Lathe VFD Wiring Conversion With Like Factory Controls

[@mmk3973-b8f]

Great video. I was about to loose my mind trying to set up my ENCO 1445 with a VFD. Then I found this video right before I did something stupid. Thanks again

[@BladesIIB]

@@mmk3973-b8f That’s great to hear, appreciate the feedback and glad you found what you need. All the best getting your ENCO set up. My PM is still running flawlessly.

[@shannonwarren6809]

Would be nice if you posted a shopping list to give people an idea of type of wire you bought. boxes, breakers, transformers and other items you used to complete this build. It will give people a nice starting spot

[@BladesIIB]

@@shannonwarren6809 I have it in an Excel file. Go to my website, use the contact me button to email me and I will send it to you. Along with a lot of the other notes and schematics shown in the video. Have shared with several dozen others to help them get their build done. No tricks, no feee just shoot me a message. www.BladesIIB.com.

[@texaswoodworks8853]

I have no intention I’ve ever doing this, but I still found it oddly satisfying. Thanks for sharing as always.

[@BladesIIB]

Happy Horned Frog - they make some nice 3 phase wood working tools. Never say never!!

[@rodneykiemele4721]

That was one of the best and informative videos on this subject I’ve seen. Thank you very much !

[@BladesIIB]

Thanks Rodney, really appreciate the feedback and glad this provided value.

[@MrRacepace]

Agreed! Very helpful video, thankyou!

[@jagboy69]

Good description. I get hounded constantly with questions how I did this to my lathe last year. I'm sending them your way, have fun answering the questions.

[@BladesIIB]

worldtraveler - Thanks, I think? 😁

[@jagboy69]

@@BladesIIB 😜

[@BillHarp]

Very Informative and presented in an entertaining and interesting way...Ive watched it several times as I am close to ordering the same lathe and rigging it in the same manner..Thank you

[@BladesIIB]

Bill Harp - Thanks for the comment, glad the video was helpful for you. I still love my lathe and no hesitation recommending the TL series from PM. All the best if you get it, and I just sent you the email with the parts list you asked about. Good luck with your set up!

[@BobGarrett66]

This was awesome!! Thank you so much for putting all of this together. A lot of information but definitely seems doable. I’m going to watch this a couple of times and start putting my plan into gear. Again, very much appreciate you taking the time to put this video out. Hope you see a ton of new subscribers soon!

[@BladesIIB]

Thanks Bob, glad to hear this provided what you were looking for. Let me know if you get stuck.

[@dangreen7709]

This helped me get over the hump rewiring my PM-1236T with the WJ200 inverter. Thank you so much for putting this together! Earned a new sub

[@BladesIIB]

Dan Green - Awesome! Glad to hear this helped you out. Congrats on getting your machine running and thanks for the sub!

[@ToBeeOrNotToBeHoney]

Thanks for this. I have a PM1340 on its way and have been working with Mark (he helped build me a panel) and this video really helped me as soon I will have to put all the pieces together.

[@BladesIIB]

To Bee Or Not To Be - glad this helped, Mark is amazing and shared his knowledge with me to get my install done. You should have a great set up coming.

[@oceaniron1]

Very nice work and a new subscriber here. I plan to purchase the PM-1440GT and add the VFD and the same controls as you have. I had reviewed Mark Jacobs 2016 Hobby Machinist thread on the conversion of another PM lathe and also nice work. However, I had some questions for him and was about to ask. I have done this type of upgrade on a bench top mill and surface grinder which are much simpler to do, less controls. You have answered most of the questions I had. Thanks for providing all the extra detail.

[@BladesIIB]

Steve Conner - Congrats on the 1440GT, great machine from everything I have heard. Mark helped me put my plan together and I used his GT materials to help sort through the learning on this as well. The video was designed to pay forward all the knowledge from Mark, glad to hear it helped and answered your questions. All the best with your build and thanks for subscribing!

[@JustRandomProjects]

Best video I have found on this. Man you took a lot of time making this video. I appreciate it and I hope you are monetized because I would have paid for this video. Thanks man!!

[@BladesIIB]

Landon’s Many Projects - Really appreciate the comment and the feedback. Glad this was helpful for you. Yes my channel is monetized slowly growing and getting more subs and views - Thanks!

[@FullSendPrecision]

I'm about to do this exact project. Thank you for the video!

[@BladesIIB]

Awesome Aaron, hope this helps you. I tried to create what would have helped me get my head around it at first. Good luck with your build!

[@ettoredicarlo1679]

Magnificent job sir. I want very much do the same to my lathe aswell.

[@BladesIIB]

Ettore di Carlo - Thanks for the comment. I hope this helps you with the process. Took me a bit to get my head around it then it went pretty smooth.

[@jamesstein6607]

Excellent job, just what I needed to see! Good idea using the contractors to control the VFD. Too bad I have a 3 phase coolant pump. Perhaps a second VFD for that.

[@BladesIIB]

James Stein - Thanks for the comment. Glad it was helpful. You may want to see what a new single phase coolant pump costs. May be cheaper and easier than a second VFD? Just a thought.

[@georgemihalis8090]

Great video! Great information clear and concise. I realize you made this a while ago, but could you please provide a list and model numbers of the components you used and where you purchased?

[@BladesIIB]

@georgemihalis8090 - Appreciate the comment. Glad it was helpful. I have an email with all the details and an Excel spreadsheet with the parts info. Send me your email address through the Contact me form on my website and I will be happy to forward the info www.BladesIIB.com.

[@gurudansingh7209]

Awesome mate 👍🥂

[@BladesIIB]

Gurudan Singh - Thanks!

[@rdonho1]

Another fantastic video!! Could you direct me to a parts list? It would be a huge help to know where to get the resistors, breakers, pots, etc.

[@BladesIIB]

joe smith - Thanks for the comment. If you go to my website www.BladesIIB.com and hit the contact me form I will email you an excel file with the parts list.

[@jimspencer3072]

Definitely the way to go. I can't imagine using a box on the lathe front, you need the normal controls

[@BladesIIB]

Jim Spencer - Appreciate the comment, I can’t imagine anything else either. Cheers!

[@rufustoad1]

Nicely done. I just bought a PM 1440 and I want really badly to install a VFD on it but this could make a guy cry if things were not as they should be. I am having them ship it with a 220v motor which might work ok but will see. How long did this take you to complete? Do you have any kind of wiring schematic you would share with others?

[@BladesIIB]

@@rufustoad1 Congrats on the new machine. I have no idea how a 220v motor would work in the machine but I would really encourage you to tackle the VFD instead. It took me a couple weeks of reading and talking to others to really get my head around the project. And it can take some time to gather all the parts you need, however, the actual build of the enclosure only took a day or so and same with wiring up the lathe when it came in. Has been running flawlessly for 3 or 4 years since. Go to my website and send me an email (contact form) and I will send an email back that I have sent to about 20 others to get them started in the project, including a parts list. I don’t think Hitachi makes the exact same VFD anymore so may not be exactly what you need but should get you pretty close www.BladesIIB.com

[@jasonalper7898]

That is amazing, thank you,

[@BladesIIB]

@jasonalper7898 - Awesome, glad it was helpful. Thanks for the comment.

[@emerysalesky1002]

Thanks for a very informative instructional video! It was so inspiring that I bought a PM1440TL lathe today and will be installing a Hatachi VFD as you did. Any wiring diagrams, schematics and parts lists would be most helpful. Did you have a problem with electrical noise?

[@BladesIIB]

Emery, how exciting you are going to love it. If you are not a member of The Hobby Machinist forum I would highly recommend joining there. You can find me there as BladesIIB and send me a PM for those files. Or go to www.BladesIIB.com and send me a message through the contact form and I will send you what you need. All the best!

[@thegraphixfoundry1681]

Great video, I'm gearing up to do this in my home shop, currently in the process of getting my panel upgraded to 200 amps. With your lathe , what was the total single phase power on the line you dropped to your vfd enclosure ? 75 amps ?? Sorry if I missed that being mentioned in the video

[@BladesIIB]

@thegraphixfoindry1681 - I am using a 50a 220 outlet that was already there for a welder plug. Your VFD should list what it needs? Bottom line, I have never popped my 50a breaker in the 3 or 4 years running the lathe. Good luck with your install. Thanks for the question.

[@JimmyGFromDayton]

Great video, super clear and informative. I hadn't realized you could run a 3 phase motor on single phase power. That being said, please, please don't wear long sleeves running a lathe, and tuck the beard back. Good content, thank you for sharing!

[@BladesIIB]

Jimmy, glad you found some good information in the video. To be clear, the 3 phase motor is running on 3 phase power. The VFD takes single phase in and puts 3 phase out to the motor. I normally wear coveralls running the lathe for that smooth tucked surface and to keep chips from getting where they don’t belong. They are long sleeve though, but snapped at the end. As for the beard, yes grew it out for the short work from home due to COVID and time to trim it back so I do t have to tuck it back. Appreciate the feedback and safety tips.

[@zx9rturbo402]

Thanx for the well-done and informative video. What I didn't hear you mention is the mechanical speed controls on the machine. Have you set it to max speed of 1800 rpm having the vfd control below that or are you selecting various mechanical speed settings such as 250 rpm with the vfd controlling below those speeds?

[@BladesIIB]

Great question. To maximize torque, and since this motor was not designed specifically for variable drive I change the mechanical gears and use the variable to adjust between mechanical gearing. I leave the frequency at 60hz the majority, select the speed I need mechanically and fine tune with the variable. Hope that makes sense.

[@charlesjones257]

AWESOME VIDEO! love your presentation and wiring diagram's. why did you pick that specific VFD? the control circuits are all24V? the original 3ph transformer works on single phase 220V? i am subscribing.

[@BladesIIB]

Charles Jones - Thanks for subscribing. Will try and answer your questions. The VFD is the only me recommended by Precision Matthews for this machine. I went with their recommendation. Yes all the control wiring is 24v both on the original configuration of the lathe and the VFD. My understanding is the original transformer is single phase. The motor is 3ph so if you had actual 3ph into your shop to run it as sent with no VFD you would run 3ph into the panel but only 2 legs would go to the transformer and the third leg would only go to the main motor. Even the coolant pump on this machine is only single phase to allow for easy VFD conversion. Hope that helps.

[@cs9260]

Great video! Question? Couldn't the the FWD/Stop/Rev be done by the VFD directly, without the need for contactors? That's how I have my Acer mill wired. Super simple and it works flawless.

[@BladesIIB]

C S - Great question, I will give the answer as best I can based on my understanding from the person who helped me. In my conversion, I am still using a lot of the native safety features in the lathe wiring. I am still powering the transformer and using the lockout switches. Bypassing all that would require adding some redundant safety back in somewhere. On a mill, I know a lot of people just hit the buttons on the VFD directly with no additional controls. You could technically do that on a lathe I am sure but when threading or other operations you really want the on off lever where it is and not have to be reaching over or around to get to the stop. I hope I understood your question correctly and that helps.

[@cs9260]

@@BladesIIB Thank you for the quick reply! I defiantly see your logic. Different VFD's allow for greater auxiliary controls. This guy has a plethora of VFD knowledge: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qqOQfotpiLmsrqc He's essentially programming the VFD to do everything. I'm in the process of rewiring my G0509g in similar fashion. All the factory controls are running through the VFD like on my mill. So far the results are amazing due to the precision tuning availability! VFD Technology is amazing.....

[@BladesIIB]

@@cs9260 yes VFDs are amazing for sure. I am running all my controls to the VFD as well. I just used as much of the existing lathe wiring as possible. So I am using the existing contactor to pass the low voltage signal to the VFD where before it passed the high voltage to the motor. So many different ways to do it. I just followed another persons method to use what I had in the lathe. The person who showed me also does a complete build where he pulls everything out and even puts in a proximity sensor for turning to a blind shoulder or threading where the lathe stops itself. Very powerful unit. Thanks for the link. I will check it out.

[@cs9260]

@@BladesIIB Thanks for all of your information and the discussion! I'm enjoying modernizing my machines. So many different ways to do it. Even the VFD brands have completely different and independent methods.

[@BladesIIB]

@@cs9260 My pleasure, I appreciate the questions and discussion as well. I have only worked with this Hitachi VFD but on the Hobby Machinist forum I have read a lot about other brands and how others use them and agree they really can bring a lot to enhance older machines, and newer ones as well. Makes 3 phase power truly accessible anywhere.

[@rogervickery9376]

I know it has been a while since you made this video, but why not just order the lathe single phase, as is an option on PM's website. I'm a Master Electrician in Canada and am just wondering. If the thought was 3 phase is more efficient (and I haven't actually done the calculations) I'm pretty sure that after inventing a 3rd phase, as a VFD does in this case, all efficiency is out the window. Just curious? Thanks in advance for your reply if you get this.

[@BladesIIB]

Roger Vickery - Fair question. When I set out to purchase a lathe I was looking at single phase. When I finally decided on this model the 3 phase was available and single phase would have been about 6-8 month wait. That said, here are some reasons I am really glad I ended up with 3phase. Being able to use the electronics for motor start up and motor stop is great. I rarely use the brake on my lathe. When under 1200 RPM the 1.5 second stop is perfect. Single phase motors are not built for constant start and stop, 3 phase are not affected by this so should last longer. In a lathe there is a lot of start and stop. Also, quick reversal is not possible with single phase, throw it in reverse while still slowing and it will restart in the same direction. For metric threading this can be an issue. Finally, having the variable speed option between gearing is a nice bonus. Some people also say you get a better surface finish with 3 ph vs single. I hope that answers your question.

[@ericb.4914]

I am looking into doing something similar to a 40 year old Harrison lathe. I am puzzled by your 120V circuit. Usually you need a NEUTRAL yet you have 2 hot legs and a ground coming into the box. The transformer clearly requires a NEUTRAL. Can you clarify?

[@BladesIIB]

Eric B. - I did not rewatch the entire video so if there is a place in there where I reference 110/120V going to the lathe, my apologies. On my diagrams and at least the beginning part I listened to I do reference 220/240v going to the lathe to run the transformer. So for my lathe the transformer and the coolant pump run on 220v single phase and only the main power motor needed 3 Phase 220v. All the 220v uses 2 hots and a ground, you do not use a neutral wire with 220v, the neutral is only when you are taking half the power or 110v. I hope that answers your question. I am not an electrician so I may not use all the absolute correct terminology. Good luck with your VFD build for your lathe, please let me know if I can answer anything else for you. I do reference low voltage several times and in that case. Am referring to the 24 voltage signal wiring and not 120v if that helps?

[@ericb.4914]

@@BladesIIB The 24v transformer in your enclosure has the standard Ground - Neutral - Line (hot) connections. Where did you get the Neutral from? From your diagram it looks like you connected 2 hot and a ground into the 24V transformer inputs which is standard for 220v residential. In other words a hot into "L", a hot into "N" and a ground into "G". I guess if the transformer can use 120 or 220 then no issues. I like the simplicity of your setup but I am just wondering about the Neutral.

[@BladesIIB]

@@ericb.4914 Thanks for the follow up. I am only using 220v for everything so I do not have a neutral anywhere in either enclosure. So only 2 hots and the ground. If you go to 31:11 in the video you will see the full talk through of the 220 input they use R and S on the lathe enclosure and I trace those from input to the R and S on the transformer. No mention of a neutral. If you did want to run anything on 110 with a neutral you would need to run from another 110 breaker into your enclosure to get that power supply. You mention L to hot and use of N in your question. I can’t find where that N input comes up? Let me know where in the video you are seeing that and I will try and address. There are two full enclosures in the build. My enclosure with the VFD and the Lathe enclosure with the transformer. So also confirm which enclosure you are referring too. Want to help you fully understand your question.

[@ericb.4914]

@@BladesIIB Thanks again. Would you happen to have the part number of the Honeywell switch for the foot brake? It looks like a plunger style with a wheel. I'm assuming it is "normally open - NO" and when you hit the foot pedal the switch closes and the signal goes through. Do you know?

[@BladesIIB]

@@ericb.4914 If you go to my website and use the contact form, send me your email and I will send you the full parts list and wiring diagrams. Same as in the video but easier to print and read www.BladesIIB.com. The foot pedal switch is a Honeywell GLEA24C. I purchased from www.Zoro.com. Looks like they still have them. It has 2 NO and 2 NC circuits. You will use one of each. One NC for the existing lathe wires on the existing switch to cut the circuit when hit and the NO will be used to close and send the free run command to the VFD so you are not fighting an electronic slow down with the brake pedal.

thnx for video. emergency stop button should have been on the far right in my opinion.

[@BladesIIB]

Gokhan Pur - I see your point, one hole closer to the operator would not hurt. I put it back in the original location and did not even think of that. Appreciate the comment.

[@JohnBlack-dv8ss]

Great video. Whats the point of doing this apart from using the vfd to control the speed of the motor? Can you just set a single phase 220v vfd to 50/60hz, and use all the original wiring and controls if the pump runs off dual voltage 3 phase 220v 60hz. Is it because the original tranformer for the lower voltage components is not dual voltage? im about to install a KBAK-27D drive to my lathe, i have to change the motor as its not dual voltage. supose what im asking is if i install a 3 phase 220v 50/60hz motor with the same speed as the original motor can i just set the vfd to the correct setting and connect the original lathe power cord direct to vfd.

[@BladesIIB]

John Black - Great question and this gets asked a lot on the Hobby-Machinist forum. I am not an expert but every time the experts answer this question it is a no, that is not how these VFD units are designed. They are designed to connect directly to the 3 phase motor. What you are looking for would be accomplished with a Rotary Phase Converter. That is a solution to plug 3 phase directly into the original wiring. The VFD gives speed control, and adds controlled start and stopping speeds. The RPC can power more than 1 machine so just trade offs for what solution will work best for you. Hope that helps.

[@JohnBlack-dv8ss]

@@BladesIIB That does help, thanks for answering my question.

[@dontletthesmokeout]

After googling the drive model, the spec sheet indicates it’s a 10hp drive requiring 220-240v 3 phase input. Is the part/model number in your description correct?

[@BladesIIB]

Dustin - yes the model number is correct. Here is a link to an additional Hitachi document that discusses the ability to use single phase input on these units as long as sized correctly for the motor being used. In this case this is the correct size for my 5 HP 3 phase motor to run on single phase input. www.hitachi-america.us/supportingdocs/forbus/inverters/Support/AN032404-1_Rev_A_Sizing_for_Single-Phase.pdf. I hope that helps. If you go to the thread on this in The Hobby-Machinist forum mksj does a better job explaining that aspect for this and other VFDs.

[@dontletthesmokeout]

Excellent!! Thank you!

[@MotecM]

@@BladesIIB What amperage is the wall outlet circuit for this set-up? Do you have any start-up inrush issues because of the oversized VFD was used? Thanks!

[@BladesIIB]

@@MotecM Great question. I have this plugged into a 50amp outlet/breaker and have not had any issue with this in nearly 2 years. According to the Hitachi manual they recommend 60a fuse and 100a breaker for this unit. I do have fuses in my build. I discussed the breaker size with PM and with the person helping me with my build and they both assured me for this set up the 50amp would be fine. So far they have been 100% correct. Hope that answers your question. Thanks.

[@taiwanluthiers]

It's a lot to think about... luckily my Victor lathe does not have a low voltage anything. Everything runs off of the 220 from the 3 phase, and that means contactors activate when you connect 220 across its coils. The coolant pump motor I think is also three phase... not sure what to do about that, may just do away with that altogether.

[@BladesIIB]

Tyler Fu - You would need to replace the coolant pump with a single phase is the easiest. As for no low voltage as I mentioned in my other comment that seems odd. Must have large wires to all your switches to run 220 everywhere? My has a small transformer and runs 24v signal wire to all the switches and contactor a. Then the contactors pass the high voltage to the motor.

[@taiwanluthiers]

@@BladesIIB Well, I need to check and see. But the mill I have is the same deal. 220 run everywhere on the micro switches and all that, no transformer or anything. You don't need huge wires for the switches because you aren't running huge currents (it's the amps that count) on those switches. I think from what I can see they all use wires that are at least 1.6mm in diameter. I heard people use network cables for controls on VFD's...

[@BladesIIB]

@@taiwanluthiers Like most things I am sure there are many ways to do it. I am not an electrician so don’t know all the options. There should be 220 on both sides of the contactor because that is what it is passing when closed. But for m lathe just a 24 volt signal that activates the magnets to close the contactor. For the VFD it uses 24 v for signal as well and yes I am using an 8 strand very light shielded wire for that.

[@taiwanluthiers]

@@BladesIIB I'm curious why your lathe (or ones like it) is like this? I wonder if it's to save money on thinner wires or to run accessories on a lower voltage? Most industrial machines that are purely 3 phase, especially older ones, just runs everything on 220 because at least in Taiwan that's how 3 phase is, you needed a split phase transformer to even get 120 volt. So that means lights, coolant pumps, etc. all run on 220 or 3 phase if it's a motor. My lathe don't even have the necessary plumbing for a coolant (I think it was included and someone removed it for whatever reason) so I'm not worried about coolant pump. On my mill everything is either 220 or 3 phase, including coolant pump, and my mill has a 2 speed motor making VFD very tricky. I had to completely rewire the mill once because I blew out a contactor trying to fix a switch. That's one problem with buying used industrial machines, you don't have any manuals. By the way what made you choose the PM 1440TL? Why not buy used industrial machines that may be cheaper?

[@atothek1804]

​@@taiwanluthiersYes correct thin "ethernet" can control VFD. Here's the trick to control clause. Control is carried out through the serial port wiring, on the front panel. Some VFD models that panel has a removable (albeit panel has wired) unit and it can be installed in short distance way from the VFD device. . Not to be left any doubt so that NO ONE start making wiring connections from wallsocket 120V or 240V or 400V Voltage example in a JR45 Ethernet cable!!!

[@AshLongie]

Why do u need the relays if u are just using the switch ? Can't you just go straight to VFd ?

[@AshLongie]

Only ask as I'm in processes now lol I've got the machine going but getting stuck with the ground where do you ground the 3phase ground ?

[@BladesIIB]

@AshLongie - I wanted to keep as much of the built in safety features of the lathe as I could. So preventing accidental start up if a switch left on, the kill button on the front etc. All still work with this configuration. I followed the advice of an expert and went with what I they recommended for this type of build. I know he does a full build out pulling all the wiring from the lathe and goes direct to the VFD but I believe he still uses contractors to add in some safety protocols. I don't have the expertise to give you a better answer than that. You may want to get on the Hobby Machinist forum and pose the question to user mksj.

[@BladesIIB]

@AshLongie - I am not an electrician, but on mine, the VFD has a ground that goes to my ground bus/bar. The motor wire has a shielding that is grounded as well at both ends. May need to consult an electrician if your set up is not matching up with that?

[@AshLongie]

@@BladesIIB myn is a Chinese vfd lol has uvw and p- the instructions are so bad I'm not sure what the p- does

[@BladesIIB]

@@AshLongie Interesting. Not sure how it compares but here is the nomenclature on mine. Mine was pretty clear with L1-L3 for the inputs either single or 3phase in - also labeled R S and T (R/L1 etc.). And T1-T3 for the output to the motor, also labeled U V and W (U/T1 etc.). So the UVW on yours if the same should be your 3phase out to the motor. I don’t have P- but I have PD/+1 and P/+ that are connected with a jumper. N/- that I don’t use and my brake resistor is connected to P+ and RB. Then I have two clearly marked G for ground with the ground symbol. So based on that, I don’t think P is your ground. Really sounds like you may need to consult an expert familiar with that VFD if the instructions are that poorly written?