JC Denton: Swordmaster - A Deus Ex Low-Tech Story

[@JCDenton3]

You mechs may have copper wiring to re-route your fear of pain, but I've got a bunch of sticks made out of steel

[@thejoin4687]

"Sticks and stones (are my weapons)"

[@nights8880]

"pick up famouse silent takedown weapon GEP GUN" re-route that tin can !

[@cyberen]

To summarize: Stick with the prod. Prod with the prod.

[@vertz505]

Prod is life (until Dragon's Tooth Sword, then that is life)

[@mortiswell]

"Just in case though, we're police"

[@SullySadface]

I thought you were a GEP gun

[@olympian3]

I work for a secret organization called my knife

[@Comkill117]

“Welcome to the coalition, PROD.”

[@rboyd87]

Still one of my favorite games. I had the PS2 port first, and then eventually on PC. I am pretty adept at melee runs. I was a nervous kid who didn't like disappointing people, and this apparently included my fictional older brother Paul. So I would play the first chunk of the game non-lethal so he wouldn't be mad at me.

[@vertz505]

I always feel bad if Paul is disappointed with the Liberty Island mission 😅

[@bkgrila]

Johnny actually backs down if you pick the right option to threaten him.

[@vertz505]

I think I knew this at some point, I just don't like him lol

[@delta1404]

Some really good dialogue, but shanking him is pretty based ngl

[@agarthansupersoldier]

"You've got 10 seconds to beat it before I add you to the list of NSF casualties" is the option to pick iirc

[@gravityflame]

I just recently played and finished this game on realistic difficulty. One of the best dystopian futuristic RPGs I've ever played.

[@vertz505]

I always have a ton of fun playing this, I'm amazed I'm still discovering things about both the world and its mechanics.

[@NeUrOmAnCeRAI]

No GEP Gun for silent takedowns? What a shame.

[@vertz505]

Maybe during a Heavy-weapon-only challenge 👀

[@SullySadface]

The GEP gun takedown is always the most silent way to eliminate Manderley.

[@vertz505]

Excellent resignation letter, too

[@BloodWraith777]

Ironic that the Dragon's Tooth Sword is in the "Low Tech" weapon skill tree, because it's literally a techno-hilt that produces a "blade" that has self-sharpening nanomachines that whirl around the blade. The sword's Achilles heel is that it's louder than the sun when drawn.

[@ProfesserLuigi]

Not a problem if you always have it drawn.

[@dheck1138]

The comment after the subway hostage rescue rings true; after nearly 20 years I still learn new things on every playthrough.

[@vertz505]

I'm always surprised to find something new! Pretty incredible game

[@SerMattzio]

I love the idea that the conspiracy spent billions of dollars creating JC only to find he doesn't have the capacity to use a gun.

[@MrChainsawAardvark]

The second Deus Ex Game doesn't get much love, but there is an augmentation that lets you deal EMP damage with melee weapons, so a no guns run through of that game could be a nice follow up to this.

[@vertz505]

That's interesting! I haven't played that one in a long time, so I'm probably due for a replay

[@sadscientisthououinkyouma1867]

Invisible War shouldn't get as much hate as it does, even if it is the weakest of the Deus Ex games (The Fall doesn't exist)

[@quint3ssent1a]

JC: it's good to be a nano-augmented superhuman, but you know what's better? Returning to monke. *Proceeds to ooga-booga his way through hordes of goons while armed with some metal sticks*

[@ThommyofThenn]

Europeans used swords just as much

[@apieceoftoast768]

The first 3 seconds make me want to play Deus Ex again

[@ArnieMcStranglehold]

9:40 I actually, genuinely, after playing through this part MANY TIMES, never knew you could open the train doors and save the hostages. THAT IS GONNA SAVE SO MUCH AMMO.

[@vertz505]

I was amazed! Never even crossed my mind to try.

[@slowerthinker]

What'll really blow your mind is that you can also open the trains doors and .... just leave. You get chewed out for it (I can't remember if it is Paul, Alex, or Manderley), but the game just carried right on with the hostages completely abandoned to the NSF.

[@deaj8450]

I've only played once, but I didn't even realize that you could kill all the nsf to free them. I just snuck in the vent and opened the subway door to free them. I assumed they would be killed if I went in shooting

[@KooYu]

That will teach them not to bring a gun to a swordfight. Good stuff man!

[@marcorossi9343]

It's so nice to see people are still playing this masterpiece, very cool video

[@jakek8687]

My presence here indicates that you are blessed by the algorithm. I will see you again, Mr. Denton.

[@vertz505]

I have indeed been blessed! Many thanks

[@ThommyofThenn]

I'm glad so many of us have played this terrific game for the first time lately. This game is truly great for long time fans but Deus Ex hit so hard for me playing it in 2023. I ended up spending time learning about all the concepts this game. It was a wild ride

[@vertz505]

It's a pretty incredible game that's held up very well!

[@CallOfCutie69]

5:20 Backstab damage (x10) is applied regardless of whether enemy is aware of you, and of weapon type. It means you can backstab an enemy that is engaging you, and that you can backstab with pistol/sniper rifle/shotgun. Then here was the rant how you shouldn’t hit head with baton and prod, I guess I should have watched further before typing. 5:47 Stun (x4) overrides backstab modifier (x10), and is x4 regardless of where you hit, so you don’t have a need circle them…

[@vertz505]

Appreciate the explanations! I thought I understood mechanics, but clearly missed some details.

[@CallOfCutie69]

@@vertz505 I missed them when playing too, found out thanks to bacon hero channel kzbin.info/www/bejne/homzaYqInNOce9E kzbin.info/www/bejne/laTbhnaopNasd8k

[@JGT-yd2wx]

The algorithm will bless you, this I know.

[@vertz505]

Many thanks!

[@BarackLesnar]

I also am predicting this

[@BabyKobeeee]

It has, this got recommended to me and I’ve never played deus ex or searched for it recently.

[@JGT-yd2wx]

@@BabyKobeeee YEAS!

[@thomasquwack9503]

@@vertz505I am here, lord Al Gore of the Rythm has sent me here!

[@JSmithRecords]

I had no idea you could untrain yourself in pistol to get some extra skill points. Nor getting the speed augmentation so early in the game, I always got it in Hong kong. And I really had no idea how powerful the prod and baton could be. Crazy how 25 years later im still discovering new things. Goated game

[@roserpgs]

Never seen a video of yours before but you landed in my front page, which I'm pretty damn happy about

[@SHDW-nf2ki]

I hate when people say skills like Hacking are useless in games like this and I should just memorize or google all the passwords. That takes all the fun out! Glad you didn't do that.

[@vertz505]

Thanks! Hacking, lockpicking, and electronics are super useful in this game. For a speedrun, I can see having a list of codes instead, but for my own purposes here, I wanted the more "authentic" experience.

[@TapOnX]

My response would be that by their standard, all skills are useless. You can just look up cheat codes or exploits and go through the game without engaging with any of its mechanics.

[@Slay1337pl]

Just when I started this exact playthrough, I get this in my recommended!

[@vertz505]

Nice! Hope you enjoy it 😁 I had fun, though I could have made it more challenging without using augmentations.

[@devanmauch7843]

I'm a simple man, I see deus ex and I've already clicked before I even realized it.

[@GilletteGaming]

Fun video. Thanks for uploading! I've played Deus Ex a bunch and somehow still find neat little stuff I've missed whenever I watch another playthrough.

[@vertz505]

Thanks for watching! Always love finding new things in this game.

[@warrenburger9907]

The most important criticism: Edit the videos so you and characters in the game aren't talking at the same time. Besides that, great job, bro 👍

[@vertz505]

Thanks, appreciate the feedback!

[@Tuckerslam]

JC got friendzoned on the dancefloor for his own creds. So he destroyed the world. With a knife.

[@vertz505]

He just wanted to dance!

[@GuiltyOSheep]

Love the your voice, really soothing and helps cozy into a hour long gameplay

[@vertz505]

Thanks, I appreciate it!

[@drakep.5857]

Hell yeah, a good little channel. Subbed.

[@vertz505]

Thanks, I appreciate it!

[@delta1404]

Just found your channel. Fun run tho definitely on the easier side. The grenade/explosives restriction is definitely the main source of challenge. I knew right away it'd be very close to standard gameplay otherwise haha. Lockpick/multitool ban would definitely be quite a run. I also just realized how weird it isthe crossbow is pistol not low-tech, and that pepper spray also falls under the latter. Also that NY subway water valve skip looks legitimately useful.

[@vertz505]

Thank you for watching! Yeah, definitely on the easy side in the end. In future runs, I'd like to think a bit more about what would make a more interesting set of tools to have available.

[@dadwrestler]

great video! you have a really well laid out structure and demeanor, you have so much potential with all us weird nerds.

[@mihkelnoot8465]

Just dropping by to say what an awesome video this is. Keep it up!

[@vertz505]

Thank you! This one has gained a lot more traction than I ever expected haha

[@waldgeist5506]

Deus Ex challenge run content? Why thank you kind sir, please keep it coming. What do you think about a System Shock 2 video? Exotics or wrench only runs might be interesting.

[@vertz505]

Thanks for checking it out! It's been a long time since I've played System Shock 2, but I like those ideas -- much appreciated

[@ChaosPootato]

High quality commentary for a high quality game, good shit man

[@vertz505]

Thank you! Appreciate it 🙏

[@jtcameron8345]

the usefulness of pointy stick will never fade!

[@vertz505]

Truly the most valuable technology

[@jo85858]

i have to admit i got very triggered when you didn't pick up the classic sword on the wall in the MJ12 barracks after being caught at the beginning of hongkong. right where you're breaking the lockers with the baton thanks to the upgraded skill, there's a sword on wall which can break the locker doors even without upgrades to the skill... which was always my way of getting through that part of the map.

[@vertz505]

Haha, I left that place and only after posting the video was like "weird, I never got a regular sword", would definitely have been good to have for a bit!

[@roserpgs]

I never played original Deus Ex, so this has been an absolute blast to see how it all plays out, especially with such a fun challenge run, definitely gonna subscribe, but first- How about that dance?

[@vertz505]

Thank you! Hahaha I had fun editing that bit, glad it's been appreciated

[@BornIn1142]

It can be cumbersome to turn on different augmentations before or during battle. However, you can actually modify one of the game's .ini files in Notepad to create custom hotkeys. It's possible to link multiple augmentation slots to a single button so you can turn on all your combat augs on instantly. (You can use cheats in that file to instantly summon 50 TNT crates, for example.)

[@vertz505]

Ah, cool! I didn't know that. I'll have to play around with it next time.

[@bhtooefr]

I feel like the Tong ending would've been the most appropriate for a low-tech challenge (and the Helios ending is the *highest*-tech ending). After all, you're forcing *everyone* to go lower-tech. (Granted, I think the Helios ending is the best ending if you think of the implications. The Tong ending assumes you can uninvent the technologies that lead to the events of Deus Ex, the Illuminati ending doesn't actually fix anything, just restores things to right before MJ12 split off of the Illuminati.)

[@vertz505]

I hear you, I was a little uncertain what I felt fit best here. I was heavily aided by augmentations, so forcing everyone to be low tech felt fake lol

[@HE13272326]

Close Combat is quite strong in DX With Low Tech on master, JC can take out almost any human enemy and with the arm augmentation the damage is even enough to engage bots

[@NavJack27gaming]

great video from a low sub channel. looking forward to seeing you gain traction!

[@vertz505]

Thank you! I've been pretty surprised by the response here, appreciate you and everyone watching and commenting 🙏

[@cosmicpanda7043]

Was thinking about doing a melee only run next. This might be the push I needed

[@vertz505]

I hope you enjoy it!

[@nunya8230]

Very cool, i like your storytelling

[@vertz505]

Thanks so much!

[@dsagent]

I had to install GMX since the base game simply would not work on my PC. I love how bright your game is. Mine is super dark but atmospheric. The funny thing is JC does have a punch move in the game, you can see him swing his hand if you are in the mirror and left click. It just deals no damage as he swings an invisible object. More importantly I live in NYC but never been to any of these places.

[@vertz505]

I didn't know he could punch (inefficiently)! That's cool, can't believe I never tried it. I remember the game looking fairly stark/bright when I first played it, but maybe it was just our pc haha

[@boilerhousegarage]

A later mod called "GMDX" allowed the lift heavy objects aug to throw any object you were carrying. This would let you throw a steel crate or barrel at an enemy or destructible door.

[@vertz505]

Ah, that could be another fun challenge to only throw stuff lol

[@redfoxdog1]

great video! not much else to say, i'm just leaving a comment for engagement

[@BarackLesnar]

Quality to subscriber ratio is off the charts right here

[@vertz505]

Thanks, I'm kind of overwhelmed by the response this one got 😅

[@shadowslayer205]

48:01 "Next, it will be the self-aware systems you have built to realize truly omnipresent observation and judgement." And now we use AI algorithms to determine how successful people are on social media.

[@yourneighbor6152]

algo brought me here, putting in my engagement now, will watch later!

[@vertz505]

Thank you! Seems I've been blessed, never expected this much engagement 😅

[@N1rOx]

I see Deus Ex in my timeline? I click

[@vertz505]

Thank you, I appreciate it 🙏

[@radscorpion8]

Does your timeline mean your life lol

[@N1rOx]

@@radscorpion8 haha it's a mistake on my part. Facebook = timeline. I was meant to say feed

[@99jdave99]

definitely check out the deus ex randomizer! makes the game pretty interesting, and has some cool built-in challenge settings you might enjoy (like "stick with the prod" (prod only, or prod/tranq-darts/emp/gas/scrambler for prod+ mode), limited bot usage (game-wide! I'm currently in a run I didn't realize had global-bot-usage-limits so I'm in the ship and have to beat the rest of the game without med bots, lol), health/energy limits (right now I'm limited to 68 energy lol), item-stack limit changes (4 medkit limit for me currently; will be a challenge with no med bots! lol), weapon damage changes, augmentation canister and energy randomization, item-location randomization, skill point cost randomization, and even mission-objective-location randomization); it really puts some fresh air into the game!

[@vertz505]

Oh my God... I feel like this is about to take over my life! Thanks for telling me about it, I had no idea

[@slartimus]

I SPEEL MY DREENK! (Ages ago, I was waiting with some friends to get into a restaurant, when across the street, someone hardcore failed at getting off their motorcycle and dumped it on the curb. One of my friends, amidst whom "Deus Ex" was a common cultural touchpoint, turned and said, "I SPEEL MY BIKE!" and we all had a laugh... although not so loudly that we had to worry about the biker dude hearing us. 😅)

[@vertz505]

hahaha that's perfect! Definitely one of my favorite references in the game

[@TotallyARussian]

i went with low tech on my first playthrough, i always prefer melee weapons to firearms, didn't regret it, of course i did utilize the gep gun

[@Wyimaginowany988]

Great video, thanks

[@vertz505]

Thanks for watching!

[@Myrmeleosi]

i recently played deus ex for the first time in my life. i think i played on the normal difficulty or hard. i played mostly with the melee weapons (prod, baton, and dragon tooth) and the gep gun.

[@c4h5n2o1]

"my dancing is augmented"

[@shadowjack239]

Deus Ex is the perfect game.

[@CallOfCutie69]

11:52 I think because how the game handles diagonals, you weren’t within 24 units or whatever

[@nicestoriesnottherealstori3006]

Oh yeah, I did not go to the police station and found out the secret as I was leaving as a subtitle box popped up with MJ12 solider on it.

[@vertz505]

Yeah I've had the same thing happen! Bit of an odd thing to experience lol

[@beybladesinmyheels1267]

Game fact: Realistic difficulty only effects bullet and melee damage that JC takes

[@TUDGAF]

JC Dragon Tooth: i am the senate

[@SalusFuturistics]

I could swear as a Kid, that the Prod does more Damage on the Head. I've noticed multiple Times, that if I don't directly aim at the Head, the Enemy does not KO from one Hit.

[@vertz505]

I had the opposite experience this time :D Riot prod only one-shotted enemies if aiming at the torso. Wiki suggests that this is always the case, as there's no attack modifier for head-shots, but there is for torso: deusex.fandom.com/wiki/Riot_prod

[@awordabout...3061]

41:10 - A LAM's a bad choice for close range combat.

[@SysOpQueen]

@9:30 That is VERY interesting, I never knew there was any option *other* than to escort the hostages onto the train. Even though I would typically kill everyone in that subway anyway [except hostages] for ease of access and a lack of desire to stealth hit them all... So if you knock everyone out, the hostages go up the stairs? Or rather, if you run in and shoot everyone before interacting with the hostages, they'll run up the stairs then? I thought they always take that subway to the next area no matter what.

[@vertz505]

I'll have to go back to see what happens -- my memory is that you take out all the NSF, Alex says good job, and then you get on the subway and they are in the next station. But in the case of opening the doors, they'll run into the subway car and then Alex will say good job. Pretty sure if there's any gunfire / alert status for the NSF, those hostages just cower in place.

[@cdru515]

Surprised you were using the knife before using the Dragon's Tooth, given that the crowbar is slightly stronger. As for being set on fire, it *is* possible for it to stop on its own, but you have to burn through a lot of medkits/energy to do so

[@vertz505]

I don't remember my exact reasoning for the knife over the crowbar -- probably thinking about attack speed, honestly. With back attacks, they both can take out a regular enemy in one hit, I think. Ah, I don't think I realized that fire will stop, but I imagine it's not worth waiting that long!

[@eldradulthran2436]

Why no Thermo-Optic Camo? Especially with high enviromental skill, they last 45-60 secs, enough to get out difficult situations.

[@vertz505]

I think I used that a few times not shown in the video, mainly just didn't find it particularly meaningful to comment on at the time!

[@Christoff070]

You should try gmdx deus ex mod. Makes the game amazing and more of a challenge, enemies have improved AI, and there's perks in addition to skills

[@vertz505]

Ah, interesting! I'll need to look into that - thanks for the heads up 😁

[@alexeytsybyshev9459]

Failed to save Lebedev. Rip run. I wanted to see how you'd take out Navarre

[@vertz505]

Trust me, my regret was boundless when I realized it was possible 😢

[@radscorpion8]

This game was amazing to me because it was the first to introduce some very serious and interesting economic, political and abstract philosophy to me at a very young age, and it did so succinctly and convincingly. Too much real philosophy these days engages in obscurantism or extreme verbosity; in this game, it was short, clear and to the point. The follow up games didn't do this as well, though Invisible War, in spite of its flawed gameplay mechanics (still a great game in my opinion), was closest.

[@vertz505]

It's been a long time since I played IW, I'll have to try it again to see how it compares. This game was also pretty foundational for me in introducing a range of concepts I've continued to think about!

[@asturias0267]

You should try out Vampire: the Masquerade - Bloodlines if you haven't already. It's somewhat similar and one of my all time favorites.

[@vertz505]

I have! It's been a long time, but I liked it a lot.

[@moist_wenis]

Deus Ex video game review of gameplay retro goodness awesome game jam and jelly packed commentary console wars hot diggity damn it's a video game video For the algo o7

[@vertz505]

Cheers, thanks for watching!

[@moist_wenis]

23:23 I too would panic if our security guy got got like this by a crouching intruder. And he tried okay lol, she totally needed his protection. @@vertz505

[@vertz505]

I had to stop playing for a bit to laugh at that point :D such a goofy game

[@piggosalternateaccount4917]

Another well presented and edited Dying Sex video, excellent

[@itachiz2]

In the mj12 prison I think you missed the chance to save the nfs soldier also in prison who can escape.

[@vertz505]

I sure did! Only realized after posting this video that I goofed. I'll help him out next time!

[@jastervoid]

Poor Tong, let the guy finish a sentence.

[@vertz505]

Look, I have area transitions to walk through! Really though, I did feel kinda bad, I forgot that transition was right there.

[@frenchferretsp1p335]

"What a rotten way to die"

[@hungryhedgehog4201]

So low tech includes the nanite energy sword but not a crossbow :P ?

[@vertz505]

😅 Devs did what they did! Crossbow is a pistol, hot new sword tech is low-tech

[@arrtemfly]

i used 2 crates @ 14:10 in my early playthroughs because i didn't know you can blow this thing up. it's very tedious tho haha

[@vertz505]

Yeah, it's not the most ideal way, but it fortunately works haha

[@DSPsWifesBF]

Are there any modern day games (post 2012ish) that are as truly open world as Deus Ex?

[@vertz505]

It's an interesting dynamic in this game -- it's very linear, but each area is a set of activities to tackle in any order you'd like. Some side-quests, yes, but ultimately, you're on a straight line. It feels open to me because you can achieve your goals in so many ways. I think that Mankind Divided did a decent attempt at the open hub with Prague, but that sequel had its own issues, as well.

[@DSPsWifesBF]

@@vertz505 maybe open world was the wrong term. I meant how the game lets you and even incentivizes tackling missions in multiple ways

[@vertz505]

I get you! Yeah, I think that Dishonored comes closest to that feeling, though I'm sure there are games in not familiar with that come close!

[@DietmarEugen]

Fallout 4, to some degree. I finished it in a combat knife only run, though I had a pistol for peeking around corners, and used some grenades when Blitz did not connect (some turrets up high). Enter buildings either by hacking or lockpicking, or by sneaking up onto rooftops.

[@ericrhodes5174]

Gimme the GEP gun!

[@Catholicgauze]

Bit weird? Heresy!

[@noisemaker1696]

So... How about that dance?

[@Planetdune]

Good idea, limit yourself to the best weapon in the game (dragon tooth) and see if it works :p

[@vertz505]

Hey, at least had a *little* challenge before I got that one :D

[@DagarCoH]

Speaking of learning new things: It seems you do not know that Anna Navarre has a killphrase you can find to skip that fight.

[@vertz505]

I think I forgot to mention in the video! I know about that trick (and the same with Gunther), but opted not to use it for the sake of keeping with melee weapons this time.

[@AnjiEnnui]

You didn't use the crossbow? When were hand crossbows invented?

[@vertz505]

Too high tech 😅 the game considers the crossbow a pistol, so sadly not available in this weapon category.

[@olivius8891]

Miguel my beloved, you didn't help him?

[@vertz505]

I chatted with him in the prison and, as always, forgot about him. Next time, I'll remember!

[@olivius8891]

​​@@vertz505Did you save Smuggler by warning him of the raid before you got to Jock?

[@vertz505]

Indeed I did! I think the game requires you to chat with him, anyway; I tried to leave because I didn't need LAMs, but Jock wasn't on top of the Ton

[@ManthonyHiggs]

WHat renderer are you using?

[@RedSntDK]

If he's following the guide he mentions and link to, it's Direct3D 10.

[@vertz505]

I think it is Direct3D, but I'll have to fire it up to check! I'm currently traveling, so I'll have to reply again once I get back.

[@someguynamedmatt2907]

comment for the algorithm

[@Illuyankas]

Please don't take this the wrong way, but was there a reason you were going into the menu and weren't using the F-key shortcuts for augmentations?

[@vertz505]

Fair question, no problem :) partially forgetting what F-keys connect to which ability, partly that the F-keys on my keyboard are stupidly small and a bit far from the rest of the keys. So if I'm in need of quickly turning them on, I like to pause to do so. I can at least remember the leg and cloak F-keys to use those quickly, just didn't get shown much in this video

[@Illuyankas]

@vertz505 that's understandable, thanks for your reply! I forget if Deus Ex lets you bind button combos like Shift+1 for F1 but that might be a possible help?

[@vertz505]

@@Illuyankas it might, but I'm not sure! Since I have shift as the "hold to walk" key, that might caist some other confusions haha. Really, it's just me memorizing things better

[@exploshaun]

If you can beat anna wirh 2 knife stabs, I don't see why you can't just backstab her on the plane.

[@vertz505]

Fair question! I believe she's still flagged as "story important" in the game at that point. There are some npcs who can't be killed or who can't be killed until certain points because it would too heavily alter the storyline

[@exploshaun]

@@vertz505 actually, there's plenty of people on KZbin who set up LAMs on the plane to kill her even before she's able to speak. Some even do it out of habit.

[@vertz505]

Ah! Seems I didn't know when her immortal status changes, then; I thought it was only after that mission. For this run, I think I still would not have done so. I wanted to avoid harming characters unless JC would reasonably know for sure that they were "the bad guys", though in future runs I might go about that differently.

[@Zuwze]

Woodysgamertag secret channel?

[@vertz505]

No relation haha, I didn't know that channel until now :D

[@steelapplepipeapfel995]

🪰

[@quintrapnell3605]

This is like the anti morrowind

[@afaultytoaster]

You didn't set up your game properly, you aren't using the Ion Storm colour scheme for the interface

[@vertz505]

Dang, gonna have to redo the whole video!

[@Jay_76]

One thing I didn't like about the first Deus Ex game was, in a game touted as having so many choices, why can't I stay loyal to UNATCO/Majestic 12? Why not give the player the option to go to Hong Kong and kill the Silhouette and Illuminati leaders including, eventually, Paul?

[@vertz505]

That's an interesting idea. I think you'd end up in the same end-game eventually -- I think Bob Page looks down on JC enough that he'd want to eliminate him in the end regardless. I think Page saw JC as a step toward his own perfection, so even if he remained a useful tool for MJ-12, I think Page would see him as too much of a threat eventually.

[@Anonymouthful]

Immersive Sim is such a useless psuedo term.

[@vertz505]

I disagree, mainly from a historical standpoint, but I'm also not sure which specific aspects you're taking issue with in the end 🙂

[@CIOTECHSFX]

you can think what you want of the name itself but it is legitimately a genre or sub genre