La Pavoni pressure profiling kit & brass sleeve Install

[@heytchap]

Bruce, you’re a legend for this one. Thank you so much.

[@BrucePappas]

Glad it helped.

[@c1bersnake]

I can barely afford a portafilter for this machine but i still watched the whole thing

[@BrucePappas]

You're very brave. Haha. Where are you located?

[@c1bersnake]

@@BrucePappas Republic of Moldova

[@BrucePappas]

@@c1bersnake - Contact Tudor @ coffee-sensor.com - He'll put you in contact with me. He's a good dude.

[@stinkdyr301]

Heck, I just want a Pavoni.....never mind the upgrades yet! Fun seeing you tinker with it.

[@BrucePappas]

Got it. That's what's great about LPs. You can run them stock, makes mods, or trick 'em out.

[@Stelios.Posantzis]

Comments are back on - it's a shame they were turned off accidentally as it seems they were off for a long time.. I have come across the Coffee Sensor website and I thought of checking back on this video. The PPK is great idea but what I'm really after is a thermometer gauge instead in its exact place (to show the water temperature in the head). The problem is... I am not sure there is a needle thermometer that is both as quick and as accurate as the duration of a shot pull requires.

[@BrucePappas]

Thanks for the heads-up.

[@andrezavattieri]

Great work. Looking forward to see the video where you test the pressure gauge. Cheers

[@BrucePappas]

Will do.

[@ghayward00]

This is an awesome video, Bruce. Thank you!

[@BrucePappas]

Thank you. I hope to show it "as it is."

[@claudiolevermag]

Bravo Bruce!

[@BrucePappas]

Thanks!

[@peladoarg]

Thanks a lot, nice video.

[@BrucePappas]

Glad you liked it and found it useful.

[@MikeFLHT]

Nice instruction for a newbie. Thanks a bunch!

[@BrucePappas]

You're very welcome!

[@ArtuRoRutrA]

Great video with great know how :) thank you !

[@BrucePappas]

You're welcome!

[@abueloraton]

Awesome job!!

[@BrucePappas]

Thank you.

[@ScottMicciche]

Nice work, Bruce. I'm considering this kit so it was nice to see it being assembled. Cheers!

[@BrucePappas]

Glad it was helpful.

[@david029014]

This is cool I want one for my pavoni!

[@BrucePappas]

Contact Tudor at www.coffee-sensor.com He'll set you up.

[@brian5651]

hi.. please help me. do you know if La Pavoni LGB is using Brass Piston or plastic teflon piston?

[@BrucePappas]

Here is the history of LP pistons: Up to 1996: brass 1996: Ryton (sometimes referred to as Teflon or plastic) 2007: returned to brass The LGB (La Grande Bellezza) was introduced in 2015, so your piston is definitely brass.

[@subhkhan]

Great vid Bruce....i recently installed the pressure profiling kit but i'm still having issues with a lot of water coming through the group on lifting the lever (regardless of tamp and grind) would appreciate any thoughts?

[@BrucePappas]

Thanks. What's the Gen & year of your machine? Did you put Teflon tape on the piston rod threads? Are the piston gaskets installed correctly? If you want, send me a video by email. Go to www.youtube.com/@BrucePappas/about and select "View email address."

[@subhkhan]

@@BrucePappas sure will do i would say it's 1997 model as it looks the same as this one in James Hoffmans vid: kzbin.info/www/bejne/onzMnp1mq7eAa6M but I will send a vid anyways. Yes teflon tape on the threads. The piston came with preinstalled gaskets....the problem is pre-existing however, i had water coming through even before the installation as well😔

[@BrucePappas]

@@subhkhan - the only other place water could be leaking is from the gasket on the top of the grouphead. But then water would be coming outside the grouphead, not from the screen. I'll be interested in seeing a video.

[@christophermills7304]

I have just fitted mine as you have here and water is coming out of the top where the pressure gauge is, do you know what the problem is? Thanks

[@BrucePappas]

There's a gasket, washer, & c-clip inside the top of the grouphead. It may need to be changed. Also, you may have to put Teflon tape on the piston shaft and PPK fittings.

[@christophermills7304]

@@BrucePappas thankyou! The machine is brand new so i will put the teflon tape on all the screw threads and see how it goes. Thanks for the video and the quick response 👍

[@PixelVoyager-m4z]

This is so calming. love the work Bruce. I'm a Romantica 2006 owner. thinking about adding the pressure kit from tudor and the bong isolator. any experience on the latter?

[@BrucePappas]

Hi, Simon. My advice is the isolator is not needed on your machine, a Gen3 (built after 2000). More needed on Gen2s.

[@junkyt6109]

Amazing to watch! Thank you! I am struggling between a Flair 58 (about to be available in 10 days, need to buy a separate frother) and LP. What would you choose?

[@BrucePappas]

It really depends what you want. With both, you get to control all the variables needed to make good espresso. As you can see in the video, I chose a La Pavoni. But buying a separate frother is not a problem these days. So...go with the one that "sings" to you. I think the Flair would make a good travel machine.

[@abueloraton]

With Flair 58 you're stuck with low temperature and dark roasts. Its 70°C temperature is a joke.

[@ronaldsantosjapan]

Nice to see how user upgradable these can be. Why did you need to replace the Bluetooth pressure sensor?

[@BrucePappas]

I prefer a gauge. I don't like looking at my phone while trying to pull a shot.

[@Wyrdrock]

What pressures are you extracting at on average? I installed the grouphead pressure guage on my Pavoni and on average am extracting from about 2-4 bar regularly. This seems low to me, since I know that supposedly 9 bars is "ideal", however whenever I manage to get it up to 9 bars, it's almost impossible to actually extract and it tastes awful. I'm wondering if perhaps I didn't install the gauge correctly (possibly teflon tape got into the hole) but I wanted to check with others to see if that was somewhat normal. Thanks!

[@BrucePappas]

I don't think most of us with PPKs pull at 9. It appears the average is more like 6-7.

[@CyberGene]

When installing the new brass sleeve, do I have to grease its inside wall as well as the piston and the two gaskets for a smoother movement?

[@BrucePappas]

You only need to lube where there's friction. Inside the sleeve and lightly on the outside of the gaskets. Also, don't forget to lube the piston shaft. No need to lube the outside of the sleeve - no matter what material the sleeve is made of.

[@marcosalvati2209]

where can I find the big black ring to insert the piston with the gaskets?

[@BrucePappas]

It was a custom piece that came with a different kit.

[@baristafabrik8317]

I need also one of them

[@severinosimeone4074]

@@baristafabrik8317 did anyone find how to buy that special ring?

[@77Cfriend]

what about that extra brass and the heat situation? maybe they changed to Teflon to help cool it?

[@BrucePappas]

I haven't found a big difference in heat. I need to try the newer stainless steel version.

[@adambromley6972]

At 20:15, that black ring you call “a great little invention” - does that come with the pavoni? Or do you order separately? Where can I get one?

[@BrucePappas]

Gabor at naked-portafilter.com supplied this with his PPK. Tudor at coffee-sensor.com also supplies one with his kit. Contact them to see if they will see you one by itself.

[@adambromley6972]

@@BrucePappas is there a name for what it is called?

[@BrucePappas]

I haven't ever heard a name for it. Perhaps, a "piston gasket installation tool?" It's shown here in the second photo: coffee-sensor.com/product/gold-brass-piston-pressure-kit-for-the-la-pavoni-ep-or-pro/

[@adambromley6972]

@@BrucePappas thanks! :)

[@franciscodelatorre9336]

Whats the purpose to install a piston with a gage on top? Sir

[@BrucePappas]

A pressure profiling kit (PPK) measures the pressure in bars that the lever asserts on the puck. It's another data point.

[@michaelcweissman]

Hi Bruce! Thans for the wonderfull video! My question: I have the Copper-Gold version of this machine. Do you think, could I use the original lever instead of the delivered chrome one with this upgrading set? Thans for the answer. Warm regards from Vienna.

[@BrucePappas]

Unfortunately (and fortunately), no. The lever needs to be replaced. Good news is the new lever is a much better design. Even better news, Tudor now makes this kit in brass. coffee-sensor.com/product/coffee-sensor-brass-piston-pressure-kit-for-the-la-pavoni-europiccola-pre-millennium-and-millenium-machines/

[@michaelcweissman]

@@BrucePappas oh! Thanks! That will be exactly what I need!

[@BrucePappas]

Have you joined our FB group! We're friendly, helpful lot!

[@eddyb.8056]

Hello sir, I'm new in the world of lever expresso machine, just have a question, which La Pavoni well build choose? Europiccola, professional or stradivari? Too much choice

[@BrucePappas]

IMHO- more important to look at the machine generation (designated by its grouphead mostly). I'd look for a Gen3 machine (after 2000) = more temp stable. I prefer a Pro = bigger boiler size. If you like the look of the Strad, get one with a larger boiler, but a Gen3 will perform the same as the more expensive Strad. I agree, so many choices and differences between machines which appear subtle, but are significant. If you get a Gen3 Pro, try to get one after 2007, when the factory went back to brass pistons. But you can always change the plastic one to a brass one for not much money (I did that).

[@eddyb.8056]

@@BrucePappas oh thanks Bruce! I didn't thinking about generation.

[@eddyb.8056]

@@BrucePappas Bruce, last question, is the pressure gauge on some boilers is helpful ? If I'm sounding insistent, sorry...

[@BrucePappas]

@@eddyb.8056 - no worries. Personally, I think ALL LP boilers should have pressure gauge. It's cheap and a good safety feature. Luckily, you can easy and cheaply install a pressure gauge, so don't let that deter you from buying a machine.

[@eddyb.8056]

@@BrucePappas thanks to you, i will drink some good ristretto! 👍 Have a nice day

[@alexace197]

Hey Bruce! Where did you get those handles? I would LOVE some for my pro.

[@BrucePappas]

MUSSA. mussatampers.com/

[@david029014]

@@BrucePappas so cool

[@johnnanavati3350]

Where can you get the “proper” tool to unscrew the sleeve? Or what’s it called? Wonderful video btw. Ty!

[@BrucePappas]

Several different tools. In Europe, I'd buy from Tudor at www.coffee-sensor.com. In the USA, I'd buy from Stefano at www.espressocare.com. It's called a "sleeve removal tool." Or you might be able to get by with a bar and a vice grip. Thanks. I like making unedited "Not-a-well-made-video" production videos. :)

[@abueloraton]

First of all, where did you get the gauge kit from??

[@BrucePappas]

I try to put my sources in the comments. Here it is again: coffee-sensor.com/

[@abueloraton]

@@BrucePappas Thank you.

[@sirbotte]

There is a way for adding this to a Stradivari model? Without changing the arm with a standard one.

[@BrucePappas]

No. The Stradivari handle moves over a smaller capture nut and the top of the piston shaft. Even LP used a different handle on their Stadivari Esperto.

[@sirbotte]

@@BrucePappas bad news... so just only with the stradivari espresso is possible to do? And there are other way for measure the pressure in the basic Stradivari? Thanks.

[@BrucePappas]

@@sirbotte - unfortunately, no, not that I know of. Have you seen how the Esperto looks with the standard handle? www.lapavoni.com/en/product/esperto-abile-espab/

[@MrTubeman007]

It would have been nice if you would have shown the difference between the part you were exchanging.

[@BrucePappas]

Good idea!

[@adambromley6972]

Do you know if this process changes for a newer model or specifically the esperto abile?

[@BrucePappas]

Yes, the interior of Gen3 (Millennium) and Gen4 (Stradivari). The hitch is the Gen4 handle. You will no longer be able to use the curved Stradivari handle, but will have to use the new Gen3 supplied with the kit.

[@adambromley6972]

@@BrucePappas The esperto abile doesn’t have a Stradivari handle? And I’m mostly wondering about cleaning the machine, not too interested in the kit itself. I’m wondering if to clean my esperto abile if the process would look like this? Assuming to clean the esperto I’ll have to take off the pressure profiling kit it already comes with. In that case there will be no need for me to switch any handles right?

[@BrucePappas]

I apologize. This is a video about installing a brass sleeve and a PPK. I don't know what cleaning process you are asking about? (And yes, the Esperto Abile already has a PPK installed and a Gen3 handle.)

[@adambromley6972]

@@BrucePappas no worry that my bad thank you :)

[@bjoernfu]

Wahhh, my heart stopped when I see the piston slowly came down and finaly crashes onto the chrome. Why not also a brass group connector instead of the last plastic piece?

[@BrucePappas]

Yeah, surprised me, too!

[@corystone9180]

Where can one find and purchase this mod for a millennium europiccola please?

[@BrucePappas]

coffee-sensor.com/

[@lazar40004]

I can’t find the brass sleeve in the link you given below ...

[@BrucePappas]

Sorry about that. The brass sleeve is still in production and not available yet; I have a beta. PPK is available now.

[@adambromley6972]

Did you oil the gasket before putting it on?

[@BrucePappas]

I lubricate all rubber gaskets before installing them. I use Dow-Corning Molykcote 111.

[@nelgchannel9661]

Mine is still a plastic sleeve and the pistone as well. I bought a lavazza coffee in the ebay. But when i tried my la pavaloni there is no crema on my coffee....I don't know which one is need to replace is it my plastic sleeve and pistone to brass or my coffee bean is not fresh anymore. Please help

[@BrucePappas]

The brass sleeve is not yet available. The brass piston is from any LP supplier. Sounds like your problem is more related to beans and grind. It's best to use whole beans freshly ground. Please join our Facebook group for more support.

[@Stelios.Posantzis]

Great demonstration but the drill press in the background really steals the show from LaPavoni... What make is it? Also, you said the brass sleeve returns the Millenium to pre-mil. status, however, the piston on milleniums is of a smaller diametre, no? Where did you get your brass sleeve and the brass pistons from? I have both the pre and the millenium. I can't stand the millenium. It was bought new and has all sorts of bad QC issues, leaking from every fitting on the boiler from day one. It really ought to have been sent to the service department which is ridiculous for a brand new product. The pre was bought second hand a decade ago, was serviced and never had any issues. It just needs new piston seals now.

[@cjpriustt]

Did you mean to say you can’t stand the Mil instead?

[@Stelios.Posantzis]

@@cjpriustt Ah yes! typing faster than I can think as usual... Just corrected it. I have read a lot about the pre vs mil. in the last few months and I've come to appreciate the changes in the design, or -more precisely- the pros and cons of each design (in my mind at least). So now, I understand the mil. does control some of the factors affecting temperature stability in a better manner. My issue, generally, from such design changes is with replacing a metal part with a plastic one. I always feel the customer gets short-changed this way. Literally too if you think about it: the plastic parts cost a fraction of the metal ones but the machine still costs the same amount. Plus I have an issue with drinking something hot that's been brewed between a teflon jacket and a plastic plunger. Could be I'm imagining things but, hey..

[@BrucePappas]

It's a Delta bench drill press.

[@BrucePappas]

The plastic (Ryton, I believe) sleeve is for heat management. The plastic piston is no longer being made, so it's good to replace with brass (or get a PPK).

[@Stelios.Posantzis]

@@BrucePappas Cheers for that. I'm trying to find a similar one online but no success so far. Looks impressive.

[@cslimtube]

Hi sir...where can i get the brass sleeve ?

[@BrucePappas]

It's not available yet. It's being developed by Tudor at www.coffee-sensor.com

[@georgegeorge1789]

@@BrucePappas Hi Bruce - have bought a few things from Coffee-sensor in the past, but cannot find the black guide to help with inserting the piston gaskets into the brass sleeve (at 20:00) on their website. Is this from Coffee-sensor, or elsewhere?

[@BrucePappas]

@@georgegeorge1789, I received this from Gabor at naked-portafilter.com when I bought his original PPK. I don't think he sells the part separately.

[@bastiencatil2509]

Why sleeve have to be change ?

[@BrucePappas]

The piston and shaft require a hole down the middle.

[@thamtham4924]

Bruce Pappas Do you mean original plastic sleeve cannot be used with ppk?

[@BrucePappas]

Sorry to confuse the two. You can do one without doing the other. I did the new brass sleeve and the PPK together, as it was easier since the grouphead was open.

[@MrPinolatino]

Great work! what kind of grease did you use?

[@BrucePappas]

Dow Corning Molycote 111: amazon.com/gp/product/B002WDU1J8