Let's Talk About Caroline Bingley

[@AdrianColley]

One piece of evidence exists in support of the idea that Miss Bingley is older than Elizabeth Bennett: Caroline is never heard to criticise Elizabeth for being too old. Lady Catherine is happy to shame Elizabeth publicly on that score. Caroline would surely have mentioned it if she was not vulnerable to the same observation.

[@janetsmith8566]

Interesting.

[@heathersealey592]

That's a good point. Because you know she would.

[@katiejlumsden]

Elizabeth is only 20, which wasn't considered old - Anne Elliot at 27 may be considered past her prime by the standards of the time period, but Elizabeth is certainly not considered so at 20. I don't think Lady Catherine is shaming Elizabeth for her age when she asks her it; her impertinence is in asking what her age is at all because it's a rude question, but she in fact says that Elizabeth needn't be ashamed of her age because she can't be older than 20.

[@AdrianColley]

@@katiejlumsden Thanks, that's a strong point. Caroline is always trying to compare herself positively to Elizabeth, but maybe she wouldn't if the comparison would be seen as too minor.

[@Karluin]

I always thought Caroline was within of a year of Bingley and Louisa had a couple years on them both.

[@whatevergoesforme5129]

The films and TV series wanted to present a Cinderella story like Mills and Boons LOL. That is why the Bennets are portrayed as "poor" especially in the 2005 version instead of landed gentry where they got their income via rental properties so they didn't need to work. The reason Elizabeth met Darcy was because they moved within the same circle. Even without the Bingleys, she would have met Darcy in Rosings by chance if she was invited by the Collinses the same time Darcy visited his aunt. And in that environment, he would have fallen in love faster and with less prejudice because he wouldn't see the embarrassing young Bennet sisters and the mother. But of course, there would have been less drama except Lady Catherine's objections and Jane not meeting Mr. Bingley.

[@bobbiesuedavis5406]

Could you talk about Lucy Steele from Sense and Sensibility? Even though she's a technically a villain, I've always admired her cleverness and ingenuity.

[@janetsmith8566]

Yes by all means Lucy Steele! An interesting psychological study begging to happen!

[@sonitagovan]

I would love one on Augusta Elton.

[@bookmouse2719]

Oh yes.

[@judiemeierfranz4329]

Agree! Also, Isabella Thorpe from Northanger.

[@BookishTexan]

This was so good. Austen's characters -- major and minor -- are so nuanced and so well realized. They are the reason that I enjoy reading Austen. Caroline Bingley was not a character I had given much thought to, but I will the next time I read _Pride and Prejudice_

[@katiejlumsden]

Thanks :)

[@AdrianColley]

I suspect that adaptations have depicted Miss Bingley as unnecessarily old in order to recruit the halo effect (which makes the audience feel more sympathy for younger and prettier characters). The same thing can be seen, to a much greater extent, in Mr. Collins: he is cast as old to make sure that we still dislike him despite the actor's charm.

[@UzmaKhan-rp6yd]

You should definitely do Mary Bennet next!!!She is one of the most underrated character, and certainly one of my favourites! Thank you!

[@katiejlumsden]

If you haven't read The Other Bennet Sister, you must!

[@kayfountain6261]

I don't get the impression that Caroline is close friends with Georgiana Darcy. She'd like to be. Partly to cement her way into G's social milieu and partly to increase her opportunities to hang about the Darcy properties outside her brother's contact with D. I've also thought that C's use of the word 'dotes' about G implies that C is a few years older than G.

[@kahkah1986]

Although it might be to make herself sound more grown up, if they are actually almost the same age, just a couple of years difference.

[@katiejlumsden]

It's hard to tell - we mostly see her want to claim that friendship, it's true!

[@loublk82]

I would love a video about Fanny Dashwood. Actually I would love a whole book about her life. Think it would be fantastic to read about her scheming and backstabbing her way through life

[@katiejlumsden]

Oooo she is such an interesting character.

[@jm15xy]

You know, there are a lot of characters in _Pride and Prejudice_ that Elizabeth Bennet and Mr. Darcy don't like but that nonetheless, both are _stuck with_ either because they're family (like all of Elizabeth's family except Jane and Lady Catherine de Bourgh) or, like Miss Bingley, are related to friends and family (Mr. Bingley's sister and Jane's eventual sister-in-law). As a married couple, they could get away with cutting out, but it would be horribly insensitive and impolite to do so. I may be wrong, but my notion is that back then, the line between childhood and adulthood was pretty stark, and that when you're an adult you're treated as an adult regardless of your level of maturity.

[@lizlittle1641]

I would love to hear you disect Mrs. Norris.

[@slashbash1347]

This should be interesting. I've given a lot of thought to Mr. Collins and why I think he's on the autism spectrum, as well as to Lydia and Wickham, but I often overlooked Bingley's sisters (the married one's usually left out of adaptations). Hell, for some reason, I remembered her name being Pearl.

[@brendantannam499]

I would love to hear more about Mr. Collins being on the autism spectrum. It would cover a multitude of 'sins'.

[@Cat_Woods]

Thanks for pointing out Caroline's age and reiterating Dr. Cox's point about her class. (It helped me notice that she was not only not superior, classwise, to Elizabeth, but actually inferior according to that hierarchy.) I could never forgive her deliberate betrayal of Jane -- not just her falseness, but her willful destructiveness. She may have needed to marry Darcy, but Charles did not need to marry Georgiana. It can be argued that she thought it would increase the likelihood of her marrying Darcy and keep him away from Elizabeth, but to me it seems like pure spite and pettiness. At the very least, cruel calculation. Darcy was unconvinced of Jane's affection for Bingley, but Caroline was not. It was more deliberately hurtful for her to participate in persuading her brother that Jane didn't really care for him. I do feel a little sorry for her as well, but she's not like one of Austen's ruined women who get "passed from man to man" and die young in a poorhouse. She'll have a comfortable life and eventually marry a man of higher class who needs a dowry. She'll continue to have the pain that Darcy married Lizzy, but she'll also continue to look down on Elizabeth's family, probably bringing up Lydia's elopement at any opportunity.

[@LiteraryMultitudes]

Excellent video! I love these deep dives. :) I think Mary Crawford should be an interesting character for such an analysis. But basically all of Austen's characters offer so much depth!

[@katiejlumsden]

Oh yes, both the Crawfords perhaps!

[@deboragiron9300]

I've always considered Caroline around the same age as Elizabeth, she has at least a few years of being in society as Elizabeth does but she is definetly very proud and prejudiced even though her fortune is from trade which she and her sister convidently forget. I think a video about the Crawfords from Mansfield Park would be fascinating.

[@MargaretPinard]

The age and source-of-money points give one much to think on! Thank you for this great talk, Katie 😊🤗

[@magorzataniewiadomska5914]

Thought-provoking as usual. As Jane Austen novels are re-readable stories for more insights, your clips are "re-watchable" (probably this word does not exist but I'm sure that you know what I mean 😏).

[@katiejlumsden]

Thanks very much!

[@SailorMoon-in-Cancer]

This was a great discussion! I’ve never thought that Caroline might be younger than Lizzie, and this possibility really does change their relationship dynamic. I think we’ve all been influenced by TV and film adaptations so much that it’s almost shocking to discover everyone’s true ages. I certainly was surprised when I found out that Mrs Bennet is still a relatively young woman (from our modern perspective), while Jane and Lizzie are already crossing into the “old maid” territory (from the Regency perspective). I still see Mr Collins as devil incarnate, but I grew to sympathize with Caroline. She has everything we could ever want but is still denied respect because of a silly artificial barrier. Her brother is responsible for making their family secure but prefers to feed her promises and focus on his leisure and romance instead. So I don’t fault her for not genuinely wishing him to find happiness with Jane, since he’s the one who focuses only on his own needs. As a woman, Caroline has no power in this matter, so her only hope is to marry Mr Darcy, and her desperation makes sense. To Austen, the fact that Caroline lacks gentry status (even though her male relatives are at fault) is the cause of her image as a hypocrite and a mean girl. But to me, as a modern reader, there’s a good reason why Caroline feels superior to the Bennets: she has the money, education and good manners, while the Bennets have none of that. The only thing they can latch on to is their land, but from a modern point of view, that’s not impressive. On the contrary, being able to afford a huge estate like Netherfield seems like a much bigger deal now. And I think modern filmmakers know that and portray her as an older lady from high class on purpose, so as to frame Lizzie’s battle against her as a battle against the old establishment. Yet in the book, it’s actually Caroline who’s trying to rise above the box society is trying to put her in.

[@katiejlumsden]

It's so interesting :)

[@glendodds3824]

The Bennets are gentry in the book and Mt Bennet has a very substantial income of £2,000 a year. In contrast, in the 2005 film the Bennets are portrayed as yokel gentry, people almost devoid of class. Moreover, in the book Lady Catherine de Bourgh describes Elizabeth Bennet as "very genteel."

[@jmarie9997]

I don't feel sorry for Caroline Bingley in the least. She's het own worst enemy with her snobbery. If she showed a little modesty (not humility) she could easily marry a gentleman. She's rich, attractive, 'accomplished', educated as a gentlewoman... but her desperation is so obvious. Honestly, if she didn't have a rich brother and Mr Darcy's acquaintance, she'd likely be shunned. As it is, the gentry she's so desperate to join probably laughs at her behind her back for her vulgarity.

[@Stashi1808]

PLEASE throughly dissect Mr. Martin in Emma. He is one of my favorite Austen heroes. His undying love for Harriet Smith, even though she at first refused him, and was trying to get Mr. Elton, and then Mr. Knightly before realizing she loved him. And how sweet he was telling her which roads were flooded even after she turned him down.😍 Darcy/Brandon material❤❤❤ I would also love to see these underrated characters: Maria Lucus, Mary King, Kitty Bennet(Pride and Prejudice), Margaret Dashwood, Mrs. Palmer, Anne Steele (Sense and Sensibility), Mrs. Cross (Love and Friendship/Lady Susan), and Mr. Rushworth.(Mansfield Park)❤

[@maryh4650]

The young age and her social position, would make a big difference. Nuevo Rich and old families are still viewed differently today. Bingley is frequently deferring to Darcy, which would also make sense and make him less of a doormat.

[@rebellius_9190]

you changed my whole perspective

[@mtngrl5859]

Since the average of women to get married in the Regency era was 22, I think Caroline is likely between 19-20. While she is clearly attracted to Mr. Darcy, she doesn't seem to be overly preoccupied with getting married. If she was over 24, she likely would be looking more intently for a husband. This is why she wants her brother to buy an estate, which will elevate her socially. I think there is enough difference in age between her and Georgiana, who isn't officially "out" at this time.

[@p.k.1401]

Would love to hear your thoughts about Jane Fairfax!

[@janetsmith8566]

Or even better, frank churchill!

[@rosezingleman5007]

I’d like to hear more about Miss Bates. Austen says that it was an honor for young Emma to be noticed by her! So she wasn’t always silly.

[@deborahgreitzer7393]

You are generous to Caroline Bingley to consider her so thoroughly. When I have read the book, which I have done many times, I thought of her merely as a caricature of a snobbish young lady used as a vehicle to bring out Elizabeth's wit, Darcy's infatuation (which makes his first proposal slightly less astonishing), and Bingley's kindness. I did wonder how one family could produce someone as open and accepting as Bingley along with two stuck-up, backbiting sisters.

[@katiejlumsden]

I guess we don't know how long their parents have been dead, and we know they all went away to school, and it would have been to different ones, so it may be that they've been brought up pretty separately.

[@AlexS-oj8qf]

Clearly you haven't met my sister.

[@janetsmith8566]

Oh dear. I have just finished finally reading the text of Lady Susan and oh… Please please please please please will you do a deep dive on Lady Susan herself? What a completely fascinating creature! And then secondly her friend Mrs Johnson - almost ditto although not quite as interesting as Lady Susan. And Also the extremely fascinating sister in law Mrs Vernon. She is the only one who’s got Lady Susan figured out from top to bottom. No wonder they hate each other! But how and why is she so good at reading Lady Susan? She certainly has what the Emma narrator would call “Penetration“. 😆

[@katiejlumsden]

Lady Susan is rather wonderful - perhaps one day I do need to do a video on her!

[@bgreer6584]

So very interesting to think, for the first time, that Caroline could be so much younger than assumed by movie or screen adaptations! How fascinating it would be to see her portrayed as a 19 or 20 year old with a younger woman’s crush on Darcy, and teenage snobbery. Delightful insight also on her actual place in society and what she wants to project to those around her.

[@jennifer2161]

That was interesting - thanks. I'd always assumed that Caroline was mid-twenties at least, having failed to catch a husband through several London seasons, and desperate. You've put a new perspective on it - two girls of much the same age, but Elizabeth scores as a reputed beauty and the daughter of a landed gentleman.

[@LilacDaisy2]

I do think it was Caroline who warned Lady Catherine that Darcy may have been engaged to Elisa (my sed button is broken). She had the most to gain, had the most evidence, was the most watchful of Darcy, and whose character most suited the action. It also matches with it being a "rumour," which an accidental slip via Miss Darcy, is not.

[@katiejlumsden]

I think you're probably right!

[@MargaretPinard]

I like applying the title to everyone rather than Darcy--totally!

[@CrankyKat4106]

I really enjoyed this video! I re-read Pride and Prejudice for Jane Austen July and sold Caroline Bingley short. I just viewed her as a comedic foil for Elizabeth, but you really humanized her (and reminded me of my unrequited love experiences as a teenager 🤣). It’s interesting to view her as more of a lovesick teenager who feels socially inadequate instead of a smug, hateful social-climbing younger adult.

[@charlesiragui2473]

I loved your consideration of age here (and re Mr Collins). Dr Cox also mentioned age in the context of Mrs Bennett, who is actually around 40 years old, much younger and much more attractive than she is typically portrayed in films. Your point about a teenage Miss Bingley making her character more sympathetic could be extended across so many JA characters. Elinor Dashwood 19, Marianne 17(!), Fanny Price 18 for instance. The youthful age range of many of her female heroines is stunning for our time and it sets up the parents as quite young too (Mrs Dashwood is clearly mentioned as 40). As you say, this modifies somewhat our perception of their behavior. These are still maturing young adults, actually legal minors. And the great exception, Anne Elliot, is striking for her less impassioned, less impulsive behavior. Even someone as principled and controlled as Elinor Dashwood does spend a fair amount of time crying with her sister. It would be hard to imagine that with 27 year old Anne Elliot, who is clearly an adult in her behavior and capacity to take on responsibility, her emotional autonomy. The fact that girls were getting married at such immature ages is interesting in itself. Austen doesn't seem to have any criticism of it, as she marries off Marianne and Fanny Price at 18. Clearly, people thought it was ok (preferable) for a woman to become mature already having a husband, and probably children, a culture gap that makes putting these stories to film challenging. It does make more sense of the parental role in the marriages, making it less tyrannical and more necessary for the girls' protection (contra: Mrs Dashwod, Mr Bennett). As far as Miss Bingley, given her rivalry, her comfort in addressing Elizabeth, wouldn't it seem that the two of them are the same age? At 20, she would have had time to become anxious socially and maritally. This would also set up their rivalry as better foils. Also, I took her friendship with Georgiana Darcy as one of an older sister role, again promoting her goal of marriage with Darcy.

[@janetsmith8566]

This was brilliant and helpful. Caroline is such an interesting character. You brought up many new facts about her I had not considered. Regarding the portrayals of her on film - I do love the Anna Chancellor portrayal of her in the 1995 pride and prejudice and feel that had she carried that sort of snobbery over into her portrayal of Lucia in Mapp and Lucia she would have been completely brilliant. As it was, I felt she very much overly underplayed Lucia to the point of great disappointment. Does anyone agree?

[@katiejlumsden]

Thanks! I must watch Mapp and Lucia sometime . . .

[@janetsmith8566]

@@katiejlumsden Currently listening to Emma and now def want to request a deep dive into the life of the Bates ladies! How did they end up as they did? How might the elderly Mrs Bates have existed long before she was only good for “tea and quadrille “?

[@christinesmith3991]

It fascinates me that Anna Chancellor is actually related to Jane Austen - her 8xgreat niece, descended from Edward Austen Knight. And Marsha Fitzalan, who played Caroline in 1980, is the daughter of the then Duke of Norfolk, which probably meant in the present day she out ranked everyone for miles around :) Which is apropos of nothing but interests me

[@tillysshelf]

This was fantastic and I do hope you continue these videos in future years! This interpretation of Caroline Bingley also means that her friendship with Jane Bennet makes more sense. I have always wondered why she would choose to be friendly to someone she clearly doesn't want her brother to marry. But in this context, where she is young and insecure and possibly integrating into a new country neighbourhood for the first time (if she went from industrial North to school then to London) it makes sense for her to pick a slightly older, mature and non-threatening girl, who already has a good social status in the neighbourhood, to try to establish herself. I think she is a product of what she has been taught, so when she speaks of accomplishments you can hear the pressure placed on her by her school/governess - and acquiring accomplishments would obscure her class issues.

[@bookmouse2719]

The Bingleys were from the North as well, so not a posh accent unless she took speach lessons in seminary class. They were new money with no title or estate.

[@janetsmith8566]

And new money has to be ten times loftier than old money….

[@glendodds3824]

Most people in the south of England don't have posh accents either.

[@jmarie9997]

She was educated as a gentlewoman. She'd have the accent and the etiquette. Unfortunately she's so desperate, she sabotages herself.

[@goodstrongwords]

So thought provoking! I honestly have given very little thought to Caroline’s character, but considering her age and social position definitely adds to her character. I would love to see you do one of these about Jane Fairfax and/or Frank Churchill from Emma. Also Miss Bates and Mr. Elton would be interesting. Wonderful video!

[@katiejlumsden]

Oooo good ideas :)

[@kevinrussell1144]

I like your reasoning about Caroline's age; I suspect she is (perhaps) a bit younger but nearly the same age as Lizzie. Since Louisa is already married, we might assume she is a bit older than Chuck. As Dr. Cox points out, class is the operative fact here. Between you and Octavia, I think you have hammered this into submission. I like your summary of Mr. Collins, too. Good job. I think you're being quite fair to Caroline, in the same way I try to be more sympathetic to Isabella Thorpe. Yes, they both have white and respectable priviledges, but they did not receive the BEST possible hands of cards. And yes, Caroline loves Mr. Darcy and is jealous of Lizzie. IF you're looking for another deep dive, you COULD trot out Ms. Thorpe, but I think Jane Fairfax would be a much more nuanced subject. As always, thanks for the wonderful content and enthusiasm.

[@ciialhynat2568]

Thanks for this video! I can't believe that you actually made me identify with Caroline Bingley but you did! (Full disclosure: I actually never read the book but watched the 2005 movie like 20 times?) I was always under the false impression that she is of the same class as Darcy and was wondering how her having on eye on him would conflict with Lady Catherine's dynasty plans. But since you explained how her standing isn't that high and how insecure she may be about it, her frustration on the whole situation is so much more understandable. If she was of old wealth she would just be a boring snob, but if she is new wealth, her criticizing established families who have a name but no money and bad manners is much more relatable for me personally. I'm the first one to go to university in my family (parents didn't even go to high school) and I was a total snob towards kids from "academic households" who were just slackers and didn't live up to my image of how a good university student has to behave. Now if one of the slackers would have gotten a scholarship that I was aiming for... (Thankfully that didn't happen! XD) Maybe it's a weird comparison but it works for me to understand Caroline better!

[@melaniebonello2182]

I did watch Dr. Octavia Cox’s video about the class of the Bingleys. It was great. Love all your videos. These in-depth ones on one character are wonderful.

[@katiejlumsden]

Dr Octavia Cox is great!

[@arwakhan7824]

I am going to reread p&p for Mary next time and I think she would be a great subject of another vid as well.

[@limerence8365]

The thing about Mr Darcy is that he is a snob. While he is very objective in many of his critisisms where the Bingley sisters is more to make themselves feel better about their own insecurities, they are still unfair crititisms. Elizabeth may have been wrong in many aspects of Mr Darcy but that doesn't change the fact there are lines like "he looked at her only to critisise" and of course that entire proposal fiasco.

[@KierTheScrivener]

Lydia, Isabella Thorpe, Frank Churchill

[@katiejlumsden]

Ooo Frank Churchill needs to go on my list.

[@janicemacdougall1844]

Another great video :) I enjoy watching Dr. Octavia Cox's videos, so interesting. In those scenes where Caroline Bingley is teasing Darcy about Elizabeth, I always feel so badly for Caroline and just want her to stop even though she is a snob.

[@katiejlumsden]

I know, sometimes I do really feel bad for Caroline!

[@nickmunguia7304]

it's giving knives from scott pilgrim but . . . bratty. I kinda love it.

[@laurajames2075]

Wonderful video and love Dr Cox, so glad you quoted her! I've been meditating on a loose comparison between Caroline and Fanny Thornton from North and South, while their temperament is rather different, there is similarity to how she treats Margaret Hale, as well as their class differences.

[@katiejlumsden]

Dr Cox is just amazing :) Fun to compare Fanny Thronton with Caroline!

[@beckybleaden]

Loved this - I thought the depictions of Caroline Bingley in both of the retellings - The Other Bennet Sister and What Kitty Did Next was fascinating as it showed her reputation to Austen fans as well as showing that ultimately she was just jealous of Lizzie and acting from a place of insecurity (not an excuse though!)

[@katiejlumsden]

Yes I've really enjoyed her interpretation in retellings.

[@Mouseling216]

video on Wickham please and Willoughby who is even better (it would be good to compare the two since they get lumped together as basically the same person when they are very much not)

[@katiejlumsden]

Willoughby is definitely on my list.

[@Douglas-gx4mr]

lovely review!

[@BookZealots]

Putting Caroline as younger than Elizabeth definitely makes her behaviour more understandable at how catty she was. I just found Dr. Cox's channel this weekend! I'm so glad you mentioned her. Now that I've read four of Austen's six books, I understand why they are re-read. They each have depth and must be read more than once. Great video!

[@katiejlumsden]

Dr Cox is wonderful!

[@KierTheScrivener]

This is amazing. I always thought of Bingley as around Darcy's age and Caroline at least twenty.and it definitely changes how I look at her.

[@tillysshelf]

It also changes how we can see Bingley and how easily he is persuaded by Darcy. The age and social status gap between them would make an equal friendship hard enough without Bingley's soft character. I do wonder how they came to be friends.

[@KierTheScrivener]

@@tillysshelf me too! I need that backstory. And yes it makes Bingley being easily led by Darcy so much more understandable

[@mrsrunningmommy]

Fabulous video, Thank you! The attached link for Dr. Octavia’s video is greatly appreciated. Happy reading😊

[@marykoenig1158]

Thanks Katie! Very interseting.

[@heathersealey592]

I've never considered Caroline Bingley as being that young - definitely been influenced by the movie interpretations! That does, and also does not, change my feelings on her actions, though some of them makes more sense in that light. Very thought provoking video!

[@kahkah1986]

Yes, they usually read to me as someone getting more desperate as they get older, but if you read them as immature, it does change how you view them, especially if you think of her, like Darcy, 'being left to think meanly of those outside' his social circle as his parents have died prematurely; they are both using it as a coping mechanism to avoid getting taken advantage of and avoiding financial disaster maybe, but Darcy is old enough now to move on, whereas Caroline doesn't yet grasp the limits of snobbery as a kind of protection. Interesting! Also interesting how it changes the dynamics of her 'friendship' with Jane if she is considerably younger than her, imo.

[@launchedathousand]

I was going to recommend Dr. Cox's video then you mentioned it, such a good breakdown. Caroline is such an interesting character, surprised you didn't really go into why she pretended to be friends with Jane though. I think Darcy might have been her first real crush which would help explain her fixation with him. Mrs. Elton or any of the Elliots except Anne would be interesting for the next video I think!

[@kahkah1986]

I know, I think you could make a similar video about Mary Elliot personally. I always feel a bit sorry for her.

[@katiejlumsden]

Yes, Mary Elliot is really quite interesting!

[@nyancat2221]

My head canon is that she’s the one who gave the ‘rumor’ of Darcy’s proposal to lizzy to lady catherine and if she really is simply a spoiled brat of a teenager then it pile make even more sense for her to be the one to do so over maybe a random servant

[@maryh4650]

Love Dr. Octavia Cox

[@bebly9797]

For me caroline is more than a teenager; my evidence is Mr Darcy treatment of his sister. He talks of Georgiana growing in height; her studying and being guarded constantly by a governess. So I don't think he would be comfortable talking confidentially and being teasing by a teenager who is just one or two years older than his sister, for whom he is like a father. And keep in mind that he has no problem to point out to his friend mr Bingley what is proper or improper and that mr Bingley is used to follow his friend's example.

[@arwakhan7824]

Yes it is definitely unrequited love.

[@colazi]

I have always loved to hate Caroline Bingley but you have given us a totally new perspective on her character . My next re-read will be much more nuanced. As ever, thank you.

[@katiejlumsden]

Thanks!

[@LusiaEyre]

I never really considered Caroline's age until recently and it's fascinating. And her portrayal in 1995 made her seem older and stately. Personally I think she is younger than Charles and Elizabeth but not by that much. She was afterall to keep his house and be the lady of the house so I wouldn't picture her too young, otherwise I think she would be just still living with Louisa. She cannot be too old as there is no mention of her fearing old maindenhood and I doubt she would've waited for Darcy too long if she was close to being shelved. She might be 20 like Lizzy or 19 at the youngest. 'Insolent girl' has a different feel to it than 'good girl'. For someone older 'girl' can be term of endearment but doesn't work as an insult. And at that age she could still be both friends and dotting over Georgiana as to prove her maturity. I believe Louisa to be the eldest of the 3 mostly because she's already married and to someone that Caroline wouldn't have picked for herself so maybe she got married when her father was still alive and before Darcy really started hanging out with them? But there is no mention of children or lack of them so she cannot be too much into her 20s or married for too long.

[@katiejlumsden]

She's so interesting! I think you're right that she's most likely around 19 or 20.

[@jenadams2576]

Love these videos. I'd love to see a video on Henry Crawford from Mansfield Park. Or any character from Persuasion.

[@katiejlumsden]

I'm sure I'll do one on Henry Crawford sometime!

[@ThornfieldBooks]

This was so interesting! I just reread Pride and Prejudice for Jane Austen July and this gave me so much more to think about.

[@shylockwesker5530]

Talk about Persuasion this year, please.

[@meghanthestorygirl4581]

Oh my goodness, this was such a good video! Whenever they make another P&P adaptation I want to see this spoiled, lovesick, lower class, teenaged Miss Bingley portrayed.

[@katiejlumsden]

Right?! Me too!

[@gbuireh6497]

I would like a video about sir Lucas. How did he became a sir? And what does that mean for his social class? Is he gentry? Is he equal in standing to the Bennets? Are his daughters marriage prospects better because of his title, or does it not matter because they are not rich? What is more important in austens world anyway, wealth or titles? See, lots of questions...😅

[@katiejlumsden]

So Sir William Lucas is a knight - I believe he's made his money in trade, then been Mayor of the town, then been given a knighthood, and also acquired land. So he is not gentry but is a knight. He's not aristocracy, but is a lower titled person, so . . . It's hard to tell whether title or wealth - or birth, which isn't the same - are more important. Sir William Lucas is titled but only recently titled, he's a self-made man, so his title is very different to Lady Catherine's.

[@feschannette4227]

Wow! Would like a disection of Jane eyre

[@alicefitzpatrick5955]

Hey Kate, so weird finding you on KZbin! Enjoyed your video x

[@katiejlumsden]

Alice Fitzpatrick from uni?! Hello, and yes, how weird! Hope you're well.

[@outsideofenough6466]

There’s no excuse for her selfish and manipulating behavior no matter how old or insecure she is. And she’s very insecure! I always thought the Bingleys were only accepted into society because of their connection to Darcy. It’s not like there’s something super special about them that would get them included. If he hadn’t opened the door for them, I don’t think they’d been accepted. Caroline owes any position she has to Darcy, and I think that’s more of a reason to accept Elizabeth at the end of the novel than to just be invited to Pemberley. She’s lucky she didn’t push him too far where he would cut her. Thanks for doing this on Caroline. She’s high on my list of characters I just love to hate!

[@jonathanparks207]

Where exactly do you get that Caroline is younger than BIngley? I can never find any such thing in the book.

[@heatheralice89]

"Judges them and then hates them!"😂

[@donnalayton6876]

I don't know but in my mind i always thought Charles Bingley was the 3rd child. Mrs. Hurst is oldest, Caroline Bingley is the middle child and Charles is the youngest .

[@alicialozano2802]

Isabella Thorne please

[@thaliashearn9801]

Really interesting, great video!

[@katiejlumsden]

Thanks!

[@aliciamunoz8419]

I would like a video about Mrs Elton.

[@MargaretPinard]

Ooh--IS there another pastiche with Caroline as heroine??? That anyone knows of?

[@katiejlumsden]

I would totally read it, but never heard of one yet!

[@vonniecao3991]

I didn't look far into your channel and I haven't been here for very long but can you talk about Lydia Bennet or Kitty (Catherine) Bennet or maybe Georgiana Darcy please? Thank you!

[@pelicanformation3802]

Walking around the room was awkward. And her motivation was clear as crystal. Naive and foolish. I agree I think she is younger, insecure and in love.

[@ElliesCozyChronicles]

This video is so interesting! I now want to reread Pride & Prejudice inmediately!😅

[@katiejlumsden]

It's one of my favourite things to reread :)

[@melodysafo5437]

I still think it would’ve been better had she apologized for her disgusting behavior and start being nice to Jane and Lizzie

[@monica_has116lentilsand2cats]

hi katie! that was such an interesting video, thank you! though i‘ve read p&p a number of times, i never thought about the fact that caroline might be or even most likely is younger (definitely not older) than lizzie. neither did i realize that she‘s of the same or possibly lower class. considering these two crucial points she becomes far less b**chy and objectionable and her desire to become mrs. darcy gains another level of meaning and importance. something to ponder… clearly, a reread of p&p is called for. 📚🤓 happy reading from tiny town austria - monica (#116lentils on IG)

[@katiejlumsden]

Caroline Bingley is so interesting :)

[@sneakymia1]

I find grey characters like Caroline, charlotte Lucas and collins and lady Catherine and wickham fascinating, I cant stand the main couple Elizabeth and Darcy, they are both snobs and Elizabeth is cruel to her mother, and cruel to her younger sisters who get no attention or guidance from their parents, mr Bennett is jerk, seen as fun dad and plays favoritism, and the reason why they financially ruined, he make fun of his daughters and teases his wife constantly and retreats to his study and leaves the heavy lifting to his wife to get all five daughter married to financially securemen

[@BJPDesigns]

I always thought Caroline Bingley had her eyes set on Mr Darcy herself and wanted to prove to Mr Darcy she was superior to Elizabeth Bennett and all the Bennett family.

[@НалеждаКувико]

Что же вы так тараторите , даже переводчик за вами не успевает . Очень тяжело вас слушать .