Lec-25: Third Normal Form in dbms with examples in Hindi | Normalization

[@shadowslayer2248]

5 years and still no other playlist could match the quality of Varun Sir's teachings! Hats OFF!!

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But still some missing 😢

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Now 6 years and counting!!

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This guy is awesome, concept was cleared in first 3 minutes only But still he gave 2 examples for better understandings

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2 hour before exam 😅

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6 years down the road, these are still helpful af and always will be. No one else can teach concepts like this

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Watched at midnight before exams and scored good marks in Dbms. Sir, you are a dronacharya.

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[@pratyushbhardwaj9202]

00:05 Third Normal Form and Transitive Dependency 02:03 Roll number is determining the city using the transitive property. 04:03 Transitive dependency and candidate keys 06:07 The table is in Second Normal Form and the candidate key is ABD. 08:09 AB and DB are the candidate keys 10:13 A is helping, B is helping, and D is helping. 12:29 A table is in third normal form if it does not contain any transitive dependency. 14:29 To be in Third Normal Form, either the left hand side of each functional dependency should be a candidate key or super key, or the right hand side should be a prime attribute.

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[@GateSmashers]

Thank you so much for your love and support.

[@pintusaini6838]

​ @Gate Smashers today i caught one mistake in the explanation at 6:12 . if prime attribute determines non-prime then it will not be in 3NF cause it fails to be in 2NF (prime att. is proper subset of CK). ref:Lec 29

[@geethikaatthi9945]

@@pintusaini6838 a non prime attribute can be determined by a prime attribute but it can't cause partial dependency hence in the above example roll no is the proper subset and there is no partial dependency so it is in 2NF

[@dynamicsid8795]

@@pintusaini6838 yes bruh u r right there is a mistake " if prime attribute which is also part of a candidate key either we can say proper subset of candidate key Determines non prime attribute then it will create partial dependency and due to partial dependency a normal form can't in 2 NF so not be in 3NF" but sir us saying it will be in 3NF

[@ritchieronald315]

@@GateSmashers I have a doubt sir . What if a non prime attribute was determining CD ? How would we proceed in that case ?

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in which SEM..?

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[@arunsuryan9133]

If a prime attribute can determine a nonprime attribute in 3NF that means that there exists a partial dependency (Becuase every prime attribute is always a proper subset of candidate key itself) and it violates 2NF. Please clear this.

[@tonypepper]

I didn't understand......

[@pixelsbyme]

yes i guess you are saying correct, it violates 2nf and therefore also 3nf

[@ZainAli-wk9yd]

For 3NF , one condition is that the relation should be in 2NF , if a relation is in 2NF then primary key of relation would be whole candidate key

[@sumitkevlani5740]

Left hand side should be candidate key or super key it means it violates the rule of proper subset case

[@pranjalthakur1236]

If Rhs is prime attributes , not LHS

[@supriyanaik3100]

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This is the best video on normalization forms

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Sir aapne bhut gazab padhaya h jo chote chote points aur trick bataiye h aapne bhut helpful h 🙏

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Thank you, sir I have watched DBMS videos one day before the exam and I had got clear that exam

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Amazing ❤️ Explanation with accurate example

[@lalhotra_unofficial_5601]

your explaination is too much understandable for all compatative exam like gate net set etc thank u

[@634_abinashmishra3]

Sir how come prime attribute presence in LHS of functional dependency meant that the relation will be in 3NF .If so then it will prove partial dependency and thus violating 2NF .I only understood the presence of candidate keys or super key obtained from candidate keys presence in LHS

[@harrypotter-el4lx]

prime attribute is in rhs

[@vinayaksharma-ys3ip]

@634_Abinash mishra Bro did you understand it now??

[@VivekKumar-wl6lc]

first of all it can't violate 2NF because it has passed the test of 2NF . After testing for 2NF it has come for 3NF.. Here condition of 3NF is only for that F. D which are already in 2Nf.

[@adityakharde4265]

@@VivekKumar-wl6lc nah it violates 2nf if you take a np attribute being determined by a prime attribute

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This vedio never gets old.. The explanation was lit🗿💥

[@ashishtayade047]

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[@_HARSHPRAKASH]

sir at 6:43 you said that prime attribute determing non-prime attribute is okay..... but that affects the 2NF condition as the non-prime attributess should be fully functionally dependent on the candidate key and not on its proper subsets. Please clarify!

[@basavavenkatasaivaraprasad7228]

same doubt if c is prime and there is no problem then 2nf is violated right

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how peacefully explained ☺️i got all my doubts cleared.

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[@mayanksingh1007]

I have some confusion at 16:20 what if there is a Functional dependency ( D-->C) then will this table be in 3 NF because this dependency is Prime to non-Prime.. it is not transitive dependency( non prime - non prime) but is also not following the mentioned statement that LHS should be a CK / SK OR RHS should be a Prime attribute ... CAN ANYONE ANSWER THIS???

[@aytida754]

if you change D -> C it, then D changes from a prim attribute to a nonprime attribute. hence D->C becomes a non prime Attr -> non prime Attr which is not allowed in 3NF. Thus it will not be 3NF

[@03_abhishekchoubey42]

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Sir thankyou so much sir Sir aap bht acha teach krte Hain Apki videos mujhe bht achi smjh ati hai Agar sir aap telegram par notes de dete to better hota or bhi Aapne jo teach kiya uske hi notes bnate to jada better hota...... Ab notes kisi or ke bnane pdte h...... But thankyou so much sir Mujhe starting me DBMS itna hard lga tha fir maine KZbin par video dekhi or apki videos first time me hi smjh aa gyi...... Thanks a lot sir🙏🙏

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[@sarthaktripathy2294]

You should explain why it is a problem if there is a non prime attribute determine a non prime attribute. Your explanation will be helpful for us. Thank you sir

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[@madanmohan1660]

At, 6:16, I think he is wrong. He said that the big flaw is that C is a non prime attribute, but in transitivity dependency that doesn't even matter. In 3NF, the condition is no non-prime attribute should be transitivity dependent on the primary key. And here D is dependent on AB.And C doesn't have anything to do with it . I may be wrong. If anyone find me wrong, pls explain!

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[@c.danielpremkumar8495]

15:46 instead of checking LHS for CK/SK , would it not be enough to check ONLY RHS to be PA ? That is, If RHS is a PA, then the table is in 3NF. Therefore, why should we check LHS at all ?

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[@kunalsahay12]

In the students table, a NPA(City) is being determined by another NPA(State). Isn't it the violation of first rule and you can conclude that it is not in a 3NF?

[@adityakharde4265]

yeah i thought the same it violates 3nf it is only in 3nf if the attribute determined is always prime or the attribute determining must be a ck

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Notes provid krva do 😓😓

[@lokeshgodara1329]

in example 1 if c was an prime attribute then CK will also contain C.... so CK=ABC and then in c->D there would be a partial dependency and R(ABCD) would not be in 2NF hence 3NF also not valid

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[@kalyansharma1785]

aap ko bahot bahot dhyabadh , mujhe normal forms nahi samajh aaraha tha aap ke video ne clear kar diya , me nepal se hu aapko bahut sara dhyawadh

[@comradepeter87]

13:32 Sir says relation is 3NF cuz no non-prime attr determines a non-prime attr (which is true), but isn't it the case for 3NF that it must also be 2NF? if you see, we have two CKs = {AB, BD}. However in case of BD, we have A being determined by just a proper subset of BD (B -> A), which violates 2NF constraints. So this isn't 2NF, so this mustn't be 3NF?

[@DoctorK2105]

condition for second normal form - All the non prime attributes should be fully dependent on candidate key BUT A is not a non prime attribute so it can be determined by D so it is in second normal form

[@abhishekroushan9735]

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Aap bahut achha padate ho sir😍❤

[@AK-us1by]

Explained a complex topic in a very easy format, Thanks.

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Best channel for gate preparation 😌

[@priyanshugupta3816]

Bhaiya aapne 6:44 mein bola hai ki prime_attribute ---> non_prime_attribute. Aisa hone par toh wo 2NF rahega hi nahi because every NPA must be fully functional dependant on the candidate key.

[@dumaloocanplay]

exactly my thought buddy

[@harshtomar2694]

exactly

[@avichiii]

that's what was thinking, D is proper subset of DB so, partial dependency is present.

[@shivamtanwar2430]

@@avichiii D is proper subset of DB but A is a prime attribute... The condition is that LHS is a proper subset AND RHS is a non prime attribute...if any of these is false then there is no partial dependency

[@ashwinnair1035]

bro condition dekho he have written or focus on or........lhs must be candidate key or rhs is a prime attribute dono me se koi ek ayega to satisfy kr jayegaaaa.....

[@tubakhan8143]

I m from pakistan or mjy bot mushkil horai thi ....sir u r superb....kmal hogyaa

[@punitojha5560]

Just a doubt : shouldn't it be Roll->City and City->State. because a single state may have multiple cities but one city will always lie in 1 fixed state

[@chetansharma9369]

Same doubt

[@beautyoftheindia8602]

In last question table is not in 2nf . So How it can be in 3nf ????plz answer me

[@yogitachavan8992]

thank you so much sir..this is very helpful for placement point of view also

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Best teacher 👍 👍👍 from jammu and kashmir

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Nahi bhai note nhi mile usse to back agayi hogi😢

[@deepvyas4644]

what if rollno and state together is a candidate key and FD contains rollno --> city will it be in 3nf as is has do not have transitive dependency?

[@Pavicy0nmani2082]

Thank you so much sir. You save my time.

[@rekharabari4964]

Sir apne Jo table me state and city liya hai wo to nonprime to fir unme se koi ek prime kaise banega aur wo kaise 3rd NF main kahelayega?

[@mariarajooot3030]

too good way of teaching..Allah bless u..and give u more and more you deserve...

[@GateSmashers]

Thank you for your love and wishes

[@azuboof]

if {roll no, state} is a candidate key, it can determine City. City can be defined by state alone and can be partially dependent on state right...so how is it in 2NF to be 3NF

[@susheeljoshi99]

6:02 I think NP attribute only determined by Candidate key so it can held property of 2 NF but you are saying something else. please make me correct if I am wrong.

[@GateSmashers]

yes you are partially right but if NP attribute is determined by NP attribute then it can also be in 2nd normal form. So it says all right hand side of functional dep should not be determined by part of candidate key.

[@binnygarg3505]

yeah bro u r ryt

[@sagarikadutta6931]

you are the best teacher.

[@waron1240]

At 6:43 a non prime is detemined by prime. Should not it be a partial dependency unless that prime attribute is a Ck. That mean it is not in 2 nf. Therefore not in 3nf.correct me if wrong. I said it because you said there is only one case where non prime determine non prime.

[@riteshbisht94]

💎 Crystal clear 🔥

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I will complete dbms in this 15 days that for sure , i am a cs student currently 2 year and dbms will be taught to us in 6 semester but i will complete it earlier 😄

[@apnastudybuddy8683]

Very well explain all the normalized forms ,great efforts, thank you sir 🙏

[@freefirelover618]

🎉

[@vickyroy844]

At 9:54 you say DB can also be a candidate key, but it seems to not confirm to 2NF then, given that A can be determined by partial key i.e. D. So possible CKs should be {AB, DBA}

[@shivamtanwar2430]

but a is a prime attribute. partial dependency check has 2 conditions - IF(lhs is a proper subset of ck) && RHS is a non prime attr .... if any of these is false, there is no partial dependency

[@pushpamandi1120]

Since i found this channel i am fully afraid of how to pass dbms after listening to ur lecture i have full confidence on getting good marks as well as knowledge. Thank u sir☺️

[@AMITGUPTA-hh2re]

Very good explanation of the the subject. Really loved it

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Your teaching method is too good sir

[@adityajain1205]

sir I have one doubt that you didnt checked for the relation to be in 2nd Normal Form before checking 3NF

[@abhinavgharde6845]

Better than knowledge gate 💯

[@samiksha_gupta_1]

I don't know how to thank you enough Sir. I have watched a lot of videos on this topic over KZbin, tried my level best to understand from them but I couldn't. I am not demeaning them, they are great teachers but I was finding it very difficult to understand their explanation.I must say that the way you teach us is commendable.

[@GateSmashers]

Thanks a lot

[@rimimalik3380]

May Allah bless you Sir...your student from pakistan 🇵🇰

[@shivanshusharma422]

Sir u said at 6:45 a non-prime attribute can determine a prime attribute will be in 3nf but it won't be 2nf so it can't be in 3nf

[@shivanidwivedi3276]

U mixed two different things. Ya its correct that if a non prime attribute determines prime attribute then it will be in 3rd NF And dont forget if u proved that it is in 3rd Normal form,then it is already in 2nd NF.

[@shivanshusharma422]

@@shivanidwivedi3276 but what if look at this way that to prove something in 3nf we have to proof it in 2nf first?🤭

[@shivanidwivedi3276]

@@shivanshusharma422 we actually are not proving.If it is not in 2nd NF then we decompose it and make it in 2nd NF.

[@shivanshusharma422]

@@shivanidwivedi3276 it might be a solution yeah to decompose it and use it for 3nf.. right here 👍🏽

[@hrutujapawar2311]

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