man-made laws in Torrah that even Jesus recognized it. That's why he was only talking about the divine law, his law(divinity claim) that imcludes the ten commandments and he also mentioned two laws (golden laws) that summarize the 10 and focus on love. 17:55 How does that logically follow? Didn't they say that meat was given to us because the plantation has been destroyed? About the Sabbath, Jesus said that we will enter God’s rest by believing in him, so there is not need to follow the Sabbath the old way, but that truth disciples, follow him every day. Jesus ate fish, vegetables, drank wine and most likely he also ate meat! 24:15 Why don't we have this verse anywhere? Jesus ate in various houses and we for sure know he ate fish. 25:35 That's it, they are not coherent historically. Except if they are talking about fasting and not about eating meat altogether. 27:00 Jesus repeatedly drunk wine, he also paralleled the wine with his blood and he said that he is the vein. People accuse Paul for inventing things when he uses the Old Testament to prove Jesus again and again. I think we should stop seeing things that aren't there and read the texts in context? In which century were those texts that you shared with us written?

[@PistisAdelphos]

The word of God is a self contained book. It proves itself for anyone who is born again. Everyone on earth could die and lose all information about history, and someone can come along with no knowledge of history, and grab a Bible and once they understand it, history itself is irrelevant. The point is to get the Holy Spirit and let the Spirit teach you what the Bible means. This is why scribes(scholars) will never be able to understand it. It literally requires the spirit to discern what it actually says. Isaiah 8:15-16 KJV - And many among them shall stumble, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken. Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples. The Torah was sealed. Jesus was the cornerstone who came to unseal for his disciples, meaning his learned people chosen and led by the indwelling Spirit. So Jesus fulfilled the prophecy. And this was the point. Isaiah 28:9-13 KJV - Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken. The way this ways going to go down was by speaking in Tongues, which is prophesying in Parabolic style speech. and Jesus explains and paul reveals about the prophecy. Isaiah 6:9-11 KJV - And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not. Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed. Then said I, Lord, how long? And he answered, Until the cities be wasted without inhabitant, and the houses without man, and the land be utterly desolate, Matthew 13:10-15 KJV - And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand. And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive: For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them. Pay attention to what Jesus says here, this is the reason why paul had to explain this in 1 cor 14. 1 Corinthians 14:2 KJV - For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. 1 Corinthians 14:21-22 KJV - In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe. The speaking of mysteries in a way hard to understand is exactly what Jesus was doing to fulfill prophecy, and it's part of what we do until his return and the gifts are perfected. And paul explains that the church carrying on this legacy is part of the fulfillment in the Gentiles church as the prophecy says men of other tongues, and in context to Isaiah prophecy, they will speak the word of God in their own languages. Because it says men of other tongues speaking the word of the Lord precept upon precept line upon line here a little there a little, because it was written like that to seal it lol. These clowns don't get it. I hope you understand and can see. And be honest and pray to the spirit for revelation on this. Another Example of God's spoken word as parables is ezekiel 20. Ezekiel 20:45-49 KJV - Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying, Son of man, set thy face toward the south, and drop thy word toward the south, and prophesy against the forest of the south field; And say to the forest of the south, Hear the word of the LORD; Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will kindle a fire in thee, and it shall devour every green tree in thee, and every dry tree: the flaming flame shall not be quenched, and all faces from the south to the north shall be burned therein. And all flesh shall see that I the LORD have kindled it: it shall not be quenched. Then said I, Ah Lord GOD! they say of me, Doth he not speak parables? Stone cold facts. Can't beat the word of God.

[@PistisAdelphos]

I should also add the proof Jesus came to unseal the law for his chosen is in mark 4. Mark 4:34 KJV - But without a parable spake he not unto them: and when they were alone, he expounded all things to his disciples. Expounded here is important look at the Greek G1956 - epilyō ἐπιλύω Transliteration: epilyō Pronunciation: ep-ee-loo'-o Part of Speech: verb Root Word (Etymology): From ἐπί (G1909) and λύω (G3089) TDNT Reference: 4:337,543 Outline of Biblical Usage: to unloose, untie to clear (a controversy), decide, settle to explain (what is obscure and hard to understand) He unties/unseals the meaning for his people through the Holy Spirit as proof. Because only the prophets can give legitimate revelation consistent with prophecy. John 16:12-13 KJV - I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. Paul was legit. He was fulfilment of the person from Hab 2. Habakkuk 2:2-4 KJV - And the LORD answered me, and said, Write the vision, and make it plain upon tables, that he may run that readeth it. For the vision is yet for an appointed time, but at the end it shall speak, and not lie: though it tarry, wait for it; because it will surely come, it will not tarry. Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith. If you read the rest of the description if fits paul to a tee. Look at all of Paul's writings he blasphemed against the church but then was sent to Graft in gentiles. Habakkuk 2:5 KJV - Yea also, because he transgresseth by wine, he is a proud man, neither keepeth at home, who enlargeth his desire as hell, and is as death, and cannot be satisfied, but gathereth unto him all nations, and heapeth unto him all people: Acts 26:12-19 KJV - Whereupon as I went to Damascus with authority and commission from the chief priests, At midday, O king, I saw in the way a light from heaven, above the brightness of the sun, shining round about me and them which journeyed with me. And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest. But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee; Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee, To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me. Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision: Here a little there a little. Habakkuk 2:6 KJV - Shall not all these take up a parable against him, and a taunting proverb against him, and say, Woe to him that increaseth that which is not his! how long? and to him that ladeth himself with thick clay! Thick clay is heavy debts, and he definitely increased his authority in the church to upset his own people. Romans 11:13-14 KJV - For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office: If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them. Romans 1:14 KJV - I am debtor both to the Greeks, and to the Barbarians; both to the wise, and to the unwise. His being in heavy debt means he has heavy obligations due to his persecution against God's people. Acts 8:3 KJV - As for Saul, he made havock of the church, entering into every house, and haling men and women committed them to prison. 1 Timothy 1:12-13 KJV - And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry; Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief. Habakkuk 2:3 KJV - For the vision is yet for an appointed time, but at the end it shall speak, and not lie: though it tarry, wait for it; because it will surely come, it will not tarry. Prophecy says the person will delay but will come and not lie. Meaning paul didn't lie about meeting the Lord. Galatians 1:20 KJV - Now the things which I write unto you, behold, before God, I lie not. Here a little there a little. Isaiah 28:11 KJV - For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.

[@brianphillips5576]

Could you state your beliefs up front? The average listener is confused on the basis of this video. Are you saying Paul was an evil man and false prophet who gave clearity to christian doctrine or is he the ambassador in chains who suffered for Christ work? I know using language of the trade helps the professor but enen Jesus helped the hearing to understand the point for the average listener. You quote a bishop that was the leader of a group of churches. In clements writings, we see Paul was used by satan to confuse the faith. I see then, we can not trust any words from the orgaized new testament. Since this christian faith, according to Jesus' words, requires trust in the Father... then let's ask the Father for the truth. The Holy Spirit will lead the true child of God into the light.

[@Hambone3773]

He is an historian and textual scholar who is no longer an orthodox Christian. He is analyzing texts as neutrally as possible but within his hypothesis that there were many Christianities in the first century and that the Pauline version won out over time not because it was inspired by God but because of cultural factors. But what he is doing is showing that this Clementine letter is a pseudopigraphic document written by an Ebionite follower of Jesus some time after 100AD. The purpose of the letter is to oppose Pauline Christianity using Simon Magus as a stand-in for Paul.

[@brianphillips5576]

@Hambone3773 just like most secular scholars... they are not to be trusted. There are no standards for the ungodly. Why should there be? There are no consequences, they think. A darwinian eveolutionist believes that random systems were the foundations of the Rna dna codes of all life. In spite of the 21st century, scientic studies in cellular biology. This is why so much of the social studies and scientific research papers are showing high amounts of scholarly fraud today. When a person thinks in their heart that there is no God to fear and love... they begin to die spiritually. This death is not decerned by the intellect. But it involves the soul... the mind will and emotions. If you lose your soul or psychi... you become irrational. Mental health is the big industry worldwide because of the irrational fears and anxieties the average God hater is experiencing. An honest person will at least ask God to show Himself if He's real and reveal His ways. Then, hold on like a roller-coaster ride. Because God promises to draw near to the one who seeks Him. Nothing like tapping into the source that can heal the spirit and soul. Otherwise, you are what your morals lead you. A person's morality dictates their theology.

[@longcastle4863]

You have a misunderstanding about what it is historians, including biblical historians, do. They are not about bolstering one’s faith or discrediting it, but understanding the context, reasons and meanings of specific historical documents. What professor Tabor is doing here is no different than what a historian does examining ancient documents pertaining to Zoroastrianism or the penal system in 12th century Carolingian France.

[@bobirving6052]

@longcastle4863 Well said. Thanks for explaining.

[@Hambone3773]

It's a good thing Pauline teachings won out. How burdensome otherwise.

[@forYAHSglory]

Since my comments don't work on the other thread I will try here. Paul saying evil to one group and saying right to another doesn't change the evil. Paul does say Jesus is of the seed of David but he also said he's not human and that is antichrist. Paul is double minded and a people pleaser and Jesus condemned that behavior.

[@bobirving6052]

@Hambone3773 Hahaha. Yes!! It’s so awesome that the antichrist won and many worship the beast because otherwise we would be burdened by pleasing god and living righteously 😅 So glad Paul won so now we can all take the wide path which leads to destruction. We can just follow the man of lawlessness! 🥳

[@koreyoneal2623]

I enjoy your lectures James but I think that you are way too leinient towards Paul and rather naive to his devices , not realizing that he spoke from both sides of his mouth , a typical people pleaser like his Herodian kinsman

[@Hambone3773]

He's an historian and textual critic. It's not his job to be lenient or hard on Paul.

[@koreyoneal2623]

@Hambone3773 but he IS lenient towards Paul , it's like he always gives him a free pass

[@Hambone3773]

@koreyoneal2623 his only job is to explain Pauline theology accurately or describe the history accurately not critique the value thereof.

[@koreyoneal2623]

@Hambone3773 I'm not trying to cut him down so relax , I enjoy his lectures , I just have a problem with how he treats Paul and I'm aloud to have an opinion too , I've shared it , now move please

[@Hambone3773]

@@koreyoneal2623 you are definitely aloud

[@allenbrininstool7558]

I don’t appreciate you people opposing the teaching of Paul

[@GwynWilliams-rg8vb]

Then don't watch it

[@forYAHSglory]

Paul is rejected by Jesus. Paul is called antichrist by John. Maybe you should look to the god Paul teaches. It's not the GOD of Abraham and Jesus.

[@bobirving6052]

@allenbrininstool7558 Haha, good one. At first I thought you said “I don’t appreciate you people exposing the words of Paul”! 😂 The wolf wants to continue without his next victims being alerted.

[@jamesdawson4800]

So many people trying to discredit Paul and lying about his gospel. They are deceivers and a false teachers. I hope they reads this and repent and turn back to the truth of the gospel...which Paul told the truth about!

[@hjelsethak]

did you even do the homework?

[@iguanapoolservice1461]

Im a believer and i don’t need Paul to be saved, only Jesus/Yeshua

[@Cr-pj8bz]

You follow Paul instead of Jesus, Paul instead of God, Paul instead of the apostles. Someone who never met Jesus once. He is the false apostle of Rev 2 2.

[@longcastle4863]

Paul took a failed apocalyptic prophet and made a religion out of him. Give him a little credit.

[@jamesdawson4800]

​@@iguanapoolservice1461obviously. Paul said to follow him as he follows messiah.

[@markdavidson9720]

If you want the truth read the Quran !

[@iguanapoolservice1461]

😂 ok let’s follow a wicked false prophet who married a 9 year old and also took married slaves as wives and even his own adopted sons wife… sure why not!!!

[@JonJaeden]

​@@iguanapoolservice1461You weren't supposed to read that part ...

[@carlanderson2468]

Why, the Quran says in Surah 2:40-43 that the Bible is good enough, also Surah 4:136, I'm good.

[@stephenmcqually2983]

About what?

[@na.ty.ka.]

@@iguanapoolservice1461have you read it?

[@yerpyaboy]

Dr James no offense they were taking over the congregation again because they were Levites Exodus 4:10-14. The Pharisees the Sadducees and the essians had no right to be Temple priest in the first place. So they were taking back their levitical priesthood and the scriptures for Hebrews did not accept the talamud upon the return from Babylon. As Josephus sites in his own writings " against Apiron " chapter 8 verses 6 through 9. Where he states upon the return the Hebrews who stayed did not accept the talamud and their book for it did not have a successor of profits or to who wrote the scripture. Therefore they did not deem it equivalent as the "book of old".

[@tbishop4961]

Lol. Total nonsense

[@nothinghere1996]

@@yerpyaboy you are spot on. Jesus was a High priest, and he knew they stole the religion.

[@nothinghere1996]

@@tbishop4961 it's 100%. Numbers 1-, Numbers 3.12-13 and Joshua 19.51. Only Levites High priests may teach about God. ❤️

[@tbishop4961]

@@nothinghere1996 😂

[@nothinghere1996]

@@tbishop4961 the Machiach cannot just be from Judah from the house of David, as the Machiach he must know scripture and only Levites have this role, Numbers 3.12-13, Joshua 19.51. To be fluent in the meaning of the bible, he must be a Levite High priest. He cannot be from both tribes, except by recognition of bloodline by the mother, and Levites are not on the list in Numbers 1 for this reason.