Jesse Plemons Couldn’t Understand Why The ‘Breaking Bad’ Writers Were Afraid Of Him | People

Jesse Plemons shares the little he knew about his character, "Todd," when he first started filming 'Breaking Bad' and how Vince Gilligan broke him down.
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Jesse Plemons Couldn’t Understand Why The ‘Breaking Bad’ Writers Were Afraid Of Him | People
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[@ritaz2008]

He did a great job playing Todd. He looked so sweet, but yet so cold when he killed someone. Todd is intriguing.

[@markvito746]

Most creepy Todd moment imo is when he threatens Skyler wearing the ski mask.. his pupils all dilated .. you coukd almost see his demons in those black soulless eyes

[@podtherod9304]

I think he’s meant to be a psychopath

[@pippishortstocking7913]

@Richard Horrocks he was a fucking sociopath. You're easy prey for them since you find it "sweet" and make excuses for it

[@brandonsmith5673]

Todd would be a serial killer in real life.

[@gregtavarez3322]

@@markvito746 stfu

[@kodiacstephens8104]

Todd is so good because he is the opposite of everything Jesse is. Jesse is presented like a rough around the edges rude punk but he is a good person on the inside. Todd is presented like a nice young man eager to please but he is a cold hearted monster inside. Jesse feels a great amount of remorse for the things he does and is constantly haunted by the things he wishes he could forget. Todd feels no remorse for the things he does and even keeps mementos of these moments.

[@Robloxman226]

I agree. He was a great foil for Jesse just like Gus is to Walt, and how Lalo Salamanca is to Saul in the prequel series.

[@trendkill3333]

Todd is a criminally overlooked character

[@TheSchemer1]

@@Robloxman226 Lalo's more of a foil to both Hector and Gus..

[@skatershaner]

I don't think this could be said any better

[@TheSchemer1]

@@skatershaner What?

[@jonomoar]

The two scariest guys were Todd and Gus because they were both remorseless killers who blended in with the world.

[@elboruboru]

But even Todd was scarier, you could tell Gus was meticulous and he didn’t do a move without thinking about it, he also showed emotions, he showed how he struggled to control his emotions. But Todd was just unpredictable, he didn’t seem to understand people or emotions, he just did what he needed to do.

[@majortom4711]

@@elboruboru Todd and Gus are two different kinds of psychopaths. Todd was born that way without a doubt whereas Gus was made into one.

[@kares2921]

@@majortom4711 You are Always born as a psycopath, which means you can never become One. Gus was probarly a sociopath, i guess he was struggling as a kid and suffered a great deal of anger and frustration when Max were killed so thats why he become a sociopath. Psykopaths have almost no emotions but sociopaths have a little emotions for others left

[@kares2921]

@Мармеладов ТВ It is tho, Hank died and His last feelings for right and wrong were there so he felt kinda bad. He also was pretty brutal i mean i killed Lydia with ricin just for revenge

[@kares2921]

@Мармеладов ТВ He didnt apoligized to his son either and he wanted to give the money to his family just because he didnt want to do all the things he did for nothing. He also Said to Skyler that he did it for him and had no regrets

[@Jaime-eg4eb]

It would have been funny if he said "and that wasn't even on the script" when he shot the kid

[@l3p3]

uff, actor died actually at that moment? but as a fan, he enjoyed it

[@thescoobymike]

Vince Gilligan liked it so much that he kept it in

[@PR--un4ub]

@@thescoobymike VRAVO BINCE!

[@armacham]

@@l3p3 Just because it's not in the script doesn't mean he used real bullets o_O only a truly insane person would use real bullets on a movie set

[@GuappaChoppa]

@@armacham lol

[@Maestro19992]

The girl got some biceps going

[@spacedad3550]

Thank you, Gustavo! Very cool!

[@fake-PSL]

That's not a girl probably

[@warhamster07]

@@fake-PSL insecurity much

[@fake-PSL]

@@warhamster07 lmaooo what

[@nadafro3116]

Shut up & go fried some chicken

[@lionelquiambao6575]

"He had it coming" lmao this guy played a creep in Black Mirror, Game Night, and Breaking Bad, but he's hilarious

[@Bloons-er3xl]

And game night ( he’s so good in that).

[@FlameMage2]

I liked him in Fargo!

[@rjonfully4915]

@@FlameMage2 same! just watched season 2, he was definitely one of the best characters

[@benconnor3206]

Check him as ‘straight laced American ‘ in Fargo season 2, his morals leave quickly , incredible performance

[@dreamweaver1603]

But he played a really great person in Friday Night Lights, which is where I first saw him. Of all the people on Friday Night Lights, it seems that Jesse Plemmons and Michael B. Jordan are the ones who will have the longest lasting careers from it. I would have guessed Jordan, but not Jesse. I know they have way different types of rolls, but character actors do well in Hollywood.

[@johncholmes643]

It's weird seeing Todd and Jesse not in calamity together.

[@johncholmes643]

@@lloydb.6979 He pretty much had a leash on jesse, Lllloyd

[@lloydb.6979]

@@johncholmes643 thats true but from the outside they were peaceful technically

[@paradygmshift7826]

After this they went to go get some pizza and beer.

[@eoinmccormack690]

@@lloydb.6979 bruh he patted him on the head and made him sit on the floor of his car he treated him like a dog

[@gst013]

This was filmed before Jesse killed Todd 👍

[@leerobbo92]

Jesus, if that's all he had to work with when he came up with Todd's character, then he deserves so much more credit. I wouldn't have got "child-like sociopath" out of that description he gives in a million years.

[@cMind607]

I mean crashing into a ditch refers to going broke and losing your business, hitting oncoming traffic refers to getting locked up. Hitting the raccoon refers to having to do whatever is necessary to not get murdered/locked up and still keep your business, that’s a lot to work with, You got a guy who would always kill the raccoon to survive. I’m sure the director gave him a speech like that he just dumbed it down for time sake.

[@cMind607]

Still deserves credit though.

[@SketchyDJM]

I would call it good casting.

[@Dammlee]

he was told that his character feels like "he hides something", i dont know how but he nailed that. todd really felt like that

[@CleanWithConfidence]

@leerobbo92 Your use of the Lord's name in vain will get you cast into eternal Hell after you die when you stand before a Holy God. The good news is God is not willing that any should perish. You broke God's Law and Jesus paid your fine by dying on the cross. This means that God can legally dismiss your case. “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. (John 3:16)” Then Jesus rose rose from the dead, defeating death. Please, today, repent or your sin and trust in Jesus, and God will give you eternal life as a free gift. Then read the Bible daily and obey it. God will never fail you.

[@hristijanzdravkovski5970]

Todd's real name is Jesse, and Aaron Paul (Jesse) was playing a character named Todd in Bojack Horseman.

[@penske_material]

Lol, I noticed that while watching BoJack Horseman 😂

[@lgtwzrd]

This easter egg and hidden reference game has officially gone too far.

[@jaredbaratta8589]

That's reTodded.

[@Torthrodhel]

Hey. Aren't you the Todd from Breakin' Around?

[@christianfilmssstm8933]

That’s too much, man.

[@BaceJeleren]

Bleeps the word "shit" but shows a child being shot

[@UKEDNHAT7]

1 IQ

[@eireyouok101]

@@TheDream64 swears don't hurt people lmao

[@3hutp]

Hipocrisy. You can see the most gory stuff in horror movies but it's not allowed to depict real sexual intercourse on TV.

[@John.Not-Jack.Daniels]

@@TheDream64 Pfft, "a real swear"? Jesus F'n Christ, grow the hell up. It's a word. We have at least a dozen other words that mean the same damn thing, and they're not "swears". Get over your bigoted view of language.

[@testtickles8755]

@@TheDream64 it wasn't a real swear, it was acting. A script. Dialogue... in an acted out scene.

[@slippinjimmy6511]

I’ll be honest, it was so satisfying to witness Todd’s demise.

[@salomahoney2675]

Can't have anyone abusing one of your clients like

[@Bogalog]

Honestly,for me it's more neutral since he's been shown as a sociopath so he wouldn't even know what he did was wrong or why Jesse was strangling him,so it's as rewarding as a stranger getting ran over.

[@shadow_master7303]

Indeed

[@ubt3606]

He didn't die watch el camino

[@allaboutthemurzic]

@@Bogalog True

[@repentandknowjesus8674]

Todd is the most dangerous person on breaking bad. He has no concept of good or bad. Like Richard Kuklinski the iceman.

[@InconsistentCod]

um no? he’s really not 😂

[@kylestephens9593]

@@moomoocowsly I don't even think one can argue that. All his actions in the series shows he's a psychopath. He's just well mannered and loyal. Which make him seem more human than he actually is.

[@grumpyae86]

Relax, the iceman was a story teller

[@stephennass3840]

Go watch El Camino. Todd is not a caring person. He is a true psychopath

[@vaahtobileet]

@@moomoocowsly Todd and Jesse didn't have to choose to do any of this. They're not good people.

[@faust13301]

C'mon now. Todd's alright. He'll even share his beer and pizza.

[@l3p3]

Right, he offered ice cream to jesse, he surely cannot be a bad person!

[@jameswesleykarl]

Tf is that song he was always listening to??? Spend the night or some shit 🤣🤣 todd is so weird oml

[@beckstar78]

@@jameswesleykarl sharing the night together oooh yeahhh

[@ZMAN166]

Based, Lord Humongous.

[@dabulls1g]

And soup, don’t forget the soup

[@rxhx]

The "calm evil" is the scariest indeed

[@Joe-vy5qw]

Todd misses the raccoon then does a u turn

[@Soleilasens]

Nah, at no point we see Todd enjoy violence. He was just completely indifferent, no empathy. Robot like

[@Joe-vy5qw]

@@Soleilasens we do, he keeps the spider as a trophy when he kills the kid, he also volunteers to torture jesse when everyone else wanted to die then and there

[@byronsenior6499]

@@Joe-vy5qw Him keeping the spider just meant he liked it. I think he also had a fondness for Jessie thinking they were close hence why he volunteered to be his handler.

[@FelixTheGhost]

Just so you know it's nothing personal

[@luckybynn5788]

There's no oncoming car and Todd could easily avoid the raccoon with no repercussions but doesn't even consider not running it over. Half-interested smile after he hears the *thump* *thump*

[@angelopalpal-latoc8473]

The two Todds: Todd from Bojack and Todd from Breaking Bad

[@FacingTheChanges]

Todd Todd Todd toooodddddd

[@TodorescuProgramming]

@Matt Strolger that's too much man!

[@existenceisrelative]

The Two Todds: a Story of Two Jesses.

[@jaredbaratta8589]

That's reTodded.

[@giraffesareselfish9563]

Imagine if Darth Vader was named Todd, instead of saying "Lord Vader has arrived" it would have been "fucking Todd's here"

[@marshall2]

Jesse Plemons has an amazing presence, and his ability to hold the viewer's attention in a scene is remarkable. My favorite scene in Breaking Bad is when he politely and calmly threatened Skyler in her baby's bedroom. He controlled that scene so amazingly. You could feel his influence in that room, and over Skyler.

[@tylerhughes2136]

"He had it comin" hahahahah

[@discobassgroove]

The face he makes right after he says it 😂

[@truthof7382]

We all got it coming kid

[@johnorson6907]

@@truthof7382 edgy

[@sampson9115]

Todd keeping that damn spider made it even creepier 😂

[@user-mw8um6mc3v]

For me the best bit is when Skyler goes into Hollys room and finds the three masked men. Todd being one of them. The calm but sinister way he speaks to Skyler....the whole scene...brilliant. Reminded me of the Fog and the scene at the end where they are standing in the Church.

[@TheArtofGuitar]

Todd was so good in Black Mirror too!

[@thalamusDecimation]

Holy crap Lois, it's Mike from the The-Art-of-Guitar KZbin channel

[@nathantalks9299]

Didn’t expect you here lol

[@borris3768]

That episode was amazing, so terrifying

[@freakyholic]

Oh my goodness. Just realized that this is the same guy in USS Calister episode!!

[@sidsiva3072]

True that

[@joshuahoover6841]

I never cheered as loudly as I did when Jesse choked him to death. By far the most satisfying on-screen death of a villain. Kudos to your acting sir!

[@ramsdell3562]

After watching El Camino it’s even more satisfying

[@tonydalton459]

Second only to Cheese in The Wire (I cheered for that) - and even Cheese wasn't as much of a pyscho as Todd - he was just horrible in so many ways.

[@jwizdum2103]

Had his performance as Todd in my top 5 in the series (obv everyone was incredible) for some reason you could tell he was more insane than anyone else in Jack’s crew. Without bein nearly a visibly menacing, it was something deeper which is some class acting.

[@DarkS1ayer100]

Out of curiosity, who are the other four?

[@jwizdum2103]

@@DarkS1ayer100 Acting wise it would have to go, 1. Walter 2. Jesse 3. Gus 4. Mike, 5. Hank.

[@FTWGamerTrue]

@@jwizdum2103 saul?

[@the.seagull.35]

@@jwizdum2103 i would swap Skyler for Mike

[@Robert-rl7rd]

Wrong! He’s not insane that’s what makes psychopaths so disturbing. They are completely sane. They just have zero empathy or morals. An insane person is actually generally harmless.

[@TweedSuit]

If someone wants to make a movie about Matt Damon, Jesse Plemons will be perfect for the part when Matt Damon gains weight and loses his mind.

[@bobbybooshay5854]

😂😂😂

[@MsFlamingoSam]

He did played as younger matt damon's character in a movie once.

[@cranberrycanvas]

this comment is played out yo. and the way you didnt add anything you just basically explained the nickname 'meth damon' is just so unoriginal. i truthfully feel bad for people like you who think youre adding something to the experience and even worse for the 50 people who apathetically agree. its like youre running the software of someone elses thoughts to give you the feeling of being an individual. time is running out and you cant even spice up some hollywood bs video thats just going through motions anyway with an original thought?

[@aks19880]

@@cranberrycanvas So............annnywaayyyy.......@OP lol yeah he would be perfect to play Fat Matt Damon!

[@superlazy3355]

Well that escalated.... Like when you get talking to that person at the bar and realise they've done a face full of coke. @ OP..... Yeah Fat Mat Damon!

[@Ceu.Noturno]

Todd is a fearsome character because when he kills, it seems like an ordinary act and he not only shows no emotion, but he also shows a complete lack of remorse, he is a true psychopath. While most other characters, like Tuco or Gus, were more maniac in their killings, he just seems completely empty inside, like if it was nothing more than a chess move

[@caitthecat]

Not a true psychopath, just truly anti-social. He lacks the narcissism and grandiosity of a "true psychopath," but he would rate very highly in the anti-social traits.

[@arunikapritimishra632]

Todd was so great in 'I'm thinking of ending things'. I almost didn't recognise him. This was the beauty of Breaking Bad. It had the impeccable cast.

[@Karynthian]

That explanation by Vince Gilligan blows my mind with how perfect and concise it is.

[@garthshmanigans1658]

That scene haunts me to this day.

[@pauljackson2409]

That was great direction by Vince Gilligan. I think that the best description of the mind-set of a psychopath that I have ever heard, is that they see other people the way a scientist sees a lab-rat.

[@the.seagull.35]

Exactly. A 12 year old kid is literally like a raccoon that ran out in front of his car. Just an inconvenient problem to be solved.

[@mrrandom1265]

It's nice to see Jesse and Todd going for couple therapy.

[@michaelherron4306]

Todd was a great character. That contrast between mild manners and cold blooded killer, brilliant!

[@transcendcapitalism]

it's really interesting to see how much jesse plemons pulls people in as he's speaking even here. i can't think of another actor who is able to do that

[@UKEDNHAT7]

I find it hilarious how Todd's real name is Jesse.

[@borris3768]

Why? There is nothing funny about it...

[@locusstudioinc263]

@@borris3768 Jesus Christ are u that sensitive? Its a fucking tv show get over it ffs

[@romanpattysstuff]

​@@borris3768 coincidences are funny

[@ChairmanMeow1]

the casting for this show was PERFECT

[@louclarkson6098]

I cant believe how eloquent and well spoken he is. I definitely appreciate his performance more.

[@realPromotememedia]

Played Todd so well. BB was soooo good, I can’t think of a single duff actor for any of it. Even the bad ones were deliberate. Awesome job.

[@remster5284]

Nice touch having the red flag on the rear of the train, attention to detail is one of the things that made this show great.

[@kevinmcnamara2082]

He’s got that far away eyes thing. Great actor. Understated and gets his roles.

[@TylerRJenkinsMusic]

Jesse Plemons is a national treasure

[@aurumone_exe]

“You’re welcome” made my jaw drop.

[@stonehobson2487]

Thanks for this video. I was curious to know how the character of Todd came about. The racoon story was helpful. Todd is always confronted with a bad choice, due to his family and lifestlye. Must be stressful. Good interview.

[@capncake8837]

Not really stressful, killing people when necessary is a casual thing for him. He doesn’t enjoy it, but he doesn’t feel too bad about it either.

[@coconutshrimp6764]

That scene in Season 5 when Todd & his crew show up at Skylers house and she walks in the nursery with Todd standing there! Their acting was SUPERB!!!

[@mazharimam6827]

Drew waved hi. Todd waved bye.

[@Jeff_Biden]

that woman's arms bro

[@JustinBradleyPhotographer]

Dead Freight to me had one of the most unique feels to it of any episode. It was like a cross between Sopranos and MacGyver. If I had to pick an episode as my favorite, this would be it. So good

[@Scotto6977]

Some of the greatest writing in tv show history

[@josephfunes4480]

Perhaps, but still not as great as The Wire. That show is like the golden standard for a television series.

[@lichtfilme]

1:05 he had it coming 😂😄😂😄 Jesse is so deadpan funny I love him

[@XDaWsOnX2]

This guy is such a underrated actor. Just watched his black mirror and just wow. Absolutely killed it.

[@Vector2112]

She definitely lifts.

[@TJ-fe7rr]

She definitely looks after herself

[@haydeng3316]

Lol

[@cockroachv]

Well she's a guy so

[@FaposaurusRex69]

@@cockroachv when a girl is more built than you so you call her a guy to excuse your insecurities

[@matthewregalado9662]

I think it’s so fucking hot

[@deletebilderberg]

Jesse was SO cold in that role. Just marvellous.

[@WheelerKyle]

Todd was the best character introduced that season, he's fascinating.

[@larrycanupp411]

I like how so into the conversation they all are.

[@sohell1992]

It's weird seeing these two together. Speaks to the acting talent of these men.

[@Dragoneer]

I’ve always wanted to see a spin-off featuring Todd and his gang

[@thesunbehindthesun1574]

Same

[@PEACEOUTPAT]

two people my age I have so much respect for as true masters of an art form. Looking forward to more memorable roles from both of them

[@RJMacReady1]

Jesse plemons is such a great actor. Hes been great in everything Ive seen him in. Just saw antlers the other day, not a memorable movie by any means, but hes just awesomely understated in every scene.

[@CoolPandaTheMovieNerd]

Lol they were afraid of him and yet we see him here as a totally sweet person.

[@thenomad4123]

Yeah I remember when I first saw Todd in the show I was like who the hell is this guy, just a normal awkward kid. The actor didn't know who he was also it seems :) Never expected he would turn into a critical and intriguing character.

[@Ajesen]

Great description from Vince of how Todd goes about things. Not malicious or evil, or sadistic, knows what has to be done but difference is he can do it easily and without remorse because he doesnt really care

[@canyoubelieve2167]

That train heist scene was probably my favorite scene in all of BB. Incredible acting and writing!

[@jermyhopkisn9654]

Jesse Plemons is great at playing both murderous psychopaths and nice, harmless guys. Both are characterized with a lot of subtlety.

[@Baci302]

Jessie: "Well, you solved the situation." Todd: "Yeah, well, you're welcome." LMAO. That's chemistry.

[@evam7431]

todd is one of my favorite characters and that raccoon analogy really does describe him well

[@1zxtv]

I really liked how he played this character, not to say I like the character but how he portrays such a young, like he said eager yet clearly disturbed character with almost an innocence or unknowing of what/who he is and how that builds.

[@RED-yw7ov]

I think thats exactly what made Todd so great. He didn’t think a lot about what he was doing or who he was. He just did! He viewed everything and everyone as a tool to his success. People were to be used or disposed of for his gain.

[@Keshaire]

Daaaamn that hostess is BUILT

[@mjelves]

Like a brick shithouse

[@davidwright8371]

It was awesome to see them reunited on that black mirror episode hillarious!!

[@KoolDrip]

He was awesome in “game night “ Too! The whole cast was amazing

[@toptenguy1]

They created a character so scary, and casted a guy who was so good at playing it, that the writers got scared? They played themselves! LOL

[@basilaydyingm7506]

When Jeese finally killed Todd I was like "Yeah Bitch!" #BreakingBad Rules!

[@cowboyforgame1063]

Glad to see Jesse and Jesse together

[@86sineadw]

Jesse plemons is so good in everything he does 👐

[@peterfieldsfields532]

He is one intense dude. He did an amazing job playing Todd, though. I know you can say this about any actor playing any character but I genuinely don't believe there's another guy in the world that could have offered anything more than what he brought to the role of Todd. He was perfect, ticked every box. 👏🙌

[@Anonymous-eq7mp]

It felt like "Todd" was playing "Edmund Kemper"

[@codyt923]

everytime i see jesse plemons all i can think of is him in "like mike" lol

[@aaronmontane6479]

IM NOT AN IDIOT!

[@guestuser1479]

Todd did a great job playing Jesse Plemons. Truly a great actor

[@MyBenjamin73]

He looks like an evil Matt Damon, in a good way

[@pippishortstocking7913]

Evil? Lol He looks very British to me.

[@pippishortstocking7913]

@Anthony Dillonthat was a totally stupid retort.

[@vicvega4415]

Stuck up British

[@IronPal]

@Anthony Dillon calm ya tits. Fucking numpty

[@IronPal]

@Anthony Dillon You calling me a fockin monkey, that's bloody disrespectful of ya ya twat

[@GrabTheSwitchMike]

He had it coming man 😂 haha

[@BlazingOwnager]

That Racoon guidance was actually so perfectly spot on.

[@canyoubelieve2167]

Jesse Plemons was so fantastic as Todd!! Just mind blowing acting.

[@wes788411]

Jesse Plemons has turned out to be such a great character actor. When I saw him in Friday Night Lights, I didn’t really expect to see him to get many acting roles. Every time I see him in a role, he always stands out.

[@codyr.48]

He did such a good job playing that character that part of me hates the actor lol. Feels bad man.

[@lyricistanonymous8126]

Yes, he disgusts me now 😥🤣😂🤦🏾‍♀️ I can't even help it😣

[@burrob78]

Great writing for Todd. Definitely great acting

[@papaq3810]

Todd did a great job playing Jesse Plemons here

[@saturatedcranium]

His character reminded me of Anton Chigurh but not as calculative and bit more forgiving.

[@adorno_gang37]

Idk dude, Anton Chigurh acts intimidating most of the time while Todd tries to appear as a nice guy

[@locusstudioinc263]

Anton was a whole other level of scary.

[@kreek22]

Chigurh was half man, half myth.

[@mackey4113]

0:50 Writers should release that script like a novel or something 👍🏼

[@romilrh]

Vince's direction to Jesse Plemons was fantastic. Basically telling him, "don't approach this scene like you're actually committing this horrible act. Approach it like it's a necessary inconvenience. Because that's how Todd would feel about it."

[@thursday0186]

He’s an incredible actor

[@jeffrahmon7892]

Wow that lady is buffed

[@LuisViCastillo]

Jeff Rahmon and Todd the opposite 👌🏻

[@BambaZillah]

The only problem I had with El Camino was the discontinuity with Todd being bloated in it.

[@-Lola.]

My favourite episode in the whole series. I know it’s not the very best, but I just really like train sequences. Also it was really suspenseful

[@DW-nb2zc]

Hope this dude gets some more good parts in the future.He's a really fine actor

[@ciromauriciodecristo1517]

Whenever someone says Abby's arms are unrealistic I'll bring them to see these interviewers' biceps

[@arjunraj9422]

"Meth'' Damon .

[@faceripper77]

😂

[@xaviierm9332]

he did amazing playing todd. if you feel disgusted or weirded out. they def did solid

[@iletaMarchita]

one of the most tense shit ive ever seen

[@scottlemoire381]

Tod was a good soldier and I’d be glad to have a hundred like him.

[@darthkek1953]

Lydia missed a trick not shacking up with him.

[@Tuhnytte]

I knew someone was going to comment on her biceps 🤣

[@troydhaliwal7910]

That girl has got one hell of a fitness regime going💯💯

[@mchllwoods]

Loved Jesse and Aaron's cameos in Black Mirror episodes Beyond The Sea and USS Callister. Well, Aaron did a voice cameo in Callister then appeared in Beyond The Sea with Josh Harnett. Jesse just appeared in USS Callister.