Kong-an (Koan) Practice by Zen Master Dae Kwang

Kong-an talk by Zen Master Dae Kwang from the Foundations of Zen Workshop at the Empty Gate Zen Center recorded on July 30, 2011.
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[@johanniemann4041]

That was the most understandable ”explanation” of koans I’ve ever heard.

[@KlausHendryck]

This guy looks so much like John Locke from Lost. This is perfect :D

[@alskndlaskndal]

This guy has such a chill vibe. 😌

[@tmalonso]

i can't pretend to know one way or another for sure, but what if the kong-an is designed to help the student realize you can't always attain understanding via thinking or logical analysis...a very simple concept, but nothing more than a concept until one realizes it as truth for themselves. The phrase, "its like falling off a log" seems perfect...because you can't fall on purpose, you can walk on enough logs until it eventually happens, but to truly consider it a fall, it simply must happen to you, rather than be done by you. Many meditative techniques seem to try to bring you to that 'place'...somewhere between you doing it, and it doing you...like breathing ;)

[@justinhoffman5726]

People will take this literally and go out walking on wet logs hoping to fall. Lol

[@tmalonso]

@@justinhoffman5726 any fool who persists in his folly shall become wise

[@justinhoffman5726]

Yup. Lolol. Sounds like you enjoy Allen Watts.. love his humor

[@tmalonso]

@@justinhoffman5726 Indeed! I think William Blake is credited with coming up with the concept, but you're right, the first time I was exposed to the notion was through an Alan Watts lecture :)

[@99desi9n]

Thank you for sharing your wisdom Master Dae Kwang. This confirms my understanding of koans as I have just replied to an upload about koan study from the Great Mountain Zen Center, whose explanation seemed contradictory.

[@badbuhdavic7088]

The koan breaks your back. It takes you to the place of knowing. It shows you your original face.

[@RyanMartin-v5b]

So, what is your true face?

[@badbuhdavic7088]

@@RyanMartin-v5b this is about experience, not words

[@EmptyGateZenCenterBerkeley]

If we make "I", then loneliness can appear. If we don't make "I", what is it that is alone?

[@dickvancalsteren2539]

Empty Gate Zen Center the other characters

[@justinhoffman5726]

If there is no I, then how can I be lonely? Also I implies you. Other. Or not I. As long as I exist, there is two. Not one.

[@EmptyGateZenCenterBerkeley]

@@justinhoffman5726 Not one. Not two. What is it that typed that message? What are you?

[@justinhoffman5726]

That's what "l" just said. There is no I to be lonely. Lol. Maybe it's the "universe" itself typing. Maybe there is no typing at all. But these are all just words which really mean nothing. We could go back and forth all day and put quotations around every word. Lol

[@justinhoffman5726]

Just repeating what "you" typed in the first place. Lol

[@EbsNhexz]

Thank you for this. I was brought into Zen through Dogen's teachings and I was very sceptical about the Koan and how it could possible successfully base a practice around them. I've been open minded for a while but haven't understood exactly how they work until now.

[@krzystofsibilla3516]

The topmost education.Thank you.

[@EmptyGateZenCenterBerkeley]

You are welcome!

[@RyanMartin-v5b]

The Buddha did not teach Koans!

[@williamfreeman5690]

Great talk! 🙏🏻⛩🏹

[@osmo2015]

Thank you, wonderful speaking.

[@EmptyGateZenCenterBerkeley]

+OSMO You are welcome!

[@miketurany2082]

this guy makes me laugh every I see him talk and see his face, because he reminds me of big Chuck Schodowski which was an endearing offish tv personality

[@Flatscores]

I remain unconvinced that thinking wont help. I guess I am more tending towards the school of thought of koans as objects of contemplation. But then again, I don't meditate, but very much enjoy contemplation, the sort that deepens any question and not answers it, which is why I enjoy koans so much.

[@AlleDageCripWalke]

Contemplation without meditation or any technique that goes beyond the mind, is just contemplation and will get you nowhere

[@kopilit]

How are you feeling now MusicfromtheFlatland? Thinking can be useful, but depends on what is thinking. If the mind tries to be free as the mind - that's an eternal thinking loop with lifetimes upon lifetimes without end. The mind will always try to think its way back into the mind unless directed by Koans and questions that can bypass the mind. Breathing bypasses the mind also.

[@eoharafisher]

I wonder if he's comparing monastic buddhism to lay christianity. I'm reading a book about pure land buddhism, which sounds a lot more like "people in the pews christianity." Not everyone can or wants to meditate. I come from a Catholic background, have gone to many contemplative Catholic retreats, and fairly easily moved to zen meditation. But most family and friends do not have that kind of passion for meditation-- or contemplative prayer.

[@HughesMath1]

Fun!

[@youarewhatyourelookingfor4496]

Every talk to someone about a banana? lol.. Love this guy

[@muninta5493]

Actually, this is Ludwig Wittgenstein in a nutshell;

[@saywhat1870]

That's interesting. Can you suggest some material/book by Ludwig Wittgenstein that resembles this teaching?

[@muninta5493]

@@saywhat1870 its like breath throughout Dae Kwangs’ teachings as I feel. Hard to put your finger on trying to explain. Wittgenstein and DAE Kwang could be friends in going the Taoist way of living, I guess. There are of course a lot of books about Wittgenstein. I should say “find out for yourself “ Thanks for response 🙏✋

[@RyanMartin-v5b]

The Buddha taught there is suffering and how to end suffering, not Koans!

[@KonradNielsenDK]

Is he a Vegan ?

[@shadowheart52]

How is it that we don't know in our rational minds that killing each other is a problem? Why did he say that? Is he just stuck on his concept about the rational mind being unable to grasp reality? Killing is a problem and every rational person knows this.

[@EmptyGateZenCenterBerkeley]

Wonderful question. What he was saying is that suffering will not be relieved by rational thinking. Why do people kill? Why is their suffering? Where does anger come from? As long as I have hatred and ignorance, there will never be peace. If we return to our self before thinking, then it is possible to see where suffering comes from. When we see that, then we can use rational thinking to help others.

[@markbrad123]

People rationalize killing all the time. Humans kill something like 20 billion animals a week.

[@EmptyGateZenCenterBerkeley]

optizap Namu Amitabul!

[@markbrad123]

***** Indeed, given all the health problems associated with eating meat and dairy I propose the human digestive system did not keep up with the technology of obtaining food from the evolved mind. Challenge anyone to try and eat meat raw if they think that is accordance with their natural physiology. Just like other creatures it would be innately automatically rejected as incorrect.

[@Knaeben]

+optizap You can eat meat raw. Just not as easy to digest.

[@raul-cv5lz]

In 32 minutes not one word of the dharma spoken

[@JasonQuinn]

Why did you speak? :-)

[@raul-cv5lz]

@@JasonQuinn why'd you text...??

[@raul-cv5lz]

@@JasonQuinn 😏🤳

[@JasonQuinn]

@@raul-cv5lz For you!

[@raul-cv5lz]

@@JasonQuinn 😳🤳