Day 9

[@davidsproul5562]

Love your work and have for years. As you move from centerfire to shotgun, especially for patterning, you need to use a 30 inch circle at 30 and 40 yards and want 75 - 80% of pellets to fall into the circle. Shoot at a 4 foot x 4 foot square with the circle centered on it. Then you can adjust chokes to obtain the desired pellets into the circle.

[@albydoucet8467]

Watching this brings back memories from when I was younger.

[@Cr0wmagnum]

It takes time to get the "feel" of the fold crimp. Nothing wrong with going slow at first. Can't finish right if you don't start right. I have never loaded slugs but it has been on my mind as well as the shorty shells. Why not both? Look foward to this new endever into shot shells.

[@WhateverYouWin]

Trying to watch the new JRB before work makes me late everyday. Gonna have the Biden effect on the economy. Come on man! 😂

[@1steelwheel1999]

as always i enjoy learning with you as you undertake this journey

[@estuardoadrianrosalesherna45]

Thanks for the information😊

[@chrisaumaugher3732]

I went down a similar rabbit hole about 15 years ago, but I did black powder, brass, and paper too. I have really enjoyed watching your videos and remembering the lessons learned; thank you.

[@fabgod420]

Love the dailies.

[@timmmyehu4013]

YEEEaaahhhh Johnny didn't blow his face off lol

[@tip56789]

Thanks for the videos! I jumped on your channel when I saw your Grendel and ARC content, then you got me hooked with the 300 Winnie and 223 loading. These daily shotgun videos made me clean off my MEC JR press I was gifted and I'm getting ready to load some squirrel loads with it. Thanks man! Your channel has helped me more than anything else in demystifying rifle and shotgun reloading. I've loaded in the past but never quite figured out what mattered for accuracy and what didn't. You are the man, thanks again!

[@paulhouse2445]

First, I basically learned to reload rifle Cartridges from your generosity. Now I am one of the guys with 20 different powders, and dozens of bullet choices available. Understand that none of this is a dig at your process. Have you ever watched Taofledermaus? You are very good at researching, understanding, and be very clear about the process but I find it incredibly Helpful to watch the other end of the Spectrum. He uses hand tools and very basic stuff to reload shotgun shells of all kinds. I love all the data, and in depth Conversation. I don't miss any of it. But I also like to keep in mind the guys that make it seem simple. Don't worry about the small stuff, and still seem to have good results with very few tools and very minimal expense. I absolutely don't want you to change! I just hope that it may help you as I feel like I owe you so much.

[@18wheelsandadozen6shooters5]

I use xmas wrapping paper to pattern, cheap and easy! I don’t reload shotgun as I don’t sour enough to make it worth it, but I have thought about trying it. I live in a shotgun state and 20ga sabot slugs are impossible to find. Figured I’d mention it in case you run out of things to do! Lol

[@robertrhodes4995]

I am glad you are reaching out to do shotshell because you spend the time to try and comply different recipes . Get up the good work !

[@matthewspeller]

Fantastic series mate! I'd suggest the big targets are not only a waste of time but they're going to be a pain in your butt. Ultimately the pattern outside the intended area is kind of moot. I would suggest a sheet of 8.5x11 paper with your trade mark 1" sticker in the middle. Maybe a 3-4" sticker if you want to get fancy and count the "kill zone". This will let you count pellets that really "count" without wasting half your day.

[@spyderxtra777]

I have never been able to successfully roll crimp a shell more than once. I roll crimp 3” hulls, cut down to 2-3/4” roll crimp once more then toss them. Also, if you are looking for a good turkey choke tube look at Indian creek black diamond chokes. We have had excellent luck with them.

[@scottlemee4986]

Looked to me like the roll crimp had a tighter pattern. Been enjoying this series!!

[@michaelbarrett2346]

Great work

[@JAM4MORE]

This series is awesome. Suggestion: its not practical but a heck of alot of fun. Just like the primer test video was fun. WAX SLUGS. Its a hoot and the weather is perfect for wax. Thanks for the videos

[@joearledge]

Good morning Shannon, I hope you had a good Christmas. I'm glad to see that you got good velocity readings, that's one thing I always struggle with with shotguns. Sometimes I'll get plausible readings, but often it'll try to tell me that the shell was 650FPS or 8,500FPS. 1. Your hulls and wads look fine to me. The velocities also look fine to me. 2. For pattern testing, I use 3Ft X 3Ft paper at 33yrds, the brown/tan packing paper in boxes from online orders works great for this or you can just buy a 3Ft wide roll of paper. 3. Yes the roll crimps can be reloaded. (I'm sitting here right now reconditioning the same clear 2 3/4" roll crimped hulls) This is where you will see more dramatic results with reconditioning. For those roll crimps that have curled in on themselves, Step 1: use the handle of a spoon, or I use the handle end of some "surgical tweezers", and scrape the mouth of the hull back and forth in a circle to "break up that scar tissue". Step 2: is recondition them giving them a very slight flare. Because the mouth is more jacked up than fold crimps, you have to carefully flex the mouth as you insert the hull conditioner, gently working it into the hull so that you don't iron down part of the mouth into the hull. For this same reason, I don't decap or resize these specific hulls till after reconditioning. Step 3: is immediately place the hull on a mandrel and let it cool for a few minutes. I use three 3/4" X 7" wood dowel rods and get a 6 hull rotation going as I work, but anything in the ball park of 0.740" should work. This is done because the mouth wants to curl back in on itself as it cools. 4. Most people put something in the bottom of the TPS wads because they are concave. In buckshot, the concave shape means it's a massive pain in the butt to stack pellets, and some have tried it and a pellet or 2 usually gets stuck in the wad and can blow out the bottom. The TPS has no cushion unless you add some(the cork and felt, ect) which may lead to increased deformation of the lead shot during firing or other issues. Not sure what the result will be with your loads, but it's worth a try. 5. Buffer should tighten up your patters and reduce setback. There are several on the market that you can try. Other than increasing pressures the only caution I know of is Precision Spherical Buffer tends to shred hulls sometimes unless you use a full length wad(like the TPS you have) so you should be fine to try it with these loads if you want. 6. The way you are seating your cork, felt and wads is perfectly fine. Any "compression of the powder" goes away when you stop pressing on it unless you have something to hold the compression. Some super tight wads, or over powder cards do this a little but not much. Just think about compressed loads you've made before. If powder springing back will increase the COAL of a rifle round, then it's going to lift that wad. 7. The couple of flakes of powder creeping past the wad is fine. Scatter gats aren't consistent enough for that to matter(50FPS to 100FPS ES). If you end up getting a ton of powder leaching past the wad, or just want to satisfy your brand of OCD, you can use an over powder card. Sorry for the novel again. You have helped me so much over the years, the least I could do is try to save you a head ache or 2. I hope some of this is useful to you or someone else. Thanks, Respectfully, Joe

[@jeremiah7855]

Love this series I've been wanting to get into reloading shotshells also this has helped watching all these videos

[@gunfunandstuff9226]

never can be too cautious when it comes to reloading....go at whatever speed YOU are comfortable with

[@graypatriot1299]

I'm enjoying these videos.

[@jonathanmcewen8438]

I recommend using ballistic products original buffer. The precision buffer will rip hulls apart if a lot contacts the wall of the hull. Just keep that in mind when selecting buffer. The precision buffer does do well in full length wads like the TPS wads.

[@freerange1776]

If you don’t add some form of wad at the bottom of the TPS Wad the shot will punch through. Bubba Roundtree Outdoors has mentioned that issue several times although he is shooting buckshot. You need some shock absorption (wads, felt, etc) to reduce pressure spike. In buckshot loads, the pellets get deformed and don’t fly straight without it. That’s why Fig 8 wads and most wads have a compression area.

[@thastinger345]

You've about got to have a cushion of some sort in the shot column of those wads as they don't have their own like a traditional wad. Those wads are intended for steel shot, their shot cup is so big because the volume of steel BBs needed to get 1&1/8 is much greater than the volume if using lead shot. Try the MG-42 wads, thick pedals and big shot cut but with a cushion

[@kuronyan3006Ackley]

😀😃😁😄👍‼️

[@o2wow]

If you have a newspaper printer, they often give away newsprint roll ends that are handy for patterning.

[@bobbylee7801]

6:23 obturation. Happy holidays 🎉

[@billmounce458]

Blue Dot is a pretty forgiving powder. Shot a lot of it in magnum pistol loads.

[@Milspecpoptart]

I always thought the shot buffer resembled powdered laundry detergent... Might give you a nice clean scent out of the barrel.

[@tommeboy3334]

seating the wad is to get out the air under the wad. In steel shot it is 100lbs. It helps

[@Hjerte_Verke]

You need to put up a new target each time. Cheap patterning targets can be had from something like a 24" x 36" newsprint pad (for artists) or a roll of wide kraft/wrapping/utility paper. The center of aim can be a cheap 3-4" sticker or even a hastily drawn circle with one of those felt markers with a 1/2" tip. EDIT: I wrote this before hearing 15:40, great minds...

[@ekimw69]

Not sure I've ever seen a pump eject like that. Looks like it's an auto eject the way the forend comes back. Maybe I've never shot with a bag. Looks sweet. Cool videos

[@jonpitt3485]

a 1300 like that one is supposed to open like that , its called something by winchester but ive forgot . I have never shot without holding it though . it partially opens when you shoot it normal

[@jamespugh]

Nice to see those loads work for you. Some full chokes in guns shot sorten loads different. My Xtra full in 500 toss my 3inch 4 shot factory loads high . Where full chuck right on about Where extra full Hatfield dose same about but full open up good bit to mossberg full. Shotgun lot of load patterning see what works and what choke works Where screw in is key.

[@glendavis9663]

👍👍

[@michaelbarrett2346]

Thank you

[@alexllc2958]

Mathematically speaking : buffers have no effect on each pallet speed !

[@Francois_Dupont]

1:08 why does you pump action open and eject automatically???? also could you please make a video about reloading/making mini-shells? around 1.75~ inch.

[@joelclark2130]

You need to put shotshell buffer instead of those extra wads, felt. All the heavy duck and Goose loads. That I load I like to use shot media.

[@wadekirby8575]

If you seat the felt wad under the shot cup the shot should not be able to setback nearly as much. I think that would reduce shot deformation and improve the pattern. My old Ithaca 37 was a 2&3/4" only gun, and it cycled 1&3/4 shells perfectly.

[@kevinlawrence3497]

👍

[@tyler6147]

Instead of counting the number of pellets that hit, have you considered measuring the overall diameter of the pattern? It seems like that would have a bigger influence on end use. Maybe. I think.

[@Thee_Sinner]

Pot que no los dos? Count them both and get shot density

[@clintfawson3302]

Being in law enforcement, we have always been told to never ever shoot slugs in anything less than cylinder bore as all of our shotgun ammunition is slugs. No constructions at all. Having aid that, I have to wonder if using full chokes has something to do with the poor patterning. Our 14 inch barrels will shoot a 5 inch group at 50 yards. Just my experience though.

[@morgunfreedom4346]

Watching the action opening under recoil reminds me of a buddy getting a new 1300 and, for some reason, putting his left hand on the receiver... his thumb filled that space where the pump overlaps the receiver 🤣

[@Francois_Dupont]

why does his gun does this? i have a mossberg 88/500 and i never did anything like this. maybe his lock is broken?

[@jonpitt3485]

@@Francois_Dupont it is made to do that winchester called it something as a selling point . I have one and would do this but i never shoot it without having my hand on the pump,with your hand on it it generally opens a little with a target load and alot with 3"

[@Francois_Dupont]

@@jonpitt3485 i find it strange, but OK.

[@tommeboy3334]

Go buy a bunch of the christmas wrapping paper. Flip it over and use the white side for the target. This is when I get all of my paper for targets as it is so cheap right now

[@denisleblanc4506]

The felt wad isn't only to fill the wad properly. Its to cushion the shot so it won't be deformed by firing. I wonder if what you called setback wasn't actually setback but it that the front pellets are the ones with the least amount of pressure so they don't mark up the wad as much as those at the rear of the shot column. Then don't forget that it goes through you choke and squeezes everything again. Forcing cone and choke will squeeze the shot column. As for the velocity difference between the shell length its probably just a matter of the extra felt wad allowing more compression thus reducing the pressure peak and velocity. These are very fast powders that probably are completely burned in maybe less than an inch or two. An extra quarter inch of compression is a lot when compared to where the pressure peak occurs and the actual peak pressure. Thats my guesses anyway.

[@cfoutdoors0624]

I buy painters paper from Lowe’s. I think they’re 48” rolls. Make you a stand 48x48, or so. I think that’s around basic size for shotgun pattern board. I don’t reload, so you take this with a grain of salt. I feel if you can make your 1.5oz load work in 2 3/4, what’s the point of loading same charge 3” shell? I would think that you’d only want the 3” shell for heavier load or heavier charge.

[@kirkboswell2575]

In general, you don't want to ignore cushion wads, but the tungsten shot won't deform like lead, so you would probably get away with it, but I don't think it's a good idea. Starting pressure would likely be much higher. The cork and felt cushioning wads certainly help, but they are actually too compressible. Vegetable fiber cushioning wads are much firmer than those, and are the standard cushioning for shot columns.

[@cfoutdoors0624]

My thought or opinion on the loss of velocity in the 3” would be during the firing cycle the extra distance compression of the 2nd felt used too much energy. For science, you could try filling that area with cork being it compresses less and see if you gain velocity over 2 felts or match the 2 3/4 load.

[@vomitingwithungodlyaccurac3218]

This has been a fascinating series. I don't reload shotgun stuff yet. I'm hoping to start casting and loading slugs with the new year. Do you have interest in loading slugs?

[@markyoung7470]

Pattern control will help with Buffer and then again it could be your choke. Buffer will help with flyers by helping keep the shot from being deformed during acceleration. Another thing you could try is coating your wads with graphite powder it may be possible for you could get a little higher velocity and a lower ES.

[@veteranironoutdoors8320]

As far as paper goes, get painters rolls of paper, probably cheaper than any other roll of paper.

[@pulldeauxduck2480]

Don’t know the yardages for patterning shotty ,uncut cups have interest for me, The 1100 to1200 FPS look good ,,uncut cup would/should stay together longer,,,sounds Like another test- fun work work!🦆

[@tonylutchka7219]

Believe it or not different wads will create different patterns it's not just the choke

[@gunfunandstuff9226]

in a pinch, use corn meal for buffer

[@diggernash1]

I was hoping that you would set up the lab radar and determine the ballistic coefficient of the wads. Someday...

[@samuel-JF1981]

Probably not, wads are stealth 🤭😇

[@thethinbrownduke6412]

Good vid, yes, the last one was painful to watch 6 and 8 fold crimp. Better not take me that long to load the buggers......

[@timpille8495]

The longer wads have more drag in the barrel that could cause your slower speeds

[@catlinlowes3312]

How much do the felt pieces weigh? Could it be as simple as the weight causing the drop in velocity?

[@H.R.6688]

Idk if I would run those wads without anything in the bottom, those Don't have any cushion for the load. The figure 8 does. I would think the shot would get flattened without anything to cushion it.

[@gunfunandstuff9226]

I believe in his previous vid, he added a felt cushion inside the wad before adding the shots/pellets

[@jeffallen3382]

Interested in how you liked the red dot on your shotgun? I've been wanting to do that with my 870 for rabbit hunting.

[@Francois_Dupont]

you dont really need a scope or a red dot while you are small game hunting. just point and blast.

[@jaythus3181]

You wouldn't need it but you'd probably like it, especially if you're not consistent with your gun placement when shouldering. I'd probably suggest getting a larger dot size or a dot that has a circle around it if you decide to get one. Also if you have astigmatism (if you're driving and headlights look like they are exploding or has lines coming from them) you might prefer a prism or holographic sight to a traditional red dot since they can look a bit blurry if you have it. Most can deal with it but if you have it bad it can be something youll complain about. I think there are a few prisms that are around the cheaper red dot price so it likely won't be a huge expense if you decide to go that route.

[@Francois_Dupont]

@@jaythus3181 i do, i have both myopia and astigmatism or what ever it is called. i had trouble with scopes in the past and i am trying to keep all my "short range" gun to the bare minimum possible without having any fragile part on them. when i am hunting in the woods here it is packed full of branches and stuff. it is also common to have huge pile of snow fall on you all the time in winter. sadly for longer range i must use a scope, but since the deer/caribou permit is so expensive, and the hunting period for them so short i am not even big game hunting anymore. its just not worth it. (i am in Quebec) have a great chistmass time my frend

[@jeffallen3382]

@@jaythus3181 my astigmatism is really bad. I've heard the Primary Arms red dots are not so bad? But I could be thinking of another brand... It's been awhile. Reason I was wanting one is I don't like wearing my glasses. Moat I'd be doing rabbit hunting with dogs so the rabbits are usually on the run. I'd like to try the both eyes open with the red dot for those snap shots.

[@jaythus3181]

@@jeffallen3382 I think primary arms have some prism sights, id look into it a bit more before deciding on choosing one though. There's a really good youtuber that has a lot of really good reviews on a wide variety of optics. I'll find his channel and edit this comment, I'd look at him for some more information on it. Edit: channel's name is c_does I highly recommend looking there for a better idea of what you want, especially if you're like me and obsessively research and plan every medium to large purchase you make to make the correct decision.

[@tommeboy3334]

2 3/4 shells with the same data as a 3 in will always show more psi and pressure

[@charlesinscore4107]

I saw that powder in a vid. Years ago. Maybe Fortune Cookie. But I never saw if it patterned better. When you get your new target made. Could you maybe due a ,with and without powder pattern shot? I'm curious if it's worth it?

[@joethearcticfox]

My vote for targets is the shoot n see style. They would show up a lot better on video and it tells a story that "36 pellets on this target" just doesn't

[@joethearcticfox]

Also, you can make your own. Cut some cardboard to a size that fits into a cheap garbage bag, I prefer white bags. Then spray paint them black (white if you are using black bags) with the cheapest spray paint you can find. Once they are dry they work wonderfully as shoot n see targets

[@boozeandbullets2084]

Hey man, I cast the Lyman sabot slug for 12 & 20 gauge as well as the lee 7/8, let me know if you would like me to send you some to play with

[@Francois_Dupont]

i also have 7/8 slugs, 00buck and #4buck. if he pays for the shipping i will send how ever many he wants. (from QC)

[@ewathoughts8476]

I see your W1300 is an auto ejector, is that normal for a W1300?

[@paulharveu526]

Those looked like some pretty stout loads. Did I miss it, what shot size was the lead in this load, #9, 7.5s,?

[@MKPatrolGuy]

I think it is #8

[@kirkboswell2575]

- This series is with #9 tungsten.

[@MKPatrolGuy]

@@kirkboswell2575 He is going to do tungsten in future videos. These loads are 1.5 oz of #8 lead, he says this in the previous video.

[@kirkboswell2575]

@@MKPatrolGuy - Must have missed that, then. What I've been watching is tungsten, supported by using tungsten shot cups. I'll look again, later.

[@kirkboswell2575]

@@MKPatrolGuy - You are correct. I missed that bit somehow. Thanks.

[@j.sagiechode]

So loading a 3" the same as a 2 3/4 is a nothing burger, the point of a 3" is to increase shot or shot weight, and/or increasing the powder charge. if they are loaded the same the point is lost.

[@j.rob.5943]

He got 100+ fps difference between the 2 lengths. I’d say that’s significant.

[@JonIronhorse]

In this manner, it was used as a data point, and that makes perfect sense.

[@Thee_Sinner]

Do you have plans to do the same testing for buckshot?

[@ron4hunting]

roll crimps on slugs is the norm now . i got a old , realy old box of federal 12 gauge slugs that are star crimped . it is the only star crimped slugs i have ever seen . i was told they might be reloads but my uncle may he rest in peace never used or trusted reloads . since they are in his stuff he gave me before he passed i would say yes they are factory . after you get done with his are you thinking of loading brass shells ? i do in 410 but load data is hard to find . not much out there for smokeless powder .

[@brentwinkelman1990]

A 2-1/4-2-1/2in 1or 1-1/4oz #9tss load would be the the most intresting to me...1oz or so off #9 or 10tss is still a pile of shot for killing turkey or even ducks/pheasants

[@joeykennedy5910]

I'm asking this before watching the video so I don't know if you mentioned this but does barrel heat affect shotguns like it does in rifles?

[@pulldeauxduck2480]

Wouldn’t think so .

[@lunkydog]

Isn't the felt acting like the figure 8 part? If you're loading straight into the TPS cup, there is no give at all.

[@smalfry83]

Coffee and JRB

[@blkmoon33]

The 1300 should handle the shorter rounds. Everyone I've seen and mine in particular (1300 Defender) hasn't jammed. The action on yours opening right after firing isn't supposed to happen. You may want to get it checked.

[@dinoc.5537]

Yikes! Why does your action pop open on firing?!? It isn't just popping open, it is ejecting the hull!

[@minigpracing3068]

Need to crawl before you can run with that press, it's not like you've done this 10,000 times. Slow and meticulous seems like it would be a good process when trying to develop something new that doesn't really have a procedure yet.

[@kennethtephabock5634]

Reloaders

[@psykoklown874]

Compression in the shot column can make a big difference in velocity because it absorbs energy. The difference between the green BPI BRP-12 and FS12 (rebranded Gualandi wads) is ~100 f/s. It's only a 2mm difference in the crush zone, but there's also a difference in the design. 🢂CHECK YOUR EMAIL🢀

[@leeprimeroessler3277]

Something tells me that shotgun have the wrong pitch for you.

[@jacobwilbert1018]

Taking away your cushion is gonna deform your shot even worse, it will be a mess n it may mangle your wad.

[@WhateverYouWin]

The velocity issues are due to the scale with the +/- 0.1GN I’d guess. Small powder charges with larger % deviation. Anyhow…

[@timpille8495]

You should check out BUBBA ROUNTREE OUTDOORS on utube He has some great information on roll crimping shotgun reloading