Johannes Ockeghem - Missa Prolationum - Kyrie

Kyrie from Missa Prolationum by Johannes Ockeghem, in the wonderful rendition of Hilliard Ensemble.
Scores are in modern notation!

[@ColonelFrank07]

You put that last scene in there knowing all us poor desperate music students would be cramming in our chants the night before our history exams, didn't you? you caught me, well played.

[@hollycampbell3412]

i low key thought i was hallucinating for a second, like i know it's late but i didn't think it was THAT late

[@WillMartinez1999]

New Mexico State

[@brynkirsch5195]

UCLA

[@user-uj9bk9rv2i]

@@hollycampbell3412 😆 one tone lowered key can actually make someone doubt their own brain's function😅 such are the struggles of having perfect pitch!

[@anagator3051]

It’s due in an hour for me 🙃 it’s almost 7 am

[@JollyBard]

That ending! Perfectly appropriate since it's now almost 2 a.m. and I definitely should be sleeping.

[@user-rg3tc9de2f]

Antoine Beaudet f

[@MountainDewGirl]

Remember

[@DenisSteffenMusic]

you too hahahahaha

[@wserthmar8908]

2:24 am for me, May 8th 2024, right now when I’m sending this comment. What a beautiful piece of music

[@seuradu8065]

Johannes Ockeghem is een ware schepper van muzikale perfectie. Dankzij deze ongelooflijke componist hebben we vandaag partituren in de kerk in barokschrift.

[@RiccardoGiubilato91]

Astonishing how he could create beautiful harmonies using the double canon

[@abrahamiglesias1160]

This piece is very beautiful. I think I'm the only person in my class that is excited to hear ockeghem's pieces

[@user-se6ic1ns5y]

Редкая музыка!

[@BubbasMeisa]

You are the only civilized person in that class.

[@MountainDewGirl]

Remember

[@brysonstevens1431]

Then it is up to you to show them how Ockehgem, Josquin des Perez, and Tallis were some of the most brilliant composers in history.

[@johnkavanagh780]

So illustrious, this made my morning

[@maryjedynak1118]

I can't get to bed this is the first piece on the listening list 😢

[@florachu1987]

beautiful polyphony

[@roeliethegoat]

I came here because a wrote an article on why we play music during funerals. Came across La Déploration de Johannes Ockeghem, written by Josquin des Prez. Thought I'd give Ockeghem a listen. I don't know anything about classical music, but I love all sorts of stuff. And I must say, this is nice :)

[@nicolasgonzalezpaladino877]

2:38 the lick (almost) but 500 years before

[@andreaweidemann5186]

OMG

[@wserthmar8908]

Beautiful

[@MrDSCH-ib2mx]

How is this possible... This is not shown in the score in the video, but all of the 4 parts have different time signatures. The treble is 2/4, the mean is 3/4, the tenore is 9/8 and the bass is 6/8! Yet all of the parts sing in harmony and it sounds so beautiful.

[@thomastallis8819]

it's a mensural canon. And like the great J.S. Bach, Ockeghem's mastery of contrapuntal technique in no way compromises the sheer beauty of his transcendent music. Ockeghem is one of the greatest composers.

[@RubenJavierTovarEsparza]

Calling them by modern voice types this way is somewhat untrue since the original had only 2 voices: the Cantus & the Contra. But each had 2 time signatures, or prolations, hence the name Missa Prolationum: Mass of Prolations. The Cantus is in 2/4 and 3/4, while the Contra is in 6/8 & 9/8. And, if you notice, on the first image with score, you can slightly see neumes on the far left. And there's only two since each represent two parts. Ockeghem & other 15th century composers such as Du Fay and Josquin are legendary in this regard.

[@mim194]

Pieces of music like this make me want to cry.

[@poritoshmukherjee5964]

*LEGEND*

[@nakiarobinson862]

This is the first time I'm listening to this, from the moment it started I fell in love with it

[@emilywaters7279]

I feel personally victimized by the ending as a music student cramming for my music history essay at 1:30am. Thanks friends

[@RosetheEnglishShepherd]

That ending is brilliant, wish I could! Too much studying to get done x)

[@nickos3]

Wtf, so relatable rn lmao

[@esuke091]

I was listening to this song for my music before 1600 class. It's stunningly beautiful. And then the end happened. And I started dying laughing. It was awesome. Thank you for making my finals week that much better :)

[@ethanprescott4683]

This is fire

[@onaocn]

Ockeghem (appendice) A quell'epoca non esisteva partitura e ogni voce era scritta su parti separate. La Messa inizia e sviluppa un canone doppio, tra Bassus e Tenor, e Contratenor e Superius in contemporanea. Christe eleison 2 sole voci si sviluppano in contrappunto libero qui. Contratenor-melodia di rara bellezza con una progressione di tre elementi discendenti (modernità) alla metà della batt. 2 che completa la battuta 3. Sib alla batt. 4 per evitare il tritono (diabulus in musica) e clausola cadenzante (Landini, modernità) con Fa# (semitono aggiunto del II materiale sonoro). La, al Bassus che forma una settima con il Sol al Contratenor che entra in ritardo in levare (modernità), che scende al Sol, (gregoriano, antichità). Batt. 6 con sincope ritmica e batt. 7 con clausola cadenzale (I materiale sonoro con Si naturale semitono naturale della scala di Do). Da ascoltare più volte per chi non legge la musica (alfabetizzarsi costa poco) per annotare le ricche invenzioni sulla falsa riga di quanto ho indicato, per chi alfabetizzato è, noti la chicca alla batt. 11, clausola al Superior priva di semitono, Sol naturale per mantenere il rapporto di esta maggiore col Sib del Contratenor.

[@tuttibae508]

Obrigada!

[@kwmusic56]

I loved the end!!!! Very clever!

[@jankawiorski]

Listen to this music is like to be on eternal holidays.

[@elEzeOrtizCanciones]

tremendous. thanks, and thanks for the ending!

[@iamthestig1]

Kyrie eleison down the road that I must travel Kyrie eleison through the darkness of the night

[@nicolesouth1716]

Beautiful. And what a spectacular finish :P

[@agato90]

Woooo!!!! impresionante, hermoso, ahora que me doy cuenta, con todo eso del pop y lo actual, la musica a involucionado.... saludos n_n

[@therealzilch1153]

Yeah, this is a great piece, and Ockeghem is a great composer- like Machaut and Bach, a master at combining mathematical precision with lyrical melodies. But as I'm sure you've noticed, the score is not synchronized with the music here.

[@ragazzotopo]

I'm sorry: it was! It has been synchronized for years...this is a real surprise! I don't know what happened! I wrote to KZbin some weeks ago about this problem but nothing changed! :(

[@therealzilch1153]

Thanks, ragazzotopo. The main thing is the singing anyway.

[@MountainDewGirl]

Remember

[@piquedard]

splendid! splendid!

[@musicaenlaniebla]

In his book "Kontrapunkt", Diether de la Motte explains the rhythmic aspects of the Missa Prolationum's Credo. Each voice follows one of the 4 different rhythmic patterns: tempus perfectus or imperfectum, each one cum (with) prolatione perfecta or imperfecta. But all rhythms follow an uniform "tactus" (speed of beats). A semibreve is perfect if is equal to 3 minims, & imperfect if contains 2. So, a perfect semibreve is longer than an imperfect one. What a task to compose with these rules!

[@KevinElamMusic]

if i'm not mistaken, the "prolations" are major and minor, not perfect/imperfect, right?

[@seniorskateboarder5958]

Read The Rhythm of Twelfth Century Polyphony by William Waite, 1954. He writes at length as to how plainchant went from tropes to modal music, how Chant was metric in nature (poetry, see esp Alexander Pope). He reproduces the Magnus Liber. Then look at 15th century polyphony, and how that emerged from modal music. And then just for the fun of it, study fugue writing.

[@kikikii123]

하...학교 수행평가때문에 명에도 없는 미사곡을 직접 찾아듣고있다니..

[@user-xz7jo5uk4s]

나랑 똑같누

[@kikikii123]

@@user-xz7jo5uk4s 진심ㅋㅋㅋ나 무굔데 미사곡을 내손으로 찾아서 듣게 될줄은 몰랐음..^^

[@ironmanveronika6407]

Sounds very good Am I allowed to use this in a video? I am building a cathedral in minecraft and thats what the video will be about. I would like to put this in the video as background musik.

[@onaocn]

Johannes Ockeghem (Saint-Ghislain, 1410 - Tours, 6 febbraio 1497) Alcune delle sue opere, accanto a composizioni di suoi contemporanei, sono incluse nella Harmonice musices Odhecaton (1501) del Petrucci, la prima collezione di musica da pubblicare utilizzando caratteri mobili. Sono passati 250 anni da Perotinus e l'allontanamento emancipazione dal canto gregoriano è sempre più evidente. Ma cosa c'era stato prima? Aristosseno di Taranto individuò alla base del sistema musicale greco il tetracordo, una successione di quattro suoni discendenti compresi nell'ambito di un intervallo di quarta giusta. Timoteo di Mileto che fu il protagonista della rivoluzione musicale del V secolo a. c. passò dal genere diatonico, a due nuovi generi: cromatico ed enarmonico, e alla costruzione della lira con non più di sette o undici corde, per consentire l'uso delle alterazioni (# b). Con l'Ars nova si vengono via via a costituire 2 materiali sonori, il primo equivale alla scala pitagorica Immaginecon semitoni tra il terzo e quarto grado (Mi Fa) e il settimo e ottavo grado (Si Do), sensibili naturali appartenenti alla scala. Mentre sensibili estranee alla scala appaiono tra il primo e il secondo grado (Do# Re), il quarto e il quinto grado (Fa# Sol) e il quinto e sesto grado (Sol# La). Giri cadenzali dette clausole che abbiamo già incontrato. Nei manoscritti antichi (canto gregoriano dal VII secolo d. c.) per riconoscere l'altezza dei suoni erano utilizzate le lettere alfabetiche. Due di queste C e F corrispondevano rispettivamente al Do e al Fa. Il secondo materiale sonoro sempre basato sulla scala pitagorica ma sulla scala di Fa, ha semitoni tra il terzo e quarto grado (La Sib) e il settimo e ottavo grado (Mi Fa), sensibili naturali appartenenti alla scala. Mentre sensibili estranee alla scala appaiono tra il primo e il secondo grado (Fa# Sol), il quarto e il quinto grado (Si Do) e il quinto e sesto grado (DO# Re). Ecco perchè troviamo dopo la chiave il Sib nell'armatura sul pentagramma, altra novità di rilievo rispetto al precedente tetragramma. Ockeghem fu il primo compositore a scrivere canoni utilizzando gli intervalli di seconda, terza, sesta e settima in modo continuativo. Assenti salti di settima, ascendenti di sesta M, molti quelli d'ottava. Uno dei più famosi contrappunti del 15 ° secolo è la sorprendente Missa prolationum, che consiste interamente di canoni mensurali, in cui ogni sezione esplora una prolatione diversa e/o una diversa distanza tra le voci e velocità relativa di ciascuna voce. Valori di nota per mensurale fiamminghi es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notaci%C3%B3n_mensural Testo trascritto dall'originale qui, click su complete score imslp.org/wiki/Missa_Prolationum_(Ockeghem,_Johannes) Compaiono 4 chiavi antiche Sib al Tenor e al Bassus Superius-Tempus imprfectus prolatio minor=2 brevi=4 minime. Motivo Fa Do Fa La Mi Fa Mi Do Do, ripreso dal Motivo del Contratenor (punctus contra punctum) Contratenor-Tempus imprfectus prolatio minor=3 brevi=6 minime. Motivo Fa Do Fa La Mi Fa Mi Do Do Tenor-Tempus imprfectus prolatio major=2 brevi=6 minime. Motivo Fa La Fa Do La Fa Do Do Do La La Bassus-Tempus imprfectus prolatio major=3 brevi=9 minime. Motivo Fa La Fa Do La Fa Do Do Do La La, ripreso dal Motivo del Bassus (punctus contra punctum) Ovvero un'opera di ingegneria musicale (punctus contra punctum) a 4 parti che sarà di modello ai posteri (J S Bach, Arte della fuga). Prima pagina Fa La Fa Do La Fa Do Do Do La è l'equivalente del "silenzio" militare nella modernità, a parte ciò nota di curiosità. Impianto su materiale sonoro 2 al Bassus e al Tenor, scala pitagorica di Fa (vedi sopra), niente accidenti alle 2 voci superiori libere di cadenzare a volte nel primo altre nel secondo modo Seconda pagina le imitazioni procedono come iniziato ma con varietas maggiore, diminuzione temporale e velocizzazione conseguente. Bellissimi gli effetti di eco che ne conseguono. Terza pagina Chiusa verticale magistrale Fa Fa Do Fa Il resto a voi.

[@PS-vm3we]

Are the other movements available?

[@moonyyummy]

omg the end totally got me

[@flutzeug5392]

Hello ! I love that, and I'm working on it currently. Could you share the score ???

[@ryan1victor]

@caardo91 The trick is the mensuration canon part is basically one giant F major harmony, and then it switches into equal note values for the remaining sections, setting a fixed distance between the parts. Still very beautiful nevertheless ;-)

[@farrand-uq6jf]

Hello from 2024🫣

[@gogogaga3974]

Gyorg Ligeti Got Me Here June 2020

[@segmentsAndCurves]

Ligeti :D

[@OscarMSmithMusic]

Where did you get this notation? I can't find it online :/

[@gabriel_kyne]

would you mind sharing this score?

[@MountainDewGirl]

Remember this

[@hildeskunstmusikheim5429]

Unfortunately the musical notes do not at all come parallel to the sounding music: Why that? What for the notes then? I just see that has been the case already 3 years before: Very unfortunate!

[@jokeberensen]

Great!

[@kaybrown4010]

Please synch the score with the music.

[@lliinnaa]

0:08

[@m3ntalcollid3r]

Beautiful Christe.

[@alexandermackay-smith2364]

Dang. Almost 0400.

[@c4tbr0wn]

es increible como fue evolucionando la musica, en el renacimiento era un poco simple, luego fue evolucionando hasta el clasicismo que fue (en mi opinion) la epoca donde la musica era mas compleja... es una pena que se haya inventado "musica" como el reggaeton y demas musica electronica, que simplemente demuestran una cosa acerca de la musica: Tantos años de evolucion tecnologica hicieron que la musica se rebajara a unos cuantos sonidos emitidos por una computadora D=

[@ltrizzle12]

Shame. You’re missing out on a new dimension of invented sound. So much beauty, complexity, simplicity and rhythmic perfection set to digitally tuned perfection. One can’t “experience” “all” of electronic music in a day, week or month. There’s so much of it now, it’s near infinite. Take some time learning it. There’s such a broad breadth of sound in the last 40 years, there MUST be something for everyone. Hopefully, you’ve changed your perspective of digital sounds in these last 11 years. ✌️

[@lunchmind]

Is it me or is the score out of synch with the music?

[@varana679]

no, it' s not you ..:-)

[@lunchmind]

Oh thank you. I thought I was losing it.

[@latelierdaugustin1850]

That's a shame indeed : the score is one page too soon each time !!

[@Pinkydoodle2_]

This is composed with a Prolation and Mensuration Cannon so each voice not only sings in different time signatures but also at different tempos.

[@laurelparsons579]

Weirdly, this only happens on Safari. If you paste in the same URL into the Chrome browser, the pages are in synch with the music.

[@itaintovertilthethin]

@PATRICKoxoEthafulm That really caught me off guard. I was listening and reading/studying for my 8am class, and I really did need to be getting to bed. So ironic and funny!

[@wookiewasabi5194]

Who's this christ guy they keep talking about?

[@ellansmith308]

But I got my music history exam tmrw! I can't go to bed now :(

[@josedeclercq1801]

Il est bien de Saint-Ghislain e quelle musique

[@alexsouris]

this a banger

[@tomarik]

I'm fairly surprised this song is so popular. This song is part of a class I'm taking. How do you make it to this video?

[@matteofinardi7755]

Same

[@rogermoore27]

I have this song on a CD but I love seeing it on KZbin

[@brinaomi4486]

I still don't understand. How did he turn 2 voices into 4.

[@Brettorini]

brina omi initially there are two voices, and two singers per voice. But, for each voice, one of the singers is singing 1.5 times slower than the other, meaning for example that they sing half notes as if they're dotted half notes. After 3 measures of this, the singers are exactly one measure apart for each voice, and so the music continues from there as two two-part canons.

[@brinaomi4486]

Delrus so does that mean theres never two extra people added to the singing

[@Brettorini]

brina omi that's right. All four are singing from the start. It's just that two of them sing slower than the other two for the first few measures. Then everyone sings at the same pace and you have a canon

[@HelennaRainhaDeTroia]

same melody with different timing

[@jordanwhite6964]

Hey, is it possible to get a copy of this score please? I can't find one anywhere!

[@ragazzotopo]

+Jordan White Of course :) we.tl/1VYPTwevpZ

[@jordanwhite6964]

+ragazzotopo Thanks!

[@krismariasy9728]

+ragazzotopo it says this is not available anymore! boo!!!

[@pannonia77]

You can find the score at www.imslp.org It says though that the score is not public domain in the US.

[@alexsadosky1339]

could you upload it again please? not available now. There's a version on imslp but it's in numes

[@chaconneviola]

ROFL! The ending!

[@MichaelCCB]

So beauty, but wait, where is the time signature? OMG :O

[@KevinElamMusic]

In the original, each of the four lines has a different time signature, corresponding to the four mensurations common in the Renaissance at that time: the top line was duple divided into duple, (think 2/2), the second line was triple divided into duple (think 3/2), the third was duple divided into triple (approximately 6/4) and the last is triple into triple (9/4). However, in modern editions, they typically normalize all four lines so that they have the same bar line spacing. Here, it appears that they've normalized the Kyries to 3/2 and the Christe to 4/2.

[@RubenJavierTovarEsparza]

​@@KevinElamMusicit's probably because most musicians nowadays have no idea how to read Mensural Notation due to various things such as different clefs, note shapes,and so on.

[@kevin_smdp]

Like si ves esto en 2026

[@palestrinabrahmsfan]

After finishing the piece...wait for a moment and don't just close this window. ROFL!

[@juliobarrios7022]

Gracias a Clemency Burton _Hill autora del libro " Un año para maravillarse" con sus dosis diaria de música clásica he conocido esta hermosa obra.

[@partypao]

Ending: WTF.

[@HypnoseElectrique]

@mytubeisapoohead Same , hehee

[@polska181]

+hi

[@inm42]

i thought you wrote double menstruation for a second there..

[@brysonstevens1431]

Oh the lost art of doing much by doing little.

[@segmentsAndCurves]

Wrong.

[@alexsouris]

#soundsofthesummer

[@riversandstones1644]

Modern notation sucks. Thanks for the video

[@MountainDewGirl]

Remember

[@smettodileggere5692]

Ciao! è possibile avere le partiture? grazie mille

[@filosofiastoria2688]

OK

[@sekine1118]

日本人のコメないとなんか寂しいな。

[@helenlauer9465]

I would dearly love to hear this wonderful assembly of music, but the 'advertisements' constituted by current high life DVDs of popular hip life beats with young people dancing erotically to music of a completely different genre, e.g. directed by Dr. Macey are totally caustic. WHAT WAS THE POINT?? for the Ockeghem / Desprez / Isaac audience most of this advertised insert material is absolutely awful. Absolutely. Even people who like both genres surely don't want them interspersed alternately one with the other. Sacred and profane do belong back to back, but not like this. WHY did someone ruin both streams like this???. Have to turn to a different youtube. Thank you, it's a real shame.

[@andrewhague1521]

Helen Lauer Have to agree with you, but I expect that youtube works algorithmically and simply inserts ads according to the popularity of the video. It would be great and actually intelligent if KZbin linked ads sympathetically with musical style. We have to remember though that its the ads that give us a wonderful free video service. I would not have dreamed that this could be done a couple of decades ago.

[@j.rossmayhew5269]

Helen Lauer Just get Adblock: it completely eliminates KZbin and a lot of other ads and popups!! Easy to install and it WORKS.

[@dataintedreality]

The end ruins it.

[@omnisquebe]

Nice way to ruin such sublime beauty.

[@IudiciumInfernalum]

What a gay ending.

[@wetbadger2174]

It's not the best but it's Ockeghem