Johnson, Sunak and Brexit: A Trio From Hell

[@elpresidente8730]

If Brexit splits the tory party then finally I will see a Brexit benefit.

[@markwelch3564]

Hopefully Brexit can end FPTP too!

[@HB-bl5mn]

@@markwelch3564 And end the UK and the ridiculous royals.

[@markwelch3564]

@@HB-bl5mn the UK is fixable, but the Royal Firm going away would be another good Brexit win if that happened 🙂

[@theon9575]

@@markwelch3564 voting the Royals (and the elitism & class division they exemplify) out of existence would be a huge gain for Britain. But I see it as a part only of overall growth and change necessary. And Brexit is/would be just a coincidental part of the process, now in Stage 1 "Getting over the Empire". To regard an overdue modernising move like Britain becoming a real democratic Republic as a "good Brexit win" is putting lipstick on the Brexit pig. Even the public legal murder of King Charles I didn't achieve that - still King Charles III sits on the golden throne while we repeatedly pray to God to "send him victorious, happy and glorious". Even with God, we should be careful what we ask for. 😂 🇬🇧

[@wombat44444444]

They appear to be destroying themselves. Fantastic...

[@frankoneill5675]

It's a bit much to suggest Sunak created the Windsor Framework. Minor adjustments were made in it, most of which were offered by the Maroš Šefčovič in October 2021, and which are largely predicated on the UK implementing the Protocol correctly. What Sunak did was to negotiate properly with the EU, abandoning the confrontational, hostile approach of Johnson/Frost/Truss.

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

For the Conservative Party, Sunak is the creator of the Windsor Framework, for his good or ill.

[@frankoneill5675]

@@JohnStevens-gp7ge For the conservative party, the British had the fastest vaccine rollout, won WW2 and put an end to slavery and the slave trade, all of which are also untrue. It's never too late to educate a Tory

[@mikebarrett691]

The Public are really fed up with seeing Johnson on all media platforms..for gods sake will he not just bugger off..

[@george78779]

This is a story of four people named Everybody, Somebody, Anybody and Nobody. There was an important job to be done and Everybody was sure that Somebody would do it. Anybody could have done it, but Nobody did it. Somebody got angry about that, because it was Everybody’s job. Everybody thought Anybody could do it, but Nobody realized that Everybody wouldn’t do it. It ended up that Everybody blamed Somebody when Nobody did what Anybody could have. The story may be confusing but the message is clear: no one took responsibility so nothing got accomplished.

[@Paul_C]

The Conservative Party needs to end, or maybe it should be split up, the lunatic fraction, the rich faction, the Christian faction, and maybe what is left might be called 'conservative'.

[@Redf322]

Same for labour split the actual left from the labour right.

[@federaltrust]

Our present electoral system encourages these broad party coalitions. Brexit however is a seismic shock which the Conservative Party may well be incapable of surviving.

[@Redf322]

⁠true the system is wrong but it is what we have . Broad churches are doomed to fail. Corbyn tied to unite the party now Starmer is purging the left. It seems current times with people more engaged in their echo chambers there is a rejection of big tents. Time for big changes.

[@Beliefish]

​@@federaltrust as someone who lives in a country with proportional representation system (Slovenija), I would like to remind you, that you still have to have a broad party coalition to have a majority in Parliament We currently have historically low 5 parties in Parliament,but just a year ago we had historically high 9 of them... how many do you think will exist in UK if you go for PR?

[@Redf322]

@@Beliefishyes true but if parties have to coalesce change can be bargained for. For example Ukip forced a referendum by stealing Tory voters. But If that coalescence is within a party it causes internal war. I think Uk would have plenty of parties to choose from. Some great and some not so good.

[@Jessjoe1956]

If brexit did destroy the Tories. That would be the one and only brexit benefit. At last we have found one.

[@johnclements6614]

They will just say that brexiters were not true Tories. "They were infiltrators from UKIP etc and useful idiots." They will most likely be able to sell it to the public but it will damage the party until younger pragmatic EU supporters join. They will have to have a period of reflection after they loose the election after next then elect a leader like Kinnock in 29 to remove the brexiteers then they may have a shot at power in 2034. But that is optimistic in my opinion.

[@Dwina5892]

Absolutely it's only positive

[@pierre976]

Brilliant conversation as usual. Thank you. 🇫🇷🇫🇷🇫🇷🇪🇺🇪🇺🇪🇺

[@dmoreyn]

I wish fedtrust would upload videos more frequently, this is truly one of the most informative and honest channels on politics in the uk.

[@federaltrust]

Noted and we will try to do more in future.

[@john22mcdona]

The Tories should be consigned to a footnote in history after the damage they have done to the economy

[@dogwithwigwamz.7320]

Cameron, it turns up, sold the country to save his career and party. Whilst Johnson, in the background, was doing exactly the same thing. Neither of them are Brexiters.

[@charlesbruggmann7909]

If it waddles like a duck, if it looks like a duck, if it quacks like a duck and if it tastes like a duck, it might well be a 🦆? « La vengeance est un plat qui se mange froid »

[@glendakirby5579]

That vote was fixed for Brexit to lose, and it still won Cameron was partying before the result. It didn't get anywhere because the globalists and their paid Politicians put a hex on it. They have made us suffer ever since and beyond around the world, soon be time to eat the bugs and submit our ownership of anything. Unless...........

[@normanchristie4524]

Does this make them both enemies of the british State?

[@dogwithwigwamz.7320]

@@normanchristie4524 It makes them careless as to what is in the interests of Mr and Mrs Average living on Average Street. As to this I don`t see much between the two. Neither of them have any idea what it`s like to be obliged to get a bloody grip ! Perhaps more importantly it means that there`s more a fantasist about them than there is visionary.

[@tomthumb2361]

It's odd that people assume the UK is a democracy, as it's actually a constitutional monarchy the arrangement of which gives preeminence to oligarchic interests and which has some democratic features that mask the unrepresentative character of all its institutions, from Parliament to the BBC. Two out of three of its main branches of government are unelected. Most people's votes in general elections are redundant owing to the FPtP 'safe seats'. Most MPs are elected by fewer than 50% of those entitled to vote. Oligarchy, asset- wealth. the Establishment etc. remain predominant. One reason the Tory Party has survived so long is that the post-1660 to 1710 settlement has survived so long, despite some tinkering with it and the introduction of universal suffrage. We are still left with a choice between two parties representing certain vested interests and by no means concerned for the welfare of the people as a whole.

[@s5utu]

@tomthumb2361:You have accurately described why so called "British democracy" is a falasey. 👍

[@HB-bl5mn]

Britain has no democratic tradition. They don't know how to behave in a round.table government. They approach everything like a football match.

[@martincarty3067]

I do hope so but my mum always used to say the Tories are like a Hydra, cut one head off and it will just grow another one.

[@federaltrust]

Brexit has deprived the Conservative Party of its traditional flexibility. It cannot wriggle off the Brexit hook on which it has impaled itself.

[@andrewblewett2300]

You guys cheer me up. There are civilised people in this country and we are not all xenophobic nationalist fanatics and economic fantasists. One day we will wake up - to realise that we are a pretty middling country with some potential for good if we manage our friendships well. The coming years are going to be very difficult as the rise of China and the climate and nature catastrophe begin to really bite, assuming we survive Putin etc. An influential role in Europe would be such a good idea.

[@dmoreyn]

I think the rise of china will be good for developing countries and the world at large. It will provide a counterbalance to the outsized influence of the global north countries

[@jonsimmons4150]

"middling country"- Like france you mean? Uk gdp depasses France, and uk has the worlds second largest trading center. Its NOT IN PARIS! i skim read thru a post.. I detect flagrant bullshittery, lies, hackneyed expressions.. ~Safe to dissmiss the whole post as bullshit.. Ps yours falls into this catagory

[@mikehutchison4892]

What is going to change rule “by divine right “ in our class-ridden country ?

[@theon9575]

@@mikehutchison4892 Goodness knows! You guys even publicly cut off a King's head once, and even that didn't work. Charles III comfortably sits where Charles I once sat. It's like most actually prefer class-distinction and rule by divine right. You don't hear many complaining 😂

[@theon9575]

@@dmoreyn The "rise of China" is more imagined than real, I think. The present uncertain Chinese economy and discontent over CCCP Government management are real. And the benefit for developing counties in the long term is doubtful, as seen in Africa now. Like the USA has always been, China is in developing countries for what it can get, not what it can give. In any case, China is also a "global north country", maybe the largest, so that just worsens that counterbalance, surely?

[@simonperring2546]

Brexit has destroyed everything it touches - whether the UK economy - the export sector - the careers of PM’s David Cameron, Boris Johnson, Liz Truss, and increasingly Rishi Sunak - and eventually the Tory party itself - indeed even Nigel Farage, the chief architect of Brexit himself, has said “Brexit has failed”. Indeed, with Brexit being made up of the two incompatible ideologies of a neo-liberal, high-immigration “Singapore-on-Thames” on one hand, beloved more by the extreme free-market capitalist wing in the Conservative party - and a nationalistic, no-immigration “Fortress England” on the other, beloved more by those provincial Conservatives in unsafe “Red Wall” seats - which are increasingly starting to tear each other apart as Brexit fails - the last thing that Brexit destroys will be Brexit itself... 😢

[@STOPTHEBOATSSTOPTHEMADNESS]

Lie lie lie fake news and brainwashed by the BBC Nigel f actually said brexit wasn’t taken full advantage of and the left wing conservatives have “FAILD” brexit so stop your spreading of shit, Woke far left propaganda “AGAIN” 😂

[@ajsctech8249]

It was very clear after the Brexit result in 2016 that Brexit would destroy the Tories. We may finally see the far right block of about 40 of 50 Tories being cut off when they become the opposition. It will take a new tory leader to remove these MPs or they will break away themselves and either join Reform or create a new party built around a far right anti immigrant and Trussenomics. The Tories need their moderate centre right people back and they basically just need a total reset.

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

The problem for that analysis is that it is far more likely the far right will not break away after an election defeat (particularly if it is severe) but will become the leadership, which will then bring on board the Reform and other extremist protest voters and remove the remaining Conservative moderates, who by then could be less than 40 MPs. Much will depend on the evolution of the economy, and the growing saliency of concern over high levels of legal immigration impacting wages, rents, services and even multiculturalism.

[@ajsctech8249]

@@JohnStevens-gp7ge Agree. A huge battle for the future direction of the Tory party is already taking shape. They need to get the moderates like Anna Soubry and Tobias Ellwood to make them a proper moderate party that could have mass appeal, but instead your Bravermans, Moog's and Truss are clearly already shaping up to take over the party in Opposition. I can't see a far right Tory party being electable then again i never saw Brexit coming. If the far right fail then I i think this national Conservative thing might become a new party. I think the Tories do need a split now as they have too many far right extremists. It will be popcorn time for us anti tories to watch them meltdown. Brexit has broken the tories

[@paulwilson4565]

'Folly rarely proceeds from any great design and its consequences are often a surprise.' - Barbara Tuchman, The March of Folly

[@markshirley01]

Proportional Representation

[@jasonkingshott2971]

PR?..Italy has had 70 governments in similar amount of years, good ad for PR.

[@markshirley01]

@@jasonkingshott2971 Germany version not the Italian version - completely different

[@jasonkingshott2971]

@@markshirley01 What has Germany got to do with anything?

[@willieckaslike]

At last: a much needed benefit from BREXIT. The destruction of one of the most evil forces in British Politics !

[@1stringendo]

I love this stuffy English , frightfully correct couple of commentators. You can’t avoid their total integrity, and passionate ( in a very British way) disdain for Brexit , and their commitment to the European ideal. Brendan you have my permission to remove your tie at least once!

[@dawnmoriarty9347]

The good side of the "Establishment". They are actually considering complex issues and discussing them thoroughly rather than going for soundbites

[@Lynnefromlyn]

Well there we are! There IS a Brexit bonus! If anything ça destroy the Tory party the. I’ll give it a thumbs up. Momentarily!

[@michaelmouse4024]

The brexit Paradox is that any govt capable of delivering brexit wouldn't. However, if brexit ruins the tory party then "every cloud..."

[@theeventhorizon-valebridge9512]

The concept of a Brexit which serves the country well (sunny uplands) is a total lie, a confidence trick, a myth, which enough foolish people fell for and sadly voted for, mainly due to their own stupidity, poor judgement, lack of critical thinking skills, naivety, gullibility and ridiculous British exceptionalism. Brexit has been "delivered" now, we've left the EU. That's what "Brexit" means, Britain-exit. It is, and only could be, a complete disaster for the UK, as anyone with an ounce of understanding , intellect or veracity would know! The country is in an utterly perilous and critical state, getting worse by the day, and although I'm horrified by what these feckless idiots have done to our UK nations, I think they now deserve to live in the misery they've inflicted upon us all.

[@ajsctech8249]

BREXIT BROKE BRITAIN

[@jonsimmons4150]

1974 EEC did

[@imstubby6844]

Sod the Tories it's buggered the UK

[@withoutwroeirs]

Who gives a £::& what it does down to the party. They’ve sent the country back to the 70’s

[@aleccap5946]

OMG how i would love to go back to the 70's

[@withoutwroeirs]

@@aleccap5946 Strikes, power cuts were common, rubbish in the streets, Northern Island violence, yes lets celebrate a return to the 70's.

[@martinhommel9967]

Let’s hope Brexit does it’s work demolishes the Tories for good

[@vivwindsor4055]

The Conservative party have been divided over Europe for decades, Brexit is just the lastest chapter of that division. David Cameron was hoping that a referendum would heal the splits. Instead the Conservatives have now inflicted their European trauma on the nation as a whole

[@TC-kk7hv]

I have referred to Johnson, Sunak and Brexit: A Trio From Hell...

[@JerushaJane1]

Fascinating discussion. Thank you. Do you think that a Johnson-Farage-Fox alliance would just have the power to make the Conservatives lose Red Wall or other marginal seats - or could it become a more permanent party in its own right? Or, in other words, would it just damage the current Tory party or help destroy it?

[@federaltrust]

In the short term such a grouping would probably just be a spoiler, but in the longer term it might well supplant the Conservative Party.

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

I believe the appeal of such a grouping would be primarily in the Red Wall, where of course Conservative majorities are also modest. But even this would be sufficient to inflict a major defeat which would lead to a transformation of the Conservative Party in opposition into something so divorced from any remnant of its traditions as to be de facto a new party. Conservatism in the sense it has existed since mass democracy died with Brexit. The issue now is whether any remnant of its traditions survives. It is possible that excluded from "the Conservative Party" or its successor, they are adopted by other parties, notably by the Labour Party.

[@iangascoigne8231]

“A trio from Hell”. A good name for a beat combo.

[@specialistcarmarketing]

Not following what they've been voted in to do, is tearing them apart.

[@Cam-mo7gq]

Nationlism isn't on the up, it's just those there are shouting louder than ever. Given the latest polling, nationlist polotician's poularity is waning & has been for over a year. On the up within the tories? Yes, but it won't fly nationally.

[@noonesbother3759]

Con party is finished , there is no doubt about that after all the dance they have done around not only Brexit but also COVID and economy, the list just goes on. I do not like lab too as they are failing to acknowledge the fact what Brexit has done to UK. If anything I’d like to see coalition of lab and libdems and latter one on the pledge to eventually rejoin the EU. I know rejoining now is not as simple as it was back in 73, but UK must works towards correcting the biggest self harm mistake in its history.

[@jonsimmons4150]

Biggest self harm in history was in 1974 "The EU is France and Germany, the rest is the trimmings.. " *~Charles De Gaulle*

[@robduncan599]

The main event will be NI and Scotland's Secession! Who will be PM to negotiate Scotland and Northern Ireland's Secession and the ending of the UK . Dissolution of United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

[@Komonsense]

BREXIT alarmingly is not only disastrous for our economy, that is by now unarguable amongst any with a modicum of sincerity. It has also had a far wider damaging impact on the state of the actual world order. Stepping back from EU, Britain removed the imminent likelihood of the bloc from not only retaining its status as the greatest and most important global market with the ability to raise a military organisation second to none that could and would in combination subdue the ever cold warring US, Russia and China whose antics would be under check by the carrot of its market and the stick of its military. BREXIT directed Britain into its place as the junior player within NATO under the leadership of the US and its foreign policy designed solely to protect US global interest. We see the effects today in Ukraine as Russia has invaded it in a direct knee jerk reaction to what it rightfully or wrongly perceives as protecting itself against NATO expansion. We see the effects of the NATO leader on the JCPOA where the EU and UK still a member of it at the time had to renege on their commitment based solely upon the unilateral decision of a deranged POTUS who only lately has been indicted on US Federal charges and who was personally responsible for the 6 January 2020 uprising threatening none other than the US constitution itself. This now has put NATO on a direct collision course with a rising power [IRAN] with the ability to make and deploy a nuclear bomb. NATO captained by the US is also on a collision course with the world's labour force [CHINA] chastising it regularly over Taiwan and challenging it daily at the South China Sea. Why does the US do this? Why did the engineers of the nutty BREXIT wish to retain their firm tag to the US? The answer of course is none other than finance. NATO today exists not for the protection of the free world against communism but to ensure that the world's biggest debtor's economy does not collapse and drag that of Europe's down with it because it is tied to it. All of this just so the US can keep on falling deeper and deeper into debt without ever having the possibility of repaying it and BREXIT as an exercise in misery for the population of the UK, just a means to allow that giant more time to continue doing the ONLY thing it can do to ward off the inevitable showdown which is global war and the collapse of our entwined economies. In this darkness, only the rise of EU was the light of hope where there really was a chance of it weaning its economy and currency off its dependence upon that of the US and its honestly less than worthless dollar currency, but then BREXIT reared its ugly head and snuffed out that possibility. Most of us love America but look, most of us also believe that debts should be actually paid right? Well our beloved does not wish to do so, and now cannot do so even if they wished it!! From this and only this stems the derivatives of which BREXIT is a small but crucial element. Britain must end its duopoly form of governance and can do so by adopting Proportional Representation and ending its first past the post voting system that regenerates and invigorates two parties dominating its Parliament while both are visibly corrupt and compromised by private donors keen to retain the status quo. Britain must rejoin the EU and know why it is doing so and discuss the impact of its foreign policy more broadly within Parliament because it is that which effects our domestic economy far more than it is given credit for. Britain must hold its MPs, Ministers and P.Ms to account personally for lying in office even if that means punitively fining them into bankruptcy and prosecuting them under the penalty of incarceration. Johnson is gone, but he is free to count his millions and his minions and enablers are clear to go on, Sunak is simply a minion and culpable for BREXIT like the rest of the party he leads. Keir Starmer is another accolade keen to make BREXIT work as he pledges, but we all know that is at best a lie for all the reasons we know and experience daily.

[@ab-ym3bf]

Long story short: you are still over egging the importance of the UK. With the uk out, the EU can finally move on with further cooperation and integration on defense, and thus form an equivalent/counterbalance to the US within Nato. A more united EU speaking with one voice internationally will also help it having a more nuanced stance on world affairs, not always on line with the US. That was less the case when the US was still represented in the EU via it's poodle.

[@Komonsense]

@@ab-ym3bf I do understand your point of view. However the EU has within it now ONLY one true sovereign nation and that is France [true sovereign because it is a nuclear armed nation]. For what I am referring to - an EU which can rise to become the better replacement for the US as the global spearhead and able to subdue US and Chinese interest while signalling and being attractive for Russia to join it, MUST have the UK at its helm with France ensuring that two real sovereign nations are within the EU. Without its UK partner or the US poodle as you put it, the EU is vulnerable to being divided and ruled by US, China and of course Russia. As usual in modern world history of the past 500 years, the British choice is paramount and crucial factor deciding the trajectory of the global's future. The poodle, in short has sharp teeth. At this level of politics and possible global transformation of world order, an EU without the UK is just a plump duck of a market ready to be plucked by all or any outside major players. An EU hegemony has a far better chance too of subduing rising powers such as Iran which itself is knocking on the door of the nuclear club and itself becoming a true sovereign. Time is running short and the dollar in reality is becoming less and less safe. The EU and UK must reunite and divorce their economies from absolute dependence on the dollar which in real terms is actually worthless!! US admitted deficit currently is well over $30T [Actuality its 10 X that!!] and the US cannot realistically ever pay it back. Don't believe me? Research it yourself. Much sooner than later the US has to start repaying its debts, trouble is that it cannot ever pay it back. We cannot go to any higher authority to make it pay it back, we cannot just keep on letting it get deeper and deeper into debt either, so the only course of action left is as usual WAR. It is as plain as the nose on your face. The EU was humanity's last hope of having a chance to avoid all of this and allowing the US to negotiate a long term plan, say 100 years to make headway in reducing its debt in a meaningful way, but BREXIT destroyed that possibility and turned Europeans against Europeans. An EU without UK, France and Germany, all as its members is vulnerable, as the EU cannot be without any single one of these. So in respect to this matter - BREXIT has been stupid and divisive and bad for every country on our planet except the US which wants to continue to captain NATO, and muddy the international realities for its own interest as it now sees it.

[@ab-ym3bf]

@@Komonsense oh dear, what an English arrogance. You cannot seriously think that a decision a medium sized economy and a country that isn't even a regional power like the UK makes has worldwide repercussions. Also, the UK is far from sovereign when it comes to defense. There is a reason why it is seen as a mere landing strip for the US, a poodle in all senses. Without the US, there is not much left of the UK as far as defense goes. Don't start with the "nuclear power" nonsense, equipment and technology are mostly on lease from the US, and the UK couldn't even finish their own submarines without last minute help of US engineers. Not to mention Ajax and flight deck carriers not making it out of harbor. I'd rather the EU starts seriously uniting it's defense industry and procurement, as they are planning now, and have an intelligent strategy of investment instead of the dogmatic "2% of gdp" NATO agreement. Once Germany starts firing up on all cilinders on defense, and all 27 integrate there will be a formidable defense force. But unlike the US it will not be used to police the world or interfere. The only vulnerable EU is the one we left behind 2 years ago, with the UK being a 5th columnist within our ranks, briefing the US on our every thought and blocking deeper integration as much as possible. A more united EU, as we have now, is way more effective. Significant is, that now they realise the UK will miss the boat in procurement being a 3rd country they all of a sudden want to be part of the initiative they have frustrated while a member. As for decoupling from whomever, be it China or the USA, the EU can seriously do this on its own, it absolutely doesn't need the UK in any single way to do this. Given the slavish adulation of anything American in the UK itnis even more likely that the EU will decouple more than had the UK be part of it. One can regularly see how US/UK have a different approach to situations than the EU.

[@Komonsense]

@@ab-ym3bf I wrote all of that and somewhere in there you have somehow deduced that I am over egging UK's importance? LOL. I simply indicated that BREXIT was an anathema to a possible peaceful future and the stability of whatever world order. In fact I have under mentioned the UK's importance as I purposely did not go into the importance of the commonwealth to the world order. With respect to the 'Poodle' yes indeed the UK is certainly the US number one poodle, however there are 26 minor poodles banded together within the current EU. This fact is amply demonstrated by their allegiance and obedience to Captain America pertaining to the JCPOA where en mass the EU with UK still a member reneged under orders of the great in debt leader. Secondly the other blighting sign that the poodles of Europe are bound by exactly the same leash as Poodle UK is the displayed suffering in silence of Germany after the Nord Stream gas pipeline was sabotaged by its leader the US!! A $12 billion dollar enterprise blown up, an act of war no less but utter silence from the current EU Leader!! Unless you get to grips and fully understand that the EU and UK so Europe as one whole body - NOT divided- I stress only 'in CONCERT'- can bring about the required change - and then with great difficulty - whatever you are talking about is not at all addressing the salient point. The EU is a union which Britain left sadly, I am talking about EUROPE which is a far bigger entity than EU alone because it encapsulates UK post BREXIT, and all European countries outside of EU and also in time it also includes Russia. Finally: There is no way to make this very long story short nor is there any room for ANY party to take a 'nuanced stance' about anything to do with this matter.

[@ab-ym3bf]

@@Komonsense "it MUST have the UK at its helm". Yeah right, that screams overegging your self-importance. As for the commonwealth, it plays no role at all on the world stage. Second iver egging. Last but not least, you didn't take anything from what I replied to you, just repeated, longwinded as in the other posts, the same thing all over. Again: an EU that speaks with one voice and is united in its goals (post brexit) is stronger and better off than an EU that is being undermined by the UK wherever possible (pre-brexit). Which in turn means that a strong EU with a high level of internal cooperation and cohesion on defence and foreign policy makes for a stronger Europe, since there are not that many non-members left bar UK, Russia and Belarus.

[@josephhenry4725]

What you try to control ends up controlling you

[@davidmcintyre8145]

When the commentator speaks of "national"tendencies specifically in the Tory party but more generally in the wider populace it should be made clear that the nation it references is the English: Wales votes Labour,the Tories do not stand in Northern ireland and Scotland has never voted for a majority of Tory MP's to represent it with the Tories not even standing in Scotland until 1965. The xenophobia that led to a brexit majority is almost entirely an English majority and xenophobia,bigotry and racism have been major factors in English politics for a very very long time

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

You make a good point. Brexit is to date the most powerful expression of the English nationalism which has over the years been the pre-eminent force in our politics and which has re-emerged dramatically since the Global Financial Crisis, coalescing around hostility to the EU. Emboldened by Brexit it seems unfortunately likely that it will now seek other targets. The Conservative Party has become for the time being its principal vehicle, but other groupings are gathering which could influence it in a more extreme direction and format, as we discuss in this piece. Conservatism resists however self definition as such, preferring the British nationalist label. This can be seen in its determination to hold onto Scotland, and its celebration and promotion of those in ethnic minorities who self-identify as British obviously, rather than English, provided they oppose EU membership. There are obviously serious potential dissonances here, but how dangerous these might be (in the event, for example, of immigration returning as a major issue) it is too early to tell. As is the impact of such dissonances on the Labour Party..

[@izzytrue8630]

What brought Johnson down were his actions!!!

[@michaelcoward1902]

and the conservatives absolutely deserve it...

[@benedictcowell6547]

Sunak suffers from Political schizophrenia..His solutions are about as effective as trying to solve the problems of operation Barbarossa

[@tonyb9735]

Not fast enough.

[@alasdairmacmillan5359]

superb analysis

[@iangascoigne8231]

Good.

[@CasperChicago]

“…absolute truth is a hard pill to swallow”. You guys are like a poker player with a winning hand; he shows his hand by spreading it face up on the table. I very much enjoy the commentary 👈🏾

[@colin6736]

I now understand the slogan 'Make Brexit Work!' Brexit is a vehicle, and the forward gears are jammed and inoperative. But you can make 'Brexit' work - by putting it into reverse. The reverse gear will still be functional, and that is the only direction in which progress can be made, if slowly and cautiously. PS Is there any chance of editing the subtitles that accompany the soundtrack? For example, which is it - sunac, sunax, sooner, or even, once, sunak? It must be a challenge for those who rely on the subtitles as they are now.

[@federaltrust]

Noted with thanks.

[@Zugswang365]

I love these videos. Very informative and considered. Keep up the good work chaps.

[@federaltrust]

Thanks, will do!

[@121evans]

Thank you for your analysis

[@federaltrust]

My pleasure!

[@Purple_flower09]

The comments section for this channel is absolutely bonkers. From the erudite intellectual to the numpty clown, every angle is represented. The internet is an amazing thing.

[@theon9575]

A broad and representative range of views held in the general community is a good thing, and interesting, to my mind. How is it bonkers? Reading only views of people who hold similar views to my own is boring and uninformative - maybe not bonkers, but a waste of my time. eg you have to read the views of the bonkers people who vote for Boris Johnson if you want to understand how a corrupt incompetent gets elected PM.

[@Purple_flower09]

@@theon9575 fair enough. I agree it's good to be exposed to a variety of views including those we don't agree with. It was the sheer diversity of perspectives that led me to use that word but as you say it's not a bad thing. Also agree regarding the criminal ex PM!

[@theon9575]

@@Purple_flower09 thanks for your response to my Comment. I apologise, too, because this is a hobby horse that I ride often. For my part, I think that I took your meaning of that word "bonkers" too seriously, or not quite as you used it. I can see straight away that you appreciate a diversity of perspectives as much as I do. I am myself a retired professor (or as a grandchild recently joked, a "geriatric academic"), and I don't exaggerate that the internet has turned a retirement that I feared when younger into a daily joy, simply because I now have instant access to almost ANYTHING that I could wish for, on any topic to any depth that might at any time take my fancy. I can scarcely believe it. Informing myself about anything new that used to take a morning's frustrating visit to a reference library can now be done in minutes if I can resist distraction from all the treasures on the way. A typical scientific "literature review" which I hated doing in 1980s could take 6 months then, in dusty library bowels, including time to arrange interlibrary loans etc 🥱 can now be achieved in 6 hours and even include reference to less-known viewpoints that I would otherwise not have found. These days, for recreation, I read a lot of history of painting and fine art- all instantly at my fingertips while drinking tea over breakfast. So exciting. Even for the daily news, whereas I subscribed to one or two newspapers or watched, say BBC news, now I have screens-full of news stories on anything. So now I get to decide what's important to me as "news" and what I want to ignore. Those decisions are no longer made for me by the BBC newsroom, or the Editor of The Guardian or, worse still by disreputables such as Rupert Murdoch. But your point remains: this also exposes us to unlimited non-sense, non-facts, deliberately misleading drivel, and views that are just plain "bonkers". And as we see in politics such as Brexit or the election of ninnies like Johnson and Trump, this can lead to great damage. The solution to this is not to try to pre-filter the wheat from the chaff, but for education & schools to teach people to discern the "real" stuff and to know when they are being deliberately misled. That is, education to "immunise" people against "fake news" and outright lies aimed at them by Johnson, Farage and the like. The voters' calamitous decision for Brexit in 2016 is a prime example of this. Since the early 1970s, I have had both very personal and professional experience with the man and the influence of Rupert Murdoch, who is a major force of evil and destruction in the English-speaking world. Mr Murdoch could, if he set his avaricious & unethical mind on it, convince the British public that motherhood undermines British sovereignty, and that they should vote against it! The internet has only strengthened his arm, and he makes an obscene fortune by following another great Australian's advice (Dame Nellie Melba) to singers, "Just sing 'em muck, love!". And more apologies: as a geriatric academic, I also have time to write endless stuff such as this...LOL 🥱

[@1258-Eckhart]

Thanks so much for this sensible exchange with its feet firmly on the ground. I was put off by the "federal" because I thought it was something American - this not being the case, I'm considering a subscription. The German government has categorised your content to be "Covid-critical", so I the video was accordingly flagged up by YT. This just for info.

[@george78779]

Good

[@TC-kk7hv]

Well, that was a great and convincing interview.

[@arthurdixon5890]

Karma!

[@artoffderidikulous3009]

Labour is no better off in this regard, it's just that they are not in government.

[@roddychristodoulou9111]

If it comes to past this would be like going from a nightmare straight into a wet dream .

[@roby1376]

intriguing foresight

[@zigowl1193]

In reply to the title. I blooming well hope so.

[@cobbler40]

Everything Brexit touches dies !

[@MartynThomas1]

It's a nice dream but I think it's too much to hope for that Johnson will form a pact with Farage with the purpose of inflicting a crushing defeat on Sunak. (@12:58 - 13:30)

[@benedictcowell6547]

That is an Irony Sunak small boat offering UCVIPP

[@jim-es8qk]

I think the conservatives understand they are not going to win the next election. Why do you think they drafted in Sunak? He is likeable and intelligent. He is their to steady HMS GB and allow them to go out with some grace.

[@ab-ym3bf]

A trio from hell, or a godsend. Depends a bit on which side of the divide you are.

[@John-yi1mk]

Millions of us sincerely hope if not Brexit that something, anything destroys the Tory party, forever.

[@theon9575]

Indeed, but I for one am just being impatient. I have long believed that, in the fullness of time, all systems and beliefs that are inherently destructive and/or evil (including autocracies & dictatorships ranging from those of Nazi Germany, Stallinist USSR, CCCP China and the Catholic Vatican which all convince devotees by lies and by misrepresenting their aims) - these all end up destroying themselves. And in any case, revenge is best served cold. But this long-rope theory requires patience and time. With Tories too. After all, back in 2016, it was already obvious and clearly argued by any half-informed, semi-intelligent person (and not just "experts") that Brexit is madness. It won because so many British people were ignorant about the basics (eg the benefits of "the Single market, or that Schengen visas would now then be required for Brits to holiday in southern France, because while every other EU resident understood the Schengen visa system for decades, most British had never heard of it - haha). Truth will ONE DAY out. ALWAYS ! So it was only a matter of time before Brexit destroyed itself. It was inevitable. Ditto Farage, Johnson, etc., even Hitler, Stalin etc. Are brought down by self-destruction because they are based on lies. It takes only patience and time - a lot of time, sometimes, as with the Popes who have peddled untruth and even murdered populations or accepted child abuse in their institution based on "fake news" and lies about Mr J Christ. It's taken 2000 years, but it's finally crumbling in on itself. The Tories are now experiencing it - the 'evil empire' is self-destructing, The blood is on their own hands. The long-rope strategy works, but needs patience. Thanks be to God.

[@helmutzollner5496]

The Tories have been on the rocks for a long time. There is the extreme right of the ERG and the old school Tories, who are the old Thatcherites. These two groups have been molded together only by their desire for power. The British Election System favours parties with a wide ideological appeal. While the left has split into several factions, the Tories have stayed united. This while this has won them the elections many times. The enormous damage the Brexit has produced is so obvious to the electorate that even the love gate relation of the left and right in the Tories will not ensure an election win. I am really curious if an election loss will lead to a split of the tories. I am also astonished that Sunak is not simply removing the whip of the more extreme right. Or might the less ideologies left of the party be in a position to reclaim the party from the ERG and UKIP crowd that seems to havevtaken it over.

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

Sunak cannot remove the whip from the economic ultra liberals because he is one of them, nor from the illiberal anti-immigration nationalists because they can split the party and destroy him. The bigger a Conservative defeat at the next GE, the greater the chances are that the latter group will control the party and it is this prospect which is now tempting some to use Johnson's personal animus against Sunak.

[@alanbrown9178]

It is no surprise that the People of Scotland have not voted for a tory government since 1955, and so many want to get Scotland out of the union. Scotland can do much, much better.

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

After the recent dramas in the SNP, I believe the independence debate will polarise into a choice of which union, the UK or the EU, most suits Scotland. But this may take until after the next GE. Once so polarised however, it can only be a matter of time before the EU wins that contest (unless perhaps the whole of the UK rejoins beforehand.)

[@davidjames2083]

Very interesting and accurate analysis, but as usual no weight given to Sunak, his wife Akshata and her $multi-billionaire father Narayana's devotion to Narendra Modi and the Ethno-Fascist cult of the BJP that now controls India. A political/religious fundamentalist cult based on the Hindutva ideology, and a political movement which dates back to Mussolini and his Italian Fascist party of the 1920's on which it was modelled. 42 year old Sunak sees his future not in Britain, or Silicon Valley once more, but in what is now the most populous country on earth with the fastest growing economy --- India --- alongside his Indian citizen wife and his father-in-law who is one of Narendra Modi's main oligarchs, and he's busy rolling the pitch in India ready for this move right now. Here's what *Wikipedia* has to say about the Hindutva ideology: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindutva

[@epluribusu9430]

Let Trump Brexit Conservative party pull itself apart? Yes. YES!!

[@philiphowell1505]

Tragedy tomorrow tragedy tonight, love from the EU and Gran Canaria.

[@sajahf]

Scary that Johnson will have such a central role, albeit from his machinations behind the scenes as you describe. Agree that he is consumed with vengeance. Nonetheless interested in John Stevens' view that this kind of loose coalition -with the smaller far right parties at the next election - opens up options for Starmer to be bolder on Europe and would have liked to hear a little more explanation of that

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

Starmer's current pro Brexit position is based on his concern to win over Leave voters in the Red Wall. The more the Conservative appeal to those voters is diluted by the intervention of Farage, Fox etc. the less that approach by Labour will be necessary creating the space for a more anti-Brexit pro-Rejoin position.

[@mkoschara]

Conservative moderates?

[@ilyasVa]

Partly

[@johnbell6507]

let’s hope so

[@andrescasado5975]

EU is a peace project rich help poor

[@charlesbruggmann7909]

The EU is a peace project where the rich help the poor - largely so that they can buy more ‘stuff’ from the rich. Everybody gets richer and everybody benefits.

[@danielcarrau]

Totally agree Britain is alors a peace project where the richest help themselves and the others rest in peace indeed

[@jimthorne304]

This might be good news, but it could also be read as reinvigorating 'Real Conservatism' by breaking away from middle of the road Conservatives. I believe that the agenda of the ERM is attractive to Conservatives in the country; the loose structure of the Conservative party is such that many local associations could align with the ERM side of the party, leaving the 'Middle of the Road' Conservatives with a very limited base in the country.

[@garyhutcheon5900]

They work for us they seem to forget that we voted for it accept it and get on with it.

[@charlesbruggmann7909]

If Starmer gets into No 10, he might be lucky. Just as Thatcher was lucky with Michael Foot and Blair was lucky with Duncan-Smith.

[@stephenlawley8776]

Stuff the consvtive party britain is destroyed

[@23merlino]

finally, a silver-lining to the brexit disaster...

[@glendakirby5579]

Ya think?

[@shawngrinter2747]

Has, not is

[@peterfeltham5612]

No it's not Brexit to blame for the mess our society is in,that's wishful thinking by remoaners.This collapse in our nations values we are now witnessing goes back at least 30 years or more.We cannot deal with our issues simply by swinging from Right wing dogma to Left wing dogma every decade or so.Besides which our parliamentary system does not attract people of talent,and until we draft a proper Constitution it never will.

[@davepaterson935]

Gosh - so it's OUR fault that Brexit has crashed and burned. Well, I suppose you got to blame somebody, but you can't say we didn't warn you. It was never going to work: White Elephants can't fly.

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

I agree Brexit is essentially the result, or expression of, weaknesses which have been building up in the UK that go back a long way (far further than 30 years). A full membership of the European project might have arrested this decline, and in economic terms between 1979 and 2008 did arrest some of it, albeit at the cost of creating other weaknesses, such as over dependence on services, especially financial services. A full acceptance that we are a European county like Germany or France, no longer special in any way globally, one which needed to radically change its ruling structures in the manner that defeat and periods of dictatorship demanded in almost all societies on the Continent, and contributing powerfully to creating the physical, mental and moral scale of a truly united Europe, would imv have arrested our decline and allowed a true national revival. But we were never fully committed in that manner, so the sort of necessary constitutional reform you mention, and the deeper psychological reform which you do not, could not come about. We remain beset by illusions unsuited to a modern, successful, medium-sized western state, a contributor to a common European civilisation. Illusions, I fear, your talk of "wishful thinking by remoaners" strongly suggests you share.

[@CockWomble1000]

Nigel Mirage is finito. Brexit is dead. Move on

[@normanchristie4524]

And we need a grown up electoral system!

[@CockWomble1000]

It’s over Enoch. That’s one of your Brexit benefits. It’s dead

[@jacquelineloaring2438]

It’s got sod all to do with Brexit, sick to death of hearing it’s brexits fault, no it’s the BENT POLITICIANS FAULT!

[@Hvantmiki]

It is brexits fault. All the issues directly has to do with brexit. Not issues we see elsewhere in europe.

[@raymondwebb4179]

Stop lying to yourself. Brexit was for the wealthy by the wealthy paid for by the less well of, unless you are wealthy , you have been shafted by Brexit lies, or do you still think Boris doesn’t LIE. ,

[@riffraff9506]

Brexit was for the super rich like richi boy & his family paid for by useful idiots who voted for it

[@jonsimmons4150]

​@@Hvantmikiyes there is and WORSE! FRANCE= WORSE! CROATIA TOOK EURO 1/1/2023- food prices up 30% overnight! Uk the EU cash cow and jobcenter *HAS LEFT!*

[@jonsimmons4150]

​@@riffraff9506tell that to the blue coller workers having to do 2 jobs to make ends meet due to cheap imported EU labour. Ask me. I was one of them, but if you did to my face, i would bloody your nose.

[@GurmitBSingh]

Mr simply a challenge to you dig a hole for others and you fall in it FULLSTOP PERIOD all nonsense discussion time is money?

[@gen_x_dad]

what???

[@GurmitBSingh]

@@gen_x_dad yes you can never understand ? Why ? a mistake is what one rectifies and move on As I don't think you know square mile FEDRAL reserve And who controls these small fries ????? So reform sensibly ?

[@gen_x_dad]

@@GurmitBSingh that was almost an actual English sentence. You want to try that one more time? I think we're nearly there.

[@GurmitBSingh]

@@gen_x_dad sense is to move country to prosperity as MA'AM QUEEN DID by whole life divotion?

[@markmerry1471]

No the only thing doing that is the con party

[@jonsimmons4150]

These to remoaning wafflers are full of sh*t.. Uk isnt short staffed.. *UK IS SHORT PAID!* In Australia, veg picking $28 ph minimum+ 8% superannuation. That is *£16.30 ph plus super!* Its the *SAME PRICE ON THE SHELVES IN AUSTRALIA!* *UK HAS A PAY SHORTAGE, NOT WORKER SHORTAGE*

[@marinusvos]

"UK IS SHORT PAID!" True, but this has nothing to do with the EU! The living standard on the continent is higher, so blame the UK Gov.!

[@ATHLDN]

so the Tories are fighting for your rights to increase your wages?

[@jonsimmons4150]

@@marinusvos rubbish is "living standards better in europe"- i lived in paris 18 years, its quasi 3rd worrld favelas in places like marseille, no go zones with 28% unemployment in most suburbs with families living in shacks. Lower income and fewer jobs and higher taxes. I travelled all over europe, and in quite a few places its like going to a ex communist ghetto.

[@ab-ym3bf]

And obviously a problem with a lot of deaf people if you need to shout.

[@ab-ym3bf]

​@@jonsimmons4150and yet every research shows higher standards of living on the continent, and the UK having the most deprived areas. But of course the word of a British brexiter that has traveled all over Europe brings more weight to the scales.

[@andrescasado5975]

ALCATRAZ new Cuba

[@lesskeels3417]

Vote Reform UK, don't waste your time with any others like Liebour.

[@benedictcowell6547]

The lib dems should create a new New Liberal Party. Drop the Dems

[@Redf322]

Well they are not that democratic looking at the last election.

[@benedictcowell6547]

I agree, but I have a lot of sympathy for Michael Meadowcroft's opposition to the merger, but Joe Grimond like figure today might do very well if such a figure is lurking in Orkney and Shetland. Hark hark the lurk at heaven's gate sings. Tell Tim that not with standing Jezebel's objection's I love Schubert Lieder@@Redf322

[@jackwachtel-scott8000]

Not even a token word of deference to the fact that Brexit was and probably still is the will of the British people. Moreover it is impossible to conclude that Brexit is responsible for all ills when Brexit has not been completely implemented. One cannot be half in and half out of the EU and into the bargain leave Northern Ireland to twist in the wind. Politicians of all shades seem to think the electorate is there to serve their wishes when of course it is the politicians who are there to serve the electorate's wishes. If the Conservatives do not remove the U.K completely from the suffocating hand and laws of the EU they will be destroyed at the next election and it will be a fate richly deserved.

[@newsgeekus1216]

Not sure people voted for what they got. Few voted for leaving the SM and CU. No one voted for putting barriers to trade and foreign investment. We are seeing the damage across the economy from autos/aerospace manufacturing to food/farming. Sad.

[@martinlee465]

How are we half in half out? We are out, no ifs and buts. Just because we are looking longingly over the fence can't be described as half in. Brexiteers wanted a bespoke brexit for every individual who voted for it, hence inevitable it wouldn't be the brexit any individual voted for. There use to be laws against suicide, now assisted dying seems to be the mantra of Brexiteers for this nation as a whole.

[@charlesbruggmann7909]

@@newsgeekus1216 ‘Foreign trade and foreign investment’ - not so sure. The British people voted for cake - eating it while still having it. As far as the economically illiterate are concerned, forinnners ‘steal’ jobs and imports ‘destroy’ industries. These are people who cannot or will not think things through and who are frequently squealing because of the inevitable consequences. They were promised cake - and they still want cake - hence the shift further and further right wards.

[@jackmccann9260]

You have to love the fake news.😂

[@laobanmo]

It's about time the remoaners realised they lost the referendum. Democracy and sovereignty are so important!

[@remcovanek2]

And democracy means you can not ever change your mind or vote. Oh wait.

[@banditalley9592]

nobody who voted remain is moaning - all the moaning is coming from Farage and Johnson etc. Remainers are just laughing at the stupidity of those who wanted to leave.

[@eugenenoonan1886]

And you lost both.

[@lestrem11]

Well it’s not doing much for Germany😂😂😂

[@lestrem11]

Germany is now officially in a recession. So much for the success of the EU.

[@Purple_flower09]

A recession in Germany is not a good thing for us in the UK. It's not a football match.

[@lestrem11]

@@Purple_flower09 I was illustrating the issues in the EU sunshine. Try to keep up or stop posting.

[@ab-ym3bf]

And you wonder why people call brexiters thick

[@ab-ym3bf]

You just keep laughing; meanwhile east European nations are passing the UK for median income one after the other since joining the EU. Your laugh is the laugh of a fool that doesn't understand what is happening in the world around him, it has become too complex.

[@lestrem11]

@@ab-ym3bf Poland are now having a leave referendum which is expected to be followed by Germany. Viva theEU🤦‍♂

[@sdlawrie601]

Two old remainers who have been unable to accept the democratic will of the people didn't match their own.

[@markargent4962]

A cultist leave voter that won't except that he fell for a load of lies . And now his EGO is so big he can't admit he made a mistake!!!

[@bryangeake5826]

26% of the population who voted Leave in a non-binding advisory referendum, where the diference was 3.78% between Leave and Remain, was not the will of the people, nor the 43% of the electorate who voted to 'Get Brexit Done' in 2019 that was then botched with a Hard almost No Deal that even the Tories know is economically unsustainable and bears no resemblance to the 'they need us more than we need them' promises of 2016!

[@colinwishbone4437]

Two old farts with no brains

[@leonardgibney2997]

The EU itself caused Brexit. The UK was in the old Common Market which worked well enough but the federalists couldn't leave well alone. Their Maastricht/Lisbon Treaty "ever closer union" was rejected by those six countries which held referendums originally. Only the UK failed to be coerced into voting again "the right way" by Lisbon.

[@HB-bl5mn]

And now look where you are. The lies of the 70ies came back to haunt the UK. Only because the late coming Brits lied to themselves that they can "reform" (destroy) the European Community doesn't mean that would happen.

[@federaltrust]

It’s certainly true that when many British politicians or commentators spoke of “reforming” the EU, what they had in mind was its destruction. Bizarrely, not all of them realised the implications of what they were saying.

[@genghisthegreat2034]

Unfortunately, your argument flies in the face of the facts. It is a fact that all four fundamental freedoms of movement were in place in the EEC before Maastricht/ Lisbon. It is a fact that the key Parent Directives on Waste, on Utilities, on Public Procurement, on Habitat protection, on migratory fish and Shellfish, on Working Time.....were all in place, or in advanced Draft before Maastricht/ Lisbon. It is a fact that all of those Directives were Trade-impacting; the Preamble Citatations to them say so.

[@HB-bl5mn]

@@genghisthegreat2034 Well, whatever. Now the UK is out and both sides are much happier. For the EU at least, the UK is a fast fading memory.

[@adrianrouse5148]

@@HB-bl5mn what ?????

[@hughbasham4389]

Are you incapable of understanding the Labour party position on Brexit? Credit Starmer for spelling it out absolutely. No return to a single market, the end of freedom of movement, and NO REJOINING. Even closer alignment by regulation is off the table. On the table is not being rude to them, ongoing support for Macron's Mickey Mouse 3rd country military initiative and the potential to review erasmus and horizon membership subject to commercial terms. Oh and since the eu has not sorted out its clearing situation we will be kind to them and carry on doing it from London and be nice to French fishermen in 2026. Brexit is not responsible for the state of the UK economy at the moment. The pandemic, the Ukraine conflict, the move by the USA to become a protectionist economy are far bigger factors. Being the metroplitan elitist types that you are perhaps you could tell us the conversations you have had with UK business leaders around the regions, outside of the Footsie 350. My feedback varies from we are growing new markets/sectors, this automation has made a real difference, my orderbooks are extending all the time, dealing with the eu is no different just extra IT required, to hard work at the moment but we are getting by. Perhaps you can tell me the working men/women you have talked with in the private sector and what has happened to their wages since the end of freedom of movement. Because I do and I can tell you those in the logistics/construction/manufacturing/security/hospitality sectors have seen increases between 30% to 70% and improved terms and conditions. The silent majority who realise Brexit benefits but choose not to shout about it. You never mention the UK's hugely improved and constantly improving balance of payments position. You talk about the demise of the car industry but can not name one UK car plant that has shut because of Brexit. You never mention the fantastic low level of unemployment in the UK or the full orderbook at Airbus for the next 15 years. Oh and the City, that institution that is falling apart.......NOT, you never mention it other than to get guest spoofers to chat sh1t as the kids would say. You also never talk about the real causes of economic pain in the UK. The ridiculous cost of environmental initiatives, forced on the country by loony councils led by Greens Lib-Dems and Labour. The woeful performance of the public sector. The ridiculous levels of poor productivity in the public sector particularly in the civil service and the ongoing cost of woke initiatives. Etc Etc No none of the above do we old spoofers mention because we know the truth, it's all Brexit fault !!!!!!!

[@jimthorne304]

Can we ask which businesses are 'growing new markets'? Would this include, for example, farms who are abandoning farming and turning their farms into solar arrays or housing estates?

[@hughbasham4389]

@@jimthorne304 Food sector, BWS, Dairy, Snacks/Biscuits all growing strongly in Commonwealth/USA/Far East markets, using the distributor model R2M. T/O £10-30m employing circa 50-100 people. Have to be honest was slightly surprised myself. Your point on farming whilst cynically made is correct, but farmers have being diversifying long before Brexit came about and unfortunately good farming land is being turned into sola panel land not because of Brexit/rewilding/set-aside but simply even with the old cap subsidies the returns and more importantly cashflow are much greater.

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

Brexit has not caused the UK's economic problems but it has greatly aggravated them and made correcting them vastly more difficult. We continue to see a deterioration in relative per capita GDP, and in industrial productivity and investment, run structural balance of payments deficits and have structurally higher inflation than our principal competitors. These are old problems aggravated. The most obvious new Brexit effect has been to reveal the extent to which our growth is now almost entirely dependent on record levels of net legal immigration: a situation which cannot be sustainable in any sense.

[@susannehartl3067]

@@JohnStevens-gp7ge Don't bother. ​ @hughbasham4389 is very well known for his unfounded bordering childish comments in other forums. He either pulls his figures out of his rear end or copies it from somebody else who has pulled it out of the same.

[@hughbasham4389]

@@JohnStevens-gp7ge Eu membership was a major contributor to the structural economic problems in the UK. Succession country labour led to a low cost workforce that allowed the so called austerity programme to work. Blair had spaffed so much money up the wall (including huge amounts to Brussels and on spurious wars which the eu did not support us in) that UK was broke. Low wages allowed UK and foreign owned business operating in the UK to take a sabbatical from investment spend that enhanced productivity. There was no spend on automation like in DE, FR, Benelux, and now 10 years on guess what UK productivity is suffering. Now lack of labour is forcing UK plc to invest in automation, which in time will be a Brexit benefit. The real productivity challenge is in the public sector. I don't agree with your observations on balance of payments as at last we are reducing imports (at a much faster rate than exports) and again slowly this will turnaround. I can find no stats to support your views on relative capita gdp. In time the UK will be in a better place. The eu post Brexit is now beginning to struggle. Their exports to the land of milk and honey are significantly down. UK divorce cash has been spent, and they are £23bn a year short. DE is in bad way, and one day the level of French debt will catch up with them and the med countries are still being tortured by the euro. They are over-regulated and sitting on too high a cost base. Punishing the UK might have been a good tactic at the time to prevent other leavers, but looks a bit short term now. We will see in time, but the longer we are out the stronger we will become.

[@grahammidwinter9895]

Everybody needs to look at the Chaos The EU is in. Economically & domestically.

[@tancreddehauteville764]

Get lost.

[@MartynThomas1]

Compared to the UK the EU is prospering. The average Polish family is on track to over take the average British family, in terms of wealth in 2029. The average Slovenian family is on track to overtake the British average next year. The British economy, particularly for ordinary people, is in a death spiral. Almost every industry is contemplating Strike action.

[@bellissimo4520]

Most of any "chaos" that exists in the EU has been caused either by the UK and it's abysmal infantile handling of Brexit, or Russia and Putin's delusions of restoring a great Russian empire. But it looks so far as the EU will weather these issues just as it did with the pandemic, and as far as Brexit is concerned, it most certainly looks like the EU countries are handling the consequences much better and easier than their UK counterparts. Maybe just try to find empty store shelves in any given city in the EU. You won't. Can't say the same about the UK currently, can you.

[@sachmo15]

A load of crap we voted democratically to leave the EU, we dont want to listen to all the excuses or what or might be , if you want to join the EU go and live there 😤😤😤

[@sidneypedroso3415]

People cant, they lost the right to live and retire in EU,they lost freedom of movement.

[@s5utu]

​@@sidneypedroso3415 unfortunately so true 👍

[@sachmo15]

@hakanozaslan9571 seems we need to know why have you come here and what 4

[@sachmo15]

@@sidneypedroso3415 yes but it should work both ways with the EU

[@TheRealSlimSteve]

26% of the UK voted to leave the EU, 74% didn't. The Will Of The People my fucking arse.

[@bazzadebear8012]

The people voted leave! Get over it lefties.

[@tommurphy727]

Boring

[@jamesjennings9907]

A brexit benefit at last.😊

[@peartreeproductions77]

The law changes made by brexit have destroyed many companies , seen many leave the UK for pastures european, we are yet to see most of the law changes implemented as well, just one example is the removal of all parallel pesticide herbicide and fungicide products on the UK market, farmers are forced to soon pay up to 4 times as much for the same product , the knock on effect to the cost of food the uk is yet to see, uk farmers are currently stock piling these products to waive off the inevitable rises and costs for the UK citizen , this will not affect europe eu zone only the British. It will affect that they cant sell their crops abroad also as they will be well over priced, it would be impossible to increase wages just in this sector alone

[@ab-ym3bf]

They can't sell their crops abroad because of the use of forbidden pesticides.

[@peartreeproductions77]

@ab-ym3bf nope you are 100 percent wrong on this sorry to say, this is one of the industry's I work in, the uks crop protection industry is for the most part parallel registrations from Europe, by coming out of Europe we loose these registrations. The same was the same for medicine but thankfully legislation was put in force to honour these registrations, not for crops

[@ab-ym3bf]

@@peartreeproductions77 we must be talking different topics or live in another universe from each other. If UK farmers use pesticides that are forbidden in the EU (you wrongly speak of Europe all the time) or countries that use EU standards, none of that British produce will enter the market.

[@peartreeproductions77]

@ab-ym3bf the majority of UK pesticides follow Europe registrations, products used in Europe .. dont worry through coming out of Europe our pesticide availability will be diminished, do you understand what a parallel registration is ?

[@ab-ym3bf]

@@peartreeproductions77 do you understand the difference between EU and Europe? And if you read my comment more carefully, I said when UK farmers use pesticides forbidden in the EU. You yourself use more the more vague term "the majority". So instead of trying to be condescending, try reading more carefully.