Let's Watch - A Troll in Central Park

[@cheezemonkeyeater]

The great thing about Don Bluth is he owns his mistakes on this movie. He doesn't try to shift blame, even though he could try to blame it on how the studio decided to only release it in like 100 theaters around the whole country, which absolutely played into it being such a bomb. He acknowledges every mistake he made in production, says why he thought it was a good idea and then how he sees that it really wasn't. He talks about this film as a very important lesson in his career. He is not ashamed of it, because the experience was very important for what it taught him.

[@StarWolf2199]

Ngl, when I used to watch it as a kid, I wasn’t bothered by it. But as an adult, yeahhhh, now I understand

[@CaffeineDeprivation]

Same

[@glasscardproductions4736]

It's like eating a kilogram of candy floss at both ages. You don't feel the effects too badly until after you're done when you're young, but when you're an adult, it's a pyrrhic victory to even finish half the lot.

[@KatePapaDrama]

Ditto😂

[@wolfworks7339]

Me too, but I also watched fucking carebears. So I don't always put a lot of stock into what child me liked. XD

[@StarWolf2199]

@@wolfworks7339 I get it man. As kids we all found interest in something that we no longer find interesting as adults

[@fatcat1414]

The ending of this movie terrified me as a kid. The happy song over a seemingly abandoned NYC being overtaken by plant life was so disturbing.

[@yourcollegedebt8384]

Replace the song with Komm Susser Tod, and Stanley basically caused the Third Impact from Neon Genesis Evangelion

[@jongab2761]

Same. It just felt more of a dystopian dreamworld to me when I was a kid

[@MrSleepy677]

@@yourcollegedebt8384 Sadly, the Queen Breast from Drakengrad might make it worse.

[@TwilightLink77]

It could be like the Last of Us too.

[@iamnotthatguy7166]

looks like something biollante would have done in the godzilla universe

[@ivest4672]

When the brother got to under the bridge, and the troll is panicking all I can imagine is “my name is Chris Hanson. Please, sit down.”

[@KimberRose16]

Same 😭

[@TwilightLink77]

Actually it’s “Take a seat. Please take a seat right over there.”

[@TheDerpyBoi]

“But I don’t want to do the show” “But you ARE doing the show”

[@KingOfGaymes]

“I just came to get something to eat!”

[@dylanparrott8347]

"fluffershy is tougher than this" that comment in the chat got me crying 🤣

[@Wolfbane8]

Timestamp?

[@dylanparrott8347]

@@Wolfbane8 I think it like 5 minutes in

[@skyshunts]

Lol I didn't even notice that comment

[@bitterbites3859]

I got another one.😂 The Cowardly Lion just called, he said grow a pair.

[@poweroffriendship2.0]

Considering that Fluttershy snapped the bear on a neck at one time, that isn't all that surprising.

[@anib8863]

I still have a massive soft spot for Thumbalina because of my weird fascination with tiny characters using/interacting with our everyday objects. Using a shoe as a bed, a feather as a broom, or a sword as a bridge, for some reason I love these types of things. I just think it's neat.

[@ggrarl]

I agree...and besides, Thumbelina is far more tolerable than this movie. The songs are much better.

[@1faithchick7]

You should watch The Secret World of Arriety. :)

[@sagelsnow6956]

Agreed. Thumbalina is one of the famous Don Bluth films that I grew up with and have a soft spot for since it was my favorite out of the ones I have seen.

[@josephschultz3301]

I mean, Thumbalina isn't great, but it _definitely_ isn't anywhere near as bad as this. At the end of the day, Thumbalina is still what I'd call a real movie. A Troll in Central Park is kind of like the Teletubbies; meaningless flashes of color and sound.

[@malachitep4276]

Yeah, it's always fun to see how miniature characters would interact in a human sized world, can lead to some very fun imagery! Many Don Bluth films I watched plenty as a kid, including some more infamous ones. Going back as an adult, I still have a soft spot for weaker works like Thumbelina, Rock-a-doodle, and Pebble and the Penguin. This one? God no lol

[@vilmublues752]

I like how the queen makes being an asshole her entire personality and is proud of it.

[@goobertron9099]

she’s a girlboss

[@pepperbytez8128]

You like her because she's an assholw, I like her because she wants to kill Stanley, we are not the same.

[@erikbihari3625]

@@goobertron9099. Yup!

[@Shiruvi]

her voice actress understood her perfectly.

[@mysticmind4563]

Well if you're going to be a leader of trolls, might as well wear it with pride.

[@ShadowNinetales]

Ways they could have so damn easily made the kissing scene less creepy: 1. Make Stanley a child character too with a child's voice, so he doesn't seem like some weird drunk uncle spending awkward alone-time with strangers' kids under a bridge. 2. Make her kiss him on the cheek, not the goddamn mouth. Some adults do in fact peck their kids on the lips, but it seems excessive to me, especially in this context. 3. Make him be all childishly happy like "Oh, you want to be my friend? Nobody's ever been my friend before!", rather than reacting with a cartoon steamy train noise of arousal and ejecting ecstatically into the air like some kind of uncomfortable euphemism. Maybe we just have dirty minds to interpret it so badly, but then again everyone reacting in this video clearly thought it was a demented scene too lol.

[@macbookvideostorage7602]

The creator of that scene outed himself... very creepy

[@fatcat1414]

Most generously this is a case of cheesy animated tropes being thrown together without much thought, like the rest of this movie. "Girl characters kiss guys as a token of appreciation, right? And then the guy gets excited, right? Cool, next scene."

[@ShadowNinetales]

@@fatcat1414 Haha yep, that's the best-case scenario. That whoever was behind that part was just plain derping too much to notice how creepy it would end up looking.

[@Scarshadow666]

@@fatcat1414 My thoughts as well (and also what I'm hoping), considering that Don Bluth has talked about how his movies had been heavily taken over by executives in the past. Best case scenario, it's just another executive out of touch on how to write characters interactions. Worst case scenario...yeah... 0_0

[@dr.altoclef9255]

He could still eject into the air, but have him like...jumping for joy and then just BOING into the air at mach speed so it's cartoony and innocent. It might help make the movie work better if he's a kid. Maybe have him be related to Gnorgha (Gnorga? Gnorg'a?) and she's disappointed in him because unlike other trolls his age he's a giggly, flower-loving pacifist whose magical powers are all related to peace and flowers. She doesn't want to kill him because he IS family, but doesn't want him around mucking up the family name either, so she has him banished (maybe with the hope that spending all the time around rock and stone with humans and human trash might toughen him up).

[@britjay2615]

My mentor when I was studying animation in college told me that he worked on this film as an assistant animator (he mainly animated for Disney, but also was an in-betweener on Rock a Doodle). He told me it was one of the worst films he ever worked on... I brought it up because I always used to enjoy watching this and Rock a Doodle as a young kid... He said "That just proves to me that kids'll watch anything" lol

[@RedMoon814]

To be fair, as crazy and bad rock-a-doodle is, it still is *far* more entretaining than A Troll in Central Park. Like, at least it had something resembling a plot. I also had Rock-a-doodle as a kid, such a nostalgic fever dream

[@trustno173]

I really want to know more about the behind the scenes about this movie, but Bluth seems to be so ashamed of this one that he rarely talks about it, as least as far as I can tell. Like what happened? Was the script not done? Apparently it had been finished for two years by the time it was released but no one wanted to distribute it, Warner Brothers agreed to do it along with Thumbelina but even they had no faith in this movie so gave it a very limited release. Also, I got curious and looked up the assistant animators on this, was is Randy Sanchez, Tim George or Johan Klingler?

[@britjay2615]

@@trustno173 I wish I could tell you more about it but it was a very one and done conversation about his time with Bluth. He was much more interested in talking about the Disney films he worked on. It was Tim George by the way. Somewhat of a relative so I was able to reach out to him when I was studying. Nice guy, really good at what he does and gave me a lot of great feedback and assistance on my thesis short film.

[@selkiefluff]

Aw, I relate to Saber's school story. I was bullied too, so no matter what I brought to school kids would make fun of it, songs, movies, books, toys, foods. One time I brought my PSP and everyone called it dumb, a couple months later everyone watched one of the bullies play his own PSP and called it amazing all day long.

[@goobertron9099]

This happened to me with but with a 3ds at summer camp 😅

[@wikeni9096]

I feel you. I was very close to my 2nd oldest brother growing up, so did a lot of "boy stuff" that the other girls picked on me for (Marvel cards, video games, TMNT, Legos, etc.). I'm happy that these things are now more accepted, but man it's hard to get over the annoyance of getting brutally bullied as a little girl for the things that are popular now. Ah, well. I'm glad people are enjoying them, I guess.

[@Sabrinathewitch2]

@@wikeni9096 I know right this is very relatable to me 😢

[@iamnotthatguy7166]

I got bullied several times at one of the middle schools i attended and that’s where i learned to laugh things off and make jokes at my own expense, it doesn’t work for everyone and you shouldn’t always resort to it depending on the situation but i found it helps me still

[@astrowolvez]

I guess semi related, but this reminded me of one time when I was playing on my gameboy a boy came over to me and said it was illegal for me to play it and I had to play a gamegirl. 😂

[@geardog24]

The more I see Stanley use his plant powers to cover New York, the more I question if he's just as bad as the Troll Queen or not.

[@TheBonkleFox]

He's related to a certain Pamela Isley

[@Camphreneas]

This is literally just Smash Ultimate’s World of Light situation all over again. Neither troll in this movie is good, and just want to take over the world XD

[@FastTquick]

He probably let his powers get out of control without realizing it, but yeah, that ending really wasn’t well thought out. Just like the rest of this movie.

[@candycane1744]

That would be so fucking cool if both were extreme opposite dictators to each other

[@kuramayoko23]

@@candycane1744 maybe that's what they were going for. But that would be giving them too much credit.

[@xenshaxiii1339]

I’ve also noticed that these kids have such a hard time walking. Like they have leg weights, gravity is increased, and the entire ground is slicked with oil or something. They got no traction on any surface when they walk.

[@geoffreyrichards6079]

It a portion of it was rotoscoped, I would suspect that the environment they filmed the footage in was probably a bit difficult to navigate.

[@madcapmakov2]

That squirrel is definitely high, like most background animals I’ve seen in other Don Bluth movies.

[@g1gabytez]

I also think the squirrel's emo for some reason

[@madcapmakov2]

@@g1gabytez Nope, he’s stoned face throughout (no pun intended)

[@SonicGurl82]

Honestly the Squirrel is the most realistic character in film.

[@adampellett4917]

It should put to get high theme on that scene. 😂

[@madcapmakov2]

@@SonicGurl82 Yeah. I’d agree on that.

[@superzilla784]

Don Bluth's movies worked better when they were mature and dark with his usual cute character to balance things out. like Ducky and Spike in Land Before Time. he treated children more maturely, and I really appreciate that because it gives me something to come back to when I'm an adult. I loved how Secret of NIMH and Land Before Time both looked like they took place after the apocalypse. as if Chernobyl moved to The Black Lands of Mordor. I wish they had stayed to this style. it really set them apart from Disney.

[@kittyfrog0]

I always hated how little story/dialogue is actually in this movie. And the parents are so neglectful. Letting two kids under the age of 7 run around 90’s New York is ridiculous.

[@AnikMonette]

And not only that, it's another variation of dad and mom breaking a promise, teaching yet again that an adult word means nothing!😑

[@M50A1]

​@@AnikMonetteReal Nickelodeon tier message

[@OctoPie-k7n]

How bad was New York in the 90s? (I'm born in the mid-2000s and I'm from Oklahoma)

[@kittyfrog0]

Not great. All of the crime, none of the cell phones (to reach police or record crimes etc.)@@OctoPie-k7n

[@KingOfGaymes]

@@OctoPie-k7ndefinitely not safe for kids to be walking around alone.. which can be said for every city honestly

[@mercuropheliac]

Rosie just looks like the kid wandering around WalMart with a full load in her diaper and her mom doesn’t do anything about it. So basically, every toddler in WalMart.

[@iamnotthatguy7166]

thank god she’s a main character in this fucking movie 🤩

[@funnyhappystudios]

2:54 that *”No. NO!”* fits so well with this corny scene LMAO

[@FrankiKaye]

I remember the teacher playing this during nap time, and that was one of the few times I chose to nap instead of watch

[@DLAlucard]

Whenever I see this movie. I always think of the 1991 animated movie; The Princess and the Goblin. Where a princess and her friend must overcome a horrible threat burrowing its way beneath the castle. If you've never seen it Saber. I'd highly recommend giving it a watch sometime. I'm sure you'd like it more then this.

[@Scrofar]

I did remember liking The Princess and the Goblin quite a bit. Enjoyed it a lot more than this xD

[@hannahdawg6829]

It's definitely a better film, and actually has a coherent plot, plus the movie having a really cheesy ending makes sense since the goblins are actually weak to music, it's genius

[@Scarshadow666]

Definitely agree! Man, you just helped me remember watching The Princess and the Goblin as a kid, hadn't seen or heard of it since then (until now)! ^^

[@Itsjaidenmarie]

Omg when I was younger I thought this movie was a fever dream, I then thought it was Disney the black cauldron, after some digging I FINALLY found the princess and the goblin and it wasn’t a dream lol

[@okami-chan9772]

Omg I still have the VHS of that movie! I even still remember the commercials from the VHS. One of them is a berry cereal commercial and the other was connected to the movie promoting some device to help find people. Something like Life Alert.

[@Kolbatsu]

I have this weird love for Rock-a-Doodle because of how insane it is. Also "jeepers I'm a fuwwy!"

[@0Sutekinaryuu0]

I adore it!

[@kozie9935]

I loved rock-a-doodle as a kid and it holds a special place in my heart. I weirdly was way more into don bluth films then Disney back then.

[@RedSupernova64]

Same. I didn't grow up with but I watched it in the late 2000s since I remember seeing it in some video stores, a couple guys I followed at the time remember it, and of course the Nostalgia Critic episode. I ended up liking the movie and I consider it the strangest phase in my life where at the time, I wanted to increase the movie's popularity by using it in memes and the sorts. That didn't happen and while I know the movie is extremely flawed, I still can't hate it. I just can't. Also, Peepers the mouse is the best character and an underappreciated waifu. :3 I did have A Troll in Central Park as a kid though and I'm fine with people shitting on it, even though I kinda relate to Gus and Rosie in the movie because I was a little boy looking after my baby sister at the time.

[@madcapmakov2]

Rock A Doodle is just garbage.

[@LittleAlternativeGirl]

Besides Fievel Goes West, Rock-A-Doddle is my second favorite Don Bluth movie ever (Thumbelina and Anastasia coming in behind them). I watched Rock-A-Doddle so much as a toddler that my parents STILL quote "I don't wanna LOSE mah money~" to this day and I'm going to be 34 this year 😂

[@jacobp7037]

Oh the queen absolutely pegs that guy

[@K1ttyGam3r]

You’re right but why would you say that

[@bakedbaker9882]

@@K1ttyGam3r Cause no one else did

[@MushieBLUSH]

“Im gonna fuck shit up and dont worry i got a flower with me *spawns in*” absolutely killed me

[@stevethepocket]

OK, shoutout to the person in chat who dropped the sickest burn I've ever seen: "It's like the Elsagate videos but with a budget" And the runner-up, who said this is what happens when whimsy is designed by committee.

[@robxholicfoxyfan8552]

Bro imagine being a sick, poor, or normal child before an accident who's last movie ever was Troll in Central Park. The fact that this could have occurred is honestly such a sour thought.

[@geoffreyrichards6079]

Bad film or not, so long as the child still got some enjoyment out of watching it, it’s not so bad of a thought. There are worse films for a dying child to see.

[@robxholicfoxyfan8552]

@@geoffreyrichards6079 That's fair. I suppose it would be worse for someone older anyways. Usually by that time in one's life though, a bad movie is ironic enjoyment anyways. Plus it isn't really a harmful movie even if not the best in any respect, so a movie about life is probably a bit more uplifting than a darker movie in a darker time.

[@williamparker7025]

Theres much worse...always remember someone on their death bed watched rise of skywalker

[@spinosaurusstriker]

​@@williamparker7025 or the last jedi

[@skyshunts]

It's better than a dying kid watching the live action remakes Disney is making.

[@bryprouty7004]

I think Don Bluth himself said something about parents complaining that his older films were too dark for children, thus inspiring this production. That information I acquired somewhere on the internet, in perhaps more places than one, is blurry in my memory, even though I think I heard it from a KZbinr years ago. The KZbinr did quote Bluth in that vid, but again, I remember nothing exactly. If I remember correctly, he made this film out of spite, which makes this film a literal troll. Don't quote me on this. However, it makes sense regarding the situation, and everything about the film points to this conclusion quite powerfully. In other words, you would say (with all things considered) with 85% certainty that this is a spite movie.

[@BartyTheParty]

That's sad because I enjoyed The Secret Of Nihm SO much more. Like, by orders of magnitude.

[@jossuecabrera8611]

And even then, dont quote me on this, but I think Don Bluth was embarrassed of the final project of the film, so all of this kinda backfired on him

[@brytilaar]

I could say that Ralph Bakshi is way more adult than Bluth's Works.

[@geoffreyrichards6079]

@@brytilaarWhat gave you that impression? The R ratings?

[@brytilaar]

Yeah

[@Newgirl999]

My mom used to put this on for me all the time she knew I used to like it as a kid and she'd play it till I was 12. I miss her and this movie 😭

[@kaywhoanimates9051]

Aw I’m sorry about your mom

[@Mr.StickxBear1987]

All dogs go to Heaven will always be special to me no matter what. Especially after learning something dark that happened behind the scenes...

[@BriannaBow]

What happened behind the scenes?

[@Mr.StickxBear1987]

@@BriannaBow Don't take this as 100% cuz I saw it a while ago but I think the voice actress for the little girl was murdered? By her own father? And it was like one of her last gigs or something? Think she voiced in LBT too. Idk it's been a minute I'd go search it for yourself.

[@BriannaBow]

@@Mr.StickxBear1987 OH! I think I remember hearing about that, but it's been a while. Some people shouldn't be parents.

[@Mr.StickxBear1987]

@@BriannaBow Agreed, imagine being jealous of your own child like smh

[@Ice-gc4ud]

​@@Mr.StickxBear1987 She was indeed the original voice of Ducky. Her mother was also murdered and I believe it was a murder/suicide situation if I remember from the news article I read a few years ago.

[@Lucky_9705]

My grandmother had this garbage pail of a movie on VHS, and it’s probably still rotting in her basement

[@FastTquick]

Ouch, that must have been an unlucky find.

[@WasatchWind]

I watched it at my grandma's house as well - and even at like five years old, I had a precocious spark, thinking "what on earth is this crap? Aren't movies supposed to be fun to watch?"

[@madcapmakov2]

My family lost mine in a move, a fate well deserved…

[@ArbitruaryLemon35]

@@WasatchWind Same. My grandpa & step-grandma had a bunch of odd movies for us grandkids when we went over to their place and this was the best out of the bunch. I can't even remember what the others were. I think some of them were obscured christian movies for kids.

[@kuramayoko23]

@@ArbitruaryLemon35 try looking for them and request Saber watch them. We need him to suffer more for our entertainment.

[@katsucandy]

growing up is realizing that stanley absolutely had a body count by the end of the movie. RIP every background character with a pollen allergy and the countless victims of the mix of suddenly slippery roads and vehicles, hazards hidden under a layer of plantlife, and whatever other horrible accidents would involve a whole city being suddenly overtaken by magical, potentially invasive and/or hostile, weeds. the humidity in that city is gonna skyrocket along with the mosquito popular, dear god

[@xenshaxiii1339]

I remember this film as a kid, and I can barely remember it at all. Man, it’s a torturous watch rn, and I’m only 1/3 in watching with you guys. However, you two make it so much better to get thru.

[@undeadgentalmen]

28:27 I adore this movie as a kid. But when rewatching it with an older mindset, my internal dialog was screaming Amber Alert! LOL This movie has not age well.

[@ShellySwirl]

I don’t get it

[@kuramayoko23]

@@ShellySwirl the Troll is talking to the little girl and saying, "I'm not like other trolls. I'm good." If we were to change the situation a little bit, let's say the child in question got into an argument with their parents and left the house or ran away from them. If an adult with ulterior motives found a child and said child says something like "adults are stupid. They're all bad," and the adult goes, "I'm not like your parents. I'm a good adult," that kid may never be seen again. Especially since "stranger danger" was a huge thing back then, they did not think that scene through. What happens if the kid equates such an interaction with a strange adult like between the little girl and the troll? Just blindly trust them because the movie showed that and it was all fine.

[@ShellySwirl]

@@kuramayoko23 OHHHHH ok

[@jenntokki]

the queen very much looks like the boss alien from the first Space Jam-

[@spammonster]

Okay, I've come up with a plot they could have used for this: Labyrinth-ripoff where the little sis gets kidnapped by the Trolls and the brother has to go rescue her by wandering through an alternate/fantasy version of Central Park. Stanley is a chaotic neutral who takes the girl to his world because he's lonely and wants someone to play with but then loses her to the Troll queen, the boy has to team up with Stanley to traverse the world but Stanley's own careless attitude towards everything makes the boy realize he needs to be less self-centered and more responsible and actual character development happens, in the end they save the sis and get out and the kids wake up under a bridge to find their parents, who were looking for them the whole time and we get a nice maybe it was all just a dream or was it ending where the bridge is now covered in flowers.

[@geoffreyrichards6079]

It may be a bit derived, but yeah, that would’ve greatly elevated the film.

[@Tareltonlives]

That would have been better than Labyrinth

[@madcapmakov2]

They’re Goblins

[@BrandEver117]

Sir, a flying speedboat has just hit The Pentagon

[@ramirezthesilvite]

Don Bluth had some brilliant films when he was given full control. The quality of his movies fluctuated wildly depending on how much studio interference there was. If the studio demanded something and wouldn't let Bluth be creative, we end up with Thumbelina, Troll in Central Park and Rock-a-Doodle. When left to his own devices, we get A Land Before Time, An American Tale and The Secret of Nimh.

[@matthewmoran5297]

Which is weird, because _Anastasia_ was probably the *most* studio-controlled film in Bluth's career, yet the movie turned out to be...decent.

[@ramirezthesilvite]

@Matthew Moran yeah. But even a broken clock is right twice a day, as the saying goes. Different people in charge of the films could cause the quality to vary wildly as well. Who knows

[@matthewmoran5297]

@@ramirezthesilvite Truth. *Whole* lotta truth in what you said

[@Account_Not_Applicable]

Except A Troll In Central Park's badness was not due to studio restrictions. It was the last movie Don Bluth had near-full creative control before The Pebble and the Penguin, which was so tightly controlled (likely because of Troll's failure at the box office), Don asked to not be credited as director, since he didn't see it as his work. He still considered Troll _his_ work and had his name on it. Don, like the best artists, need a balance of creative freedom, but also necessary restrictions. You restrict a vision too much, you can't have what you want properly fleshed out. You give too much freedom over a vision, you have no focus on what is important and necessary. It's why his earliest movies and Anastasia were so good; he had people willing to work with him, but also willing to put their hands in the pot when needed.

[@trustno173]

I don't know about that, Bluth parted way with Spielberg because he didn't like Spielberg interfering and changing things on Land Before Time and American Tale. Makes you wonder if he regrets that.

[@zbcrazy]

I’m glad I put my soda down right before the twin towers because I had the exact reaction Saber did 😂 BIG YIKE

[@WasatchWind]

It's crazy that lilo and stitch directly ran into... Uh, concerns around this as well.

[@BLANKbelikeMemes]

At first when I read the comment I had no idea what you meant, but then I immediately looked up after reading just to see a ball flying towards the tower and I literally said woah exactly when saber yelled. The timing is just too perfect 😅. ( I'm laughing at the timing, not the other reason. I'm not that insane)

[@iamnotthatguy7166]

a movie set in NY pre 9/11 has the twin towers no waay

[@zbcrazy]

@@iamnotthatguy7166 I’m aware it was pre-9/11, I was a kid when this movie came out. But that scene obviously feels weird now that it’s post-9/11, particularly since I haven’t seen it in 25+ years so I forgot it was even in the movie.

[@AnikMonette]

The scene alone was funny but Saber's laugh was also super contagious that I cracked up, too!😂

[@dustytailstudios]

The reason it feels wrong is simple: it doesn't hold up to Don bluths standard for storytelling. His entire motto was "A child can handle anything as long as there's a happy ending" Most of his stories deal with with extreme themes like death,immigration,crime.even lighter toned movies had a slight bite to it. Because they're structured like old fashioned FAIRY TALES. Not DISNEY fairy tales, we're talking "Ariel turning to seafood after being told to kill her love" or "Snow whites step mother dancing in burning iron shoes" and "Cinderellas step sister getting their eyes pecked out". They're well known fairytales cause quite literally CENTURIES of children where told these stories. Don bluths animations followed the same structures of showing dark consequences and concepts to kids,but give the ending happy endings. Fivel suffered for weeks learning about the reality of life as an immigrant before he found his family. Littlefoot went on a harrowing journey that had themes of loss and death looking for paradise. Even the lesser movies like Pebble in the penguin had a fairy tale like story, of huey wanting to bring a magic stone to the woman he loved, but literally everything goes wrong! Almost all his movies,in one way or another,follow a fairytale structure and feeling. It's why they feel TIMELESS. Because fairytales themselves are timeless Troll in Central Park quite literally is a spit to Don bluths belief. Instead of giving up a feel of a gripping fairytale, it's more like a little baby's bedtime story. There is no big themes that grip imagination and allows kids to question their world. This is something you tell them to BORE THEM TO SLEEP!

[@Skye_Blue]

I loved Don Bluth movies as a kid, even if I thought they were bad. I always adored the animation style in them. But for whatever reason, I don't remember ever watching this one. If I ever did, I now see why I forgot it.

[@dreamguardian8320]

I have always enjoyed Don Bluth's 2D animation too. I even wish he was still in business, so we could still have his movies and video games around today, instead of nothing but 3D and live action. Not to mention, we could see all the movies that were cancelled, like Don Bluth's version of Beauty and the Beast. A Troll in Central Park and some of the other movies may not have worked, but I still enjoy Don Bluth's animation.

[@JackTheVulture]

don bluth films are sometimes so good at being so deeply unpleasant to look at, even the things that are trying to be cute. I feel like ive seen that little girls design about 100 times but theres something so uncanny and off about it. this feels like a parody of a childrens movie that youd see within another show or movie.

[@torytellstales]

It's like spotting Peter Lorre in a cartoon.....You're either caught off guard, feel awkward about seeing him, or am glad to see him depending on who you are lol

[@SiRenfield]

Doubt anyone cares but the voice of the King and Killer is an old character actor named Charles Nelson Reilly, probably best known for Hollywood Squares. And fun fact: he has a Weird Al song dedicated to him, and it’s quite badass

[@Soufriere84]

I got to watch Weird Al perform the Charles Nelson Reilly song live -- I already knew who the guy was through Match Game -- so it just made the song even funnier for me

[@SiRenfield]

@@Soufriere84 NGL I want to learn that song in guitar LOL

[@annabunovsky5628]

Saber, I actually have a similar story to your “We’re Back” trauma. In first grade, we once watched Aladdin in music class & were told to pay attention to the background music & see what instruments we recognize dl the sound of. That seemed to go over well, so neurodivergent lil 6-year-old me told the teacher we should do this again with Fantasia, because that movie’s all about the music. My teacher (god bless him) thought this was a great idea, and so next class we watched Fantasia. Those uncultured little shits known as my classmates wouldn’t shut up for five seconds. Just try to picture both a weird little girl & a grown man with a music degree equally disappointed that they’d been foolish enough to cast pearls before swine.

[@geoffreyrichards6079]

I’ve had the same experience with other kids when I was younger. I felt pretty discouraged by whole ordeal. It’s kinda the reason why I developed a bit of a distaste for more obnoxious films like “Space Jam” and (to some lesser degree) “Hercules”, since they feel like the sort of films specifically targeted at that demographic.

[@TheGuardDuck]

Makes you relate just a little with Sheldon Cooper.

[@annabunovsky5628]

Oh geez 😂 In all seriousness, I’m not actually bitter about it. I mean, I was when I was six, but now I kinda look back on it with humor.

[@leoultimaupgraded9914]

To be fair, most kids are dumb and dont care how good a movie is artistically or how good the writing is as long as theres something exciting happening on screen. I can speak from experience as I was definitely one of those kids growing up lol. It sucks but I cant blame them

[@ARCtheCartoonMaster]

@@leoultimaupgraded9914 Yeah, I remember watching _Fantasia 2000_ as a kid and found it really fascinating, and years later I was annoyed that my older sister called it "the one we didn't get".

[@runningtoastgirl7766]

I hate how he sees that his toddler sister falls into the sewers but he is so insistent on bringing his toy boat with him into the sewers. Focus on the objective, leave the plot convenience boat outside while you are making sure she isn't freaking face down in the sewer! I hate that child so much XD

[@randylaytonorangeboy]

Saber and Rishi's jokes are brutal and I love it.

[@DraconasTenZHG]

26:14 - This looks like that one scene in Harry Potter 2 where Lockhart messes up spells and instead of healing Harry's broken arm HE FUCKING DELETES HIS BOOOONES (and according to miss Pomfrey regrowing bones is very painful) Also Rishi, your voice and laugh are hella cute * u *

[@Vulpes_Ailurus]

Saber and Rishi are so adorable together.

[@zainmudassir2964]

You ship them?

[@swap6984]

@@zainmudassir2964 They probably meant just their dynamic as friends

[@StraightestDakregor]

Alright alright, remember guys, no shipping real people, it's uncomfortable as fuck and it can easily destroy their relationship

[@screamingbean7509]

@@StraightestDakregorI agree, please don’t ship irl people, fictional characters it’s fine since they’re not real. But shipping real people has ruined creators friendships with others before

[@bobbysauce64]

We don’t want another situation like Jaiden and TheOdd1sOut

[@TheLadyLiddell]

I kinda wish Saber would put subtitles on the movie so we can follow along with both the plot and the commentary.

[@rbc8639]

Yeah because the audio is usually very quiet and unintelligible while the commentary is good volume but greatly overshadows the movie

[@DiaryofaRecoveringAddict]

This cartoon just reminds me of when I used to watch it at my grandma’s house when I was little. I loved it back then, so it does give me a sense of nostalgia. Going to my grandma’s house is one of my fondest memories. We also watched Mickey and the Beanstalk a lot. :)

[@swissyode]

I found the ending to be kinda nice. hopeful even if its cheesy and naive. there's a consistent message about dreaming of a better future in the movie at least.

[@mishamorozov5325]

The faces this whole fucking movie I'm dying

[@hannahdawg6829]

The only good thing I can say about this movie is that the lady playing Gnorga is having the time of her life and hamming it up to the nth degree XD

[@geoffreyrichards6079]

That would be the late and great Cloris Leachman, best known for playing Frau Blücher in “Young Frankenstein”. Though my favorite role she played was Dola in the Disney dub of “Castle in the Sky”.

[@Wolfbane8]

This was the first Saberspark stream I caught live and even though I got in the second half, the commentary you two provided had me dying and got me craving for more. Really glad you finally uploaded this stream

[@mckenzie.latham91]

There's parts of this I like, for example the whole green thumb vs stone thumb between Gnorga and Stanley, I like the using Gus to turn Stanley to stone. But yeah it's too...much in many places.

[@kozie9935]

Fair

[@MasterSorez]

Rishi's expressions on her character are just adorablee

[@Elena-ce8ek]

I agree 🤗🥹

[@davidhileman8567]

When Phillip Glasser voices Fievel, I'll say one thing to describe it. It is *ABSOLUTELY ADORABLE!* As adorable as Bluth's films' animation is gorgeous. I might probably put this little guy as at least the cutest Don Bluth-created character (though maybe Steven Spielberg had a bigger hand, because Fievel is plenty based on, and named after Spielberg's maternal grandfather; Spielberg's family is primarily Jewish, with his paternal grandparents being Ukrainian-Jewish, like Fievel and his family, with his grandfather having escaped to Spielberg's birthplace in Cincinatti to escape being drafted into the Russian army), and among the most adorable characters in animation.

[@jameshuker56]

I gotta compare this to another's opinion about this movie "You know in a show (e.g. the Simpsons) and you see the kids watching TV and some over the top nonsense is playing that obviously nobody else is putting thought into, because its in the background and nobody needs to pay attention to it." This is that movie!!

[@SiRenfield]

Kind of reminds me of the Rainbow Monkeys movie from that one episode of KND

[@stevethepocket]

It's literally the cutesy dancing flowers from _101 Dalmatians_ but made into a whole movie without irony.

[@kalebdivney8393]

Stanley looks like if Dopey and LeFou had a love child. Lol.

[@joaquinm9148]

Just be glad this is one of the better animated movies with the word “Troll” in it

[@TheFloraBonBon]

theres a fine line of cute an creepy...the goody troll looks creepy when hes talking to the kids... Plus the little girl looks like another character, but i can't remember who

[@professormultipurpose5244]

Stella from Help I’m a Fish?

[@TheFloraBonBon]

​@@professormultipurpose5244I think so

[@JarahKnuckey]

...So... why are we treating the entire world being consumed by plants is a good thing? That's a Poison Ivy style ending.

[@TheloniasBrowntail]

If I had the software I would totally make a youtube poop of Troll in Central Park, but insert the voice clips of Dom Deluise's Fingers the Octopus from Toonstruck, badmouthing at the flowers and swearing at the kids.

[@TheGuardDuck]

You should get some software!

[@raffiefoxmew3691]

Nightmare fuel film, I remember my nan had this on VHS when I was a kid. The worst thing was the f***ing crying scene, that was so vomity even as a 5 year old I hated it. But as an adult, some of the interactions are HIGHLY SUS.

[@CamCat13]

I remember seeing ads for this and I wanted this. Im so glad my mom never bought this movie for me. She saved her money

[@MrXemnas1992]

The funniest thing is that Dom DeLuise wasn't even the original voice of Stanley...Buddy Hackett (Scuttle in The Little Mermaid) was cast first lol

[@Alexhikari]

I remember this movie from childhood, but more recently from a legit college class. "Queen of Mean" song has no point, and the movie legit ended after Stanley got his patch of grass. As the main character got what they wanted.

[@astrowolvez]

They could have easily had some business man who wanted to destroy central park and the evil troll teams up with him to destroy stanley and thus all the plants. At least that would be conflict and a plot.

[@mathiasJUSTsvendsen]

Stanly the Troll causing 9/11 is gonna be my new headcannon xD

[@raelogan]

Don Bluth can draw THREE men: Hair Loopy, Big Guy, and Chad Chin With Massive Teeth

[@ninavale.]

Now, between the 'it's all just fantasy' daydream land magic but apparent completely real and lasting destruction of Central Park(and overall lack of cohesive story telling) this honestly shouldn't be what I focus on, but since EVERYONE touched upon the core part then....I think the parents need a better household help. Cuz I asumme Maria's duties include watching over the kids when the parents are at work. But like A WHOLE DAY HAS PASSED(the kids left right after parents left for work, and returned when parents came back. and it's dark) and she didn't like once wonder why kids are not coming out to ask when lunch/dinner is? Nor did she check on them to call them for their meals....did she just go "these little kids that need regular meals are probably not hungry today. Oh well"?

[@moonmochi6131]

I thought I ahted this movie, becuase it was bland, but I still remember every single word for Gnorga's song. After that I decided to stop pretending to eb cool and just enjoy the pretty visuals (because theya re amazing), and let my kindergarden self be happy.

[@averageytviewer6893]

You're entitled to like what you like! ❤

[@moonmochi6131]

@@averageytviewer6893 I just remember the songs of this movie, I really liked the ending song, it matched with things like "Once upon a time in a Forest" or "Ferngully". I ended up studying nature related things because of that, I believe.

[@LizRabbit]

Around an hour in, the story about you bringing a movie to class and everyone pretty much ignoring it...I can relate. My daycare used to allow us to bring movies . I was(still am) really into Godzilla. I had Godzilla versus Mechagodzilla 1974. Brought it to daycare, think I was about six or seven, teacher put it in. No one liked it. Either they blatantly ignored it or openly mocked it. Teacher took it out and pooped in Barney Goes Camping. I never brought another movie.

[@RonnieQuinn99]

A Troll in Central Park is the type of movie that get puts on during nap time at daycare for the kids who don’t want to sleep

[@RodneytheOperaRat]

2:30 *That sound effect when that flower bloomed* *NOOO😂😂🤣*

[@appleloaf9270]

This movie freaked me out as a child. Made me never want to go to park on my own or leave house without my parents in fear of meeting this troll in real life. Something about his smile scared me and how he just never had any other real emotions (why I never liked Barney either), it felt uncanny to me. At the end of the movie when he covered the whole world in green I ran to the corner of the room shaking and crying.

[@LuC-k777]

Fair enough

[@kuramayoko23]

What really bothered me watching this again as an adult was when the troll was talking to Rosie and saying, "I'm not like other trolls. I'm good. etc." that sounds like the words of a groomer. I'm almost certain they put that in there on accident. Can you imagine if a kid identified with that with a stranger talking to them like that? While stranger abductions are rare, at the time with the whole "stranger danger" message being taught to kids, it makes even less sense.

[@ShellySwirl]

@@kuramayoko23 How tf is that like a groomer? That sounds NOTHING like a groomer wtf??..,, You are absolutely sick..

[@TheDjreapers]

I remember watching this as a child and now that im an adult, I can realize that its pacing and story just isnt there

[@KarmikCykle]

There was an alternate ending to the 1986 Little Shop of Horrors where Audrey II eats everyone and takes over the world. You can find it online and in the special features on at least one DVD. The evil monster puppet plant taking over on purpose is less disturbing than the ending of this movie.

[@ambam64]

Last time I watched this was at a friend's house back in the very early 2000's. Only got as far as when the boy turned back to normal, leaving me on a cliff hanger. Probably should've ended it there, too.

[@sagelsnow6956]

For more of these let's watch, I have a couple to recommend. They are either underrated or not known in the community. One is 'Help! I'm A Fish' which has Alan Rickman as the villain and is a cute movie for kids. Another is 'Romeo and Juliet: Sealed with a Kiss' and yes... it is actually about seals. And finally, a movie I recently found out about which is called 'The Princess and the Cobbler'. The animator for Who Framed Roger Rabbit originally started it and it finished in a 30-year production. They have 3 versions and I recommend the Fred Calvert version first and then the Miramax version. There's a Recobbled where they add everything that didn't make the cut but I did not care about that one. Please @SaberSpark! Could you do at least one of these films?!

[@astolforiderofblack8704]

I think I remember hearing Don Bluth refer to this film as a stillborn baby.

[@Foxtrot369]

I'm surprised that, as Americans, you guys weren't aware of Belvedere Castle in Central Park. This movie is... not good... but they didn't just magic a castle out of thin air that New Yorkers just, failed to notice.

[@AutisticBearLover]

I’m American and I had no clue. I guess unless you live there you don’t know.

[@Foxtrot369]

@@AutisticBearLover I'm Australian, never been to the US & I knew about it...

[@aeroblu2002]

What the hell is Bedivere castle? Is that a Chinese thing?

[@zachanikwano]

I was watching this at work and the moment 10:42 I was confused and when I paused and glanced I was trying not to laugh. Also chat being chat, 10/10

[@Taitou25]

10:56 Sir, a second Troll has hit the towers

[@gyrrakavian]

The tails the trolls have are straight from Danish folklore. Their trolls have pretty much that exact tail.

[@americaroleplayer]

Gnorga the Queen of Mean makes me furious because DAMN IT THAT MUSIC IS GOOD The lyrics are stupid, but the voice and the music itself is really fucking good!!! They were so close to having a GOOD song in this movie!! It's very reminiscent of 'My Father's Son' from Secret of NIMH 2, they had like 90% of a good song and decided to fuck it over at the last moment.

[@TwilightLink77]

It’s like villains gets the best songs.

[@astrowolvez]

You could have told me this was test footage from an art student who needed to quickly add a plot and I would absolutely believe you.

[@TakusenX]

RIP everyone with pollen allergies in NYC after Stanley shows up

[@danibnanieee]

I loved this movie so much as a kid. Like rewatched it daily. So nostalgic watching it again!

[@keikarhinopuppy]

It must have driven your parents insane, mine tell me as much since I did the same with Pocahontas.

[@iamnotthatguy7166]

I feel like viewing this movie a single time is enough to stunt a child’s growth

[@Mooffgamesgamer]

10:40 That really aged like wine 😂

[@KawaiiKing64]

55:25 Absolutely lost my shit at the guy in chat who said "Now THIS is podracing!" During the jetboat scene X'D

[@arturoaguilar6002]

I'm concerned how casually Saberspark mentions his bullying impulses as a normal reaction.

[@bladenot-runner1795]

The animation was FANTASTIC, except for the lighting of the characters. It seems like there was a huge divide between the background and the characters- which makes sense, artistically, but it indicates poor teamwork. If these characters had been lit according to their background, it would have looked wonderful. This is driving me insane, lol. All I can think of is how easy it would be to fix. Edit: nvm, the story is disturbing as all hell. Wtf did I just watch?

[@DarthBiomech]

I wonder who tortured Don to make this movie, cuz I can't believe a guy who directed The Secret of NIMH also made this.

[@OpalSpring]

I love this movie. It was one of my favorites when I was little, and I recently re-watched it with a friend. He ended up enjoying it a lot more than he thought he would and that made me so happy.

[@monkeybrain0212]

Never seen this film before and I wished it stayed that way 🤣 but it was fun to see your guys reaction. Yeesh. Some of the lines in this were more awkward than first date farts

[@scarlettrahnavard3101]

My cousins liked this movie but I found myself drawing or playing with my tomagochi when they would watch it a billion times a summer.

[@ThisGuyWho]

Is it me or does Gnorga look like Danny DeVito’s character from Space Jam in drag? 😂😂😂

[@GWFanSoftcoreBrony]

This movie is just painful to watch, not just because it's a bad movie but because seeing Don Bluth do this badly after so many (okay three out of however many came before this) amazing films hurts. Plus, this is the one time that Dom DeLuise's performance couldn't make me still like the character he played.

[@asadyeehaw]

"Mr president the troll has hit the pentagon"

[@MikeOxlong-mo8oh]

Ostanley Bin Trollden

[@SpyroTheGerudo]

Time for a take XD I think this movie had potential to be better, but there was no faith in this. The whole film is so extreme in its audience choice it comes off as cynical, when all of the pieces could have made a great idea. I rewrote this entire movie, and what I did was changed the motivations for characters, changed multiple scenes and cut out most of the filler, and I gave the movie a central theme. I feel as though this movie doesn't know what its theme is. It has no idea what it is about, so let's make it about following your dreams and working towards making your dreams real. It's not much, but it's something. From there, I like the idea of Gnorga being bad for the sake of it. She is a troll, and trolls are established as bad, but I decided they should be feuding against the humans. So instead of having their home be ambiguous, they could be under New York City, say in their sewers. Stanley could be fascinated with the human world instead of just wanting to make flowers, and he aspires to travel to the surface and make friends with the humans. His green thumb is used to create a world that emulates the human world by planting flowers and bushes. He also collects human artifacts, like tire caps, or a 32 ounce cup from McDonalds. What pushes him to see the human world is his hole being discovered by the trolls, and they trash it. When being taken to Gnorga for high treason, he escapes, and manages to make his way to the human world! Then he realizes he is no safer here than he is with the trolls, so he finds refuge in Central park. There is way more to this than just that, but basically having a central theme at all can give this movie mileage.

[@Lunarthewolf]

"Mom, can we have My Neighbor Totoro?" "We have My Neighbor Totoro at home." My Neighbor Totoro at home:

[@cori_arts5612]

"Woah, how can you tell it's Don Bluth movie?" Cheeks in profile, big lower lips, very expressionist faces and, of course, Dom DeLuise! Don Bluth is my favorite animatior of all time and I HATED this film. Watched it once. Edit: Can't believe Saber forgot Rasputin who has the greatest villian song of ALL TIME!