Steam Trains and Cold War Conspiracies: The Legend of the Strategic Reserve

[@liamtahaney713]

I like that the railway enthusiasts' attention for detail both birthed and disproved the conspiracy

[@ttaibe]

The real enthusiasts found the mistakes that indicated there is indeed a conspiracy. Those mistakes were subsequently fixed by government plants masquerading as enthusiasts. Wake and smell the coal.

[@t.bfisher5855]

I just feel that is just poetic irony 😂😂

[@ttaibe]

@@t.bfisher5855 It is, i was just joking.

[@hb1338]

People with an eye for detail (I am one such person) often it hard to understand that lesser mortals very rarely bother to dot their i's, cross their t's or even check their lists of information.

[@ilaser4064]

10:16 ??? 🤣

[@SmallBlogV8]

"Not only did they think it could be true, but they _wanted_ it to be true." That, IMO, is why any given conspiracy theory takes off.

[@rolandayers6726]

Sometimes they take off by virtue of being (in whole or part) true. These days the term 'conspiracy theory' gets used as a thought-terminating cliché to dismiss inconvenient truths, including those detailed in publicly available official government reports that governments hope no one will bother to read.

[@smorris12]

Exactly this

[@hb1338]

.. and also why almost every conspiracy theory includes a large dose of the exotic.

[@stevebrown3559]

@@hb1338 and an EXTRA large dose of the idiotic...

[@markholdsworth3486]

The trouble with poo-pooing all 'conspiracy theories' is you seem to suggest that there are no conspiracies. Which I doubt.

[@Zeppflyer]

When you first said "Strategic Steam Reserve", I pictured a cave containing a ten story tea kettle under a cozy that required the combined efforts of every grannie in the Home Counties to create.

[@joeyoung431]

There's a spectacular alternate history waiting to be written about a secret second rail network and the vital role it played in countering a terrible threat the mid-century British government kept under wraps - a sort of trainspotting Jonathan Strange and Mister Norrell. Design oddities in certain models arise from their need to fulfil certain roles; certain lines exist because it was necessary to get them to certain parts of the country; engineers and designers are unsung heroes of desperate missions. It could be played for laughs, or tremendously straight. Maybe this story could take the form of an intermittent series by a KZbinr with a large collection of images and footage of Britain's existing and historical rail networks in action. If only we knew of such a person...

[@REDARROW_A_Personal]

In Sweden they made a documentary called the Onset of Darkness. Which is about Russia invading Sweden during a Cold War gone Hot senario and uses a mix of Archival and Acted Out Footage.

[@a11oge]

a sort of Dr Strangelove with trains. JH can play all the Peter Sellers roles.

[@jackiespeel6343]

The name Yerkes would somehow be incorporated (possibly along with other key names).

[@a11oge]

@@jackiespeel6343 he would be Dr Strangelove himself

[@SportyMabamba]

@@a11oge🏆

[@DR.NIMROD]

i had the pleasure of rescueing the very last reserve steam engine from its hidden shed in sweden a few years ago. that engine has now been restored to full working order.

[@REDARROW_A_Personal]

Do you have a video of it? Maybe some pictures?

[@vickielawless]

Isn't that the Riddles Austerity 90733 at Keighley?

[@DR.NIMROD]

@@REDARROW_A_Personal i have pictures of it somewhere and videos of the second to last steam engine being pulled out of the shed excist on youtube. i will endevour to post the videos here soon.

[@DR.NIMROD]

@@vickielawless dont know about the engines in the video but the one i helped rescue is called e2 955. google it.

[@michi9575]

​@@REDARROW_A_Personal The video is from Eisenbahnromantik and is called expedition Santräsk or so

[@tjmfarming9584]

We had a steam reserve down under in my home state of Western Australia. Mind you it wasn’t because of the threat of nuclear Armageddon, rather it was in the event of an oil crisis, the WAGR (that’s the Western Australian Government Railway to those outside of Australia) set aside several locomotives at locations such as the workshops in Midland, the coal powerhouse of Collie, and a few other places too. Unfortunately this never came to fruition and at least a good 1/3 of those locomotives were cut up. But a good few of the Collie examples survive today.

[@MinimumGauge]

I completely forgot this was a thing till just now. I remember hearing rumours about this sort of thing when I was young in the 90's. Even if we were to keep a reserve it wouldn't be all these eclectic rare types, it wouldn't make sense. They would of been BR standards, 8F/9F and the austerity engines anyway. It's always fun to speculate though.

[@stephencope7178]

I heard this around the same time. The U.S. were depositing cruise missiles at various places. I heard that Charwelton tunnel on the ex Great Central was one such location for a number of Austerity 2-8-0 locomotives, to be used in the event of a nuclear war. . .strange how these rumours spread!! 🤔

[@bussesandtrains1218]

Maybe b1s and bullieds if you were lucky

[@MajesticTrains]

I've heard the theory that the preservation scene itself was the strategic steam reserve too, without them realising it. It would make sense after all, as the government wouldn't have had to put the time and money into keeping locos running when volunteers do it anyway, they could just be requisitioned in the event of war.

[@josephteller9715]

Yes, hiding the reserve in plain sight and getting other people to do the work of maintenance as volunteers....

[@freddiespreckley6324]

They also have the advantages of being dispersed around the country, meaning that any one bomb couldn't destroy them all, and of being largely located on old, out of the way, branch lines, which were of such low strategic value that they were closed, meaning they would be unlikely to be specifically targeted, increasing the chances of survival.

[@bassetdad437]

It would be a logistical nightmare operating away from their home sheds. Apart from Black 5s and some GWR most locos are one offs.

[@kildrummer]

The ultimate example of hiding in plain sight.

[@rolandayers6726]

Like Dad's Army in reverse, i.e. the recruits DIDN'T think they were doing something useful.

[@Reddsoldier]

I think that the whole preservation movement itself would be the best way to disguise a strategic reserve if you ask me. What better way to ensure locomotives are used, kept in working order and have people who know how to use them?

[@jimthorne304]

What's always struck me as improbable about the whole 'strategic reserve' story is that the entire infrastructure to operate mainline steam has been removed, so these locos couldn't be coaled, watered, oiled, maintained, or even crewed. Incidentally, we have no coal either....

[@beeble2003]

There was plenty of coal around in the 1960s and 1970s. The mass infrastructure for steam locomotives had been removed, but it's possible to run them without that, as you see with today's heritage railways and mainline steam specials. Sure, it's much less efficient than having that infrastructure, but it's better to have some trains running inefficiently than to have none at all. (Somebody else made the same argument about today's electrical signalling systems. Same argument applies -- you can run trains without signals, just inefficiently.)

[@katrinabryce]

We did have lots of coal up until Thatcher closed the mines.

[@williamhall667]

@@katrinabryce There were still many pits open even in the 2000s in Nottinghamshire, a couple in Derbyshire and another few around Doncaster. The last two only closed less than 10 years ago. Nevermind Blair's government shut down more pits nationally than thatcher did. All so we could import so called cleaner coal from Russia.

[@beeble2003]

@@katrinabryce It's almost like I said "in the 1960s and 1970s"...

[@beeble2003]

@@williamhall667 "Nevermind Blair's government shut down more pits nationally than thatcher did." Er, that's not even close to true. 115 mines were closed while Thatcher was Prime Minister, according to Wikipedia. There weren't anything like 115 mines left in the country by the time Blair became PM. Furthermore, they were privately owned by then, so the government didn't close any of them. According to the statistics of the Northern Mine Research Society, the following 18 mines closed while Blair was PM: Ashfordby, North Selby (1997); Monktonhall, Silverdale, Whitemoor (1998); Calverton (1999); Annesley/Bentinck (2000); Longannet, Prince of Wales (2002); Betws, Clipstone (2003); Gascoigne Wood Drift, Riccall, Stillingfleet, Wistow (2004); Ellington (2005); Harworth, Rossington (2006).

[@axelhejnebo9142]

Interestingly, the last steam engines of the strategic reserve in Sweden were only taken out of storage and into preservation during the 2010s there is even a video on youtube from one of the last expiditions to retrieve a couple of engines from a shed in the north of Sweden.

[@iaingardener9268]

The mistake we made in hoping for a strategic reserve was believing that government policy towards the railways in the 1960s was cogent and rational

[@MatecaCorp]

I have found that the majority of conspiracy theories tend to be coping mechanisms for government incompetence lol

[@fairweathercyclist]

This has reminded me of the stories my dad would tell me back in the 70s about the alleged strategic reserve in a tunnel under a hill near Neath in South Wales. This tunnel was supposed to contain ALL the ex-GWR Grange class locos which would apparently explain why none got preserved.

[@iankemp1131]

Certainly I saw a version in a club magazine around 1980 and it looked plausible then. The "missing" locos were said to be Granges, Black 5s, 8Fs and 9Fs, which are sensible multi-purpose engines to keep. Not just in case of a nuclear exchange, but if our oil supplies got cut off - we had plenty of coal mines then. So one could reasonably imagine a government planning in this way. But evidently they didn't!

[@chriscalkin1735]

There's nothing conspiratorial about soldiers training on heritage railways. The Army has its own railway trade which is mostly reservists, but some regulars too and the heritage scene provides places to train without disrupting the National Network. Back in the day, as a logistics instructor, I made use of the heritage sector whenever possible.

[@josephturner7569]

I was a train driver. I was also in the RAuxAF. At a Reserve Forces exercise at Horley Lake I met the Railway Operating section of the RLC. One of my mates mentioned what I did for a living. They wouldn't stop trying to recruit me. But I didn't fancy being a soldier.

[@bassetdad437]

The heritage sector always made use of the Army as much as possible too. The heritage railway I volunteered on and later worked on had several workers who were also TA volunteers doing annual camps on the army railway.

[@michaeljohnson9421]

The army actually had its own railway for many years, for training troops in rail operations. It was the Longmoor Military Railway, in Hampshire. Quite an odd line because it wasn't built for any kind of real-life transport need, so it didn't really go anywhere. It closed in 1969 and the locomotives ended up on heritage railways. The biggest and best known is the 2-10-0 Austerity loco Gordon,. now on the Severn Valley Railway.

[@gilles111]

The same in The Netherlands, there is a part of the ground troops which are specified in building tracks, bridges etc. and they do also sometime co operational projects with heritage railways. So the can train about laying tracks and replace a bridge and the railway gets a great work done for almost free. At the end of WW2, the British did a great job in The Netherlands by building several railway lines across the country which were after the build for military transports but many are used for years after the war. Dutch Railways did also buy some locomotives of the British arme for use in the first years after the war.

[@hairyairey]

So basically Jago Tornado is our strategic reserve now? Which is going to have problems getting south of Peterborough soon. In fact almost all signalling is electronic now, electro-mechanical relays being phased out. Which is a shame as they would survive an EMP. Then again, getting electricity at all would be tricky.

[@Alex-cw3rz]

One of the other reasons why Steam reserves existed, is because compared to early electric and diesel Locomotives, steam locos were actually easier to maintain as they could run even when quite a lot of stuff is broken or damaged. It was why industrial Locomotives in the UK were often Steam even after steam Locomotives had been got rid of on the main line (plus cheaper to rent and run).

[@azzifyy5988]

They might be easier to maintain in the sense that everything is mechanical but they're also more expensive to maintain, they're definitely not cheaper to run and they have a much lower tractive effort because Diesels tend to be all wheel drive. Steam locomotives were used in the 60s simply because at the time BR had bought a huge range of different diesel locomotives and the majority of them didn't work at all or as well as advertised. Dieselisation was a disaster for BR but in today steam loses out in almost every way. The diesels that did work were very successful in taking over from steam for example the class 55 Deltics taking over from the A4 Pacifics on the London to Edinburgh journey and reducing the journey time even though the A4 got priority over other traffic while the class 55 did not.

[@sbisson]

Rian Hughes' novel The Black Locomotive mixes London psychogeography with science fiction, with the Strategic Steam Reserve a key part of the plot, the climax of which is a late night dash on a black SR Lord Nelson class from Box to the Crossrail tunnels at Paddington (all in the hands of a secret society of train enthusiasts!).

[@michaelwright2986]

Obviously, for all those who needed to know, the plans for running the Strategic Reserve rail network were available in heavily encoded form in books published under the name of W. Awdry.

[@ToastedAlmond98]

I know you probably say this in jest, but I've actually read at least one bit of fan-fiction which posits that Thomas and his comrades were spared the cutter's torch because they were intended to form the basis of an SSR should the worst have happened (presumably supplemented by preserved and industrial mainland engines). I think it's a pretty fun concept - if a little morbid - but it arguably has about as many flaws as all the theories about a British SSR. I suspect that had such a Reserve actually existed, it would most likely have been made up of as few different classes as possible, and all of relatively modern design (I believe the Swedish and Soviet SSRs were assembled on this logic). Certainly nothing like the band of misfits, one-offs and oddities staffing the railways of Sodor! [I seem to recall that bit of fan-fiction addressing this issue with a scene where the Fat Controller had loads of Standards and Austerities foisted on him by BR.]

[@duck1946]

I was a fireman/second man working out of KX in the 60.s, we had a few ex Scottish footplatestaff who came south after being made redundant, i can remember this topic as "canteen gosip",but these guys spoke of taking 8F,9F and black5's to one or two naval yards for storage in the early to mid 60's, they only went as far as the dockyard gates the MOD then moved the locos inside.They dont remember bringing any scrap trains out.

[@musoseven8218]

I'd heard similar too👍✌️

[@andrewemery4272]

Proof, if proof were needed, that railway enthusiasts live in their own fantasy world.

[@jchinuk]

A fascinating video as usual, while the UK may not have had a strategic reserve, NATO certainly did and one of those locos (a BR52 'Kreigslok' named '"Peer Gynt") used to be a the Bressingham Museum. I can't add a photo of the explanation plaque, but the gist is here :- "This German-built Class 52 2-10-0 locomotive No. 5865 was first produced in 1937. The class were know as "Kriegslok" - literally War Locomotive'. They were simple and sturdily built and proved to be very reliable machines. Over 8,000 were built - larger than any other class of locomotive and they saw service all over Europe. For the technical minded, the locomotive has two cylinders 600mm x 660 stroke. The coupled wheel diameter is 1.4 metres and the firegrate area is 3.9 square metres - the size of the latter was such that many were converted to mechanical screw firing or to oil burning. The working pressure is 15.5 atmospheres, producing a tractive effort 50,172 Ibs at its drawbar. The locomotive weighs 136 tons and is 23 feet high. The dimensions are such that it could not work on British railway lines (even though they shared the same track gauge) as it would foul bridges and platforms etc. No. 5865 went to Norway during the war and at the end of the war it was taken over by the Norwegian State Railways and named "Peer Gynt". It was taken out of service in the early 1950s. That was not, however, the end of the story as this locomotive and many others of this type were overhauled in 1953 using NATO funds and placed in tunnels as "War Maintenance Reserve" for use if ever NATO needed to operate railways in a war emergency situation. They were largely forgotten until 1972, when this example was discovered in a sealed tunnel and Alan Bloom (the late founder of Bressingham Steam Museum) bought it to add to the collection. It was steamed on a number of occasions but when the boiler reached the end of its certification period, the projected overhaul costs were found to be prohibitive. Unfortunately too, the locomotive's boiler was lagged in asbestos which nowadays has to be removed by specialist contractors and this operation alone will cost in excess of £30,000." I have no idea if it's still there, but it was reasonably well-preserved. I have no idea if any other survived, but they were still running in Germany on mainlines into the 70s. By the way, the Electro Magnetic Pulse from a nuclear detonation only really affects modern electronics, valves are usually immune, which is why the old Soviet military persisted with valves long after NATO went 'solid state'.

[@chrislaarman7532]

Regarding survival of Baureihe 52 engines: I think that every preservation railway on the Continent that wanted one has got one (ot two). They were in service in the GDR until (about) the end of steam, many of them modernised and renumbered to subseries BR52.80. - There is even one in Switzerland that has been upgraded to a demonstration project. (I can't quickly find the number, some 52 81xx, but I have seen here here on KZbin.)

[@andrewcumming7769]

Not the only 1933-1945 German that'd find a place in NATO eh? I've seen one in the UK on the Nene Valley Railway, not sure if they've ever steamed it though

[@chrislaarman7532]

Actually, the Class 52 wasn't started in 1937. Its "original", Class 50, was first built in 1939. As the need for more locomotives rose and the availability of parts sank, some of these engines were delivered while "incomplete" or "temporarily completed" (my descriptions!), and known as "Baureihe 50 ÜK" ("ÜK" short for "Übergangs Kriegsbauart": transitory war version), with the intention to bring these up to standard in due course. Other classes continued to be built, eventually also becoming affected by the war circumstances. Eventually, it was decided to concentrate all locomotive building efforts on a single type, based on this light freight class 50. This "austerity" version of the class 50 was the class 52. Its construction should require as little resources (of materials and manpower) as possible. There is a video here on KZbin (a Nazi propaganda movie, likely in German, probably embedded in other related videos) showing how they did that. After WW2, West-Germany could afford to phase the class 52 out rather soon. The GDR couldn't, so there the class 52 got updates and remained in service till roughly the end of steam in the GDR and of the GDR itself. - Oh yes: all factories capable were included in the effort, including those in occupied territories. After the war, the liberated countries revindicated the engines built by factories on their soil, so Germany had to hand quite some over. By the way, the Dutch government bought quite some Austerity class locomotives from the British War Department. Engine 73755 "Longmoor" is on display in the Dutch railway museum ("Spoorwegmuseum") at Utrecht, and some WD tank engine may be active on a preservation railway here. (When you start googling, be aware that Dutch "tenderloc[omotief]" and German "Tenderlok[omotive]" refer to English "tank engine". English "tender loco[motive]" is German "Schlepptenderlok[omotive]", with no Dutch term known to me.)

[@alanmuddypaws3865]

Fascinating video! I wish it could be true. I think one reason for Finland maintaining a strategic reserve was to do with fuel. Finland has a bit of nuclear power, and some hydroelectric, but not a great deal of generating capacity. In the event of something bad happening the steam locos could be fired with wood, as they have rather a lot of trees in Finland.

[@rjs_698]

The other reason this made sense for Finland and Sweden was that they were, at the time, neutral powers. This meant they might have ended up relatively intact, with only fallout and the electromagnetic pulse to worry about, but cut off from much of their usual energy supply. In that case steam locomotives powered by wood would make a lot of sense. In the UK we would have to assume that most of our major population centres, and their associated rail infrastructure, would have gone which means a strategic reserve of steam locomotives didn't really make much sense.

[@brettpalfrey4665]

Hang on, Jago! Why would Finnish locomotives finish (sorry) up in UK, or any other country using standard gauge? Finland uses 1524 mm (5 ft in English money) not the standard 4ft 8 1/2 inches (1435mm) of George Stephenson fame...did they get refitted? or is there a Russian re-gauge secretly setup to enable Soviet trains to work on British railways after they won the Cold ( or even tepid) war? 7 out of ten, Jago, see me afterwards!! (seriously though, another brilliant video...do keep em coming!)

[@MinimumGauge]

They were going to be re-gauged by enthusiasts, which wouldn't be a problem, but they're outside the loading gauge of UK railways, which is why we have so many just kind of sat rusting in the UK.

[@brettpalfrey4665]

@@MinimumGauge Thanks for that! I didnt even consider the loading gauge! Which begs the question why bring them to the UK in the first place? Clearly more to all this than at first glance...

[@MinimumGauge]

​@@brettpalfrey4665 From what I know it was simply wishful thinking. Lawrie has a video about one that's been restored to working order where he details the basic story of one of them, I suspect it's the same story for most of them. kzbin.info/www/bejne/qJStZYGYjpaYm8k

[@glynwelshkarelian3489]

As a half Finnish and half Welsh person who likes trains: Pelasta moottori!. I cannot speak the language and have tried to get the internet to tell me how to say: 'Save the engines!' I have probably posted: "I demanded that the donkey be re-painted!! Finnish is a not an easy language.

[@paulsengupta971]

Iechyd da and kippis!

[@SamanthaWritesThings]

Fellow half-Finn checking in to confirm and give a hearty PASKA PERKELE to the beautiful yet murderously difficult Finnish language.

[@Kromaatikse]

"Moottori" would I think refer specifically to an internal-combustion engine, or maybe an electric motor. For a locomotive you want "veturi" - and for the plural, "veturit".

[@jaakkomantyjarvi7515]

Well, it's close... it's as if I were to write "Achub y modur!" instead of "Achub yr injanau!"

[@jsp7202]

I can remember when the Green Goddess fire trucks came out during a firefighter's strike in the late 1970s. It surprised people that the army had held on to them and this undoubtedly fueled the rumors of a strategic reserve.

[@Kromaatikse]

Not just the '70s, they were used to cover strike action much later than that. It was noted that due to their obsolete and simplistic design, they couldn't travel anywhere near as fast as modern fire engines - but you'd rather have them than nothing at all.

[@rikkilamb]

​@@KromaatikseYes 2004

[@sumpyman]

Op Fresco covered the nationwide fire strike that happened in 2002 and I was part of it! The Green Goddesses weren’t just fire trucks, they were actually designed to provide fresh clean water to the general population after a Nuclear war. Other than put out fires, they could be used to pump water for decontamination roles, washing clothes, people and equipment and providing filtration for kitchens and hospitals. They were powered by a petrol fuelled v8 rover engine and were predominantly made of wood. Always made us chuckle that we were turning up to a fire in something much more flammable that the thing that was alight! Good times!

[@mikeprzyrembel]

Home Office not army.

[@rupep2424]

Interesting how things change. Horses, carts, canals & even steam locos are now primarily for pleasure. Maybe in a century or two people will take nostalgic trips on motorways... 🤔

[@tombaxter6228]

It was a nice idea, and probably could have been viable into the late 1970's or so, but people forget that the entire steam-age infrastructure, such as turntables and watercranes had largely been removed after steam's demise. If only BR had adopted the East German railway's idea of 'Plandampf' operations, that is, taking steam locos out of the reserve and running them in regular service to keep crews' driving skills up to date and not incidentally, make lots of money out of steam enthusiasts..

[@nomadMik]

_The Cold War ended before the World Wide Web_ - I never before considered just how close in time those two world-changing events were to each other! That fact seems likely to create its own conspiracy theory!

[@PrograError]

Well... TBH the WWW that we know it as comes as the 9/11 was about to happen... The US military already had an internal system much earlier...

[@tmorganriley]

Both in 1991, in fact: the World Wide Web went public, and the breakup of the Soviet Union. It does make a very convenient break for periodization! Though this isn't the first time: the fall of Byzantium to the Ottomans in 1453 (considered the terminal event of the European Middle Ages) happened during the middle of Gutenberg's first print run of Bibles (with street date of 1454/1455).

[@roderickmain9697]

It would make much more sense to have heritage railways use and maintain locomotives in plain sight than have a secret cache which would have to be maintained out of sight. Quite a lot of them have connections to the mainline so easy(ish) to run further affield. So - Todays strategic reserve - look - right there - merrily puffing their way through forgotten vales and picturesque scenery trying to make believe its just for tourists. ;-)

[@hb1338]

Hiding sensitive things in plain sight is much more common than many people realise.

[@ThinkingAloud]

Another location suggested was the tunnels at Heapey, Lancs, once connected to the Chorley-Blackburn line. This was possibly bolstered by the use of the exchange sidings for storing ex L&Y locos in the 1950s.

[@MrAuriga67]

If you visit the ex ROF site at Heapey, it is supposed to be abandoned, but has surprisingly new CCTV cameras all around. Tales of lorries entering the site at night, loaded with coal have been talked about. I live very local to the site, it would be easy to hide "stuff " in there. Un fortunately the track bed of the Chorley to Blackburn line has been built on rendering rail access virtually impossible.

[@ThinkingAloud]

I used to live just down the road, and can still remember when there were still rails in place inside the fence in the road at the level crossing by the rail entrance! :)

[@DaimlerSleeveValve]

The Heapey site has recently gained fresh ownership. Lots of people like to have secure underground storage. When it was controlled by BAe, I used to work with people who visited regularly. There was nowhere to hide anything bigger than an ammunition box.@@MrAuriga67

[@stewartellinson8846]

I always loved this one - a wonderfully dotty piece of wishful thinking. The Wiltshire tunnels were home to Enfield precision engineers who made Royal Enfield motorcycles and some others were later bought by a company called Rusepalm who tried to sell them on a space by space basis as a big bomb shelter around 1981; I don't know if any money changed hands but it got onto nationwide and debates about planning applications for nuclear bunkers were had in the house of commons; locals were worried about the traffic implications if "the balloon went up"! . I believe they now house the UK's largest underground wine storage facility; a strategic reserve indeed!

[@daveoftheclanburgess]

There was also an unsuccessful engine factory (Bristol Aircraft), and Ordnance Factory (munitions) and prepared space for another factory. The RAF had a secure communications centre in there until about 1993. fascinating use for an old quarry.

[@pogglefishii6807]

As 18th Assistant Undersecretary of State at the Department of Transport (Contingencies and Civil Emergencies Division), I hereby congratulate Mr Hazzard for this excellent piece of misinformation. The general public must never find the stockpile of Steam Trains, Sinclair C5’s, Segways, and certainly not that *fully functional* flying saucer we built in the early seventies (which now has Network Rail livery).

[@erik_griswold]

Glad you did not give away where you are keeping the SRN4s!

[@pogglefishii6807]

@@erik_griswoldThey’re in the old railway tunnel at Le Portel (but we don’t care who knows that since we sold them all to France in 1990).

[@fredblogs639]

Not many people know that the Network Rail flying saucer was based on an earlier Bulleid design, the drawings of which were produced at Eastleigh works. There was a secret underground (as opposed to overground) tunnel connection to the WW II aircraft factories on the adjacent Eastleigh International Airport where prototype construction began. Sadly, the flying saucer depended upon some of the technology being developed for the Leader. Thus, when the Leader was cancelled, the flying saucer project was put on hold until major scientific breakthroughs in the late 1960s made it possible to continue.

[@IgnatSolovey]

There are hundreds of rusty (or rusted out) engines stored across Russia in places called “the reserves bases” (báza zapása) for the exact same reason. Some of these bases are strictly guarded, some are less so, so most of those were documented by local rail fans in the recent three decades. Not only engines actually, but other kinds of locomotives, coaches and other railcars too. Sometimes they come back: with steam engines, the better preserved are occasionally get pulled out for restoration to function as a tourist attraction, but passenger cars, 3rd and 2nd class, that technically are write-offs, get back on track every year to form “supplementary trains” to fill up the demand for cheap train tickets to Sochi and back. Those, while technically sound as a rolling stock (Russian passenger trains are actually among the world's safest) are highly uncomfortable in comparison to proper modern ones. The layouts basically didn't change for almost a century, but, well... ill-maintained windows, barely functioning stinky toilets (of “direct drop” type, thus off-limits at stations where the train stops for more than 5 minutes), absolutely no air conditioning (air conditioners are a relatively new thing in Russian long-distance trains, maybe about 20 years, and still definitely not all carriages are equipped with those, although there is quite a progress indeed), and even the water boiler (a.k.a “titan” - and oftentimes in such cases those are still based on coal-burning stove rather than an electric heater) may not function in every car on such “supplementary” train - which is an utter disgrace, because tea in a long-distance sleeper is a must, and is a separate tradition in Russia and around (with addition of instant coffee, instant noodles and suchlike in the recent decades). For comparison, a regular sleeper train takes about 26 hours from Moscow to Sochi - bare minimum of stops, modern carriages with proper lavatories, air conditioners and even showers . A “supplementary” takes up to 44 hours, using very indirect routes and with frequent long stops. Cheap they are, but this kind of journey is not nice at all, particularly when it's over +30°C outdoors. Been there, done that. Usually these trains are full of children with parents... or without, on their way to or from summer camps. So during the day it's really noisy, and at night If you managed to avoid a children's camp on the go, you are surrounded by fat mommas with incessantly yelling babies and toddlers, beer-bellied husbands of said mommas, their in-laws, etc., all coming from the depths of the land to the seaside - at the lowest budget possible. Which doesn't prevent them from watching their favourite dumb TV shows on smartphones and tablets, particularly if the carriage is equipped with more than one or two power outlets - and without headphones.

[@eattherich9215]

Painting passengers black would be going too far even on the grounds of national security.

[@chrisrand5185]

Correct. In the event of nuclear war we were to paint ourselves white to reflect the blast!

[@eattherich9215]

@@chrisrand5185: tragic and I wonder how many people's last thought would have been 'but we did what the government told us.'?

[@nicomonkeyboy]

On a channel that is constantly interesting, this was surely one of the most fascinating videos of all. Bravo!

[@amethyst7084]

Thanks for sharing the interesting facts on the Strategic Reserve, Jago. I know we can't save everything, but it's a shame a number of these great steam engines are being left to rust away.

[@eggyboy123]

The railways of Finland are built to the Russian gauge. To use them in the UK would require major rebuilding

[@davidty2006]

Theres only 1 finnish locomotive thats operational in britain. it's in someone's back yard.

[@CTXSLPR]

Hazzard, Jago Hazzard, Agent 2-6-2 because Whyte notation cant handle the underground...

[@musoseven8218]

A good video with valid points. A Strategic Steam Reserve (SSR)? As someone who lived near to the Last Ditch, and amongst lots of overt and covert bases during Cold War 1, the government are VERY good at keeping secrets and at loosing paperwork. Then there's things like the 150 year rule etc. Eg I've seen bases disguised as farms in the UK (with thinly disguised airstrips adjacent), akin to the X-Files or similar in the US. Box Tunnel and Box Tunnel Junction? My Grandfather made me aware of such - he often kept quiet about the war, he was a professional soldier before WWII. The area around BTJ? There's still a secret base there, a DUMB, no more than a stone's throw away. In addition my grandfather test fired massive ship's guns in WW II near to that location - he was ex RA and had a lot of experience with guns he was put on "light duties" after fighting the Waffen SS and getting wounded and getting out of France via "Dunkirk". His first light duty was manning AAA in Hyde Park during the Blitz! His other light duty was test firing said ship's guns - underground! They were supported by a rail network - the whole set up was massive. Speaking with a consultant and ex Professor, circa 1996, at one of my then suppliers, who had subsidence due to mining about to swallow up their factory, he pretty much declared that most of the CW 1 DUMBs would be sold off and declared as newer versions and/or refurbished preferred DUMBs had already taken their place (he'd worked on government project in or should I write, under London). An old boss of mine, who worked in MOD civil engineering procurement, had previously told me how compartmentalisation worked when selecting and employing positively and negatively vetted contractors. Strangely as he got mid way through his last contract (after he'd tendered and selected suppliers etc) he was struck down with a mystery illness affecting his brain and he was in a coma for three months after collapsing in Whitehall. In the US? People in his position have had their memories wiped and/or "suicided". So NEVER underestimate secrecy. Also after the last three years, the PsyOp we've been through and are going through? It's not hard to see how governments and big business now operate, many ex military, with ATS clearance, now work in the private sector which isn't subject to FOI Requests etc. I'm sure that the government had a plan, steam would have been logical as little to no electricity was involved and we still had coal reserves. Plus, I've no doubt there was room for hidden storage, more room than most would think. Railheads etc would be the issue, also when being used water etc, remember in the early 1970s Alan Peglar's Flying Scotsman had to haul two tenders for that very reason (water troughs, towers, cranes all gone). I've heard stories, sightings of things other than SSR or railway related, about DUMBs and blocked off tunnels in Eg The Royal Forest of Dean - from credible first hand sources. I worked with certain military and railway assets and was made to sign the OSA. All things are possible - so I keep an open mind about a SSR. A bit like the last episode of the, at times, cheesy but fun, TV series "Ultimate Force", send out an armoured vehicle, convoy, flashing lights etc and that's the decoy, meanwhile an adapted dust-cart or Kellogg's Cornflakes artic goes the other way without fanfare carrying the ATS weapons or other ATS equipment.

[@kernicole]

I haven't read all the comments, so this question may already have been asked. Unless I'm mistaken, Finland's railways were built to the Russian 5ft gauge, so how could their locomotives run on UK rails?

[@ShadowDragon8685]

"On the other hand I could be a government plant, and this whole thing is just here to put you off the scent. I'll let you decide." Since I don't think His Majesty's Government is shoveling you the kind of cash that would buy a rail nerd's silence on the matter of a strategic steam reserve, I think not.

[@41708]

Excellent and valid points well made! If we desired to have independent means following a war of any sort then we should have kept out coal mines intact. Steam locos are not much use without coal. But we are now depending on imports of everything.

[@nixmixes770]

Nice to see the restored Nuclear Dawn mural in Brixton featured 👍.With some expert timing, it would be possible to get a shot of the mural with a steam-hauled train passing on the bridge in the background (forming the periodic round-Kent excursion trips).

[@ukmoshinist4595]

Thanks, I wondered where that was!!

[@DaveF.]

Plus - what use a fleet of steam powered trains be when you've spent years removing every coal bunker, water tower and non-electronic switch across the entire network.

[@garrymartin6474]

I was in "Threads" as an extra 👀

[@eddmorrell90]

Great video as always Jago 👍this evening I was getting a bit ratty and short tempered with life! I realised that I hadn’t had my Sundays dose of railway’s “a la jago” lol. Just thinking, if steam engines were a back up plan! Where would they get the coal from? It’s not like we can pluck it out the ground anymore 😂! Anyhoo I’m going into business making tinfoil hats! Enquires to; stickyourheadbetweenyourlegsandkissyourassgoodbye😅

[@mothmagic1]

Sadly not enough of the 9F were saved in my opinion.. Always been my favourite class.

[@anotherfreediver3639]

Agreed! Not enough freight locos of many types in fact.

[@PhillipBicknell]

Let's start a new conspiracy: 'They' worked out how to harden military vehicles to the EM pulse, so the same tech was applied to diesel engined locos.

[@ukmoshinist4595]

“Or I might just be a government plant!”😂😂 Jago Gold!!

[@Ribeirasacra]

Plus there were the Green Goddesses and other civil defence machine/infrastructure to uphold the rumour

[@ZonkerRoberts]

I've had some "strange locomotive movements late at night" but my doctor gave me pills for that.

[@petewood2350]

I like the conspiracy theory of British Rail painting passengers that fall asleep painted black.

[@tremensdelirious]

Talking about attention to detail: I did my MSc Dissertation on heritage railways. Got a 60% return on my survey of heritage railways. Average for a survey return is around 33% Guess enthusiasts just couldn’t leave the survey unanswered in the inbox

[@gilles111]

However there wasn't anything like a strategic reserve, there are a lot of railway lines which are part of the military strategic reserve. Not only in the UK but all over Europe. When you come across a line where you think "why on earth did they build this and is it still here" or lines which are kept in surprising good state however there hasn't been seen trains for years or demolition/closing never got through, great chance there is a good reason for it. The army sees the line as strategic interest and forces the government. to maintain it.

[@bruceknights8330]

Back in the day I ran the MOD network at Shoeburyness, where we were storing several hundred LU 59 stock vehicles. It was commercially very good but the military didnt really Iike their site bring cluttered up with old trains. They were always happy to book hours to my cost centre though! After a moan by a particularly irksome retired Major I told him that they were part of the mythical strategic creserve and that we would be digging tunnels to store them in. This shut him up but a few months later I was approached by a well known RAIL magazine asking for my comments about the secret underground tunnels at Shoebury. To this day, people are convinced there was a huge secret stash of lost locos at " Pigs Bay"

[@hb1338]

I hope you shopped the Major to the police for his likely breach of the Official Secrets Act.

[@bruceknights8330]

@@hb1338 I had him horse-whipped on the steps of his London club, in front of his whole household.

[@tomatotrain6692]

If you could, could you please take a look about the Finnish locomotives in britain and how they ended up there and make a video about it.

[@Ribeirasacra]

Of topic. 6:13 I thought that was Harold Shipman

[@Kromaatikse]

It's usually quite easy to identify a Finnish steam locomotive. Just look at the cylinder blocks; where you'd usually find two barrels (one for the power piston and the other for the valves), Finnish types usually have a third, which incorporates a bypass valve for efficient coasting. There's a pilot valve in the regulator which provides steam pressure to close the bypass valve when power is wanted, and that pressure leaks off when the regulator is closed, so the bypass valve opens. A less obvious feature - at least from the outside - is that Finnish locomotives were relatively early adopters of multi-jet exhausts, using a design by local engineer Kylälä. He noticed that enginemen had developed a practice of securing a bar across the exhaust nozzle inside the smokebox, to improve the draught, essentially making a crude approximation to a two-jet exhaust. He refined it to a properly engineered four-jet exhaust, keeping the total cross-section area the same as the original but increasing the surface area of the exhaust steam as it entrained smokebox gases. This was later refined further by Chapelon to make the famous Kylchap exhaust. The combination of these two features made Finnish locomotives quite advanced and efficient types, despite their obsolete-looking appearance. The latter was occasioned by the large spark arrestor built into the chimney, made necessary by the extensive use of wood fuel - Finland having no native coal reserves, but some of the densest forests on the planet. Today, Finland has several steam locomotives preserved in operating condition and used for railtours or to operate museum railways, and a decent number more in cosmetically restored condition in museums, or simply kept on station plinths. There's even some fairly large-scale models in the main booking hall of Helsinki railway station.

[@allenra530]

Direct drive diesels have the same advantage of not needing electricity to operate, but transmitting the power to the wheels in something as large as a locomotive is problematic when you consider gear trains and clutches and the like.

[@davidchilds9590]

A former RAF colleague of mine told of seeing (in the mid-60s) mothballed 8Fs and 9Fs being moved (wrapped in polythene) into underground tunnels at an munition depot where he worked. If they were stored then, it would have been a reasonable precaution at the time. My understanding was that they were removed and scrapped in the '70s, when it became apparent that (Cold War notwithstanding) bringing them back into use post-strike would be impractical.

[@andysouth6624]

I think a Nuclear War sounds a good idea, if all other forms of transport are replaced by steam trains

[@DavidWilson-hh2gn]

Optimism at least trying to run 5' guage Finnish locos on the British guage!

[@sideshow4417]

These rumors were prevalent around Heapey depot which was a storage for munitions made at ROF Chorley, never proven and highly unlikely.

[@ferky123]

When the sun does another Carrington Event we'll love having the steam engines.

[@IN_THIS_DAY_AND_AGE]

A strategic reserve of steam locomotives? Now we don't even have any coal.

[@SalvatoreBabones]

So why were there dilapidated Finnish steam locomotives in London???

[@FlyingScott]

Jago, something about this video just made me admire your efforts as a creator so much more. Your filming is of such characteristic, dare I say, charming visuals, but in being just a guy with his iPhone they are so achievable. Look at the shot of Repton for instance: Yes it is beautifully dramatic but it is also, pardon the phrase, imperfect. You either just retrieved your phone out of your pocket or you braced yourself for the drain cocks. Your hand is not as steady as with a perfectly straight tripod. Or the shot with the L&Y locos: you've said you don't like to have other people in the shot, but when it is a good shot regardless you just roll with it. You run an awesome channel, and you make the best with what you have, which as you have admitted is mostly simple amateur stuff. That's why I think you have to be one of the best. You're not someone with a crew or deep pockets, you're just a person who likes trains, like the rest of us :)

[@marvwatkins7029]

Great to see JH doing some non-tube stuff. These secret Nordic locos are like the myth of the (American) GG-1 electric locomotive stored somewhere in Britain (where it could never run anyway).

[@Kayaking_to_escape_family]

I have seen it !!! Its real !!! The strategic train reserve is under, brb there someone at the door

[@alexhamilton6188]

Military training on heritage railways was done for variety of signalling systems and block working as Bicester had basic signalling and the MOD depots ran with regulator working. Those Squadrons were 275 Rly Sqn and 79 Rly Sqn. Im ex 275 Sqn and 507 STRE.

[@NickRatnieks]

The military kept stocks of stuff- for example engines and spares for the "Green Goddess" fire tenders and a number of years ago, the spares were sold off- so owners of old Bedford lorries and buses had a spares bonanza. You show that Army J-94 Austerity Royal Engineer in your film and if there was a steam reserve then why not store them on the Longmoor Military Railway in Hampshire which closed in 1969 and was run by the Royal Engineers. This was a big complex and I visited it a few times- not least a weekend cadet camp there a few months before it shut and we were given an official tour and told it would probably the last one before closure and at that time Clan Line, Blackmoor Vale and the 9F later named Black Prince plus the Austerity 2-10-0 Gordon. I saw the siding where a number of J-92s were cut up by a scrap man and a friend found a water gauge in the bushes. If the government had wanted a strategic reserve then Longmoor was perfect but the Government clearly did not and did not save any steam engines other than for the national collection- and BR found that a pain to manage it seems as their idea at that time of a steam engine, was a pile of cut up bits ready for the smelter.

[@Thornaby37]

I've often wondered if the strategic reserve was just an April Fool's spoof in one of the railway magazines

[@LeoStarrenburg]

What would have happend to the coal supply "logistic chain" and the track side water supply if there was such a thing as the SSR ? As for UK gov. secrets: the London BT tower is a great example.

[@AtheistOrphan]

And the trained drivers and firemen, and the regular maintenance, etc, etc.

[@beeble2003]

There was plenty of coal around in the 1960s/70s. Water can be obtained from the public water supply -- and if that's not working, there are bigger problems than just running trains.

[@hb1338]

".. the London BT tower is a great example". Of what ? I presume the answer is "hiding in plain sight". BT tower was built as a communications hub. It has been known right from the outset that some of the traffic it carries is commercial and some is 'private', mostly government. All of the traffic has always been encrypted, and any information relating to whether the two types of traffic can be distinguished from each other is kept well away from the public domain by application of the Official Secrets Act, as Duncan Campbell will testify. In a similar way the public mobile phone network has a number of private channels which are used by the emergency services, undisclosed government organisations and commercial companies.

[@fernbedek6302]

Nuclear war planning was so bad. Canada’s ‘secret’ underground command centre only had about 24hrs of air in it if they actually turned the electronics on.

[@Eurobazz]

Wasn't it a PITA to recalibrate the wheels from Finnish 1,524mm gauge to standard gauge 1,435 mm?

[@chrislaarman7532]

... and shrink the locomotive to the (even smaller than continental) loading gauge?

[@NewController01]

0:06 wait...when did the Epping and Ongar acquire one of those?

[@francesconicoletti2547]

Now I want a British Post Apocalypse TV show where the survivors of said apocalypse travel round in an former heritage railway steam train.

[@NotAllowedFavourites]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/e4Kxo4J9o9Cel9k

[@yorkshirewanderer6176]

When I visited the Epping Ongar for the first time I looked up what that Finish locomotive was and why it had been left to rot. Apparently it was brought to be restored to run on the line until they discovered asbestos and it just got left where it is to this day. Not sure how true this is.

[@SilverGear_]

You know I recently read a science-fiction (if it can be called that) fiction written around the possibility of the strategic steam reserve and plays into the final act of the book. It is simply titled "The Black Locomotive" and while it got a fair bit of the specifics around the locomotive wrong (eg a King Arthur class from the Great Western, wth?!), it does lean into the strategic reserve theory and the fun that could be had.

[@MattyP62618]

1:47 i don't think there was any flaw in the thinking, as simply, they were never used & the cold war stayed cold until it ended

[@johnmurray8428]

The times I went into Ongar starting in the late 1990s, that locomotive turned up between visits. For many visits it sat on the run around siding. Many of the locals called it Russian.

[@chrisrand5185]

The secret reserve is made up of Great Western locomotives which operate from Kings Cross (platform 9 3/4).

[@davidty2006]

specifically of the hall class oddly enough...

[@MrDportjoe]

don't just like this one I lOVE IT! I was six in 1962. I recall my mom coming home from the neighborhood coffee klatch with the news that thegood people on our street in Eugene Oregon had drawn up a list of who sheltered in which of the few units there were on our 1/4 mile long suburban hide away and because we were the only renters we were S>O>L. we neve did duck and cover drills as there were no targets in blast range. That said 12 -13 years later my advanced first aid training for university credit was based after bomb scenarios. some where out there is the baby that thousand of us watched being delivered on a door laid across saw horses. YES it was an OB/GYN's hands we saw as that baby crowned but...

[@template16]

Jago as a government plant? That's an interesting concept. I understand HM Government are seeking a James Bond type person, maybe Jago's real career.

[@theodricaethelfrith]

Some very timely WW3 content

[@rjds1800]

The strategic reserve is “hidden” somewhere in York 😂😜

[@TimEaston]

A very good video as usual Jargo, on the non-existance of the UK's strategic reserve

[@Thunderer0872]

The list of scrapped locos by enthusiasts shows that the idea of a UK Strategic Reserve was a myth. but go all the way to a possible nuclear war, I doubt much of the railway would be in any condition to run steam or even a hand cart, also who would be around even use it and what for possible reason would anyone need it? Those that were lucky to live? waiting in bunkers for 50 years or 100 years or longer? if the bunkers didn't take damage? would anyone remember or be in any condition to or have NBC suits able to work a steam engine. I know you covered that here but a full America - Russian exchange would most likely make the earth uninhabitable for Thousands of years making any Strategic Reserve redundant after the first wave of missiles falling. Now I need to lie down in the fetal position and try not think about what I just wrote, what with current world situation I think I just freaked myself out.... You must be a government plant!!! (SIC)

[@KaitlynnUK]

I wore my bestest Tin Foil Hat for this episode :)

[@julianaylor4351]

From your kitchen draw, that's where mine is. 😆🤣

[@radagastwiz]

I recall sometime in the last 18 months seeing a Ukrainian steam loco being pressed into wartime service. You never know quite when something might be needed.

[@dunebasher1971]

As alluded to in the video, the idea that the railway infrastructure would be in any way serviceable following a nuclear attack is beyond ludicrous. Perhaps in some rural areas a very long way from any cities there would be track that was still passable and not melted, buckled, buried in debris or otherwise beyond use, but for anywhere remotely close to a population centre, forget it. That's before you factor in the need to have an army (small "a") of skilled, experienced people to run the trains whom you could be sure wouldn't have been killed in the attack and could be kept alive indefinitely in the irradiated hellscape afterwards, and vast quantities of protected coal and water stocks for the trains at a time when coal for heating and uncontaminated water for drinking would be the rarest and most precious commodities available next to food... like all conspiracy theories, it falls to pieces with the application of just the tiniest amount of critical analysis. Indeed, the entire concept only makes even slight sense with a 1950s mindset of nuclear war, where people still had the quaint notion that it would just be like WW2 with bigger bombs and many had yet to grasp the civilisation-ending enormity of what it would actually mean.

[@runeodin7237]

Hi Jago, as usually an interesting and well-researched video. But where come the Finnish locomotives you talk about in the start into the story? Finland uses the wider Russian track gauge, so a Finnish locomotive wouldn't work on the standard gauge lines of Britain.

[@nigelclark1823]

As conspiracy theories go, this was far more interesting, enjoyed it as usual.

[@samrussell9264]

1) Tracks... Where to go? 2) Fuel... Who's digging for coal? 3) Water... Unless there's STRINGENT Filtering, Radiation Build-Up would be a Real problem... 4) Crew... If you don't know what you're doing... BOOM!!

[@joeblow9657]

Do you really trust the British government to be forward thinking enough to have a strategic reserve of anything? I sure don't.

[@frostedbutts4340]

That's not true, they have a bottomless reserve of BS and lies.

[@joeblow9657]

LOL ROFL🤣 I meant a reserve of anything anyone actually wants. @@frostedbutts4340

[@richardm7004]

If you watch the closing scenes of Threads, there's a still photo depicting a steam loco running again in the aftermath, along with miners hewing coal by hand. If my memory serves me correctly, I think there might have been an old resurrected steamer in an episode of the 1970s era BBC post-apocalypse drama "Survivors", presumably based on the same idea.

[@TheSpitfiregoggles]

There was also a kids TV series called The Tripods, idea being that all humans had a brain implant installed to make them subservient to the alien invaders and there was little or no modern technology. That featured a small steam loco pulling people around in what I think was supposed to be France, though I'm pretty sure it was a British loco.

[@chrishenniker5944]

I think it was a traction engine that was shown in Threads.

[@Realm-of-Horror]

Nice use of footage from "Threads". The most horrifyingly depressing film of all time!

[@StevensPaul]

Told you to save some extra Steam Locomotives,but did YOU LISTEN??........NOOOOOOOOO🤪😠😬😒!!!

[@steamsuhonen9529]

What I find suspiciously missing in this video is an explanation as to why Finnish locomotives would be useful in Britain. British tracks are mostly standard gauge and Finnish tracks are almost exclusively wide gauge, so the locomotives wouldn't be compatible with anything.

[@chrisg6086]

Is there a prize for identifying the GWSR's Winchcombe Station at 0:43?

[@jonathanscripps917]

Ah Mr Hazzard, I've been expecting you. Also, you forgot to thank your donors, or should I say, handlers, at MI6, TfL & GCHQ. Cheerio 🇬🇧