Let's Reconstruct Middle Chinese | #1

[@Mac_an_Mheiriceanaigh]

in Irish we have /s/ becoming /t/ in certain word-initial contexts also

[@konokiomomuro7632]

Burmese has */s/ became /θ/ that approaches [t̪] so...

[@benedyktjaworski9877]

As I mentioned in a separate comment - I made the same association! But in Irish it’s actually prehistoric dVsV becoming t through a -dh- stage (*sindā sūli ‘the eye’ → *indā hūli → *ind hūl´ → intūl´ in tṡúil → ə(n)tūl´ an tsúil) rather than just s becoming t. And it happens regularly only after the article ‘an’ (in Modern Irish also sometimes after other words in -n, like ‘lán-tsásta’, ‘Cionn tSáile’, etc. - but that’s analogical and non-standard at every stage of the language). It’s basically the lenition of /s/ to /h/ devoicing the /d/ that used to be a part of the article (Old Irish ‘ind’ in certain contexts, Proto-Celtic *sindos, *sindā, etc.). I’m sure something completely different is going on in those Chinese variants.

[@lucichan]

The multitasking is unrivalled lol

[@stevenzheng5459]

I am familiar with Mandarin, Cantonese, Hokkien, and Hakka. A looks like a Mandarin variant B looks like a Wu dialect C is definitely Hokkien D looks like a Min dialect, but not sure which one E is a Hakka variant F is definitely standard Cantonese (Guangzhou/Hong Kong) G really lost with this one, looks Wu-ish H definitely standard Mandarin (Putonghua)

[@iuiang1178]

G is Wenzhounese.

[@harveylam4294]

D seems like Hainanese to me...

[@benedyktjaworski9877]

Huh. A very striking thing with your “leniting variety” is that it strikingly seems to follow a… Goidelic pattern of lenition. You get both /t/ → /h/ and /s/ → /t/ there. Now, the s → t thing in Irish, Manx, and Sc. Gaelic is restricted to a specific morphosyntactic context (lenition after the article ‘an’ /ə(n)/), and is an anomalous pattern but it exists (and actually it’s three consecutive changes in a trench coat - first lenition s / V# _V# → h, then apocope of the first vowel, and then devoicing d-h → t; eg. *sindā sūli ‘the eye’ → *indā hūli → *ind hūl´ → intūl´ in tṡúil → ə(n)tūl´ an tsúil). I’m sure the story behind the Chinese variety is completely different - but still, striking how well it seems to be reproducing the anomalous pattern from Goidelic!

[@harveylam4294]

I have an inkling that this is Hainanese, a Southern Min (disputed?) language that underwent significant phonological restructuring after it was introduced to Hainan. For example, under the presumed influence of neighbouring languages, like Hlai and Ong Be, the plain dental stop *t underwent implosivisation to /ɗ/ in most varieties. This triggered a chain shift of sorts, along the lines of *tsʰ > s > t > ɗ, which is remarkably similar to how Vietnamese historically developed (*s > t > ɗ > n, where *tɕ > ɕ/s and *kr, pr, etc. > *kʂ > ʂ/s). Note that only the aspirated dental stop *tʰ spirantises to /h/ in Hainanese. A handful of other quirks also align it closely with Northern Vietnamese (*j > /z/, *kʰ > /x/, etc).

[@kori228]

B is definitely Wu, I'm guessing Suzhou specifically because it has the *au > æ (including *iau > iæ > iɛ). It merges 陽上 tone into 陽去 tone (女 and 老 have the same tone as 道 232). 2 入 probably should actually be /ɲiəʔ ~ ɲɪʔ/ because the /z-/ is literary from Mandarin 14 去 I didn't realize unrounded the medial. I would expect /tɕʰʑʷ/ because it comes from that same /-y/ vowel. F is Cantonese, I recognize that

[@sino-tibeto-myanmar]

I would love to see significant numbers of "Indo-European" loanwords in Mid Chinese, such as words for "Honey", "Horse", "Cart", "Wheel", "Dog", And they were not really from loanwords of Sanskrit when the era of Buddhist was flourished in Yellow River basin. But seem there are also Mon-Khmer loanwords too, such as words for "Turtle", even "Tea" etc (Mon-Khmer / Austro-Asiatic ancestors mostly likely dominated modern-day Yun Nan province).

[@Mac_an_Mheiriceanaigh]

very fun and interesting!

[@광동아재廣東大叔]

Beginning from the B at the left, seen from the pronunciation, that should be similar to 上海話，閩南話(Hokkien)，海南話，客家話，廣東話(Cantonese)，similar to 溫州話，and 普通話. A looks similar to Mandarin but I'm not sure. It's true that a comprehensive knowledge about several Southern Chinese dialects is required to reconstruct the phonetic system of middle Chinese.

[@Thelaretus]

H is obviously Mandarin. Look at the numerals 'one', 'two' and 'three'; also, doesn't the word for 'sky' remind you of a certain massacre?

[@KertPerteson]

That thumbnail is amazing man😂

[@NickyDIY101]

oh my god

[@milobem4458]

language H looks similar to Mandarin, probably some older form

[@LanguageBLOX1_Alt]

h w