John Deere B - Gasoline vs. Kerosene Demonstration

The "all fuel" John Deere's and other tractors of the early 20th century could burn gasoline, kerosene, and distillate/tractor fuel/TVO. This video demonstrates some of the differences between gasoline and kerosene. The main reason we don't still run kerosene in these old tractors is the price. Kerosene these days is usually over twice the cost of gasoline.

[@privatepilot4064]

Kerosene and Jet fuel are basically the same. Jet fuel is much cheaper to purchase at the airport and works just fine in kerosene heaters and diesel engines. In the Navy we used to clean parts with a bucket of jet fuel and a cigarette hanging out of our mouth. We never had a mishap and even threw the cigarettes into the bucket of jet fuel to extinguish them. Great video.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Interesting. Thanks.

[@Cougracer67]

When my dad was in his early twenties (during the mid-30's) his dad had several farms and a fleet of Farmall F-20's. Dad and three of his brothers had the job of plowing after harvest. He said that after several long days of plowing on kerosene the F20's would start losing power due to carbon build up on the valves. So they would plow for a day or so using gasoline so "the valves would heal up" (Dad's words). Plus, as mentioned, so much kerosene did not burn but got past the rings into the oil. After sitting overnight the kerosene would float on top of the oil. The tractor companies knew this and had a petcock on the side of the oil pan to open and drain off the kerosene every morning. Kerosene gradually fell out of favor and various companies came out with "cold manifolds" (without the exhaust jackets around the intake to heat the incoming kerosene), plus high compression pistons. The cooler intake charge plus the higher compression gave significantly more power than kerosene, plus less hassle getting the tractor going in the morning!

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Interesting. Thanks for the comment. The John Deere B in this video had a petcock on both sides of the crankcase. One must have been intended to drain off kerosene like you mentioned.

[@fordguy728]

My grandpa told me stories of running his A on Kerosene back when he was a kid farming. He swore the tractor make more power on kerosene and the exhaust manifold would glow red when plowing at night from the higher operating temps.

[@rogerclark9285]

I was wondering about the power comparison. I spent many hours on our B 50 years ago. My brother still runs it once in a while.

[@MichaelBrown-zp1sf]

My dad had an old 1940's International Harvester that had a small gasoline tank and a larger kerosene tank. Young people think that flex fuel/ hybrids are a modern concept. My dad was a hard ass but i wish i could talk to him now. Hes been gone about 14 years now.

[@NEAFarmKid4010]

This is a very, very interesting experiment! I've never seen anybody running their two-cylinders on Kerosene like they were designed. Neat stuff. One day I plan on plumbing my gasoline starting tank on my H up as a reserve fuel tank, and now that you've made this, I'm almost interested in taking it out and plowing with both fuels and seeing if I notice much of a difference, as I know Kerosene was supposed to produce slightly less horsepower from the factory.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Thanks. If kerosene was cheaper, I think a lot of us would still be using it in old tractors. As it is today, it is over twice as expensive as gasoline.

[@rogerclark9285]

Man does this bring back memories.

[@edwardgabriel5281]

I'm 95, me too.

[@billbright1755]

I remember our model D John Deere had a gasoline tank for starter purposes and a distillate tank for warmed up operations. The distillate was far less expensive. Seemed to run well on both without adjustments other than switching fuel valves. The A was gasoline only, the model 70 was diesel only with a small gasoline starter engine with separate small gas tank. The famous twin cylinder design with low rpm and high torque values with superior fuel consumption and the hand clutch operation. Those sights and sounds of farming forever with me. The gears meshing and the plow cutting soils, the grunt of the chuff chuff, the blackbirds as they found insects in the new turned ground. We would oft see the entire day’s changes from the seat of those machines. Also an Oliver Cletrac diesel and it’s related steel track clank sounds.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

I am curious if you happen to remember the price of the different fuels back then? Thanks for the comment!

[@paulstavrides9785]

I thought all Bs had two tanks.

[@dwhallon21]

Another excellent video. Great details. Explains fuel differences in common man terms.

[@duginvirginia5737]

Excellent video and thorough, well planned out experimental run. I was really surprised to see / hear no difference when the fuel change occurred while running. This was great !

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Yes, I was surprised too. The run on Kerosene was indistinguishable from gasoline. Thanks!

[@i_am_gohan9232]

This is really cool to watch.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@parttimer7624]

Great video. Been wanting to experiment myself on a farmall 12 with kerosene,diesel, and moonshine.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Thanks. I have a follow up video coming soon ...

[@SLED4NK7]

Awesome video. I run my 1929 mccormick deering 10-20 on diesel fuel instead of kerosene. It's designed to run on kerosene but off road diesel fuel is a little less expensive in my area and works just as well.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Thanks! I assume you're running a mix of diesel and gas in the 10-20, or did you mean straight diesel?

[@SLED4NK7]

@@AntiqueCarsandStuff Yes I meant straight, 100% diesel fuel. I was monitoring the manifold temperature and it has to get up to 450 degrees or so before you can switch it over to diesel fuel. Once on diesel fuel you can't even tell, runs clean unless you loose temp. I have 2 tanks similar to your B, 3 quart gas tank and a 15 gallon "fuel" tank. Turn one valve off the other one on.

[@robwhite3241]

@@SLED4NK7 Ive heard of 50/50 mix but never straight diesel. How's the power running on diesel? do you fowl the spark plugs much? Post a vid of it running on diesel!

[@dalewells4961]

My dad had a G John Deere that he ran on distillate. When he couldn't get distillate anymore he would mix 5 gallons of diesel fuel with 10 gallons of gasoline. They had different spark plugs for distillate burning use the metal part of the plug was about twice as long so as to retain more heat.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

I did not know that about the spark plugs. Thanks!

[@mrfarmall-vk4gw]

What a awsome video, i am gonna try this out some day just to see for myself. Nice job!

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Thanks. It was a fun experiment!

[@themadscientest]

Kerosene is between 120 and 150 F, also if keeping an old tractor like that I'd say use kerosene since it isn't going to be tainted with corn.

[@tractorsold1]

When Nebraska started testing tractors, they found dual-fuel tractors would produce the same power on kerosene or gasoline. Kerosene was not only cheaper, but also more available. But folks who tried kerosene in their Ford Model T found out the hard way that it had an engine who's technology had moved beyond running kerosene.

[@redrockplumber5124]

Fun video. Enjoyed the music too. Thanks

[@tangydiesel1886]

Another downside to kerosene or distillate fuels was that it would get past the rings and dilute the engine oil. Most tractors back then had two oil petcocks. It was recommended in the book to drain the kerosene off at the lower petcock, and then fill back up with oil to the top one. Or, if they just had one, to open it up and drain it every day to the correct level.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Yes, the JD had two drain cocks.

[@DanielMeyer-ls5ph]

An old farmer explained the popularity of stove fuel (kerosene) ; the tractors burned 3 gallons per hour on gasoline @ .03 per gallon, and burned 2 gallons per hour on kerosene @ .02 per gallon.

[@theusconstitution1776]

Like fuel oil or diesel fuel it must be vaporized atomized in order to ignite that’s why it’s one of the safest fuels that we can use!

[@patrickkane7207]

All fuel john deere's had shorter pistons, most were changed after the war to use gas, i'm 83 years old.

[@johnkelly903]

I'm 85 ours were on gas

[@anthonyhengst2908]

This is a great demonstration

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Thank you! I sure enjoyed it.

[@CPUDOCTHE1]

It appears that you have a gasoline manifold. Some had an all fuel manifold. My '40 B does. We used to run power fuel in it exclusively. We never started them (had a '43 A too) on gas. When we did switch them over to gas, we closed the idle and load jets about 1/4 turn. The other day it was about 55 degrees and I had to prove to my son that it would still start on one crank.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Do you happen to remember the price of power fuel back then? Just curious. Thanks.

[@johndeere1951a]

The Owner's Manual states a few less horsepower rating with the distillate. It must've been a challenge to build enough engine temp for the change over in winter

[@leonardcollings7389]

In the early 60s we would cultivate corn using fuel oil. Gasoline was 18c a gal and fuel oil was 13c per gal. The tractor would run all day but make sure you switch over to gas for the final minutes of work or you will never start it on fuel oil.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

What type of tractors did you use?

[@leonardcollings7389]

John Deere B for cultivating. A or 60 for plowing and latter on 720 gas, 730 diesel@@AntiqueCarsandStuff

[@edwardgabriel5281]

I remember. having to switch back to gas.

[@Whitebuffalo44]

Well done video, I have a 39 B and as soon as I can clean the junk fuel from the starting tank I will do the same. I have a couple of Fairbanks Morse Z engines that I use for jobs around my place. If you warm up the engine on gas it will run on diesel all day long. As long as there's a load I've never had carbon build up. The one engine has water injection to eliminate precombustion and reduce the impact on the connecting rod

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Thanks. How does the water injection work?

[@Whitebuffalo44]

@@AntiqueCarsandStuff there is a threaded hole in the head water jacket with a banjo fitting and a needle valve. The Tube goes into the head just behind the mixer and butterfly valve. When the engine is working hard it will knock from precombustion so water is added to stop the knocking. I've read that the correct amount of water will with the heat turn into hydrogen, and I turn give the engine more power.

[@misters2837]

Very Cool Test, I have never ran my G on Kerosene...The All fuel Deere tractors (at least to my knowledge) lasted into the beginning of the 50/60/70 series tractors which replaced B/A/G respectively, I am most familiar with the G/70 (Although my Best Friend owns B #60003 - The Nebraska test 1939 B and the 4th "Styled" B ever built.) As the 70 was the end of the All-Fuel tractors and the Gasoline/LP tractors were more powerful with their 6:1 to 7:1 and/or higher compression engines (and Duplex 2-Barrel Carburetors) they were down sizing the engines to get same or more power with less displacement 379cu. in...The All-Fuel 70 was a "Hybrid" of sorts, having the 412cu. in. "G" Cylinders with a Duplex Carburetor Cyclone Head, gave it 5 more horsepower over the 38HP "G" but it still didn't make the 48 belt horsepower of the 379cid 7.3:1 Gasoline "70" but it was close enough to satisfy the farmers "stuck" on "All Fuel" tractors.... It was a changing time as the 70/80 Diesels were making 50/65 horsepower respectively from 379/471cid engines on 30% less fuel than the G/D they were replacing.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Interesting. Thanks!

[@boots7859]

Pretty darn good video.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Thanks!

[@316jd140]

When they ran the Nebraska test, they documented whether it was kerosene, gasoline, etc. There is a website to pull up the tests on the older tractors, and it will also show the year and what fuel was used. It would be interesting to see what hp ratings a kerosene tractor versus a gasoline tractor to the same tractor model.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

I looked up a couple of those reports. I didn't find any Kerosene data, but I found some Tractor Fuel and Gasoline data .... A tractor running Tractor Fuel used about 11% less fuel than the gas engine, but also produced about 10-15% less horsepower than the gas engine.

[@carlkuhn5483]

@@AntiqueCarsandStuff It is interesting that kerosene burns hotter than gasoline. Kerosene tractors typical ran lower compression ratios to prevent pre-ignition or spark knock, I assume because of this higher burning temperature. The lower compression ratio contributes to the reduced power output.

[@carlkuhn5483]

Something else that occurred to me is that in the case of the John Deere 70, if you compare the All-Fuel version to the Gas version, the All-Fuel version maintained the same size engine as its predecessor, the model G (413 cu. in ). The Gas 70 engine was smaller (380 cu. in.) which helped offset the power loss due to the lower compression ratio. This explains why when a G or 70 All-Fuel is brought up to the specs of the Gasoline engine it will actually produce more power than an original Gas 70 tractor. By the time the of the Model 720, the Gas and All-Fuel engines were again the same size (360 cu. in.). This explains why All-Fuel 720 saw almost no power increase over a 70 All-Fuel while the changes to the Gas 720 produced a very significant increase in power.

[@rugerscout308]

@@AntiqueCarsandStuff also they don't record how the operators eyes burned when the wind shifted into the direction of the operator! We have a collection of 17 Letter Series John Deere tractors. Most are capable of starting on gasoline and switching to kerosene. We've done it with several of them and found that unless you are actually using the machine under load it is necessary to keep the tractor in the upper end of the temperature range in order to keep from fouling the plugs which would make starting the next time difficult. Back in their prime power days I'm sure this wasn't a problem. But I can bet at the end of the day operators may have cut that shut down/switch over time too short causing many a hard restart! There's no doubt they would run on kerosene, that's really the only advantage the horizontal flow two cylinder intake system had over the up draft competition of the day. (although IH also made start on gas, run on kerosene tractors at the time, all were up draft) Most manufactures went away from all fuel as soon as gasoline came down in price. As we all know now, kerosene is all but impossible to find and if you can find it it's much more expensive than gasoline so I guess there just no point putting anything but gasoline in the little tanks as well as the big tank and use them as a reserve tank.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Very interesting! Thank you.

[@jefffrayer8238]

The nice thing about the old 2 cylinders is they will burn most anything. With the sediment bowl they are a good place to burn up old gas if you're going to work it a while. Many engines can burn alcohol if warmed up on gas but it means little since the price difference. You have the right manifold for distillate as there is also a gas manifold. Distillate served a purpose back when it was 1/3 cost of gasoline but became useless and outdated later. Idling , doing nothing, proves little about the advantages of using kerosene. Most farmers replaced the low compression pistons designed for distilates for high compression pistons and enjoyed the more power and advantage of gasoline. In fact that tractor could easily have the gas only pistons rendering it useless in successfully working hard using distillates. Nice demonstration but has very little value. Farmers left distillates for a reason.

[@Tad-vd2do]

I know this videos old, but you should try distillate too. Most confuse that with kerosene and compare all 3.

[@olgabloziene6597]

Thanks, very informative

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Thanks for watching!

[@nathanduckeorth806]

This is really interesting,,I wonderd how and why them old JD run on kerosene

[@BlueBlazer47]

I'm wondering if jet-octane kerosene burns any more readily than normal grade kerosene. Wish I'd been there - I love the smell of burning hydrocarbons.

[@brianshields7137]

Try towing a plot on kerosene you will see the difference we used to plot for 15 to 25 minutes on gasoline pre change over and after it was easy plowing no hesitation ,winter was harder we ran a copper tube around the exhaust to help keep the fuel going to the carburator hot

[@PaulCTownsend]

Interesting thank you.

[@adaboy04]

Did you notice any rise in running temperatures on the kerosene? Just was curious seeing it burned warmer in the dish. Cool experiment!

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

I ran the tractor for about 15 minutes on kerosene and there were no changes to the operating temperature. Maybe a longer run would have caused the temps to increase? Hard to say. These John Deere Bs run so cool anyway. It would be interesting to perform this test on a 4 cylinder tractor .... and record the temps.

[@milkman1944]

Dad had a B from the early '40s and we occasionally ran it on kerosene. When we were discing, it ran noticeably hotter on kerosene and would have to run a lower gear when we were discing uphill to prevent overheating. I didn't notice a change in power but ran hotter when pulling hard.

[@timgeissler6045]

I run my John Deere G on 40/60 gas/diesel when I have it out in the field I don't plow a lot but when I do I use the old G and I do notice it runs smoother with that mix compared to just using gas and seems to have the same power I do notice if I have a little to much diesel it smokes fairly good but if I keep it 40/60 or 50/50 it's pretty close to burning kerosene

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Interesting. You wouldn’t think diesel and gas would mix well. Thanks Tim.

[@JohnSmith-fs4dx]

Is kerosene still available today to use as fuel? Did your tractor run hotter or did you have to change the radiator shutters to regulate engine temperature as a result of burning the hotter fuel?

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Kerosene is still available but it is expensive. Yes, the tractor ran slightly hotter on kerosene.

[@PatrickquintonOwens]

Could you get a bit of oil and put it in the kerosene would that make it behave more like petrol how would you keep it from seperating though or would it?

[@farmingforfunandprofit940]

During WW2 Gas was Rationed........ My Dad worked at the Navy Yard In Charleston about 60 miles He Plumbed A Flat Head Ford Woody station wagon...... with a kerosene tank and two valves by the seat...... He Would Get it heated up on Gasoline switch over to Kerosene on the open road... once he go in traffic he would switch back to gas.....About every so often my brother and himself would pull the heads an remove the carbon......

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

That's really neat. I could see myself doing something like that back then!

[@claudioguzmanb4404]

Hola, acá en Sudamérica en los antiguos tractores John Deere 60,se utilizaba kerosene y no petróleo, a excepción de los modelos 730 y 830 que sí funcionaban con diesel... obviamente por el bajo costo del combustible.

[@timnewman1172]

Nice running wartime B, too bad about the Van Sickle paint...

[@hitmanharding0075]

I know a bloke that runs a 1990’s Range Rover on kerosene with fuel the price it is he is paying 16p a litre the motor never grumbles either been going on it a year already. I’ve ran older diggers and dumpers on it too but one Kubota we had must of had a sensor cause it refused to work on it

[@michaelaversa5572]

The fact that it burned slower means you'd get better milage, I guess. Although some of the comments seem to suggest you get less hp from the kerosene. Too bad Kerosene wasn't so expensive aside from our current climate.

[@MrAM4D3U5]

I think your heat gun was picking up the temp of the glass you had the kerosene in and not the liquid, good informational video though 👍

[@michaelaversa5572]

Interesting. Thanks for that. I have a 41 H that is the same deal, although we have never run it on Kerosene. I would think there would be more lubricity with the Kerosene also. I thought I remember the owners manual saying you may have to tweak the carb jets a bit with Kerosene, but it seems as though yours ran fine. Maybe under load you would ?

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Yes, more mileage (working time) on kerosene is my conclusion. I was unable to test HP comparisons but it seems that lesser HP (if any) would be offset by the huge cost savings in running kerosene vs. gasoline back in the 40s. You can Google some of the old Nebraska tractor tests…. Some of them do report differences running different fuels, although those reports are somewhat difficult to understand.

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

There was absolutely no difference in the way it ran on kerosene vs. gasoline. Doing this experiment under load might answer more questions. If you saw Part 2, the operating temperature did increase on kerosene. Some folks have said that exhaust manifolds would often glow red after working with a tractor on kerosene.

[@michaelaversa5572]

@@AntiqueCarsandStuff I believe the manual had the results from the Nebraska tractor test. I'll take a look at the manual tomorrow. It would be interesting to see if they specify if the tests were done while running on gas or Kerosene. If it's in there, I will let you know.Time for bed, ha ha .

[@michaelaversa5572]

@@AntiqueCarsandStuff I didn't see part 2 but will take a look. Thanks again .

[@michaelaversa5572]

@@AntiqueCarsandStuff Nebraska Tractor test 312 was performed on Distillate.

[@ymarb7085]

Would ya consider tryin a video with wood gas ?

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

No, but this link has some good information sources .... journeytoforever.org/biofuel_woodgas.html

[@johnkelly903]

You always wanted to make sure you shut it down by running it out of fuel.

[@charlesatwell6658]

I forgot to ask did the fumes out the exhaust smell like a diesel tractor?

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

I noticed the smell more in “part 2”. It smelled more like a kerosene heater than diesel.

[@swampfizz]

does that JD still have its curtains by the radiator?

[@charlesatwell6658]

I wonder how many farmers forgot to switch back to gas when they parked their tractor and then flooded it the next day trying to start it on kerosene?

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Yes, that would be a problem. I bet that happened a few times.

[@johnkelly903]

It wasn't fun did it as kid on neighbors 39 B. We run gas in ours so I killed like we did ours at home.

[@billbright1755]

They were better to not lug excessively and choose a gear that allowed for pulling without exhaust smoke. Smoke was unburned fuel and also could flood cylinder walls to migrate into oil system. Also if cylinder primer cups( if equipped ) were opened to insure no hydraulic lock above piston at first strokes of starter procedure. The D was hand flywheel start the others electric start. 70 gas gasoline pony witch also helped wam cylinder head of diesel engine via shared coolant system for cold weather conditions.

[@nathanduckeorth806]

Wouldn't think that would be too good for the spark plugs but I don't really know!

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

Yes, you wouldn't think so .... but, most everyone burned kerosene in their tractors back then. It makes you wonder what, if any, long term effects there may have been.?

[@travismoore7849]

A carbon felt wick will catch fire like gasoline if soaked in kerosene with a gentle breeze blowing.

[@jayeddleston9486]

I run 1937 A on kerosene all time it’s good for mosquito control 😂

[@my_carp_life3424]

Is USA KEROSENE the same as UK PARAFFIN?

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

I believe they are very similar but not exact. Paraffin is a more refined petroleum product than kerosene. Besides a slightly different chemical composition, paraffin has less odor and will produce less soot when burned. I don’t know how well it would work in an old tractor.

[@mcw1593]

Maybe I just didn't see it, but as a professional solder-er your can is just screaming for flux.

[@PatrickquintonOwens]

I think you can run a diesel or at least mix it with diesel aparently clean the engine doing it now andvthen though Im not sure guy who demonstrated this his van broke down shortly after, modern engines are much more finely tuned ect, not a good idea I'd think to mess or alter fuel supply

[@AntiqueCarsandStuff]

I don’t think it would run well on straight diesel. Maybe mixed with gasoline it would do ok.

[@EricMatson-ru7jj]

Nothing new all older John Deere tractors were made to run on it There is a 1 gall tank that held gas and you ran it till the motor got hot and there were shutters in front of the radiator too

[@warhound7781]

my father commented how mad grandpa used to get when they forgot to switch tanks and run the old A out of gas...lol